Jari Matti Latvala

[MJW]

Just how many events is JML scheduled to start this year in a Stobart Focus WRC. Is it 16 or is there some split with a Group N car?

[Tomi]

it has been quite little news about him and how many, he self said many in a interview during rally around Cardiff.

[Koppomsbo]

Just how many events is JML scheduled to start this year in a Stobart Focus WRC. Is it 16 or is there some split with a Group N car?


http://www.stobartmotorsport.com/profile_latvala.asp


4??

[MJW]

http://www.stobartmotorsport.com/profile_latvala.asp


4?? refers to 2006 season

[A.F.F.]

Mr.Jouhki also said MANY.

[Christina]

But how many is "many"?

[Tomi]

But how many is "many"?

many is more than 2 but less than 20 :)

[fastboy]

Malcom Wilson has said at the minute 10 rounds but hopefully should be a full 16 if they can get the budget together,but he also said Ford would do everything possible to help him.
Motorsport News interviewed Gronholm who said he will retire if he is champion this year,and possibly even if he is not.Ford are weighing up options on his replacement but a solid year from Latvala will put him in pole position for the no 2 in 2008.

[Simmi]

Thats really exciting news. He is fast without question on all surfaces. About half way through last season I never thought he'd get an opportunity like this so lets hope he takes it.

[Tomi]

Ok, now more info, many is atleast 12 events with the Stobart car.

[Simmi]

He could do a Sordo this season I hope and work himself into a works seat for 08 or 09 when Marcus moves on.

[Tomi]

He could do a Sordo this season I hope and work himself into a works seat for 08 or 09 when Marcus moves on.

Yes, this season is very important for many privateers, in case Grönholm wins, he propably stops his carreer, also 2 Suzuki seats is avilable for next year, now it's really the right time to show if can drive or not.

[White Sauron]

Yes, this season is very important for many privateers, in case Grönholm wins, he propably stops his carreer, also 2 Suzuki seats is avilable for next year, now it's really the right time to show if can drive or not.


On crash.net confirmed Latvala will be Stobart's nominated driver on ALL 16 rallies. Great!!!!!!!!!!!!

[miksu]

On crash.net confirmed Latvala will be Stobart's nominated driver on ALL 16 rallies. Great!!!!!!!!!!!!

yeah, i was just posting the link and asking if i understand it correctly, but i guess i do! :)

http://www.crash.net/news_view~t~Stobart--We-will-do-all-16-events-with-three-cars-~cid~4~id~141816.htm

[Simmi]

Anyone know where the money has come from?

[Tomi]

Anyone know where the money has come from?

most of it I think from the village shop in Tuuri, and propably other sponsors too

[DonJippo]

most of it I think from the village shop in Tuuri, and propably other sponsors too

Yes other sponsor like these,

http://www.st1.fi/index_en.php
http://www.jarilatvala.com/

[Finni]

Great! I think this deal nearly corresponds being official driver.

I wait much from Jari-Matti.

[MJW]

most of it I think from the village shop in Tuuri, and propably other sponsors too

I heared it is Mr Joukhi paying for 2007.

[DonJippo]

I heared it is Mr Joukhi paying for 2007.

He is driver's manager and uses his connections and network to find sponsors and seats for drivers. He does not pay their drives.

[JAM]

Latvala is one of my hopes. The guy show skills to be a Gronholm's replace and is a young driver that deserves support rather than others. Go Go Go!!

[miksu]

here's a link to JM's press conference story. you can see the car in the back ground, and if thats the colour, it looks great!! though the car looks like plain ST focus. But the colour can be the same mainly black, with yellow/red ST1 logos.

http://www.yle.fi/urheilu/mediasali/video/id62425_rm.html

[pucky54]

It looks like he will drive the 2nd Stobart car in all 16 Events. Let's hope 4 that...

[Roy]

Jarri-Matti Latvala. That is the most impressed driver in this Norway weekend. Last year we saw him in 4 rallies in The Stobart Focus. This year he does al 16 rounds :up:

Last year he drives on tarmac in the Stobart and I call him a 'Crashtest Dummy' He was fast, but so much he had an accident. Even in PWRC (I follow a few) he had problems. I was affraid for a new Duval. But on the last rallies he won in PWRC. The 4th place in Wales GB was even fantastic.

This year he had one accident in Monaco. In Sweden and now in Norway his speed and driving are OK. The stage times are beautifull for a young gun he is! The Sunday is not drive yet, so I hope he is stay calm on place 5th.
For this year I hope he can score some solid points. He knows the most rallies becauce he drives in PWRC. I expect top 8 finishes. I hope he is is driving more with his head and can grow by Stobart -the driving school for Ford.

If this is the last year of Gronholm Latvala is in pole position for that seat. That would be OK for JM Latvala. But his target that year (2008) is points and some podiums.
And not a new Duval I hope: young, fast and broken cars! This year he (can) learn a lot.

[MJW]

Ford 08, Miko, JML & Henning?

[Christina]

Jari-matti is only actually confirmed for 12 events. I think some of the tarmac events he is yet to be confirmed for, like Ireland.

But he is doing extremely well! he said that at the end of last year that he matured as a driver and it shows in his australian, new zealand and GB results. I hope he does well in norway! it was a shame what happened in sweden with his engine because he was on the brink of scoring points.

[bowler]

stobart website has him listed for 16 events.

Let's hope they are right.

[pino]

I am very happy for his amazing performance so far, I've always liked him ever since I watched him at Acropolis 2003 :up: Malcom should sign him as replacement for Marcus :D

[Finni]

I think that this rally has not even showed Jari-Matti's level - except few flashes. Yestarday he had very bad starting position due to time-punishment.

[Finni]

I think that J-M has been at least match to Henning Solberg in this rally in terms of perfomance. I expect that Jari-Matti will be the leading driver of Stobart team for the rest of the year. He way more talented than Henning Solberg. I think already that it's likely that next year Ford drivers are Hirvonen and Latvala (if Grönholm retires). Henning will have no chances for factory seat as he is unable to deliver on asphalt.

[JAM]

Latvala is one of the young hopes. He is fast and now needs to prove that is also reliable. His mistakes were the result of strong speed and some lack of experience, but that could change.

On this rally he made a good perfomance, without the problem on the steering he would probably reach the 3rd place.

By the way, who is paying his presence on WRC? Stobart? If Stobart is paying then good, because this is really doing someting good for the sport and receive the exposure deserved.

[Roy]

Wow! He was flying... and again in a tree. He lost again his concentration. Why he can't stay driving? What is in his head?

What does he need? Who can helped these boy? With so many talent he must learn to concentrate.


Jari-Matti Latvala said:
“I am very disappointed with things today. We were in a strong podium position before the problem so it’s quite a big loss for me. We had a hydraulic problem on the stage before and I had to use the manual gear change during the stage. When I saw Loeb stopped maybe I lost some concentration but when we turned into the corner the car went straight and under-steered off. We hit a tree with the front of the car, spun around and blocked the stage. I was worried as Mikko was very close behind and I didn’t want to get in his road so we got the car moved into the bushes very quickly. Hopefully there is still a chance of getting some manufacturer points tomorrow, the battle is close with Subaru so at the minute every point will count.”

[Buzz Lightyear]

Wow! He was flying... and again in a tree. He lost again his concentration. Why he can't stay driving? What is in his head?

What does he need? Who can helped these boy? With so many talent he must learn to concentrate.



did you tell solberg, atkinson, marucs, and seb the same thing? i think this rally is like finland, with the road half the stage! its very dangerous, and no
margin for error. I can forgive jari on the occasion, as he is in good company.

[COD]

He said on Finnish TV that he lost his concentration because of the gearbox problems. However young he is, he has experience from 50 WRC events + numerous other rallies, so he should be able to handle those situations by now. Not ready for Ford no.2 yet I'm afraid.

[Tomi]

True, JM let outside things effect too much and seem loose the consentration when someting goes wrong, but when things works he drives very well, good result in Ireland and Wales and the second Ford seat is his, im quite sure about this, Henning is far to slow for the second car.

[Helstar]

I've seen the TV coverage and he was driving only with left hand on the wheel while right hand is busy on the tiny little gearbox ... it's not really confortable to race in that way, more and more in the tricky Japan roads ! We can forgive him =D he is great talent and future world champion IMHO.

[COD]

Henning is far to slow for the second car.

I don't think he has ever been seriously considered for that position

[Tomi]

I don't think he has ever been seriously considered for that position

I also dont think that, he is just the best measure when it comes to J-M, but there is not many privateers this year showin their skills around, that makes it difficult to compaire who would be good for the seat.
What comes to Latvala, theese same stories was about Mikko too not so long time ago, but not i dont think there is anyone anymore who doubt his driving skills.

[cut the b.s.]

