Win didn't change me -- says Button [Archive]

agwiii

30th December 2006, 01:14

Jenson Button says winning his first Grand Prix in Hungary this year did not change him as a driver.

After more than 100 starts and intense pressure from the British press, the 27-year-old Honda racer finally broke through in the damp Budapest race.

But Button disagrees with his father, John, who thinks the Englishman became a 'more aggressive and better' driver in 2006; an opinion backed by his run of points-scoring finishes in the latter half of the season.

Button told ITV: "We have different views on that one.

"I think winning my first Grand Prix, it changes you in the way that you've won your first Grand Prix, but it doesn't change your mentality or your way of thinking when you go into your next race at all."

Source GMM
CAPSIS International

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/061229093625.shtml

Valve Bounce

30th December 2006, 11:18

Good on Bunsen, to be totally honest with his own feeling, and au contraire with his dad's. I wish him good luck next year. But then, I also wish the best of luck to ant.

agwiii

30th December 2006, 11:21

I wonder if he needs to change?

zoostation

30th December 2006, 14:59

it kinda did change him, he drove faster after this =)

Viv

30th December 2006, 19:30

I do not know if it was a result of better speed or a better car, but he did get the highest points amongst all the drivers after his race win. For competition and entertainment's sake I hope that is the case next year too. Atleast we'll get to see a close championship then.

stevie_gerrard

31st December 2006, 02:04

not so sure about a close championhip, Button needs to find that consistency throughout a whole season before he can be considered for the championship.

would be lovely if it happened next season though :)

Ranger

31st December 2006, 02:29

I wonder if he needs to change?

Why would he need to? He still wants to win and be champion. He's not someone who I think needs to fix up his driving either.

agwiii

31st December 2006, 04:51

Why would he need to? He still wants to win and be champion. He's not someone who I think needs to fix up his driving either.

Perhaps he needs to win "several or more" races?

Valve Bounce

31st December 2006, 05:31

Well, the Poms thought they could win. :D

Ranger

31st December 2006, 07:41

Perhaps he needs to win "several or more" races?

...And your point is?

He's making sound progress as it is. I still don't get why he would need to change after his win, considering he piled on the most points of any driver between Hungary and Brazil, and pretty much doubled Barrichello's points haul throughout the year.

Hondo

31st December 2006, 10:42

...And your point is?

He's making sound progress as it is. I still don't get why he would need to change after his win, considering he piled on the most points of any driver between Hungary and Brazil, and pretty much doubled Barrichello's points haul throughout the year.

Was he first in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to....".

Was he second in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to...".

Was he third in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to...".

Having to resort to lame statistics is pretty weak, but, ok...I have never so much as sat in a Formula 1 car, never worked for a Formula 1 team, never even been to a race, but Button only has 1 more win than I do. I must be doing pretty good!

Narr

31st December 2006, 12:51

Was he first in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to....".

Was he second in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to...".

Was he third in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to...".

Having to resort to lame statistics is pretty weak, but, ok...I have never so much as sat in a Formula 1 car, never worked for a Formula 1 team, never even been to a race, but Button only has 1 more win than I do. I must be doing pretty good!

the statistic would be meaningless if it wasn't for the huge jump that Honda made in the performance of the car and the team, it's maybe churlish to suggest everyone on the forum is as good as any driver that doesn't yet have a win.

agwiii

31st December 2006, 15:19

He's making sound progress as it is. I still don't get why he would need to change after his win, considering he piled on the most points of any driver between Hungary and Brazil, and pretty much doubled Barrichello's points haul throughout the year.

Button's a plodder who will never win a championship. Counting angels on the head of a pin means nothing. There is no second place winner, and Button's had his moment of fame - like Alesi and a few others. At least he's been able to stand on the top of the podium once, that's more than Webber and most of the others in the grid will ever see,

agwiii

31st December 2006, 15:21

Was he first in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to....".

Was he second in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to...".

Was he third in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to...".

Having to resort to lame statistics is pretty weak, but, ok...I have never so much as sat in a Formula 1 car, never worked for a Formula 1 team, never even been to a race, but Button only has 1 more win than I do. I must be doing pretty good!

Excellent, well reasoned, and polite response!

