Hyundai WRT

[doubled1978]

Mikkelsen said in an intervu that he struggle to get the right feeling in the car, they don't thrust the car at the stages.
In tests it feels good, than on the stages it feels different.




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Sometimes I think testing can be misleading, when you pound over the same road man times you adjust yourself to the road and car, even if its subconscious and you can feel well with the set up. when you have to be flat out on the first pass in competition, there is no adjustment time and you are slow.

[Mk2 RS2000]

I find it interesting that the decision to develop the Paddon transmission requirements must have been made some time ago so that he could test and refine in the Estonian rally before Finland. Also interesting is that at Shakedown he used the set up as decided upon by the other two team drivers after their Finland test day then changed to his Estonian Rally developed set up for the rally. For sure, aside from being quicker than his team mates he did appear to be far more comfortable with his car than they were all event.
With this investment into a set up developed for Hayden it does make one wonder what changes might be in the wind for next season.

[skarderud]

I find it interesting that the decision to develop the Paddon transmission requirements must have been made some time ago so that he could test and refine in the Estonian rally before Finland. Also interesting is that at Shakedown he used the set up as decided upon by the other two team drivers after their Finland test day then changed to his Estonian Rally developed set up for the rally. For sure, aside from being quicker than his team mates he did appear to be far more comfortable with his car than they were all event.
With this investment into a set up developed for Hayden it does make one wonder what changes might be in the wind for next season.The only driver with a contract for 19 is Mikkelsen?

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[KiwiWRCfan]

The only driver with a contract for 19 is Mikkelsen?

Sent fra min SM-G950F via Tapatalk

Both Mikkelsen and Tanak have contracts for 2019

[rallyfiend]

Both Mikkelsen and Tanak have contracts for 2019

Mikkelsen not necessarily.

It's understood the options on the second year are in the team's favour...

[N.O.T]

Mikkelsen gets closer to becoming ostberg vol. 2 year by year... a nobody with a rich daddy.

[focus206]

Earlier in the season I've read that Hyundai would have introduced few upgrades to the car for Deutschland Rallye. Are they testing them or did they change plans?

[nafpaktos]

Mikkelsen gets closer to becoming ostberg vol. 2 year by year... a nobody with a rich daddy.

At the end of next year we wll know for sure.This moment its a bit early to judje him.When he was at vw he was a rising driver,actually 3rd driver.This year is his first as leading driver along with Neuville,so be patient until the end of next season.

[wrc2017]

At the end of next year we wll know for sure.This moment its a bit early to judje him.When he was at vw he was a rising driver,actually 3rd driver.This year is his first as leading driver along with Neuville,so be patient until the end of next season.

Did Mikkelson even do Finland? he was anonymous... there could be some clearing out of the divisions next year

JML?
Mikkelson?
Sordo?
Paddon?
Evans?

Maybe not Breen, but he soon need to start showing something... if Ogier goes to Citroen, I dont see room, unless he outbids Otsberg?

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Mikkelsen has to the be the biggest disappointment of 2018.

After all his 'desperate to get back to WRC' talk and then landing a great full-time seat in possibly the best car, he has done virtually nothing. He's scored a third of the points of Neuville who everyone used to think he was superior to..

[AnttiL]

This has been a polarized year indeed with only the big three winning rallies and others getting only podiums here and there. Breen, Evans, Mikkelsen and Latvala have had ”difficult” seasons, Lappi and Suninen are still rookies and others have only part time seasons.

[mknight]

This has been a polarized year indeed with only the big three winning rallies and others getting only podiums here and there. Breen, Evans, Mikkelsen and Latvala have had ”difficult” seasons, Lappi and Suninen are still rookies and others have only part time seasons.

Yeah that's a fair point.

Basically there are only 4 drivers who you could say have good season:
3 full time (Neuville, Ogier, Tanak) and Sordo

for all others there is some good result here and there but overall less than expected.

If we going for biggest disappointment then Latvala takes it ahead of Mikkelsen for me. Car he developed and fought for title with last year. Now slowest Toyota and with crashes as well. The "suspension failures " that always plagued him are also back. Also an interesting static. Latval has not a lead a WRC event for a single stage this season. Sad I though he was great last season and his mojo got back after 2016.

Mikkelsen is close second, most of the disappointment comes from the contrast between the 3 rounds in Hyundai last year.

Evans would win the award for some british journalists. I still remember Colin Clark claiming at kitchen table after wales that Evans will fight for title this year no matter what car he is in.

[Eric]

Mikkelsens season has been terrible so far, no doubt about that.
But lets not forget, both Portugal and Sardegna looked really good for Mikkelsen until the car broke down. Not his fault and nothing he could do about it. Finland was disappointing but lets give the guy a break. With him coming to Finland with most likely two podiums from the two last rallies, no one would speak about his bad season.

Lets see what he can do the rest of this season and the start of 2019. It took Neuville 4-5 years to adapt to the Hyundai. Mikkelsen has been in the team less than a year....

[AnttiL]

Lets see what he can do the rest of this season and the start of 2019. It took Neuville 4-5 years to adapt to the Hyundai. Mikkelsen has been in the team less than a year....

Like said, he had great pace in Catalunya and Australia but we haven’t seen any of that this year

[mknight]

Like said, he had great pace in Catalunya and Australia but we haven’t seen any of that this year

Nah Sardinia with leading by 14s in first service before car broke.

[GravelBen]

Mikkelsens season has been terrible so far, no doubt about that.
But lets not forget, both Portugal and Sardegna looked really good for Mikkelsen until the car broke down. Not his fault and nothing he could do about it.

In Sardegna the car broke after he had spun it twice and backed it into the bales, so that breakage might have been his fault. Can't say for sure though, maybe it would have happened anyway.

[mknight]

In Sardegna the car broke after he had spun it twice and backed it into the bales, so that breakage might have been his fault. Can't say for sure though, maybe it would have happened anyway.

This is not true and I have no idea where you have it from.
He lost 2nd gear on stage before, check out the replay how it just starts jumping out after making strange noises on multiple brakings. No spins. Then on the stage after that during breaking the gearbox breaks completely and he spins as the gearbox is stuck in gear (note that he needs to change from 3 to 1). What's the real reason for looosing 2nd only Hyundai knows.

[GravelBen]

I got that from watching it live and the day highlights :rolleyes:. They showed a small spin in SS6 (maybe spin is the wrong word, more like a half spin and slide wide) and a problem with second gear after that, then a spin again in SS7 and got stuck in reverse up against the bales.

I just watched the WRC+ in-car as well now to check - the one in SS6 is around 4:30, its not much of an impact (not one you would normally expect to break things) but it is enough to stall the car when it hits the berm so its possible the gearbox was weakened then. You don't hear the gear problem until later in the stage.

I can't tell from the in-car if the SS7 spin was stuck in gear or just that he was distracted by the problem and having trouble driving the car without second gear. It obviously wasn't completely broken/stuck because he could select reverse and back up to the bales.

I didn't say it was definitely the spins that damaged the gearbox, just meant that it might have been a factor. I agree that only the team will know what went wrong with it.

[SubaruNorway]

Mikkelsen joking about doing the Norseman Xtreme Triathlon today will be easier than Rally Finland
https://parcferme.no/rally/mikkelsen-er-forberedt-pa-a-bli-lagkameratens-hjelperytter/

[lluisva555]

Our aero review of the new Hyundai i20 AP4++ built by Hyundai New Zealand and Paddon Rallysport that Hayden Paddon drove in the Ashley Forest Rallysprint. Some interesting proposals we might see in the future WRC car

https://wrcwings.wordpress.com/2018/09/24/hayden-paddons-new-hyundai-i20-ap4-aerodynamic-proposals/

[mknight]

A bit of a gravedig but I haven't seen this before


I got that from watching it live and the day highlights :rolleyes:. They showed a small spin in SS6 (maybe spin is the wrong word, more like a half spin and slide wide) and a problem with second gear after that, then a spin again in SS7 and got stuck in reverse up against the bales.

I just watched the WRC+ in-car as well now to check - the one in SS6 is around 4:30, its not much of an impact (not one you would normally expect to break things) but it is enough to stall the car when it hits the berm so its possible the gearbox was weakened then. You don't hear the gear problem until later in the stage.

I can't tell from the in-car if the SS7 spin was stuck in gear or just that he was distracted by the problem and having trouble driving the car without second gear. It obviously wasn't completely broken/stuck because he could select reverse and back up to the bales.

I didn't say it was definitely the spins that damaged the gearbox, just meant that it might have been a factor. I agree that only the team will know what went wrong with it.

I watched SS6 some 2 months ago and it never would have occurred me to call that thing on SS6 a spin. The car is always pointing the right direction. He is a bit longer on the breaking and then the car stalls (without any audible throttle input) in ruts on the outside of the corner in like 5 kph.

In SS7 you hear for some 2 mins before the corner in 3-4-5th gear massive rattling from the gearbox (much louder than engine noise), which is not there at the start of the stage. At that point pieces of 2nd gear are likely getting everywhere in the gearbox. That he can select reverse after stopping in the corner only means the pieces were not blocking reverse at that moment.

To recap your original comment:

In Sardegna the car broke after he had spun it twice and backed it into the bales, so that breakage might have been his fault. Can't say for sure though, maybe it would have happened anyway.

The first highlighted part is not correct, first one wasn't a spin. In the "final" spin he is on throttle and the car doesn't drive ( and spins out due to momentum), so gearbox is completely broken.
The second highlighted part is quite a statement to suggest based on the only visible incident with 5kph stall with little throttle. A bit like saying Latvala broke his car in Germany by pissing next to it.

[Mk2 RS2000]

Just a small correction to this article It is all 100% New Zealand designed and made by Hayden and his team

[mknight]

https://parcferme.no/rally/andreas-skjonner-ikke-hvorfor-det-kun-er-hyundai-han-sliter-med/

""We knew in January that the car was not good enough for you on asphalt. Now we are in October. Why did not something happen?

"First of all, there are not so many asphalt runs on the calendar, and we have had very few tests on asphalt. I push on for changes, but it takes time before things come. Things that came two weeks ago I asked for a year ago. And some of the changes are still improving, even for me. You see, the other two get it. They have been closer. But I do not have that. So there I still have to figure out something, says Mikkelsen."

....
"I just have to figure out the driving style with the car, so. I'm still trying to drive a car, which I think is best driving a car and the way I've been driving for years, "says Mikkelsen.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Well it's true that Neuville and Sordo were seemingly closer to the top (then again there were only 3-4 dry stages).

Rest kinda supports what was said around here before. Adapting the car to Mikkelsen is not a priority at all, neither are tarmac tests and due to that he seems to be giving up and trying to drive differently.

While the first part is kinda understandable since he is not fighting for championship (though that wasn't clear before Corsica when he was 3rd in standings) and they have Sordo as a tarmac driver, it still hurts them in manu champs when Sordo does not get points (like in Germany). But as I wrote already in april after a while becomes a bit too many rallies where the car(s) have issues (Finland, tarmac -Corsica and Germany for all, Spain for Mikkelsen) and it the end, that's why they will loose manu champ imo.

Have to wonder about how universal the 2017/2018 I20 really is. The only driver that drives it consistently fast is Neuville.

