Chinese GP thread *merged*

[spiltmilk]

http://weather.yahoo.com/forecast/CHXX0116_c.html

The forecast for China say thunderstorm on sunday. I dont know if its reliable but if we have another rain race we are indeed in for another treat this year. Nurburing then Fuji now Shanghai woo hoo

[ShiftingGears]

I hope so! Maybe Webber or Raikkonen will win :D

However I remember last year there were many times where there was a good chance of rain occuring, but it didn't happen. So I wouldn't say its at all guaranteed.

[Ranger]

Back to back races, it must be said, are brilliant. We're barely over Fuji and now we have China less than a week later. With weather it should be brilliant and unpredictable.

1st practice is underway.

[waitey]

Anyone know what the weather is like over there?

Currently in FP2, Heidfeld has stopped on track, don't know what for though.

[ShiftingGears]

McLaren and Ferrari are unbelievably close in the free practice sessions. With rain, this should be a good one.

[leopard]

Hamilton may have the great adjustment from just learning simulator at the wet track where everyone didn't have experience, but at the track mostly drivers have previously ever tested, I think it is now his teammate's turn. A piece of hope :)

[Trqster]

I would love to see the 2 macs and 2 ferraris together at the start of the race, with a wet track (but without too much spray) in front of them and all racing with the same tyres.
This would be the only way, where we could really see each other's talent in driving in the wet, especially compared to their team-mates. :s mokin:

My current thoughts on most driving hability on the wet would be:

- Alonso - I think he's just brilliant and the still the best in the wet and Fuji was just an exception... I think he's Schummi's sucessor as the "rain maister".

- Hamilton - from what he shown in Fuji, maybe he'll become one of the greatest ever also in the rain.

- Raikonnen - a good driver in the wet but prone to many mistakes by overdriving a bit the car.

- Massa - surely not Senna/Schummi alike in those conditions - proved already several times. Much more competitive in the dry.


As other drivers go, I would name Webber and newcomer Vettel and Kovalainen as the most promising.

[Valve Bounce]

With th elikelihood of LH being docked 10 places on the grid, that should make things more exciting for the championship. Nothing like a bit of evening the points by Bernie, Max and their cohorts for the Establishment to make for more interest from viewers in the outcome of the WDC.

Did anyone see this coming? Maybe Jacques did.

[Mintexmemory]

With th elikelihood of LH being docked 10 places on the grid, that should make things more exciting for the championship. Nothing like a bit of evening the points by Bernie, Max and their cohorts for the Establishment to make for more interest from viewers in the outcome of the WDC.

Did anyone see this coming? Maybe Jacques did.


Quote from F1 official site report

Prior to the incident, Hamilton had radioed his team to ask them to tell Red Bull to get Webber to drop back, as he felt the safety car was struggling to keep ahead of the pack in the difficult conditions.

“When we were behind the second safety car, I was constantly on the radio to my engineers to tell the Red Bull team to get Mark (Webber) to make a little more of a gap because I couldn’t go any faster because the pace car was in front of me, so I was trying to keep the distance with him and then I’d move over because I couldn’t see Mark and then he’d just appear alongside me, so he kept out-braking himself. I felt something was going to happen, and I guess my instincts told me right.”

Asked after the race about his apparently erratic driving behind the safety car, Hamilton said: “That wasn’t really the case - we just needed to keep the heat in the brakes. I was running quite a hard compound of brakes, so if I did light braking, I would have glazed the brakes. So I was making sure there was a little bit of a gap, maximising the gap that you’re allowed, and use it to my benefit. It was tough because Mark behind me was just too close, and all of a sudden he braked really hard.”


Now if that is backed up by recordings I don't see what the stewards can do but drop the whole issue.
As I said elsewhere, what has Webber to gain from all this moaning - other than to get his entry for Raw Prawn of the year award in early

[jens]

It would be fun if Massa wins, then we would have four drivers with four wins each and the Brazilian Grand Prix will be an ultimate decider, who wins in that area (most wins) this season. :p : And Massa has been pretty strong at Shanghai [2004 qualified 4th (!), finished 8th. In 2005 finished 6th (partly thanks to SC) and last year's race was ruined due to an engine change], also if Hamilton finishes in Top5, then Räikkönen's title chances are over and he won't need to help the Finn.

Also it's worth mentioning that this year's best rookie in GP2 - Kazuki Nakajima - was pretty good at FP1 (9th fastest). :up: I think his chances of getting alongside Rosberg as a race driver next year are definetely increasing.