I've seen the TV coverage and he was driving only with left hand on the wheel while right hand is busy on the tiny little gearbox .


Ah, just like the good old days :-)

JML is quick but its time for him to keep it together better, I almost could forgive him this error but for a photo I say where he was standing smiling with his stricken car, had he been tearing his hair out I'd have forgiven him, 2nd was there for him and with it a big boost to his hopes for the Ford 2nd seat next year and he blew it, I really hope he can do something great in RI and GB

[ste898]

He is good driver.....but not ready for BP Ford team yet!!!

[janneppi]

Latvala is doing well today, until of course a squirrel drops in his lap through the air went causing him to hit a tree.
Sometimes I scare myself. :(

[duff]

Exellent driver, a huge talent. I think he just needs another year to build up his consistency before heading to the works team.

[GigiGalliNo1]

he's really nice had a bit of a chat with him about a fellow forum-er here :p

[ZequeArgentina]

I Think he is he most talented driver (out of the already "works" drivers), his raw speed is only matchable in gravel by Loeb and Marcus (and probable Solberg an may be Atkinson, just that with the Sub no one can tell).

In tarmac he has been improving (but still far from those plus Sordo, or even Hirvonene and Kopecky).

For me he is readyto take the 2nd seat, not to lead the team this year, but buid him as team leader for 2009.

[Roy]

did you tell solberg, atkinson, marucs, and seb the same thing? i think this rally is like finland, with the road half the stage! its very dangerous, and no
margin for error. I can forgive jari on the occasion, as he is in good company.

It was not the first time this year for our young talent. This young talent he is great, but with no help with this problem he can't grow to an real point finisher.

[Roy]

I saw another thread about J-M Every time whe n he score a good position there is athread about him. Maybe we can mege them.

About Latvala. Great result in ireland. This is the boy I want to see, a boy who becama a man! No I say Put him in the second BP-Ford abu Dhabi (and Duval for Tarmac results). Or not...
He can lead a rally, now he much learn do stay concentrate. Maybe he can learn as offical driver in Works team, maybe one year at stobert for learning and become a consisstent driver.

Latvala is growing and I am happy (for him too) with this first podium finish in WRC. Great he can deliver that at young age.

[A.F.F.]

Yep... sorry for not looking this up.

[Roy]

Malcolm sees in Latvala new World Champion
"There is no question he is a star for the future and he will be World Champion."

Seat is safe for young Fin I think.

http://www.crash.net/motorsport/wrc/news/157435-0/wilson_sr_drops_latvala_hint.html

I hope he gets this oppertunity. He is very fast. In Norway, Finland, Italy, Japan, he set top times and lead for a while or was close. And he was fast in other rallies too.
Maybe for tarmac Ford can give the second seat to a tarmac driver, so they can beat Citroen harder. What I've seen so far Latvala can fast on each surface and tarmac is'nt bad. He can grow in skills.

If he stay on the road, keep his head cool, we can see him as World Champion in 2009? I hope so! I was always fan of Ford -I still do- and a drivers title was not important for me, (stupid fan, I know. Now Loeb wins to much, so I'm disapointed Gronholm make errors.) now Latvala can get my support.
That was the reason I was desperated he wasd to manny off road and I call him a craghtest dummy. I saw in him more, I was afraid M-Sport made a Duval again. Fast, but no results.

Now I say: I have hope in Latvala. :up: Offcourse he made errors, has a lot to learn and do sometimes stupid things. Yougsters and people in general don't things 100% always good.

Latvala for #2 in Ford team!

[A.F.F.]

Mikko did exactly what he has been told to with ford. During the process, he has grown to the top level. Might not be a bad idea to edvelop Jari-Matti the same way. Back Mikko up and develop at the same time. :up: :)

[N.O.T]

Jari MAtti is fast and thats the hard part when you need to be top driver.....Consistency will come one way or another....I don't think he is a good option for the official team if the team wants the championship next year...but he can sure turn some heads with his speed.

[Simmi]

It will be interesting to see what happens in Wales with Jari Matti. I'm sure with the manu title sewn up Malcolm will be telling both Mikko and JML to go for it to put pressure on Loeb.

[Tomi]

It will be interesting to see what happens in Wales with Jari Matti. I'm sure with the manu title sewn up Malcolm will be telling both Mikko and JML to go for it to put pressure on Loeb.

true, it will be interesting to see how he does against Sordo too, i think it gives somekind of hint about Fords next years manu. title possiblities.

[ITC55]

It will be interesting to see what happens in Wales with Jari Matti. I'm sure with the manu title sewn up Malcolm will be telling both Mikko and JML to go for it to put pressure on Loeb.

It will be interesting for sure, i think Jari Matti will be right on the pace, but wilson may pull him back and tell him and Henning to collect good points for stobart, especially if the thrid place in the points may be crucial to retaining stobart as a sponsor next year

Wouldn't it be great to have a leader board like this Gronholm, Hirvonen, Latvala, H.Solberg, P.Solberg then Loeb......
Not that i don't like Loeb but he has a few more years in the WRC

[jonas_mcrae]

With the way he drove in Wales I think he WILL be the second driver at ford next year. Unless Wilson gets Duval or Garde or someone with more experience to back up Mikko, Jari Matti will wear number 4 next season.

[Brother John]

In Belgium newspaper stood that Duval can get the asphalt rallys from Wilson with Ford but for the gravel rallys he must bring 1000.000 Euro.

He has not that quantity of money or a sponsor!

[Magnus]

But you have soon BJ :)
Maybe you can help him?

[Brother John]

But you have soon BJ :)
Maybe you can help him?

Yes I have to call A.F.F. as soon as possible. :D

[Tomi]

Yes I have to call A.F.F. as soon as possible. :D

Dont waste your hard earned money in Duval.

[A.F.F.]

In Helsingin Sanomat today, they said it all depends how the negotions with Ford go on. If M-Sport manage to convince Ford to continue after 2008 with another four year deal, then Jari-Matti's stakes are high.

If Ford refuse to renew the deal, then Duval is logical option with money purse.

[AndyRAC]

Rememeber seeing J-ML on Epynt in 2002 I think in a white Renault Clio, would've been one of his first events over here. And later that year in the Cambrian Rally finished 2nd in an Impreza I think behind a young Finnish driver in a yellow Impreza, a guy called Hirvonen,mmm they both beat Burton's Peugeot Cosworth. Who'd have thought then what we know now, though they were both promising.

[A.F.F.]

Who'd have thought then what we know now, though they were both promising.


Mr. Jouhki ;)

[Tomi]

Rememeber seeing J-ML on Epynt in 2002 I think in a white Renault Clio, would've been one of his first events over here. And later that year in the Cambrian Rally finished 2nd in an Impreza I think behind a young Finnish driver in a yellow Impreza, a guy called Hirvonen,mmm they both beat Burton's Peugeot Cosworth. Who'd have thought then what we know now, though they were both promising.

thats nice in rally, to follow the carreer of drivers you belive in, how they step by step getting to the top.

[Tomi]

Mr. Jouhki ;)
I think Hirvonen was a bit open card, but with Latvala there has never been any doupts.

[AndyRAC]

I think Hirvonen was a bit open card, but with Latvala there has never been any doupts.

I'd have to agree, Pirelli Rally of 2003, think it was Falstone, and Pentti was standing behind me, as he was his mentor I believe. I've followed his career almost from the start. The speed is there, now it's just the consistency, which seems to be coming as well. Nice guy as well.
Go Jari-Matti!!!

[Tomi]

I'd have to agree, Pirelli Rally of 2003, think it was Falstone, and Pentti was standing behind me, as he was his mentor I believe. I've followed his career almost from the start. The speed is there, now it's just the consistency, which seems to be coming as well. Nice guy as well.
Go Jari-Matti!!!

I heard from Pentti first time about JM too, he told that very talented guy is in his school.
Lol, soon if Conrad Rautenbach and Garreth Jones gets in WRC cars, a quite big amount of todays WRC drivers has been in Penttis school.

[greencroft]

Delighted to see young JML doing so well.

I am fortunate in that I now own his first 4wd car, the Lancer Evo6 he drove to second place on the Cambrian mentioned above. In years to come, I think I will have a WRC car, that's a World Rally Champion's car!

[Tom206wrc]

For information, this week-end JMM will drive a Toyota Corolla WRC at the Ronde Prealpi Mastershow in Italy ;)

http://www.prealpimastershow.net

Mikko Hirvonen will be there also in a Focus WRC as car number 0... :)

[AlfaWRC]

For information, this week-end JMM will drive a Toyota Corolla WRC at the Ronde Prealpi Mastershow in Italy ;)

http://www.prealpimastershow.net

Mikko Hirvonen will be there also in a Focus WRC as car number 0... :)

Thanks! Is it sure that Mikko will be there as zero car?
Is that Rally Sprint run on Saturday or Sunday?