Sordo was also minutes behind in Finland and GB last year (didn't start this year). Mikkelsen struggles on tarmac and also in Finland. Paddon has been struggling on gravel on basically all rallies except Finland (certainly relative to 2016 where he had same speed as Neuville and also compared with some 2017 drives (Sardinia).

So if you were Paddon/Breen/Evans would you go for part-time seat at Hyundai knowing this or part-time seat at Citroen (which obviously was also temperamental but now seems to be improving) or to full-time at MSport where you risk that car will start falling behind. Hard pick.

[AnttiL]

Paddon has been struggling on gravel on basically all rallies except Finland (certainly relative to 2016 where he had same speed as Neuville and also compared with some 2017 drives (Sardinia).

Paddon was leading Portugal before his crash, and subsequently had to take Sardegna easier because another heavy crash would have been dangerous to the sustained injuries. To me it seems he has been playing tactics of trying to secure points by not taking risks, especially in Turkey. And in a way, it has paid off.

[mknight]

Last year he led/was in the top on multiple gravel rallies before technical issues or mistakes. This year it was only portugal with lotsof road cleaning and not by much.
IMO it's clear that he is slower this year relative to last.

[GravelBen]

Paddon was leading Portugal before his crash, and subsequently had to take Sardegna easier because another heavy crash would have been dangerous to the sustained injuries. To me it seems he has been playing tactics of trying to secure points by not taking risks, especially in Turkey. And in a way, it has paid off.

My thoughts too. Leading Portugal before crashing (which from memory was quite unlucky dodging a big rock on the line), taking it easy in Sardegna due to injuries (and terrible road position for the day 1 mudbath), fast in Finland despite playing it safe for team points, strategic drive protecting the car in Turkey (with podium result). GB was the only rally he seemed a bit off pace, and team orders/strategy may have been a factor there too - though its never been one of his best rallies, he doesn't seem to like the mud as much as more consistent gravel.

Of course none of us are unbiased when it comes to supporting drivers/teams, but mknight's status as Mikkelsen no.1 cheerleader does seem to result in some very selective memory at times.

[AnttiL]

Last year he led/was in the top on multiple gravel rallies before technical issues or mistakes. This year it was only portugal with lotsof road cleaning and not by much.
IMO it's clear that he is slower this year relative to last.

If we look at the 2017 season, Sardegna was a good pace until the two crashes. In Portugal he was interrupted three times with technical problems. When the car worked, he made four stage wins but also a similar number of off-pace stages. In other rallies he was never fighting for the lead.

[mknight]

How do you compare Paddon overall performance in 2016-2017-2018 then? In short.
For me it's 2016>>2017>2018.

In any case that wasn't the main point. Main point was that the only one delivering consistent top 5 performance in the 2017+ i20 is Neuville. All the other drivers have rallies where they used to be fast and now aren't, not necessarily that the car is slow, but setup seems tricky.

[GravelBen]

Main point was that the only one delivering consistent top 5 performance in the 2017+ i20 is Neuville.

2017 was a nightmare year for Paddon with all sorts of sh!t going on, thats public knowledge now and no secret.

5th-Ret(from 1st)-4th-4th-3rd-7th in 2018 is pretty consistent top 5 performance isn't it, especially for a driver thats only getting half the seat time compared to most of the guys he is competing against. I remember Colin McRae once saying that the difference between the top 5 or so drivers in the world on any given day is mostly just confidence. And without the time in the car its very hard to build that confidence. Hopefully they let him have a charge in Australia instead of driving risk-free for points, but it will probably depend what the others do early on.

The car definitely seems to suit Neuville better than anyone else though, I do agree with you in that regard.

[Rally Power]

Main point was that the only one delivering consistent top 5 performance in the 2017+ i20 is Neuville. All the other drivers have rallies where they used to be fast and now aren't, not necessarily that the car is slow, but setup seems tricky.

You’re forgetting Sordo; he fought for the lead, or podium places, in MC, Mexico, Portugal, Argentina, Germany and Catalunya! Corsica was the only rally he was off the pace, still he managed to end fourth. I’m amazed Hyundai management isn’t pushing him to do a full season next year, although this part time drive seems to suit him and the team.

[mknight]

You’re forgetting Sordo; he fought for the lead, or podium places, in MC, Mexico, Portugal, Argentina, Germany and Catalunya! Corsica was the only rally he was off the pace, still he managed to end fourth. I’m amazed Hyundai management isn’t pushing him to do a full season next year, although this part time drive seems to suit him and the team.

No I am not. Last year he was way back in Finland (as usual both for him and Hyundai) and GB (last of the 4 Hyundais almost 4 mins behind). Also in Sweden he was way off at +2:10, only the fact that so many cars crashed/dropped made that 4th place, in 2018 at same pace he would be 8th.
This year he does not start on those rallies (kinda for obvious reasons).

Question is if it's mostly Sordo that can't do those rallies, but he certainly can drive on Corsica. In either case you can't say he has been consistently fast in the I20, only Neuville is.

[Rally Power]

Jesus mate. Are you blind? How can you say Sordo wasn't consistently fast in 6 of the 7 events he did this year?

[mknight]

Jesus mate. Are you blind? How can you say Sordo wasn't consistently fast in 6 of the 7 events he did this year?

You are blind or read too fast:

"Quote Originally Posted by mknight View Post
Main point was that the only one delivering consistent top 5 performance in the 2017+ i20 is Neuville. All the other drivers have rallies where they used to be fast and now aren't, not necessarily that the car is slow, but setup seems tricky."

EDIT: To write even more clearly. Only one delivering consistent top 5 performance in I20 since start of 2017.

[Toyoda]

Sordo's driving style is closer to Neuvilles as apposed to Paddon and Mikkelsen, so logically it would be a better fit?

[Rally Power]

You are blind or read too fast:
"Quote Originally Posted by mknight View Post
Main point was that the only one delivering consistent top 5 performance in the 2017+ i20 is Neuville. All the other drivers have rallies where they used to be fast and now aren't, not necessarily that the car is slow, but setup seems tricky."

I read it again, very slowly this time. What's a 2017+ i20, for gods sake?

Anyway, Neuville and Sordo are doing a fine job with the i20, Paddon seems more at ease with it and Mikkelsen looks totally lost. Hopefully he'll do better next year. Time will tell.

[mknight]

I read it again, very slowly this time. What's a 2017+ i20, for gods sake?

Anyway, Neuville and Sordo are doing a fine job with the i20, Paddon seems more at ease with it and Mikkelsen looks totally lost. Hopefully he'll do better next year. Time will tell.

I wrote it again for even clearer wording, "Only one delivering consistent top 5 performance in I20 since start of 2017." Sordo is simply not driving the rallies where he did bad last year and on Corsica he was clearly slower than last year.

[Mk2 RS2000]

As shown on the Television coverage from Rally Australia the body language on display from the Hyundai Control room as Hayden Paddon crosses the finish line in second place says it all.

Not one of jubilation and success but rather of resignation and realisation of what could have been.

The next Board meeting could be interesting

[AnttiL]

They also lost both championships that day

[stefanvv]

They also lost both championships that day

Semantically they haven't lose anything, just didn't won them.

[Mk2 RS2000]

They also lost both championships that day

They were clutching at straws, they lost them both earlier than that

[mknight]

Don't think that had anything to do with Paddon. You mean they should go all wild about finishing 2nd when they are used to win (multiple times this year) and just lost both championships?

[Toyoda]

Don't think that had anything to do with Paddon. You mean they should go all wild about finishing 2nd when they are used to win (multiple times this year) and just lost both championships?

No, they should applaud a job well done to Paddon, it's called respect, of which Hyundai is sorely lacking.

[stefanvv]

they are used to win (multiple times this year) and just lost both championships?

Hey statistic, Toyota has 6 victories as manufacturer, Hyundai & M-Sport x 4 (1 shared by Toyota and M-Sport). Tanak and Ogier x 4, Neuville 3. Hyundai are the bottom and clearly in the position of catching up.

[mknight]

Hey statistic, Toyota has 6 victories as manufacturer, Hyundai & M-Sport x 4 (1 shared by Toyota and M-Sport). Tanak and Ogier x 4, Neuville 3. Hyundai are the bottom and clearly in the position of catching up.

How does this counterprove what I wrote? They did win a few times this year and in AUS they lost everything.

[stefanvv]

How does this counterprove what I wrote? They did win a few times this year and in AUS they lost everything.

Your post makes them look like winners, clearly they are the losers (before AUS).

EDIT: They have every obligation to applause Paddon for his work in AUS solely. What they has shown I already know so I'm not disappointed.

[mknight]

Your post makes them look like winners, clearly they are the losers (before AUS).

They were leading the manu champ 3 rallies ago. Doesn't that make them winners/would be winners?

Anyway I did go to watch the moment Paddon crossed the line (didn't remember it from live) and while I still mean they did have a reason to be disappointed it was quite striking how not a single one made any congratulations-like movement. But yeah came with chance for 2 titles, took 0 and didn't win rally. Msport and Toyota each took one and Citroen went there basically without ambitions.

[Toyoda]

They were leading the manu champ 3 rallies ago. Doesn't that make them winners/would be winners?

Anyway I did go to watch the moment Paddon crossed the line (didn't remember it from live) and while I still mean they did have a reason to be disappointed it was quite striking how not a single one made any congratulations-like movement. But yeah came with chance for 2 titles, took 0 and didn't win rally. Msport and Toyota each took one and Citroen went there basically without ambitions.

and I totally get your point, but even a token acknowledgement would have been nice, I actually reckon the live feed was out of sync with the footage from the HQ and Paddon had not finished yet, just seemed to dead in the room.

[stefanvv]

They were leading the manu champ 3 rallies ago. Doesn't that make them winners/would be winners?

75% of the championship is not the whole championship. Tanak & Ogier had their bad rallies mid-season, without those Hyundai would be in the same place like at the end of the year.

[mknight]

and I totally get your point, but even a token acknowledgement would have been nice, I actually reckon the live feed was out of sync with the footage from the HQ and Paddon had not finished yet, just seemed to dead in the room.

Yeah agree after seeing that, also that it looked like they were looking on something else cause there was not a single movement anywhere.

[Mk2 RS2000]

and I totally get your point, but even a token acknowledgement would have been nice, I actually reckon the live feed was out of sync with the footage from the HQ and Paddon had not finished yet, just seemed to dead in the room.

The live feed was synced for the other teams, By the way, go back and look at the similar shots from Turkey. Same reaction at the finish there too.

[sollitt]

... But yeah came with chance for 2 titles, took 0 and didn't win rally. Msport and Toyota each took one and Citroen went there basically without ambitions.I agree with you here. As good a drive as Paddon's was, the mood in HQ wouldn't have been particularly cheery. I'm sure they have conveyed their congratulations when they arrived back to base.
Some of the hysteria that's been whipped up around this issue is ridiculous and surely not helpful to Paddon's cause.

[stefanvv]

I agree with you here. As good a drive as Paddon's was, the mood in HQ wouldn't have been particularly cheery. I'm sure they have conveyed their congratulations when they arrived back to base.
Some of the hysteria that's been whipped up around this issue is ridiculous and surely not helpful to Paddon's cause.

When someone acts as a loser, he always be one.

[Barreis]

if hyundai wants (good) points from every rally, they should give full season to Sordo

[Fast Eddie WRC]

You cant blame them for looking sad...

