Tost 'ASSAULTS' Speed after European GP?

[Giuseppe F1]

Its whats being claimed...

...I know the team probbaly expected more from their sophmore (sp?) drivers, but I do think the way Scott has been treated...with the whole 'will they/wont they' resign Scott at the beginning of the season fiasco, and him being left out of the Spa test...plus how Berger and Tost are using the press to unsettle Speed - is quite bad and unprofessional.


If the report below has some truth and Speed is indeed to be ousted before Hungary, then MAYBE this is why they didnt let him run at the Spa test...because they knew he would be out of the team before then anyway - perhaps Tost provoked Speed to thus help this process along??

===============




Scuffle could spell end to Speed's career
Still no harmony between team and drivers
23/07/07 12:17

Scott Speed's Formula One career could have ended in a Nurburgring gravel trap.

According to the website of American broadcaster Speed TV, the Toro Rosso driver risks being replaced ahead of the Hungarian Grand Prix following a physical altercation with his team boss Franz Tost on Sunday.

It is claimed that the pair nearly came to blows in the team garage after Speed returned to the garage, and one witness described the scuffle as 'assault' by Tost.

American Speed, 23, is quoted as saying: "It's clear that from my bosses me and Tonio both have very little support.
"

Tost and team co-owner Gerhard Berger are openly courting both Sebastien Bourdais and BMW's Sebastian Vettel for 2008, leaving the Italian team's current pairing aware that their days at Toro Rosso are probably numbered.

"It doesn't take a rocket scientist to read the press and know that Franz and Gerhard are pushing like hell to get rid of me and Tonio," Speed admitted.

Source GMM
CAPSIS International

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/070723121723.shtml

[ioan]

Its whats being claimed...

...I know the team probbaly expected more from their sophmore (sp?) drivers, but I do think the way Scott has been treated...with the whole 'will they/wont they' resign Scott at the beginning of the season fiasco, and him being left out of the Spa test...plus how Berger and Tost are using the press to unsettle Speed - is quite bad and unprofessional.


If the report below has some truth and Speed is indeed to be ousted before Hungary, then MAYBE this is why they didnt let him run at the Spa test...because they knew he would be out of the team before then anyway - perhaps Tost provoked Speed to thus help this process along??

===============




Scuffle could spell end to Speed's career
Still no harmony between team and drivers
23/07/07 12:17

Scott Speed's Formula One career could have ended in a Nurburgring gravel trap.

According to the website of American broadcaster Speed TV, the Toro Rosso driver risks being replaced ahead of the Hungarian Grand Prix following a physical altercation with his team boss Franz Tost on Sunday.

It is claimed that the pair nearly came to blows in the team garage after Speed returned to the garage, and one witness described the scuffle as 'assault' by Tost.

American Speed, 23, is quoted as saying: "It's clear that from my bosses me and Tonio both have very little support.
"

Tost and team co-owner Gerhard Berger are openly courting both Sebastien Bourdais and BMW's Sebastian Vettel for 2008, leaving the Italian team's current pairing aware that their days at Toro Rosso are probably numbered.

"It doesn't take a rocket scientist to read the press and know that Franz and Gerhard are pushing like hell to get rid of me and Tonio," Speed admitted.

Source GMM
CAPSIS International

http://www.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/070723121723.shtml

What a crappy situation. They could simply tell them that their contracts won't be renewed.

[ShiftingGears]

Yeah, unfortunate really. I hope they enjoy whatever they end up doing after F1!

[Giuseppe F1]

More on the story over at PITPASS.COM:


http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_news_item.php?fes_art_id=32236

[fasttrakker55]

Good riddance to Speed.

But I'm surprised by Luizzi....he started F1 in a very strong manner but right now, he may either not be getting the backing required or he's just not interested anymore. Because he does have talent unlike his teammate....

[teamsuperimu]

STR is a mess. The car is completely unreliable and worse yet it not very fast. The management doesn't seem to be able to get any improvement from either of its young drivers. How exactly does taking a swing at your driver improve lap times? Mind you SS has made his share of mistakes, but he hasn't been in the most supportive situation either. Consistently throwing your driver under the bus in the media can't do much for confidence. They have the same chassis as Red Bull and Ferrari power, but still can't pull one single point as a team? Come on! The driver is the only problem here. That's why I'm Super Aguri fan despite being an American


Anyway, Speed will be in Champ car by the end of the year (more than likely, by the end of the week) with other Red Bull/STR castoffs Robert Doornbos, Neel Jani and (future castoff) Bourdais. It's probably for the best that way. F1 brave foray into US market was a failure so interest in keeping an American driver is nil.

