Future format of WRC events?

[AnttiL]

Yet the drivers themselves speak of rallies as the essence of motorsport and the images prove it. Yet we are no longer able to intrigue someone to wake up early in the morning, pack a backpack and go on trial.

"I would never do this again because we are in 2022 and we must remember that the 80s have passed for forty years. I keep saying it. It is useless that we continue to want to convince people that the past is beautiful. The past is over.

Let us ask ourselves: how do we bring to people what we have today with the tools we have today?

I take the liberty of saying one thing and I say: those of F1, who will be ugly, bad and unpleasant in the eyes of those of rallies, however, since Liberty Media arrived, he said "well gentlemen, now we do because we are continuing to talk to each other. us and to be self-referential ". And it is the same mistake we are making as we keep talking about rallies. All nice but outside the rallies nobody gives a damn, so you have to take someone who comes from outside who knows how to do real communication and says that now it is done like this.

F1 started using social media, Youtube, Netflix and all these things it does and, magic magic, now it goes to America. Because? Because they presented F1 in a different way than the stereotypical one that has been going on for years and today they like the same product. Then they made cars that know how to be more spectacular with less suffering in the wake thanks to studies paid for by the promoter. Not the FIA. Liberty Media invested some money, hired people, to do some studies and take it to a higher level of showmanship.

We keep talking, wondering how to do the best rallies with people who have been in rallies for 50 years and they keep telling each other that rallies are good. Okay, let's carry on but the guy across the street hasn't the faintest idea who these people are.

We make real reports, meetings with the drivers as it should be. Truly spectacular and well-known montages. People get passionate and go to see them and see them again. In Formula 1 you have your Coca Cola, lounges, sponsors and everything becomes a show. In rallies we take people far away to eat the dust and they don't give a damn."


Yet attempts like Ypres and Monza didn't go all that well, did they? Didn't they show something different than what rallies are?

"It was full. People care and whoever pays the ticket saves the race, but what really matters is the all-round visibility. Those who bring the money are the sponsors, the ones who pay for the TV rights. World F1 teams also get money based on TV rights, World Rally teams also pay for the air they breathe. Explain to me how a new manufacturer is attracted to a sport where: there is no visibility, he has spectators on the side of the road and maybe with an exit you kill someone, I have hospitality for sponsors but I often don't use them because the cars they go out in the morning and come back in the evening.

What show do I do in the service park? What's in there? Is there anyone who has raised the problem? No, there is All Live. They will write it on the plaque the day the rallies die: "but they had All Live"

https://www.rallyssimo.it/2022/05/28/rallyssimo-incontra-andrea-adamo/

Regarding this Adamo interview, let's discuss here what the future of rallying should be? More service-park centric? Back to old remote servicing? Or remain as it is now?

[tommeke_B]

It's quite odd, when people are talking about visibility/popularity etc, rallying is always compared to Formula 1... Comparing rallying to F1 is like comparing cycling to football. Now everything seems centered about all live, but I really wonder how many (or few) people are watching it. I'm a big fan, have a subscription, but apart from the powerstages I've seen maybe 3 or 4 stages live on it, this year...

For the sport itself and the service-park vs remote service, I think it should be up to the organizers to decide their format. What works in Finland or Croatia does not necessarily work in Acropolis or Wales.

[Sulland]

Historic reference for the subject;

https://www.motorsportforums.com/showthread.php?40422-WRC-future&highlight=future

In my book we need more difference in the WRC calendar, not only the sprint format they use today.
Listening to Michele Mouton on how it was in the past, with longer rallies that could have 40-60 different SS.

[WRCStan]

There's not necessarily anything wrong with the events if the promoters responsibilities, commercial structure and regulations could be tweaked. To Adamo's points, I'd start there. Moreover, any change to events would be pointless without revolution here.

On the idea of 'Monzas' though, finish them with a single-venue Sunday rather than a power stage. Combine them with a World Rallysprint Championship on the Sunday. Co-drivers optional. Fly in your VIPs then. If travelling service parks make combining special stages and single-venues more feasible, do it.

[steve.mandzij]

There's not necessarily anything wrong with the events if the promoters responsibilities, commercial structure and regulations could be tweaked. To Adamo's points, I'd start there. Moreover, any change to events would be pointless without revolution here.