They lost the Manus title to Tommi's new team (Toyota), after losing to a private team (M-Sport) last year !

Plus Neuville blew the Driver's title when it was the best chance he's ever going to have.

They've been in the WRC for a good while no, spent a fortune... and won nothing.

[racerx1979]

They we're damn close though. We had three teams in it to win it this year. I hope it's the same next year but unfortunately MSport will need a miracle to do the same for 2019.

Toyota seems like they will dominate but this will force Hyundai and Citroen to up their game which is great. Nueville will be a threat again. Ogier will be in a new car and who knows what will happen.

It's part of Motorsport. Nuevilles teammates did not help him in any way this year. Seb deserved his win but his teammates should share some glory in that too. Literally giving away minutes of time to help the Frenchman. Mikkelsen was the worst of the drivers this year. He should move to Ford.. maybe the Fiesta will fit his style.

Hyundai has a lot of work to do. The Korean Japanese rivarly is very strong and I'm sure they will do as much as they can to improve for 2019. Citroen should also be up there. The dark horse is MSport going I to 2019. Suninen and maybe Breen cannot carry them to any victories. Loeb won't be doing them any favors...might just be a year of paying drivers like Turderidis, Greensmith and maybe Camili having a go. Block also wants to do Mexico, Chile, Argentina and Spain. So it was will just be business for Malcom this year.

[dimviii]

"The year looked promising, but at mid-season we lost control of the championship," said Alain Penasse, Hyundai Motorsport's Belgian team manager, Olivier Gaspard's mate. RTBF's special correspondent in Australia In the end, we finished twice in second place, with Thierry at the drivers 'side, and Hyundai Motorsport at the constructors', these are the little details that made the difference. next time we have to go back and get the two world titles, we have our chances, we've proved we're in the game. "

At the microphone RTBF, the Belgian driver spoke Sunday at the end of the Rally Australia his desire to see Hyundai play "tactical" in his favor from the beginning of the season 2019, as M-Sport did with Sébastien Ogier this year, but Alain Penasse does not agree ...

"I do not agree at all with the team game from the start of the season," said the Belgian Hyundai Motorsport team manager, "there are other drivers under contract, and the goal is not to demotivate them in the first race, look at Elfyn Evans at M-Sport, who had to park himself after Sweden, had a very difficult season and only got back on track for the last two races It's true, M-Sport has the title of the drivers with Sebastien Ogier, but I think that we should not go so far in the team instructions.At the end of the season, if we are in position and able to apply it correctly, you have to do it, but not at the first race of the season. "
https://www.rtbf.be/sport/moteurs/rallye/wrc/detail_penasse-des-consignes-d-equipe-des-le-debut-de-la-saison-pas-du-tout-d-accord-avec-ca?id=10076688&utm_source=rtbfsport&utm_campaign=social_share&utm_medium=fb_share&fbclid=IwAR0ZVzDKSgCwwefpCXbuiwlh1ZhqwK-4Tb6WDyr4XTsHkqXXBwgge-0sjKo

[steve.mandzij]

They we're damn close though. We had three teams in it to win it this year. I hope it's the same next year but unfortunately MSport will need a miracle to do the same for 2019.

Toyota seems like they will dominate but this will force Hyundai and Citroen to up their game which is great. Nueville will be a threat again. Ogier will be in a new car and who knows what will happen.

It's part of Motorsport. Nuevilles teammates did not help him in any way this year. Seb deserved his win but his teammates should share some glory in that too. Literally giving away minutes of time to help the Frenchman. Mikkelsen was the worst of the drivers this year. He should move to Ford.. maybe the Fiesta will fit his style.

Hyundai has a lot of work to do. The Korean Japanese rivarly is very strong and I'm sure they will do as much as they can to improve for 2019. Citroen should also be up there. The dark horse is MSport going I to 2019. Suninen and maybe Breen cannot carry them to any victories. Loeb won't be doing them any favors...might just be a year of paying drivers like Turderidis, Greensmith and maybe Camili having a go. Block also wants to do Mexico, Chile, Argentina and Spain. So it was will just be business for Malcom this year.It won't serve as any consolation for the team, but it's unfair to say Hyundai hasn't achieved anything in their four years of WRC. Their early years were tough and quite hopeless, really, but the 2016 i20 was the first car to properly challenge the Polo in it's dominant streak, and they had arguably the best car in 2017. The team's progress has been pretty clear and positive, even if their results don't show it.

What is true though is that 2018 has been pretty laughable for them. The i20 and the Fiesta are really starting to fall back against the Yaris and even the C3 is picking up the pace.

[Japé]

At the microphone RTBF, the Belgian driver spoke Sunday at the end of the Rally Australia his desire to see Hyundai play "tactical" in his favor from the beginning of the season 2019, as M-Sport did with Sébastien Ogier this year, but Alain Penasse does not agree ...

"I do not agree at all with the team game from the start of the season," said the Belgian Hyundai Motorsport team manager, "there are other drivers under contract, and the goal is not to demotivate them in the first race, look at Elfyn Evans at M-Sport, who had to park himself after Sweden, had a very difficult season and only got back on track for the last two races It's true, M-Sport has the title of the drivers with Sebastien Ogier, but I think that we should not go so far in the team instructions.At the end of the season, if we are in position and able to apply it correctly, you have to do it, but not at the first race of the season. "
https://www.rtbf.be/sport/moteurs/rallye/wrc/detail_penasse-des-consignes-d-equipe-des-le-debut-de-la-saison-pas-du-tout-d-accord-avec-ca?id=10076688&utm_source=rtbfsport&utm_campaign=social_share&utm_medium=fb_share&fbclid=IwAR0ZVzDKSgCwwefpCXbuiwlh1ZhqwK-4Tb6WDyr4XTsHkqXXBwgge-0sjKo

If other teams will adapt this "tactical" Ogier / F1 style 'only one driver in team' approach, it surely will be the best way to kill popularity of WRC! Back in the days we used to have up to 4 equally fast drivers in one team that could fight the same rally win without team orders - that should be still real on WRC.

[rp]

If other teams will adapt this "tactical" Ogier / F1 style 'only one driver in team' approach, it surely will be the best way to kill popularity of WRC! Back in the days we used to have up to 4 equally fast drivers in one team that could fight the same rally win without team orders - that should be still real on WRC.

It will be interesting next year to hear what Lappi and Loeb will say, when they have been forced to slow down...

[spiderem]

"I do not agree at all with the team game from the start of the season," said the Belgian Hyundai Motorsport team manager, "there are other drivers under contract, and the goal is not to demotivate them in the first race, look at Elfyn Evans at M-Sport, who had to park himself after Sweden, had a very difficult season and only got back on track for the last two races It's true, M-Sport has the title of the drivers with Sebastien Ogier, but I think that we should not go so far in the team instructions.At the end of the season, if we are in position and able to apply it correctly, you have to do it, but not at the first race of the season. "
https://www.rtbf.be/sport/moteurs/rallye/wrc/detail_penasse-des-consignes-d-equipe-des-le-debut-de-la-saison-pas-du-tout-d-accord-avec-ca?id=10076688&utm_source=rtbfsport&utm_campaign=social_share&utm_medium=fb_share&fbclid=IwAR0ZVzDKSgCwwefpCXbuiwlh1ZhqwK-4Tb6WDyr4XTsHkqXXBwgge-0sjKo[/QUOTE]

LOL. sorry sunshine but this is real world, no disneyland. So you may think it's not ethical, but at the end of the day the shareholders want titles, nothing else.

[sollitt]

LOL. sorry sunshine but this is real world, no disneyland. So you may think it's not ethical, but at the end of the day the shareholders want titles, nothing else.

In this instance I agree with Penasse. There's no point having 3 horses in the race and only feeding one.

[GravelBen]

LOL. sorry sunshine but this is real world, no disneyland. So you may think it's not ethical, but at the end of the day the shareholders want titles, nothing else.

I don't think shareholders want titles if they come at the expense of the popularity and perceived integrity of the team ;)

[stefanvv]

Hyundai with best team spirit, joke of the year:D

[AL14]

What tactics? Neuville had comfortable lead at mid year. He lost the championship because of him, not because of Evans. He should think less to percentages and tactics and more on being less arrogant and play his game bravely.
That's what a leader do, and that's how Ogier earned that kind of status on M-Sport.
I don't wanna be too rude since after all Neuville has been a great driver last years, after a bad moment. But if the first thing Neuville said after his defeat is that and not "I will work on improve the way I manage a favorable situation because that made me lose two championships with a better car" then he really is hopeless.

[er88]

The really unlucky retirement in Turkey cost Neuville a huge amount of points, but it was still in his hands. The stupid mistake in Wales however cost him what could have been a win, certainly at least a Podium. Two poor back-to-back events that you just can't afford to have at that stage of the season.

Hyundai have to look at themselves first before crying about Msport, but they're still a proper team and have a good car. No need for anyone to get too hysterical just because they narrowly missed out. It's fine fine margins and it's great to see they're committed long term.

[GravelBen]

The really unlucky retirement in Turkey cost Neuville a huge amount of points, but it was still in his hands.

You can call it unlucky and maybe it was, but they knew the rough roads were going to be hard on the cars - his team-mate drove a strategic rally to look after the car and finished on the podium as a result. You might not make your own luck completely, but you can certainly contribute to it.

Agreed about the fine margins and no need to panic though - often its just a few key moments that make the difference.

[dupanton]

You can call it unlucky and maybe it was, but they knew the rough roads were going to be hard on the cars - his team-mate drove a strategic rally to look after the car and finished on the podium as a result. You might not make your own luck completely, but you can certainly contribute to it.

Agreed about the fine margins and no need to panic though - often its just a few key moments that make the difference.

It was a mistake by a mechanic. They changed the complete suspension on Friday evening but 1 mechanic forgot to tighten something. That is why it broke.
So definitely nothing he could do about it...

[Allez Andruet]

I wonder what's happening at Hyundai... First there were all these rumors about the imminent driver announcements, but nothing happened. During Rally Australia it seemed obvious that Paddon was truly in the dark about his position in the team in 2019. One might guess that means he's out - if he was about to stay, the team surely would have let him know that before the last rally of the season. Could it be possible that the Koreans have gone apeshit for once again losing the bid for both titles, and are demanding some changes in the team (i.e. more dramatic changes than just bringing Huttunen in for few rallies)? I still don't believe in that scenario where Paddon would be let off in favor of Sordo and Huttunen sharing the third car. Could Hyundai have a genuine wildcard in their sleeve?

[AnttiL]

What do they have available? Evans, Østberg and Breen aren't really better than any of their current drivers, assuming the car has issues with most drivers other than Neuville. Will they throw enough money to get Loeb to fill in for what they're lacking in on tarmac pace?

[Allez Andruet]

What do they have available? Evans, Østberg and Breen aren't really better than any of their current drivers, assuming the car has issues with most drivers other than Neuville.
Good question. Driver market is quite flat at the moment. Le Maestro is obviously out and any of the trio of Evans, Östberg and Breen isn't exactly what the team needs. Maybe Evans would have the best shot out of these three, but is hardly an upgrade from Paddon. Talking about wildcards, that one Swede still isn't under any contract for next year...?

[GravelBen]

It was a mistake by a mechanic. They changed the complete suspension on Friday evening but 1 mechanic forgot to tighten something. That is why it broke.
So definitely nothing he could do about it...