[Hendersen]

Good riddance to Speed.

But I'm surprised by Luizzi....he started F1 in a very strong manner but right now, he may either not be getting the backing required or he's just not interested anymore. Because he does have talent unlike his teammate....

Huh? They have both averaged about 12th place for the last year and a half of their career at STR. I'm not some fan of speed or something, but your comment is just completely moronic.

[Bezza]

Both are decidedly average and there are better drivers with out a drive. Also, Speed is a cocky little bugger with a big ego but not big talent. Ciao.

[truefan72]

Good riddance to Speed.

But I'm surprised by Luizzi....he started F1 in a very strong manner but right now, he may either not be getting the backing required or he's just not interested anymore. Because he does have talent unlike his teammate....

why?

over the past 2 years he has been faster nd better than Liuzzi, that comment is simple anti-usa driver bias, plane and simple. Based nowhere on facts

[truefan72]

some stupiud anti-speed comments here which don't spruprise me at all .just ridiculous.

Anyway more to the point, Red Bull Racing and Torro Rossi are on adangewrous path to historic ineptitude and collossal mismanagement. They treat drivers like pawns, undermine their own young driver program, have poor management skills, spend money like water, mostly on the wrong things, show little erfort for improvement, transparently use the press to uindermine their drivers, then take swiungs at their own drivers.

I used to be a Rud Bull fan up until the start of last yearm when I saw them uncerimonsiously work over klien until his exit and the way they treated speed, and Tonio.

They are delusional if they think that thier cars are competitive, especially at Torro Rosso. The situation there is even worse. Very poor all around job by the entire team and management. Speed and tonio are drving crap cars and still show signs of huge potential. If you put them both in the RBR, I bet you (at least speed) would be more than amatch for their current lineup. Furthermore, If the two of them were in a toyota, I guearantee you they would be doing better than the two guys there right now.

Speed IMO has talent, and more importantly is extremely fast and can maintain his pace. I look at the live timing in the races where he get's to finish and you can clearly see him and tonio often doing better than theRBR lineup in both lap pace and positions. He is great at starts, usually overtakes a bunch of cars and can challenge for postions 8-12 consitently.

I wish vEttle and bourdais well, but caution them to watch their backs. I am pretty sure the idiots at Torro rosso are crafting clauses to be able to remove bourdais after a few races if he doesn't "perform" same with vettel. Surely they will already have their eyes on toher drivers while those two are competing.

It is a complete waste of money and time the way those two teams conduct themselves.

The best thing that happened to Klienwass to leave that team. The same will ring true with Speed and Tonio. I strongly beleive all 3 have a brighter future ahead of them in F1

[LTalbot]

some stupiud anti-speed comments here which don't spruprise me at all .just ridiculous.

Anyway more to the point, Red Bull Racing and Torro Rossi are on adangewrous path to historic ineptitude and collossal mismanagement. They treat drivers like pawns, undermine their own young driver program, have poor management skills, spend money like water, mostly on the wrong things, show little erfort for improvement, transparently use the press to uindermine their drivers, then take swiungs at their own drivers.

I used to be a Rud Bull fan up until the start of last yearm when I saw them uncerimonsiously work over klien until his exit and the way they treated speed, and Tonio.

They are delusional if they think that thier cars are competitive, especially at Torro Rosso. The situation there is even worse. Very poor all around job by the entire team and management. Speed and tonio are drving crap cars and still show signs of huge potential. If you put them both in the RBR, I bet you (at least speed) would be more than amatch for their current lineup. Furthermore, If the two of them were in a toyota, I guearantee you they would be doing better than the two guys there right now.

Speed IMO has talent, and more importantly is extremely fast and can maintain his pace. I look at the live timing in the races where he get's to finish and you can clearly see him and tonio often doing better than theRBR lineup in both lap pace and positions. He is great at starts, usually overtakes a bunch of cars and can challenge for postions 8-12 consitently.

I wish vEttle and bourdais well, but caution them to watch their backs. I am pretty sure the idiots at Torro rosso are crafting clauses to be able to remove bourdais after a few races if he doesn't "perform" same with vettel. Surely they will already have their eyes on toher drivers while those two are competing.

It is a complete waste of money and time the way those two teams conduct themselves.

The best thing that happened to Klienwass to leave that team. The same will ring true with Speed and Tonio. I strongly beleive all 3 have a brighter future ahead of them in F1

Agreed True Fan.