:up:

Ian McC

31st December 2006, 15:57

the statistic would be meaningless if it wasn't for the huge jump that Honda made in the performance of the car and the team, it's maybe churlish to suggest everyone on the forum is as good as any driver that doesn't yet have a win.

Indeed, as it stands at the moment he wont win the championship in that car, it isn't up to it.

F1boat

31st December 2006, 18:17

I like Jenson very much and I think that he is now faster then before his first win. I wish him many more wins next season.

ArrowsFA1

31st December 2006, 19:45

Button now knows he can win a GP. Before Hungary he may have had the confidence that he would win, but until the win came he (or the team) couldn't be sure he was capable of being a winner.

They're now both sure. That must make a difference, however minor.

Valve Bounce

1st January 2007, 00:29

The way they are going, bunsen will probably get his next win before the Poms :D

Narr

1st January 2007, 00:51

Indeed, as it stands at the moment he wont win the championship in that car, it isn't up to it.

Let's not delude ourselves that any driver can win without the best car, the driver makes a difference but it the car that counts.

Valve Bounce

1st January 2007, 02:37

Let's not delude ourselves that any driver can win without the best car, the driver makes a difference but it the car that counts.

Correct premis; only a top driver can win without the best car.

TOgoFASTER

1st January 2007, 03:23

Overall :laugh:

PSfan

1st January 2007, 07:27

Was he first in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to....".

Was he second in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to...".

Was he third in the Championship? "No, but he had more points from Hungary to...".

Having to resort to lame statistics is pretty weak, but, ok...I have never so much as sat in a Formula 1 car, never worked for a Formula 1 team, never even been to a race, but Button only has 1 more win than I do. I must be doing pretty good!

Actually, if you only consider the races after the Hungary fluke race. Jenson Scored less points (25) then Alonso (34), Schumacher (31), and Massa (28).

Ranger

1st January 2007, 08:14

Ranger

1st January 2007, 08:23

Button's a plodder who will never win a championship. Counting angels on the head of a pin means nothing. There is no second place winner, and Button's had his moment of fame - like Alesi and a few others. At least he's been able to stand on the top of the podium once, that's more than Webber and most of the others in the grid will ever see,

You seem to make a hell of a lot of assumptions considering that you are supposedly looking forward to March 18 because it will be the end of assumptions and speculations and the start of actual racing.

I would mention the famous case of Peter Warr claiming that Nigel Mansell would never win a race as long as he had a hole in his arse, but you seem to have arrived at your straightforward opinion already, so I'd be wasting my time.

PSfan

1st January 2007, 09:04

Hungary was no fluke. Wet, yes. Raikkonen went out from the lead yes, Alonso out of the lead, yes. Button was catching Alonso at some 2sec/lap before he went out. It was a chance in unusual circumstances that he capitalised on fully.

A win is a win, you can't discount that.

when was the last time that all 3 podium finishers in an F1 race had not a single win between them before the start?

Had it not been for Kubica's Dq, only 1 of the drivers ahead of Button in the standing would have scored points.

It was a fluke race and a fluke winner! those kinda results only happen 1 in ten years, Ask Panis!

Valve Bounce

1st January 2007, 11:22

We have to be realistic about bunsen's chances when he has to face oponents like Kimi, Massa and alonso - a formidable task. WE just cannot say that bunsen should win if the opposition's cars are much stronger. I know that I have been one of the most severe critics of bunsen, but common, give the guy a break. Honda has to match Ferrari, McLaren and possibly Renault in ability before we talk about bunsen's chances.

stevie_gerrard

1st January 2007, 20:28

The way they are going, bunsen will probably get his next win before the Poms :D

Hey!! :mad: Save it for the Ashes Thread :p :

jens

1st January 2007, 20:49

Button and Heidfeld often seem similar to me. Both are quick, very consistent and rarely make driver errors. Both have started their career in the same year and are now in a team that is said to have potential to rise. Both have been promising, but have never had a chance to prove themselves in a top car. Both are in situation, where they are reaching the "now or never" point of the career.

The main difference between them is that Button gets a lot more media attention...

agwiii

1st January 2007, 23:14

<SNIP>I would mention the famous case of Peter Warr claiming that Nigel Mansell would never win a race as long as he had a hole in his arse, but you seem to have arrived at your straightforward opinion already, so I'd be wasting my time.

