It was fun

[seppefan]

2008 will be tha last year of ChampCar.
Cotman will get PKV, NHL, Walker, Minardi USA, PCM minimum into the IRL leaving Conquest , Forsythe,Rocketsport. Not sure if DCR can afford a move.

So bi bi.

GF, Paulie G and DP are to blame, make NO mistake.

Lets watch it unfold and I will see you at Indy.

Maybe as early as 08 as Paul Newman says they may get Justin and Graham there.

Feel sorry for KK as he tried but picked the wrong business partners.

[Dr. Krogshöj]

Yeah it was fun. And it will be fun in 2008. After that, life goes on, F1 and GP2 will be fun.

[jimispeed]

Champcar will still be here in 2009.

And things will be looking up for Champcar!!

[seppefan]

Yeah it was fun. And it will be fun in 2008. After that, life goes on, F1 and GP2 will be fun.
as will Long Beach, Indy, Edmonton, Surfers,etc etc see you there.

[MAX_THRUST]

Pigs might fly.......

On the trun the lights out thread, the fans are saying bye bye you won't be missed to some of the negative posters.

I would like to add that I think CCWS have had that attitude this past year, if you don't like it leave. People are leaving, more now than ever.

How are you gonna get crowds to watch a race in Spain, when no one cares.

Do the decent thing, vclose down and take the best tracks to the IRL. I was a huge CART fan and followed CCWS hoping for something similar. They got rid of ovals, and got rid of all the sponsors. What is the point...

[anthonyvop]

2008 will be tha last year of ChampCar.
Cotman will get PKV, NHL, Walker, Minardi USA, PCM minimum into the IRL leaving Conquest , Forsythe,Rocketsport. Not sure if DCR can afford a move.

So bi bi.

GF, Paulie G and DP are to blame, make NO mistake.

Lets watch it unfold and I will see you at Indy.

Maybe as early as 08 as Paul Newman says they may get Justin and Graham there.

Feel sorry for KK as he tried but picked the wrong business partners.

The Question is not if Champ Car will be around in 2009 but will the IRL?

[seppefan]

The Question is not if Champ Car will be around in 2009 but will the IRL?

Of the two I go sadly for the IRL as they have the 500. End of. Wish it was otherwise.

[Dr. Krogshöj]

as will Long Beach, Indy, Edmonton, Surfers,etc etc see you there.

Maybe. Depends on what kind of racecars will race there.

[indycool]

The IRL will be because there'll be an Indianapolis 500 and a series around it, hence, the IRL.

When you read posts over the last couple of months here and other fora, you see a lot of hopelessness instead of enthusiasm for CC, but when the snow is falling and things are moving very slowly, SOME of that is to be expected. I'm grumpier in the winter than the summer.

Then again, there hasn't been a whole lot to cheer for. I count six car-driver combination "done deals" -- Tracy/Forsythe, Servia/PKV, Figge/PCM (duh), Bernoldi/Rocketsports (for how long with PG, who knows?) and Rahal and Wilson/N/H/L and it's Feb. 1.

'09? Let's get through '08 first.

[mike15]

Lets watch it unfold and I will see you at Indy.


So what this all comes down too is your just an I500 supporter.
Yep I thought so.

[seppefan]

So what this all comes down too is your just an I500 supporter.
Yep I thought so.

Really, surprising that you thought that as I did not know until I realised that their might only be one series! I will be at Long Beach etc as well if the races are on the calendar. I guess what I am saying is that if OW goes to one series I will still be interested as long as their is a road course, street course & oval mix.

[sanguin]

2008 will be tha last year of ChampCar.
Cotman will get PKV, NHL, Walker, Minardi USA, PCM minimum into the IRL leaving Conquest , Forsythe,Rocketsport. Not sure if DCR can afford a move.

So bi bi.

GF, Paulie G and DP are to blame, make NO mistake.

Lets watch it unfold and I will see you at Indy.

Maybe as early as 08 as Paul Newman says they may get Justin and Graham there.

Feel sorry for KK as he tried but picked the wrong business partners.

Wow, who knew TC was so powerful and teams line up to follow him?

So they will give up LB and Toronto and RA to go to the ovals of the midwest?

Why didn't they go sooner?

[seppefan]

Wow, who knew TC was so powerful and teams line up to follow him?

