Are ITV to pull the plug on WRC coverage??

[AndyRAC]

It is reported today in Motorsport News that ITV are possibly thinking of pulling the plug on their coverage, instead it might go to one of the ITV digital channels. Can't say I'm surprised by this; no leading British driver challenging for wins, sometimes put on after midnight, no extra coverage for Rally GB,etc. Just somes up the state of the WRC in this country at the moment, any thoughts??

[Daniel]

I always watched it on Eurosport anyway. No big deal :) At least for me

[Simmi]

It's the same coverage as Eurosport so it's not really a problem. Cant be great though having coverage pulled from two of the WRC's most popular countries in Finland and the UK. A bit scary how we are now relying on a channel that has its main focus on the IRC. A perilous position for WRC coverage!

[chrisc]

i dont think eurosport are goin to show it next year, did they not say at the start of this year it would b there last???

[Daniel]

I also get S4C. So I can watch the coverage in Welsh with English subtitles :p But I think that's still the same coverage as well.....

[AndyRAC]

I can get Ralio as well and I have digital. My point was that the WRC has sunk so low that it doesn't justify a place on terrestrial TV in UK. You couldn't imagine the same happening in F1 could you, imagine the outcry!

[Simmi]

Looks like I might have to get out to a few more events next year as that will be the only way I'll be able to watch it lol!

Men and Motors show coverage still I think. Maybe if they could combine the AXN show and the regular coverage it could be something decent, and then show the ISC feed on the Sunday evening or something as a review of the rally.

[A.F.F.]

I can get Ralio as well and I have digital. My point was that the WRC has sunk so low that it doesn't justify a place on terrestrial TV in UK. You couldn't imagine the same happening in F1 could you, imagine the outcry!

Is that really the reason or has WRC outprized itself from terrestrial TV ?

[MJW]

Who cares about ITV. Chanel 4 coverage was moronic, "here is a rock Penny, it can damage rally cars" then ITV's coverage is like taking a sleeping tablet. RALIO on S4C is how rallying programmes should be.

[Daniel]

For people who can understand Welsh :p I can't! :(

[L5->R5/CR]

ISC needs to re-juvenate the television package in general anyway.

Maybe this will be the catalyst that would do it.

In 2006 we didn't have WRC here in the states so we took to downloading it from the internet so we had the english language Eurosport feeds. The shows were sub-par. There are way to many interviews, with not nearly enough time showing the action.

The quality of the broadcasts aren't all that great IMO so why should a network keep dishing out money. F1 broadcasts by comparison have far more production quaity from what I have seen...

[Tomi]

For people who can understand Welsh :p I can't! :(

look up a guy name jamie edwards, he can translate for you :)

[Daniel]

ISC needs to re-juvenate the television package in general anyway.

Maybe this will be the catalyst that would do it.

In 2006 we didn't have WRC here in the states so we took to downloading it from the internet so we had the english language Eurosport feeds. The shows were sub-par. There are way to many interviews, with not nearly enough time showing the action.

The quality of the broadcasts aren't all that great IMO so why should a network keep dishing out money. F1 broadcasts by comparison have far more production quaity from what I have seen...
Yes. Quite right. Too much time is spent on showing the cars going around mediocre corners or on virtual spectator competing against other digital cars..... Very boring. I loved the days when you used to have good helicopter footage, good incar footage and good on stage footage. While I agree the F1 coverage shows better editing I still think the sport itself makes for less rivetting viewing :)

[MJW]

For people who can understand Welsh :p I can't! :(
Welsh? a significant portion of that show is in Finnish, (Marcus does seem to enjoy favoured status, and the drivers are interviewed in their own language)

[Simmi]

Its just the same boring routine every show and it is desperate for a re-vamp. I dont need to see reverse shots of drivers driving and shots from behind Manfred Stohl's seats etc. Helicopter shots are expensive but they truely lead to much better coverage.

[Daniel]

Excuse my ignorance :p

[Tomi]

Yes. Quite right. Too much time is spent on showing the cars going around mediocre corners or on virtual spectator competing against other digital cars..... Very boring. I loved the days when you used to have good helicopter footage, good incar footage and good on stage footage. While I agree the F1 coverage shows better editing I still think the sport itself makes for less rivetting viewing :)

Its impossible to coverage rally like F1, too expensive, F1 is in an open field, when rally is in a forest, they would have to change the sport too much, better with crap coverage than to destroy the sport.

