Mickey vs. Goofy

[call_me_andrew]

In your opinion, what makes a race track challenging? Is it long straights, slow, sharp turns, fast, wide turns, or something else? I've noticed that ovals tend to get bashed here, but if you run the old Hockenhiem backwards and take out the chicanes, you've pretty much got an oval.

[tinchote]

In your opinion, what makes a race track challenging? Is it long straights, slow, sharp turns, fast, wide turns, or something else? I've noticed that ovals tend to get bashed here, but if you run the old Hockenhiem backwards and take out the chicanes, you've pretty much got an oval.

To discuss about tracks this way, we should first agree on what we want to discuss. For example, Hungaroring is a track massively bashed by the fans because there is no passing. But many drivers like it, because it flows and is challenging to setup the car and drive. Same with Magny Cours.

Regarding Hockenheim, even without the chicanes it was far from being a oval: it always had the "stadium" section, with several turns. And then it was a great dillema for the drivers to setup the car: do you go for low downforce or high downforce? The choices were so different, that I remember a year when the fastest car in the straight was a Minardi.

[Kevincal]

The main thing for me is a tracks WIDTH.... I hate narrow tracks with no room to pass...

[wmcot]

The main thing for me is a tracks WIDTH.... I hate narrow tracks with no room to pass...

I agree, but even the wider tracks build up excesses of "marbles" that make the racing line very narrow in many places which negates the whole idea of a wide track. If there was a way to eliminate the tires creating marbles, the racing lines would be a lot wider and it would be possible to pass off the line in places.

It's getting so ridiculous that it's even messing up ovals. I was watching an IRL race earlier this year (yeah, I was bored) and the marble situation was so bad that many times a car would pull just slightly off line to let a lead car about to lap him by and the car being lapped would totally lose it into the wall!

[555-04Q2]

The perfect race track can be summed up in one word - Spa.

[leopard]

agree, this time ;)

:s mokin:

[555-04Q2]

agree, this time ;)

:s mokin:

Thanks mate, now its gonna rain all bloody day long here ;) :p :

[Easy Drifter]

The old "Ring". Too dangerous now. In North America, Mosport. Scenery St Jovite, both natural and 2 legged. Food RA. Do not know Europe except by rep.

[trumperZ06]

:D Hhmmm... good question !!!

Answer can depend on if you're driving or watching !!!

From a driver's viewpoint we like...

changes in elevation
different corners... both fast & medium slow.. and throw in an esses
short & long straights with... an opportunity to set up a car for passing

VIR, Barber & Road Atlanta are good examples... offer all of the above with an opportunity to get into a rhythmical flow

Viewing... in person, tracks that you can walk around, enabling you to see the cars at different sections of the track.

Sitting in the stands... not much good at a road course (even Long Beach wasn't good on Sunday's).. thats why ovals/infleld tracks at ovals... are popular.

[call_me_andrew]

Regarding Hockenheim, even without the chicanes it was far from being a oval: it always had the "stadium" section, with several turns. And then it was a great dillema for the drivers to setup the car: do you go for low downforce or high downforce? The choices were so different, that I remember a year when the fastest car in the straight was a Minardi.

That makes it different from Indy on steroids how?

Feel free to elaborate on what makes Spa so wonderful?

[Sleeper]

That makes it different from Indy on steroids how?

Feel free to elaborate on what makes Spa so wonderful?
Lots of very fast, challenging corners for the drivers, the type that sets the men from the boys (I'm thinking Eau Rouge, Pouhen and Blaunchemont), plenty of elevation change during the corners and a changable micro climate in the area.

[Hondo]

Sitting in the stands... not much good at a road course (even Long Beach wasn't good on Sunday's).. thats why ovals/infleld tracks at ovals... are popular.

Also bear in mind American racing heritage has always been win on sunday, sell on monday. Early races were about prolonged speed and endurance and what better way to showcase that for the public than to have the entire race right there before their very eyes on an oval, just like horse racing. Yessir, you can buy a Chevrolet just like that one at 9:00 am monday morning, come and see me! The fan, who has paid full price for his ticket, can watch the full race, not just one section of it. He can watch one particular car or driver the whole time, one particular brand name, or maybe one particular team. TV in NASCAR, much like Formula 1, has a tendency to focus on the front runners and big names. If you go to an oval in person for a NASCAR Cup race, you'd be surprised at just how much racing for position is constantly going on behind the leaders. I went to an ARCA race once and spent almost the entire race watching 4 guys constantly fighting it out at midfield. Ovals have their place for racing and for their fans

[leopard]

Thanks mate, now its gonna rain all bloody day long here ;) :p :
I bless the rain down in Africa :p : ;)

As sure as Kilamanjaro rises like a leopard above the Serengeti. (misheard) :p :

[555-04Q2]

I bless the rain down in Africa :p : ;)

As sure as Kilamanjaro rises like a leopard above the Serengeti. (misheard) :p :

I'm impressed :up: :p :

[MAX_THRUST]

Any track with undulations and gradients. Up hill down dale!!! You can't beat that gut wrench feeling of a dip like paddock hill bend (Brands Hatch), or the drop at Laguna Seca, the dips and falls of Mid Ohio Sports Car course. Thats what the drivers love and as fans we like to see the cars twiching around. For that reason Monanco is always a good race, because the cars are two fast for the track......

Oh and for the oval fans, half to one mile ovals are great,,,,,no one and half mile tracks, and I love the superspeedways like Michigan....

[jso1985]

I don't think we can compare any F1 track with ovals, in fact I think oval racing is whole different sport.

I don't know what makes a track good or bad for a driver, from my point of view the good tracks have a good mix of slow and fast turns, elevation changes, and has to have at least one really difficult turn(like Eu Rouge or Turn 8 at Istanbul).
or at least have some flow, not like Magny Cours or Indy(the road curse).

Bring Zandvoort back :D

[ShiftingGears]

I like seeing scenic tracks with a flow and three dimensional corners (elevation changes)
A variety of slow, medium and fast corners aren't essential for a great racetrack, as the old Spa Francorchamps and Osterreichring proved. As long as the circuit has flow and seperates the men from the boys. And those types of circuits seem to be a little lacking due to tracks being built for marketing and to cater for the cars inability to overtake.
Also I agree with wmcot. Narrower tracks wouldn't be a problem if there wasn't the issue of marbles anywhere off the racing line.

[BDunnell]

Lots of very fast, challenging corners for the drivers, the type that sets the men from the boys (I'm thinking Eau Rouge, Pouhen and Blaunchemont), plenty of elevation change during the corners and a changable micro climate in the area.

And passing places, too.

Silverstone is also blessed with plenty of good overtaking spots. Even though it's just an old airfield and thus as flat as a pancake, it's still an exciting track at which to watch F1 cars. They can also attain very high speeds there, and there's even a passing place at the end of the straight in question. It's a shame the old Woodcote is no more, but times change. It's also a shame that viewing is so crap at the circuit. For me, Silverstone is still a million times more exciting than anything new that's been built in years.