[Tom206wrc]

It's a rally show(very short stages) ;)

[Tom206wrc]

After three stages on the Prealpi Trevigiane Mastershow Latvala is leading the field for 14s(over S2000 driver Luca Rossetti) :D :D

[AlfaWRC]

Anywhere pics to find?

[Tom206wrc]

Victory for JMM :bounce:

Incredible 4th best place overall(1st GrN)for other Finn Jari Ketomaa :eek:

[Miika]

Ford announced at the ROC that J-M truly is Mikko´s team-mate next year.

[rp]

It´s confirmed! Latvala is the second Ford´s works driver...

[Zes]

Yess!!! 3+2years!!!!

[Woodeye]

http://www.iltasanomat.fi/urheilu/uutinen.asp?id=1466685

So Ford remains being still Finnair! :D :up:

[Roy]

Is nice when I can understand too.
Can someone translate, do someone know a English text?

[tmx]

congrats to jari for getting the manu's seat. *weep*

[teufel]

Congrats to JM, i wanna see him winning at least one round next year!

[ouninpojha]

Hello everybody...First, i'm sorry for my bad english, i'm french and it's the first time that i'm go on a english forum...

I think it's not a good choice for wilson, to nominate Latvala on the second car, because he's not regular. He have often accident and for the constructor championships it's not good, because, Citroën have two drivers who are constant et fast...(espacilly Loeb :D )

But it's not very important, because i'm a fan of Citroën, and Loeb of course ;)

And i'm sorry again for my english...

[pino]

Hello everybody...First, i'm sorry for my bad english, i'm french and it's the first time that i'm go on a english forum...

I think it's not a good choice for wilson, to nominate Latvala on the second car, because he's not regular. He have often accident and for the constructor championships it's not good, because, Citroën have two drivers who are constant et fast...(espacilly Loeb :D )

But it's not very important, because i'm a fan of Citroën, and Loeb of course ;)

And i'm sorry again for my english...

You should be more sorry for what You've just posted rather than for your english ;)

[janneppi]

BTW ouninpojha, is the wrong spelling of name Ouninpohja intentional, or a slip of the keyboard.? ;)

[ouninpojha]

Sorry but what is BTW?

In fact, i choose this name on another forum 2 years ago, and i didn't know if the "J" war befor or after "h".

And, when you write ouninpojha, it's more easy with the "J" before "H"..lol

[koko0703]

No surprize, very logical choice for Ford, but still good to hear Latavala is confirmed to be in Ford works seat. I'm very looking forward to seeing him on the stage next year.

[Roy]

Yess!!! 3+2years!!!!

Where do you can find this. that is amazing.

I found this:
http://www.crash.net/motorsport/wrc/news/158199-0/ford_confirms_line-up.html
http://www.m-sport.co.uk/news/198

This news is a nice birthday present :bounce:

[janneppi]

Sorry but what is BTW?

In fact, i choose this name on another forum 2 years ago, and i didn't know if the "J" war befor or after "h".

And, when you write ouninpojha, it's more easy with the "J" before "H"..lol
BTW is short for by the way. :)
Just wanted to make sure it wasn't a typing error that needs fixing. :)

[Zes]

Where do you can find this. that is amazing.

I found this:
http://www.crash.net/motorsport/wrc/news/158199-0/ford_confirms_line-up.html
http://www.m-sport.co.uk/news/198

This news is a nice birthday present :bounce:

Here: http://www.yle.fi/tekstitv/txt/P203_01.html Only in finnish...

[Brother John]

Nice to see J-M Latvala with the official Ford team.
Good choice from Ford for the future. Ford has a good marriage with the rally sport and looks ahead in the future of young top drivers. :up:
Ford and rally that´s tradition, they stay in good and bad times with rally, what we can not say of other brands in WRC.

[cut the b.s.]

Nice for JML, well done to him, Ford should be in a very strong position to win both titles in 2012 when Loeb has retired

ps. I think JML will get a title before Mikko ever does

[Tom206wrc]

Congratulations to Jari-Matti ;)

[Frozzy]

congrats to JML hopefully next season he'll get rid of his terrible luck this year and actually win an event because he has the speed to lead but then theres allways bad luck there stop him in his tracks

[dyfi1]

Jari Matti..... Onnea ja `Hirvi` vaara ;)

[A.F.F.]

Justice is served :up:

But what's equally interesting is that Jari-Matti's contract is multi-year, hence it goes beyond the proposed change of rules which means that Ford has planned to stay in rallying even the machinery should change dramatically :bounce:

Anyways... good luck for young Latvala :D

[DonJippo]

But what's equally interesting is that Jari-Matti's contract is multi-year, hence it goes beyond the proposed change of rules which means that Ford has planned to stay in rallying even the machinery should change dramatically

That's not entirely true, Ford has not yet confirmed it's going to be there after 2008. So in fact the contract at this point is only for one year and only after Ford confirms it will continue in WRC and with M-Sport it becomes multi-year contract as has been told.

[traxx]

Firts pictures of Jari on official Ford Focus :
http://wrc.is.free.fr/posts/2007/12/17/432-latvala-au-volant

[Roy]

Here: http://www.yle.fi/tekstitv/txt/P203_01.html Only in finnish...

Thnx, for info. Looks like I can trust. I conclude Ford for long term in WRC.

Another thing: This is embarrassing, does nobody of this forum noticed today is my birthday? :bigcry: :( :rolleyes: :down:

[A.F.F.]

That's not entirely true, Ford has not yet confirmed it's going to be there after 2008. So in fact the contract at this point is only for one year and only after Ford confirms it will continue in WRC and with M-Sport it becomes multi-year contract as has been told.

Ok. Thanks for correction.

[jonkka]

That's not entirely true, Ford has not yet confirmed it's going to be there after 2008. So in fact the contract at this point is only for one year and only after Ford confirms it will continue in WRC and with M-Sport it becomes multi-year contract as has been told.

Your jumping the gun too. Why did Wilson wait for so long until announcing his 2nd driver for 2008? And why didn't Suzuki come out with their drivers earlier?

My 2c is that M-Sport did have contract with Ford to run in the WRC until end of 2008 only. Wilson was negotiating about extension of the deal and without knowing about the future, he did not know if his choice of drivers would be for short-term (2008 only) or long-term. This much he said himself.

If Ford would have said, "drive 2008 first and then we'll see if we'll extend the deal", Wilson would have had to sign the best possible driver to deliver results in 2008 and I think that best option for that was Gardemeister (he knew the team and is reliable points scorer).

But as it is, seems that Ford agreed to extend the deal and Wilson was able to take the long-term view, now being sure that 2008 results did not play a role in the future decisions. Hence, he was able to sign Latvala. Two young Ford drivers likely won't retain Ford's manufacturers crown in 2008 but if they continue to learn at this rate, Ford will be very strong team in 2009. Gardemeister was not needed and Suzuki signed him.

Ford's lack of confirmation (see below, it's the 3) of being in WRC beyond 2008 could be down to politics, they want to know what the rules will be and witholding their confirmation, wish to be able to influence those rules.

Note that there are three different Ford's in this:
1 - Ford Motor Company
2 - M-Sport, which has deal with (1) to run the
3 - BP Ford World Rally Team

[Tomi]

Your jumping the gun too. Why did Wilson wait for so long until announcing his 2nd driver for 2008? And why didn't Suzuki come out with their drivers earlier?

My 2c is that M-Sport did have contract with Ford to run in the WRC until end of 2008 only. Wilson was negotiating about extension of the deal and without knowing about the future, he did not know if his choice of drivers would be for short-term (2008 only) or long-term. This much he said himself.

If Ford would have said, "drive 2008 first and then we'll see if we'll extend the deal", Wilson would have had to sign the best possible driver to deliver results in 2008 and I think that best option for that was Gardemeister (he knew the team and is reliable points scorer).

But as it is, seems that Ford agreed to extend the deal and Wilson was able to take the long-term view, now being sure that 2008 results did not play a role in the future decisions. Hence, he was able to sign Latvala. Two young Ford drivers likely won't retain Ford's manufacturers crown in 2008 but if they continue to learn at this rate, Ford will be very strong team in 2009. Gardemeister was not needed and Suzuki signed him.

Ford's lack of confirmation (see below, it's the 3) of being in WRC beyond 2008 could be down to politics, they want to know what the rules will be and witholding their confirmation, wish to be able to influence those rules.

Note that there are three different Ford's in this:
1 - Ford Motor Company
2 - M-Sport, which has deal with (1) to run the
3 - BP Ford World Rally Team

Nice theory but Gardemeister was signed long time ago already.

[Wim_Impreza]

Thnx, for info. Looks like I can trust. I conclude Ford for long term in WRC.

