WRC fuel consuption

[WRC17]

How many miles do WRC cars do per gallon in stage mode?

[ESTR]

Some time ago I was at GTI Treffen in Austria. Well there was Skoda's tent and their R5 machines (combi version too). And I read at the specs list that Fabia have around 60.. Wow incredible... There was also replica of Polo WRC but no specs.

[tommeke_B]

I don't know about the most recent cars. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I've been told a Fiesta WRC 2013 spec was around 65l/100km, so converted that's 4,35mpg. S2000 cars at the day had similar consumption, earlier (2L) WRC cars far more.

[Mirek]

Yes, I don't know how the 2017 WRC cars but before it was around 60-70l/100 km, old WRC cars 15-20 years a go even more than 100l/100 km. R5 today have also around 60l/100km I think (br21 knows better for sure).

Anyway in the turbo cars large part of the consumption is taken by ALS. That's why I think that the most meaningful way how to integrate some often discussed hybrid systems into rally is to implement semi-electric turbochargers without classic ALS. It would be relatively easy to implement (I think) and it would bring fuel consumption to much lower values without changing the appearance of the cars, i.e. it would look good for marketing reasons but for petrolheads not much would be changed in terms of sound and spectacle (sound slightly). It would be theoretically good also for reliability.

[br21]

Current WRC cars I don't know, I think slightly more than R5s (as restrictor bigger so more air so more fuel needed also). R5 cars use around 55-60l per 100km in stage mode. All depends on driver (pushing harder or less), conditions (very slippery or sandy needs more), level of ALS.
Last 2l WRC cars used around 80l typically.
Old turbo gpA cars used 100l, sometimes even more. Mostly due to less advanced ECUs, ALS strategies, etc. Newer cars also use direct injection systems, which allow much detailed fuel distribution.
Consumption depends also on fuel type, E85 for example gives around 30% more consumption than normal fuel.

[tommeke_B]

So Van Rompuy only needed 50l/100km SS? :D

[AnttiL]

old WRC cars 15-20 years a go even more than 100l/100 km.

I remember hearing in 1996 a Toyota Celica ST205 would take exactly one litre per kilometre on a stage.

[Mirek]

I remember hearing in 1996 a Toyota Celica ST205 would take exactly one litre per kilometre on a stage.

I heard about early Octavia WRC that it took around 110l/100km.

[WRC17]

I heard about early Octavia WRC that it took around 110l/100km.

iS that with ALS on full, how much would the performance be reduced but MPG increased if ALS was turned down or off?

[Mirek]

Maybe somebody can give better values (dimviii, br21?) but I believe that with Evo IX gr.N the consumption with full ALS is nearly double than without.

[WRC17]

I meant was the skoda MPG with ALS on full?

[Mirek]

I meant was the skoda MPG with ALS on full?

Aha, yes.

[dimviii]

Maybe somebody can give better values (dimviii, br21?) but I believe that with Evo IX gr.N the consumption with full ALS is nearly double than without.

about 40% more,depents from the stage,and how much strong antilag you have select

[mknight]

Anyway in the turbo cars large part of the consumption is taken by ALS. That's why I think that the most meaningful way how to integrate some often discussed hybrid systems into rally is to implement semi-electric turbochargers without classic ALS. It would be relatively easy to implement (I think) and it would bring fuel consumption to much lower values without changing the appearance of the cars, i.e. it would look good for marketing reasons but for petrolheads not much would be changed in terms of sound and spectacle (sound slightly). It would be theoretically good also for reliability.

Totally agree (as I also did in the past). Should be possible to spec. it in the rules.
Also, it might even be possible not to have it running all the time when off-throttle. A suitably large electric motor could be able to spin up the turbo really quick as a reaction to throttle input, minimizing any delay.

[N.O.T]

How many miles do WRC cars do per gallon in stage mode?

per gallon....

We use metric around here you colonial pleb...

[WRC17]

How much performance difference would there be with ALS off?

[br21]

How much performance difference would there be with ALS off?

A lot for sure. But can't say exactly, as it depends on stage characteristics, on car (turbo spool, etc), on mapping, conditions, driver, etc.

[Coach 2]

I meant was the skoda MPG with ALS on full?

And you are from US or?

[Mirek]

A lot for sure. But can't say exactly, as it depends on stage characteristics, on car (turbo spool, etc), on mapping, conditions, driver, etc.

Do You know whether 2017 WRC have by-pass air channel or whether it is banned like in R5?

[br21]

Fresh air valve is allowed for WRC cars.

[NickRally]

Yes, I don't know how the 2017 WRC cars but before it was around 60-70l/100 km, old WRC cars 15-20 years a go even more than 100l/100 km. R5 today have also around 60l/100km I think (br21 knows better for sure).

Anyway in the turbo cars large part of the consumption is taken by ALS. That's why I think that the most meaningful way how to integrate some often discussed hybrid systems into rally is to implement semi-electric turbochargers without classic ALS. It would be relatively easy to implement (I think) and it would bring fuel consumption to much lower values without changing the appearance of the cars, i.e. it would look good for marketing reasons but for petrolheads not much would be changed in terms of sound and spectacle (sound slightly). It would be theoretically good also for reliability.

Mirek, one more big supporter of this concept here. You raised very valid points, only one that is touch open to dispute is “It would be relatively easy to implement (I think)” – the engine manufacturers/tuners got slightly bad taste of this system due to the struggles of some of the F1 engine manufacturers, though if you don’t try to squeeze every last ounce of performance out of the system, things should be a lot more manageable. I also suspect drivers would love it.

[WRC17]

A lot for sure. But can't say exactly, as it depends on stage characteristics, on car (turbo spool, etc), on mapping, conditions, driver, etc.

If i am correct, the car would still have the same BHP with ALS off, but the turbo would take more time to respond?

[Mirek]

The peak power would be same, yes, but You would still loose a lot of time with slow response to the throtle and a certain time needed to get on the nominal power curve. The appearance of the R5 would look closer to the S2000 cars (or old gr.A/B cars) with a massive lack of torque immediately after pushing the throttle.

[WRC17]

I guess this would be more of a problem on stages where drivers need to lift off the throttle more than it would on a stage with only tight junctions and long straights?

[Mirek]

Yes, exactly. Massive problem for events like Corsica, smaller problem for Ypres for example. Same on gravel. Huge problem in Argentina (high altitudes would make it even worse), smaller problem in Poland or Finland.