MotoGP - Misano

[Ranger]

I predict Rossi will claw something back from Stoner here.

Other than that I can make no predictions!

Some news:
Marco Melandri make not take part in this race either:
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/61858

[tha_jackal]

Should be a good weekend with everyone having to learn the track..

1. Rossi
2. Stoner
3. West ( cmon Ant, put that track knowledge to use! :laugh: )
Pole> Hopkins

Peaace!

[NinjaMaster]

I think Brno showed that Yamaha have gone further backwards.

1. Stoner
2. Hopkins
3. Vermeulen.
Pole. Pedrosa

[fatman]

I've given up on the official pickems and the these unofficial ones as well. Who can make predictions anymore?

We'll know more once everyone gets on the track and we can see if it's going to be a Bridgestone or Michelin affair. If Bridgestones have the advantage then no one would bet against Stoner. If it's Michelin with the advantage then it will be a battle between Rossi and the Repsol boys.

[Corny]

Yamaha will not be up there, there can't be made so much progress in just 2 weeks.. (even less) Even though I expect Edwards to do quit well, normally he's quit fast on new circuits..
Barros has ridden here, not? Maybe he'll be for the top spots
Ah, Stoner, nearly forgot him.. He'll win :D !

1 Stoner
2 Pedrosa
3 Vermeulen or Edwards :D

[ChrisS]

Barros has ridden here, not?

only West has ridden here before, a few months ago in WSS ;) and Stoner did 1-2 laps during the Ducati Week

Edwards and Vermulen that raced here on Superbikes, Barros that raced in 500cc and Capirossi that won in 250cc raced in counter-clockwise direction

BTW Stoner has safety worries about the track surface

[osg]

Hmmmmm......... i honestly haven't got a clue.

Lottery this round, although i expect to see Ant up there as he is the only rider to have raced the track in the current layout.

[NinjaMaster]

Hopefully the surface has been improved since the superbikes because it was apparently disgraceful and the MotoGP boys are even more picky about tracks than WSB.

[tha_jackal]

Misano is currently underwater, at one corner on the track the water level is higher than an armco barrier :s hock: .. 125 QP1 has been delayed and i think if anyone gets out on track today again they will be very very lucky..

[tha_jackal]

Infact, all afternoon sessions have been cancelled..

[Corny]

how many wet days did we have this year? it's unbelievable

[ChrisS]

Some pics
http://pix.crash.net/large/368839.jpg

http://pix.crash.net/large/368829.jpg

http://pix.crash.net/large/368830.jpg

http://pix.crash.net/large/368836.jpg

http://pix.crash.net/large/368843.jpg

[ChrisS]

more

http://pix.crash.net/large/368856.jpg

http://put.edidomus.it/dueruote/news/foto/allagamentoBIG.jpg

Edwards sweeps at Misano :p
http://pix.crash.net/large/368889.jpg

[Ranger]

Mother****er... :s hock: Man that's pretty nuts to see but it doesn't say too much about the circuit's drainage. :\

Perhaps it will be like the 1989 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1989_Italian_motorcycle_Grand_Prix) race. Again, that'd be nuts but it really doesn't say too much about quality control here. :\

[The Phantom]

Wow... things are not looking good for the racing to actually go ahead.

The bikes are on slicks; that deluge must have really hit hard...

[Corny]

Mother****er... :s hock: Man that's pretty nuts to see but it doesn't say too much about the circuit's drainage. :\

Perhaps it will be like the 1989 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1989_Italian_motorcycle_Grand_Prix) race. Again, that'd be nuts but it really doesn't say too much about quality control here. :\

Was that Chili's only 500 win?

[ozrevhead]

love the rubber ducky :D

[Ranger]

Was that Chili's only 500 win?
Yep, sure was.