So they will give up LB and Toronto and RA to go to the ovals of the midwest?

Why didn't they go sooner?

Because if the is one series then surely they would not give up the races you mention. Hope not. Ask them why they did not go sooner but Jimmy V, Paul Newman, Haas, Walker have all said they may or will go in the last few days. As you know.

[sanguin]

Because if the is one series then surely they would not give up the races you mention. Hope not. Ask them why they did not go sooner but Jimmy V, Paul Newman, Haas, Walker have all said they may or will go in the last few days. As you know.

Jimmy or Walker have not said they would go,Jimmy said they need a merger, Walker said he talked to the IRL, but didn't go and Haas was a so-called quote from RM and no where else has that been confirmed by any other source. Now we have confirmation that NHL is racing in CC.

There is no merger and the other series doesn't get anything automatically. Those events would be in jeopardy under TG's control,IMO. I believe none of these teams want a merged series with the owner of IMS in charge,or they would have left already.

[seppefan]

Jimmy or Walker have not said they would go,Jimmy said they need a merger, Walker said he talked to the IRL, but didn't go and Haas was a so-called quote from RM and no where else has that been confirmed by any other source. Now we have confirmation that NHL is racing in CC.

There is no merger and the other series doesn't get anything automatically. Those events would be in jeopardy under TG's control,IMO. I believe none of these teams want a merged series with the owner of IMS in charge,or they would have left already.

Ok lets wait and see.

[Colt21]

2008 will be tha last year of ChampCar.
Cotman will get PKV, NHL, Walker, Minardi USA, PCM minimum into the IRL leaving Conquest , Forsythe,Rocketsport. Not sure if DCR can afford a move.

So bi bi.

GF, Paulie G and DP are to blame, make NO mistake.

Lets watch it unfold and I will see you at Indy.

Maybe as early as 08 as Paul Newman says they may get Justin and Graham there.

Feel sorry for KK as he tried but picked the wrong business partners.

Cotman, like Penske, Ganassi, and others before him, was very anti-IRL. He quit AGR to try and start a Champcar team, and then ended up working for them. Now everyone is starting to smell the Rose's.

NHL, is gone in 2009, and they are taking Cleveland with them! And Sanguin, if you do not know about the special occasion on 2/17 (and you don't), then zip it.

The biggest thing that upset most the Champcar employees, was when TG made the offer, KK, PG and GF only wanted to line their own pockets. They did not try to work out details on where the Champcar staff would go. Another reason TC bolted.

They had a chance, to grow the series and use the strong fan base to establish a professional and growing open wheel series. Instead, they put their faith in baldy, which will prove to be a fatal decision.

The good news is the Champcar will continue, in some sort, with the Atlantic series. Many of the people will be able to assist in that series, which is still probably the best open wheel series in the states.

[keysersoze]

I believe none of these teams want a merged series with the owner of IMS in charge,or they would have left already.

What they want and what they are able to make transpire are two completely different matters. It's February and the CCWS has six confirmed car-driver combinations.

CCWS does not seem to be in control of its own destiny, and unless some profound changes take place, it is doomed. The remaining owners are like Decaprio and Winslet hanging on to the back of the Titanic as it plummets, only when they get there they are greeted by the Three Amigos, who are doing nothing but waiting to jump.

[sanguin]

What they want and what they are able to make transpire are two completely different matters. It's February and the CCWS has six confirmed car-driver combinations.



Sebring will answer a lot of questions.There are other series without confirmed rides also.

[MAX_THRUST]

Imagine you are an American based team owner and things are difficult within the IRL and CCWS. Unlike the CART days where the loss of the 500 was not at the beginging the end of the world. Now though where would you want to stay.

This year I would go IRL racing. If I could have held on as long as I have then I would have stayed in CCWS to see what would happen. However this year I think I would jump ship. If any team does that and the series is down to 12 cars, would you stay as a team owner.

Forget the fact your a fan and think how you would feel as a business man/team owner who has staff who depend on your business doing well. If I worked for CCWS I would approach the IRL for a job, both based at INDY anyway.

I wanted the IRL to fail, it has but so has CCWS, the only way this is gonna get better is if the two merge. In 5 years time we may have a good sloid series or it may all be gone.

