If i were Ron Dennis i would...

[ratonmacias]

based on his (RD) declarations that each driver alternates the strategic advantage and that this was alonso`s turn i would give alonso the strategic advantage 3 races in a row.

lewis got it in germany and stole it in hungary so to make things fair give alonso the next to races and one more to punish hamilton for disregarding an agreement.

what would you do?

[donKey jote]

I´d give Lewis a stern talking to for pulling my pants down in front of everyone. But not too stern in case he walks next year :p :

[markabilly]

based on his (RD) declarations that each driver alternates the strategic advantage and that this was alonso`s turn i would give alonso the strategic advantage 3 races in a row.

lewis got it in germany and stole it in hungary so to make things fair give alonso the next to races and one more to punish hamilton for disregarding an agreement.

what would you do?

Fire him for back talking,ignorrinng his orders or sell his contract to Spyker......but RD will probably go buy a new swivel and F...himself as ordered by the new team principal, LH.
:beer:

[TMorel]

If I were RD I'd be bloody grateful that at least one of my drivers got on the podium.

I'd also be pleased that at least one of my drivers knows he was in the wrong (LH saying he's in trouble with the boss)

I'd probably be relieved that one of my drivers still is grown up enough to talk to me direct rather than being so bloody childish to turn his back on me, walk off and only talk via his trainer.

I'd then smack both drivers round the head for being smug arrogant b@stards before privately admitting that it's that kind of attitude that wins championships

[donKey jote]

driver's championships at least, it loses constructor's points at that pesky green table :D

[F1MAN2007]

...but RD will probably go buy a new swivel and F...himself as ordered by the new team principal, LH.
:beer:

:rotflmao: :beer:

[F1MAN2007]

But to be serious, the employee (LH) didn't respect and follow the instructions of the employer (RD) and this can lead to the gross misconduct.

Inside the Mclaren team, discipline actions should take place by tomorrow, otherwise the other employee may feel normal to tell their boss to F**** swivel without fear of being punished or sacked to the limit of these words.

So minimum respect is needed inside the team.

[ten-tenths]

man if i was ron right now i would be freaking. i don't know of the exact contractual rights of alonso and hamilton, but i would not be suprised if he loses both drivers to other teams. and i would be trying to guage which driver i can hold onto and then would give favorable treatment to that driver over the other to appease him in hopes of retaining them.
this is why schumacher always had it in his contract of being the number one driver. if alonso and raikkonen both had that status right now they could just concentrate on beating each other and a little bit less on worrying about the team and trying to beat their teammates.

[tinchote]

If RD is too harsh with LH, we'll likely see him driving a red car next year :D

In any case, regarding LH's "dissobedience", he should do nothing. He already did something when (and he declared this on writing) he allowed his other driver to take revenge.

[markabilly]

If RD is too harsh with LH, we'll likely see him driving a red car next year :D

In any case, regarding LH's "dissobedience", he should do nothing. He already did something when (and he declared this on writing) he allowed his other driver to take revenge.

Right on!!

My revenge is to shoot myself in the foot....

Now if you don't stop messing with me, next time I will shoot myself in BOTH feet and start from PITLANE with you stuck on the pole, all by yourself......see how you like that....

No I doubt that LH will be driving red, i would think that the one driving the red car would be more likely to be FA, but only if Ferrari gives him his own personal gas gauge for his car......I wonder if FA would take one of those PCs all loaded up with maclarenut plans, so Ferrai could look but not see.....

[Forum Buddy]

Just Grow up Alonso.

You were caught by the stewards, not Lewis.

Ron you need to give your talking to Mr Alonso.

Well Done Lewis.

[Buzz Lightyear]

Dennis is a control freak. Lewis flipped, and rightly so. If what Dennis was saying was correct, then lewis was never going to get his last lap in... and thats bollocks. Dennis cannot control these guys. Lewis is a racing machine, and not even RD is going to stop him. Lewis has all the cards... Ferrari or BMW would give him a $100m dollar contract tomorrow.

As for Alonso, his ego is the size of Spain. He has to admit that Lewis is quicker, at the moment. His interview after qualifying was pathetic. He thinks he was being clever. Instead, all Alonsos sound bites seem to come from the Spanish Media, rather than giving an honest interview on TV.

Lewis has come of age.. and he is taking no sh1t from anyone. Kimi defiantly wouldnt take it from Alonso. Its just we didnt expect this reaction from Lewis... until now. Nobody has told Ron to go swivel... until now.

Brilliant!

[wedge]

I thought McLaren gives the best strategy to whomever is quickest is Q2???

IMO that's the better system because Q2 is when the car is at the absolute quickest, and the drivers should earn the right to implement their optimum race strategy.

[Mikeall]

I guess no one had any complaints at the start of the season.

[PSfan]

based on his (RD) declarations that each driver alternates the strategic advantage and that this was alonso`s turn i would give alonso the strategic advantage 3 races in a row.

lewis got it in germany and stole it in hungary so to make things fair give alonso the next to races and one more to punish hamilton for disregarding an agreement.

what would you do?

If I was RD, I would Shut my trap before someone at the FIA reads between the lines and decide to really stick it to McLeran!!!

Weren't they investigated earlier this year for team orders? They where let off then because it is common practice to tell a driver to hold position so save car/engine.

However telling a driver to give up position is clearly against the "team orders" rules, and I don't care if its done during qualifying or that they alternate this strategy, it's still wrong regardless of which driver benefits, and which one sacrifices.

[Sleeper]

If I was RD, I would Shut my trap before someone at the FIA reads between the lines and decide to really stick it to McLeran!!!

Weren't they investigated earlier this year for team orders? They where let off then because it is common practice to tell a driver to hold position so save car/engine.

However telling a driver to give up position is clearly against the "team orders" rules, and I don't care if its done during qualifying or that they alternate this strategy, it's still wrong regardless of which driver benefits, and which one sacrifices.
Well they cant both have the exact same stratagy, this isnt Champ Car, you cant service two cars at the same time, there isnt the space so at each race one of them is going to have to have the slightly better stratagy.

If I was RD, I would pointedly ignore public forums. :dozey:

[Valve Bounce]

I thought McLaren gives the best strategy to whomever is quickest is Q2???

IMO that's the better system because Q2 is when the car is at the absolute quickest, and the drivers should earn the right to implement their optimum race strategy.


I agree. Funny none of the teams seem to have thos problem with such a minor perceived advantage.

[markabilly]

If I was RD, I would Shut my trap before someone at the FIA reads between the lines and decide to really stick it to McLeran!!!

Weren't they investigated earlier this year for team orders? They where let off then because it is common practice to tell a driver to hold position so save car/engine.

However telling a driver to give up position is clearly against the "team orders" rules, and I don't care if its done during qualifying or that they alternate this strategy, it's still wrong regardless of which driver benefits, and which one sacrifices.
Silverstone and germany....but no it will never happen..what a joke

[PSfan]

Well they cant both have the exact same stratagy, this isnt Champ Car, you cant service two cars at the same time, there isnt the space so at each race one of them is going to have to have the slightly better stratagy.

If I was RD, I would pointedly ignore public forums. :dozey:

What does this have anything to do with my point, and btw: I clearly remember, and I believe it was ferrari servicing BOTH cars at the same time either very early in this season or sometime last season during 3rd round qualifying... I'll have to check my tapes...

But can't you have 2 slightly different strategies without telling one driver to slow down and let the other pass?!?!

[Blackburn Buccaneer]

based on his (RD) declarations that each driver alternates the strategic advantage and that this was alonso`s turn i would give alonso the strategic advantage 3 races in a row.

lewis got it in germany and stole it in hungary so to make things fair give alonso the next to races and one more to punish hamilton for disregarding an agreement.

what would you do?


nothing: just proceed with the schedule according to plan.

surmizing here, but looking back at events in germany, it's possible hamilton felt, that the wheel nut incident , had to be considered as an interuption on the teams planned sequence of events\strategy, and therefore, the team should reset its timing\strategy to that date at hungary. he may even have brought this up, and been told that it would only be possible if alonso agreed.
maybe he got rebuffed: another thing, hamilton and massa are supposed to get along, i can just see him thinking, no way alonso is gonna give him a break, after the way he showed up massa after the last race: so hamilton took matters into his hand: dennis might even have known he would.