Really? Thats the first time I've heard that explanation anywhere, did it come from a team source or just rumour? Not saying you're wrong, I might have just missed it but curious as I never heard it anywhere else.

[AnttiL]

Talking about wildcards, that one Swede still isn't under any contract for next year...?

Would Tidemand be an upgrade on Mikkelsen? He would need at least a full season to learn the WRC car and when they drove Skodas, Mikkelsen was clearly faster. And at the same time the team already has a youngster in the development, being invested on...

[dupanton]

Really? Thats the first time I've heard that explanation anywhere, did it come from a team source or just rumour? Not saying you're wrong, I might have just missed it but curious as I never heard it anywhere else.

A team source, 100% reliable ;)

[Allez Andruet]

Would Tidemand be an upgrade on Mikkelsen?
Most definitely not.

Any kind of "guaranteed fix" surely isn't available, but I still think it's possible we'll see some drastic changes. In somewhat similar fashion than we saw earlier this year when Meeke got sacked. Ofcourse Hyundai doesn't have a "Meeke" to put all the blame on, but after five years without a single title, I wouldn't be surprised if something had to change. Will it make the team perform any better? Maybe not. But like in any corporate business, if you're not meeting your targets, you better have a corrective action plan to present to people above you in the organization. It could be close to that kind of situation at Hyundai. Let's see.

[AnttiL]

I think they should just do more testing and try to find settings that work for other drivers than Neuville. It's interesting that Paddon is considered slow on tarmac but maybe he's just slow on tarmac on a Hyundai, like Mikkelsen?

[Zeakiwi]

I imagine the accountants at Hyundai HQ will be looking for places the budget can be trimmed.
A team of village dog drivers? https://youtu.be/chrzpnL1OEM (dogs trained to drive) Rhorl used say he could train a monkey to drive a quattro.
https://phys.org/news/2018-10-hyundai-q3-profit-plummets-sales.html

[AL14]

I think they should just do more testing and try to find settings that work for other drivers than Neuville. It's interesting that Paddon is considered slow on tarmac but maybe he's just slow on tarmac on a Hyundai, like Mikkelsen?

Paddon is historically slow on tarmac. It's his biggest limit, I don't know how much margin of improvement he has but not participating on tarmac rallys will not help for sure.
I remember Latvala in his early days was nowhere in the pace on tarmac but in the second part of his career he managed to be competitive, even against Ogier, and win a couple of rallys.
I'm sure that Paddon with a right car, a right mindset and a bit more speed on tarmac is still a threat.
Agree with you about setting the car also to other drivers but we don't really know how much that's really the case, I mean, did they really don't listen to Paddon/Mikkelsen/Sordo and their feedback in tests and on development of the car?

[tommeke_B]

I remember the last time I saw Paddon on tarmac, it was Catalunya 2016. I think his pace was good there, too good to call him "historically slow on tarmac".

[denkimi]

All hyundai needed to do was hire ogier. If you can't beat someone, make him join you.

Imagine a team with ogier, neuville and mikkelsen. They would have the constructors title surely in the bag, and 66% chance on getting the drivers title too.

[Essaj]

All hyundai needed to do was hire ogier. If you can't beat someone, make him join you.

Imagine a team with ogier, neuville and mikkelsen. They would have the constructors title surely in the bag, and 66% chance on getting the drivers title too.

Should have just gotten Tanak aswell just to be sure

[AL14]

I remember the last time I saw Paddon on tarmac, it was Catalunya 2016. I think his pace was good there, too good to call him "historically slow on tarmac".

It's clear that when I say "slow", I mean it in comparison to the top guys like Ogier, Tanak etc.... not in general...

[GravelBen]

I remember the last time I saw Paddon on tarmac, it was Catalunya 2016. I think his pace was good there, too good to call him "historically slow on tarmac".

Most of his WRC tarmac results have been 5th-6th, so not competing for wins but still collecting points. Which I think isn't bad considering you can almost count on your fingers the number of tarmac rallies he has done in his whole career (total over all classes not just WRC, NZ doesn't really have any tarmac rallies so he had done no tarmac before PWRC etc). Think he just needs more tarmac experience and seat time to move from that level to challenging for podiums.

[AnttiL]

Most of his WRC tarmac results have been 5th-6th, so not competing for wins but still collecting points. Which I think isn't bad considering you can almost count on your fingers the number of tarmac rallies he has done in his whole career (total over all classes not just WRC, NZ doesn't really have any tarmac rallies so he had done no tarmac before PWRC etc). Think he just needs more tarmac experience and seat time to move from that level to challenging for podiums.

Let's look closer:

Deutschland 2017: 8th overall. 0.88s/km from the winner, slowest works WRC, two punctures
Corsica 2017: 6th overall. 0.43s/km from the winner, slowest works WRC, an overshoot on the last stage, no other issues.

and compare to Mikkelsen:

Deutschland 2018: 6th overall. 0.44s/km from the winner, only faster than Breen out of works WRC and only thanks to Breen's mistake. No issues.
Corsica 2018: 7th overall. 0.49s/km from the winner, slowest works WRC. A brief excursion into a ditch, no other issues.

[tommeke_B]

This comparison is just ridiculous and pointless...

[Fast Eddie WRC]

In this instance I agree with Penasse. There's no point having 3 horses in the race and only feeding one.

When that one is the 5-time Champion and the team-mates only gained places only by virtue of their start position then its different. Evans and Suninen were never faster on an equal road.

M-Sport were smarter and that's also part of motorsport. They knew defending the Manu's title was impossible so gave Ogier full assistance.

Hyundai need to learn if they ever want to win a title.

[racerx1979]

It was more an act of desperation maybe. Malcom knows the team will be crap in 2019 unless they get a top driver. It will be a boring year for MSport fans unless they get Loeb which will not happen. I can already hear the tone of the WRC commentators... Sad bunch

[denkimi]

Most of his WRC tarmac results have been 5th-6th, so not competing for wins but still collecting points. Which I think isn't bad considering you can almost count on your fingers the number of tarmac rallies he has done in his whole career (total over all classes not just WRC, NZ doesn't really have any tarmac rallies so he had done no tarmac before PWRC etc). Think he just needs more tarmac experience and seat time to move from that level to challenging for podiums.
Say there are 10 or 11 factory drivers, and about half of them runs into mayor issues each rally.

[AnttiL]

This comparison is just ridiculous and pointless...

why?

[tommeke_B]

why?
Why would it make sense in your opinion? You include what fits you to prove what? Mikkelsen is at a later stage in his career, with far more experience than Paddon, and even then you compare Mikkelsen'18 to Paddon'17, which adds another year to the difference in experience. Oh, by the way, you didn't include the tarmac-stages from Catalunya this year, where Mikkelsen lost +-0,75s/km.

If you really want to play with numbers and figures, Paddon ended up with 73 points doing only 7 events, while Mikkelsen scored 84 points doing 13 rallies.... Mikkelsen's season was a huge disappointment.

[AnttiL]

Why would it make sense in your opinion? You include what fits you to prove what?'

Oh, by the way, you didn't include the tarmac-stages from Catalunya this year, where Mikkelsen lost +-0,75s/km.

I only wanted to compare the rallies both did in the same cars. My point wasn't to say that Paddon sucks or Mikkelsen sucks, but to just say the tarmac levels of these drivers in this car are surprisingly similar. Another point in the numbers was to show that the overall result in a rally doesn't give everything about your pace. You could end 5th or 10th being as slow in relative to the winner.



Mikkelsen is at a later stage in his career, with far more experience than Paddon, and even then you compare Mikkelsen'18 to Paddon'17, which adds another year to the difference in experience.

This is just nonsense (although Mikkelsen has more WRC starts), but Paddon isn't a rookie really...

EDIT: Especially in terms of WRC2017 cars, Paddon has more starts.



If you really want to play with numbers and figures, Paddon ended up with 73 points doing only 7 events, while Mikkelsen scored 84 points doing 13 rallies.... Mikkelsen's season was a huge disappointment.
I know. Mikkelsen retired from good positions in Argentina, Portugal and Sardegna, and suffered of the tractor in Australia, whereas Paddon had a good starting position at each gravel rally and didn't have to do the tarmac rallies where he's not so good at. But it was not my point to compare their performances this year.

[SubaruNorway]

Article about Mikkelsen's season, don't think I've ever read something this revealing...
Also mentions mechanic was at fault for driveshaft issues in Turkey since some bolts where missing.


https://parcferme.no/rally/apenhjertig-andreas-gir-et-detaljert-innblikk-i-hvorfor-ting-har-sviktet/
Hopefully it makes sense in your own language.

English:
https://translate.google.no/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=no&ie=UTF-8&u=https%3A%2F%2Fparcferme.no%2Frally%2Fapenhjertig-andreas-gir-et-detaljert-innblikk-i-hvorfor-ting-har-sviktet%2F&edit-text=

[AnttiL]

Thanks, a great read. I also forgot Turkey from my previous post. Mikkelsen could have won that rally.

BTW the Norwegian link does not work. Seems to have some English in the URL

[Mk2 RS2000]

An interesting article that pretty much sums up the Hyundai season, a view one would suspect that is also shared by the Board of Hyundai Motorsports division of the company. How Team Management reacts to this is the point of interest for the future.

https://www.driven.co.nz/news/motorsport/hyundai-s-failed-wrc-challenge-highlights-hayden-paddon-s-value/?fbclid=IwAR1Y76z01if0REeoZFMd5qmC8UT0dftpjkJ2dfI0 xqZPZnue7YY1MQr4jMU

[Grutz]

After reading the 2 articles above, I reflect on the attitude of Mikkelsen. He seems like a beaten up man! I think he can turn it around but if I was management at Hyundai WRT I definitely would be reviewing next years driver line up. I have said it before but I would Give Nueville 14 starts (whole season) Paddon 10 starts (No Monte, Corsica, Germany, Spain). Mikkelsen 10 starts (No Portugal, Argentina, Mexico, Sardinia), Sordo 8 Starts (No Sweden, Finland, Chile, GB, Turkey, Australia).

That will give Mikkelsen a chance to get his Mojo back but also give Paddon a chance to prove wether he his worthy of a full season (I actually think he is but trying not to be too biased). But hey, Paddon is not signed yet so he just might completely miss out if managment wants a bit more of a refresh.

[Grutz]

There could also be management changes at Hyundai as the Koreans may want some blood for all their investment that has yet to realise any championships!

[jonkka]

So, Mikkelsen's Rally Australia was his 100th WRC start and Hyundai didn't commemorate it at all?

[GigiGalliNo1]

Nor did they smile when Paddon finished the powerstage and on the podium, live on TV

[Marcco]

My thoughts about Hyunday. I think their weak spot is that they have too many drivers. I guess it’s hard to make a car/setup that works for 4 drivers. And even if it would, there are only 3 cars and not all of them can do full season, which affects their form/confidence.
I think they should dump Sordo. I know, he had good results this season, but you need to sacrifice something for better future. In long term I think it is better to put some effort to figure out why Mikklesen is not performing well and fix that. Same goes for Paddon, give him full season, take steps to make the car work for him and I believe it would work out.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Rumour is the opposite, that they will only have Neuville doing all events and rotate the other 3 drivers, maybe even 4 with Loeb !