On the idea of 'Monzas' though, finish them with a single-venue Sunday rather than a power stage. Combine them with a World Rallysprint Championship on the Sunday. Co-drivers optional. Fly in your VIPs then. If travelling service parks make combining special stages and single-venues more feasible, do it.i hope you're kidding,,,

Sent from my Pixel 3a using Tapatalk

[WRCStan]

i hope you're kidding,,,

I'm not saying every round or the classics, and still have 2/3 days of special stages, just something different for one day. In fact it's traditional in GB to have a 'Stately homes day', I just put it at one place. Ypres '21 was pretty much it, Spa was just underutilised (Covid rules? Can't remember), Germany could use the Nurburgring or Baumholder maybe. Spain, circuit Catalunya. Monza doesn't work for me in December. Perhaps getting circuits can be tough but other single-venues could be available?

Should be a show, a spectacle. Get Rallycross on the same weekend even. Same promotor FFS. Get Walter Rohrl displaying the Audi, Neuville said it. MBS can get his stars doing the rallysprint... etc.

What is it you don't like?

[steve.mandzij]

I'm not saying every round or the classics, and still have 2/3 days of special stages, just something different for one day. In fact it's traditional in GB to have a 'Stately homes day', I just put it at one place. Ypres '21 was pretty much it, Spa was just underutilised (Covid rules? Can't remember), Germany could use the Nurburgring or Baumholder maybe. Spain, circuit Catalunya. Monza doesn't work for me in December. Perhaps getting circuits can be tough but other single-venues could be available?

Should be a show, a spectacle. Get Rallycross on the same weekend even. Same promotor FFS. Get Walter Rohrl displaying the Audi, Neuville said it. MBS can get his stars doing the rallysprint... etc.

What is it you don't like?the way I replied was tongue-in-cheek, but I do think this is a load of rubbish. F1 doesn't need road shows every weekend to stay relevant and bring itself to the masses, and crucially those street shows aren't at all part of the competitive portion of the sport. Rallysprints and rallyshows have no place in the pinnacle of rallying for me: the sport is a spectacle in itself, it just needs better marketing! Nobody wants to see a rally sprint or a gymkhana show anymore. If they did, then World RX wouldn't be dead.

Sent from my Pixel 3a using Tapatalk

[WRCStan]

the sport is a spectacle in itself, it just needs better marketing!

This is part of my base case of a ground up reform. Super-Sundays are not a hill I'll die on by any means, was trying to stay relevant to the thread.

I think the conversation on how the sport is run, promoted, regulated, who for and who gets to make money out of it is the discussion to have, but perhaps it's been covered to death here and sometimes the only prominent answer is "they should do more free coverage", but I'd always enjoy that thread if it returned.

[kirungi okwogera]

I am philosophical about this. There is nothing in the nature of rally that lends it to doing the same thing as F1 (except in one crucial way they should absolutely imitate -- getting a very skillful documentary filmmaking team to document seasons behind the scenes a la Drive to Survive, which multiple non-motorsport-fan American friends and family of mine have repeatedly recommended to me, unprompted). Suggestions to build the sport by not doing the sport, or doing a different sport/event alongside it, seem like desperation. Desperation to achieve what? Parity with F1?

Why can't WRC be second fiddle to F1? Why does it always seem to urgently need so many more viewers, so much more visibility? The money, right. But then, is it a good idea in the first place to cost X millions to run a single car at the top level, so as to require a very high level of world market visibility to bring value the manu's that compete?

I don't know, if there was a lot less money in the sport I think I would still find it entertaining to see the best drivers in the world compete. If they were all driving slower cars, I'd be a little disappointed, sure, but driving skill does still show and HP by themselves are not so expensive. Others have said before, less tire and suspension and grip technologies and more HP also makes for a more spectacular driving style, if slower stage times. But oh no! That sounds like a regional backwater event.

What makes a WRC event special compared to a regional event? High level cars and high level drivers. In a regional event a rich gent can run a used WRC car competitively while the most talented driver in the event might be running a FWD. So WRC does need special visibility in media, from organizers, and from manu's and teams to try and find these good drivers and put them in the best cars to avoid that fate. Currently, this does happen in WRC to some extent - they do look for actually good drivers because it will win them rallies. Most of us would agree that current and past champions have not gotten there through luck of being the best funded guy (or on the best funded team, though you could argue that unequal teams do affect the championship a lot). If WRC maintains enough prestige so this system of talent scouting continued to exist, ensuring actual competition between actually skilled drivers, then I'd accept it never being F1.