[Hawkmoon]

I think Hamilton needs to be brought into line. You don't talk to your employer that way. He disobeyed the team and should be disciplined for it. He needs to learn that he isn't above the team and that his needs are secondary to those of the team.

As for Alonso, I think Dennis has to seriously consider letting him go. He's not going to play second fiddle to Hamilton, and nor should he really. I don't think Dennis will be able to manage the peronalities/egos of both drivers and the constant conflict between the two has far more potential to hurt the team than it has to help it.

McLaren were right to sign Alonso and were equally right to sign Hamilton. Nobody could have forseen the speed with which Hamilton would reach the front. I think Dennis probably thought he would have a couple of seasons of Hamilton learning the ropes before he became a real challenge to the Spaniard.

[N. Jones]

Why does Ron put himself in this situation to begin with (two drivers fighting for the WDC)?? Is the thought of winning the WCC worth all of the pain??

[veyonce]

Ron Dennis dug a hole by saying both drivers has a fair fight for the driver championship points. His "wonder boy" is getting too big for his racing boots and already showing disrespect to Ron Dennis in his rookie season... Now Lewis's whining about Alonso not talking to him. :rolleyes: Lewis need to receive disciplinary action (Frankly, I don't think McLaren bear to punish him and he knows that by apologising the next day). It won't be long before Lewis climb over Ron's head. Well Ron, you reap what you sow..

I won't be surprised to see Alonso leaving McLaren. It will be interesting to see where he goes if he really leaves.

I can't wait to see Nelson Piquet Jr or Nico Hulkenberg rattle the "wonder boy" in the near future..

[Ian McC]

Why does Ron put himself in this situation to begin with (two drivers fighting for the WDC)?? Is the thought of winning the WCC worth all of the pain??

I don't think even he expected this much from Hamilton, Lewis was probably supposed to be learning from Alonso in a number 2 position. Instead, he shook off the rookie tag after 5 minutes and out performed his team mate.

[Juppe]

What makes me laugh out loud, is that when Ron had Kimi in his team his worst problem was Kimi's occasional tabloid publicity, which was in Ron's opinion unacceptable...

I bet, that at the moment Ron would welcome gladly those sorts of minor problems over this year's episodes. :D :D :D

[wmcot]

What makes me laugh out loud, is that when Ron had Kimi in his team his worst problem was Kimi's occasional tabloid publicity, which was in Ron's opinion unacceptable...

I bet, that at the moment Ron would welcome gladly those sorts of minor problems over this year's episodes. :D :D :D

Right, the Kimi episode shows what an obsessive control freak RD is - only now, both his drivers are on the verge of being out of control. If I was Ron Dennis, I'd be tearing my hair out right now (figuratively, in Ron's case!) :)

Better yet - spankings for all!!!

[truefan72]

driver's championships at least, it loses constructor's points at that pesky green table :D


they have the WCC well in hand.If they go at it at this rate McClaren will have a 1-2 in the WDC and large enough margin in the WCC. Along with tons performance money, a que of sponsor eagerly awaiting their turn to place branding, the press coverage on a daily basis, and if they stay together, a strong likelihood of another WCC and possible WDC in 2008. ...But I guess that's not good enough since the "team morale" seems to be down.

[donKey jote]

As for Alonso, his ego is the size of Spain. He has to admit that Lewis is quicker, at the moment. .
"let´s take another dig at the dirty Spaniard" :rolleyes:
I reckon they´re fairly matched ego-wise, and he has admitted many times that he needs to be quicker, in the Spanish media at least. Shame you don´t get both sides of the story :)


Instead, all Alonsos sound bites seem to come from the Spanish Media, rather than giving an honest interview on TV.
you mean an honest interview on "British TV"... then give him an honest chance :D :rolleyes:
I could understand if he is a bit allergic to your press, couldn´t you?

[Donney]

No he couldn't since he only knows his side of the story and that side is slightly biased, don't you think?

Not that spanish press is any better, but we (spanish who participate here) can read both sides in this forum and get a wider view of the matter.

[DonnieDarco]

I completely agree that there is no way Hamilton should have spoken to Ron the way he did, there can be no doubt about that whatsoever. That needs to be addressed too, if Hamilton wishes to have a long career in F1. It's going to take a LOT more than one heartfelt apology to get back in Ron's good books after all this!

But lets face it, it's no secret there have been tensions in the team ever since it was discovered that Lewis is as fast and often faster, than Alonso.

How many times I wonder, has Alonso thrown a wobbly behind closed doors, accused the team of bias to Hamilton etc, and forced little advantages to himself? To the point that Lewis may well have thought stuff it, I'm going to do my own thing and to hell with Alonso?

Its a difficult situation because nobody expected that Lewis would be as good as he clearly is in his rookie year, least of all a two times world champion. And I can understand if Alonso feels unsettled by it, because I would too!

But by the same token, Hamilton can't help the fact that he's had about the best rookie year anyone could hope for.

[donKey jote]

If I were Ron Dennis I would ban Anthony and discipline Lewis :laugh:
I just read (in el pais ;) ) that it was Anthony who called the stewards, and that Lewis carried on argueing with Ron at the hearing... no wonder they had no choice but to penalise McLaren too :dozey:

[donKey jote]

behind closed doors

Bingo :D
http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/16/16_3_166.gif

[DonnieDarco]

Love your selective quoting :laugh:

[seppefan]

If I were RD I'd be bloody grateful that at least one of my drivers got on the podium.

I'd also be pleased that at least one of my drivers knows he was in the wrong (LH saying he's in trouble with the boss)

I'd probably be relieved that one of my drivers still is grown up enough to talk to me direct rather than being so bloody childish to turn his back on me, walk off and only talk via his trainer.

I'd then smack both drivers round the head for being smug arrogant b@stards before privately admitting that it's that kind of attitude that wins championships

Yes, yes. Correct

[donKey jote]

Love your selective quoting :laugh:
I agree with everything you said :D
But the highlight was "behind closed doors", which is where Lewis (and his dad :p : ) should have kept it too :D

[BDunnell]

I agree with everything you said :D
But the highlight was "behind closed doors", which is where Lewis (and his dad :p : ) should have kept it too :D

Hardly practical nowadays, though, is it.

[DonnieDarco]

I agree with everything you said :D
But the highlight was "behind closed doors", which is where Lewis (and his dad :p : ) should have kept it too :D

I agree with that, but I think that with tensions like that in a team, it was bound to explode into the public arena sooner or later :D

[Valve Bounce]

If I were Ron Dennis I would ban Anthony and discipline Lewis :laugh:
I just read (in el pais ;) ) that it was Anthony who called the stewards, and that Lewis carried on argueing with Ron at the hearing... no wonder they had no choice but to penalise McLaren too :dozey:


Hey Buddy!! do you have a link for this - it sounds too good to be true but then it probably is correct. If Anthony called the Stewards, then he should be banned from the McLaren pits together with Alonso's massager. No team can put up with back stabbing like this.

[wedge]

Yes, LH deserves disciplinary action but LH can do or say whatever he likes because he has proved he's a top class driver who gets results.

Ron did whatever it took to keep Senna in 1993, Frank Williams was desperate for a top driver who could fight for titles 1991 and therefore willing to give in to Mansell's demands.

[markabilly]

The team doing quite well without a true leader is something called.....and what would put them over the top?
No it ain't Honda or Syker

BMW
No real hotshoe

If I ran BMW I would jump at the chance to hire FA and I would have me a WDC for sure....

On the other hand, if I were mercedes (and not RD) it would be "LH, go F...swivel yourself" we just do not need that kind of image, it would hurt our sales that go primarly to doctors lawyers upper level corporate types

Besides FA should not go there (to ferrari), apparently they do not have gas gauges in their cars

[Fallingwater]

Yes, LH deserves disciplinary action but LH can do or say whatever he likes because he has proved he's a top class driver who gets results.
That's kind of saying Alonso has every right to block Hamilton or speak badly about the team because he's been WDC two years in a row. That's not exactly ethical.