[ozrevhead]

what hamilton did was dangerous

but he is F1's 'golden boy' so hes excused :o hplease: :o hplease: :o hplease:

[jens]

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/071005103537.shtml

There is a possibility that the Chinese Grand Prix might be cancelled? :o

But if that happens, it would give to all the conspiracy theorists something to talk about as Hamilton ensures the WDC. :p :

[ioan]

what hamilton did was dangerous

but he is F1's 'golden boy' so hes excused :o hplease: :o hplease: :o hplease:

Don't say it so loud. ;)

[ioan]

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/071005103537.shtml

There is a possibility that the Chinese Grand Prix might be cancelled? :o

But if that happens, it would give to all the conspiracy theorists something to talk about as Hamilton ensures the WDC. :p :


One top team's forecast, we have learned, is that a strong category-four typhoon currently ravaging Taiwan could have moved on to Shanghai by race-day.

Let's wait and see what happens on Sunday.
There is for sure one top team that would be happy if there was no race this week end.

[rohanweb]

I hope so! Maybe Webber or Raikkonen will win :D

However I remember last year there were many times where there was a good chance of rain occuring, but it didn't happen. So I wouldn't say its at all guaranteed.

nope it will be Lewis Hamilton wins at shangai.
coz Ferrari cant get thier correct tyres ready !

[jens]

Due to the typhoon everyone aquaplanes off the track except Sutil and Yamamoto, who score a Spyker's 1-2 finish. Race will be redflagged after mid-distance and halved points will be given. :bulb: Alonso is classified 4th (Hamilton 11th) and he will be only 9,5 points behind before the last race!

[Tazio]

The weather report is calling for afternoon showers.
If they start during quali, and the conditions are changing through-out. I wonder how the Stewarts are going to convolute, and, and just generally screw up the proceeding's!

[rohanweb]

News in Lewis Hamilton beaten the rest to claim Pole position..
what a perfect lap he did... rest looks so ordinary to LH as there arent any answer on track from Kimi,alonso & massa..

History books to be re-written .. ;-)

Go 4 the kill Lewis..

DC to support LH to fly the British flag.. !!!

my message to the rest of the guys supporters.. leave those anti-hamilton stuffs and join in the fun.. the guy is doing a great job whatever it means..

[Dave B]

During the commentary for Japan, Martin Brundle mentioned "typhoon" tyres. Everybody assumed he was talking rollocks and meant "monsoon", but now I'm not so sure!

Anyhoo, I'm glad I got up early (again) to watch Lewis string together that astounding pole position lap. With Fernando down in P4 there's every chance of the Championship being decided tommorow :D

Brilliant performance from DC too, his best qualifying of the year in 5th :up:

[Robinho]

greta pole lap, from being consistently being a tenth or 2 behind the top 3 most of the weekend he saved the best for the right moment and have put 2 cars between him and Alonso, if he wants the Championship the nest way is to ensure there is no doubt, rather than leaving it up to others, its a great start, can he keep it up through the race?

[Dave B]

I honestly think that in the dry the Ferraris will have better race pace, so I've got my fingers crossed for some rain.

That said, his main Championship rival is down in P4, so even if Lewis does lose out to the red cars it's not necessarily game over.

I'll be watching from behind my sofa!

[Robinho]

me too Dave, my fear is that he's gone for a fully dry setup. whilst the others are hedging for an at least part wet race, and therefore could get swallowed up if the rain comes, but i'd be surprised if that wast the case, as he's in the position where he can afford to be cautious and 4th behind Alonso is enough.

if he keeps at least one red car behind him at the start then that should make a big difference, although the nature of the forst couple of corners suggests to me that he'll come out the other side ok

[Turkeyneck]

Stunning lap to get pole. No doubt the LH haters will be saying "yes but this......yes but that......." zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Good luck for tomorrow Lewis.

Well done DC, great job

[jens]

Wonder if some guys or even teams have gambled for a wet setup. For example Renaults and Williamses - they are in truly untraditional positions. Also great performances from Coulthard and Schumacher. :up: I have a strange feeling that Ralf will pass Jarno in the points standings this weekend again. :\

STR looked good too. But I think we'll get at last some answers tomorrow if it really rains - how much differently drivers will perform.

BMW seems to be on heavy fuel load (also watching out for rain?). In Q3 in the penultimate attempt Massa was 0,3 seconds faster than anyone, so I wonder whether he made a mistake on his last flier. Same question about Alonso.

[janneppi]

He got the pole only because Aloso didn't give him his setup, if he had used it, he would have been third or fourth. ;)

[ShiftingGears]

Alright, either Raikkonen's fueled heavier, or Lewis pulled one out of the bag. Thoughts?

[rohanweb]

Alonso claims of his heavy fuel load for his 4th place, and i dont think lewis is lighter on fuel, because all 4 cars on front were just 1/10th of a second apart earlier, even if lewis is lighter i dont think he is any significantly low on fuel, but he can and will make grounds on alonso for the first 15 laps or something if he can get a good start ahead of kimi..

what do you guys think???

