Winners and loser for 2008 Season

[Ed]

ok so what does everyone think about nest year then, which teams are going to do well and which ones willl do rubbish?

Ferrari- I think the will be the team to beat next year

Mclaren- I was really ahppy to see then do well this year and hope it goes well for them next year , but on past performances they havent been able to pull off to good seasons in a row since hakkien won back to back titles

BMW- im really unsure. They are a great team and achieved all the goal they set down this year and last, I think 08 will be the biggest challenge for them

Honda- it can't get worse for the team but they are starting to run out of excuses now, and I feel time in running out for the team

Redbull - i think they will be the suprise of the year

Toyota- 2005 seems a long time ago for the team, but they have done it before so they have the ability to do it agian.

[passmeatissue]

Hmm, interesting, well for me...

Ferrari will have lost the advantage of knowing the Bridgestones better than the others, also the loss of the dream team might be starting to show after a year. Will Ross be there? I think a slight loss of competitiveness, and if anything a bit more unreliability.

McLaren may know the ECU a bit better, they will be a wiser about the benefits of being easy on the tyres, but (presumably) no Alonso to help the development. How much will that matter?

Both these teams will be totally up for it, knowing their drivers will use absolutely 100% of whatever car they can give them. The Kimi/Lewis battle should be fantastic.

BMW - somehow not *quite* at the top level yet, but closer.

Red Bull, I agree, on a roll, Newey still has it. Hopefully Geoff Willis can give them better reliability.

Renault - still missing the top guys who were poached after 05/06 and have not made up ground during the season. Even Fernando won't give them enough, I think.

Honda - I fear even worse, still being run by the boss's accountant mate.

Fingers crossed for Williams, improved during the season and the team I would most like to see have a good year.

[mirek01]

I think most of the teams will be very close together. In 2008 top team will be Ferrari and McLaren but close to them will be BMW, RBR, Renault, Williams and next group will be Toyota, Honda, STR. Performance will depend on witch track they are and weather and of course development of the car. I hope it will be more mix results not only McLaren and Ferrari winning races.

[jens]

BMW-Sauber is a black horse next year. I won't be surprised if they actually win the titles.

McLaren is another joker, whose performance it's very hard to predict. They have been average in even years in this Millenium. Of course such statistics mean nothing, but there are several negative factors, which may hinder their preparations for 2008.
100 Million $ penalty, it looks like the athomsphere in the team is a bit unsteady at the moment too. They also won't have Ferrari's information in 2008. :p : Also Alonso is likely to leave. Maybe those scandals have reduced the interest of sponsors too. All that raises huge questions. I won't be surprised if they make a significant drop again and maybe win an odd race at best, but on the other hand McLaren can never be underestimated.

Renault is another interesting question. It's gonna be their second year with B-stones. They are such a great team, who has won back-to-back titles and has proved itself at the highest level. I have belief in them! Maybe Alonso goes back there too and maybe Renault will get some more sponsors too (arguably Renault lacked a bit of money this year).

It's hard to predict Williams. Sam Michael has hinted that their car is gonna be a revolution. But life has shown that "revolution" does not automatically mean "success" and the last revolution Williams has introduced - back in 2004 - was a failure. So it's hard to predict whether Williams will fall, stay on the same level or even rise. Arguably they had a 60 Million $ loss in 2006. It didn't affect their 2007 performance, but will it in the long run?

Was Red Bull's speed at the end of the season some kind of a hint for things to come? On the other hand they were one of the few teams, who developed the current car until the end of the year and didn't start fully concentrating on 2008 earlier. This year RB finished in the points only in 6 races out of 17, so may they become a consistent point scorer and at last beat their record points sum from 2005 (34 pts)?

Don't expect much from Honda. Maybe they'll start consistently qualifying at the end of the Top10 (like Trulli this year) and maybe start consistently scoring lower point positions, but that's about it. Toro Rosso will probably continue to stay in the shadow of RB, but if RB gets significantly better, then STR should become more competitive too (like at the end of this season). And Vettel may score some good points for the team in wet conditions and place the team higher in the WCC than the car deserves. :p : Super Aguri will arguably build the '08 challenger on their own, but with their limited resources I doubt that it would be a fantastic one. Maybe Gascoyne can save the new Indian team from being the worst team in F1. THe new B-spec car showed at least some promise at the end of this season and they almost started matching Super Aguri.

Hopefully ProDrive will join F1 too.