[Bagwan]

Obviously , the only way for Ron to fix all this , is to set up a #1 strategy thumb-wrestling event before each race .
I can see it now .

The sun's just coming over the horizon , and the Spaniard , dressed in full matador regalia , swings his cape dramatically as he jumps the pit wall on to the one end of the start-finish line .
Meanwhile , at the other end , the young British knight clangs his armoured feet down onto the tarmac .
He lifts his face shield , and they stare .

Then , the two of them , prompted by the chime of a huge gong in the centre , by Ron , wearing referee black and white stripes(needs to get used to wearing stripes) , walk slowly towards each other .

Ron has had arranged in the centre , 4 tires on thier sides , stacked , to provide a table . They remove one , when the drivers get there , as it is too tall .

Ron slips a Ferrari rear wheel cover from behind his back , and sets it in place , explaining it as needed to provide an even playing surface . Several technicians step forward and start measuring it , and Ron explains that they need to ensure everything is on the level .

The thumbs come forwards , and after some confusion as to who gets to start on the grippy Spaniard's fore-finger knuckle side , the battle ensues .

El matador's thumb looks left and bobs right , but cannot get over the nail of Sir Lewlew , who keeps his thumb up as he refuses to follow team orders to let Fern the possibilty of an advantage .

Then , caught on camera for all the world to see , the Spaniard swings his foot around the "tire stack" (reported on British TV as a "tyre pile") , and kicks Sir Lewlew in the shin . This loses him valuable seconds , thinking about his next move , and he relaxes his thumb for a moment .
El Matador pounces , denying Sir Lewlew the prime strategy .

Ron explains that they should clarify the kicking rules in thumb-wrestling because they have to use thier feet to stand on during the contest , and Fern might have slipped on Ron's sweat , as he was under " a lot of pressure at the mo " , and perspiring profusely .

The FITW (Federation International Thumb-Wrestling) does not buy the story , and sanctions Juan Pablo Montoya for laughing in the background at the hearing .



OK , I guess that won't work either .

[donKey jote]

Hey Buddy!! do you have a link for this - it sounds too good to be true but then it probably is correct. If Anthony called the Stewards, then he should be banned from the McLaren pits together with Alonso's massager. No team can put up with back stabbing like this.
I just found the online link to the article in the paper: http://www.elpais.com/articulo/deportes/noche/fratricida/McLaren/elpepudep/20070806elpepidep_4/Tes

Now bear in mind that el Pais isn´t Marca, but it is Spanish :D


Nadie esperaba una reacción similar. Todo el mundo ( hispanohablante ? ;) ) estaba convencido de que, a lo máximo, aquello era un asunto interno del equipo McLaren Mercedes. Pero... no. Alertados por el padre de Hamilton, Anthony, los comisarios intervinieron.

Durante la reunión con los comisarios, Dennis y Hamilton se enzarzaron en una agria discusión hasta el extremo de que los propios comisarios debieron cortarla. "Eso es asunto vuestro. Ya lo resolveréis en casa", les dijeron

They also quote ioan´s best friend Verdegay: "En la sentencia no hay ningún elemento legal que justifique la sanción a Alonso"

As far as I´m concerned (which despite my braying isn´t really that much :laugh: ), they are all a bunch of donkeys for spoiling what could have been a great 3-way race :)

http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/16/16_3_166.gif

[Garry Walker]

If I were Ron Dennis I would ban Anthony and discipline Lewis :laugh:
I just read (in el pais ;) ) that it was Anthony who called the stewards, and that Lewis carried on argueing with Ron at the hearing... no wonder they had no choice but to penalise McLaren too :dozey:

If it comes from Spanish press, who on earth would doubt its credibility? :rotflmao:


they are all a bunch of donkeys for spoiling what could have been a great 3-way race :)


Then the next time you need to tell your buddy Alonso not to behave like an idiot. He was the one who caused this.

[Fallingwater]

Then the next time you need to tell your buddy Alonso not to behave like an idiot. He was the one who caused this.
Not according to the rest of team, at least.
Are you denying the incident of harsh words between RD and LH? Wait, the Spanish media probably invented that too!
You should just believe the unbiased British media, for example. They'll certainly be more truthful when it comes to Alonso's wrongdoings :D

[Garry Walker]

Not according to the rest of team, at least.
Are you denying the incident of harsh words between RD and LH? Wait, the Spanish media probably invented that too!
You should just believe the unbiased British media, for example. They'll certainly be more truthful when it comes to Alonso's wrongdoings :D

LH was obviously the one guilty of not letting FA pass him. But he wasnt guilty of FA staying in pits for 10 seconds and blocking him. This is what FA is guilty of and that is what landed him the deserved penalty. What LH did wasnt good for the team, but it gives FA no justification for what he did.
Why did you say " not according to the rest of the team, at least". Ron himself admitted FA wasnt innocent in this.

Where have I denied that LH and RD apparently had a very heated exchange?

British press has many faults, but compared to spanish press, they are angels

[donKey jote]

British press has many faults, but compared to spanish press, they are angels
LINK PLEASE :bounce: :rolleyes:

keep living in your dillusion, matey, the Spaniards never invented the term "tabloid press" :laugh:

[Garry Walker]

LINK PLEASE :bounce: :rolleyes:


What kind of a link do you want? I suggest you read some of Carlos Miquels works, they make Shakespeare and Verne look like amateurs.




keep living in your dillusion, matey, the Spaniards never invented the term "tabloid press" :laugh:
So you trust what is written in spanish press and consider them not biased? :rotflmao: :rotflmao:

[donKey jote]

About as much as I trust what is written in the British press ;) :dozey:
Unlike you, I can read past the bias in both the Spanish and the English press :laugh:

btw, I don't read french press, so I'm not sure what you mean about Verne :rotflmao:
(I admit to being a donkey and not having a clue who carlos miquel is :D )

[Garry Walker]

About as much as I trust what is written in the British press ;) :dozey:

Yet you seemed to take it as undeniable truth that it was Anthony Hamilton who called the stewards, that sounds exactly what happened doesnt it :rotflmao:

[donKey jote]

So that's where you're coming from :dozey:
didn't you spot the :laugh: ?, hardly a statement of undeniable belief :rolleyes:

[Buzz Lightyear]

you mean an honest interview on "British TV"... then give him an honest chance :D :rolleyes:
I could understand if he is a bit allergic to your press, couldn´t you?

No. The FIA post qualifiying interview. Watch Alonso squirm out of every direct question.

PS Im not British, so have no bias toward their tabloid press.

[donKey jote]

You saw Alonso squirm after quali, I saw Lewis squirm after the race. I guess it's down to the colour of our glasses :D

[Ian McC]

Ron needs to punish them both, he is Boss, they need to learn that. If he doesn't anarchy will soon set in.

[Wilderness]

Spot on, from his drivers to the engineers to Anthony Hamilton.

[tinchote]

I just found the online link to the article in the paper: http://www.elpais.com/articulo/deportes/noche/fratricida/McLaren/elpepudep/20070806elpepidep_4/Tes

Now bear in mind that el Pais isn´t Marca, but it is Spanish :D


(...)

They also quote ioan´s best friend Verdegay: "En la sentencia no hay ningún elemento legal que justifique la sanción a Alonso"


Of course, the "authority" quoted is a Spanish guy on a Spanish newspaper :rolleyes:

There is enough in the sporting code to justify the actions of the stewards:


from FIA F1 Sporting regulations (http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.nsf/1754DB4574B7A2C0C1257329003642F0/$FILE/2007-F1-SPORTING_REG_13-07-2007.pdf?Openelement)
31.1 Save where these Sporting Regulations require otherwise, pit lane and track discipline and safety measures will be the same for all practice sessions as for the race.

(...)

31.6 In the event of a driving infringement during any practice session the Stewards may drop the driver such number of grid positions as they consider appropriate. Unless it is completely clear that a driver committed a driving infringement any such incident will normally be investigated after the relevant session, any penalty imposed shall not be subject to appeal. Where appropriate, regard will also be given to the provisions of Article 18.1.

31.7 Any driver taking part in any practice session who, in the opinion of the stewards, stops unnecessarily on the circuit or unnecessarily impedes another driver shall be subject to the penalties referred to in Article 31.6.


