The Next Bourdais [Archive] - Motorsport Forums

Placid

27th October 2007, 03:35

Robert Doornbos and Neel Jani are drivers with F1 experience. And with Sebastian Bourdais heading to F1, I believe Jani and Doornbos should have no trouble in catching a ride with any F1 team if the seat is open.

Graham Rahal always that his goal is F1. But he is like 4-6 years away and needs sponsors to at least have winter test drives as is Marco.

What chances you believe that Simon Pagenaud, Andreas Wirth, Nelson Phillipe, and Will Power have in landing an F1 ride in the future?

Gibbsy

27th October 2007, 05:30

I think it depends on how the current Bourdais goes.

tinchote

27th October 2007, 07:02

I would look at it this way: Bourdais, with 4 consecutive champcar championships, is heading to a midfield team. What can you expect for people that have less achievement?

millencolin

27th October 2007, 08:19

As much as i would love to see Sir William Power take on F1, its unlikely. Champ Car isnt in a good state atm to be turning out formula one stars. But in saying that, i think the top of the Champ Car field would do a better job than some of the current F1 drivers

jens

27th October 2007, 12:27

I think in the next few years Doornbos has the best chances to join F1. He is backed by Red Bull and if DC leaves after 2008 and as a result Vettel frees a seat at STR, maybe then...

Josti

27th October 2007, 12:33

I think in the next few years Doornbos has the best chances to join F1. He is backed by Red Bull and if DC leaves after 2008 and as a result Vettel frees a seat at STR, maybe then...

Even Red Bull has no problem if Doornbos joins another team. He was in talks with Williams and Toyota, but I honestly think he will stay in Champcar another year.

jso1985

27th October 2007, 22:34

What chances you believe that Simon Pagenaud, Andreas Wirth, Nelson Phillipe, and Will Power have in landing an F1 ride in the future?

as much as most GP2 driver have...(few)

tinchote

28th October 2007, 01:41

as much as most GP2 driver have...(few)

Indeed. The way I see it, with very few exceptions every driver in Champ Car and GP2 is very capable. It is already hard to get to that stage. To shine among those drivers has to do with talent, but also with opportunities. And for opportunities, the political/commercial side takes precedence. So, you have to be really good, you need to have a lot of backing, you need a very good manager - with good enough contacts -, and enough luck to be in the right place at the right time.

Valve Bounce

28th October 2007, 01:42

ArrowsFA1

29th October 2007, 10:59

What chances you believe that Simon Pagenaud, Andreas Wirth, Nelson Phillipe, and Will Power have in landing an F1 ride in the future?
Their chances are slim to zero IMHO because F1 team owners are not looking to Champcar for drivers.

I think Bourdais is an exception for two reasons. 1) He has an impressive background in European racing having won the French F3 and International F3000 titles, and had tested for both Arrows and Renault before moving to Champcar. 2) He has dominated Champcar for 4 years.

It was a risk for him to 'turn down' Renault for Champcar, just as it is a risk for him to sign for Toro Rosso. If he struggles then no top team will touch him, but if he outperforms the car then they might.

The likes of Simon Pagenaud, Andreas Wirth, Nelson Phillipe, and Will Power need either to move to the GP2 series (if they can) and prove themselves there or become consistent winners in Champcar to get within any sort of sniff of a F1 car.

Added to that is the fact that the trend seems to be for F1 teams to sign drivers on long term deals - see Piquet, Kovalainen & Hamilton for examples - and develop them themselves. There's also the fact that there are other attractive racing series available in the States for the drivers you mention.

Valve Bounce

29th October 2007, 13:09

Like the song Too many chiefs and not enough Indians, this is the refrain in reverse: Too may drivers and not enough teams or cars. The maths is there.

Eki

29th October 2007, 14:58

Too many chiefs and not enough Indians,
Are you talking about Jefe Maximo?

Caroline

29th October 2007, 15:02

It was a risk for him to 'turn down' Renault for Champcar, just as it is a risk for him to sign for Toro Rosso. If he struggles then no top team will touch him, but if he outperforms the car then they might.

I hope that he does well in the car. I really do, but you have to wonder if there could have been a better seat in F1. I would like to see how he would do in one of the top cars.

seppefan

29th October 2007, 15:08

Justin Wilson would be quick in an F1 car. He would suit Williams.

ioan

29th October 2007, 16:57

Justin Wilson would be quick in an F1 car. He would suit Williams.

Wasn't he already in F1?

Malbec

29th October 2007, 16:58

I would look at it this way: Bourdais, with 4 consecutive champcar championships, is heading to a midfield team. What can you expect for people that have less achievement?

I agree, and lets not forget how many seasons it took him of hammering on different F1 teams doors.

I don't think Champcar is currently the best route into F1, not with GP2 taking up a lot more attention from the F1 teams.

Caroline

29th October 2007, 17:13

Wasn't he already in F1?

I think it should read 'a competitive F1 car'. The Minardi he drove wasn't going to make his name in F1. Justin Wilson is doing rather well in Champ Car. Don't imagine he is worrying about F1 too much at the moment.

ArrowsFA1

29th October 2007, 17:15

Don't imagine he is worrying about F1 too much at the moment.
Particularly if he ends up with the NHL seat vacated by Bourdais :)

Caroline

29th October 2007, 17:18

Particularly if he ends up with the NHL seat vacated by Bourdais :)

Wouldn't that be good news?

aryan

29th October 2007, 17:23

Justin Wilson would be quick in an F1 car. He would suit Williams.