[AndyRAC]

Subtitles are available I believe on page 888 on Teletext I think, as I live on Merseyside I can get all the Welsh TV, so S4C is no problem, and Ralio is a great programme with enthusiastic presenters, especially the girl, who is very nice!!!

[Daniel]

Its impossible to coverage rally like F1, too expensive, F1 is in an open field, when rally is in a forest, they would have to change the sport too much, better with crap coverage than to destroy the sport.
I agree. Something just seems to have changed in the last couple of years with the coverage. We used to have some damn sexy coverage and now it seems someone who doesn't seem to understand the sport has control of where the cameras are and what they do. There are far too many long shots of a corner in the distance and then the car comes into view, goes out of view and then comes into view in the foreground. All the while the camera doesn't move. It kind of gives the impression that the cars are doing a bit of sunday driving to me. Then there are the cameras they put on the road on corners which the cars hit and turn upside down. Then as someone just mentioned you have the reverse shots of drivers which seem to occupy an increasingly large amount of coverage and which also suck quite badly.

[Tomi]

Welsh? a significant portion of that show is in Finnish, (Marcus does seem to enjoy favoured status, and the drivers are interviewed in their own language)

maybe we can rig a cable from your house to mine then

[Tomi]

I agree. Something just seems to have changed in the last couple of years with the coverage. We used to have some damn sexy coverage and now it seems someone who doesn't seem to understand the sport has control of where the cameras are and what they do. There are far too many long shots of a corner in the distance and then the car comes into view, goes out of view and then comes into view in the foreground. All the while the camera doesn't move. It kind of gives the impression that the cars are doing a bit of sunday driving to me. Then there are the cameras they put on the road on corners which the cars hit and turn upside down. Just like having a w@nk it's kind of good every once in a while but when you start doing it 3 times a day you get tired of it quickly. Then as someone just mentioned you have the reverse shots of drivers which seem to occupy an increasingly large amount of coverage and which also suck quite badly.

maybe hey should consentrate on less stages, but do it better, when richards company started, reporters from our national YLE showed where to put the cams for them (this is no joke), thats the level of their stuff.

[MJW]

maybe we can rig a cable from your house to mine then

I'm not sure whether it (Ralio) will be on the internet from 2007. The drivers speak are interviewed in their language and sub titles in Welsh appear on the screen. My grasp of the Finnish language is coming along nicely, - I now know more than p***ele, and v**u.

[Tomi]

I'm not sure whether it (Ralio) will be on the internet from 2007. The drivers speak are interviewed in their language and sub titles in Welsh appear on the screen. My grasp of the Finnish language is coming along nicely, - I now know more than p***ele, and v**u.

:) , improving, but good you already know the most important.

[MJW]

Also Karhu, Karjala, makara etc.

[Daniel]

Knowing how to say Makara as well as indicating how many you want by showing a number of fingers is probably the most important Finnish a rally fan can learn :up:

[MJW]

Ralio have even had Marcus speaking Welsh!

[Tomi]

Ralio have even had Marcus speaking Welsh!

lol

[Tomi]

Ralio have even had Marcus speaking Welsh!

BTW. where you in Jyväskylä now last summer?

[Norwegian Blue]

p***ele

Was that one of Makinens favourite words way back when...? :D

[dyfi1]

Ralio have even had Marcus speaking Welsh!

Hmm, missed that :( . However, if we`re all going to be watching Ralio for our WRC coverage, then a few key words that are rally related, might be helpful. Here`s a few to be getting on with.

rali ............................. rally
chwith ........................ right
dde ............................ left
pencampwr ................. champion
pencampwriaeth y byd.. world championship
llychlynwr ................... scandinavian
afon ........................... river
ia ............................... ice
eira ............................ snow
asffalt ........................ tarmac
glaw .......................... rain

Happy viewing :D

[L5->R5/CR]

Yes. Quite right. Too much time is spent on showing the cars going around mediocre corners or on virtual spectator competing against other digital cars..... Very boring. I loved the days when you used to have good helicopter footage, good incar footage and good on stage footage. While I agree the F1 coverage shows better editing I still think the sport itself makes for less rivetting viewing :)


Boring content but far superior producton quality and attainable in rallying........




Its impossible to coverage rally like F1, too expensive, F1 is in an open field, when rally is in a forest, they would have to change the sport too much, better with crap coverage than to destroy the sport.

Yes and no.


You simply need more crews and better organization.

There was an article a while ago by Nicky Grist, when he was involved in the US broadcasts of the WRC. He mentioned that there are something like 4 actual camera crews for an average WRC. This is a joke. The only reason to use so few crews is to have less footage to edit, which, if they were organized, wouldn't be as hard as they are making it out.