You must be a Kimi fan with your shared scatological humor.

:down:

Ranger

2nd January 2007, 01:31

You must be a Kimi fan with your shared scatological humor.

:down:

Who said it was humour? I was simply making a reference to a famous wording of an assumption which turned out to be quite wrong.

And yes, I am a Kimi fan, and I was before October 22nd, if you must know.

agwiii

2nd January 2007, 02:47

Who said it was humour? I was simply making a reference to a famous wording of an assumption which turned out to be quite wrong.

Never assume.

Ranger

2nd January 2007, 13:05

Never assume.

That was the general message of my post (which you dismissed because of "scatological humour") towards your assumption that Button wouldn't win a championship and Webber and most of the others won't win a race.

agwiii

2nd January 2007, 14:46

That was the general message of my post (which you dismissed because of "scatological humour") towards your assumption that Button wouldn't win a championship and Webber and most of the others won't win a race.

I suggest that you avoid any further attempts at scatological humour and follow your own cryptically convoluted advice; never assume.

ArrowsFA1

2nd January 2007, 14:54

Scatology has it's place...elsewhere.

Back to Jenson Button saying winning his first Grand Prix in Hungary this year did not change him as a driver.

Thank you :cool:

Knock-on

2nd January 2007, 18:18

I suggest that you avoid any further attempts at scatological humour and follow your own cryptically convoluted advice; never assume.

Most of your posts are misguided assumptions so criticising others seems rather hypocritical to me.

As for Button being a "plodder", you must be joking. :laugh:

Don't forget who his Team Mate is. Only a driver that pushed MS on quite a few occasions and would have beaten him regularly if he was allowed ;) I also believe he is acknowledged as one of the best wet weather racers out there. Since RB has been at Honda, he has been made to look very second rate.

If Honda can get a car that is close to the top 3, Jenson could be the differentiating factor IMHO.

PSfan

2nd January 2007, 23:30

Most of your posts are misguided assumptions so criticising others seems rather hypocritical to me.

As for Button being a "plodder", you must be joking. :laugh:

Don't forget who his Team Mate is. Only a driver that pushed MS on quite a few occasions and would have beaten him regularly if he was allowed ;) I also believe he is acknowledged as one of the best wet weather racers out there. Since RB has been at Honda, he has been made to look very second rate.

If Honda can get a car that is close to the top 3, Jenson could be the differentiating factor IMHO.

Funny you should mention that if Honda could get a car close to the top 3... Seems to be Honda did give Button a top 3 car, and Button still couldn't get a win. Now if we should take Button's statement that the win didn't change him as fact, then its safe to assume he like alot of people didn't view his win as completely deserving, and therefore doesn't believe the Demon that had prevented a win, has truly been exorcized.

As for using Rubens as a measuring stick. Its been argued, debated and generally discussed as to why his performance at Honda isn't up to what he managed at Ferrari, and still the easiest explanation is, the car isn't a Ferrari, and Rubens still isn't up to speed with the handling characteristics of the Honda, and perhaps won't be... Harder to teach an old dog new tricks...

As far as Button claiming the win Didn't change him, Well I have a little trouble swallowing that. Just the fact that he no longer has to face the 100+ races and no win question would make going to the track more pleasurable. And knowing that there is always a chance for a win should envoke some confidence that wasn't there before his win. But If Jenson wants to come out to the press and publicaly call his dad a liar... then thats his prerogative, and it must me true.

Roamy

3rd January 2007, 05:25

Why would it change him when he seems hard pressed to do it again. Maybe it is not too late to sign JV and get some wins.

agwiii

3rd January 2007, 05:44

Why would it change him when he seems hard pressed to do it again. Maybe it is not too late to sign JV and get some wins.

There is a rumor that the red bulls will be signing Villeneuve fils and Wayne Montoya. :)

Roamy

3rd January 2007, 05:58

quit teasing !!!

agwiii

3rd January 2007, 06:23

quit teasing !!!