Early hypothetical guess about the WCC rankings in 2008:
1.-2. BMW and Ferrari
3.-4. Renault and McLaren
5. Red Bull
6.-7. Honda, Williams
8. STR (may even challenge Top6)
9. Force India
10. Super Aguri

[ioan]

Winners: Bernie :down:
Loosers: Us, the fans :s

[stevie_gerrard]

Winners Honda ;) they wont make the same mistake twice :p :

Losers Prodrive, i can see them struggling unfortunately :(

[Hawkmoon]

Ferrari - F2007 provides a great basis for the '08 car and Raikkonen doesn't have any adjustment period next year. A Raikkonen/Ferrari double would have to be the stong favourite pre-season.

McLaren - Who knows? Who will partner Hamilton? How much will Stepney-gate and the fine effect them? Couple this with McLaren's inability to produce a good car two years running and I have no idea how they will go.

BMW - need to find 0.5 seconds a lap to challenge at the front. I don't think thay can find that speed and then a bit more to allow Heidfeld and Kubica to beat Raikkonen, Massa and Hamilton. Race wins and a solid 2nd or third in the WCC (depending on McLaren) followed by a tilt at the championship when Alonso joins them for '09.

Renault - will make a few strides to get closer to the front but have probably got too far to go the challenge for the title.

Red Bull - ditto but with the added problem of having to fix woefull reliablilty whilst at the same time making the car faster. Good luck Mr Newey!

The rest will fight it out for the scraps with Williams the only real chance to escape the bottom pack. Force India and Super Aguri to fight it out for last place "honours".

[Cozzie]

Ferrari: I believe Massa will lead their charge next year and a lot of questions will be raised about our "current champion" but nevertheless they will be a top two team.

McLaren: Their performance depends on whether Alonso stays because he has brought a lot to the team, Lewis is a superb driver but bhas been helped by Alonso's knowledge. Either way they should still be competing for the title.

BMW: They have two great drivers but I do think that they will be left standing still when rival teams make progress in leaps and bounds and will really struggle to feature on the podium.

Renault: Once again this depends on the driver line up but I can see them taking the fight to BMW in the WCC but I'm not sure they have a long future without FA.

Williams: A similar year to 2007 can be expected with Rosberg making his team-mate (whoever that may be) look incapable but as a team Williams should only keep getting better.

Red Bull: Unlike most I think they will be the big losers of 2008, Webber will never win races and DC's time is well and truly up. Look for drastic driver changes in 2009!

Toyota: all depends on driver choice but they should make a little progress and be consistently competing for points, however this is a team that will always make the wrong decisions and underachieve.

Honda: Things can only get better, the question is how much better? I believe Honda will be able to fight with BMW and Renault next year with Button grabbing the odd podium, Barrichello is too old and will let the team down.

Scuderia Toro Rosso: Bordais will take time to adjust to F1 but will be a true star by the end of the season and he will be backed up well by Vettel, I believe these two could well be Red Bull's lead drivers for 2009, both are promising and will string together some good results. They will outscore the senior team.

Super Aguri: Looked great early on in 2007 then kind of fell apart, I expect a similar situation in 2008 but Ant will show his true class, he deserves better.

Force India: Sutil will really come of age in 2008 and Force India will be able to compete for points albeit rarely.

Prodrive: Backmarkers. DR has left things to late, enough said.

Of course things are never as close as you expect and things never go to plan but oh well.

2008 WDC:
1. Massa
2. Hamilton
3. Alonso
4. Kovalainen
5. Raikkonen
6. Heidfeld
7. Rosberg
8. Kubica
9. Button
10. Piquet Jr

2008 WCC:
1. Ferrari
2. McLaren
3. Renault
4. BMW
5. Honda
6. Williams
7. Toyota
8. STR
9. Red Bull
10. Super Aguri
11. Force India
12. Prodrive

[wmcot]

Winners: Bernie :down:
Loosers: Us, the fans :s

That's true of any season!

[wmcot]

Ferrari: I believe Massa will lead their charge next year and a lot of questions will be raised about our "current champion" but nevertheless they will be a top two team.

McLaren: Their performance depends on whether Alonso stays because he has brought a lot to the team, Lewis is a superb driver but bhas been helped by Alonso's knowledge. Either way they should still be competing for the title.

BMW: They have two great drivers but I do think that they will be left standing still when rival teams make progress in leaps and bounds and will really struggle to feature on the podium.