Another thing: This is embarrassing, does nobody of this forum noticed today is my birthday? :bigcry: :( :rolleyes: :down:

Happy birthday. ;)

Nice to see Latvala has the seat, I think he could do very well next year.

[jonkka]

Nice theory but Gardemeister was signed long time ago already.

Have you seen the actual contract and it's text? How do you know there isn't a clause nulling it void if better offer was made to Toni?

I admit that naming the Wilson's alternative as Gardemeister might be far-fetched (I suspected it myself before Ford's announcement) but logic I presented should be sound.

[Tomi]

Have you seen the actual contract and it's text? How do you know there isn't a clause nulling it void if better offer was made to Toni?

I admit that naming the Wilson's alternative as Gardemeister might be far-fetched (I suspected it myself before Ford's announcement) but logic I presented should be sound.

Wont tell how i know, but Garde was signed about the same time he started cancel events he already was in the entry using the excuse there is no money, far before Grönholm announced he will stop.

[jonkka]

Ok, I will take your word for it.

[DonJippo]

Your jumping the gun too.

It's in here...
http://www.hs.fi/urheilu/autourheilu/artikkeli/Ford+valitsi+Latvalan+Gr%C3%B6nholmin+saappaisiin/1135232640247

[Roy]

That's not entirely true, Ford has not yet confirmed it's going to be there after 2008. So in fact the contract at this point is only for one year and only after Ford confirms it will continue in WRC and with M-Sport it becomes multi-year contract as has been told.

Not jet, but:
Ian Slater, Vice President Communications of Ford of Europe and Premium Automotive Group, said the team's new driver line-up is a key aspect of Ford's strategy. "Ford of Europe is planning for a long-term success in the WRC.
Well long term is longer then 2008, I would say.
http://www.m-sport.co.uk/news/198



Happy birthday. ;)

:up: thnx ;)

[A.F.F.]

Well, the most important thing is that I was right, right ?? ;) :p :

[jonkka]

Left. :eek:

[ST205GT4]

Ford and rally that´s tradition, they stay in
good and bad times with rally, what we can not say of other brands in WRC.

I don't know about that. I wouldn't say Subaru has been having such a great time for the last few years!

[Brother John]

I don't know about that. I wouldn't say Subaru has been having such a great time for the last few years!

I have not yet seen Subaru in rally for more than 30 years! :D

[koko0703]

Two young Ford drivers likely won't retain Ford's manufacturers crown in 2008 but if they continue to learn at this rate, Ford will be very strong team in 2009.

I don't neccessarily count out Hirvonen-Latvala Ford from the manufacturer championship next year because they are fighting against Loeb himself. I think both Mikko and J-L can stay ahead of Sordo on gravel, and with little help from Subarus, who may finish ahead of Sordo, the chamiponship should be pretty close. I personally think Citoren vs. Ford is 50-50 chance next year.

[ST205GT4]

I have not yet seen Subaru in rally for more than 30 years! :D

15 years isn't a bad commitment.

[Viking]

15 years isn't a bad commitment.

25 years!

http://www.rallybase.nl/index.php?type=make&makeid=2

[gloomyDAY]

I love this chap's talent, but I'm worried about the DNF's.

He has the speed and now he just needs to be consistent. Rally GB would have been a highlight for him this year, but his windshield kept fogging. Damn shame! Best of luck to him and I'm anxious to see how JML will perfom at Monte Carlo.

[ST205GT4]

Well spotted Viking. I thought they'd only entered at a world level in the early 90s.

[Roy]

Can somebody tell the young Fin, now he drives for a big team and he is a famous person, he needs a new website? Really his site is crap. http://www.latvalamotorsport.com

[DonJippo]

Can somebody tell the young Fin, now he drives for a big team and he is a famous person, he needs a new website? Really his site is crap. www.latvalamotorsport.com (http://www.latvalamotorsport.com)

As per request ... http://www.jmlatvala.com/

[Roy]

As per request ... http://www.jmlatvala.com/

Thnx! A good site. Never see it.

[User]

And they have all the same site :D

(http://www.plopcrew.net/)

[Finni]

I read his thoughts and got worried that his driving might be too much affected by Wilson's contual ordering. J-M has once used Grönholm's old psychologist to get out of his head in the race situation but if there is continually worriesome team-boss spitting orders how to drive I am not sure if J-M is in the best state of mind to do his absolute potential on the road.

[Tomi]

I read his thoughts and got worried that his driving might be too much affected by Wilson's contual ordering. J-M has once used Grönholm's old psychologist to get out of his head in the race situation but if there is continually worriesome team-boss spitting orders how to drive I am not sure if J-M is in the best state of mind to do his absolute potential on the road.

I dont think there will be any problems, now he get tests before the events and his job is to secure points not to win rallies, much easier for him than last year.

[Karukera]

Exactly. Latvala's pace and consistency is best JM's friend.

Wilson will indeed probably freeze JML on a couple of occasions but if they want to retain the manu crown they actually have to go for it.

I even expect Hirvonen to stand back behind JML sooner or later in the season on some rallies, on Wilson's orders to ensure manu and Mikko's points.

Sure, JML will take some points away from Mikko but that's what Mikko did in 2007 from Marcus, 5 points. Fair.

So to me Sordo and Citroën should seriously worry, not JML. :)

[Roy]

He does it again. 2 times in one rally he make a mistake. First time he cut a corner to much Result: flat tyre. Second time he broke a part of the car.
Hey :wave: Latvala! Are you wake up? You must stay on the road, you are a Manufacturer driver.
I think he can handle the pressure, but must learn to drive on tarmac and stay on the road. On day four he showed the real Latvala That is the Jari Matti Latvala I want to see. Go further with this! And watch out by cutting corners.

Latvala:
"I made two mistakes and it was a long and difficult weekend, but I found good speed today and I was happy with my times," said 22-year-old Latvala. "It's unfortunate they came three days too late. I've learned much about cutting corners with the new tyres - I can't afford to do that if I want to finish rallies. Today I also learned I have to be aggressive in turning for the tyres to work to their best."

[gloomyDAY]

The acne is what's holding JML back. Once that clears up....no, I'm kidding!

As someone else mentioned JML just needs to be consistent. His times are spectacular when he finishes without any incidents. The speed, resources, and ability are all abundantly available. All he needs to do is work harder to bring the car home.

[A.F.F.]

I still think Monte is the worst possible place to start as manu driver. Some succeed, some don't.

[Donney]

Come on he is learning and learning fast and Monte Carlo is a tough nut to crack. I think he is going to be the next big thing in rallying.

He did a good rally apart from those mistakes.

[Roy]

If we give numbers to Latvala each rally. My list:
Monte 6. Sweden 9. He drives very good. Lead from ss2 until last stage. Very mature, very fast. Why not a 10. What is perfect drive. He has an almost off. ok, he corrected well thats why a 9.

To win at this age and so early in the season is wonderfull. This remark for Latvala makes this thread complete! :bounce:

[Zico]

If we give numbers to Latvala each rally. My list:
Monte 6. Sweden 9. He drives very good. Lead from ss2 until last stage. Very mature, very fast. Why not a 10. What is perfect drive. He has an almost off. ok, he corrected well thats why a 9.

To win at this age and so early in the season is wonderfull. This remark for Latvala makes this thread complete! :bounce:

Indeed..

Unquestionable raw pace yet usually many crashes and mistakes, kinda reminds me of Colin in this aspect, he can only improve with experience, If he's lucky (and seb isnt :D )..who knows.. maybe a future WDC?

Thoroughly deserved.. Im very happy for him.. :)

[jacko]

... Why not a 10. What is perfect drive. He has an almost off. ok, he corrected well thats why a 9...
..i think he should get a 11 point score with an almost off and his correction on that situation...

[duff]

An excellent drive from the young fella. For me this is already making 2008 more interesting than I thought it may be.
I hope (& believe) that this win won't be the only one for J-M this year...

[DonJippo]

Why not a 10. What is perfect drive. He has an almost off. ok, he corrected well thats why a 9.

Name a driver who didn't have almost off? They all do in every event.

[Roy]

Name a driver who didn't have almost off? They all do in every event.

A 10 is perfect. I give never and never a 10, because nobody is perfect. even my girlfriend I give a 10- (almost perfect) ;)

[Brother John]

A 10 is perfect. I give never and never a 10, because nobody is perfect. even my girlfriend I give a 10- (almost perfect) ;)

And my name is Nobody. :p : :s mokin:

[ZequeArgentina]

Everybody is changing opinion too quickly.
In Montecarlo everybody was bashing him and looking who could replace JML by second half of the year,see here:
http://rallybase.motorsportforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=413757#post413757

Now he is god, come on be a little more rational and not so reactive.

Sorry if someonefeel himself offended. Not my intention.