I heard on the broadcast that Sebastian Bourdais had Jon Todt as his manager. If that's true, could we see Bourdais in a red Ferrari some day?

[truefan72]

Agreed True Fan.

I heard on the broadcast that Sebastian Bourdais had Jon Todt as his manager. If that's true, could we see Bourdais in a red Ferrari some day?

i hope so. I have always been a bourdais fan, but wished he entered F1 in a different manner and with a better car. i wonder what his prospects at Toyota would have been

[N. Jones]

(I like this phrase today) My two cents:

Maybe Speed & Liuzzi need a change of scenery? How long has STR been in disarray? Would it be better if they weren't owned by Red Bull?? I know in F1 you have to be consistent right away but I wonder if a new team for both drivers (not necessarily the same one) would be a good thing...

[Valve Bounce]

He'll have to join Dennis Pagan I suppose.

[Roamy]

they are toast so just drive the sh!theaps in the ground and then go champ car racing. **** berger he screwed williams up and now str but SB and Ralf

[wmcot]

If Bourdais is smart (or his management is) he will sign a short contract with STR and then move on to bigger and better teams. It take a good team leader to make a good team and I'm not sure that Tost or Berger are good leaders. I did support Berger when he drove for Ferrari, however!

[ioan]

why?

over the past 2 years he has been faster nd better than Liuzzi, that comment is simple anti-usa driver bias, plane and simple. Based nowhere on facts

A huge part of the comments around here are based on bias and stupidity, so don't be surprised, and even more important don't give them to much attention.

[Mickey T]

A huge part of the comments around here are based on bias and stupidity, so don't be surprised, and even more important don't give them to much attention.

i soooooo love that this comment came from you. might use it in another quote in another place sometime...

[wmcot]

Perhaps Tost was upset because Speed missed ramming Hamilton when he spun off????

[ioan]

i soooooo love that this comment came from you. might use it in another quote in another place sometime...

I've got it trade mark registered! So it's no, unless you send the money before! :p :
You already ow me some for quoting it! :D

[Mickey T]

I've got it trade mark registered! So it's no, unless you send the money before! :p :
You already ow me some for quoting it! :D

it's in the public domain and it's attributed to you already. that's the law satisfied!

you need to put the trademark logo on it to protect yourself better.

[millencolin]

why?

over the past 2 years he has been faster nd better than Liuzzi, that comment is simple anti-usa driver bias, plane and simple. Based nowhere on facts

show me where exactly there was anti-usa driver bias. are you that paranoid that if someone attacks your driver, its because they hate america? grow up, seriously. the vast majority of the people here are professional in their posts and dont bring in country of origin to the equation. Sure when it comes to sport, we aussies love to beat the british. but that doesn't mean i automatically think Lewis Hamilton is over-rated. infact i think he is a future champion and the English will finally have bragging rights over something!

the plain and simple fact is that Scott Speed hasn't lived up to his namesake. not quick enough and not consistant enough, plain* and simple. based PURELY on facts.

[Flat.tyres]

i soooooo love that this comment came from you. might use it in another quote in another place sometime...

I read it and then notice who posted it. nearly spat my tea over my keyboard :laugh:

OK, if ioan has copywrited it, Ill just post a link in my signature :D

[keysersoze]

How can anyone say that Speed or Luizzi are crap drivers is mystifying. They are fairly evenly matched to one another but that's all we truly KNOW. Everything else is speculation or opinion . . . and the biases that color them.

What is truly unfair is that they have been paired at all. Both were very new to F1 and haven't been able to benefit from having an experienced teammate. IMO one or the other should have gone to Red Bull, and Coulthard should have gone to STR. That way a veteran could be paired with a young lion and BOTH programs can move forward.

As it is we have two new drivers and a fledgling program (that apparently lacks money and ability to develop and manufacture new parts) that is bound to struggle on all fronts. No wonder they are at each others' throats.

[Flat.tyres]

How can anyone say that Speed or Luizzi are crap drivers is mystifying. They are fairly evenly matched to one another but that's all we truly KNOW. Everything else is speculation or opinion . . . and the biases that color them.

What is truly unfair is that they have been paired at all. Both were very new to F1 and haven't been able to benefit from having an experienced teammate. IMO one or the other should have gone to Red Bull, and Coulthard should have gone to STR. That way a veteran could be paired with a young lion and BOTH programs can move forward.

As it is we have two new drivers and a fledgling program (that apparently lacks money and ability to develop and manufacture new parts) that is bound to struggle on all fronts. No wonder they are at each others' throats.

good points :up:

im not the greatest fan of speed but he looks like the sort of driver that would benefit from a bit of guidence and a firm steering hand.