Renault: Once again this depends on the driver line up but I can see them taking the fight to BMW in the WCC but I'm not sure they have a long future without FA.

Williams: A similar year to 2007 can be expected with Rosberg making his team-mate (whoever that may be) look incapable but as a team Williams should only keep getting better.

Red Bull: Unlike most I think they will be the big losers of 2008, Webber will never win races and DC's time is well and truly up. Look for drastic driver changes in 2009!

Toyota: all depends on driver choice but they should make a little progress and be consistently competing for points, however this is a team that will always make the wrong decisions and underachieve.

Honda: Things can only get better, the question is how much better? I believe Honda will be able to fight with BMW and Renault next year with Button grabbing the odd podium, Barrichello is too old and will let the team down.

Scuderia Toro Rosso: Bordais will take time to adjust to F1 but will be a true star by the end of the season and he will be backed up well by Vettel, I believe these two could well be Red Bull's lead drivers for 2009, both are promising and will string together some good results. They will outscore the senior team.

Super Aguri: Looked great early on in 2007 then kind of fell apart, I expect a similar situation in 2008 but Ant will show his true class, he deserves better.

Force India: Sutil will really come of age in 2008 and Force India will be able to compete for points albeit rarely.

Prodrive: Backmarkers. DR has left things to late, enough said.

Of course things are never as close as you expect and things never go to plan but oh well.

2008 WDC:
1. Massa
2. Hamilton
3. Alonso
4. Kovalainen
5. Raikkonen
6. Heidfeld
7. Rosberg
8. Kubica
9. Button
10. Piquet Jr

2008 WCC:
1. Ferrari
2. McLaren
3. Renault
4. BMW
5. Honda
6. Williams
7. Toyota
8. STR
9. Red Bull
10. Super Aguri
11. Force India
12. Prodrive

Prodrive might be a contender if they are running full factory McLarens. Toro Rosso may be a surprise or a flop depending on how Bourdais adapts to F1. At least there looks like a potential for some upsets going into F1, but it has looked that way before and the same old teams come out on top...

[jens]

It surprises me, how underrated BMW is. Nobody expected such strong results from 2006 (5th) and from 2007 (3rd) as they in reality produced. Several people even expected them to drop after a promising 2006 and now there are again such pessimistic expectations. Strange.

[ioan]

It surprises me, how underrated BMW is. Nobody expected such strong results from 2006 (5th) and from 2007 (3rd) as they in reality produced. Several people even expected them to drop after a promising 2006 and now there are again such pessimistic expectations. Strange.

You don't have to forget that this is mostly based on the personal preference of the forum members! ;)

[ArrowsFA1]

It surprises me, how underrated BMW is. Nobody expected such strong results from 2006 (5th) and from 2007 (3rd) as they in reality produced. Several people even expected them to drop after a promising 2006 and now there are again such pessimistic expectations. Strange.
It think it's mainly because for them to beat Ferrari and McLaren they'll need to make a huge step forward and like many I can't see that happening next year. They may be closer again though.

[waitey]

It surprises me, how underrated BMW is. Nobody expected such strong results from 2006 (5th) and from 2007 (3rd) as they in reality produced. Several people even expected them to drop after a promising 2006 and now there are again such pessimistic expectations. Strange.

I TOTALLY agree. Next year could be huge for them. I can almost see them doing what Renault did in 2005, and really stepping up. I just don't realise why people continually underrate them. They should be the team everyone is picking to rise their game again next season.

They have two fantastic drivers, and I seriously think people should watch out for Kubica next season. Both their drivers are underrated. But it suprises me how little attention Kubica gets, is it because he is ugly!? Forget that, the guy has shown he is a racer, can PASS people, is super quick, only problem so far has really been a bit of bad luck. The guy was in the lead in China, and really could have got at least a few podiums this year. My pick for the suprise win in 2008 if there is to be one.

Heidfeld again, still underrated but started to get a bit more attention this year. BMW for 08 should at least hold their third position in the constructors championship. The question is how much can they fight it out up the top.

[jso1985]

That's true of any season!

then when are now like those women who get constantly beaten by their husbands yet they don't want to divorce yet!

we're still watching the bloody races even if we know we're "losing" ;)

[GP-M3]

Ferrari: I believe Massa will lead their charge next year and a lot of questions will be raised about our "current champion" but nevertheless they will be a top two team.