If you are WRC and you "be yourself" - that is, don't chase money that requires you to try to change your sport into F1/rallycross/motogp etc., and if that means less money, regulate less money in the ways you can to still bring value to participants, it opens up opportunities in other ways. Format experimentation that keeps things still rally. Old timey nostalgics can suggest 5000 mile rallies that take 8 days or whatever. Corsica 8x 50km stages. All that stuff that feels more "pure" rally because it takes what makes rally special and increases it, rather than diminishing it.

And get people who know how to film this kind of thing not as sports coverage but as Film with a capital F. That's the biggest lesson to take from F1. Cinematic drama draws people to your live events/coverage.

Just some thoughts. The discussion always seems to be this desperate focus on being like the more successful motorsport when it can never be. Working with the differences as selling points seems like a better idea than pretending they don't exist.

[WRCStan]

Great post but some points run contrary to a widely misunderstood fundamental. This championship serves WRC Promoter, not the other way round. That's a reality I consider when I posted.

I think we can all spot that things aren't great for the sport but not really see or agree why, which is why we have these discussions. It isn't because we all think it should be as big as F1. Don't think Adamo even made that point.

[djip]

There's not necessarily anything wrong with the events if the promoters responsibilities, commercial structure and regulations could be tweaked. To Adamo's points, I'd start there. Moreover, any change to events would be pointless without revolution here.

On the idea of 'Monzas' though, finish them with a single-venue Sunday rather than a power stage. Combine them with a World Rallysprint Championship on the Sunday. Co-drivers optional. Fly in your VIPs then. If travelling service parks make combining special stages and single-venues more feasible, do it.

I think there is some smart ... and some history in this comment

1- Super-specials, gymkhanas, circuit racing were all part of the rallies back in the 60s. Closer to us, the first day of the old RAC was "mickey-mouse" stages - lots of them but they wedre more or less inconsequential on the final result.

2- Which brings me to present : i like the idea of a sunday (which in any means is not a proper "classic" rally day as it is so short ...) devoted to easy-to-market, good-for-your-sponsors stages. Whether this is on a track (Nurburgring a good idea) a rallycross track or proper stages, have the cars come back to parc fermé between each run, with interviews etc ... Build up the finale. But ensure that this is only a small fraction of the overall rally and that the guy who is 3 minutes behind after a full 2 days of "real" SS has no chance of leapfrogging everyone ...

I neverr thought I could say something like that, but in addition to a proper filming, this may be whhat is missing to appeal to the riches (sponsors, manufacturers) and the masses.

[AndyRAC]

It's quite odd, when people are talking about visibility/popularity etc, rallying is always compared to Formula 1... Comparing rallying to F1 is like comparing cycling to football. Now everything seems centered about all live, but I really wonder how many (or few) people are watching it. I'm a big fan, have a subscription, but apart from the powerstages I've seen maybe 3 or 4 stages live on it, this year...

For the sport itself and the service-park vs remote service, I think it should be up to the organizers to decide their format. What works in Finland or Croatia does not necessarily work in Acropolis or Wales.

This is absolutely!! The current format makes sense (I dislike it, and always have) and the reasons are valid. I recall the discussions in the late 90s when the 'cloverleaf' format was introduced; it will bring in more sponsors, cut costs, easier for TV, etc

Here we are in 2022, and I think the sport has gone down a blind alley, and won't turn back. I'd probably keep the current format for now, but maybe experiment with some Saturday evening finishes. However I'd give the 'classic' events far more freedom, including stage km but remembering it's 2022, and not 1992. To me the 'classics' are Monte, Acropolis, Safari & Finland - and if RallyGB ever comes back (not NIreland) then I'd give that classic status.

[Sulland]

Current format is ok. But would it be wrong to let the events decide a bit more on what type of rally, serviceplan and length they would like to have in their event?

[rallyfiend]

Current format is ok. But would it be wrong to let the events decide a bit more on what type of rally, serviceplan and length they would like to have in their event?

I suspect that if this sort of flexibility was to be allowed - and in the hands of an event organiser - then the cost / fee to be an event would invariably go up, because WRC Promoter / teams / FIA / Suppliers would need a contingency to cover their increased costs if an event decides to do something completely mental....