Are we talking about the same Wilson who got trounced by Webber?

Speaking of Champcar, as a very passing observer of the series, I will have a keen eye on Bourdais as his success/failure will have a huge impact on me and many F1 fans' idea of Champcar.

Afterall, we all (yes even those of us who don't follow US mootorsport closely) know that US Open Wheel racing is nowhere near what it was, say 15 years ago.

aryan

29th October 2007, 17:41

Particularly if he ends up with the NHL seat vacated by Bourdais :)

Didn't he also try his luck with Jag for a couple of races?

I've heard all sorts of absurd ideas on how he didn't get a fair treatment at Jaguar as the team supposedly revolved around Webber, but it all semms like a sour loser crying over spilled milk to me, as I have never heard such claims from Webber's respected team mates (i.e, Rosberg, Heidfeld, DC, Klien, Davidson)

OmarF1

29th October 2007, 17:53

Maybe there will not be such thing as the next Bourdais, if Sebastien does not perform well at Red Toro, he will be back to CC very soon, hope not.

jens

29th October 2007, 20:13

Are we talking about the same Wilson who got trounced by Webber?

Wilson didn't get enough time to adjust in Jaguar. On the other hand, if he was such a great talent, probably at least someone among F1 teams would have picked him for 2004...

jso1985

29th October 2007, 20:32

exactly!

maybe his Jaguar short stint didn't help, but his Minardi races weren't that good anyway, he didn't get noticed by any other F1 team so I guess he wasn't that good enough

millencolin

30th October 2007, 04:31

Are we talking about the same Wilson who got trounced by Webber?

I wouldnt say Webber trounced him, and this is coming from a very biased Mark Webber fan. Wilson did manage to score some points for Jaguar (something PizzaBoy couldn't do), his car had a fair amount of mechanical retirements and didnt have much time to adjust to the Jaguar enviroment.

Wilson is a top-notch driver, but I think he has his eyes set on the NHL seat. And good luck to him!!!

ArrowsFA1

30th October 2007, 08:59

maybe his Jaguar short stint didn't help, but his Minardi races weren't that good anyway, he didn't get noticed by any other F1 team so I guess he wasn't that good enough
Bottom line is that Wilson was not picked up by any of the F1 teams and he moved to CC, but I think he's a very talented driver who would do a good job for any team on the F1 grid. As it is he's shown his ability in CC, and will hopefully get the NHL ride next year.

Malbec

30th October 2007, 15:22

I've heard all sorts of absurd ideas on how he didn't get a fair treatment at Jaguar as the team supposedly revolved around Webber, but it all semms like a sour loser crying over spilled milk to me, as I have never heard such claims from Webber's respected team mates (i.e, Rosberg, Heidfeld, DC, Klien, Davidson)

I believe Davidson and just about every other driver who worked at Minardi was pretty open about the team only being able to prepare one car fully. The second car was always not as fully developed as the first. I remember that the second car didn't even have power steering a long while after it had been deployed in the first. None of that diminishes lead Minardi drivers like Webber or Alonso, clearly the speed gap wasn't entirely due to the difference in preparation.

Similar tales also emanate from Milton Keynes that neither Stewart nor Jaguar were capable of preparing two cars of equally high standard although the gap was far smaller than at Minardi. You could argue that even now with Webber suffering far more than DC with reliability problems that the same is still true!

jens

30th October 2007, 16:52

You could argue that even now with Webber suffering far more than DC with reliability problems that the same is still true!

Actually Webber hasn't suffered more from unreliability issues than Coulthard this year, but the difference is that Webber has had problems while running in good position, but DC has had problems in qualifying or when he has been nowhere in the race.

aryan

30th October 2007, 19:55

I believe Davidson and just about every other driver who worked at Minardi was pretty open about the team only being able to prepare one car fully.

Fair point mate, I had forgotten the whole power steering at Minardi saga.

And I don't want to sound like I am bashing Wilson. He is a F3000 champion, and apparently has been doing quite well in CC. All credits to him.

However with all the young blood coming out of GP2, and judgind by the performence of the likes of Vettel, Sutil, Kovaleinen and Hamilton, it seems clear that F1's future lies in GP2 and no many people would want to give Wilson another chance.

Malbec

31st October 2007, 01:48

However with all the young blood coming out of GP2, and judgind by the performence of the likes of Vettel, Sutil, Kovaleinen and Hamilton, it seems clear that F1's future lies in GP2 and no many people would want to give Wilson another chance.

I totally agree.

With all due respect to those involved in F1, they don't really have the ability to look far outside their field. They look at GP2 because its shoved under their noses every other race weekend. Champcar might as well be from another planet as far as they are concerned.

Ranger

31st October 2007, 05:34

However with all the young blood coming out of GP2, and judgind by the performence of the likes of Vettel, Sutil, Kovaleinen and Hamilton, it seems clear that F1's future lies in GP2 and no many people would want to give Wilson another chance.
Good point.

Wilson will be 30 next year, I really don't think his break is coming. Without his 4 ChampCar titles, no one on the grid would have touched Bourdais, and he'll turn 29 next year. Can't imagine Wilson doing it with lesser acheivements and an F1 tenure already.