British GP faces final ultimatum

[ArrowsFA1]

The prospects of Britain holding on to its Formula One grand prix appeared slim last night despite positive noises coming out of Silverstone about local authority approval for the circuit's grand designs.

F1's commercial rights holder, Bernie Ecclestone, said the British Racing Drivers' Club had only months to commit to a new deal at the market rate or the British Grand Prix, which has until 2009 to run, would be no more.
Daily Telegraphy story (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml?xml=/sport/2008/02/06/smgars106.xml)

Farewell to the Australian, British... :eek:

[ShiftingGears]

It'd suck to have another circuit with history and relatively high lap speeds usurped by another characterless Middle Eastern/Asian track without flow. I hope this does not happen with Silverstone.

[Ranger]

Any bets on which race will get it's next death threat? :\

[millencolin]

Any bets on which race will get it's next death threat? :\

$10 says Canada

[Ranger]

$10 says Canada
Would make sense... Street circuit, somewhat poor live viewing, lack of grandstands... sounds pretty similar to Melbourne's situation.

But would Bernie erase the North American market completely? can he reeaalllllly be that stupid?? Right guys?? :confused: :\

[MAX_THRUST]

Howmany new fans are there in the middle east and far east, compared to those Australian and British/European fans. If you keep dropping those events the fan base in those countries is bound to dip. Can they be sure that the new countries have got that many people who even care about F1?

Its a risk but when your that rich and that old you'll be gone before it all back fires then it'll be someone elses problem.

[SGWilko]

Bernie only gets away with srewing everyone he meets for so much fecking money is because they let him....

If I were the BRDC, personally, I would not be too bovvered, one day, Bernie will keel over, probably from the stress of losing count - yet again - when totting up his gazillions.

When someone from this planet takes over, the 'home of Blitish Motorsport' will come back to the calendar.

Just gotta bide your time.

Either that, or have Bernie stand near a grassy knoll..........

:laugh:

[Whyzars]

Silverstone is my favourite race and I would be very disappointed if it was lost to the sport. :(

OT: Does Monte Carlo have its place on the calendar 'guaranteed' or is it subject to the same negotiation techniques at contract renewal time?

[woody2goody]

The fact that Silverstone is one of the best circuits to drive on the calendar makes this situation worse. Granted, the overtaking is fairly rare during the grands prix, but it would be a crying shame if it was axed.

[Rudy Tamasz]

Great news! Let's replace it with Sudan. They have oil there, limitation on advertising anything is zero and there's a strong Chinese presence. That's the ideal place for F1 in globalization era. Of course, Sudan doesn't have a racing heritage or knowledgeable fans, but that's secondary.

[VX_Rules]

Rockingham please?

[jens]

Silverstone has been under threat already for many years (like Magny-Cours), so I have already got used to such 'intense situation' and don't feel that Silverstone is really under threat any more. :p :

[JasonD]

Would make sense... Street circuit, somewhat poor live viewing, lack of grandstands... sounds pretty similar to Melbourne's situation.

But would Bernie erase the North American market completely? can he reeaalllllly be that stupid?? Right guys?? :confused: :\

Street circuit? I bike/jogging path maybe but its not a street circuit.

[savage86]

The Poison Dwarf does it again, my god what does Bernie even do anymore apart from demand vast amounts of cash. The guy needs shoving out the door and a proper motor racing fan put in charge.

I mean, he puts up loads of his own money to help Turkey, does he come from Turkey? NO. How many F1 teams are based in Turkey NONE, how many people turned up to the race last year? not many.

AAAAGHHHHH

[Hawkmoon]

Bernie seems to have lost any appreciation for the sport a long time ago. Now it seems that the only thing he cares about is money.

Do the fans want Silverstone on the calendar? Hell yes! So leave it alone Bernie. Formula 1 generates so much money these days that surely screwing a few more millions out of the UK isn't more important than F1's heritage.

[airshifter]

Though I'd love to see it back for good in the US, I think that calling Bernies bluff on the Indy race was probably a good decision over time. He would have just ended up trying to nail them for more money every year, or come up with some other lame excuse.

I'd hate to see the Silverstone circuit go as well.

[gloomyDAY]

Though I'd love to see it back for good in the US, I think that calling Bernies bluff on the Indy race was probably a good decision over time. He would have just ended up trying to nail them for more money every year, or come up with some other lame excuse.