Combined Session 2 and 3 times:

Pos Rider Bike Time
1. Casey Stoner Ducati 1:34.714
2. Valentino Rossi Yamaha 1:35.230 + 0.516
3. Anthony West Kawasaki 1:35.582 + 0.868
4. Carlos Checa Honda 1:35.644 + 0.930
5. Colin Edwards Yamaha 1:35.660 + 0.946
6. Chris Vermeulen Suzuki 1:35.708 + 0.994
7. Randy de Puniet Kawasaki 1:35.778 + 1.064
8. Nicky Hayden Honda 1:35.850 + 1.136
9. Daniel Pedrosa Honda 1:35.998 + 1.284
10. Loris Capirossi Ducati 1:36.069 + 1.355
11. John Hopkins Suzuki 1:36.265 + 1.551
12. Makoto Tamada Yamaha 1:36.321 + 1.607
13. Alex Barros Ducati 1:36.484 + 1.770
14. Sylvain Guintoli Yamaha 1:36.501 + 1.787
15. Marco Melandri Honda 1:36.649 + 1.935
16. Alex Hofmann Ducati 1:37.087 + 2.373
17. Toni Elías Honda 1:37.412 + 2.698
18. Kurtis Roberts KR 1:37.489 + 2.775
19. Shinya Nakano Honda 1:37.770 + 3.056

With Melandri having a big crash (what is it with these Gresini guys??) :D

[ozrevhead]

rain hail or shine Casey is the man

Weather you like it or not! :p

[ozrevhead]

more pics

http://www.superbikeplanet.com/image/2007/mgp/misano/1/

:o

[osg]

Man..... melandri's highside was a monster by the looks of it....... Westy looks awesome so far!!!!

[jonny hurlock]

top 3 qualifing
1. stoner
2. rossi
3. hayden

[Corny]

it seems Stoner is the better one on Rossi..

[Ranger]

Hope the race is good tomorrow! Stoner's last 2 pole-to-flag wins were a bit dull I have to say, so hopefully Rossi or Hayden can rip one back on him.

[ChrisS]

qualifing times

1. Casey Stoner AUS Ducati Marlboro Team (B) 1min 33.918 secs
2. Valentino Rossi ITA Fiat Yamaha Team (M) 1min 34.094 secs
3. Nicky Hayden USA Repsol Honda Team (M) 1min 34.469 secs
4. Randy de Puniet FRA Kawasaki Racing Team (B) 1min 34.506 secs
5. John Hopkins USA Rizla Suzuki MotoGP (B) 1min 34.536 secs
6. Dani Pedrosa SPA Repsol Honda Team (M) 1min 34.580 secs
7. Carlos Checa SPA Honda LCR (M) 1min 34.628 secs
8. Chris Vermeulen AUS Rizla Suzuki MotoGP (B) 1min 34.717 secs
9. Colin Edwards USA Fiat Yamaha Team (M) 1min 34.768 secs
10. Anthony West AUS Kawasaki Racing Team (B) 1min 34.939 secs
11. Sylvain Guintoli FRA Dunlop Tech 3 Yamaha (D) 1min 35.202 secs
12. Marco Melandri ITA Honda Gresini (B) 1min 35.236 secs
13. Loris Capirossi ITA Ducati Marlboro Team (B) 1min 35.283 secs
14. Shinya Nakano JPN Konica Minolta Honda (M) 1min 35.389 secs
15. Toni Elias SPA Honda Gresini (B) 1min 35.632 secs
16. Makoto Tamada JPN Dunlop Tech 3 Yamaha (D) 1min 35.865 secs
17. Alex Barros BRA Pramac d'Antin MotoGP (B) 1min 35.897 secs
18. Kurtis Roberts USA Team Roberts (M) 1min 36.605 secs
19. Alex Hofmann GER Pramac d'Antin MotoGP (B) 1min 36.659 secs

[ChrisS]

I didnt see the qualifying or live timing, were michelin riders competitive on race tyres? also is Rossi using the new engine?