[Buzz Lightyear]

Aparentely..Toro Rosso have fired Scott Speed with immediate effect. He will be replaced by Sebastien Vettal...

[donKey jote]

Gerhard Berger was quoted in MSA as saying "we have the two stupidest drivers" - hint being neither would last too long and Vettel and Bourdais or Glock to arrive soon.
Apparently he was particularly annoyed at Speed for not getting his act in gear for more than 1 day after being personally requested to do so, and preferring being online with his Motley Crue friends over a bit of work.

[Azumanga Davo]

Who's the PR manager, Andrea Sassetti? Sounds like an even worse situation than what Perry was in... :(

Please, don't let STR turn into as big a joke as THAT team did...

[truefan72]

Aparentely..Toro Rosso have fired Scott Speed with immediate effect. He will be replaced by Sebastien Vettal...

I wouldn't be surprised, but I haven't seen any stories of this come over the wires. Please send us a link to the story.

[keysersoze]

speedtv posted the story about an hour ago. However, it looks like Scott forgot to tell his dad.

[truefan72]

the plain and simple fact is that Scott Speed hasn't lived up to his namesake. not quick enough and not consistant enough, plain* and simple. based PURELY on facts.

I can point you to almost all of speed's completed races and you will cleary see him doing a really good job in the STR. often better than Liuzzi. Practice and Quali are not the end-all be-all in the F1 weekend, completeing the 60 lap race counts for something right? and that is especially true for those with slightly weaker cars.

Look at Wurz who many here would say is getting beat by his teammate Rosberg and is even rumored to be on the hot seat. Yet come raceday, he is able to secure 13 points for williams compared to 5 from rosberg. He has podiumed once and was about 0.2 seconds behind in podiuming again. But ask the folks here in the forum and they would say he's crap or not better than Rosberg.

Yes Quali is important, but drving well throughout the race is even more so.

In speed's 3 races he has completed he was 14th, 9th and 13th, Here is his season to date

Australia started p 17 ,retired ahead of Liuzzi (who was in an accident to be fair) and DC with a wheel problem on lap 22.

Malaysia started 17th, finished 14th, ahead of VL who statred 16 and finished 18, as well as ahead of Kubica, Davidson, and ralf Schumacher who also completed the race

Bahrein, started 19 was out at the first lap incident with Button, meanwhile VL retired lapo 26

Spain, started 22 after Quali problems, and went from 22 to 14 at the start before retiring on lap 8 with mechanical failure, VL started 16 went up to 15 and was overtaken by Webber before retiring on lap 19. Webber couldn't overtake Speed during their racing.

Monaco, Qualified 18 finished 9th in the most techincal and tightest track, ahead of these drivers who completed the race
Rubens Barrichello
Jenson Button
Nico Rosberg
Heikki Kovalainen
David Coulthard
Jarno Trulli
Ralf Schumacher
Takuma Sato
Anthony Davidson

Liuzzi was out after a lap 1 crash


Canada started 16 and was taken out by Wurz on lap 8. Liuzzi qualified well in 12th, and was in an accident on lap 54 running 6th IMO his best race

USA started 20th finished 13, At the start move up to 14, and ran a solid race with VL who qualified 19 and ran the entire race behind Speed until he retired on lap 68.

France, qualified 15 and retired on lap 55 in 11th position with Technical issues. VL started 17 and had an accident on lap 1

Britain, qualified 14th was running as high as 11, and after his pit stop was invloved in an accident on lap 29. Liuzzi started 15 and ran as high as 14th, and then retired a few laps after his second pit stop on lap 53 in 13th postion.

Europe, we all know what happened there

so overall Speed has done a decent job IMO, better than Liuzzi. But Liuzzi has also shown potential. Niether driver deserves to be treated the way these two have with the crap car that wasn't even running a seamless shift geasrbox until France. All you have to see is houw super Aguri is doing this year compared to last year. And then look at STR, the simple fact is that the team have not gotten their act together and show no support to the drivers. You absolutely cannot win that way and they will continue to languish until they change the principles or get bought out...yet again.

