Webber only a qualifier?

[Schultz]

Mark Webber, throughout his career, has been portrayed as a qualifying specialist who consistently fails to make an impression during the race as he seems to only hold his position or even slip down the field during the race. Webber detractors have said this is proof of his poor race craft and inability to overtake. Me and many other Webber supporters have argued that infact, Webber has qualified well beyond the average capability of his car, which hasn't been able to give him the race speed to keep up with the speed the cars behind him are able to produce.

Today I think, is one of the most important days in Webber's career. It is his chance to prove the doubters wrong and show that a) he can overtake cars and b) that he has the ability to match his qualifying speed with his race pace.

Although my support of F1 has waned this year, my support for Mark has not. Because of this I am going to make the statement that if his car has no technical problems and Coulthard shows good speed, when the dust settles, most people will consider Webber a contender for their 'star of the race'.

I think this is the ultimate situation that will give the doubters a chance to reconsider their opinion of Mark Webber, and it is my belief that he will make that so.

[Ian McC]

He will no doubt be compared to DC's performance of the last race though if he can do it on this track is debatable.

[Ed]

the thing is that if your guna raise the argument that the car is not good enough to keep webber where he qualified then you have to say the same for Trulli with all the quali performamnces he had at Jordan, Renault agianst Button and at Toyota.

I still think the verdict out on whether or not Webbers got the race craft. As a avid fan of Hiedfeld it was anooying to see webber out qualify him during most of the 2005 season, yet I would always know that within ten laps he'd be close to webber on the track ,and by then end of the race ahead most of the time.

[futuretiger9]

Webber has been touted as a star for some time. Tomorrow is an opportunity for him to prove it in a race environment. The Red Bull seems to be improving, and I would back him to possibly get in the points. A good start would obviously help his cause.

[davidalbert]

Lets hope that all the niggling problems that he has been having in the races are out of the way. It will be easier to judge his race craft and ability if he has no problems. As i for one don't believe that we have seen the best of Mark Webber. I doesn't matter how good a driver is if he hasn't got a car capable of winning.

[Hawkmoon]

the thing is that if your guna raise the argument that the car is not good enough to keep webber where he qualified then you have to say the same for Trulli with all the quali performamnces he had at Jordan, Renault agianst Button and at Toyota.

The difference between Webber and Trulli is that there is no such thing as the Webber Train whilst the Trulli Train is a very real entity. So real infact, that Williams' Sam Michael said that Williams used to develop qualifying strategies that included trying to stay ahead of the Italian so that they wouldn't get stuck with a ticket on the Train. F1 Racing even did a piece on the phenomenon.

I think Webber has a long way to go before he starts his own railway but he certainly seems to be better at qualifying than he does at racing.

[Valve Bounce]

Webber has been touted as a star for some time. Tomorrow is an opportunity for him to prove it in a race environment. The Red Bull seems to be improving, and I would back him to possibly get in the points. A good start would obviously help his cause.

A helicopter wouldn't hurt either. :(

[RJL25]

as i have always said, webber has NEVER had a good race car. Never ever ever. He has never had the opportunity to show how good he is.

Thing is, a really good driver can make a rubbish car look pretty nifty in qualifying, which is what mark has done all throughout his career, but only the very best drivers (im talking senna, m. schumacher, g. villeneuve here) can make a rubbish car look good in a race. A race is just too long and eventually, over a 50-60 lap race, the cars inherint crapness will show through.

Thats not to say mark cant sometimes make his rubbish car look good in a race! Monaco is a good example of this, mark is always quick there, and mark has had a couple of remarkably good drives for jaguar and last year when the williams stayed the distance mark looked pretty good. The problem is mark isnt the best, therefore he cant replicate these "superhuman" drives every week like senna, m. schumacher and g. villeneuve could.

I still maintain webber could win a world championship in the right car tho. If he was in either of the mclaren or the ferrari this year he would definetly have a good chance of winning the world championship. I think it would probably come down to him and alonso, as kimi doesnt work hard enough, massa has too many brain explosions and as good as hamilton is, and thats very very good, inexperience will catch up with im before seasons end

[Valve Bounce]

Good wrap -up for Mark. I think he really has to prove himself against DC before we can go higher in our aspirations. I'd like him to do well - we'll see. The season is young.

[pino]

The difference between Webber and Trulli is that there is no such thing as the Webber Train whilst the Trulli Train is a very real entity. So real infact, that Williams' Sam Michael said that Williams used to develop qualifying strategies that included trying to stay ahead of the Italian so that they wouldn't get stuck with a ticket on the Train. F1 Racing even did a piece on the phenomenon.