The entire analysis is not bad, but I really disagree with this part. I think next year is Kimi's all the way. This years car was built from MS/Massa specs, and suited FM perfectly.

According to Peter Windsor, Kimi struggled in the first half of the season, trying to get the most out of a fast car by modifying his driving style. Then around Indy time he said 'ForgetAboutIt' and started to change the car to fit his style... they got somewhere fast and the rest is history, 6 wins, by far the most points of any driver in the second half of the season.

Futhermore, one of the main areas Kimi improved the car to his liking, was in turning down the excellent Ferarri traction control, as it interfered with his style. With the loss of TC for next year, Kimi should even be stronger.

Finally, the next car will be (has been) designed with Kimi in mind, so he should start out hot, right from the beginning of the season. I'd put $ on Kimi right now, for sure.

[BDunnell]

It surprises me, how underrated BMW is. Nobody expected such strong results from 2006 (5th) and from 2007 (3rd) as they in reality produced. Several people even expected them to drop after a promising 2006 and now there are again such pessimistic expectations. Strange.

I think there's an element of realism about this view. Forgetting comments about everyone being as biased as some, we have seen many teams over the years being in a similar situation as BMW is in now fail to make that next step forward. Benetton/Renault shows that it can be done, but others demonstrate the opposite. Believe me, I would love to see BMW making it a three-way fight at the front, and I would love to see Heidfeld and Kubica winning races as I really rate both of them, but I think the higher expectations ought to be tempered.

Still, I fervently hope BMW proves me wrong.

[wmcot]

then when are now like those women who get constantly beaten by their husbands yet they don't want to divorce yet!

we're still watching the bloody races even if we know we're "losing" ;)

Yep! Pretty pathetic, aren't we! Maybe we could get Bernie into a counseling center for power addicts! :)

[aryan]

It surprises me, how underrated BMW is. Nobody expected such strong results from 2006 (5th) and from 2007 (3rd) as they in reality produced. Several people even expected them to drop after a promising 2006 and now there are again such pessimistic expectations. Strange.

5th in 2006 was nothing special, that's where Sauber usually finished with their Ferrari copycats. 2007, while I was pleasantly surprised by them, I think the general feel among the paddock was they were 3rd simply because many other teams (Renault, Honda, Toyota, Wiliams even) had utterly failed, after all, they wer nearly 0.5 off McLaren and Ferrari in nearly all tracks, and that's were most of the paddock should have been.

I'll keep a keen eye on them for next year though, they have two good drivers, enough money to develop, a good wind tunnel, basically they have the ingredients to success. We'll have to see if thay can make a winning package out of it.

[Ed]

5th in 2006 was nothing special, that's where Sauber usually finished with their Ferrari copycats. 2007, while I was pleasantly surprised by them, I think the general feel among the paddock was they were 3rd simply because many other teams (Renault, Honda, Toyota, Wiliams even) had utterly failed, after all, they wer nearly 0.5 off McLaren and Ferrari in nearly all tracks, and that's were most of the paddock should have been.

I'll keep a keen eye on them for next year though, they have two good drivers, enough money to develop, a good wind tunnel, basically they have the ingredients to success. We'll have to see if thay can make a winning package out of it.

What a naive post, how can you said they only did well because the other teams didn't!! surl;ey that means that they did the better job then

[Malbec]

What a naive post, how can you said they only did well because the other teams didn't!! surl;ey that means that they did the better job then

I think there's some strong logic behind arguing that BMW did well because others didn't get their act together. Renault had problems adapting to BS and also lost by far their strongest driver for this season. Heiki and Fisi were both weak in different parts of the season. Honda shot themselves in both feet with a terrible car and teams like RBR and Williams are still in the recovery/rebuilding part of their cycles.

It will be interesting to see how McLaren cope with a $100 million drop in their budget for next year and what will happen with Alonso, if Ferrari start to see real damage from the infighting that seems to be afflicting the team and if BMW cope well with having their staff poached by other teams.

Honda will probably do better because their baseline this season was so low. They appear to be abandoning a lot of principles laid down by Willis such as giving up the use of turning vanes and going for bargeboards like the rest of the paddock. We'll see how the new engineering team there go.

RBR ought to do well too with a year under their belt working with a totally new design. They could score a heapload more points simply by improving reliability.

Don't really know about Toyota. Nothing suggests 2008 will be any different to 2007 and the years before but eventually someday something has to click and they have to be able to produce a great car given the budget and resources they have.