The simple reality is that ISC has committed itself to nightly broadcasts and too many at rally commitments so it doesn't have the set up to commit the necessary resources.

There needs to be a complete reworking of the program and I think that needs to start with dropping friday and saturday broadcasts and doing 2 hour re-caps on sunday. They can use more camera crews and get better footage as well as have higher quality broadcasts.

[MJW]

BTW. where you in Jyväskylä now last summer?

Yes, me and the family were there, best rally in the world.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

Take the coverage back to the BBC. :up:

Get Richard Hammond to do the presenting with Tony Mason.

I remeber when Needell and Mason used to do the commentating and that got me interested in rally. I thought channel 4 initially gave WRC the coverage it deserved but the presenters were rubbish. ITV coverage isn't worth watching. It's dire when compared to the coverage F1 and BTCC get on ITV.

[J4MIE]

If they were to show a repeat of the shows, even if it's mid-week during the night, then maybe some of us that attend events would be able to watch!

As it is, I can't recall sitting down to watch any coverage in 2006. Which is rediculous, really.

[Simmi]

The simple reality is that ISC has committed itself to nightly broadcasts and too many at rally commitments so it doesn't have the set up to commit the necessary resources.

There needs to be a complete reworking of the program and I think that needs to start with dropping friday and saturday broadcasts and doing 2 hour re-caps on sunday. They can use more camera crews and get better footage as well as have higher quality broadcasts.

I completely agree with this they are putting themselves under pressure to get a show out that in many cases will be put on in the middle of the night anyway. They are creatively restricted by this and as a result just come out with rush-job coverage.

If they have to do a live stage they should do it on the saturday stages with a little recap or something but they wouldn't even have to do that IMO just show the leaderboard coming into the stage. Then have a quality highlights package to air on the Sunday with repeats. Emphasis on quality with some F1 style production values (Helicopters, more cameras, split screen comparison rather then Virtual spectator w**k). I really beleive they have to spend a little to make a little in their current situation. It has to be a case of 'you get what you pay for' and at the moment I'm led to believe the TV stations dont want to pay for what they are getting.

[LotusElise]

Will someone please let me know when Ralio is available online. It sounds much better that ITV and I don't always listen to the commentary anyway.

[BDunnell]

Can't say I'd blame ITV for dropping it. I don't think rallying has been at a lower ebb in the UK in terms of public interest and the sport's overal profile for a very long time.

[AndyRAC]

Can't say I'd blame ITV for dropping it. I don't think rallying has been at a lower ebb in the UK in terms of public interest and the sport's overal profile for a very long time.

I quite agree, the recent Rally GB virtually passed by without anybody knowing, on the Friday Jeremy Clarkson was on BBC 5Live being interviewed, he expressed surprise that it was taking place, and he was a friend of Burnsie. I f he didn't know it was going on what hope the casual sports fan. With no top British driver (sorry Matt Wilson) the profile of the sport in the UK is doomed.

[Simmi]

There has to be something more fundamentally wrong then having a driver from a particular country involved when the Finn's have lost their terrestrial coverage too.

[Daniel]

I quite agree, the recent Rally GB virtually passed by without anybody knowing, on the Friday Jeremy Clarkson was on BBC 5Live being interviewed, he expressed surprise that it was taking place, and he was a friend of Burnsie. I f he didn't know it was going on what hope the casual sports fan. With no top British driver (sorry Matt Wilson) the profile of the sport in the UK is doomed.

I disagree. Australia have never really had any top drivers in the WRC and interest in the WRC event has showed a similar decline as the sport in the UK. I don't think a country needs to have a driver in the championship for it to be all good. As has been discussed to death already the sport is not as great as it used to be :) But to simply put a lack of interest in the WRC in one particular sport down to a nationwide hissy fit about not having a driver in the WRC is absurd. Rallying will ALWAYS be popular in the UK because there is a huge rally culture here and that's what has bread some very good drivers. I think things like pricing of tickets, location and the more compact route that Rally GB's have enjoyed lately is more to blame for the lack of interest here....

[AndyRAC]

Yes I know that Rallying is popular in this country, you only have to go to a National event to see that. What I was trying to say Is that is the excuse that is sometimes used by TV companies, ISC; a lack of a home driver affects how they cover the sport, it shouldn't make any difference whether there is a British driver or not.