LOL

Mysterious Rock

3rd January 2007, 08:28

Would it not be fair to say Button could win the championship next year without winning a race as long as he was up there and consistent

Narr

3rd January 2007, 11:43

Funny you should mention that if Honda could get a car close to the top 3... Seems to be Honda did give Button a top 3 car, and Button still couldn't get a win. Now if we should take Button's statement that the win didn't change him as fact, then its safe to assume he like alot of people didn't view his win as completely deserving, and therefore doesn't believe the Demon that had prevented a win, has truly been exorcized.

As for using Rubens as a measuring stick. Its been argued, debated and generally discussed as to why his performance at Honda isn't up to what he managed at Ferrari, and still the easiest explanation is, the car isn't a Ferrari, and Rubens still isn't up to speed with the handling characteristics of the Honda, and perhaps won't be... Harder to teach an old dog new tricks...

As far as Button claiming the win Didn't change him, Well I have a little trouble swallowing that. Just the fact that he no longer has to face the 100+ races and no win question would make going to the track more pleasurable. And knowing that there is always a chance for a win should envoke some confidence that wasn't there before his win. But If Jenson wants to come out to the press and publicaly call his dad a liar... then thats his prerogative, and it must me true.

If you are referring to 2004 and Honda's car then you need to remember where JB's team mate was that year, although Sato isn't the best on his day he's a quick driver and he didn't have anything like the success with the car as JB. So it could be argued JB was the differentiating factor that year.

Rubens is a good and experienced driver and wouldn't take a whole season to get to grips with the car, he's just not as good.

Jenson isn't calling his dad a liar, the orginal article mentions he doesn't think the win has changed his approach to driving whilst his Dad's opinion is different.

ShiftingGears

3rd January 2007, 13:04

Would it not be fair to say Button could win the championship next year without winning a race as long as he was up there and consistent

History says that it's next to impossible. Noone in the world championship has won the title without a win, and only two drivers have won it with only one win. One of those titles was in tragic and unpredictable circumstances. I believe its pushing it to say that Button will win the championship next year, let alone without a win.

Narr

3rd January 2007, 15:24

History says that it's next to impossible. Noone in the world championship has won the title without a win, and only two drivers have won it with only one win. One of those titles was in tragic and unpredictable circumstances. I believe its pushing it to say that Button will win the championship next year, let alone without a win.

The new points system has made it more possible that someone could win the WDC with only one or no wins, Kimi only had 1 win in 2003 but took it to the wire.

Dave B

3rd January 2007, 22:53

Jenson would never say that the win changed him because that would imply that before Hungary there was something which needed changing.

But as Arrows said, there's a big difference between believing you can do something and knowing that you can.

Jenson may not feel any different when he steps into the car, but next time he finds himself leading a race there'll be less of those nagging "what if?" questions in his head.

Driving at that level is a tremendous physical feat, but it's also a mind game. If Button has even one less thing to worry about, that's got to have an effect on his driving.

Much rests on Honda's ability to produce a good car, of course, capable of challenging not just Renault and Ferrari but also - probably - a resurgent McLaren and the ever-improving Red Bull and BMW.

I'm not predicting a WDC for Jenson just yet, but I'm fairly certain that he'll win races in 2007. If not, it won't be for the lack of effort or skill.

Dave B

3rd January 2007, 22:55

Why would it change him when he seems hard pressed to do it again. Maybe it is not too late to sign JV and get some wins.

:rotflmao:

Start a thread for your retired hero in History and Nostalgia, fella :p

Narr

3rd January 2007, 23:28

:rotflmao:

Start a thread for your retired hero in History and Nostalgia, fella :p

Or Nascar if JV can scrape the money together :D

Bagwan

4th January 2007, 17:34

:rotflmao:

Start a thread for your retired hero in History and Nostalgia, fella :p

Worried that he's still on the market , Davey ?
Wondering why there's no news ?

Bun bun certainly will be relieved to not be asked the duck question any more , but , we seem to have 2 opinions as to whether he's different now .

The 2 views come from someone who's known him from birth , and from himself .
The question is , who do we believe ?

His dad has got to have been influenced by the win as well , and not having to field the questions , but , at least he has a bit of space to stand back and watch his son .
He sees the pressure has dropped for Jensen .
I am more inclined to believe him .

But , "100 plus races without a win" will soon change to "100 plus plus with only one" if Honda doesn't have the act together , though , so the pressure may return soon anyway .
My guy went 1 race without a win at the start .