[T16]

Rumour is the opposite, that they will only have Neuville doing all events and rotate the other 3 drivers, maybe even 4 with Loeb !

Where is that rumour from Eddie?

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Where is that rumour from Eddie?

Colin Clark.

[rallyfiend]

Colin Clark.

If it comes from COlin Clark, it's not a rumour, it's just ramblings of a narcissistic actor.

Given that he attends every single event, his lack of knowledge or insight in to whats going on shows just how much people in the service park don't talk to him....

[T16]

Colin Clark.

Isn’t that just speculation though?

[T16]

If it comes from COlin Clark, it's not a rumour, it's just ramblings of a narcissistic actor.

Given that he attends every single event, his lack of knowledge or insight in to whats going on shows just how much people in the service park don't talk to him....

Got a feeling he won’t be anywhere near the WRC team next year anyway.

[BobJones]

Hold on.

Colin Clark isn't predicting Loeb to Hyundai, he's just saying it would be good and that in his mind Hyundai needs him. But he's definitely not saying that contact has been made, negotiations are on-going or that it will happen.

What doesn't help is forum members misinterpreting what he's saying, posting to here and then a flock of Clark-deniers jumping on a bashing bandwagon.

[T16]

Hold on.

Colin Clark isn't predicting Loeb to Hyundai, he's just saying it would be good and that in his mind Hyundai needs him. But he's definitely not saying that contact has been made, negotiations are on-going or that it will happen.

What doesn't help is forum members misinterpreting what he's saying, posting to here and then a flock of Clark-deniers jumping on a bashing bandwagon.

Fair point, but it doesn't change that he still talks a lot of crap.

[AnttiL]

Fair point, but it doesn't change that he still talks a lot of crap.

And we don't talk any crap at all on this forum? :D

[T16]

And we don't talk any crap at all on this forum? :D

Not as much as Clarke.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

As Hyundai havent confirmed any F/T drive for anyone but Neuville -and Sordo supposedly has P/T role - remaining driver rotation would seem very plausible.

[er88]

Loeb has signed for Hyundai according to David Evans. Article in autosport

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/140632/loeb-signs-hyundai-wrc-deal-for-2019

[er88]

So Mikkelsen, Sordo, Loeb and Paddon all rotating? Or Paddon out?

Think it's harsh on Paddon if he's binned totally tbh

[AnttiL]

Quite a big story, quite silly season!

However, I'm still puzzled about how they will rotate the drivers. Will Loeb set Mikkelsen aside in the tarmac rallies? Who will do Sweden and Finland in the third car which Sordo doesn't like, and Loeb has said he doesn't want to do anymore? Paddon? Huttunen?

[T16]

Quite a big story, quite silly season!

However, I'm still puzzled about how they will rotate the drivers. Will Loeb set Mikkelsen aside in the tarmac rallies? Who will do Sweden and Finland in the third car which Sordo doesn't like, and Loeb has said he doesn't want to do anymore? Paddon? Huttunen?

I think Loeb's mind may have changed when the RX program was pulled. He's got a lot of spare time and he's, very much, tasted the sweetness of victory again. Full season.

[EstWRC]

wow, Hyundai is finally pissed off that they havent won something, took only 5 years.

[er88]

Mikkelsen will be a lucky boy if he's managed to keep a full season drive next year. Surely he hasn't?

[AnttiL]

I think Loeb's mind may have changed when the RX program was pulled. He's got a lot of spare time and he's, very much, tasted the sweetness of victory again. Full season.

I think Hyundai already said they will enter Neuville-Mikkelsen-Sordo to Monte.

[T16]

I think Hyundai already said they will enter Neuville-Mikkelsen-Sordo to Monte.

You know what, I got carried away - he's in Dakar until too late anyway..

[dupanton]

Maybe he will do WRX with Hyundai too?

[Tarmop]

Probably one argument yes, he was/is interested in that series, he wanted to run a private 208...but they were asking too much for the car i believe.

[AL14]

My opinion will be unpopular but imho if that's true both Hyundai and Loeb made a mistake.

E. But I am very bad when I have to predict something, so it should be a good deal. :D

[AnttiL]

My opinion will be unpopular but imho if that's true both Hyundai and Loeb made a mistake.

Can you explain that further? I think it's a win-win situation. Loeb gets some WRC drives (which Citroen couldn't offer, nor would Toyota, not to mention M-Sport) and Hyundai gets crucial support in winning the manufacturers title.

[AL14]

Can you explain that further? I think it's a win-win situation. Loeb gets some WRC drives (which Citroen couldn't offer, nor would Toyota, not to mention M-Sport) and Hyundai gets crucial support in winning the manufacturers title.

Ok, I've read it the article better and before I tought Loeb signed I full year deal. Now I'm understanding that it's not like that and I change my mind on Loeb's side. It's good for him.
But I still don't know if it is good for Hyundai, imho I would have saved the spots to try to raise a future champion, or to recover Paddon or to bet on some other driver. I actually would have taken Ogier before he signed with Citroen and before he signed with M-Sport back then.

Loeb is good low-term but even if he is a legend and the best of all times he's not as fast as he was in his days.

[AnttiL]

But I still don't know if it is good for Hyundai, imho I would have saved the spots to try to raise a future champion, or to recover Paddon or to bet on some other driver.

I think Paddon has been given enough of chances to show what he can do, and Huttunen is their future champion in the making, but not still ready to help them win the manufacturer championship. Also, in Loeb they get a brilliant tarmac driver, something their team is lacking on (in addition to Neuville).

I actually would have taken Ogier before he signed with Citroen and before he signed with M-Sport back then.

At this moment it's just if's and would's.


Loeb is good low-term but even if he is a legend and the best of all times he's not as fast as he was in his days.

He can still win rallies, I think that's enough.

[AL14]

At this moment it's just if's and would's.

I agree, but in my (partial) defence I said it when it was the time as well! :)



He can still win rallies, I think that's enough.

To me not, since a good winning team doesn't think low-term but mid-long term.

[T16]

To me not, since a good winning team doesn't think low-term but mid-long term.[/QUOTE]

M-Sport weren’t exactly thinking mid or long term when they signed Ogier and we all know how that story went.

[AL14]

M-Sport weren’t exactly thinking mid or long term when they signed Ogier and we all know how that story went.

Ogier is completely different case. He is at the peak of his career, the best out there and if you are not too much unlucky he will give you the driver championship title. There is not long term or low term discussion.

[Tarmop]

They`ve been in the championship for 5 seasons now, spent a load of money and are still without any titles- what makes it worse, lost them to a private team with the smallest budget and another big Asian manuf. on their 2. year back. Even if it`s short term, other options are even shorter ( stepping down from the series).

[Rallyper]

To me it´s absolutely clear Huyndai should write Mikkelsen off. Or give him Huttunen under his wings in a two car WRC2 team 2019.

Then go on with Neuville-Loeb-Paddon. And Sordo for some rallies.

[T16]

Ogier is completely different case. He is at the peak of his career, the best out there and if you are not too much unlucky he will give you the driver championship title. There is not long term or low term discussion.

I guess if Loeb beats Neuville on most rounds then we will see if he's past it or not. I don't think they have done this because they feel sorry for him. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he goes for another championship. He's certainly not going to sign up with them to drop a position to let TN past... no way.

[able1]

To me it´s absolutely clear Huyndai should write Mikkelsen off. Or give him Huttunen under his wings in a two car WRC2 team 2019.

Then go on with Neuville-Loeb-Paddon. And Sordo for some rallies.

Hyundai is not the car for Mikkelsen, he did good in VW , only reasonable move for him is Msport. Hyundai is worst team out of the four (performance wise), only Neuville can drive it well.

[AL14]

I guess if Loeb beats Neuville on most rounds then we will see if he's past it or not. I don't think they have done this because they feel sorry for him. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he goes for another championship. He's certainly not going to sign up with them to drop a position to let TN past... no way.

He will not go to any championship, he will miss Monte, he has not a full year contract and honestly, even if I think he is the best of all time, he's not at the same level he was 10 years ago.

[Sulland]

Hyundai is not the car for Mikkelsen, he did good in VW , only reasonable move for him is Msport. Hyundai is worst team out of the four (performance wise), only Neuville can drive it well.

Any development on the i20 for 19, that might give Andreas back the good feeling?

if not;
Pay him out of his contract, so he can go to be lead at Ford.
Even if he has contracted full seson for Hyundai!

[able1]

I guess if Loeb beats Neuville on most rounds then we will see if he's past it or not. I don't think they have done this because they feel sorry for him. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he goes for another championship. He's certainly not going to sign up with them to drop a position to let TN past... no way.

Loeb cannot beat Neuville on most rounds because he will not drive most rounds , Loeb will do 3-4 rounds max

[SubaruNorway]

Or a proper relation to an(other) engineer

Being overrun by the team/ex F1 engineer has been an issue i understand.

Colin Clark must be giggling his ass off by the people who mocked him on here the other day with Loeb actually going to Hyundai now it seems.

[T16]

Loeb cannot beat Neuville on most rounds because he will not drive most rounds , Loeb will do 3-4 rounds max

How are you so sure that his contract is for 3-4 rounds max? I thought they were releasing details tomorrow?>

[Rallyper]

I guess if Loeb beats Neuville on most rounds then we will see if he's past it or not. I don't think they have done this because they feel sorry for him. I wouldn't be surprised at all if he goes for another championship. He's certainly not going to sign up with them to drop a position to let TN past... no way.

He doesn´t need to beat Neuville. It´s not that kind of contract. I´d rather say he´s the one who will help TN get the title if possible. The others in Huyndai didn´t make it.

[able1]

How are you so sure that his contract is for 3-4 rounds max? I thought they were releasing details tomorrow?>

3-4 rounds is an estimate (my estimate) , he has said it so many times that he will not come back full time.

[T16]

He doesn´t need to beat Neuville. It´s not that kind of contract. I´d rather say he´s the one who will help TN get the title if possible. The others in Huyndai didn´t make it.

Do you really think, if he has a sniff of victory, he will roll over and let Neuville win? I just can't see it happening. I think they have hired him to let him do his thing, which is winning.

[T16]

3-4 rounds is an estimate (my estimate) , he has said it so many times that he will not come back full time.

Yeah, I get that, and I appreciate I might be living in hope, but I just think things will have changed in his mind now he's dropping ten (is it ten?) RX rounds... and because of the feeling he got when he won again. I guess we'll see tomorrow.

[wia5958]

So i can imagine it will go something like this at hyundai this year. Paddon huttenen in wrc2 pro keep paddon match fit and step him back up to full wrc program 2020. Neuville full season. Loeb in for mikkelson on tarmac rounds leaving loeb neuville sordo. Thats a strong tarmac lineup. And sordo/loeb to alternate some gravel events ones sordo isnt so strong on. And possibly sweden

[deephouse]

Loeb is capable of winning straight away. You all could argue here but he showed in a pretty much unpredictable car even for him. He will not only help Neuville or the manu title, but he will help in development and make that car fast on tarmac and gravel too. He is no just average person but he have many years of experience on that level. What profit he could also have is WRX. He could help develop cars there too and be more competitive since PSA is nothing but a cheapstake. Mikkelsen, OK I don't know what is with him or with his car. But if he will continue like that he will be out of the team but then will be #roadtowrc really hard to achieve again. I don't know but everytime that driver needs to show what they can achieve they could do amazing things but when they re signed for a long term they fall back.