If you happen to think that this is not enough to penalize FA, think of the following: next race, when FA is about to come for his last pit stop 2 minutes before the end of Q3, Massa stops for 30 seconds at the entry of the pit lane, preventing cars from entering the pit lane. FA cannot do the last lap, and KR gets pole. Does Massa deserve a sancton or not? Because it is exactly the same situation. The fact that unsportmanship is against your own teammate doesn't make it less so.

[Buzz Lightyear]

If i were Ron Dennis i would... tell Alonso.. that if you cant work with hamilton... you can go

link?

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/formula_1/article2211563.ece

[pits4me]

LH was obviously the one guilty of not letting FA pass him. But he wasnt guilty of FA staying in pits for 10 seconds and blocking him. This is what FA is guilty of and that is what landed him the deserved penalty. What LH did wasnt good for the team, but it gives FA no justification for what he did.
Why did you say " not according to the rest of the team, at least". Ron himself admitted FA wasnt innocent in this.

Where have I denied that LH and RD apparently had a very heated exchange?

British press has many faults, but compared to spanish press, they are angels

The British press also remembered Alonso was slightly off Hamilton's pace all weekend. Too bad it took diabolical action in the pits (by the 2-time WDC!) to protect his "image".

[markabilly]

think of the following: next race, when FA is about to come for his last pit stop 2 minutes before the end of Q3, Massa stops for 30 seconds at the entry of the pit lane, preventing cars from entering the pit lane. FA cannot do the last lap, and KR gets pole. Does Massa deserve a sancton or not? .
Depends. Does running out of gas qualify as an acceptable excuse...... :roll: :burnout: :rotflmao:

[leopard]

I'd tell FA next time you must make the maneuver smoother, it wasn't your typical playing it harshly.

hilarious thread :D

[wmcot]

That's not exactly ethical.

Pretty much sums up modern day F1!

[TMorel]

markabilly - you say Mercedes don't want that sort of image of someone telling their boss to "swivel"

I was in a Mercedes dealership yesterday (after the most disgusting treatment at an Alfa Romeo dealership) and a bigwig doctor was in there chatting to a salesguy.

Basically he was saying the "stick it to the establishment" and "win at all costs, even if you have to screw your teammate" is exactly the sort of image that sells - and considering he was buying two cars, something expensive for the wife (or maybe mistress) and something obscenely expensive for himself then maybe this is exactly what Mercedes needs to encourage.

(and no, I didn't buy a Merc after all, am going back to try and find someone who actually wants to sell me an Alfa Romeo Spider - but has nothing to do with Lewis or Fernando)

[F1MAN2007]

According to Marca, Alonso had served Dennis with the ultimatum "Hamilton or me".

[Valve Bounce]

According to Marca, Alonso had served Dennis with the ultimatum "Hamilton or me".


OBOY!! things are hotting up in Woking.

[truefan72]

According to Marca, Alonso had served Dennis with the ultimatum "Hamilton or me".

hmm lets see,

2 time WDC champ living on his laurels, unable to stand the pressure of his fellow team driver, complainer, critical of his engineers and managment when he doesn't get his way, conflicts with others, cheats on the track, creates acrymony when told that fair and equal treatment will be the norm, refuses to talk to team principles, uses the spanish press as his rage outlet

or the current WDC leader, lightning quick, $19 million cheaper, huge potential, while breaking records ALL in his rookie year, always complimentary of the team, works well with others, Doesn't let his own Ego get in the way of his performance, coveted by every top team out there, and well on is way to mega stardom on a global level, probably beyond the F1 circles.


you choose who stays and who goes...

I wish they would both stay, no matter what the "F1 insiders" think ( usally former drivers with their own bent POV's), this situation of having the top 2 WDC drivers and 2 of the top 3 drivers in F1 on the same outfit is nothing but nirvana for McClaren Business. Twice the TV coverage, huge amounts of press, increased sposnsorship and branding etc.

I want them stay because it gives us a direct comparison of driving ability and competition. We can't say; "such and such driver is not in the best car, therefore, we can't compare." In this case we can and the WDC is ever the more exciting because of that, With Kimi and Mass going at it (amicably) and Heidefeld and Kubica running neck and neck, we are treated to very competitive and balanced intramural battles.

[ArrowsFA1]

OBOY!! things are hotting up in Woking.
Or the media are making things up. They wouldn't...would they? :s pinhead:

[Hondo]

If I were Ron Dennis, I'd move to Switzerland, sell my McLaren shares, walk away from the whole mess laughing, and not look back.

[Flat.tyres]

Or the media are making things up. They wouldn't...would they? :s pinhead:

i understand that Ron will honour Freddies contract although if Alonso requested a move, he wouldnt exactly cry about it. and thats not from the press either.

[markabilly]

markabilly - you say Mercedes don't want that sort of image of someone telling their boss to "swivel"

I was in a Mercedes dealership yesterday (after the most disgusting treatment at an Alfa Romeo dealership) and a bigwig doctor was in there chatting to a salesguy.

Basically he was saying the "stick it to the establishment" and "win at all costs, even if you have to screw your teammate" is exactly the sort of image that sells - and considering he was buying two cars, something expensive for the wife (or maybe mistress) and something obscenely expensive for himself then maybe this is exactly what Mercedes needs to encourage.

(and no, I didn't buy a Merc after all, am going back to try and find someone who actually wants to sell me an Alfa Romeo Spider - but has nothing to do with Lewis or Fernando)


well then perhaps mercedes needs a proper marketing analysis of what will sell their cars--does swiveling sell more cars and phones...if LH does sell more than FA, then there is the answer.....like I said earlier, follow the money and if you know where the money is going......

now all thos purists out there, they have forgotten that the days of a Chapman at lotus or enzo ferrari, where they sold road cars to produce revenue and profit to go racing all long dead and gone.

The name of the game is to use to use racing to produce revenue and profit from the sale of road cars and other products for the stockholders....

[F1MAN2007]

i understand that Ron will honour Freddies contract although if Alonso requested a move, he wouldnt exactly cry about it. and thats not from the press either.

That is normal, first his loved kid who can trait him all the sort of the F*** words as he wants, and after becomes the recycled driver. Also he would be stupid losing all the investement he has made in this brilliant arrogant kid. :D

[markabilly]

markabilly - you say Mercedes don't want that sort of image of someone telling their boss to "swivel"

I was in a Mercedes dealership yesterday (after the most disgusting treatment at an Alfa Romeo dealership) and a bigwig doctor was in there chatting to a salesguy.

Basically he was saying the "stick it to the establishment" and "win at all costs, even if you have to screw your teammate" is exactly the sort of image that sells - and considering he was buying two cars, something expensive for the wife (or maybe mistress) and something obscenely expensive for himself then maybe this is exactly what Mercedes needs to encourage.

(and no, I didn't buy a Merc after all, am going back to try and find someone who actually wants to sell me an Alfa Romeo Spider - but has nothing to do with Lewis or Fernando)

Just realized that you might be serious about a spider...there is a reason they don't like selling too many, cause they only have some much space in their garage for working on them....had one many many years ago. Really needed at least three--one to drive while fixing the second with parts stolen from the third

But when it ran, gee it was one fine drive.....before the aflie, I wanted to buy this ac shelby cobra with the 427, but my pop said look at the seats (real bad shape), the paint chipped and scarred and a general state of disrepair and the price was outrageous like $3.0K, buy a chevie instead and so I did...finally could not stand it any longer (and being older with money to spend), saw the alfie and bought it...too bad I just did not buy and park the cobra

Of course the price may be dating me...I could talk about the GPs I went to wondering around in the pits and talking to Jim Clark (when I asked if he was going to win, he just gave me a slight nervous little grin, and said if yes, if the car does not break), or the time I went to Riverside CAn-am, got every driver's signature on the written program on Friday and Saturday, and then as we started to leave the pit area, someone offerred my old man a beer and me a cold coke from a cooler in the back of the their pick up

After a few mintutes of chit-chat with all the practice over, it was time to go, and my dad said don't you want Mr. Newman's autograph? Puzzled I was because I had not noticed his name on the program, I asked "are you a driver?"