Which would in turn impact the amount of events that actually COULD propose to run in the WRC..

Funny things is - you don't tend to hear event organisers / promoters complaining about the format. And they are the ones that really take a risk to put the events on. And there seems to be no shortage of new events wanting to be in the WRC. So we have to at least admit that the current format is working in some areas....

[WRCStan]

Current format is ok. But would it be wrong to let the events decide a bit more on what type of rally, serviceplan and length they would like to have in their event?


The total distance of the special stages shall be between 300 km and 350 km. There shall be no single special stage minimum or maximum distance. However, there shall be no more than 80 km of special stages between visits to service parks or tyre fitting zones.

The choice and timing of the special stages must be such that there is no overlap of at least the first 15 cars on any special stage before the start of the next special stage at normal intervals.

The construction of any itinerary that contains any more than 4 special stages (under the exclusion of a super special stage, if any) between two services is subject to FIA and WRC Promoter’s written approval.

The timetable of a rally shall be in the following order:
– Reconnaissance
– Administration (may also take place prior to the start of reconnaissance)
– Scrutineering
– Shakedown (as detailed in Art. 36)
– Ceremonial Start
– Rally concluding with a mandatory ‘Power Stage’ as in Art. 50
– Podium Ceremony

Rallies must start on a Thursday with a Ceremonial Start or Super Special Stage and finish on a Sunday

Rallies must competitively run over 2.5 days, including section starts or section finishes. Any variation to this format will be subject to the agreement of the FIA and the Promoter

Throughout the rally there shall be one main service park. Organisers may, however, submit to the FIA and the Promoter promotional justification to support relocation during a rally.

The schedule for each car in the service park is as follows:
-15 minutes before the first SS following an overnight regroup. For the final day of the rally, an organiser may replace this service with a TFZ
-40 minutes between two groups of stages
-45 minutes at the end of each section before an overnight regroup.

Other than respecting the following criteria, organisers are encouraged to evolve their own rally characteristics and may devise their own rally programme/itinerary.

Yes, it would be wrong.

[Sulland]

Yes, it would be wrong.

That is only todays rules. Everything can be changed, if the product improves!

[kirungi okwogera]

Great post but some points run contrary to a widely misunderstood fundamental. This championship serves WRC Promoter, not the other way round. That's a reality I consider when I posted.

I think we can all spot that things aren't great for the sport but not really see or agree why, which is why we have these discussions. It isn't because we all think it should be as big as F1. Don't think Adamo even made that point.

You're right, looking back at my post I mentioned F1 too much. I don't actually just mean everyone has F1 in mind as a real target, I just was thinking of the many proposals to make rally less like rally and more circuit-like, with the (perhaps imaginary) idea that that will bring more money and crowds.

[AndyRAC]

That is only todays rules. Everything can be changed, if the product improves!

That's the thing - if the product improves. Is the product good enough, is it offering value? The evidence would suggest not.......where are the new manufacturers, the major sponsors, etc Too many at the top have their heads in the sand. They keep doing the same thing and expecting a different outcome.....

[AnttiL]

Current format is ok. But would it be wrong to let the events decide a bit more on what type of rally, serviceplan and length they would like to have in their event?

So, one event decides that they will have all flying service. All teams must buy service vans and mobile service tents and ditch their service park systems. Another event decides that they will have 1000 stage kilometres, so many components will need redesigning to take that much driving without changing/rebuild.

[WRCStan]

That is only todays rules. Everything can be changed, if the product improves!


That's the thing - if the product improves. Is the product good enough, is it offering value? The evidence would suggest not.......where are the new manufacturers, the major sponsors, etc Too many at the top have their heads in the sand. They keep doing the same thing and expecting a different outcome.....

I'd like to ask you both what the product is, I'm not sure what you mean. I also believe those at the top are happy with the state of things. 10 Rally1 cars is just about right and they make most of them run, they're not calling for more manufacturers. Happy days!

Anybody know which rally/ies had the longest SS kms, of any championship or none, in the last 5 years? Or just how much demand is there from entrants?

If a breakaway series formed on old-fashioned principles, well, compare the standings of the Golden Era (https://www.ewrc-results.com/season/1986/) or the McRae years (https://www.ewrc-results.com/season/1995/), with the AllLive years (https://www.ewrc-results.com/season/2019/). One looks a healthier, more entertaining and competitive championship to me.