[Brother John]

Everybody is changing opinion too quickly.
In Montecarlo everybody was bashing him and looking who could replace JML by second half of the year,see here:
http://rallybase.motorsportforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=413757#post413757

Now he is god, come on be a little more rational and not so reactive.

Sorry if someonefeel himself offended. Not my intention.

I agree with your post, it goes most of the time this way here on the forum!

[Roy]

I agree with your post, it goes most of the time this way here on the forum!

o yeah. This day you 'smash' other form members? Everybody sucks, besides nobody? Mr Nobody?

About changing too quickly. I don't know its about me, but it is my post what is quoted here the most. I see al lot in Latvala and for many years. But I saw a crashtest dummy I was/am afraid he is too fast and crash the car. We saw it on Monte, but day 3 he was fast and consistent like Sweden the whole weekend.

I hope he can do more this year. If he stays on the road he can be fight with Loeb. He can test more then last year, so he can be faster. My point last year was: Latvala must be learn to stay on road. Does he learn enough this year to win the title in 2009? Or maybe this year? The speed is there.

[Brother John]

o yeah. This day you 'smash' other form members? Everybody sucks, besides nobody? Mr Nobody?


"smash" other Forum members???????? can't you say here not your opinion? What are we here intolerant.
My name is nobody! it had been meant as a joke!!!! of moet ik het in het Nederlands zeggen!!!

[Viking]

Everybody is changing opinion too quickly.
In Montecarlo everybody was bashing him and looking who could replace JML by second half of the year,see here:
http://rallybase.motorsportforum.com/forums/showthread.php?p=413757#post413757

Now he is god, come on be a little more rational and not so reactive.

Sorry if someonefeel himself offended. Not my intention.

Absolutely! After Sweden i think Loeb is on his way down, he crash to often, has no luck and Citroen can’t build engines! I cant see another rally where he can beat Latvala :D

[Brother John]

Absolutely! After Sweden i think Loeb is on his way down, he crash to often, has no luck and Citroen can’t build engines! I cant see another rally where he can beat Latvala :D

Maybe Loeb don´t like his new boss? :p For this reason he wanted friday evening already to go home! :D

[Zico]

Interesting comment by Loeb in this weeks motoring news.. He thinks Jari Matti is quicker than Gronholm already!

[Corny]

he might be, but over a year distance Marcus will score more points:d

[Zico]

he might be, but over a year distance Marcus will score more points:d

Agreed.. for this season at least.

[Roy]

Latvala can follow F1 car with a WRC. Nice video at WRC.com
http://www.wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=310&featureid=571&desc=Latvala%20races%20a%20plane%20and%20a%20Formu la%20One%20car


Now I pick this thead up, a short analyse of Latvala first half season as works driver.

The tarmac roads of Monte was the first 2 days very bad. He did cut corners where he can't and was slow. But the third day he learned a lot and it was ok. It is promised for the tarmac rallies in the second half of the season. In Sweden we saw the Latvala we hope we see more of this. Fast and reliable from start to finish. Very nice run.
On gravel roads Latvala shows his speed, but also his errors. But also car failures give him not the results what he earns. This season Ford has a lot of suspension failures. In Turkey the young Fin shows a lot of speed -again- and also reliable drive.

For Finland I think he can fight again for win with Hirvonen and Loeb. On tarmac rallies he is not strong. But the other gravel rallies in part II of this season he can also fight for the win. Latvala showed more and more a mature drive.

It depends on how he come back from the break. His mature drive come also from all the rallies he drive after almost 2 weeks after again. Now there is for 6 weeks no rally. Fall Latvla back to a crashtest dummy or can he hold his growing drive?
If Latvala holds it, he is what Loeb said over him: "Latvala is faster than Gronholm." If he falls back also a Loeb qoute: "Hirvonen is my biggest opponent, he is very consistent." For so far you can't say that about Latvala. Fast, but not consistent as Hirvonen and Loeb. Looking back to part I of this season it will be promised second part of 2008 for Latvala and the competition.

[Bobcat]

Ford Rally Star Jari-Matti Latvala Takes On Nurburgring With The Focus RS
http://paddocktalk.com/news/html/story-132836.html
http://media.ford.com/news/forduniversitychallenge-colognestudentspreparefocusrsfornurburgring.htm

[gloomyDAY]

Sick! I can't wait for the pictures.

Are there any pictures of the car?

[Roy]

Sick! I can't wait for the pictures.

Are there any pictures of the car?

Not so spectacular see at: http://www.worldrallypics.com/ford

[Bobcat]

Sick! I can't wait for the pictures.

Are there any pictures of the car?
http://www.frst.ch/%7Ene0dyme/images/vln/VLN_23.jpg

http://www.frst.ch/%7Ene0dyme/images/vln/VLN_22.jpg

http://www.frst.ch/%7Ene0dyme/images/vln/VLN_18.jpg

http://www.frst.ch/%7Ene0dyme/images/vln/VLN_19.jpg

http://www.frst.ch/%7Ene0dyme/images/vln/VLN_21.jpg

[6789]

Jari has the open faced helmet on still :D

[Woodeye]

Who are the two women in the pic?

[gloomyDAY]

Who are the two women in the pic?Second and third drivers? I was about to ask the same question.

Thanks for the pics guys!

[Viking]

Who are the two women in the pic?

Easy, Anja Wassertheuer, Stuttgart and Daniela Schmid , Österreich ;)

[FlyFinnsFly]

I meet Jari four weeks from tomorrow and it's my second time meeting him as i met him last year at a Ford show here in Northern Ireland

[N.O.T]

I meet Jari four weeks from tomorrow and it's my second time meeting him as i met him last year at a Ford show here in Northern Ireland

and ?

[bluuford]

Jaaaaari.... Maaattti Latvala :-) What else! You know he/she just wanted to tell that he meets to one of the superstars? You didn't know that WRC drivers are superstars? Well, they are for FFF and it is the most important thing:-)

Greetings from Vienna:-)

[J.Lindstroem]

I meet Jari four weeks from tomorrow and it's my second time meeting him as i met him last year at a Ford show here in Northern Ireland

NICE!

you are freckin famous. almost.

[FlyFinnsFly]

Well also my brother met him along with Mikko and Jarmo last year as he met Mikko and Jarmo at a Ford dealership and those pics are on Jon44w

[N.O.T]

wow.... any other drivers you have met ?

[FlyFinnsFly]

well just Jari but my brother did meet Malcolm Wilson and Stephen Finlay in '95 though

[N.O.T]

stephen finlay ??

wow...

[FlyFinnsFly]

Yeah he's got the signed poster up in his room and in my room, i have Jari's autograph up and it's been up since 7th June 2009 and i wont take it down never

[Daniel]

You'll find that most people have met one or more drivers.

I've met Tommi M, Juha K, Mikko H, Colin, Alister, Marcus G, Sebastien, Francois Duval, Richard Burns, Carlos Sainz and the list goes on. No one is impressed by the fact that you've met one driver......

[driveace]

I meet thousands of drivers every day coming towards me ,passing me,so i have met lots of Tommys ,Jari,s Marcus,s,Dicks ,Harrys,no great deal meeting other drivers then!

[A.F.F.]

I have met Daniel who have met numerous drivers from WRC. I'm not sure if I'm a celebrity but I feel like one :)

[A.F.F.]

Oh, he's banned... again :mark:

[Rallyper]

So, can we go back to serious matter on this topic as well? And leave the childish talk to other forums. :dozey:

[A.F.F.]

Funny, I think it was january 2009 when this forum turned to such a dull place it is novadays :dozey:

[J.Lindstroem]

i HAVE BEEN ON THIS FORUM FOR 7 YEARS AND I HAVE NEVER SEEN IT IN BETTER SHAPE.

TRUE STORY.

[Barreis]

What do you have to do to be banned?

[GigiGalliNo1]

I think JML won fair and square in NZ. His consistency worked out in the end and errors by other drivers are what made him win. Mikko as well fell down that hole and didn't come out on top.

[Mintexmemory]

What do you have to do to be banned?

Find a moderator's sore spot / PC paranoia and keep rubbing :)

[Francis44]

Now to Portugal, it will be interesting to see how he goes here, we know he had a major crash last year and I dont think he will enter in attack mode, specially on the Felizes stage.

BTW I dont know what's going on but theres loads of off-topic here, a mod might aswell fix this nonsense.

[duff]

BTW I dont know what's going on but theres loads of off-topic here, a mod might aswell fix this nonsense.

Yep.
I do remember the days when this forum did have mostly interesting banter and information and every thread didn't end up in some kind of s#*t fight over what N.O.T or Daniel (though not Daniel so much recently) have said. And yes, they do bring it on themselves constantly and consistently but its up to the level headed of us to not bite.

Whoops, I forgot myself, now I'm WAY off topic...