Williams are looking good now as well, they may well be able to punch above their weight next season too, at least I hope so.

[jens]

I think there's an element of realism about this view. Forgetting comments about everyone being as biased as some, we have seen many teams over the years being in a similar situation as BMW is in now fail to make that next step forward. Benetton/Renault shows that it can be done, but others demonstrate the opposite. Believe me, I would love to see BMW making it a three-way fight at the front, and I would love to see Heidfeld and Kubica winning races as I really rate both of them, but I think the higher expectations ought to be tempered.

Still, I fervently hope BMW proves me wrong.

What in my view makes BMW's chances better, is that seemingly everything in Ferrari and McLaren does not seem to run perfectly. Here has already been a lot of talk about McLaren's problems, which might hinder their progress. But also Ferrari and I think I said it already a year ago that 2008 has to be that year, which shows, how much effect has the departure of Team MS had on the team. Also as arguably there is a strife in Ferrari, who would be the team principal (Todt vs Brawn), then it reminds a bit the chaos that where Ferrari was before Todt-era. But nevertheless it looks like in Ferrari the situation is calmer than in McLaren and it would be harder to catch them. If the top teams are struggling, then their closest rivals - namely BMW - should be those, who will gain.

[BDunnell]

What in my view makes BMW's chances better, is that seemingly everything in Ferrari and McLaren does not seem to run perfectly. Here has already been a lot of talk about McLaren's problems, which might hinder their progress. But also Ferrari and I think I said it already a year ago that 2008 has to be that year, which shows, how much effect has the departure of Team MS had on the team. Also as arguably there is a strife in Ferrari, who would be the team principal (Todt vs Brawn), then it reminds a bit the chaos that where Ferrari was before Todt-era. But nevertheless it looks like in Ferrari the situation is calmer than in McLaren and it would be harder to catch them. If the top teams are struggling, then their closest rivals - namely BMW - should be those, who will gain.

I wonder whether BMW will have a 2008 season similar to Renault's in 2003, in which they aren't quite there in terms of challenging for the championship, but make a step forward to race wins. Clearly, the potential is there.

[aryan]

What a naive post, how can you said they only did well because the other teams didn't!! surl;ey that means that they did the better job then


I think you misread by post. It does mean that they did a better job this season, however it does not in itself mean that they will be championship contender for next year. At the start of the season, they were about 0.5 second a lap off, and they remained that much off by the end of the season. Some might even argue that Renault and Williams both closed the gap by the end of the season, but it was too little too late.

Renault, Toyota, Honda, RBR and Williams were no where near the top end of the grid at the start of the season, and that gave BMW (which admittedly did a better job) a carte blanche for the 3rd spot.

Since 1979, the title of World Contructors Champions has gone to one of the following 4 teams: Williams, Ferrari, McLaren and Benetton/Renault. A fifth team has a mighty job ahead of itself if it wants to join these four.

[ioan]

I think you misread by post. It does mean that they did a better job this season, however it does not in itself mean that they will be championship contender for next year. At the start of the season, they were about 0.5 second a lap off, and they remained that much off by the end of the season. Some might even argue that Renault and Williams both closed the gap by the end of the season, but it was too little too late.

BMW stopped development of this years car at the moment when McLaren were thrown out of the championship.
I think they concentrated much more on next seasons car than most of the other teams, except maybe Renault who scraped this season's project after a handful of races.

[passmeatissue]

Grandprix.com are saying today that Alonso is negotiating seriously with Red Bull. Add him to Newey and Willis, with one of the biggest budgets...

[ioan]

Grandprix.com are saying today that Alonso is negotiating seriously with Red Bull. Add him to Newey and Willis, with one of the biggest budgets...

They lack reliability, and sadly that's what wins titles nowadays, not speed.

[passmeatissue]

Willis' role is to give them reliability, while Newey does his mad aerodynamicist thing.

[Malbec]

Willis' role is to give them reliability, while Newey does his mad aerodynamicist thing.

If Willis is so good, why did it take him so long to negotiate another job after leaving Honda?

Ultimately F1 is the ultimate capitalist market. If someone is valued by those in the know then unemployment is not an option. Willis took too long to be reemployed which is an indication of how he is viewed within the paddock.

[ArrowsFA1]

If Willis is so good, why did it take him so long to negotiate another job after leaving Honda?
Was he on "gardening leave" and thus unable to take a job elsewhere?