[AndyRAC]

I also believe those at the top are happy with the state of things. 10 Rally1 cars is just about right and they make most of them run, they're not calling for more manufacturers. Happy days!



If they're happy then it doesn't say much for them - or their ambition for the sport. It could/ should be so much better.....

[Sulland]

Most other world championships would be cancelled if only 10 contestants would come.
And who are the ones at the top that are happy? Top of FIA, top of manufacturers or other tops?

The 2 things I would changed in the description are:

1. change distance to; from min 300km to max 500 km.
2. overlap btw stages of at least 25 cars, instead of 15. We need time to see top 5-10 drivers in WRC2 in all live.

Maybe some adjustment in how often they should have service, after talking with the teams and privateers.

[Eli]

Most other world championships would be cancelled if only 10 contestants would come.
And who are the ones at the top that are happy? Top of FIA, top of manufacturers or other tops?

The 2 things I would changed in the description are:

1. change distance to; from min 300km to max 500 km.
2. overlap btw stages of at least 25 cars, instead of 15. We need time to see top 5-10 drivers in WRC2 in all live.

Maybe some adjustment in how often they should have service, after talking with the teams and privateers.

And maybe bring someone who knows more than only saying each day of each rally this year:’welcome to the hybrid era/the first time on gravel/tarmac/snow/sand/super special stage in this hybrid era’.

[WRCStan]

Most other world championships would be cancelled if only 10 contestants would come.
And who are the ones at the top that are happy? Top of FIA, top of manufacturers or other tops?

The 2 things I would changed in the description are:

1. change distance to; from min 300km to max 500 km.
2. overlap btw stages of at least 25 cars, instead of 15. We need time to see top 5-10 drivers in WRC2 in all live.

10-15 is about perfect for the entertainment package that Rally1 is, not overall. Double the Rally1s loosely doubles the live TV shows length, which I guess is their biggest earner, and the WRC+ output. There's no demand for it! Inclusion of WRC2 anywhere in live coverage is for Promoter's convenience only, they haven't paid the fees to earn the coverage, it's also too many entrants for the same reasons. The 300-350km rule is a joke anyway when 5/9 events this season haven't met it.

FIA/Promoter are the happy guys at the top. They make money off the entrants and the rallies, then sell these to alllive viewers and broadcasters, then they sell the viewers to their sponsors, and sell the entrants to their commercial partners (tyres, fuel). They tell the entrants when to turn up to face the media, fine them when they don't toe the line, ban them from having sponsors that clash with theirs. Forced hybrid, the FIA/Promoter's fight for their own financial/commercial purpose - maybe Ford cared but of the manufacturers that actually bothered to enter, Toyota don't and now we prove Hyundai don't.


WRC Promoter GmbH is responsible for all commercial aspects of the FIA World and FIA European Rally Championships, including TV production and the marketing of global media and sponsorship rights. It also has responsibility to increase competitor numbers and to propose the venues that form the WRC and ERC calendars.

Read that last sentence as, "it also has responsibility to increase revenue for the FIA from competitors and venues." Find me a good example where they are there for the growth and improvement of the sport. It's bobbins!

I agree with AndyRAC, it could and should be so much better. Whilst it's OK to dream what we want to see, it's pointless if we can't also be realistic. Promoter is pushing Rally1 down the spec cup road. No sign yet that this isn't working for them or that they see trouble ahead.

For me, I see identity problems with FIAs own rules that say 4 manufacturers are needed to justify a World Championship. Rally1's are single-build competition cars, without a demonstrable production requirement, yet they have to be built by a production manufacturer for a manufacturers championship. Rally2-5s have to be series produced yet there's no manufacturers championship nor manufacturers entering. Absolute joke. FIA Sporting and Rally departments need to sit down and decide WTF it is and be real with us.

[AnttiL]

Most other world championships would be cancelled if only 10 contestants would come.
And who are the ones at the top that are happy? Top of FIA, top of manufacturers or other tops?

The 2 things I would changed in the description are:

1. change distance to; from min 300km to max 500 km.
2. overlap btw stages of at least 25 cars, instead of 15. We need time to see top 5-10 drivers in WRC2 in all live.

Maybe some adjustment in how often they should have service, after talking with the teams and privateers.

In 2017 the maximum length of an event was still 500 km but not many rallies made it longer than needed. Every stage costs money.