[Gregor-y]

I'm okay with his. Subaru had veterans like Vatanen, Alen, Kankkunen and even Makinen to support the team's main drivers. And Loeb's proven he can still win, let alone bring the points and attention. The biggest surprise is that I think he's properly outside the PSA realm for the first time.

That makes Jean Ragnotti the rally Highlander, where there can be only one (manufacturer).

[Fast Eddie WRC]

It's clear to me that Loeb is going there 100% to help them win the Manu's title. They want that really badly after all the money they've invested over the years. If Loeb beats Neuville at times, that's just tough.

[Rally Power]

Loeb has signed for Hyundai according to David Evans. Article in autosport
https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/140632/loeb-signs-hyundai-wrc-deal-for-2019

Great news for Hyundai and the WRC; 2019 will be a heck of a season!


To me it´s absolutely clear Huyndai should write Mikkelsen off.

Drivers have ups and downs, like everybody; if firing them after a bad season was the norm, probably Ogier would be the only still driving.

[able1]

Great news for Hyundai and the WRC; 2019 will be a heck of a season!



Drivers have ups and downs, like everybody; if firing them after a bad season was the norm, probably Ogier would be the only still driving.

i agree . Tanak had several very poor seasons and look at him now.

[Tarmop]

Although he was an unexperienced paying or semi-paying driver in a private operation, not a multiple rally winner and (former) podium contender in a team with the biggest-2. biggest budget fighting for the title. Hyundai offered him 6 rally`s at the end of his DMack WRC season, that should be an indicator between the difference of full-manu vs semi-manu.

[Myrvold]

Yeah, I get that, and I appreciate I might be living in hope, but I just think things will have changed in his mind now he's dropping ten (is it ten?) RX rounds... and because of the feeling he got when he won again. I guess we'll see tomorrow.

Nope, he's always repeated that the reason he stopped rallying full time, is still there, and it's rather unlikely it will ever change.

I guess, if for some reason we go down to 8-10 rallies a year, he might be considering a full season comeback. Well, depending on the amount of testing.

[Tarmop]

He and Elena probably remind themselves of their age. One thing is being able mentally and skill-wise, but being able physically to do all the 14 rounds is another story. Around that time, when Elena posted his "bye-bye" tweet, he also referred to his physical capabilities i believe.

[T16]

[QUOTE=Myrvold;1202131]Nope, he's always repeated that the reason he stopped rallying full time, is still there, and it's rather unlikely it will ever change.

Has he said this since Peugeot pulled out of RX though? (I’m not arguing that he hasn’t - I genuinely don’t know).. do you?

[Myrvold]

Has he said this since Peugeot pulled out of RX though? (I’m not arguing that he hasn’t - I genuinely don’t know).. do you?

No, but it's not down to what other things he are able to drive. As I've understood it, it's the whole commitment of a long WRC season, with all the testing, travelling, pre-work etc.

[nafpaktos]

What is the reason for not official confirmation neither from Hyundai nor from Loeb????????????

[Jewy46]

Didn't see this one coming! Had seen the rumours but didn't believe it would happen. Well done to Hyundai for pulling off a master stroke.

Does anyone else think that this is further evidence of the lack of good atmosphere and team management within Citroen. I believe Loeb never really wanted to leave the PSA group but when he saw that he wasn't going to get a drive after delivering their only rally win last year, he thought to himself f**k this and lost his loyalty. Just my 2 cents, I know that's how I would feel.

Also I think he felt he could win in the Hyundai after doing so in an inferior C3.

[AnttiL]

https://www.rallit.fi/gronholm-valimiehena-loebin-huhutussa-diilissa-sanoin-heille-katsokaa-etta-loeb-tulee-meidankin-autoon/

Grönholm says he gave Loeb's number to Hyundai and asked them to make sure Loeb will use his WRX cars.

https://www.rallit.fi/suomalaislupaus-pikakommenuksella-wrc-testiin-mutta-tulevaisuus-auki-tilanne-naytti-hyvalta/

Then on this article Grönholm regrets giving that number because he has realized it's not good for Huttunen's future - if the team needs to win a title, there's no resources for giving drives to a junior. Although, it's mentioned that Huttunen had a WRC test on Wednesday

[T16]

Two year contract too:

https://motorsport.hyundai.com/wrc-line-up-fine-tuned-for-2019/

[nafpaktos]

Sébastien Loeb
13 mins ·

When Passion (re) takes over on reason ☺️

After Peugeot Sport's decision to withdraw from FIA World Rallycross Championship and the withdrawal of a major sponsor from Citroën Racing don't allow them to be able to align a 3th car in WRC, no more Option was offered to me with the PSA group and so I had to bounce quickly to stay in the race ��

It was out of the question for me to take my sports retreat and my thirst for victory and new challenges being still intact, I could not refuse the proposal of Hyundai Motorsport, with 6 SLEEVES IN WRC IN 2019 And maybe other equally exciting challenges to come ��

Their project seduced me, with a team and a car that will allow me, I am sure, to be able to fight at the outposts and try to get a 80th win in wrc with Daniel Elena ��

It was with a huge emotion that it had to say goodbye to all the teams of citroën racing and Peugeot sport with whom I built my career and thanks to whom, I became the pilot and the man I am today ����

And finally thank you all for being always so many and faithful to carry us, to Daniel and to me, as much affection and support ����

Stay tuned, I'll tell you advantage in my next chronicle about the events of recent weeks, the reasons for this choice and over the months to come ��

Seb.

[jparker]

I wonder what could have happened in the last 2 years if Malcolm Wilson led Hyundai, and Nandan led M-Sport.

[N.O.T]

I wonder what could have happened in the last 2 years if Malcolm Wilson led Hyundai, and Nandan led M-Sport.

Nandan is an employee... Wilson OWNS m-sport

[Rallyper]

These news will raise the value of WRC 2019. That´s for sure!!

[Allez Andruet]

How should it be read that Huttunen isn't even mentioned on the press release?

[denkimi]

citroen must really have fucked up to chase away loeb.

[tommeke_B]

citroen must really have fucked up to chase away loeb.

Maybe it was part of Ogier's contract? ;)

[T16]

citroen must really have fucked up to chase away loeb.


They don't have the budget and maybe another Seb wasn't too happy (especially given Loeb's win in Spain).

[Mirek]

Maybe it was part of Ogier's contract? ;)

In that case it would be interesting and a symbolical dot at the end of a circle which started many years a go...


They don't have the budget and maybe another Seb wasn't too happy (especially given Loeb's win in Spain).

Seb said they didn't offer him anything.

[jparker]

Nandan is an employee... Wilson OWNS m-sport
Ok fine, but still....

[dimviii]

Seb said they didn't offer him anything.

but they were talking with Loeb as Budar said.

[dimviii]

Daniel Elena
41min ·
I'll go wherever you go, no matter where the place is

Hyundai Motorsport management with Sébastien Loeb for 6 WRC races from 2019

Citroën Racing and Peugeot Sport, M-E-R-C-I for all these incredible years I will never forget you

PS: Do not worry, I already learned to say 'drink' in Korean: Masieo

[Allez Andruet]

https://twitter.com/RallySweden/status/1073207151819153408

1693

Vad fan? So Loeb is doing Sweden then?

[AnttiL]

https://twitter.com/RallySweden/status/1073207151819153408

1693

Vad fan? So Loeb is doing Sweden then?

Yeah, Sordo's season starts from Mexico

[BigWorm]

Translated from Sordo's Instagram:


Happy to be able to announce that next year I will be in 8 races of wrc 2019 with Hyundai. The tests were more or less defined but the arrival of Loeb has meant that we have some changes but the number of races remain the same, 8. The participation in the Monte Carlo rally was fixed until today ... but now it seems that it will be Mr. Loeb with Neuville and Mikkelsen who will defend the colors of Hyundai on an asphalt rally. We will look forward to the rally in Mexico where both Carlos del Barrio and I will be ready to fight for victory. Greetings to all and see you next year

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Neuville:
Welcome to the @HMSGOfficial team @SebastienLoeb and @DanosElena and happy to count @DaniSordo and @CarlosdelBarrio with us again next year! Strong team to fight for the manufacturer and driver titles in 2019 ����
#WRC #TN https://t.co/QimT7xJ2Bp

I see he puts the two Championships in order...

[TypeR]

How should it be read that Huttunen isn't even mentioned on the press release?
In my opinion Huttunen should drive in WRC2 for next 1-2 years before thinking about WRC.. didn't show anything special in 2018 to get a seat in WRC.

[Ds3]

Goodbye Newville, Goodbye dreams ...
Run at M-Sport while there's room ...
Loeb has never been a team player, he's greedy ...

[EstWRC]

are you going to make that petition or public protest now ?

[mknight]

In my opinion Huttunen should drive in WRC2 for next 1-2 years before thinking about WRC.. didn't show anything special in 2018 to get a seat in WRC.
Agree one more R5 season is totally fine. 2018 was his first.

For both Neuville and Mikkelsen this is good news Loeb will certainly help with car development. And no he wont run full season, it's about (free) time, travel and not needeing to prove anything. Which means he is no threat to Neuville for a seat even if he beats him. For Sordo it's not so good news, since Loeb wants tarmac rallies and already got him out of Monte. For Paddon it's terrible news.

[racerx1979]

So Danny does 8 events and Loeb 6. Paddon is out unless they run a 4th car considering Mikkelsen and Nueville are doing a full season. Sucks for Hayden.

[dimviii]

After the announcement of Sebastien Loeb's commitment for 6 WRC rallies in 2019, we are rubbing our hands at Hyundai. "Sébastien Loeb ran a few WRC rallies last year," said Alain Penasse, Hyundai Motorsport team manager. "With talent, he still won the Rally of Catalonia this season, and we were very interested in it, so when Peugeot Sport's announcement came out, we immediately contacted him." It was not an easy deal but we are very happy to welcome him to the team and our goal is obviously to win the title of world champion builders in 2019. "


Sébastien Loeb will quickly integrate the team. And will amblée aligned on the first rally, Monte Carlo. He will only ride 6 races. It's his own decision. And that suits Hyundai Motorsport well. "We already had verbal agreements with the other drivers, and it would have been difficult for us to negotiate his presence on more than 6 rallies, so his wishes are good for us."

The arrival of Loeb also seems to please the other drivers of the team, who can enjoy his experience. "Thierry Neuville is very happy to have someone of Sébastien Loeb's caliber at his side, as is Dani Sordo, who has worked with Loeb for 4 years and has forged ties of friendship with him. Everyone knows we will be able to benefit from their expertise in the team. "

As to whether, despite his stature, Loeb will serve Neuville when the time comes, Alain Penasse proposes to wait: "For that, we'll see.Each walk begins with a first step.But what is certain it is that Thierry Neuville, even if he is already experienced, will always be able to learn from contact with the world's nine-time world champion Thierry Neuville was also quite positive after the announcement of the arrival of the Frenchman.He knows very well what it can bring him."