[jens]

Here have been questions whether BMW is close enough to top teams to start challenging them next year. Well, I agree with those, who say that Renault is too far from the top as in several races they were even struggling to score points. I think they may score a race win at best. But it's a different matter with BMW. They scored 101 points this year. McLaren achieved 110 points last year and they fought for the title this year. Ferrari achieved 100 the year before and fought for the title in 2006 again (although it was clear that the tyre rule would suit them). Renault scored 105 in 2004 and won the titles next year. BMW has a decent platform at the moment. Last year they scored just 36 and they have made a significant step forward for this year. I think they should be able to achieve at least 150 points in 2008 and if they can get closer to 200 points, that would already already put them close to winners.

By the way. In February in 2007, when BMW looked strong in winter testing, then several guys expected BMW to fight for the title already this year and then the fact that they had been nowhere close to frontrunners in 2006, was not taken into account at all. :s After this season, which has set a lot stronger platform, has created a lot of scepticism.

But of course at the moment it's only a pure speculation, so don't kill me if BMW fails to fight for the title next year. :p :

[Malbec]

Was he on "gardening leave" and thus unable to take a job elsewhere?

IIRC he was sacked midway through last season wasn't he? He was only hired midway through this season so he spent a year out. I believe most gardening leave requirements tend to be around six months so that suggests he couldn't find employment for a while. I certainly remember him doing interviews a few months after he lost his job which sounded rather like he was touting himself on the job market.

[Malbec]

Here have been questions whether BMW is close enough to top teams to start challenging them next year. Well, I agree with those, who say that Renault is too far from the top as in several races they were even struggling to score points. I think they may score a race win at best. But it's a different matter with BMW. They scored 101 points this year. McLaren achieved 110 points last year and they fought for the title this year. Ferrari achieved 100 the year before and fought for the title in 2006 again (although it was clear that the tyre rule would suit them). Renault scored 105 in 2004 and won the titles next year. BMW has a decent platform at the moment. Last year they scored just 36 and they have made a significant step forward for this year. I think they should be able to achieve at least 150 points in 2008 and if they can get closer to 200 points, that would already already put them close to winners.

By the way. In February in 2007, when BMW looked strong in winter testing, then several guys expected BMW to fight for the title already this year and then the fact that they had been nowhere close to frontrunners in 2006, was not taken into account at all. :s After this season, which has set a lot stronger platform, has created a lot of scepticism.

But of course at the moment it's only a pure speculation, so don't kill me if BMW fails to fight for the title next year. :p :

The problem in using trends like that is that sometimes teams fall very low after a successful season, Honda came no 2 in 2004 and 5th (?) in 2005, won its first race in 2006 then barely beat its own year old customer car team this season.

[jens]

The problem in using trends like that is that sometimes teams fall very low after a successful season, Honda came no 2 in 2004 and 5th (?) in 2005, won its first race in 2006 then barely beat its own year old customer car team this season.

But who says that Ferrari and/or McLaren won't have a "low"? :) As I mentioned earlier, they may well start having one again...

[Placid]

Snyder Predictions (God bless his soul):

Stallion power to repeat.

Wanted an upset with BMW but ok as runner-up.

Expecting McLaren to struggle a bit.

Williams Magic flourishes.

Flavio will come up short again.

Surprise with the Sebastien brothers.

Big horns tamed again.

Dismal performance with Honda.

Post-Ralf blues with Toyota.

Sidekick status remains with Super Aguri.

Richards avoiding basement.

No Obi-Wan miracle for "The Force".

Ferrari over BMW after Shanghai.

[aryan]

IIRC he was sacked midway through last season wasn't he? He was only hired midway through this season so he spent a year out. I believe most gardening leave requirements tend to be around six months

You believe incorrectly sir!

I've seen gardening leaves of up to two years in my industry.

[leopard]

The most interesting thing from team to pay attention to next season is How good Hamilton take up the team on the Alonso's leave.

There are two possibilities, one if Hamilton can optimize his skill in accordance with any potency belongs to McLaren then they will go up or at least retain all they have this year. Otherwise two, they will be back struggle (as usual) and would be the object of the game for drivers like Massa and Alonso (in case he got competitive car), while Kimi will get all benefit from their fight.

I got the feeling that McLaren will be back struggle. Congrats!

[Malbec]

You believe incorrectly sir!

I've seen gardening leaves of up to two years in my industry.

Perhaps, but I recall that in his case six months was mentioned specifically.