I'd hate to see the Silverstone circuit go as well.I thought the very same thing about the race in the USA. Great event at Indianapolis, but just like the British GP, another icon bites the dust. Soon it will be "doom and gloom" for other classics such as Silverstone.

Anyone want to get the kleenex?

[Tazio]

Silverstone has been under threat already for many years (like Magny-Cours), so I have already got used to such 'intense situation' and don't feel that Silverstone is really under threat any more. :p :

Word!

[Ranger]

Jens makes an interesting point.

Especially with Lewis "Golden boy" Hamilton on the grid, Bernie would have to be completely and utterly stupid to get rid of the British GP.

...not that he isn't short of that mark as it is.

[Tazio]

Jens makes an interesting point.

Especially with Lewis "Golden boy" Hamilton on the grid, Bernie would have to be completely and utterly stupid to get rid of the British GP.

...not that he isn't short of that mark as it is.
I've heard every year since about the turn of the Millenium that Siverstone is going to lose their GP!
Ain't gonna' happen unless another venue is found, or built in GB. Period!

[samuratt]

If this is true i am going to miss Silverstone a lot.

Along Monaco and Sepang are the three racetracks I enjoy the most when playing on my PS2 :)

[MAX_THRUST]

I think Bernie is trying to get more goverment funding into motorsport in the UK, as many other countries are subsidised by the authorities there. In some respects I do feel its more about pollitics and getting our leaders to realise the huge impact motorsport has on the UK economy.......

damn I almost sounded like I knew something then, aside from that I think Bernie is a power crazed, midget who wouldn't let me date his daughter, or look after his wife for a couple of hours, even if I promised not to show them a good time.

Maybe he needs a new wig/syrup/rug on his head........which is made out of Ukranien virgin goat hairs..thats better normallity resumes.

[Garry Walker]

Good job Bernie. Really good job.
Just keep taking those races to countries where the people actually have no interest in F1 like China and Bahrain and get rid of the races where the people are actually excited and really care about racing, like Silverstone and Monza.

I wonder if Bernie thinks the UK government should fund racing (silverstone) as massively as for example they did in Bahrain.

[Mark]

Two races in Spain and none in the UK where most of the teams are based!?

[Nick Brad]

I don't know Mark, Spain is under threat now with the Lewis racism saga so that's two more races for the middle east.

I can't see Britain losing the GP, but then again, I can't see the BRDC letting it fall into serious risk anyway. After all, they become redundant if the GP goes, either that or they have to get off their backsides and actually support and help motorsport in this country.

[trumperZ06]

:dozey: Bernie's off to Third World Countries...

where he can con Goverments into subsidising the events...

and allow Tobacco advertising !!!


;) Maybe Y'all can start following Sports Car Racing... which looks like a good substitute for the sorry state of F-1 !!!

[jso1985]

I doubt Bernie will ever drop the British GP, even more now with the Hamilton-mania.

I think this is the 7th time he gives the track an ultimatum...

[SGWilko]

I can't see Britain losing the GP, but then again, I can't see the BRDC letting it fall into serious risk anyway. After all, they become redundant if the GP goes, either that or they have to get off their backsides and actually support and help motorsport in this country.

What do you suppose the BRDC does that they are not trying to do now....

a) rob a bank
b) print their own money
c) threaten to blow up parliament (oh, that's been tried already.....)
d) all of the above

:dozey:

[Nikki Katz]

While I can see that it's good that the circuits are under pressure to keep improving, I hate that Bernie seems to be making a quick buck by pulling out of important countries and moving into the arse-end of nowhere. F1 needs the British GP, just like it needs a race in France and the USA. It doesn't need a race in United Arab Emirates.

[wmcot]

Sounds like Bernie's in the running for this year's "Certified Half-wit" award! ;)

[Rollo]

But would Bernie erase the North American market completely? can he reeaalllllly be that stupid?? Right guys?? :confused: :\

Sure he would. Britain, Canada, Australia, in fact anywhere that a) doesn't have tobacco sponsorship and b) pay him £50 gazillion immediately, he would dump at a second's notice.

All praise the holy god Dollar. Amen.

[markabilly]

Amen.


i say screw them all, take it all off to those countries where the tobaaco ads run wild and free

Praise the lord and pass that plate of cash to benie

The rest of you brothers and sisters have another drink of the kool aid, and then let me hear you say from the bottom of your heart AND HOLD NOTHING BACK, BECAUSE HE IS LISTENING!!!