[ShiftingGears]

I reckon Raikkonen's got more fuel.

[rohanweb]

He got the pole only because Aloso didn't give him his setup, if he had used it, he would have been third or fourth. ;)

lol @ janneppi...

well.. lewis driven the wrong line at qualy today to snatch pole.. mr todt has evidence and he is going to make an allegation that the pole of lewis mclaren is illegal.
uncle max is waiting to hear from todt & co

[rohanweb]

I reckon Raikkonen's got more fuel.

you probably right, he is a real contender to win the race..mmm hamilton need to raise the game by try and get some space between the ferrari's specially at the first stint..

[ShiftingGears]

As Alonso said,
"If it rains tomorrow, fourth will not mean anything."

[rohanweb]

As Alonso said,
"If it rains tomorrow, fourth will not mean anything."


does this mean alonso will try and pooooshh and crash his car at some turn away from the camera's? ..lol ..

i thought he is the rainmaster, but shame he proved to be a wobbler in rain against a rookie..


oopppsss..

[truefan72]

If Kimmi is fueled heavy ( which I think he is) then its'a gamble for a dry race.
If it rains then all bets are off in terms of the strategy. If it pours then it is really a tough gamble. with the SC and slower lap time as well as the poorer visibilty that strategy get's tossed out.

i don't mind rain but I dont' want to see the cars driving around a pace car for 20 laps again.

[Ranger]

does this mean alonso will try and pooooshh and crash his car at some turn away from the camera's? ..lol ..

i thought he is the rainmaster, but shame he proved to be a wobbler in rain against a rookie..


oopppsss..

One result does not maketh the man.

[BDunnell]

He got the pole only because Aloso didn't give him his setup, if he had used it, he would have been third or fourth. ;)

:laugh:

[Valve Bounce]

The typhoon could be extremely dangerous. I should know - I used to go out in the middle of the night to evacuate squatter huts on hillsides that were affected by landslides. And Typhoons cause landslides through extremely high rainfalls. The actual typhoon causes very strong gusting winds, which can even rock high rise buildings; what they could do to an F1 car on the track, even if it was stationary, could be disastrous. Never underestimate the effects of a Typhoon - they cause death and destruction.

Having said all this, I hope that if the Shanghai GP is cancelled, it will be re-scheduled for a later date. Anyone know if this is possible?

[tinchote]

I find it funny that people talk about the qualy as if it was certain that all the drivers are on the same fuel load. And then - someone mentioned that - you have the question of which setup they are using, particularly with chances of rain for the race.

I think it would be prudent to reserve judgement on the qualy performances until we see how the race develops tomorrow.

[rohanweb]

Just heard from jean todt that he is going to appeal about Hamiltons lap that Ferrari thinks LH produced the lap while driving without fuel in his car.


;-)

[Valve Bounce]

Just heard from jean todt that he is going to appeal about Hamiltons lap that Ferrari thinks LH produced the lap while driving without fuel in his car.


;-)

Yeah!! Massa must have tipped him off. :p :


...............or Alonso. :D

[truefan72]

http://eurosport.yahoo.com/06102007/23/vettel-docked-ten-places.html

vettel docked 10 places again

[VkmSpouge]

A very good lap by Lewis Hamilton to snatch pole, he I guess he might be slightly lighter and I would expect the Ferraris to have better race pace...at least in the dry.
All around a decent qualifying session for British drivers. David Coulthard did superbly to grab 5th place, Jenson Button was once again very good by forcing that rubbish Honda into the top 10. Also a good qualifying performance by Ralf Schumacher, 6th place is pretty impressive after his previous performances.

[Tazio]

The typhoon could be extremely dangerous. I should know - I used to go out in the middle of the night to evacuate squatter huts on hillsides that were affected by landslides. And Typhoons cause landslides through extremely high rainfalls. The actual typhoon causes very strong gusting winds, which can even rock high rise buildings; what they could do to an F1 car on the track, even if it was stationary, could be disastrous. Never underestimate the effects of a Typhoon - they cause death and destruction.

Having said all this, I hope that if the Shanghai GP is cancelled, it will be re-scheduled for a later date. Anyone know if this is possible?The Typhoon has done exactly as you said in Taiwan.

It looks like the race will run wet, but before the typhoon makes landfall in China.

"Authorities in China on Saturday issued a flood alert as it braced for Krosa. Local meteorological offices said the typhoon was expected to hit the Chinese mainland between Sunday midnight and Monday noon."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20071006/sc_afp/taiwanweathertyphoon

I hope the storm doesn't interfere with LH's championship party!
I pray his father keeps a close eye on the lad, or the FIA gives the typhoon a 12 hour stop, and go penalty!

[markabilly]

The Typhoon has done exactly as you said in Taiwan.

It looks like the race will run wet, but before the typhoon makes landfall in China.