And then humanly it can stick. "All the drivers we have on the team are easy people, Sébastien Loeb is someone who knows what he wants, it's true, but it's not complicated at all. the marriage with the other pilots will be done without too much problem. "

And Alain Penasse concludes: "The arrival of Loeb is a good marketing move for Hyundai, but it's also a good sporting coup."

https://www.rtbf.be/sport/moteurs/rallye/wrc/detail_alain-penasse-neuville-est-tres-content-d-avoir-quelqu-un-du-calibre-de-loeb-a-ses-cotes?id=10097516

[deephouse]

They still have discussion with Paddon about what to do in 2019. I think he will get some WRC2 outing and maybe new car for New Zealand. Maybe they will attack ERC or APRC, who knows.

[Japé]

When Loeb has won the first two rounds he might start to have second thoughts about driving only 6 rounds. And probably it is not an issue for Hyundai to have even 4 cars per rally.

2019 WRC+ All live pricing probably just got raised ;)

[Tarmop]

He is the maestro, but it is not going to be a walk in the park for him...especially taking two in a row. If he is a podium contender on all the events, its good...figthing for the win on some, excellent. Toyota has a driver capable of winning everywhere, two capable of taking atleast a podium everywhere, Ogier is Ogier, Lappi and Suninen can also suprise us and Hyundai needs Neuville to win...

[Allez Andruet]

In my opinion Huttunen should drive in WRC2 for next 1-2 years before thinking about WRC.. didn't show anything special in 2018 to get a seat in WRC.

Ofcourse, no-one's promoting him to WRC based on his 2018, but Hyundai has invested in that guy and he's been testing the WRC lately.

[Tarmop]

Why shouldn`t they invest in him again...in WRC2 etc, Loeb`s partial program should not have a bad influence in his career as he is young enough...maybe quite the opposite, learn from the best.

[dimviii]

Sure, Thierry Neuville tells us that he has learned of the confirmation of Sébastien Loeb's commitment by Hyundai for the next two years (with a six-run program in 2019, which will start at the Monte Carlo). at the same time as everyone ", this Thursday in the early afternoon.

Good news ?

Yes, of course, it's good to have Loeb on his team! Sincerely, that's the thing I was waiting for Hyundai to finally fight for the title, or even for both titles!

It is true that in previous seasons, your teammates have not been a great help; neither for the team nor for you?

I do not want to say negative things about Andreas (Mikkelsen) or Dani (Sordo), who have had their share of bad luck, but have also been successful under certain circumstances. What I want to say is that the more the line-up will be strong, the more it will benefit everyone at Hyundai. Having Loeb with us is a great asset!

In the past, you also had the opportunity to complain that some drivers, like Ogier, had been able to count on the voluntary retreat of some of their teammates, to pick up some points in the championship. Do you think Loeb will be ready to do the same?

We'll see what happens during the season, but from the moment he does not make the whole championship, it's clear that Seb will obviously not play the title. He is there to strengthen the team as a whole, which is why the team hired him.

What does Sébastien Loeb mean to you?

First a nice memory, because he was close to me when I made my debut in WRC at the wheel of a DS3 WRC Citroën Junior Team. It was at the Monte Carlo 2012, almost 7 years ago. We shared the same infrastructure. It was nice to see him, and especially to see on this first occasion that we had him and me, the same sense of the party!

Did you ask him for some advice at the time?

No, I did not bother him too much: I started in the big leagues, as he approached what would be his last full season, finally crowned with a ninth world title.

And this time, are you going to ask him some tips to help the team evolve the car, or whatever?

No, I think that now, it is rather the other way that it will happen: it is rather he who will probably ask me one or the other pipe ...

https://www.lesoir.be/195441/article/2018-12-13/thierry-neuville-avoir-loeb-avec-nous-un-formidable-atout-pour-hyundai

[dodge33cymru]

Surprised by that, something really doesn't feel right about it but I'm sure I'll get over that. I feel immensely sorry for Paddon though and hope he gets at least a full WRC2 Pro campaign; 2nd in Aus and doesn't have a seat at all next year.

[Grutz]

Congrats to Loeb and Hyundai for this deal. The 1 thing I don't understand is why is Mikkelsen doing Monte over Sordo. I thank the last 12 months has shown how poor Mikkelsen has been on tarmac compared to Sordo. He obviously has a very rock solid contract but I thought contracts were made to be broken! Gutted for Paddon though too.

[deephouse]

Hyundai is NOT Citroen when contracts doesn't mean anything. How would you feel if your boss would kick you out?

[AnttiL]

Hyundai is NOT Citroen when contracts doesn't mean anything. How would you feel if your boss would kick you out?

Well, Paddon and Sordo had contracts for 2018...drove only half seasons.

[mknight]

Congrats to Loeb and Hyundai for this deal. The 1 thing I don't understand is why is Mikkelsen doing Monte over Sordo. I thank the last 12 months has shown how poor Mikkelsen has been on tarmac compared to Sordo. He obviously has a very rock solid contract but I thought contracts were made to be broken! Gutted for Paddon though too.

Appart from contract issues in Monte Mikkelsen is usually very good. Even with i20 last year he was equal with Sordo until the technical issue. Then on Saturday Sordo crashed out from 3rd while Mikkelsen was fastest of the day.

Come Corsica Hyundai will have much more of a dilemma in case Loeb wants to drive it. There Sordo definitely looks like a better pick.

[denkimi]

Congrats to Loeb and Hyundai for this deal. The 1 thing I don't understand is why is Mikkelsen doing Monte over Sordo. I thank the last 12 months has shown how poor Mikkelsen has been on tarmac compared to Sordo. He obviously has a very rock solid contract but I thought contracts were made to be broken! Gutted for Paddon though too.

i don't understand why they don't run 4 or even 5 cars if they really want neuville to win the drivers title. i shouldn't be that big a problem with their budget.

[T16]

So what happens if Loeb wins the Monte and Sweden then?
Still just six rounds?...
I would be surprised.

[racerx1979]

Loeb himself only wants to do 6 rounds. I think either the Hyundai press release or Motorsport interview says this.

[T16]

Loeb himself only wants to do 6 rounds. I think either the Hyundai press release or Motorsport interview says this.

I know, I'm aware of this, but I just think his (and Hyundai's) mind(s) might be changed if he nails the first two events with wins. Don't forget, not that long ago he only waned to do three rounds and not long before that, he had retired altogether.
I just think it would be absolutely amazing for the sport if he did have another crack at the WDC.

[Grundo Farb]

Paddon just confirmed on his social media that he was offered only 1 rally (which is an insult) and he declined so there won't be any WRC for him this year.

That is just wrong to retain Mikkelsen over him like this...

[racerx1979]

Wow, that sucks. 1 rally is a slap in the face. I hope he gets picked up by MSport....

[Allez Andruet]

I hope he gets picked up by MSport....

I think Hayden himself ruled out that option, saying it's Hyundai or nothing.

[racerx1979]

I agree.. it seems as if he waited too long?? Devastating for him. They offered him one rally because they know he would say no. Maybe he will show up in WRC 2 Pro...

[Mk2 RS2000]

An interview with Hayden today

https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/motorsport/109370937/no-world-rally-championship-ride-for-kiwi-driver-hayden-paddon-in-2019?fbclid=IwAR3qkxazCzrVpnz3wvWJX0Y3GOYjI1W9X6zo _Mx6Uzvu4XfCjoeJB9-QfdQ

[GravelBen]

I agree.. it seems as if he waited too long?? Devastating for him. They offered him one rally because they know he would say no. Maybe he will show up in WRC 2 Pro...

From his comments (though he wasn't so blunt) it wasn't him waiting, it was the team stringing him along with empty promises to delay things while they screwed him over behind the scenes.

I don't think Hyundai NZ will be very happy either, NZ is a small country that values old-fashioned things like loyalty and honesty - by treating their local brand ambassador like this the WRC team have probably just cost them quite a lot of sales.

[mknight]

Paddon just confirmed on his social media that he was offered only 1 rally (which is an insult) and he declined so there won't be any WRC for him this year.

That is just wrong to retain Mikkelsen over him like this...

Mikkelsen had a contract. Paddon, Sordo and Loeb had not. The last two got picked over Paddon.

[Ds3]

Goodbye Newville, Goodbye dreams ...
Run at M-Sport while there's room ...
Loeb has never been a team player, he's greedy ...

[EstWRC]

Paddon just confirmed on his social media that he was offered only 1 rally (which is an insult) and he declined so there won't be any WRC for him this year.

That is just wrong to retain Mikkelsen over him like this...

i just cant believe this, he was the most scoring Hyundai driver in the second half of the season. E: (well just 2 points less than Neuville but Paddon with 2 less rallies!)

this is mean hyundai, really mean from you.

Mikkelsen with a full season and Paddon at home? Meh

[T16]

Goodbye Newville, Goodbye dreams ...
Run at M-Sport while there's room ...
Loeb has never been a team player, he's greedy ...

Haven’t you already posted that exact same thing already? Or is it my imagination?

[AnttiL]

Haven’t you already posted that exact same thing already? Or is it my imagination?

Yes he has, better to just ignore.

[Allez Andruet]

I don't think anyone who out of two attempts fails to get Neuville correct even once is to be taken too seriously.

[mknight]

i just cant believe this, he was the most scoring Hyundai driver in the second half of the season. E: (well just 2 points less than Neuville but Paddon with 2 less rallies!)

this is mean hyundai, really mean from you.
Hanninen was the most scoring Toyota from Finland (included) up to and included his last rally in GB. Østberg was the most scoring Citroen this year...

[jparker]

That is just wrong to retain Mikkelsen over him like this...

I'm sorry but there's nothing wrong with that.
The potential of driver is not evaluated just on points scored.

[Marcco]

So what happens if Loeb wins the Monte and Sweden then?
Still just six rounds?...
I would be surprised.

Exactly! Loeb is not a team player, he is alpha male. This whole "Hyunday driver swaping thing" can backfire one day.

[BobJones]

In the end, good move by Seb Marshall.

[AL14]

That is just wrong to retain Mikkelsen over him like this...

Maybe Neuville had a role on this. Mikkelsen is his friend and he never got along with Paddon. But this is pure speculation

[able1]

In the end, good move by Seb Marshall.
Easier and safer to sit on a couch back home than next to Krash Meeke. (my opinion)

[AnttiL]

In the end, good move by Seb Marshall.

Yeh, I think I already mentioned it earlier while assuming Paddon would have a half season, that Marshall got it better to have a full season. Also, I'm not sure how much drivers and co-drivers spend time together in between rallies, but it must have been weird for Seb to watch Hayden have so much of his own business in NZ and rallies with other co-drivers? I mean, for example Latvala does 2-3 historic rallies a year with Hänninen, but Hayden has done like a full season of NZ championship, where he is on the other side of the globe. And to add to this the fact that it's usually the driver who pays the salary of the co-driver (except at Citroen).

[able1]

If Hyundai doesn't win 2019 Manufacturers Title they should sack whole management, engineers and start anew with 2020 car.

[Tarmop]

What`s wrong with the engineers and car? Nothing a bit of development can`t cure. That`s probably not only their problem...

[er88]

If Hyundai doesn't win 2019 Manufacturers Title they should sack whole management, engineers and start anew with 2020 car.Get a grip

[able1]

Get a grip

its obvious that something is wrong in Hyundai 4,5 years with no results, Even top brass has admitted that. And Factory doesnt care about some odd rally wins here and there , they want titles

[Tarmop]

Neuville has been right up there last two seasons. They have room to develop, all of them do. Most of the results can be explained with lineups.