He said no, and I gave a look like forget it..at which time Mr. Newman started laughing and said that is okay kid, I understand...and so he did not sully my book with some actor's signature.....

Earlier that day as the cars were being pushed from the garage to the pits for the frist practice and qualifying of that day, Jim Hall stopped and gave me his autograph...and then Dan Gurney who was helping push his car, saw me and stopped a whole procession of race cars and asked me if I wanted his autograph, which of course I responded with thanks. He said NO, no, thank you, signed and patted me on the back while the other cars and drivers were forced to wait. Then came Swede Savage, then Bruce Mclaren, and Denny Hulme, all of whom stopped with their race cars that were being pushed and without a request from me and signed the program with smiles on their faces......

Oh well, those were really the great days :D :D

And now we have progress, moving forward to the modern times of Bernie ernie, Rd, FA, LH and such.....

[Flat.tyres]

That is normal, first his loved kid who can trait him all the sort of the F*** words as he wants, and after becomes the recycled driver. Also he would be stupid losing all the investement he has made in this brilliant arrogant kid. :D

Lewis needs to take a step back. for sure, he is driving the best out there and wants to win the WDC more than life itself. he has also got right underneath FA's skin BIG TIME. remember the comment after the last race that even though he scored no points, he was amused to think he was still leading the championship? That was aimed at Alonso and I understand p*ssed him off right royally :D

problem is, he needs to maintain that composure. I understand that Alonso has been playing some games this year but Lewis hasn't bitten which has been hard on Freddie. Lewis needs to do more of the same and getting up Rons nose is not going to achieve his goal. I know some dont like Ron here but he will dish it out if he needs to so Lewis better watch his step a bit.

[jarrambide]

Or the media are making things up. They wouldn't...would they? :s pinhead:

Marca?, making things up?, How can you doubt the most ethical paper in the world. ;)

[leopard]

If I were Ron Dennis, I'd move to Switzerland, sell my McLaren shares, walk away from the whole mess laughing, and not look back.

Can't, you can't go anywhere before you make it clear that you win espionage scandal. ;)

[tinchote]

The guy certainly doesn't want to retire. He probably has more money than all of us together, but he needs to be jumping all around the World to see his cars race. I'm the most removed from liking him, but his passion - in a quirky British way ;) - is undeniable.

[ten-tenths]

if i was ron dennis.... i would sock the crap of briatore. briatore basically called ron a liar! wow, sucks to be ron right now.

[F1MAN2007]

Marca?, making things up?, How can you doubt the most ethical paper in the world. ;)

Haaaaa......!!!!!! :D

[555-04Q2]

if i was ron dennis.... i would sock the crap of briatore. briatore basically called ron a liar! wow, sucks to be ron right now.

Wrong!!! It sucks to be Ron all the time :D

[rohanweb]

Dennis is a control freak. Lewis flipped, and rightly so. If what Dennis was saying was correct, then lewis was never going to get his last lap in... and thats bollocks. Dennis cannot control these guys. Lewis is a racing machine, and not even RD is going to stop him. Lewis has all the cards... Ferrari or BMW would give him a $100m dollar contract tomorrow.

As for Alonso, his ego is the size of Spain. He has to admit that Lewis is quicker, at the moment. His interview after qualifying was pathetic. He thinks he was being clever. Instead, all Alonsos sound bites seem to come from the Spanish Media, rather than giving an honest interview on TV.

Lewis has come of age.. and he is taking no sh1t from anyone. Kimi defiantly wouldnt take it from Alonso. Its just we didnt expect this reaction from Lewis... until now. Nobody has told Ron to go swivel... until now.

Brilliant!


Well said mate :)
one of the best comments I have ever read.. keep it up...

[rohanweb]

Ron Dennis = Lion King ;-)

[wmcot]

The latest, according to McLaren, is that the "F-word" was not used by either Hamilton or Dennis. Also, that Lewis and Fernando are talking and planning to meet during the holiday.

Link:http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/09082007/13/mclaren-deny-hamilton-s-hungarian-profanities.html

While this could be true, I expect that McLaren will next announce that the F-word has never been used by an employee at any time!

Is it just me or has McLaren been issuing an awful lot of explanations/excuses for things this season?

[markabilly]

The latest, according to McLaren, is that the "F-word" was not used by either Hamilton or Dennis. Also, that Lewis and Fernando are talking and planning to meet during the holiday.

Link:http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/09082007/13/mclaren-deny-hamilton-s-hungarian-profanities.html

While this could be true, I expect that McLaren will next announce that the F-word has never been used by an employee at any time!

Is it just me or has McLaren been issuing an awful lot of explanations/excuses for things this season?

Well, now, it does not say that he never said "go swivel", just did not say" F***" as in "go F****swivel" and it was never clear rather it was from the radio or in the pit garage

HOWEVER that is not important, what is, is this: It is great to hear from LH that he is going on holiday with FA. That sounds very very sweet, they must be planning on drinking lots and lots of Kool aid together :beer: and LH will be reasurring to FA, that if RD ever again tells LH to to let FA pass, he will certainly do so...should that ever happen again (meanwhile LH is thinking "RD you better never ever F******talk like that to me ...")

[Juppe]

The latest, according to McLaren, is that the "F-word" was not used by either Hamilton or Dennis. Also, that Lewis and Fernando are talking and planning to meet during the holiday.

Link:http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/09082007/13/mclaren-deny-hamilton-s-hungarian-profanities.html

While this could be true, I expect that McLaren will next announce that the F-word has never been used by an employee at any time!

Is it just me or has McLaren been issuing an awful lot of explanations/excuses for things this season?

Actually, their statement says that Lewis did not say the F-word - it however leaves it open whether Dennis used it or not.

... which is a sure sign that he did. :)

[pits4me]

hmm lets see,

2 time WDC champ living on his laurels, unable to stand the pressure of his fellow team driver, complainer, critical of his engineers and managment when he doesn't get his way, conflicts with others, cheats on the track, creates acrymony when told that fair and equal treatment will be the norm, refuses to talk to team principles, uses the spanish press as his rage outlet

or the current WDC leader, lightning quick, $19 million cheaper, huge potential, while breaking records ALL in his rookie year, always complimentary of the team, works well with others, Doesn't let his own Ego get in the way of his performance, coveted by every top team out there, and well on is way to mega stardom on a global level, probably beyond the F1 circles.


you choose who stays and who goes...

I wish they would both stay, no matter what the "F1 insiders" think ( usally former drivers with their own bent POV's), this situation of having the top 2 WDC drivers and 2 of the top 3 drivers in F1 on the same outfit is nothing but nirvana for McClaren Business. Twice the TV coverage, huge amounts of press, increased sposnsorship and branding etc.

I want them stay because it gives us a direct comparison of driving ability and competition. We can't say; "such and such driver is not in the best car, therefore, we can't compare." In this case we can and the WDC is ever the more exciting because of that, With Kimi and Mass going at it (amicably) and Heidefeld and Kubica running neck and neck, we are treated to very competitive and balanced intramural battles.

Very good observations Truefan. The Spanish press decided to go after Fleet Street and we are seeing the consequences. I think some of the POTP (put out to pasture) drivers including Eddie Irvine can only wish they had a smidgen of attention young Lewis and Alonso are getting.

Any press, goo or bad, is a plus for marketability. Lewis has been very quiet with certain elements of last weekend. When the swell of speculation and conjecture die down, likely after Turkey qualifying, we may see less spin and a more structured response.

[markabilly]

As long as they are talking about you, it is better than when they are NOT--just ask davis weedie or whoeever was that driver who drove for red cow burger until recently......gee what was his name....

[hazza24]

aparently, Lewis and Fernando plan to spend some quality time together over the summer break.....
http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=40330

Is it me or does this not sound like the works of Hamilton, but rather a worried McLaren Team...!

[truefan72]

aparently, Lewis and Fernando plan to spend some quality time together over the summer break.....
http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=40330

Is it me or does this not sound like the works of Hamilton, but rather a worried McLaren Team...!

However way they get together, I'll take it. It is a good thing. Maybethey can agree that they are going to provide us wuth a spectacular back-and-forth for the WDC and amicably as well.

