What's With Kubica's Penalty?

[David Lowndes]

Kubica was given a drive through penalty for what? Spinning, on a wet track? Sure he collected Hamilton, but it was a racing incident! I saw no penalty for Button or Heidfeld for running into each other.

As some one said on another thread "The FIA have helped Lewis this year"; this is another example of that, and to cap it all Hamilton went on to win regardless, so Kubica's race was ruined for nothing. Way to go FIA, as if F1 hadn't gotten stupid enough already!

[Corny]

it was a bit weird indeed :s

[F1boat]

Nobody should touch FIA's favored son, the ultra talented Brit.
The saddest part of it is that this really diminishes Hamilton's achievements and even a die hard hater like me admits that Lewis drove very well today.

[Mikeall]

Surely a racing incident. They were side by side and Kubica lost control and only tapped Hamilton. This kind of thing happens all the time without a penalty...

[yodasarmpit]

The penalty was a bit harsh I have to agree, but to suggest he received it because it was Hamilton he bumped into is beyond ludicrous.

[David Lowndes]

The penalty was a bit harsh I have to agree, but to suggest he received it because it was Hamilton he bumped into is beyond ludicrous.


There were plenty of other bumps, all of which went unpunished.

[BDunnell]

The penalty was a bit harsh I have to agree, but to suggest he received it because it was Hamilton he bumped into is beyond ludicrous.

I agree. People on here are far too quick to see conspiracy in everything nowadays, and I'm getting rather tired of it.

[VkmSpouge]

I think it was a silly penalty, it was clearly a racing incident and while I believe Kubica was to blame he didn't deserve to be penalised.

[Storm]

It was a stupid penalty and surely it looked like the punishment meted out was harsher because of who the victim was.

[fandango]

I agree. People on here are far too quick to see conspiracy in everything nowadays, and I'm getting rather tired of it.


I don't think it's a conspiracy, and I don't think it's pre-meditated to help Hamilton. However, the stewards were extremely inconsistent in their ruling on this one, while ignoring many others. I reckon they probably would have reacted in the same way had it been Alonso in Hamilton's position, but it shows that they pay more attention to incidents involving championship contenders, which is simply not fair imo.

There is a problem with the perceived "Britishness" or "Anglo-Saxon-ness" of the FIA, the stewards, and F1 bosses in general. What I mean is that the logic offered in the interpretation of the rules is very Anglo-Saxon, something which is not intentional but does cause problems for others. So with an English contender for the Championship this kind of thing is bound to come up.

[markabilly]

as a mere commoner from Poland, he dared to interfere with Hamster's march to Bernie's golden dreams of $$$$$$$$$$$---enough said :vader:

Warning now officially served on the rest of those "useless drivers" (to quote RD)

[BDunnell]

I don't think it's a conspiracy, and I don't think it's pre-meditated to help Hamilton. However, the stewards were extremely inconsistent in their ruling on this one, while ignoring many others. I reckon they probably would have reacted in the same way had it been Alonso in Hamilton's position, but it shows that they pay more attention to incidents involving championship contenders, which is simply not fair imo.

I very much agree with that assessment.

[Bradley]

Kubica's penalty was ridiculous and undeserved!

FIA's message to other drivers seems to be : "beware not to overtake Hami, as you will be punished if you put anything in this boy's way to become the first rookie world champion"

Sad.

[tinchote]

As others have said, I think that the ruling is usually inconsistent,and in particular it's different near the front than near the back. But to suggest that he received the penalty because he did it to Hamilton (suggesting it wouldn't have beent he same with Alonso) is ridiculous.

And, by the way, I would like to remind the fellow forumers that many here were completely in favour when MS was penalized at Malaysia a few years ago. So maybe it's not only the marshalls that have double standards ;)

[BDunnell]

Kubica's penalty was ridiculous and undeserved!

FIA's message to other drivers seems to be : "beware not to overtake Hami, as you will be punished if you put anything in this boy's way to become the first rookie world champion"

Sad.

Evidence?

[Bradley]

Evidence?

What a question ...

Can you give evidence why the penalty was deserved?

[BDunnell]

What a question ...

Can you give evidence why the penalty was deserved?

No. If you bothered to read the rest of the thread, you'd see that I agree it was unfair on Kubica. However, this does not automatically mean I feel there is some great conspiracy involved here. Quite how you have reached this conclusion, I have no idea. The truth is there is no evidence for it at all, just as there wasn't when everyone went on about the FIA favouring Ferrari all the time.

[mirek01]

Kubica was only driver who got penalty for contact.
He was at that point faster than Hamilton.
Hamilton run wide at that corner and Kubica take a chance to pass him.
What Kubica should do at that point ? Stay whole race behind him because he is leading championship? :confused:

[rohanweb]

Does this penalty suggests that intervening with race leaders (front runners) or championship leaders would be punished? ..

well.. in a way I agree a backmarker or middle-bunch runner effectively change the championship// Kubica should have been mopre careful following LH ;)

[jso1985]

punished for spinning...

anyway didn't the FIA took the decision of analyzing race incidenst AFTER the race? to avoid decisions that might me wrong, I remember they took that decision after the Montoya-Barrichello incident in the 2003 USGP(after the race they found out Rubens was actually with braking problems so JPM wasn't actually to blame)

[Ranger]

They should've penalised Vettel for his collision with Alonso. That was no more or less of a racing incident than Hamilton/Kubica.