[Robinho]

whilst i bear no ill will towards Speed i think using Liuzzi to benchmark does not show anything special. both drivings are underperforming IMO, whilst the car may not have much pace they are making far too many mistakes.

personally, although the team seems to be in disarray, i expect more from Berger in his management, the 2 have had a couple of seasons now and should have shown more glimpses that they can cut it, they've had bigger chances than many.

on the other hand, Berger has always been outspoken, but i respected him as a driver and his knowledge should be great. therefore, perhaps he is right and he has a couple of idiots on his books. maybe he shouldn't be telling us that, but he might just be right?! ;)

[gm99]

Aparentely..Toro Rosso have fired Scott Speed with immediate effect. He will be replaced by Sebastien Vettal...

So, Speed is to(a)st now ;) ?

Sorry, couldn't resist, really.

I too think it's a shame - he's been doing as well as you possibly could expect driving for a team like STR and I would be surprised if Vettel, talented as though he surely is, managed to do much better. Speed's problem is probably his personality - he doesn't take sh*t from no-one, and in today's hyper-clean, sponsor-friendly world of Formula 1 that is not something team bosses are looking for.

[gm99]

**** berger he screwed williams up and now str but SB and Ralf

Pray tell me in what way Berger screwed up Williams?

They went from 5th in the constructors' championship in 1999 to third after Berger and BMW joined in 2000, then won their first races since 1997 the following year and by the time Berger left BMW Willams in 2003,they were actually challenging for the drivers' championship and were second in the constructors with 144 points. It's been a steady decline for Williams ever since (although they do seem to be on the up again this season). If you mean that Berger was responsible for BMW dropping Williams and buying into Sauber, that's a decision that has been taken (by Dr. Theissen and the BMW board) long after Berger left the company.

As for STR, that was a team that didn't even exist before Berger bought into it, so there hasn't been much to screw up - they certainly are higher up the grid than its predecessor, Minardi.

And replacing a driver with another one who isn't any worse is not exactly screwing up, either.

[OmarF1]

Damn, I Hope Scott isn't done yet, he has one of the greatest quotes ever in F1, "Last night, I had a boner THIS BIG" and Tonio saying to him "uh yeah?" with a "get this weirdo out of my sight" face LOL!!!!!!!!!!

[truefan72]

So, Speed is to(a)st now ;) ?

Sorry, couldn't resist, really.

I too think it's a shame - he's been doing as well as you possibly could expect driving for a team like STR and I would be surprised if Vettel, talented as though he surely is, managed to do much better. Speed's problem is probably his personality - he doesn't take sh*t from no-one, and in today's hyper-clean, sponsor-friendly world of Formula 1 that is not something team bosses are looking for.

that too is true.

I always rooted for berger as a driver and hoped that the first Austrian team(s) in F1 would do much better but both have been a huge dissapointement and Berger's conduct has been shameful.

Running and energy drink company and an F1 team are 2 completely different beast. They should have hired competent professionals instead of filling key postions with their home slice.

Die ganze situazion tut mir leid. von ein Oserrreicher zu ein ander :(

[keysersoze]

It seems mighty rich of Berger to complain about Speed's and Luizzi's penchant for a good time. If I remember correctly, when ole Gerhard was driving he partied with the best of them. :p

[markabilly]

Damn, I Hope Scott isn't done yet, he has one of the greatest quotes ever in F1, "Last night, I had a boner THIS BIG" and Tonio saying to him "uh yeah?" with a "get this weirdo out of my sight" face LOL!!!!!!!!!!
Maybe just wishing he had something to compare--He probably just hate it when that happens

[nigelred5]

As for STR, that was a team that didn't even exist before Berger bought into it, so there hasn't been much to screw up - they certainly are higher up the grid than its predecessor, Minardi.

And replacing a driver with another one who isn't any worse is not exactly screwing up, either.

Same team, new name, same results.

[Robinho]

It seems mighty rich of Berger to complain about Speed's and Luizzi's penchant for a good time. If I remember correctly, when ole Gerhard was driving he partied with the best of them. :p

true, but he also raced with the best of them too, when Liuzzi and Speed start getting the results then maybe he'd cut them some slack?

[Ranger]

true, but he also raced with the best of them too, when Liuzzi and Speed start getting the results then maybe he'd cut them some slack?
Well, what does he expect for two guys driving a Toro Rosso?

Methinks attitude comes in here. Maybe he's under the impression that their partying nature hinders the team's progress. But how would he know?

Besides, this is coming from someone who, even in his mid-30s, did such things as suddenly yanking the handbrake whilst Jean Alesi was driving Jean Todt's new Lancia Stratos, resulting in the car flipping, and then said to his boss "Sorry about the kerb marks in the roof" :D

Sounded like a funny guy as a driver but he just seems like a bit of a hypocrite or a nob as a team manager (with this lineup anyway). :\