Go JML. Huge talent and most importantly the calmest driving face since McRae :)

[Ucci]

Let's enojoy and look closer JML's endurance race-24 hours of Nürburgring, starting tomorrow at 03:00 p.m.
Team achived 101-position in qualifications (total of 198 cars).

[Maui J.]

I've only just noticed by watching the in-car from NZ, but Jari-Matti does a bit of tongue steering. Not to the same level as Duval but just now and then.


Great consistent drive in NZ without mistakes. Good luck to him and Mikka in Portugal.

[gloomyDAY]

Doubters have vanished from the thread.

How convenient. Stay hidden!

[AndyRAC]

Jari-Matti is driving in the Nurburgring 24 Hours.......

[MJW]

Jari-Matti is driving in the Nurburgring 24 Hours.......
Any website links, results or preferably videos?

[AndyRAC]

Any website links, results or preferably videos?

http://www.radiolemans.com/

http://www.24stundenonline.de/index.php

http://adac.24h-rennen.de/Streaming.4101.0.html?&L=1&cHash=f6a7d1bb2f

[Sladden]

Im glad JML won this round. Althou both the Sebastiens was stronger than him..it kind of felt like they lost it rather than him winning New Zealand.

[Tom206wrc]

Guess what happened...just few minutes ago in Portugal :rolleyes: :s

[Wim_Impreza]

Better this with quite fast times and a victory in the Rally New Zealand then very slow stage times as Hirvonen is again doing.

[FlyFinnsFly]

Saw Jari-Matti on the 6th and it was a crazy day with so much going on

[Daniel]

Who cares?

[FlyFinnsFly]

shut ur beak

[Daniel]

The thing is most people on here have seen a race/rally driver or five....

[bluuford]

FFF, listen, you are going to loose your good night sleep now.. I play basketball every week together with real rally driver :-) And now comes the part that is not allowed below 16 years..that rally driver has even won one JWRC round !
:-P

[Bobcat]

World Rally Championship - News - Latvala to help Hirvonen’s title push (http://www.wrc.com/news/latvala-to-help-hirvonens-title-push/?fid=14964)

"Despite Latvala’s offer of support to Hirvonen, Ford Abu Dhabi World Rally Team head Malcolm Wilson says he won’t be making Hirvonen the squad’s number one driver just yet. “For the time being the drivers’ position [as equal number ones] stays as it is,” said Wilson."

[Barreis]

Let we hope they'll go off.

[Juha_Koo]

Let we hope they'll go off.

I usually bear with your incredible commentary but that's just total plain BS and extremely stupid thing to say. It's very sad and terrible to see that you have so much hatred in you, that you really wish those kind of things. It's immature and horrific. Off in Finland is always dangerous because speeds are so high. We've been very lucky not to have fatalities in many years on WRC level. Wanting someone to go off is beyond my understanding. Yes, I usually watch rallying in "places" and I try to find action, but I don't have any special wishes for anybody to go off, it's just because in those places you can see the best driving too.

Let we hope that they deliver a strong result in Finland and keep it on the road.

[Tomi]

Off in Finland is always dangerous because speeds are so high. We've been very lucky not to have fatalities in many years on WRC level. Wanting someone to go off is beyond my understanding.

You have to understand that some of theese tossers have never seen a rally and have no clue what so ever what it is about.

[focus206]

World Rally Championship - News - Latvala to help Hirvonen’s title push (http://www.wrc.com/news/latvala-to-help-hirvonens-title-push/?fid=14964)

"Despite Latvala’s offer of support to Hirvonen, Ford Abu Dhabi World Rally Team head Malcolm Wilson says he won’t be making Hirvonen the squad’s number one driver just yet. “For the time being the drivers’ position [as equal number ones] stays as it is,” said Wilson."
Ok, but if he keep on destroying his Fiesta (if it's really his fault) on every rally, he can do nothing to help Mikko and the team, he must be more clever.

[tfp]

I usually bear with your incredible commentary but that's just total plain BS and extremely stupid thing to say. It's very sad and terrible to see that you have so much hatred in you, that you really wish those kind of things. It's immature and horrific. Off in Finland is always dangerous because speeds are so high. We've been very lucky not to have fatalities in many years on WRC level. Wanting someone to go off is beyond my understanding. Yes, I usually watch rallying in "places" and I try to find action, but I don't have any special wishes for anybody to go off, it's just because in those places you can see the best driving too.

Let we hope that they deliver a strong result in Finland and keep it on the road.

Lets hope for a ford 1-2 for the flying finns :)

Oh, and the ignore button could be our friend here ;)

[tfp]

Ok, but if he keep on destroying his Fiesta (if it's really his fault) on every rally, he can do nothing to help Mikko and the team, he must be more clever.

I wouldnt say for every rally, if you had said every practice, then you'd be right:-)

[Juha_Koo]

Ok, but if he keep on destroying his Fiesta (if it's really his fault) on every rally, he can do nothing to help Mikko and the team, he must be more clever.

Could you list which mechanical failures that JML has had this season happened because of him?

[Barreis]

I usually bear with your incredible commentary but that's just total plain BS and extremely stupid thing to say. It's very sad and terrible to see that you have so much hatred in you, that you really wish those kind of things. It's immature and horrific. Off in Finland is always dangerous because speeds are so high. We've been very lucky not to have fatalities in many years on WRC level. Wanting someone to go off is beyond my understanding. Yes, I usually watch rallying in "places" and I try to find action, but I don't have any special wishes for anybody to go off, it's just because in those places you can see the best driving too.

Let we hope that they deliver a strong result in Finland and keep it on the road.

Then let's say small off. :)

[tmx]

Could you list which mechanical failures that JML has had this season happened because of him? Loeb cars always had better reliability, since his full season from 2003 until now, his cars doesn't break down very often. Notice I said Loeb's cars, not Citreon's customer cars.

[focus206]

Could you list which mechanical failures that JML has had this season happened because of him?
It's not easy to say if the mechanical failures are caused by his driving style or because the reliability of the Fiesta. Of course, the Fiesta has a worse reliability than the DS3, but if you see Mikko, he had way less problems than Jari-Matti, even if he still drive a Fiesta. It can be bad luck, but it can be even the too much aggressive driving style of JML.

[darkstar]

in greece hirvonen´s driving style looked most aggressive of all, i felt he was at full limit on eatch spot i was watching.

[Bobcat]

...but if you see Mikko, he had way less problems than Jari-Matti, even if he still drive a Fiesta.
In fact, Mikko's car also had a lot of "little" problems in similar areas.

[focus206]

In fact, Mikko's car also had a lot of "little" problems in similar areas.
So are you saying that Jari-Matti is just very unlucky to have the "big" troubles and there are no problems with his driving style?

[Barreis]

Don't worry, it'll be the same speech again: "It was my mistake.."

[Tom206wrc]

So... :s

[amilk]

I'm not sure if he will grow up one time.....

[Andre Oliveira]

I do not understand the critics to Jari-Matti. At the video we see perfectly well that he was surprised by Novikov. This is not a mistake it. So I want to leave here a word of support to Latvala and say like it is for drivers who like to rally. Force, you'll come out on top. I do not want to know the titles of the Loeb. For me men like Solberg, Latvala, Ogier ... will always be more applauded as they were Mcrae, Sainz, Vatanen, ... Only one can win, but not everyone can make a difference.

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y100/autohabit/McRae_crashCorsica20001.jpg

[Martin Luijk]

That's true. And in Sweden he got a puncture on the 3rd last stage. That could happen to Hirvonen or Loeb too in Mexico.

[Psycho!]

In a review on WRC.COM it suggests tha JML was faster than Loeb on the three events that has been done this year...He just must put everything together and that's mainly down to luck,the only thing nobody can handle!!!

[Martin Luijk]

It is difficult to say. You compare two different driving styles. For now Loebs strategy works much better than JML's one.

[Gherid_lacksGPS]

I do not understand the critics to Jari-Matti. At the video we see perfectly well that he was surprised by Novikov. This is not a mistake it. So I want to leave here a word of support to Latvala and say like it is for drivers who like to rally. Force, you'll come out on top. I do not want to know the titles of the Loeb. For me men like Solberg, Latvala, Ogier ... will always be more applauded as they were Mcrae, Sainz, Vatanen, ... Only one can win, but not everyone can make a difference.

http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lxpfttmPEq1rn95k2o1_400.gif

[spiderem]

In a review on WRC.COM it suggests tha JML was faster than Loeb on the three events that has been done this year...He just must put everything together and that's mainly down to luck,the only thing nobody can handle!!!

I think JML and ford will have a chance to win a championship when the FIA will start a new rule saying :
Ok guys, as you can't avoid crashing or breaking during a rally, we will give you 1 championship point per fastest stages...

...