Hawkmoon, if you were a F1 driver and had signed for a Team that had failed to build a competitive car, but thanks your skills you manage to start in 2nd or 3rd row...what would you do at the start ? Park the car and let anyone pass you or keep the position and try to defend it ? ;)

[Hawkmoon]

Hawkmoon, if you were a F1 driver and had signed for a Team that had failed to build a competitive car, but thanks your skills you manage to start in 2nd or 3rd row...what would you do at the start ? Park the car and let anyone pass you or keep the position and try to defend it ? ;)

He should defend his position to the best of his ability. He's very good at it too. The problem is that he always seems to be defending his position against a string of cars behind him and never seems to be the one attacking the car in front. It's a perception I have of him from watching him race for the last decade and I haven't seen enough evidence to the contrary to yet change my mind.

I'm sorry pino, your man's one of the quickest guys out there over a single lap but over 70, he's lacking something. To keep it on-topic, Webber is just as quick over 1 lap but always seems to find problems in the race. Reliability problems, accidents and bad luck seem to dog him on race day. Webber, like Trulli, will need to reverse this trend if he is to be remembered for more than his heroics on Saturday afternoons.

[Valve Bounce]

Maybe it would be a great idea if they swapped teams

[pino]

Maybe it would be a great idea if they swapped teams

Neither Toyota nor Jarno would love that ;)

[pino]

He should defend his position to the best of his ability. He's very good at it too. The problem is that he always seems to be defending his position against a string of cars behind him and never seems to be the one attacking the car in front. It's a perception I have of him from watching him race for the last decade and I haven't seen enough evidence to the contrary to yet change my mind.

I'm sorry pino, your man's one of the quickest guys out there over a single lap but over 70, he's lacking something. To keep it on-topic, Webber is just as quick over 1 lap but always seems to find problems in the race. Reliability problems, accidents and bad luck seem to dog him on race day. Webber, like Trulli, will need to reverse this trend if he is to be remembered for more than his heroics on Saturday afternoons.

You didn't answer my question ;)

[Stuartf12007]

more bad luck for Webber today.

looks like he is never gonna live up to his potential.

[Mandiblard]

Well he did manage an overtaking move at least, his move on Liuzzi was the only one I saw all race. Terrible track that is.

[AJP]

Webber will get a reliable car....especially for Monaco...I think both Webber and Coulthard will finish in the points at Monaco.

[Ranger]

They say you have to make your own luck... but this race was just tough when he retired 8 laps in and his team-mate had no fuel flap issues or reliability problems.

[Gibbsy]

Well he did manage an overtaking move at least, his move on Liuzzi was the only one I saw all race. Terrible track that is.

I think my coverage misssed that. Good move?

[millencolin]

bit hard to judge the guy when his car breaks after a handful of laps

i had a little wager with my dad saying that Webber's car will break within the first 10 laps. although i didnt want that to happen, at least i still made $5 out of my general misfortune

Will Webber become the greatest driver never to win a gp? thats whatim worried about...

[ozrevhead]

its taken him so long to get to F1 - now he is finally there the cars fail on him

:(

[millencolin]

Although my support of F1 has waned this year, my support for Mark has not.



same can be said for Will Power and Champ Car... I'm cheering him on, but I couldnt care less about CC Now

Bringing it back on topic now

I think Webber's best chance for success though will be the next round at monaco... remember last year he was challenging for the win... perhaps with some reliability he could score a podium!

[Schultz]

same can be said for Will Power and Champ Car... I'm cheering him on, but I couldnt care less about CC Now

Bringing it back on topic now

I think Webber's best chance for success though will be the next round at monaco... remember last year he was challenging for the win... perhaps with some reliability he could score a podium!


I really feel sorry for the series. It's been run into the ground when it could really be something much bigger. I really think of Bourdais leaves the championship, it's almost the straw that broke the camel's back.

[Mandiblard]

Unfortunately I don't think the new Red Bull will work very well at Monaco, just a feeling.

I think my coverage misssed that. Good move?
Basic overtake, got in front just before the first corner and got real close to Scott Speed too. It was hard to tell who was who with those three a second apart. Then I never saw him til he had to pull out

[Ed]

webber never been in a good car??

the william in 2005 weren't that bad a car, Hiedfeld got 3 podium outta it

[jens]

I think the phrase "qualifying specialist" is used too negatively. When people describe someone as a "one-lap-wonder", then they mean that the driver can drive fast only for one lap, but otherwise he is quite useless. I think that statement is clearly wrong and all of those "one-lap-wonders" have often shown great racing as well. The have naturally very good raw speed and at least occasionally - if not often - it also can be seen in races. About overtaking - well, I'm yet to see F1 driver, who doesn't overtake! And if someone doesn't pass, then he most probably wouldn't make it to F1 after a very tight competition in lower formula classes. The main difference between drivers is that how many risks in battles is anyone eager to take.