[Corny]

I didnt see the qualifying or live timing, were michelin riders competitive on race tyres? also is Rossi using the new engine?

yes the michi's were competitive, I think the quali gave a good indication of the fastest guys (on racetyres also, I mean)
and yes Rossi's got the new engine

[ozrevhead]

it seems Stoner is the better one on Rossi..
accoring to every else its the tires or the bike

Casey just the mug whos steering the thing

[ozrevhead]

FYI

List of Constructors and their grid positions...

Ducati - 1st, 13th, 17th, 19th
Yamaha - 2nd, 9th, 11th, 16th
Honda - 3rd, 6th, 7th, 12th, 14th, 15th
Kawasaki - 4th, 10th
Suzuki - 5th, 8th
KR - 18th

[The Phantom]

Actually Stoner is only on the bike to fulfil sponsor commitments (someone has to walk from Parc Ferme to the podium, and Livio Suppo is camera-shy - but Ducati are in negotiation with Ago to have him fulfil this largely ceremonial duty for 2008 and beyond).

Stoner also provides a bit of ballast during cornering, but as soon as Ducati can get the electronics to compensate for that you can be sure Stoner will be given the flick and sent back to the cow paddocks he belongs in.

[osg]

Actually Stoner is only on the bike to fulfil sponsor commitments (someone has to walk from Parc Ferme to the podium, and Livio Suppo is camera-shy - but Ducati are in negotiation with Ago to have him fulfil this largely ceremonial duty for 2008 and beyond).

Stoner also provides a bit of ballast during cornering, but as soon as Ducati can get the electronics to compensate for that you can be sure Stoner will be given the flick and sent back to the cow paddocks he belongs in.

bwahahahahahahaahahahahahahaa thats funny s**t phantom!!!

[osg]

Vermuelen fastest in Warmup....... interesting mix there in the top 10.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v433/oosrg/Motorsport/MisanoMotoGPWU.jpg

[ChrisS]

last night I read that it wasn't sure if Rossi was going to use the new engine for the race because its too fuel thirsty and Yamaha was going to spent the night doing the maths to see if he could finish or not.

I'm not sure what they decided

[osg]

OMFG. That is all.......

[Gibbsy]

Bloody great time to be an Aussie Motogp fan.

How anyone can take anything away from Casey is beyond me. People forget that he was actually pretty quick in a Honda last year that sat around 127th or so in the queue for new developments. This year he is the only Duc rider showing anything.

And Chris V! What a star. If he could get his quali sorted he will be a contender. His mid to late race pace is awesome! His team mate battle with Hopper this year has really been something to watch.

Go Case, Go Chris!

[tha_jackal]

I think its easy to forget its only Wests sixth race, give him a full season (like Stoner, Vermeulen have had) and he'll be heading up towards the front.. Stoner was amazing so to was Chris, can it get any better if your an Aussie? I think not

[Corny]

what a difference to last year, MotoGP is simply boring at the moment!

[ChrisS]

the race was almost as exiting as an F1 race

the finishing order was clear after just a few laps

[jim mcglinchey]

Alot of people are coming on after every race to say how boring it was. If you feel that way why dont you stick with F1 or whatever. No matter who wins its still an amazing spectacle.

Its a pity thet Rossi, Nicky and Dani werent in the race but I dont think it would've effected the podium. Suzuki are the only ones keeping Casey honest at the moment.

Did you see the latest motogp.com survey? Now will the Rossi fans finally admit that he's beaten and get over it!

[Ranger]

I didn't watch MotoGP from 2001-2005 so I suppose I can't comment on rider domination, but man... The media here are discussing the possibility of Casey winning the title in Phillip Island, but at this rate he might have it won by the next round in Estoril :s hock:.

Although I'm all for Aussies winning, and full kudos for Casey whos doing so, this degree of dominance is just unhealthy. :\ The race itself, like the past two, was pretty boring. The absence of the Repsol riders (thanks to Randy) and Rossi just made that more evident.

[Ranger]

I predict Rossi will claw something back from Stoner here.