And your second demand makes it even harder.

[flat_right]

This is really getting out of hands! Has anyone written to some admins or moderators?

[lmmjvss]

This topic was very interesting!
I still think that there is "something" in the format used in (saturday's) Extreme-E, in that Sprint Rally Sweden Lockdown and in the UCI Mountain Bike Downhill championship. I know mountain bikes are NOT rally.. I know Extreme-E with pointless electric suvsISH are boring (plus their focus is on the "rallycross format" from sunday) but "the format" is interesting to the viewer IMO. I got hooked on the MTB DH in just one event on red bull tv haha watching it because I was bored haha

[AndyRAC]

EWS is closer to rallying than DH MTB; first stage on the Saturday evening is the Pro stage, which hands out extra points, followed by another 5 stages on Sunday, including extra points on the 'Queen' stage.

Anyway, the WRC formats aren't changing; it's what they've built the whole thing on. (Whether that's right or wrong is another matter).

[WRCStan]

Can I poll: how many people follow Extreme-E?

[the sniper]

Can I poll: how many people follow Extreme-E?

Seems popular with the Rok family...

[pantealex]

Can I poll: how many people follow Extreme-E?

Me, but only for Drivers who are competing in it. Those cars are boring and I dislike "one make series"

[WRCStan]

Hello, the Sunday shift is here.

[RS]

Now everything seems centered about all live, but I really wonder how many (or few) people are watching it. I'm a big fan, have a subscription, but apart from the powerstages I've seen maybe 3 or 4 stages live on it, this year...

Similar here here, mostly because i’m working a lot of the time during a rally. Being able to follow an event from start to finish isn’t really going to fit with most people’s lives, but the powerstage format on a Sunday is really perfect for live TV and the casual fan.

But are there any countries around the world where this is available for free on a main tv channel? In the UK we have live or strong highlights packages on major tv channels for F1, FE, Formula Sexist, BTCC.. so it’s not a motorsport issue.

Powerstage is an entertaining and spectacular tv product and the promoter should concentrate on getting this in front of as many eyeballs as possible to provide good value for the manufacturers and sponsors and to draw more people in to purchasing their All-Live product.

[AndyRAC]

The Power Stage should be free on Red Bull TV and/or YouTube.....

[lmmjvss]

Can I poll: how many people follow Extreme-E?

I do! Im a big fan of Kristoffersson and I also like to follow Loeb, Carlos, the Hansen brothers, I have this little crush on Cattie Munnings and on Mikhaela. Im also a big Tanner Foust fan so this year Im even more interested. I used to watch Emma Gilmore in GRC and NZ Rally Highlights too. So its all about the drivers for me. I always skip the "save the planet" part of the show (80% of the broadcast haha). Im not a big fan os spec suvs tho. If it was more open or at least like Dakar's, It'd be one of my favorite series for sure.

[SubaruNorway]

I watch pretty much everything on WRC+ if i can, even if I'm on an event i will spend the next week re-watching everything haha.
We are even 3 of us having it on in the background at the garage on Fridays. Not so much onboards anymore because of the angles.

Extreme-e is decent with always something crazy happening, i also skip through the talking.

[rallyfiend]

Similar here here, mostly because i’m working a lot of the time during a rally. Being able to follow an event from start to finish isn’t really going to fit with most people’s lives, but the powerstage format on a Sunday is really perfect for live TV and the casual fan.

But are there any countries around the world where this is available for free on a main tv channel? In the UK we have live or strong highlights packages on major tv channels for F1, FE, Formula Sexist, BTCC.. so it’s not a motorsport issue.

Powerstage is an entertaining and spectacular tv product and the promoter should concentrate on getting this in front of as many eyeballs as possible to provide good value for the manufacturers and sponsors and to draw more people in to purchasing their All-Live product.

I'm not sure that's so true...

F1 highlights are on C4, WRC is on ITV4. So it's fairly comparable.

Formula E is behind the red button on C4 if it's there at all.... It gets constantly bounced around. It may as well no exist.

[rallyfiend]

The Power Stage should be free on Red Bull TV and/or YouTube.....

I suspect that would destroy the sales model. It would be the premium product that broadcasters buy...

[AndyRAC]

I suspect that would destroy the sales model. It would be the premium product that broadcasters buy...