[Comal]

In rallying you make a lot of your own luck - punctures etc can quite often be due to overdriving/going off and similar.
Latvala crashes due to lapses in concentration, so quite different to McRae.
Part of winning a rally is driving to the maximum that the conditions/car allow so that you can get to the finish, not being fastest on some of the stages.

[EuroTroll]

I think JML and ford will have a chance to win a championship when the FIA will start a new rule saying :
Ok guys, as you can't avoid crashing or breaking during a rally, we will give you 1 championship point per fastest stages...

...

That's not a bad idea IMO. Would make it more interesting, especially when there are no real fights for position going on.

[A FONDO]

Not bad but not possible. FIA works only for Loeb (Citroen). I dont like Formula 1 at all, but in terms of satisfying the spectators they really know how to keep it interesting and regain audience. Just a little comparison:
-F1 was becoming boring and officials applied a new opportunity for overtaking (DRS) so the drivers in front have to keep pushing more;
-WRC was becoming a dramatic battle with several drivers fighting for the win to the very end, and the officials applied a new rule that helps the fastest to be unreachable after the first day

[MikeD]

I do not understand the critics to Jari-Matti. At the video we see perfectly well that he was surprised by Novikov. This is not a mistake it. So I want to leave here a word of support to Latvala and say like it is for drivers who like to rally. Force, you'll come out on top. I do not want to know the titles of the Loeb. For me men like Solberg, Latvala, Ogier ... will always be more applauded as they were Mcrae, Sainz, Vatanen, ... Only one can win, but not everyone can make a difference.

The difference between McRae and Latlava is that despite McRae's many crashes he also won a lot of rallies. That cannot be said of Latvala. But keep dreaming ;)

[MikeD]

F1 was becoming boring and officials applied a new opportunity for overtaking (DRS) so the drivers in front have to keep pushing more;


Only problem with thar asumption is that the TV-ratings have been dropping rappidly since DRS was introduced. Fake overtaking is not what F1 is all about and true fans don't want it.

[A FONDO]

I dont know, I dont have truthworthy source for such statistics. Can you tell, are today's ratings lower than the times with Schumacher's dominance? And maybe the ratings fell because of Vettel / RB dominance, not DRS specifically?

[JAM]

Latvala needs a Citroen to win rallyes. If you look at Mexico, Hirvonen was very near Loeb. The car makes a big difference.

The only way to be faster as de Citroens is to run at 110%.

I can't understand the critics of Latvala. What's the Loeb strategy? The have the faster car.

It's easy to have a winning strategy when you have a winning car in hands.

The difficult is NOT HAVING A WINNING CAR like Latvala and Solberg. That is the really challenging situation.

[MikeD]

I dont know, I dont have truthworthy source for such statistics. Can you tell, are today's ratings lower than the times with Schumacher's dominance? And maybe the ratings fell because of Vettel / RB dominance, not DRS specifically?

Part of my work is sponsorship deals and meassuring effect of sponsorship, so I have acces to quite a lot of info regarding this. Regarding the TV numbers then yes, they are significant lower in most countries compared with the dominant years of Schumacher (even in Germany despite two titles for Vettel). One exception is the UK but apart from that it is a lot lower .... but so are e.g. the major football leaques in Europe, so there might be a ressecion factor aswell due to many of these sports events being a part of expensive TV packages which some people might be forced to cut from their household budgets.

But it's not only the TV viewing, it's also the amout of spectators for almost all sport events that are dropping massively, and especially F1 is hit hard due to the high ticket and hotel prices.

I don't know if you are an F1 fan, but look at the lack of Forum activity in that sport. Apart from PlanetF1 almost all of them are closed.

So there is something clearly wrong with F1 and DRS might have given more overtakings, but it for sure haven't generated more fans and spectators.

[bluuford]

Part of my work is sponsorship deals and meassuring effect of sponsorship, so I have acces to quite a lot of info regarding this. Regarding the TV numbers then yes, they are significant lower in most countries compared with the dominant years of Schumacher (even in Germany despite two titles for Vettel). One exception is the UK but apart from that it is a lot lower .... but so are e.g. the major football leaques in Europe, so there might be a ressecion factor aswell due to many of these sports events being a part of expensive TV packages which some people might be forced to cut from their household budgets.

But it's not only the TV viewing, it's also the amout of spectators for almost all sport events that are dropping massively, and especially F1 is hit hard due to the high ticket and hotel prices.

I don't know if you are an F1 fan, but look at the lack of Forum activity in that sport. Apart from PlanetF1 almost all of them are closed.

So there is something clearly wrong with F1 and DRS might have given more overtakings, but it for sure haven't generated more fans and spectators.

I think that the problem is purely simplicity. Sunday viewer does not want to remember all kind of DRS zones, KERS, whatever things. They like to see simple races simple points systems. Who needs all those pointless fancy things when the same team with the biggest resorces still wins it all?

The other thing is all kind of penalties. I stopped watching all F1 races when I found out that 1/3 of the qualifying results and 25% of the race final results will be cahnged by stewerads because someone was driving too slowly, too sideways, too agressively, too arrogantly, too much like Ken Block etc. You cannot make everybody happy, that is life. Sh*t happens. Noone penalizes Novikov for crashing and distracting Latvala, that is good and simple.

Due to our new start position rule we might never see Henning or Ketomaa or some other good drivers winning stages, but on the other hand, it keeps things simple. Everybody are driving as fast as they can from start to finish. I am note sure about the benefit of this rule yet but it makes things simple.

Giving points for each stage win is really, really bad idea. What happens if someone crashes and blocks the road? No points for this stage? What happens on the next stage when the fastest guy goes there with worn tires (due to the fact that he was pushing on the previous stage but the others were just driving it through due to the bloked road?). Lets keep things simple.

[A FONDO]

Ratings can never be accurate indicator. For example, in my country theres a dominant TV provider who bought exclusive TV rights for streaming Serie A (italian football championship) in the whole country, but later some sophisticated juristic conflicts arose and stopped streaming it. But the ratings analyzers from abroad dont know this, they trust only pure statistics and conclude that the reason is something else, like bad TV times, poor refferees, corruption scandals etc. So its hard to agree that DRS is the reason for fading interest. But even if it really is, my initial idea was that F1 officials are trying to do something for the good of the show, in contrast to WRC which only satisfies one person's whims.

[N.O.T]

The WRC cannot afford not to have a driver with the rallying approach of Latvala in its ranks...

but on the other hand a team with high hopes cannot afford to have him as well...

who wins this battle remains to be seen.

Mcrae was part of rallying in a different era for both the sport and the manufacturer attitude...plus he had that very nice video game.

[MikeD]

Ratings can never be accurate indicator.

In some countries they are very accurate due to the TV-Meter systems installed in private homes. But in other countries (in less developed countries it's still meassured using classic questionnaires and using strata selected areas in relevant cities).

I also think it hard to compare F1 with WRC simply because F1 is so much bigger world wide. I mean Ferrari and McLaren have app. 1000 employees each for their team just to prepare 2 racing cars. And for that reason alone it's so imporatant to win races and titles. And they are for sure not happy with the developent in TV ratings because they will lose sponsors or the sponsors will pay less due to the lower amount of exposure.

PS: I didn't say that DRS was the reason alone for less fans - I just stated that there are no signs in the numbers that DRS is generating more fans. It might generate new fans but it also moves fans away from the sport. But the facts are that F1 is not in a healthy situation and neither is the WRC.

[Gregor-y]

Giving points for each stage win is really, really bad idea. What happens if someone crashes and blocks the road? No points for this stage? What happens on the next stage when the fastest guy goes there with worn tires (due to the fact that he was pushing on the previous stage but the others were just driving it through due to the bloked road?). Lets keep things simple.
Is it wrong I immediately thought 'this could get Schumacher into rally?'

[EuroTroll]

Giving points for each stage win is really, really bad idea. What happens if someone crashes and blocks the road? No points for this stage? What happens on the next stage when the fastest guy goes there with worn tires (due to the fact that he was pushing on the previous stage but the others were just driving it through due to the bloked road?). Lets keep things simple.

Yeah, but take Mexico for example. By Sunday, everything was clear. (Latvala didn't think so, but that's another story.) The Citroens could just cruise, and we knew that nothing was probably going to happen to them because they were taking no risks. If there had been points for stages though, the Citroens would probably have pushed harder, and there would have been a bigger chance of something interesting happening.

I just think it would add to the excitement, and keep rallies interesting until the end. This IMO outweighs the possible unfairness of some situations, which are not likely to occur very often.

[Mirek]

Points for stage victories would brake the fundamental principles of rallying. No, please not.

[janvanvurpa]

In rallying you make a lot of your own luck - punctures etc can quite often be due to overdriving/going off and similar.
Latvala crashes due to lapses in concentration, so quite different to McRae.
Part of winning a rally is driving to the maximum that the conditions/car allow so that you can get to the finish, not being fastest on some of the stages.