Piff and twaddle to that! :\ :p :

[ChrisS]

Alot of people are coming on after every race to say how boring it was. If you feel that way why dont you stick with F1 or whatever. No matter who wins its still an amazing spectacle.

amazing spectacle? there is probably more racing and better spectacle in a single lap of a BSB or SBK race that there was in the entire Misano race.

This year has to go down as the most boring in the MotoGP era. Stoner is riding like a star, he doesn't put a wheel out of line and wins fair and square but as for "racing"... what racing?

[Wim_Impreza]

Indeed Chris, Stoner is even more dominating than Rossi ever was. That says a lot.

Again a crash for de Puniet and he reduced the chances for the whole Repsol Honda team. This Frenchman will it never learn, it seems...

[osg]

Indeed Chris, Stoner is even more dominating than Rossi ever was. That says a lot.

Again a crash for de Puniet and he reduced the chances for the whole Repsol Honda team. This Frenchman will it never learn, it seems...

Being a Rossi fan, it hurts to see him like this, but being beaten by an Aussie makes it bearable obviously...... no excuses though. I feel irrespective of engine and tyre problems Valentino still would have struggled... Casey has been THE man all year, and deserves to wrap up the title in the next couple of rounds as a reward for the superiority he has shown.

As for De Puniet...... well he'd better get used to looking at the back of West and Hopper, cos thats what he'll be doing next year........ that is if he doesn't get sacked for continually poor results and excessive repair bills.

[The Phantom]

I don't think it's unhealthy to have Stoner streeting the field; it simply means the other teams (and riders) will have to pull their socks up and get on with the job of fielding competitive bikes. The bar has been raised.

Great result for the Australians, and Chris the V is finally starting to show what he's got.

Both factory Ducs ran out of fuel on the slow-down lap, but it's strange that Capirossi's went first - it's not like he was riding it harder than Stoner. Would be interesting to compare the datalog info on throttle openings.

So was it a pneumatic valvetrain problem that stopped Rossi? JB must be scratching his head...

[Ranger]

The problem was not that Stoner won, it was just that the race between the top 5 was boring. Laguna Seca, Brno and Misano have all been pretty boring.

I did find the Turkish GP and German GP this year very interesting though, because there was actually racing down the field up until nearly the end, whereas positions for Misano were decided after about lap 10.

Which confuses me... After a pretty decent season we've suddenly had 3 pretty boring races in succession. :\

[jim mcglinchey]

So was it a pneumatic valvetrain problem that stopped Rossi? JB must be scratching his head...

It would seem that Yam are at the stage that Suzuki were at around the midle of last year. Remember the day that Hoppers bike broke down when he was running well and he started booting the bike and it transpired that it was teething trouble with the pneumatic lifters.

[ShiftingGears]

I think rider aids on the bikes take away from the spectacle a little. Stoner is a machine this season, I would've never thought so this time last year. Simply amazing progress.

[ChrisS]

BTW another problem MotoGP is having for a while now but I think was especially obvious at Misano is the size of the Grid, just 19 riders

2 riders crashed from the start, Hayden and Kurtis were left far behind the rest, 2 riders retired later in the race, the Dunolp tyres of tech3 only lasted half the distance, that basically meant that Edwards, Nakano and the Hoff got a top 10 finish (hoff 11th) just by keeping it upright and bringing it home

[AndyRAC]

Come back 500cc 2 strokes, sort the men from boys!

[ozrevhead]

Come back 500cc 2 strokes, sort the men from boys!
yep Id love it too because when Casey wins then as well everyone will run out of excuses and will be forced to admit how good he is!!!

[AndyRAC]

yep Id love it too because when Casey wins then as well everyone will run out of excuses and will be forced to admit how good he is!!!

Although it said partly tongue in cheek, there was an article in a magazine and Stoner would like to ride one. Would like to see him on one, I've no doubt he'd be successful. Too much is made of the tyres for his dominance. The kid is riding fantastically, give him the credit he deserves, plus his wife's a stunner!