Well their sales model is flawed; WRC All Live should be the premium product, the Power Stage should be the hook to draw customers in.....I don't know how they think they're going to get new followers/customers. They really must live in a bubble.....

[rallyfiend]

Well their sales model is flawed; WRC All Live should be the premium product, the Power Stage should be the hook to draw customers in.....I don't know how they think they're going to get new followers/customers. They really must live in a bubble.....

All Live is an OTT product (literally means 'over the top'). It's surely there for the hardcore fans.

It's still predicated on selling TV rights to broadcasters for the income that is derived from that and also the audience that comes from that to help justify the involvement of manufacturers and sponsors as well as governments paying for the events.

No different to F1's own F1 TV product. That's extra money, not the main source of income....

[WRCStan]

I always skip the "save the planet" part of the show (80% of the broadcast haha).

Yeah there's something off-putting about people flying around the world in private jets telling me I need to act because cow farts are killing us.

[WRCStan]

Similar here here, mostly because i’m working a lot of the time during a rally. Being able to follow an event from start to finish isn’t really going to fit with most people’s lives, but the powerstage format on a Sunday is really perfect for live TV and the casual fan.

But are there any countries around the world where this is available for free on a main tv channel? In the UK we have live or strong highlights packages on major tv channels for F1, FE, Formula Sexist, BTCC.. so it’s not a motorsport issue.

Powerstage is an entertaining and spectacular tv product and the promoter should concentrate on getting this in front of as many eyeballs as possible to provide good value for the manufacturers and sponsors and to draw more people in to purchasing their All-Live product.

I can't imagine a 90 minute power stage would work with 20 minute's worth of ad breaks. Promoter is happy selling the sponsors it has to the customers it has rather then giving it away. Don't forget there are WRC highlights on ITV4 too, just mid-week and now later at night.

[AndyRAC]

All Live is an OTT product (literally means 'over the top'). It's surely there for the hardcore fans.

It's still predicated on selling TV rights to broadcasters for the income that is derived from that and also the audience that comes from that to help justify the involvement of manufacturers and sponsors as well as governments paying for the events.

No different to F1's own F1 TV product. That's extra money, not the main source of income....

F1 is a bad comparison; in a completely different league. But if that is how WRC Promoter is thinking, then it's not a surprise WRC struggles....I can't believe TV rights bring much money in for the WRC.

[PLuto]

I am not sure if it is really necessary to bring live from all special stages. If there is special stage at 7:00 in the morning, only hardcore fans will wake up to watch it (and lot of them will not do it anyway). Maybe it should be better to sell to TV only some stages, but do it in more proper way...

[rallyfiend]

I am not sure if it is really necessary to bring live from all special stages. If there is special stage at 7:00 in the morning, only hardcore fans will wake up to watch it (and lot of them will not do it anyway). Maybe it should be better to sell to TV only some stages, but do it in more proper way...

That is what happens, isn't it?

Even in the event itineraries it clearly notes which stages are Live TV stages.

Seems to be maybe 4-5 per rally (including Power STage).

[rallyfiend]

F1 is a bad comparison; in a completely different league. But if that is how WRC Promoter is thinking, then it's not a surprise WRC struggles....I can't believe TV rights bring much money in for the WRC.

No one other than a hardcore / existing fan is ever going to watch or get sucked in by All LIve.

Same with other motor-racing. You think people get interested by watching a practice session or qualifying? No way...

[pantealex]

I am not sure if it is really necessary to bring live from all special stages. If there is special stage at 7:00 in the morning, only hardcore fans will wake up to watch it

7AM in Europe is some different time in Japan, Korea, Australia, NZ, Argentina, Mexico, USA ...
so it's not that simple...

[PLuto]

7AM in Europe is some different time in Japan, Korea, Australia, NZ, Argentina, Mexico, USA ...
so it's not that simple...

There is a question how many hardcore fans is in Japan, Korea, Australia, NZ, Argentina, Mexico, USA ... I dont have numbers of viewers, so difficult to say. But early starts in WRC is going against the competitors and also against the spectators. It is (maybe) good only for TV...

[WRCStan]

No one other than a hardcore / existing fan is ever going to watch or get sucked in by All LIve.

Same with other motor-racing. You think people get interested by watching a practice session or qualifying? No way...

I've noticed this year ITV4 have stifled the BTCC output to the final race of each series, where they used to do the full Sunday. This weekend they preferred to show 2 films from the 1950s. Don't understand that.