AMEN

[markabilly]

What do you suppose the BRDC does that they are not trying to do now....

a) rob a bank
b) print their own money
c) threaten to blow up parliament (oh, that's been tried already.....)
d) all of the above

:dozey:
gEEEEAAAASSS wILKO, Well, have you not learned your lessons of history??

Answer to your question is NONE of the above.

Simple , sell it to benie's personal company, and suddenly the wisdom of holding the race will become very clear....of course legalizing thos tobaaKA ads would help with the clarity of vision for one and all

[Osella]

Actually guys, I think you're about three years out of date with your thinking.

Consider, how many F1 teams actually have tobacco sponsorship?
Ferrari, and...? No others! There is even very little alcohol sponsorship too.
So that is no longer the issue, in fact Bernie himself has stated that races are potentially going to lose their places if they don't fit in with European TV timeslots..

I think I have finally worked out what Bernie's Silverstone problem is though, and it has very little to do with the facilities etc.. (Considering the ever-increasing number of temporary events which surely cannot have as effective paddock facilities as Silverstone..)

No, I think the real problem is Bernie himself. He took a team which was a formerly race-winning outfit which was falling further behind the pace and turned them into a multiple championship-winning outfit with major international sponsorship deals and works engine contracts, then took F1 from a relatively minor special interest sport into one of the world's most-watched and internationally recognised sports.
I think he is just frustrated, as someone who is immensely proud of his country's successes and does not see failure as an option, as to why Silverstone has not achieved the same heights as he has in his organisations..

I also think he would love to take it over and turn it into one of the world's top racing facilities (instead of heliports!), but the BRDC do not want to lose sight of club/national racing, which I think Bernie would happily forgo in order to achieve a higher 'status' for Silverstone.

[jso1985]

agree :up:

Tobacco is a thing of the past for F1, while's Bernie greed is still a current issue(and maybe more than ever), if a country allows tobacco sponsorship is not gonna help much if they want a F1 race there.

[Tomski]

Well I hope siulverstone does loose the race. Two reasons, F1 has totlally lost the plot as both a "sport" and a spectacle, secondly have you ever been to the place and seen some of the so called spectator facilities?

Grandstands with no roofs (you either fry or drown), dirt "viewing" banks (grandstands are for the privileged corporate visitros), ancient toilet blocks, and rip-off catering.

Good riddance!

[wmcot]

Farewell to the Australian, British... :eek:


Hello Portugal!

[BDunnell]

Good job Bernie. Really good job.
Just keep taking those races to countries where the people actually have no interest in F1 like China and Bahrain and get rid of the races where the people are actually excited and really care about racing, like Silverstone and Monza.

I wonder if Bernie thinks the UK government should fund racing (silverstone) as massively as for example they did in Bahrain.

:up:

I don't feel that a penny of Government money should go to Silverstone. In this case, motorsport (not all of it, but much of it, and especially F1) is its own worst enemy. F1 likes to portray itself as being very cash-rich, and it is. Thus, the general perception of all motorsport by the general public is that it is overflowing with money, and even lowlier series do little to dispel this. Why then, the non-enthusiast public would be forgiven for asking, should the taxpayer fund the redevelopment of Silverstone? After all, it's not as if the business of motorsport — the bit that's most important to the UK in financial and employment terms — is going to up sticks and leave these shores if the British GP gets cancelled. How much of the revenue from the British GP actually stays in the UK, after all?

[BDunnell]

Sure he would. Britain, Canada, Australia, in fact anywhere that a) doesn't have tobacco sponsorship and b) pay him £50 gazillion immediately, he would dump at a second's notice.

All praise the holy god Dollar. Amen.

Yes, and all in favour of those parts of the world that, by comparison with Britain, Canada and Australia, are not known for being located in politically stable regions no matter how many major sporting events are held there.

[ShiftingGears]

Hello Portugal!

+ at least 5 hairpins, and no elevation changes :p :

[Osella]

How much of the revenue from the British GP actually stays in the UK, after all?

Not sure about revenue per se, but I'm pretty sure that as the race loses money year on year in terms of ticket sales it all stays!...
The track has to pay so much money to Bernie for the rights to hold the race that they do not make money themselves.

In terms of merchandising I'm pretty sure most of it stays in the UK, certainly most of the trackside merchandising operations are pretty well-known UK companies, likewise the hotels, guest houses etc will all take money from the teams and visitors..