[Hawkmoon]

They should've penalised Vettel for his collision with Alonso. That was no more or less of a racing incident than Hamilton/Kubica.

They have. 10 place grid penalty for China.

It was harsh on the Pole but look on the bright side, it gave us the Massa vs Kubica fight at the end which was the best bit of the race.

[truefan72]

it was an uneccessary penalty, although Kubica should have chosen a better spot to overtake Hamilton. Based on their rulings, I expect Vettel to get a 10 place penalty for the next race for contact with Webber ( ala Sato :) )

[Ranger]

They have. 10 place grid penalty for China.

It was harsh on the Pole but look on the bright side, it gave us the Massa vs Kubica fight at the end which was the best bit of the race.


it was an uneccessary penalty, although Kubica should have chosen a better spot to overtake Hamilton. Based on their rulings, I expect Vettel to get a 10 place penalty for the next race for contact with Webber ( ala Sato :) )
Vettel did indeed get a 10-grid penalty. But it hardly compensates for the fact that a very likely podium and a possible win was thrown out the door for both drivers, who won't have that opportunity again for some time (ever?).

[truefan72]

Vettel did indeed get a 10-grid penalty. But it hardly compensates for the fact that a very likely podium and a possible win was thrown out the door for both drivers, who won't have that opportunity again for some time (ever?).

aha , I see

so he did get a 10-grid penality

interesting.

yes and you are right, Webber was looking extremely good for a podium. and possibly Vettel too. I don't think the Renaults were going to pass the Torro Rosso

[COD]

It was a very stupid penalty. Mika Salo commented on Finnish TV that he doesn't understand that penalty or others like that. He said that no wonder there are no overtaking in F1 anymore as everytime someone tries to overtakes and makes a contact, he gets a penalty. Also like said here, Kubica was much faster than Hamilton at that point, so it what else should he have done than try to overtake?

[jens]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3LXMIZxI28

To me that overtaking attempt by Kubica looked and still looks too optimistic. He was behind Lewis and had no chance of getting ahead or even alongside (without contact).

Btw, when Hamilton started losing speed in the next few laps after the collision, I was far from being amused, but thankfully he didn't have a serious damage.

[truefan72]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3LXMIZxI28

To me that overtaking attempt by Kubica looked and still looks too optimistic. He was behind Lewis and had no chance of getting ahead or even alongside (without contact).

Btw, when Hamilton started losing speed in the next few laps after the collision, I was far from being amused, but thankfully he didn't have a serious damage.


Great Video Jens

Good to see RTL again. As the commentators said, it wasn't a good move by RK. They also seemed particularly interested in the BMW vs. Mercedes angle which is understandable'

Anywa, RK would have takne LH on the straight fair and square if he just shoud 20 seconds more patience..

But the penalty was still harsh

[Bagwan]

How dare that wretched Peter Windsor , asking Lewis if he was accepting fault in the incident .
"I didn't see him coming" doesn't mean he could have given room .
He had run wide and opened the door not for Robert to drive through , but to let him have a better look at the advertising on the side of his car . Every opportunity to show one's corporate colours should be taken .

[ioan]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r3LXMIZxI28

To me that overtaking attempt by Kubica looked and still looks too optimistic. He was behind Lewis and had no chance of getting ahead or even alongside (without contact).

Btw, when Hamilton started losing speed in the next few laps after the collision, I was far from being amused, but thankfully he didn't have a serious damage.

Pitty we don't have a shot from above (I doubt there was chopper in the air given the weather).

All we know is that Hamilton ran wide and RK went for the gap, did LH close the gap or RK was going to fast for the conditions and thus pushed LH wide? Can't really say from these angles.

I would have said that it was a racing incident.

[Ian McC]

I would have said that it was a racing incident.

Agreed, do the stewards issue their findings when they make these decisions?

[ioan]

Agreed, do the stewards issue their findings when they make these decisions?

Not always.

[Easy Drifter]

IMO it was a racing incident and so were many of the others, both penalized and not. The Steward's decisions are often inconsistent.
Unless things have changed there are different Stewards at each event. Some have racing experience, some don't. I don't think many, if any have experience at high levels race driving.
It was not that many years ago that F1 got its own Race Director in Charlie Whiting rather than a local Clerk of the Course.
Many years ago after I retired as a driver I was turned down as a Steward locally because "I might favour the drivers too much". At that time most of our Ont. Stewards had never raced and the one's who had had done very little. Heaven forbid a Steward might be someone who actually knew what it was like out there. I don't think things have changed much.
I have seen drivers hauled before the Stewards for passing under a yellow when they were already commited to a pass as the yellow came out. Trying to back out of a pass at that point would probably be cause for another yellow.

[OmarF1]

Indeed a strange one, you know Kubi is one of my favourite drivers and I find this penalty pretty weird If we apply the same logic, Vettel touched Alonso in a similar way and nothing happened. You know there's always unfair with the way FIA applies its rules, they seem to protect the guys on front and not the guys on the back, they rarely penalize Yamamoto for touching Liuzzi or Davidson for bang some wheels with Sutil I wonder why is this?, don't the guys that are at the back or middle pack are competing too? just because they have nothing to lose deserve to not to be penalized? or they are not worth to even look at?