[beachbum]

The good news is the Champcar will continue, in some sort, with the Atlantic series. Many of the people will be able to assist in that series, which is still probably the best open wheel series in the states.This is one statement I think almost everyone can agree on. The Atlantic series has a rich history and continues to be a fine development series. It could easily become a headliner series. I have no doubt that it will find a new home if something happens to Champ Car. Linking with the ALMS series would be a natural fit and good for both series.

[ChaimWitz]

Champcar will still be here in 2009.

And things will be looking up for Champcar!!

Too funny. Do you by chance drive a Pontiac Aztek? Yes, things will be looking up for ChampCar in 2009 because it will be Tango Uniform and Ten Feet Under. C'mon Jimispeed, Sanguin, FerrrariF1, please tell us how those TWELVE seats will be filled by Long Beach and please do tell us where the money comes from (or, more accurately, doesn't come from) to run this series? How is this going to work? Blind faith and hate are not going to cut it. Adios Amigos.

[jimispeed]

Too funny. Do you by chance drive a Pontiac Aztek? Yes, things will be looking up for ChampCar in 2009 because it will be Tango Uniform and Ten Feet Under. C'mon Jimispeed, Sanguin, FerrrariF1, please tell us how those TWELVE seats will be filled by Long Beach and plase do tell us where the money comes from (or, more accurately, doesn't come from) to run this series? How is this going to work?


Just ignore my willingness to try and help a series survive. Just ignore my passion for a series that runs deep in my veins. My father gave me the passion for this series back in 1978. Indy was a huge part of it back then. It's not just about KK, it's about a historical series that started it all.

You and I will never agree on this. This is a Champcar forum.

If I were someone who didn't believe in this series anymore, I wouldn't waste my time anymore. I would love to see a unification. Not a total burial of the freatest open wheel series that ever existed. Having TG in total power just doesn't sit well with me, and it never will.

If there can't be an agreement in where all of the parties get equal say, and the soul of the Champcar World Series remains historical, then I can't belong.

If you don't believe in Champcar anymore, then why are you here??

[ChaimWitz]

Just ignore my willingness to try and help a series survive. Just ignore my passion for a series that runs deep in my veins. My father gave me the passion for this series back in 1978. Indy was a huge part of it back then. It's not just about KK, it's about a historical series that started it all.

You and I will never agree on this. This is a Champcar forum.

If I were someone who didn't believe in this series anymore, I wouldn't waste my time anymore. I would love to see a unification. Not a total burial of the freatest open wheel series that ever existed. Having TG in total power just doesn't sit well with me, and it never will.

If there can't be an agreement in where all of the parties get equal say, and the soul of the Champcar World Series remains historical, then I can't belong.

If you don't believe in Champcar anymore, then why are you here??

I am here because I believe in the sport and it needs to come together now. I was there back in 1978 and ChampCar is not CART which was actually INDY Car racing. I am sorry it doesn't sit well with you but irrational and blind fanaticism does not sit well with me and will have no place in the sport soon. We need to be one culture and one series.

[SoCalPVguy]

Sebring will answer a lot of questions.There are other series without confirmed rides also.

Remember your comments --- we will be discussing after Sebring just to see how right or wrong you are. Based on your record, it may get ugly for you.

Again you deflect CCWS issues with comments re. the IRL.

Starter, you are all over me by e-mail and private messages about my preceived attitude towards the CCWS poor present situation - yet time and time again you allow this guy to break the forum convention by discussing the other leagure out of context in replies to comments strictly regarding CCWS.

I demand that you insist that this guy, and a couple of others too, post their IRL comments over in the other appropriate fourms and stop littering the CCWS forum with the hate and jabs at the other series as a way of defelecting addressing the current issues of CCWS.

[sanguin]

Remember your comments --- we will be discussing after Sebring just to see how right or wrong you are. Based on your record, it may get ugly for you.

Again you deflect CCWS issues with comments re. the IRL.

Starter, you are all over me by e-mail and private messages about my preceived attitude towards the CCWS poor present situation - yet time and time again you allow this guy to break the forum convention by discussing the other leagure out of context in replies to comments strictly regarding CCWS.

I demand that you insist that this guy, and a couple of others too, post their IRL comments over in the other appropriate fourms and stop littering the CCWS forum with the hate and jabs at the other series as a way of defelecting addressing the current issues of CCWS.

I did not bring up the other series, it is in the first post and many others after that.