[The Phantom]

Came across a post-Misano Rossi interview, where he commented that it's a pity that it's no longer the case that the rider is the most significant aspect of the performance (words to that effect). I'm disappointed to see Rossi making such petulant comments, as I have more respect for him and his achievements than anyone else out there - to date, only Pedrosa had been blaming everything but his own performance. Everyone else out there can see what's going on, and is man enough to say so. Yes, technology is here. But Rossi has used emerging technology to his benefit over the years, arguably more so than any other current rider! You can't have it both ways (although rumour has it that he does, but this isn't that sort of forum ; )

Perhaps if Rossi could get closer to Stoner he'd realise that Stoner is simply riding the rings out of the bike... he's in select company, here's my list of the riders who do the same and get the results. In no particular order:

Hopkins (has not had the results he's deserved, that's changing)
Mladin
Bayliss
Sofuoglu
Vermeulen (also now starting to shine - if he can reach his WSB form then Stoner will have a fight on his hands for wins)

I can't speak for BSB as I'm not following it this year, but past experience tells me there's that many again in BSB alone. All of these guys do the business from start to finish - no late charges, no breaking away and then backing off. No overt mind games on or off the track. No whinging when it doesn't go their way (well Hopper has a few times, but in his defence he's stuck it out while the bike went through its adolesence, and is a major contributor to its current form).

As always, we'll just let the riding do the talking... Stoner is the first rider to win three in a row on a non-Japanese bike since Ago, and is likely to take 13 wins this year, surpassing Doohan (12) and Rossi (11). He has more points at this time than Hayden had overall last year, with 5 rounds to go. He has led something like 2/3rds of all laps so far in 2007. He broke the pole-to-win curse.

But yeah, if he wasn't on a Ducati (with a whole 5 years* worth of GP experience in it), he'd be getting hosed every round. It's not like he's put his whole life into becoming world champion, or anything...

http://www.caseystoner.com.au/photos/before_motoGP/image_02.jpghttp://www.caseystoner.com.au/photos/before_motoGP/image_21.jpg

(images from http://www.caseystoner.com.au/bio.php)

* Funny how no-one is commenting on the superlative efforts of Ducati in building the best 4-stroke GP bike ever? Might start a topic on that one.

[The Phantom]

BTW I'm not implying that people here are bagging Stoner, you guys know which way is up. I guess I'm just venting at what I'm reading elsewhere. I understand the 'boring' comments, but of course you understand that it's not boring at all to Australians :)

He looks impressive no matter what he's riding:

http://www.cmgonline.com/articles/CMG06/news/060511/BigP/Casey_Stoner_bg.jpg

[ChrisS]

In my mind its something like this:

60% rider 40% bike, at worst its 50-50, the bike importance has increased for rider 80% bike 20% as Burgess described it back in the 500s but still the rider is more important. In comparison I rate F1 as 80% car 20% driver

[ChrisS]

An interesting article on the subject (this is just a part of it that someone typed for another forum)



"MotoGP.........is the fun over"?

MotoGP has changed they call it "progress". There has always been and will always BE.....progress. In the 1980's 500cc GP bikes were made more manageable by the perfection of reed valves technology. In the 90's the bikes were futher tamed by the introduction of the big-bang firing order. In 1998 they were emasculated by the switch to "greener" fuel which made them "like big 250's" according to 500cc master Doohan. Then in 2002 they finally had their bollocks chopped off when MotoGP went to 990cc 4 strokes. As former 500cc winner Christian Sarron said, "The four strokes are nice bikes......for girls".

But is engine management-traction control, wheelie control, launch control, engine-braking control, REALLY sucking the glory out of MotoGP, just like it did with F1 cars? YES, if you ask the riders. EVEN 800's genius Casey Stoner thinks so. "These things should be 1500's not 800's," Stoner says. "In fact I'd rather be on a 500cc two-stroke, they weren't stacked out with computer control systems. THESE 800s.....everyone can ride them."