[Roamy]

i f I were RD I would send FA to ferrari or renault and hire Nico!!

[ArrowsFA1]

aparently, Lewis and Fernando plan to spend some quality time together over the summer break.....
http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=40330
How true this is:

"...it is disappointing that inflammatory and untrue material is given to the media and published which may damage reputations. This inflammatory material is then commentated on by many others as if it is factual.

[leopard]

There is not open war, but I guess there is an unavoidably ice war between them :D

[wmcot]

Actually, their statement says that Lewis did not say the F-word - it however leaves it open whether Dennis used it or not.

... which is a sure sign that he did. :)

Actually, I'm amazed that McLaren (RD) feel they have to issue a statement at all. I'm sure that the F-word has been used at least once in the McLaren pits, factory, or offices in a time of anger.

The more things that RD explains, the more it appears he is hiding. As I quoted earlier, "Methinks he protests too much..."

[ArrowsFA1]

The more things that RD explains, the more it appears he is hiding...
Why does that follow? If you were to see inaccurate, unfounded or untrue stories about you and/or your business in the international media, which were being repeated ad nauseam, and discussed and dissected as fact, would you be happy to let them stand? Wouldn't you want to correct them?

[555-04Q2]

Why does that follow? If you were to see inaccurate, unfounded or untrue stories about you and/or your business in the international media, which were being repeated ad nauseam, and discussed and dissected as fact, would you be happy to let them stand? Wouldn't you want to correct them?

When you are innocent, the truth will be uncovered and you get on with life. When you are guilty, you tend to make a noise and divert the attention. I know because it happened to me when I was 17 years old.

My advice to Ron is to keep his mouth shut and make his accusers look stupid when the truth comes out if he is innocent of the accusations.

[ArrowsFA1]

When you are innocent, the truth will be uncovered and you get on with life. When you are guilty, you tend to make a noise and divert the attention. I know because it happened to me when I was 17 years old.

My advice to Ron is to keep his mouth shut and make his accusers look stupid when the truth comes out if he is innocent of the accusations.
That may be very good advice, but Ron Dennis doesn't strike me as someone who can sit back and allow thrown mud to stick. He's said in the past that losing races and championships causes him physical pain, and it's clear that what he and his team are going through at the moment is doing the same. You can see and hear it whenever he's interviewed on tv.

[janneppi]

When you are innocent, the truth will be uncovered and you get on with life. When you are guilty, you tend to make a noise and divert the attention.
How can the truth be discovered if he should remain silent?
If Lewis would say he didn't swear, you'd propably accuse Dennis from writing that statement. ;)
If a tape would be given to public, you'd accuse Dennis of doctoring it ;)

The best thing we can do would be to ignore what is "reportedly" said and focus on what happens the track.

[555-04Q2]

How can the truth be discovered if he should remain silent?

If he is innocent, someone has to fabricate something to make him look guilty and that is when holes in the accusations can be found. Then you speak up. Remember, you learn more in all aspects of life when you listen and keep the hole in your mouth shut. The same applies to making statements. The more you say, the more people say you are guilty or you are trying to hiding something. Let the truth sort things out.

Accusations only hurt when they are real and you need to look inside yourself to unravel them. When accusations are untrue, you can at least sleep at night in confidence. I've been there and I know how he feels (to a certain degree) but I never had millions of people watching me :s hock:

[555-04Q2]

That may be very good advice, but Ron Dennis doesn't strike me as someone who can sit back and allow thrown mud to stick. He's said in the past that losing races and championships causes him physical pain, and it's clear that what he and his team are going through at the moment is doing the same. You can see and hear it whenever he's interviewed on tv.

I dont really like the RD to be honest, but I do feel for him having the current stolen document and driver problems all at the same time. Hell at 60 odd, I hope I dont have to worry about getting to the toilet in time, let alone the problems he has to put up with at the moment :p :

[ArrowsFA1]

Hell at 60 odd, I hope I dont have to worry about getting to the toilet in time, let alone the problems he has to put up with at the moment :p :
Me neither :laugh:

[leopard]

There has been a lot of good advice today :)
If the accusation was real and true we may obtain the bitter consequence for our fault, it hurts; but if the accusation was untrue and we did not do anything to be guilty, it hurts more.

[Flat.tyres]

If he is innocent, someone has to fabricate something to make him look guilty and that is when holes in the accusations can be found. Then you speak up. Remember, you learn more in all aspects of life when you listen and keep the hole in your mouth shut. The same applies to making statements. The more you say, the more people say you are guilty or you are trying to hiding something. Let the truth sort things out.

Accusations only hurt when they are real and you need to look inside yourself to unravel them. When accusations are untrue, you can at least sleep at night in confidence. I've been there and I know how he feels (to a certain degree) but I never had millions of people watching me :s hock:

so, Ron should remember that sticks and stones can break his bones but names will never hurt him eh? :rolleyes:

there is so much crap being written that occassionally he has to respond to put matters straight. You say its too much, I say he has released very little for the team boss leading the Championship.

[555-04Q2]

so, Ron should remember that sticks and stones can break his bones but names will never hurt him eh? :rolleyes:

there is so much crap being written that occassionally he has to respond to put matters straight. You say its too much, I say he has released very little for the team boss leading the Championship.

Hollywood stars constantly read cr@p about themselves in the papers every day like they are pregnant when they arent or they have a drinking problem or they nailed a prostitute on 4th Avenue last Sunday. What do they do? They ignore the cr@p and carry on making movies and spending their millions because they know it is all cr@p and doesnt need commenting on.

[ArrowsFA1]

What do they do? They ignore the cr@p and carry on making movies and spending their millions because they know it is all cr@p and doesnt need commenting on.
Or they sue (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/6565347.stm) ;)

[555-04Q2]

Or they sue (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/6565347.stm) ;)

Yes, but they dont sue everyone who makes a false statement against them. If they did, they would be in court for a million years ;)

[janneppi]

If he is innocent, someone has to fabricate something to make him look guilty and that is when holes in the accusations can be found. Then you speak up. Remember, you learn more in all aspects of life when you listen and keep the hole in your mouth shut. The same applies to making statements. The more you say, the more people say you are guilty or you are trying to hiding something. Let the truth sort things out.

How do you suppose the "truth" would come out if not by McLaren?
Press very often make false accusations and start rumors, when was the last time you saw another journalist accuse their colleagues of lying?
Or are you waiting for someone to voluntarily come clean?

The details of this incident will fade in time, but the "alleged" fight between Lewis and Ronnie will be remembered even if it might not have happened at all.
That's why Dennis needs to be quick in his reply, get in before it's too late.

[555-04Q2]

How do you suppose the "truth" would come out if not by McLaren?
Press very often make false accusations and start rumors, when was the last time you saw another journalist accuse their colleagues of lying?
Or are you waiting for someone to voluntarily come clean?

In order to be guilty, someone has to prove an allegation against you. If the allegations are false, why defend yourself when they cant be proven.

Heresay is heresay and proof is proof. One should be defended, the other ignored.

[Flat.tyres]

In order to be guilty, someone has to prove an allegation against you. If the allegations are false, why defend yourself when they cant be proven.

Heresay is heresay and proof is proof. One should be defended, the other ignored.

or

theres no smoke without fire and sh*t sticks ;)

damned if you do and damned if you dont.

[555-04Q2]

The details of this incident will fade in time, but the "alleged" fight between Lewis and Ronnie will be remembered even if it might not have happened at all.
That's why Dennis needs to be quick in his reply, get in before it's too late.

I think he needs to give Lewis a clap around the earhole for being disrespectful. Thats the only problem I have seen with the RD/LW affair.

[janneppi]

In order to be guilty, someone has to prove an allegation against you. If the allegations are false, why defend yourself when they cant be proven.

Heresay is heresay and proof is proof. One should be defended, the other ignored.
If Dennis wouldn't reply to the accusations, you'd probably say it's because he can't say anything because it's true. ;)

[555-04Q2]

If Dennis wouldn't reply to the accusations, you'd probably say it's because he can't say anything because it's true. ;)

Nope! The other way round ;)

[F1MAN2007]

..... Also, that Lewis and Fernando are talking and planning to meet during the holiday....?