Why am I the only one being stalked?

[ChaimWitz]

I did not bring up the other series, it is in the first post and many others after that.

Why am I the only one being stalked?

Sanguin, maybe becuase you invite it? Hey, can you get back to all of us on how ChampCar is going to make business sense out of their current circumstance? You seem to avoid that question. Why? You seem to be a man on the inside with the latest scoop? Surely Paulie G-String or one of the other Amigos have filled you in on the next brilliant plan.

[garyshell]

And Sanguin, if you do not know about the special occasion on 2/17 (and you don't), then zip it.


I'll say the same thing to you that I did to heelintoe and chamwitz. If you have some "inside info" and can't or won't talk about it, then don't even mention it. This "nahny, nahny, boo boo I know something you don't" stuff is juvenile at best, I won't use the word I really WANT to use, lest Starter have to give me another "language" warning.

If you have "inside info" and want to share it great, if not YOU need to zip it.

Gary

[garyshell]

I did not bring up the other series, it is in the first post and many others after that.

Why am I the only one being stalked?

Oh geeeeeee, poor wittle you!!!! I can't imagine why everybody is picking on you. Grow some freakin' back bone. :eek:

Gary

[Colt21]

I'll say the same thing to you that I did to heelintoe and chamwitz. If you have some "inside info" and can't or won't talk about it, then don't even mention it. This "nahny, nahny, boo boo I know something you don't" stuff is juvenile at best, I won't use the word I really WANT to use, lest Starter have to give me another "language" warning.

If you have "inside info" and want to share it great, if not YOU need to zip it.

Gary

I guess you don't have a clue what "occasion" is taking place on the 2/17 either. Again, outsiders like you, Sanguin and others try reason with only your opinions, and little facts.

IF you plan at being at the "occasion" on the 17th, then look me up. It should be quite easy to do...but I doubt you recieved an invitation.

There will be plenty in attendance on the 17th, from both sides of the OW fence to celebrate some good news...

We'll be more than a "mile high", and that is the only clue an outsider like you will get...."nups" said?

[bblocker68]

Is this an official announcement????

Nothing will surprise me at this time and all I can now do is hope for the best. I'm sure something jaw-dropping will be announed next week too. I have a feeling things are going to keep getting more interesting.

[garyshell]

I guess you don't have a clue what "occasion" is taking place on the 2/17 either. Again, outsiders like you, Sanguin and others try reason with only your opinions, and little facts.



Lets get a couple of FACTS straight. First and foremost, if you bothered to follow these forums a bit you would know very well I am not in the Sanguin camp. And second you have presented no "facts" for any of us, who are not on the inside, to digest. All you have done is act like some two year old, saying "I know something you don't know." So, freakin' what? Goodie for you, Mr. Insider (alleged). What purpose does it serve to tell us you know something we don't know? Does it boost your own ego in some way?

This is a fan forum, that just happens to have a few folks who are also in the business. It is not a racing business forum which happens to have a few fans who drop in. If it WERE the latter, this sort of thing would be entirely appropriate. But given that the purpose of this forum is the former, this sort of thing is smarmy.

Like I said, if you want to talk about what you know, great. But if you just want to tease the rest of us, and gloat that you are somehow better or more important than the rest of us, you can shove... OK Starter I won't say it, I dont think I have to...

Gary

[bblocker68]

Spill the beans. We're hanging on your every word :)

[Chris R]

oh yeah, the 2/17 thing - you mean you guys don't know? :confused:

anyway that's old hat - wait until you hear about the 2/18 thing....... :D

seriously, I agree with Gary - if you know something and want to share - cool - if not let it go...

if you are right we'll all be celebrating something come 2/18..... if you are wrong you'll just look like the rest of us (lost and confused)...

if you expect us "outsiders" to roll over and believe you well, good luck with that.... this sport has been over-promising and under-delivering for too long for most fans to believe much of anything until it happens.....

[Colt21]

Lets get a couple of FACTS straight. First and foremost, if you bothered to follow these forums a bit you would know very well I am not in the Sanguin camp. And second you have presented no "facts" for any of us, who are not on the inside, to digest. All you have done is act like some two year old, saying "I know something you don't know." So, freakin' what? Goodie for you, Mr. Insider (alleged). What purpose does it serve to tell us you know something we don't know? Does it boost your own ego in some way?