Valentino Rossi: "I prefer the 990s becuase the latest control systems make it harder for the rider to make the difference." In other words, the most talented riders want nastier bikes so they can use their rare skills to beat their lesser rivals.

Colin Edwards agrees that electronics have taken some of the talent out of MotoGP. "You go into a turn, you take your line, you open the gas and the bike somewhat takes care of itself," Edwards says, which doesn't sound very difficult at all. "In the old days you used to come out of a turn, get on the gas and you'd go "Man, I could've got on it five meters earlier....next lap you're on it five meters ealier and then you're flying to the moon, so that's where traction control really helps".

Riders fully rely on the technology to keep them out of trouble. Earlier this season, eavesdropped on a MotoGP ace debriefing his engineers after practice. The rider had been flicked over the highside when he got too eager with the throttle....AND he was angry. "I should never have crashed" he told his crew chief. "The traction control should have taken care of it."

[Dr. Gellar]

BTW another problem MotoGP is having for a while now but I think was especially obvious at Misano is the size of the Grid, just 19 riders

2 riders crashed from the start, Hayden and Kurtis were left far behind the rest, 2 riders retired later in the race, the Dunolp tyres of tech3 only lasted half the distance, that basically meant that Edwards, Nakano and the Hoff got a top 10 finish (hoff 11th) just by keeping it upright and bringing it home

I totally agree with ChrisS. Having only 19 bikes on the grid is way too few. Watching the start of the race at Misano, I was looking at the grid thinking, "That's it?? The grid looks half-empty." There has been all this talk about tires and Stoner's dominance ruining the show, but the problem of having a very thin grid to begin with seems to have been quietly swept under the rug, if only for the time being. There need to be more players in the big show.

[osg]

Came across a post-Misano Rossi interview, where he commented that it's a pity that it's no longer the case that the rider is the most significant aspect of the performance (words to that effect). I'm disappointed to see Rossi making such petulant comments, as I have more respect for him and his achievements than anyone else out there - to date, only Pedrosa had been blaming everything but his own performance. Everyone else out there can see what's going on, and is man enough to say so. Yes, technology is here. But Rossi has used emerging technology to his benefit over the years, arguably more so than any other current rider! You can't have it both ways (although rumour has it that he does, but this isn't that sort of forum ; )

Perhaps if Rossi could get closer to Stoner he'd realise that Stoner is simply riding the rings out of the bike... he's in select company, here's my list of the riders who do the same and get the results. In no particular order:

Hopkins (has not had the results he's deserved, that's changing)
Mladin
Bayliss
Sofuoglu
Vermeulen (also now starting to shine - if he can reach his WSB form then Stoner will have a fight on his hands for wins)

I can't speak for BSB as I'm not following it this year, but past experience tells me there's that many again in BSB alone. All of these guys do the business from start to finish - no late charges, no breaking away and then backing off. No overt mind games on or off the track. No whinging when it doesn't go their way (well Hopper has a few times, but in his defence he's stuck it out while the bike went through its adolesence, and is a major contributor to its current form).

As always, we'll just let the riding do the talking... Stoner is the first rider to win three in a row on a non-Japanese bike since Ago, and is likely to take 13 wins this year, surpassing Doohan (12) and Rossi (11). He has more points at this time than Hayden had overall last year, with 5 rounds to go. He has led something like 2/3rds of all laps so far in 2007. He broke the pole-to-win curse.

But yeah, if he wasn't on a Ducati (with a whole 5 years* worth of GP experience in it), he'd be getting hosed every round. It's not like he's put his whole life into becoming world champion, or anything...

http://www.caseystoner.com.au/photos/before_motoGP/image_02.jpghttp://www.caseystoner.com.au/photos/before_motoGP/image_21.jpg

(images from http://www.caseystoner.com.au/bio.php)

* Funny how no-one is commenting on the superlative efforts of Ducati in building the best 4-stroke GP bike ever? Might start a topic on that one.

hitting the nail firmly on the head again Phantom...........