I think Lewis has an interest in another thing than the recycled driver. :D

Lewis is a phenomena :D and it is not on track he is fast, even on babies no one could do better than him :D


http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/08_01/hamiltonBIG0808_228x505.jpg

[Firstgear]

I guess LH fanatics were right - Lewis CAN walk on water.

[wmcot]

Why does that follow? If you were to see inaccurate, unfounded or untrue stories about you and/or your business in the international media, which were being repeated ad nauseam, and discussed and dissected as fact, would you be happy to let them stand? Wouldn't you want to correct them?

I would think that RD would be far too busy running McLaren to worry about answering every little accusation with a formal statement. A simple "It never happened" or "That's completely untrue" to the press would be enough.

The more RD tries to defend himself to the press, the more the press are likely to continue to harass him with stories. He should treat the press like a spoiled, crying child - ignore them and they'll stop. No audience (RD) - no performance (media).

[leopard]

It doesn't mean he has to stop answering media, such doing may on the other hand make everything getting worse.

I think it is media's own right ask him anything and he has right to treat media formally or the other way, and media write it with their own version. We the audience who judge it according to our looking glass :)

[leopard]

heck, she isn't Asian, I can't believe Lewis now :D

[wmcot]

It doesn't mean he has to stop answering media, such doing may on the other hand make everything getting worse.

I think it is media's own right ask him anything and he has right to treat media formally or the other way, and media write it with their own version. We the audience who judge it according to our looking glass :)

Perhaps that's his personality. For me, I would figure they're going to make up whatever they want to so by not speaking at all to the media, it would give them fewer words to twist around. Here I'm defending him and I'm not even a fan of his.

[F1MAN2007]

heck, she isn't Asian, I can't believe Lewis now :D

end of the story with asians...!!! :D

[leopard]

end of the story with asians...!!! :D
From now on I have no doubt at all that Lewis is strong, she is big :D

[Juppe]

From now on I have no doubt at all that Lewis is strong, she is big :D

..and she is also boss's daughter:

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/showbiz/a ... article.do (http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/showbiz/article-23408315-details/Lewis's+mystery+brunette+is+the+boss's+daughter/article.do)

Lewis is fishing for trouble, I think.

[F1MAN2007]

The Kid continues to suprise me!!!

"Lewis Hamilton crowned his 2007 debut season by winning the title in Japan in October. "

Link :http://www.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/070813160928.shtml

[F1MAN2007]

....Lewis is fishing for trouble, I think.


no, no mate,no trouble, just this is the life of so-called "STARS" is....!!!! :D

http://img.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2007/06_04/hamiltonBIG_468x557.jpg

[Buzz Lightyear]

Hi guys... you know who this babe is??

Daughter of TAG McLaren co-owner, Mansour Ojjeh!!!

Talk about keeping it in the 'family' !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[F1MAN2007]

Hi guys... you know who this babe is??

Daughter of TAG McLaren co-owner, Mansour Ojjeh!!!

Talk about keeping it in the 'family' !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Very difficult to make choice.....?!!! :D

The first babe is the Daughter of TAG Mclaren co-owner Ojjeh!!!

And the second babe is the singer Natash Beingfield!!!

[leopard]

..and she is also boss's daughter:

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/showbiz/a ... article.do (http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/showbiz/article-23408315-details/Lewis's+mystery+brunette+is+the+boss's+daughter/article.do)

Lewis is fishing for trouble, I think.
this is surely troubling me for envying of that so much preferences for Hamilton, the brunette, blond and Asian

[leopard]

Very difficult to make choice.....?!!! :D

Not so difficult, the first choice has stronger chassis and wouldn't be a bad choice for F1 driver :D

[wmcot]

Hi guys... you know who this babe is??

Daughter of TAG McLaren co-owner, Mansour Ojjeh!!!

Talk about keeping it in the 'family' !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Could be a future of McBabies!!!

[leopard]

It's though to make a future prediction ;)

[F1MAN2007]

Not so difficult, the first choice has stronger chassis and wouldn't be a bad choice for F1 driver :D


Haaaaaaa!!!!!! You are right man!!! :laugh: :beer:

And as long she is Boss's daughter you are sure soon you gonna be a billionaire with all favours!!! The Kid is clever :D

[F1MAN2007]

Could be a future of McBabies!!!

:laugh:

[punkologist]

geez there are a lot of Mclaren hating jealous loser Ferrari fanboys on this site! What's with all the hatred of LH?

Anyway if i were ron dennis i would pack FA's bags for him and give him his marching orders the end of the year. He is a dirty cheating p***k, and a terribly sore loser (this coming from a huge Mclaren fan). He would fit right in with Schumacher's former cheating team at Ferrari.

[donKey jote]

He is a dirty cheating p***k
This coming from a p***kologist, so it must be true :dozey:

[Juppe]

geez there are a lot of Mclaren hating jealous loser Ferrari fanboys on this site! What's with all the hatred of LH?

Anyway if i were ron dennis i would pack FA's bags for him and give him his marching orders the end of the year. He is a dirty cheating p***k, and a terribly sore loser (this coming from a huge Mclaren fan). He would fit right in with Schumacher's former cheating team at Ferrari.

???

I didn't see any hatred of LH - just envy of his numerous good looking girlfriends!

...and as it is well covered in media and other threads Lewis was no better than Alonso, but Alonso got punished, so you as a Lewis fan should be happy about that.

[Flat.tyres]

This coming from a p***kologist, so it must be true :dozey:

:laugh:

[555-04Q2]

geez there are a lot of Mclaren hating jealous loser Ferrari fanboys on this site! What's with all the hatred of LH?

Anyway if i were ron dennis i would pack FA's bags for him and give him his marching orders the end of the year. He is a dirty cheating p***k, and a terribly sore loser (this coming from a huge Mclaren fan). He would fit right in with Schumacher's former cheating team at Ferrari.

:erm: You need to get some leg over or something.

[F1MAN2007]

This coming from a p***kologist, so it must be true :dozey:

:rotflmao:

[wmcot]

geez there are a lot of Mclaren hating jealous loser Ferrari fanboys on this site! What's with all the hatred of LH?

Anyway if i were ron dennis i would pack FA's bags for him and give him his marching orders the end of the year. He is a dirty cheating p***k, and a terribly sore loser (this coming from a huge Mclaren fan). He would fit right in with Schumacher's former cheating team at Ferrari.

You're a couple of years too late. You would have loved it when the site was dominated by a "lot of [Ferrari] hating jealous loser [McLaren] fanboys" and their hatred of MS. :)

BTW - It's really hard to tell that you are a huge McLaren fan - NOT ;)

[leopard]

p***k, which word the most suitable to be filled in? I don't think mods would mind you write it fully if it refers to pluck (chicken, nose hair etc)

[punkologist]

punk was not the word i was going for there!

Yes i did notice the admiration of LH's girlfriends, but in most threads and posts on this site it seems to be pro ferrari, anti mclaren and people just cant wait to get stuck into LH.

[wmcot]

punk was not the word i was going for there!

Yes i did notice the admiration of LH's girlfriends, but in most threads and posts on this site it seems to be pro ferrari, anti mclaren and people just cant wait to get stuck into LH.

I personally have no problem with LH. I do have a problem with RD and his self-proclaimed "integrity."

Look around at a few more threads and you'll be sure to find the anti-Ferrari bashers. They're still out there full of hatred for MS even though he retired a year ago.

[555-04Q2]

punk was not the word i was going for there!

Yes i did notice the admiration of LH's girlfriends, but in most threads and posts on this site it seems to be pro ferrari, anti mclaren and people just cant wait to get stuck into LH.

Never before in the history of mankind has someone been as wrong as you are on the topic of Ferrari and Mclaren on this forum. Stick around a while ;)

[Flat.tyres]

I personally have no problem with LH. I do have a problem with RD and his self-proclaimed "integrity."


really??????? I have been in a around the sport for quite a few years and never heard Ron proclaim his integrity. I think he would admit to being a workaholic, single minded, hard nosed perfectionist and businessman, but you must be confusing the integrity bit with what his colleagues, competitors and rivals claim of Ron.

ask Frankie :laugh:

[punkologist]

Never before in the history of mankind has someone been as wrong as you are on the topic of Ferrari and Mclaren on this forum. Stick around a while ;)

i haven't been here long, its just the first impression i have got. especially after nuerburg.