Please forgive me if I don't understand, I've only been sporadic rally competitor since about 1984, so there's a lot I don't understand.
I've never quite understood this word "over driving"... please 'splain it.

But more important: I only watched Jimmy's son Colin MeRae from his first events in BRC, all they way to when he killed his neighbors and his son flying that helicopter totally irresponsibly....
Now only watching these 2 drivers their whole careers, I really haven't been in their heads, can you tell us what led Colin to crash so frequently and violently?
If it wasn't "lapses of concentration" was it sheer monstrous arrogance and stupidity?
Or what?

[janvanvurpa]

Points for stage victories would brake the fundamental principles of rallying. No, please not.


Mirek, what has the whole "SOOOOOOPER Rally" rules done?

[bluuford]

Yeah, but take Mexico for example. By Sunday, everything was clear. (Latvala didn't think so, but that's another story.) The Citroens could just cruise, and we knew that nothing was probably going to happen to them because they were taking no risks. If there had been points for stages though, the Citroens would probably have pushed harder, and there would have been a bigger chance of something interesting happening.

I just think it would add to the excitement, and keep rallies interesting until the end. This IMO outweighs the possible unfairness of some situations, which are not likely to occur very often.

There is always risk that fastest guy runs even further away from the following pack. And how can you explain the situation that for example Loeb wins the rally, Latvala gets 6th place and wins 22 stages.in one stage he goes off and looses a lot of time. So, by the end of rally Loeb gets 25 points and latvala gets 27 points. It is far away from simlicity. During the first Academy year they used those stage points system. Even forumers had hard times to follow the results. How on eart proper Sunday follower is able to understand it?

[N.O.T]

even with that i think Latvala would still lose....

Lets change them into whoever makes the most rolls after an accidents wins...

[EuroTroll]

There is always risk that fastest guy runs even further away from the following pack. And how can you explain the situation that for example Loeb wins the rally, Latvala gets 6th place and wins 22 stages.in one stage he goes off and looses a lot of time. So, by the end of rally Loeb gets 25 points and latvala gets 27 points. It is far away from simlicity. During the first Academy year they used those stage points system. Even forumers had hard times to follow the results. How on eart proper Sunday follower is able to understand it?

With hard work and good cheer. :p :

It would complicate things a little, I agree. I also think Mirek's point is entirely valid. I just think I would like it. So I'm being entirely selfish. :)

[Viking]

Mirek, what has the whole "SOOOOOOPER Rally" rules done?

It has made Latvalas DNF stats better... ;)

[Rallyper]

Keep it simple. Like football, only two goalframes and kick the ball with your team in the opponents goal as many times as poosible during 90 mins.

WRC 20 -30 stages, 400 K, fastest all together scores highest points. Nothing more nothing less. No PS, no restart. Fastest man starts first. MAybe that would tease more manufacturers?

[Mirek]

Mirek, what has the whole "SOOOOOOPER Rally" rules done?

I've been always against that but You can see that many people actually like it...

[A FONDO]

WRC 20 -30 stages, 400 K, fastest all together scores highest points. Nothing more nothing less. No PS, no restart. Fastest man starts first.
This is my ideal for rally rules

[RAS007]

not bad but not possible. fia works only for loeb (citroen). i dont like formula 1 at all, but in terms of satisfying the spectators they really know how to keep it interesting and regain audience. Just a little comparison:
-f1 was becoming boring and officials applied a new opportunity for overtaking (drs) so the drivers in front have to keep pushing more;
-wrc was becoming a dramatic battle with several drivers fighting for the win to the very end, and the officials applied a new rule that helps the fastest to be unreachable after the first day

+1

[dimviii]

and the officials applied a new rule that helps the fastest to be unreachable after the first day

new rule is very right.What do you want,to make the faster driver with handicap so the slower/less talented come near with him?
If they want to be champions they have to be faster/more constitent inside stages,not with handicaping the faster driver.

[Mirek]

new rule is very right.What do you want,to make the faster driver with handicap so the slower/less talented come near with him?
If they want to be champions they have to be faster/more constitent inside stages,not with handicaping the faster driver.

Amen

Moreover the much more unfair rule was applied for ages and the only effect it brought was annoying tactic games...

[RAS007]

new rule is very right.What do you want,to make the faster driver with handicap so the slower/less talented come near with him?
If they want to be champions they have to be faster/more constitent inside stages,not with handicaping the faster driver.

Nobody is saying that the fastest should be handicapped. First on the road should be first on the road. End of story.

[noel157]

Don't think Latvala was "over driving" when he went off. He, as he admitted, panicked and lost the plot. I find it odd that a driver of his calibre did that when he saw Novikov's car on it's roof and I don't think the Russian's car was even on Latvala's line. He really should've taken things in his stride, slowed some if necessary and foot to the floor again.

[Mirek]

Nobody is saying that the fastest should be handicapped. First on the road should be first on the road. End of story.

I can't believe someone could enjoy drivers slow down or even stop before finish line. How can that attract more public interest?

[N.O.T]

nobody is saying that the fastest should be handicapped. First on the road should be first on the road. End of story.

looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool...

[RAS007]

looooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooool...

Lolololololololololololololololololzerslolzerslolz ers.

[dimviii]

First on the road should be first on the road. End of story.

When he was always first on the road sweeping the whole year ,was champion again for plenty of years,and the others out of the road or 2 minutes slower.
This year the real difference between Loeb and others will be visible.Try to accept it,because at the end of championship the points gap will be huge.

[RAS007]

I am not sure why you would think that comment was necessarily referring to Loeb, or why you would leap to his defence; I am really a traditionalist and prefer fewer rules. In any case, I don't appreciate the ad hominem attack.

[N.O.T]

i am not sure why you would think that comment was necessarily referring to loeb

loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooolzzz...

maybe because you +1 the post and highlighted in BOLD the FIA works only for Loeb ???????

[A FONDO]

I can't believe someone could enjoy drivers slow down or even stop before finish line. How can that attract more public interest?
The solution for avoiding tactical slowing is very simple: just ban receiving other cars times. And direct radio conection with the team of course, unless the car is stalled.

[N.O.T]

The solution for avoiding tactical slowing is very simple: just ban receiving other cars times. And direct radio conection with the team of course, unless the car is stalled.

you are watching this sport for a short time then....teams always informed the crews of the split times....either by radio or by sending people mid stage holding cartons with the times....

[RAS007]

loooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooolzzz...

maybe because you +1 the post and highlighted in BOLD the FIA works only for Loeb ???????

Apologies, I didnt realise this was the Loeb fanclub. :rolleyes:

[Mirek]

The solution for avoiding tactical slowing is very simple: just ban receiving other cars times. And direct radio conection with the team of course, unless the car is stalled.

That's not a solution because it is almost impossible to apply. First they can (and they do when necessary) put people on stage who show splits to drivers and second there are so many means of connection today. How will You stop them using simple GSM? Will You put some disruptor in the car? They will always find a way.

[RAS007]

That's not a solution because it is almost impossible to apply. First they can (and they do when necessary) put people on stage who show splits to drivers and second there are so many means of connection today. How will You stop them using simple GSM? Will You put some disruptor in the car? They will always find a way.

I agree that this is not a solution, but neither is the current rule, for the reasons previously mentioned.

[Mattyp]

Quite a laugh reading all the comments ok Latvala made a mistake and lost the plot but if we had a sport full of people that just gave up when things got to hard how boring would this sport be, What would everyone be saying if Latvala backed off and lost 30sec in the last stage only to find out loeb or hirvonen had punctures or a spin and a stall ( unlikely but not impossible stranger things have happened ) the outcome could of been very different , to me rallying has always been a sport where the never say die attitude has shone through ,

quite the contradictory statements up here on one hand everyone hates the tactics that used to be used with drivers slowing down to consolodate road position or places but yet you all are complaining that Latvala didnt slow down and consolidate ??????????

Also quite like the idea of fastest first on road ok in some events they loose time but other events it can be an advantage to be first on the road to say that its not fair is just PC bull next thing people will be complaining because when one competitor entered the stage it was dry but the next car it started to rain this is unfair ???

Rant over

[Mirek]

I agree that this is not a solution, but neither is the current rule, for the reasons previously mentioned.

So to sum that, You say it is right that

1) The fastest driver is punished for the fact he is fastest
2) We have fake competition just because of point 1)
3) Annoying tactic games are applied
4) That the opening days of the event are run in cruise mode in purpose of not to be first on the road the other day

And You say that it is wrong

1) When fastest driver benefits from the fact he is fastest
2) When results reflects actual level of competition
3) When top drivers have to compete since the very first stage
4) When spectators are not bored by tactics

A bit biased, isn't it?