As for the teams, the current testing rules make the circuit's location irrelevant for now, unlike the days when Lotus, Jordan, Brabham, Williams etc could just pop up and run for a day. A Gp-less Silverstone would cut the prestige of the circuit and would also surely cut their revenue, however as trackday and test day charges would have to fall in order to keep people's interest.
And they will never be able to replace F1 with bikes (hopefully!) as there are far better circuits at Brands and Donington which are appreciated more by bike fans and have a special relationship with those who watch and attend motorbike races.

However, the loss of a Grand Prix would make it more difficult for the teams to attract manufacturers and sponsors to them as they are almost without exception, British-based (even Toro Rosso has technical links in Milton Keynes at RBT), and if the country did not have a GP it makes awareness of the teams and the reasons for their location harder to stress to backers, ("You want $50 Million for your team!?!!, but you don't even have a race in your country, the nearest is Belgium, why don't I go and speak to Astromega and get them into F1 instead...) Sounds almost facetious to say so, but it will happen.

I think the answer to the funding crisis is to give the race to Bernie, just as Spa did, and then suddenly the worries over the future disappear (Spa's temporary absence was due to political issues within Belgium, not FIA/FOM concerns.), investment and development occur, and the race makes money as Bernie takes the TV rights and the circuit retains the gate money to keep it ticking over..

The problem with this is the BRDC, who I believe want to keep the grass roots racing, motorbike racing and trackdays at Silverstone, Bernie is less interested...However I think the main reason is that the BRDC are ex and current racing drivers, who I think it is fair to say just don't like Bernie and would almost rather lose the GP just to spite him, than let him have a say and make the race and track successful and sustainable.

Makes you wonder whether if the BRDC headquaters had been centred at Brands originally if any of this would have been an issue...

[BDunnell]

However, the loss of a Grand Prix would make it more difficult for the teams to attract manufacturers and sponsors to them as they are almost without exception, British-based (even Toro Rosso has technical links in Milton Keynes at RBT), and if the country did not have a GP it makes awareness of the teams and the reasons for their location harder to stress to backers, ("You want $50 Million for your team!?!!, but you don't even have a race in your country, the nearest is Belgium, why don't I go and speak to Astromega and get them into F1 instead...) Sounds almost facetious to say so, but it will happen.

It's an interesting counter-argument to the one I posed, and I did consider this, but I'm not so sure. This is because UK-based backers are no longer crucial to UK-based teams.



The problem with this is the BRDC, who I believe want to keep the grass roots racing, motorbike racing and trackdays at Silverstone, Bernie is less interested...However I think the main reason is that the BRDC are ex and current racing drivers, who I think it is fair to say just don't like Bernie and would almost rather lose the GP just to spite him, than let him have a say and make the race and track successful and sustainable.

Makes you wonder whether if the BRDC headquaters had been centred at Brands originally if any of this would have been an issue...

Things have undoubtedly got better since Jackie Stewart left his prominent position within the BRDC. There is, by all accounts, less tension between the club and (Max and) Bernie.

[Osella]

It's an interesting counter-argument to the one I posed, and I did consider this, but I'm not so sure. This is because UK-based backers are no longer crucial to UK-based teams.

Things have undoubtedly got better since Jackie Stewart left his prominent position within the BRDC. There is, by all accounts, less tension between the club and (Max and) Bernie.

Agreed, UK backers are less crucial, and that was pretty much my point, how are you going to get companies from places like the US or the middle east for example to back an F1 team if they look at you and your team is based just outside a village in Oxfordshire, and your nearest GP race is in another country...
It's just not very marketable... Why is Monaco popular, because it's the race they take all the sponsors to. Now imagine why you want to take investors to your (admittedly high-tech) factory in rainy semi-rural England, and you can't even tie it in to a GP event full of your local fans to show them why it's worth them spending $50million on you...

I think the Jackie Stewart issue has helped, if only he would leave all his high-profile positions the racing world in general would be much better off!
But I still think it's a shame that the BRDC block almost all development ideas on the grounds that national racing will be badly affected by it. If only they had relocated to Brands, or started there originally then Nicola Foulston/Octagon wouldn't have been able to bugger up Brands Hatch Circuits (Ltd), national racing wouldn't have been screwed up by the TOCA not going to Brands' circuits issue, and national and club racing could say bollocks to Silverstone, we're going to show you some real racing at much better circuits. (Anything below GT2's just looks daft on the GP circuit anyway!)