7AM in Europe is some different time in Japan, Korea, Australia, NZ, Argentina, Mexico, USA ...
so it's not that simple...

Wouldn't even travel that far. Sunday in Estonia will kick of at 4:48am for us. Not going to happen, because I can catch up in my own time, but this is still a hardcore fan thing to do.

[AndyRAC]

The BTCC has had the first two races on the main ITV channel; switching to ITV4 later in the afternoon.

[WRCStan]

The BTCC has had the first two races on the main ITV channel; switching to ITV4 later in the afternoon.

Ah!!! Thank you that's good to know.

[Sergiow]

This thread started with that Adamo interview from rallyssimo.it, thanks to Antil for creating this topic. The same rallyssimo.it now have a new (extensive) article,

"Ideas and criticisms for an almost defunct world. The lack of a radical change within the rally scene is felt more and more and we must therefore ask ourselves. What is missing to return to the glories of the past?", check it out https://www.rallyssimo.it/2022/08/15/idee-e-critiche-di-un-mondo-ormai-pressoche-defunto/ (https://www.rallyssimo.it/2022/08/15/idee-e-critiche-di-un-mondo-ormai-pressoche-defunto/)

Main topics in this article are Cars, Idols, Young Italians pilots, Social Networks and Public entertainment

[Sergiow]

I always skip the "save the planet" part of the show. What was very much visible in the Alghero WRC Parco Assistenza this year were 13 stands of various dealers (like BMW) and local companies that exhibited some full electric vehicles. Not just cars but also scooters and electric bikes. An exhibition space that was entirely dedicated to zero-emission mobility. I already told it before and say it again that the WRC Service Park has a multiple role, especially in WRC Sardegna

The real big news of 2022 for the "green" version of the Rally Italia Sardegna was however represented by the ACI Sport e-academy green by smart e-cup. The first edition of this innovative campus dedicated to under 18 was held at the Ittiri Arena and brought ten very young students to discover the world of racing in all its aspects, on board the electric smart e-cup training courses that give life to the green championship. The Academy provided three days of theoretical and practical driving lessons, setup and mechanics courses, relationship and conscious use with the media, attention to fitness and nutrition. In addition, all students were followed by two life coaches, an educator and a neuroscience expert, who leaded them to discover "the other side of the pilot", the more emotional and personal one.

After the WRC Rally Sardegna, there was also "WRC in schools" intiative organised by Rally Italia Sardegna Sassari Automobile Club with various initiatives dedicated to young people on the issues of road and environmental education, see

https://www.algheroeco.com/un-successo-il-progetto-wrc-nelle-scuole/

[pantealex]

Rally Finland service park also had "e-cars" expo (Audi, Mercedes, Polestar, Skoda, Tesla and maybe others) + many organizations car was fully electric.

[Sergiow]

Rally Finland service park also had "e-cars" expo (Audi, Mercedes, Polestar, Skoda, Tesla and maybe others) + many organizations car was fully electric.

Funny how a lot of other (non WRC participating) manufactures try get a piece of the WRC cake with their "e-cars" expo. But probably related to local companies or dealers.

[mknight]

https://twitter.com/VolvoCEGlobal/status/1559193016975462401

Got this pushed on Twitter, doesn't look very local to me.

[Sergiow]

https://twitter.com/VolvoCEGlobal/status/1559193016975462401

Got this pushed on Twitter, doesn't look very local to me.

That reminds me of BMW who are taking a cheap piece of the cake from MotoGP by just providing the Safety Car only.

[lmmjvss]

Its weird when you get to the point where you see this is all PR BS.

LIke, FormulaE and ExtremeE's Alejandro Agag is creating a new BOAT RACING series saying they are doing this to "help the world" or whatever 'green' BS they say. And like.... Right, but WITH THIS NEW SERIES (Its called E1), you will disrupt the ocean/lake/river/whatever with MACHINES RACING around places wheres there is an eco-system already.
So they will be >disrupting this eco-system< just to SHOWCASE ELECTRIC BOATS TO PROTECT THE ECO SYSTEM.. ??? like, honestly... WTF. Are people that stupid?
This is getting to a point where it looks more safe to just shot these people in the eye just to avoid NEW THINGS being produced generating MORE CO2 while they say "REDUCE POLUTION" hahahah Jeeeez