This is a fan forum, that just happens to have a few folks who are also in the business. It is not a racing business forum which happens to have a few fans who drop in. If it WERE the latter, this sort of thing would be entirely appropriate. But given that the purpose of this forum is the former, this sort of thing is smarmy.

Like I said, if you want to talk about what you know, great. But if you just want to tease the rest of us, and gloat that you are somehow better or more important than the rest of us, you can shove... OK Starter I won't say it, I dont think I have to...

Gary

Just becuase you don't know, and you were not invited, does not mean you need to get all up in a huff.

I left some fairly easy hints..."occasion"..."mile high"..."nups".....it does not take a brain surgeon, (or a heart attack in your case) to figure it out. No secret to anyone involved in the sport, just an unknown to those who haven't got a clue.

It is NOT any major announcement, or news, per say. Just and "engagement" that most of the OW community will be part of...'cept for you and those like you.

Too much information here from people on the outside. They have chased away those from the inside...save for a select few.

We'll save the last dance for you though, if the heart manages to stay together.

[Colt21]

Is this an official announcement????

Nothing will surprise me at this time and all I can now do is hope for the best. I'm sure something jaw-dropping will be announed next week too. I have a feeling things are going to keep getting more interesting.

A party, gathering, an event yes, but no announcment, (though an announcment was part of the invitation...)

[garyshell]

Just becuase you don't know, and you were not invited, does not mean you need to get all up in a huff.

I left some fairly easy hints..."occasion"..."mile high"..."nups".....it does not take a brain surgeon, (or a heart attack in your case) to figure it out. No secret to anyone involved in the sport, just an unknown to those who haven't got a clue.

It is NOT any major announcement, or news, per say. Just and "engagement" that most of the OW community will be part of...'cept for you and those like you.

Too much information here from people on the outside. They have chased away those from the inside...save for a select few.

We'll save the last dance for you though, if the heart manages to stay together.

You really are a piece of work. I hope you enjoy your smugness and the wedding. I see you have conveniently disabled sending PM's to you, so I can't say what I would REALLY like to say.

Gary

[Colt21]

You really are a piece of work. I hope you enjoy your smugness and the wedding. I see you have conveniently disabled sending PM's to you, so I can't say what I would REALLY like to say.

Gary

Just becuase you didn't get an invite, tisk, tisk.

[clydekart]

2008 will be tha last year of ChampCar.
Cotman will get PKV, NHL, Walker, Minardi USA, PCM minimum into the IRL leaving Conquest , Forsythe,Rocketsport. Not sure if DCR can afford a move.

So bi bi.

GF, Paulie G and DP are to blame, make NO mistake.

Lets watch it unfold and I will see you at Indy.

Maybe as early as 08 as Paul Newman says they may get Justin and Graham there.

Feel sorry for KK as he tried but picked the wrong business partners.

Where is your proof this is last year? Pure speculation or disinformation.
CC will be around for many years to come.
Newman will NEVER go to the IRL.
Why feel sorry for KK, he's a multi-millionaire.

[Champcar4life]

I been asking myself this alot, I hear alot of people that say they are fans of the series and have passion about it, but when I read some of the post I worried, its like some fan are counting the days when Champcar folds so they can jump ship. I would like too see a merger if its done right and not one sided, because no one wins and we end up right where were at.

I take most of the stuff I read on here with a grain of salt.so I will wait until I heard something offical from the heads of Champcar LLC.

[Jimmy Magnusson]

If Newman/Haas leaves it would sort of open the flood gates, you'd have to believe. And I'm not so sure about Newman "never going to the IRL", plenty of others have said that in the past. CART died a few years ago, and while the new management has not been utterly rubbish I can't say I have much faith in them. The Euro expansion especially seem a bit daft. I do believe that if NHLR goes, the "war" is over. And that's not such a bad thing.

I will add, however, that CC seems to be doing its best to put togeather a good season. If, and that's a big if, they get Pagenaud in Conquest with Perera, Viso in Minardi and especially Montagny in Forsythe and Tags in PKV, it will be a very, very good lineup. Not a star lineup, but many quality drivers, and without Bourdais it could be quite close for the championship. If it's Champ Car's last season (can you see a merger happening? I can't say I do), let's hope it's a good one.