Sell out to Bernie and leave Silverstone to the F1 and Le Mans races, put more night races on there and get Brands or Donington (Or Rockingham if you want facilities and a central location!!) as the real home of national racing, hell Brands Oulton and Donington alone have enough layouts to vary the racing, bring back Pembrey, Cadwell Park or Mallory even, to the GT/F3/TOCA packages and you have some real interesting tracks and a decent British GP/testing/night race facility at Silverstone.

Just my suggestion... ;)

[tintop]

Things have undoubtedly got better since Jackie Stewart left his prominent position within the BRDC. There is, by all accounts, less tension between the club and (Max and) Bernie.


Why is that a good thing? F1 is a whore, and Stewart is a bore. A lot more integrity in the latter, I'd think.

Seriously, history will treat these two insecure little F1 men harshly regardless of their riches, and Jackie will always be a hero. Yeah, F1 has made tons of money by prostituting itself to rich camels in the desert, but like a tree falling alone in the forest, eventually there will be no one left to hear, watch, or care.

[Tazio]

Why is that a good thing? F1 is a whore, and Stewart is a bore. A lot more integrity in the latter, I'd think.

Seriously, history will treat these two insecure little F1 men harshly regardless of their riches, and Jackie will always be a hero. Yeah, F1 has made tons of money by prostituting itself to rich camels in the desert, but like a tree falling alone in the forest, eventually there will be no one left to hear, watch, or care.
Truer words were never spoken!
As a youngster to me Jackie was so cool.
I've never heard a negative word spoken in truth
about his race craft!
Now, What does that have to do with the price
of tea/tobacco/whores in China?
That's the reality, and it is sad.

[Ari]

Jens makes an interesting point.

Especially with Lewis "Golden boy" Hamilton on the grid, Bernie would have to be completely and utterly stupid to get rid of the British GP.

...not that he isn't short of that mark as it is.

Is the way I see it.

There's no hope in hell of Bernie giving up the British GP. That said, he wants to be a part of the crew cashing in on Lewis.... not just the GP organisers. All said and done, that's kinda fair enough isn't it?

[ArrowsFA1]

There's no hope in hell of Bernie giving up the British GP.
He's doing a good impression of someone who may do just that:

Formula One supremo Bernie Ecclestone has warned that the British Grand Prix will be dropped from the calendar in 2010 unless Silverstone's owners agree to his financial demands.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/67605

[JSH]

The sooner the media stopped referring to him as "Formula 1 Supremo Bernie Eccelstone.." instead of just simply "C__khead Bernie Eccelstone (C@#khead Bernie Eccelstone)" the better off everone would be.

[dc10]

The sooner the media stopped referring to him as "Formula 1 Supremo Bernie Eccelstone.." instead of just simply "C__khead Bernie Eccelstone" the better off everone would be.

+1
His ego is bigger than he is and they are feeding it.

[Viktory]

IMO if UK lose their round, it will be a big loss. I hope Bernie can for once see beyond the financial and facilities side of F1 and keep at least a part of the F1 heritage intact.

[aryan]

Here's what Frank Williams has to say about this:






Q. What do yo think about the future of traditional races, especially with Silverstone under such threat?

FW: I think that Formula One should be as international as possible. On that basis Bernie will have wanderlust to fly around the world and see where he can get the best deals. He'd love to have one in North America. But I think he recognises that he must keep the core heritage races, which I understand to be Britain, Monte Carlo, Germany, Italy and France. I don't think they'll disappear. Even if he gets less money from them. (But) I can't second-guess Bernie that well.



http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/67643

[Knock-on]

I get the feeling that Bernie would love to call the BRDC bluff.

I think there will be a British GP but not necessarily at Silverstone. He's itching for a street race even for a year or two.

[Mark]

Bernie has said for a long time he would love street races in London and Paris.

[Knock-on]

Bernie has said for a long time he would love street races in London and Paris.

With Boris driving the "safety" car :laugh:

[JSH]

Bernie has said for a long time he would love street races in London and Paris.

There once was a series in the US that based itself on "Street Races".... yeah... didn't quite work out as they wanted. :(

If a city charges a "congestion" tax for vehicles to enter it, then I think the chances of an F1 street race are bugger all.

[Tallgeese]

I say that they should rotate GPs with the exception of the Monaco GP. For example, every GP will get its turn with a total of 18 races per year. For instance, the British GP will run for 18 years & slip out for one year so that another GP can take its place for that time.

I'd also add an (on the 18-race format):

Asian GP
North American GP
South American GP

On top of the European GP