I used to rate Webber very highly. It was 2003, his second season in F1. He scored points really consistently that year and then I was sure that he was a top driver. But after that it has gradually gone downhill. After I heard he had signed the contract with Williams, I expected a lot from him, but he has disappointed me a bit during the last two seasons. He doesn't look utterly confident and tends to make clumsy errors occasionally - the last one being a spin at the entrance of the pitlane at Melbourne. He has had several pretty good and even amazing races, but they do not occur consistently. Sometimes he seems to have some off-weekends with no clear reason, like his comment after 2006 Italian GP qualification (P19, Rosberg was P12): "I have no idea, why I was so slow." Yes, he has also been quite unlucky with unreliability and that's true that it's quite tough to rate Mark, especially as he has driven alongside a strong team-mate only for one season and on other occasions he has been partnered by a rookie. Therefore I guess that his battle with Coulthard is quite decisive for him.

I may not be among the biggest admirers of Webber's talent, but at the moment I feel a bit sorry to him. I mean look at Barcelona Grand Prix. Webber had problems both in qualifying and in the race, while DC scored a fine 5th place. I guess Mark might not feel comfortable at all. He might believe that he may have fought or even beaten DC that weekend, but he had no chance to prove himself against the Scotsman - neither in quali nor in the race.

[Stuartf12007]

with the way the cars are its impossible to overtake at Monaco, so if Webber finishes it will be where he qualified.

[aryan]

Webber is yet to really prove himself as a racer, partly because of his rookie team mates.

DC is known quantity, so this is a great test for webber. If he can soundly beat DC and get at least twice DC's points, then he may have a chance of moving to a top team, but with DC's current form, that seems a bit illusive.

[cy bais]

I feel for him, it seems almost every race Sunday, he's on the sidelines conducting an interview as to why his car broke down. But he's always upbeat and continue-on.

Best to ya Mark.

[Valve Bounce]

The Red Bull appears to be quite a good car this year, and all Mark needs is a bit of luck with reliability issues.
Maybe he ought to drink more of that goop. :eek:

[Mickey T]

He doesn't look utterly confident and tends to make clumsy errors occasionally - the last one being a spin at the entrance of the pitlane at Melbourne. .

the melbourne spin was caused by a fly-by-wire throttle glitch in the electronics, which went haywire after the first pit stop. he's also been notoriously hard on his fuel flaps.

He's comfortably outpaced DC in qualifying and in races - at least until the gremlin-magnet side of his character comes out.

Oh, and some ideas on the subject from the horse's mouth...

Last year was probably the first time I felt really comfortable with my racing performance for every lap of the season.
I would get to the point of finishing races 20 or 30 seconds behind Kimi after 90 minutes of racing, knowing he was in a McLaren and I was in a Williams and that’s not a bad effort over a race distance.
Sometimes it was a reasonable race car as well, last year’s Williams. It just wasn’t reliable enough on the days when it was fast enough.

Turkey was a cracker for us. Just made the top 10 and came out of turn one in fourth and had a faultless race. Then we both got smashed in times, with the 14th fastest race lap.
It’s all about tyres in Formula One. You find out how tight the balance window of the car is. That’s the difference between fast, consistent stints and falling away on long runs. That’s the difference between good racing cars and mediocre ones.
The designers are fighting to get a bigger balance window the car can operate in over the whole life of the tyre.
Over a 25 lap stint they change and scream and struggle.

When they brought out the one-lap qualifying distance I thought “I am going to hate this”. I would much rather go out there and get the rhythm of putting laps together. What I didn’t realize was so did every other *******. I would much prefer the old way.
In the race or in qualifying when we put the new tyres on, that’s the difference. Most guys can do the times on old tyres or scrubbed tyres.
When you get fresh tyres it is an art. Some drivers may not be able to put it out on the limit like others can.
In Hockenheim, we qualified 11th and sat 4th, 5th or sixth most of the race. When we are trying to race in these positions where we are qualifying it’s tough.
You look at any races in the year, it’s just a perception from the Jaguar days (qualifying).
It was an unbelievable qualifying car and a very poor race car.

then 2005 was a pain in the arse with the one-tyre thing. At Jaguar and Williams we were legendary at **** starts. Last year we could have good starts.
I am cool with it (the perception of being just a hot qualifier). I had a good season as a racing driver last year. I was happy with it and I know I didn’t leave much in it anywhere in races.
Sometimes I can get behind guys struggling with balance and wonder how it can be so bad, but I know other guys have thought the same thing behind me.

[millencolin]

The Red Bull appears to be quite a good car this year, and all Mark needs is a bit of luck with reliability issues.
Maybe he ought to drink more of that goop. :eek:


no no DONT DRINK IT MORE... drink too much and it becomes addictive! I'm a recovering Red Bull addict :p : Used to drink a lot of it when i was a projectionist... took a year to break the addiction, now i can seldom enjoy my red bull with vodka every saturday night