"Authorities in China on Saturday issued a flood alert as it braced for Krosa. Local meteorological offices said the typhoon was expected to hit the Chinese mainland between Sunday midnight and Monday noon."

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20071006/sc_afp/taiwanweathertyphoon

I hope the storm doesn't interfere with LH's championship party!
I pray his father keeps a close eye on the lad, or the FIA gives the typhoon a 12 hour stop, and go penalty!

it will be raining cats and kool aid.....all he will need to do is open his mouth, a talent he seems to be using more and more... :D

[Tazio]

it will be raining cats and kool aid....
Now that is hysterical!!!

[Mintexmemory]

Seems the God(s) are also on LH's side
Prediction: A real racer will win today
Enjoy the ride everybody :)

[Valve Bounce]

Conditions could be very treacherous: gusty winds and maybe heavy rain or just showers. One thing we all knew, typhoons are things to be respected. Never went sailing when the typhoon signal was up.
I'll go check the web cam that Ari sent to me.

[Valve Bounce]

Here you go: http://canales.elcomerciodigital.com/webcam/asia/webcam-shanghai.htm

[ioan]

Prediction: A real racer will win today
Enjoy the ride everybody :)

As you say! ;)

[yodasarmpit]

Yep, Kimi did well to win today.

[Dave B]

I reckon Kimi had that in the bag today, regardless of Hamilton's misfortune. A superb drive which has kept his championship hopes alive :up:

[savvas]

If there is a tie in Brazil(?) Alonso 1st and Lewis 3rd, who will win the dr. championship?

[savvas]

If there is a tie in Brazil(?) Alonso 1st and Lewis 3rd, who will win the dr. championship?

[Dave B]

If that were the case, Alonso would have more wins so take the title.

[Tazio]

Seems the God(s) are also on LH's side
Prediction: A real racer will win today
Enjoy the ride everybody :)
Seems like god drives a Ferrari
A real racer smoked hamilton
The pass on hamilton was most enjoyable

[VkmSpouge]

Good win for Raikkonen, excellent 4th for Vettel. Button drove very well to get 5th place and Liuzzi while overshadowed by his team mate still had a very good result in 6th holding off Heidfeld very well. Disappointing day for Red Bull who could have hoped for 4th and 5th today but ended up with 8th for Coulthard who nevertheless did well to hold off Kovalainen in the closing stages.

[usa]

Alonso drives china 3rd Qualification with a wrong tyre pressure.

Fantastic Vettel,

[Dave B]

Alonso drives china 3rd Qualification with a wrong tyre pressure.

Fantastic Vettel,
Once again I find myself asking you if you've got a source. :rolleyes:

For his part, Alonso seemed to be attributing his P4 to a heavier fuel load:



"It was a pretty weird qualifying, because in Q1 and Q2 we were all closely matched, but then in Q3 I was a little lower than I expected," Alonso said after qualifying. "But both my laps were good and let's hope it's something to do with the fuel load.

"I don't know when we are stopping, let alone the Ferraris, so let's hope that's the reason. In any case, anything can happen in the race tomorrow so we have to be there.

"I think the car was fine. Both my laps were good, and I nearly got the same time with the hard of the soft tyres, so we have to see what happens tomorrow."
Source: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/63060

[SGWilko]

Dirty play?

Are the showers at the Shanghai circuit not working?

Wrong pressures in the tyres. What is the correct pressure meant to be?

Be telling us its they've put diesel in the car by mistake next.........

[markabilly]

Actually NS was spotted messing with the tires......but on Ham's car....

[Ari]

The question is more about what happens in 2 weeks from now?

The thing is.. should Uncle Ron stuff up Nando to get Lewis over the line is that illegal? I'm not saying it would happen... but if it did... It's RONS team so surely he can do as he likes?

[Valve Bounce]

The question is more about what happens in 2 weeks from now?

The thing is.. should Uncle Ron stuff up Nando to get Lewis over the line is that illegal? I'm not saying it would happen... but if it did... It's RONS team so surely he can do as he likes?

Not likely; because if they take each other off, Kimi could actually win the championship.

[markabilly]

Not likely; because if they take each other off, Kimi could actually win the championship.
Stop that kind of talk, you are scaring BE

[Ari]

Not likely; because if they take each other off, Kimi could actually win the championship.

I wasn't meaning like that... more so as in delivering Nando a non-competitive car etc.

[Ranger]

[quote="Ron Dennis"]"We weren't at all fazed about Kimi]

I thought this one deserved its own thread. This is following revelations on French TV that McLaren overheated Fernando's tyres in qualy to subtly prevent him from fighting Hamilton.

[Ari]

But I thought there was no #1 driver over there at Macca land?

[leopard]

But I thought there was certainly overheated tyres driver at Macca land?