[BDunnell]

I disagree. Australia have never really had any top drivers in the WRC and interest in the WRC event has showed a similar decline as the sport in the UK. I don't think a country needs to have a driver in the championship for it to be all good. As has been discussed to death already the sport is not as great as it used to be :) But to simply put a lack of interest in the WRC in one particular sport down to a nationwide hissy fit about not having a driver in the WRC is absurd. Rallying will ALWAYS be popular in the UK because there is a huge rally culture here and that's what has bread some very good drivers. I think things like pricing of tickets, location and the more compact route that Rally GB's have enjoyed lately is more to blame for the lack of interest here....

I think your last point is correct, but I am convinced that the general media have lost interest in the WRC since there ceased to be front-running British drivers on a regular basis. A look at the column inches the newspapers devote to Rally GB now compared to then would surely be telling.

[Daniel]

and what to do about this?

An EU funded project to rejuvenate lost habitat for the native british rally driver OR should we found a society to help highlight the plight of the lesser funded british rally driver? Perhaps the RSPSBRD (Royal Society for the Promotion and Sponsorship of the British Rally Driver?

Quite frankly I think the problem is not going to be solved by either of these silly ideas. Quite frankly the BRC is ****. Back in the F2 days you basically had works drivers driving in one of the most hotly contended series in the world. It was ****ing great and ****ing awesome and it was something you would have been proud to have on your CV. Now what is it?

[BDunnell]

Quite frankly I think the problem is not going to be solved by either of these silly ideas. Quite frankly the BRC is ****. Back in the F2 days you basically had works drivers driving in one of the most hotly contended series in the world. It was ****ing great and ****ing awesome and it was something you would have been proud to have on your CV. Now what is it?

This is another problem. I feel that rallying had a higher profile in the UK when the British series was at its strongest and produced good British drivers. People knew who the likes of Jimmy McRae, Tony Pond, Louise Aitken-Walker et al were. Nowadays, who really cares about Mark Higgins?

[Daniel]

This is another problem. I feel that rallying had a higher profile in the UK when the British series was at its strongest and produced good British drivers. People knew who the likes of Jimmy McRae, Tony Pond, Louise Aitken-Walker et al were. Nowadays, who really cares about Mark Higgins?
I feel that the UK problem is a big par of the wider problem.

I didn't know who Mark Higgins was last year at Castle Combe and asked him most embarassingly if a 205 T16 Evo II was his so I believe this is a big problem because I was sooooooo embarassed when Caroline told me who he was and then I realised :embarassed:

[Tomi]

I think daniel has right, years ago brittish champion was a respected title, but now days average. But for upcoming drivers its good to go there to drive a few events, because of different roads and big motor press.

[Captain VXR]

I would hate it if ITV dropped it and Eurosport did too because I wouldn't even be able to even see it in German (I can only get German Eurosport).

[cut the b.s.]

I feel that the UK problem is a big par of the wider problem.

I didn't know who Mark Higgins was last year at Castle Combe and asked him most embarassingly if a 205 T16 Evo II was his so I believe this is a big problem because I was sooooooo embarassed when Caroline told me who he was and then I realised :embarassed:


In 1 post you remember fondly the good ol' days of F2 in the BRC, now you say you didnt recognise Mark Higgins! Guess who was one of the leading drivers in the BRC F2 days.........

PS. Did Mark recognise you :-)

[cut the b.s.]

I quite agree, the recent Rally GB virtually passed by without anybody knowing, on the Friday Jeremy Clarkson was on BBC 5Live being interviewed, he expressed surprise that it was taking place, and he was a friend of Burnsie. I f he didn't know it was going on what hope the casual sports fan. With no top British driver (sorry Matt Wilson) the profile of the sport in the UK is doomed.


You are right, anyone familiar with UK press will know that football is up there as the No.1 sport, golf, rugby, cricket, athletics, F1, rallying etc all get some coverage always but it increases and decreases depending on how successful the home grown people are doing, right now there is not a lot in WRC to interest the average sports fan, diehards will still follow but the specialist press is for them, mainstream publishing pretty much will ignore WRC till a UK driver starts to do well.
ITV have all the viewing figures, they are a commercial business, if people dont want to watch WRC they cant sell ads so the program gets dropped, dare I say it but its just a little sign of how 'healthy' WRC is right now ;-)

[Daniel]

In 1 post you remember fondly the good ol' days of F2 in the BRC, now you say you didnt recognise Mark Higgins! Guess who was one of the leading drivers in the BRC F2 days.........