[Kata89]

If I were Ron Dennis, I would put one of them (FA or LH) into a Prodrive car, and so they could have two teams with a No1. and a No2. (Paffett and de la Rosa) driver

[leopard]

punk was not the word i was going for there!

You were right, it has three spaces left and is not suitable for punk to be filled in.

[555-04Q2]

i haven't been here long, its just the first impression i have got. especially after nuerburg.

As the saying goes, first impressions last. But I assure you, Ferrari are the enemy on this (any every other I know) Forum ;)

[leopard]

Not sure about Ferrari is public enemy, I only know team order is a fixed rate ;)

[Flat.tyres]

As the saying goes, first impressions last. But I assure you, Ferrari are the enemy on this (any every other I know) Forum ;)

really? I thought they were the most supported team?

true, they have been guilty of some silly things and have had a very contentious driver for a number of years but theres very few people that would consider Ferrari an enemy and they are just extreemists anyway.

rival, sometimes bitter rival, but always a competitor in my opinion.

[Big Ben]

If we were RD we would be so much better... That´s why he´s where he is and we are here talking about him

[wmcot]

really? I thought they were the most supported team?

true, they have been guilty of some silly things and have had a very contentious driver for a number of years but theres very few people that would consider Ferrari an enemy and they are just extreemists anyway.

rival, sometimes bitter rival, but always a competitor in my opinion.

Unfortunately too often in sports, rival and enemy are not distinguishable to many. Then again, neither are fan and fanatic.

[Flat.tyres]

Unfortunately too often in sports, rival and enemy are not distinguishable to many. Then again, neither are fan and fanatic.

enemy and fanatic tends to go hand in hand.

I can think of a few fanatics that refuse to accept documented facts and ignore logic and probability. Can you?

If people refuse to accept that there is 2 sides to a story, then you get fanatical in my opinion.

[555-04Q2]

really? I thought they were the most supported team?

true, they have been guilty of some silly things and have had a very contentious driver for a number of years but theres very few people that would consider Ferrari an enemy and they are just extreemists anyway.

rival, sometimes bitter rival, but always a competitor in my opinion.

Before you were here and when Ferrari/MS were ruling F1, virtually everyone who was not a Ferrari/MS supporter critisised everything they did, be it good or bad. Now that Mclaren and their boys are dominating, it seems to be their turn. You cannot win sometimes :(

Now, back on topic :)

[Flat.tyres]

Before you were here and when Ferrari/MS were ruling F1, virtually everyone who was not a Ferrari/MS supporter critisised everything they did, be it good or bad. Now that Mclaren and their boys are dominating, it seems to be their turn. You cannot win sometimes :(

Now, back on topic :)

you will never find me criticising Ferrari or MS unless I believe there is just cause as you will find me questioning Ron's motives over the moveable floor disclosure.

contrary to some Ferrari fans opinion, I am objective and back up what I say with evidence. Im a McLaren fan, obviously, but appreciate that they are out there to win and if they cross the line, will admit it as I have done on several occassions.

contrary to some Ferrari fans opinion, I am objective and back up what I say with evidence. Im a McLaren fan, obviously, but appreciate that they are out there to win and if they cross the line, will admit it as I have done on several occassions.

Interestingly contradictory statement, that.

A fan,defined by the Oxford dictionay thus......

http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/fan_2?view=uk

Classified as "ORIGIN abbreviation of FANATIC"

Fanatic, described by the Oxford dictionary as......

http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/fanatic?view=uk

It is impossible to be fan and remain objective, so give the sanctimonous hogwash a break and just provide the real, hard evidence to back up your arguments....it would make a nice change.

[janneppi]

Tamburello, let's not go to personal attacks, thanks.

Tamburello, let's not go to personal attacks, thanks.

Wouldn't dream of it.

[wmcot]

Before you were here and when Ferrari/MS were ruling F1, virtually everyone who was not a Ferrari/MS supporter critisised everything they did, be it good or bad. Now that Mclaren and their boys are dominating, it seems to be their turn. You cannot win sometimes :(

Now, back on topic :)

Yeah, sometimes it seems that with 11 teams on the grid, fans of the other 10 teams will always hate the winner. It sucks to win.

[leopard]

It is recommendable to change our favorite team / driver every season according to who takes the lead at the time, we will not hate any team nor driver by doing so :D :p :

[555-04Q2]

you will never find me criticising Ferrari or MS unless I believe there is just cause as you will find me questioning Ron's motives over the moveable floor disclosure.

I'm not accusing you of criticising anyone, just stating what happened on this forum before you got here and what is now happening to Mclaren while you are here. Winning is a crime :p :

[Flat.tyres]

Interestingly contradictory statement, that.

A fan,defined by the Oxford dictionay thus......

http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/fan_2?view=uk

Classified as "ORIGIN abbreviation of FANATIC"

Fanatic, described by the Oxford dictionary as......

http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/fanatic?view=uk

It is impossible to be fan and remain objective, so give the sanctimonous hogwash a break and just provide the real, hard evidence to back up your arguments....it would make a nice change.

why dont you get your pathetic literal definitions and stick them. :p :

if you dont want to play with us and just want to start fights then do it somewhere else.

[Flat.tyres]

I'm not accusing you of criticising anyone, just stating what happened on this forum before you got here and what is now happening to Mclaren while you are here. Winning is a crime :p :

no problem :up:

[ArrowsFA1]

If i were Ron Dennis i would...have thought 'sod it, I don't need this. Money's in the bank. Been there, and won more races and titles than I care to remember. It's time to hand over the reins to Whitmarsh.'

[wmcot]

If i were Ron Dennis i would...have thought 'sod it, I don't need this. Money's in the bank. Been there, and won more races and titles than I care to remember. It's time to hand over the reins to Whitmarsh.'

I think Ron still loves the sport too much (at least he did before the events of this year!)

[janneppi]

If i were Ron Dennis i would...have thought 'sod it, I don't need this. Money's in the bank. Been there, and won more races and titles than I care to remember. It's time to hand over the reins to Whitmarsh.'
If McLaren wins the WCC and one of his drivers the WDC, i think he just might retire.

[ArrowsFA1]

Fortunately for McLaren I'm not Ron Dennis :p : and I suspect that, if anything, events of this year will see him stick around a little longer.

[Flat.tyres]

If i were Ron Dennis i would...have thought 'sod it, I don't need this. Money's in the bank. Been there, and won more races and titles than I care to remember. It's time to hand over the reins to Whitmarsh.'

nail / head.

[Daika]

Are mclaren shielding their drivers from the media again?

"The British team have shielded their stars from the media and neither attended the official FIA press conference on Thursday afternoon."

c'mom they are boths grown ups!!! i'm sure they gonna collect their throphies when they win...

[donKey jote]

Baldy was making a fuss on telecinco about not being allowed to talk to his beloved for the first time ever :dozey:

[Dave B]

Are mclaren shielding their drivers from the media again?

"The British team have shielded their stars from the media and neither attended the official FIA press conference on Thursday afternoon."

c'mom they are boths grown ups!!! i'm sure they gonna collect their throphies when they win...
Source? The schedule (http://www.fia.com/mediacentre/Press_Releases/FIA_Sport/2007/August/210807-01.html) had Coulthard, Massa, Heidfield and Kovalainen down to attend, it made no mention of the McLaren drivers. Besides, its not an option. If the FIA say you're attending, there's very large fine for a no-show.

[Daika]

Source? The schedule (http://www.fia.com/mediacentre/Press_Releases/FIA_Sport/2007/August/210807-01.html) had Coulthard, Massa, Heidfield and Kovalainen down to attend, it made no mention of the McLaren drivers. Besides, its not an option. If the FIA say you're attending, there's very large fine for a no-show.

http://www.planet-f1.com/story/0,18954,3213_2680768,00.html

They didn't attend the last race

They wasn't called, so i guess you are right.