PS. Did Mark recognise you :-)

Well I'm from Australia so only saw review DVD's and tapes :)

He actually remembered me in Australia last year when I said "I was that idiot at Castle Combe who asked if that 205T16 was yours" personally I'd rather he hadn't remembered :p

[AndyRAC]

You are right, anyone familiar with UK press will know that football is up there as the No.1 sport, golf, rugby, cricket, athletics, F1, rallying etc all get some coverage always but it increases and decreases depending on how successful the home grown people are doing, right now there is not a lot in WRC to interest the average sports fan, diehards will still follow but the specialist press is for them, mainstream publishing pretty much will ignore WRC till a UK driver starts to do well.
ITV have all the viewing figures, they are a commercial business, if people dont want to watch WRC they cant sell ads so the program gets dropped, dare I say it but its just a little sign of how 'healthy' WRC is right now ;-)

Healthy is the word, if it was healthy there would be more manufacturers, more paid seats,etc. So in my opinion it isn't in a healthy state no matter what people might say, so you can't really blame ITV for thinking of pulling their coverage. Why can't it return to BBC2 like it used to, seeing as the only motorsport BBC have now is the excellent MOTO GP, but no cars. We can always hope...

[cut the b.s.]

Well I'm from Australia


never before have 4 words explained so much to me before :-)

[BDunnell]

Healthy is the word, if it was healthy there would be more manufacturers, more paid seats,etc. So in my opinion it isn't in a healthy state no matter what people might say, so you can't really blame ITV for thinking of pulling their coverage. Why can't it return to BBC2 like it used to, seeing as the only motorsport BBC have now is the excellent MOTO GP, but no cars. We can always hope...

Why would the BBC want it either?

The fact is that the 2006 WRC has passed more people by who used to at least have a vague idea of what was going on in it than I can recall.

[Simmi]

Yeah I think we've established the current coverage isnt worth having and is definately not worth being made to pay that much for. They keep saying global audiences are going up but I dont understand how.

[cut the b.s.]

Yeah I think we've established the current coverage isnt worth having and is definately not worth being made to pay that much for. They keep saying global audiences are going up but I dont understand how.


Maybe they are being counted by the same people who used to tell us 2million people watched the RAC Rally.......

[NjHarwood]

To be honest i think the only reason ITV bought it off Channel 4 was too try and get all the motorsport they could and make them look like a good channel. I first cought bit of WRC when BBC had it. Then i didnt know what was going on and then 4 got it...by then i watched it as much as i could. But now ITV has destroyed it further. No advertisments for fans watching there favourite soap, nothin like F1 where every 5mins and in the weather you hear about it! Anyway ITV are going downhill themselves and loosing money. They have got the Main bloke of the BBC now running them to try and turn things round!

I have freeview, so i dont get Eurosport and now Men and Motors has vanished from existance on my TV.

What i would like to see is the destruction of tacky graphics, leaders only, 1 corner per stage coverage!

As a fan i am discused in the coverage. 1 hour on one day in the early hour of the morning is beyond stupid! I would love to see F1 or at least BTCC standard viewing. Even BTCC which i never used to watch has jumped out of the darkness!

I think WRC and ISC and Imersat or whatever should get Colin and Bec's and so on onto our tv sets as well as radio, so we have some intelligent commentators and get some far better editors who want to work for there money and get the viewing up!

[DoN_cz]

anyone knows if Eurosport will broadcast WRC in 2007?

[Talbot]

The main problem I have with terrestrial WRC coverage is the camera men. Whether it be BBC, Ch. 4 or ITV they all seem to focus on a front wheel of a car as it goes past.
For goodness sake pan back. We need to see the whole car!
Afterall, as has been suggested you can ignore the c**p comentary, or put some decent driving music on to accompany.

[Simmi]

The terrestrial coverage is just the same as the Eurosport coverage though. And all of it is bought from the ISC, so its the ISC cameramen. Its the footage that they supply that is the problem because its boring and unimaginative.

[Daniel]

The main problem I have with terrestrial WRC coverage is the camera men. Whether it be BBC, Ch. 4 or ITV they all seem to focus on a front wheel of a car as it goes past.
For goodness sake pan back. We need to see the whole car!
Afterall, as has been suggested you can ignore the c**p comentary, or put some decent driving music on to accompany.
Very true. Or they focus on a corner off in the distance and the car then goes out of view and then into view in the foreground. Bores me to death........

[hari]

anyone knows if Eurosport will broadcast WRC in 2007?

The first preview from the Monte is already scheduled on the Eurosport Website for Thursday, Janunary 18th - 22.45h

So I think it will have the same good coverage as we are used to it in the past.