[mknight]

Not really. Hyundai does not have a single podium from Finland and never had podium pace there either.

This year none of the drivers had top speed on tarmac even though 3 of them have won tarmac rallies before.

.. on top of that they still have reliability issues and lost 2 cars that were leading Turkey due to mistakes made by mechanics.

Lineup is quite down the list of main issues imo.

[deephouse]

They built pretty much big company from scratch and are succesfull right now. Not have any of the WRC titles yet but are working on it. But what if they were dominant right now, if that would be good for the sport and other manus? (like VW in their days). Look at the battles at every rally and all cars are pretty much fast everywhere. Drivers are fast pretty much everwhere. I'm talking about seconds between them or less on 15km stages. That's pretty insane for a normal people. It's all about challenges, commitment and battles between all.

[Tarmop]

Not really. Hyundai does not have a single podium from Finland and never had podium pace there either.

This year none of the drivers had top speed on tarmac even though 3 of them have won tarmac rallies before.

.. on top of that they still have reliability issues and lost 2 cars that were leading Turkey due to mistakes made by mechanics.

Lineup is quite down the list of main issues imo.

Yes, because being the last WRC on tarmac, when ones teammate is second or atleast fighting for the podium ( ADAC and RACC) really aren`t the indicator of drivers...its just learning for over a year.... They all have reliability issues, M-Sport maybe less...Toyota offered plenty of chances to grab the manuf. title, with Tänak out several times and Latvala also.

[SubaruNorway]

If Hyundai doesn't win 2019 Manufacturers Title they should sack whole management, engineers and start anew with 2020 car.

Changes have already been made and hearing promising things for the handling of the car, lets just hope it won't be a VW domination all over again because that car should dominate now really.

[Tarmop]

Saying one team has made changes and will dominate in December, 1.5 half a months before a rally (where the car doesn`t have to dominate at all really)? And to think that Toyota and Citroen, both with top drivers and good developers are sleeping?

Bwahaha, seriously?

[SubaruNorway]

That made sense... Where was i talking about MC?
Lets just wait and see!

[Lead]

Changes have already been made and hearing promising things for the handling of the car, lets just hope it won't be a VW domination all over again because that car should dominate now really.

If true, thats sounds interesting.

[Tarmop]

That made sense... Where was i talking about MC?
Lets just wait and see!

Because everything else is even further, they all work to be better, especially those with the budget and good development drivers, yet You are claiming NOW, on 14.12.18 that TODAY Hyundai is already good enough to dominate next season.

[racerx1979]

Rumor has it Loeb looked at a pic of the Hyundai and told the group over the phone "add two degrees caster in front and 1 degree toe in at the rear and all should be good"... wallah!!

[Mk2 RS2000]

Maybe Neuville had a role on this. Mikkelsen is his friend and he never got along with Paddon. But this is pure speculation

Right from the beginning Neuville saw Paddon as a threat rather than as a team mate. I have seen it happen on an event first hand.

[deephouse]

Haha what will be the case with Loeb. He could easily beat him.

[Sulland]

Lets hope Mikkelsen and Loeb gets a tough training camp, with 10 hr driving for a week, so they know the car so well so it becomes a part of them! And also the engineer of their choice, so communication netween driver and tech staff improves.

[denkimi]

Right from the beginning Neuville saw Paddon as a threat rather than as a team mate. I have seen it happen on an event first hand.
perhaps up until 2016, when paddon was only 22 points down on neuville. i doubt he sees him as any kind of threat nowadays, since they're clearly on a different level.

[sollitt]

perhaps up until 2016, when paddon was only 22 points down on neuville. i doubt he sees him as any kind of threat nowadays, since they're clearly on a different level.Not so. Paddon is well capable of matching Neuville on the stages when permitted the opportunity to do so. So no change in that regard.
But it's a lesson Paddon perhaps should've learned early in the programme.
If you want to be the prince you need to get along with the princess.

[dimviii]

Right from the beginning Neuville saw Paddon as a threat rather than as a team mate. I have seen it happen on an event first hand.

Paddon wasnt so ''kind'' of words to Neuville these days also.The days Neuville was in doubt at Hyundai.

[mknight]

Yes, because being the last WRC on tarmac, when ones teammate is second or atleast fighting for the podium ( ADAC and RACC) really aren`t the indicator of drivers...its just learning for over a year....

Let's write it again, this time even more clear: All 3 Hyundai drivers won WRC rounds before.
So Let's look on the 2/3 of the team that you skipped over so fast.
Neuville won Corsica in 2017 and both him and Sordo were fighting for win in Germany in 2017 and Sordo was also in Spain.

This year Neuville was 5th or 6th (if you count Lappi) fastest on pace in Corsica, lucky to manage 3rd with both Citroens crashing. In Germany none had top 2 pace and again Neuville got really lucky with Ogier puncture and Latvala and Sordo out. In Spain they were 6th and 7th in speed, and both lost to Evans whom they easily beat in Corsica.

Their 5 year long lack of pace in Finland is something you ignored completely. "Doesn't suit the car" is what they say.

But yeah driver lineup is the main issue that they need to work on...

[Mk2 RS2000]

Think that you will find that now they have the Paddon transmission option available that the car will be a lot better performed on the faster stages.

[Mk2 RS2000]

Right from the beginning Neuville saw Paddon as a threat rather than as a team mate. I have seen it happen on an event first hand.
2015 Rally of Sardinia. Neuville was #1 in the team as lead driver and Paddon was #3 on the list driving the bitza car which was the old one only slightly updated. Paddon was leading after two day when the transmission mounting broke out of the casing and they finished day two with oil leaking everywhere and with ratchet straps and zip ties holding the transmission in place. That evening at service the crew set about with more temporary repairs in and endeavour to make the car mobile and strong enough to limp to the finish as there was no spare transmission for that car. Hayden drove brilliantly the next day and nursed the car home in second place behind Ogier and ahead of Neuville.

However, and this is where it gets interesting, when Paddon arrived back at service at the end of day two there was a spare unused upgraded transmission that was sitting there as part of Neuville's kit and the use of that transmission was vetoed by the man himself.

To put is in simple term, if Hayden did not finish the next day then Neuville would improve his placing and personal points tally.

Self before team and that is going to be very interesting to watch during 2019.

[GravelBen]

Not really. Hyundai does not have a single podium from Finland and never had podium pace there either.

No podiums, but Paddon had podium pace there this year - he was 4th while holding back for most of the rally to ensure manufacturer points after Neuville and Mikkelsen both threw it off the road behind him. It was easy to see watching it that he could have gone faster if the team didn't need maximum risk avoidance, IIRC he even commented about it being frustrating having to drive that slowly.

[racerx1979]

Too bad Paddon won't be able to run any rallies this year. Maybe he can gather enough cash to run a few events with MSport or Citroen, but I highly doubt it.

[SubaruNorway]

Too bad Paddon won't be able to run any rallies this year. Maybe he can gather enough cash to run a few events with MSport or Citroen, but I highly doubt it.
Garage is empty on his instagram story so something new is going on

[EstWRC]

didnt he say somewhere that his has strong ties with Hyundai NZ and thats why he cant go to elsewhere?

[Tarmop]

Let's write it again, this time even more clear: All 3 Hyundai drivers won WRC rounds before.
So Let's look on the 2/3 of the team that you skipped over so fast.
Neuville won Corsica in 2017 and both him and Sordo were fighting for win in Germany in 2017 and Sordo was also in Spain.

This year Neuville was 5th or 6th (if you count Lappi) fastest on pace in Corsica, lucky to manage 3rd with both Citroens crashing. In Germany none had top 2 pace and again Neuville got really lucky with Ogier puncture and Latvala and Sordo out. In Spain they were 6th and 7th in speed, and both lost to Evans whom they easily beat in Corsica.

Their 5 year long lack of pace in Finland is something you ignored completely. "Doesn't suit the car" is what they say.

But yeah driver lineup is the main issue that they need to work on...

Hyundai has never been good in Finland, true (Paddon could have gone faster this year though and now he is sacked). Then again, nothing else you say can explain why one of their main drivers is the last WRC on those rounds. Like Neuville has pointed out several times, he didn`t have his wingmen.

[er88]

Hyundai has never been good in Finland, true (Paddon could have gone faster this year though and now he is sacked). Then again, nothing else you say can explain why one of their main drivers is the last WRC on those rounds. Like Neuville has pointed out several times, he didn`t have his wingmen.Yeah Paddon was like around 4th fastest in Finland and on a pretty good pace considering his role was to collect pts, but generally they have struggled.
Neuville and Sordo were happy with the car in Spain after the changes had been made, especially in the dry conditions. Even after the changes had been made for that event Mikkelsen was embarrassingly slow in Spain. Beaten by R5s on a full length stage is tragic.

When you look at their team, Paddon and Sordo did their job this year. It was Mikkelsen who was the disappointment. Light years behind Thierry in every department and barely scraped ahead of his team mates in the championship, despite them only doing half seasons.

So clearly Mikkelsen was a major issue this year as part of the line-up. He's not a bad driver clearly, but he had a nightmare season and with a better #2 (or a driver who could deliver in the car) Hyundai would've been much better placed to win a title or two. Even with the small deficiencies in the car.

Mikkelsen has ofcourse a few mechanical failures to point to which have to be taken into consideration that cost him pts, as well as it being his first year in the car. But he was the one who underperformed in the team considering the expectations on him, and the expectations he had on himself. Which was to try and challenge for the title. It's why he got the big contract and Paddon and Sordo got benched to give him the full season.

Next season is the biggest of his career. Hopefully they've sorted out any of the politics within the team, tailored the car more to his liking and Mikkelsen himself regains his mojo.

[GravelBen]

didnt he say somewhere that his has strong ties with Hyundai NZ and thats why he cant go to elsewhere?

Its definitely a big factor - they've been a big supporter of his career, he's their top brand ambassador in NZ and those ties are likely to continue long after his WRC days are behind him so its a practical consideration. That combined with the fact that he's a very loyal person himself, unfortunately the WRC team haven't returned that loyalty.

Not many other options though either (only really M-sport once Toyota had signed Meeke and Citroen looked like having Loeb until they cut back to 2 cars) and the Hyundai team have obviously been stringing him along with empty promises about next year in the meantime. I would love to see what he could do in the Toyota.

[GravelBen]

Garage is empty on his instagram story so something new is going on

Even before the WRC team decision he said he had a few other projects happening this year too - while he wasn't planning to contest NZRC (nothing left to prove, just the enjoyment of driving the roads), I think his NZ team are developing a second Hyundai AP4 car.

He has unfinished business with the Ashley Forest Rallysprint (a popular NZ event) after mechanical failures previous years, maybe he is building something mental to smash the record there.

Its possible the empty garage means bigger changes though.

[Zeakiwi]

Paddon Rally sport was shifting from the Auckland base to a bigger facility in Wanaka (potentially the Cockermouth (M-Sport) of NZ?)
Paddon Rallysport - winmax brakes, italian shock absorber etc dealer for nz.

[Zeakiwi]

Paddon Rally sport was shifting from the Auckland base to a bigger facility in Wanaka (potentially the Cockermouth (M-Sport) of NZ?)
Paddon Rallysport - winmax brakes, italian shock absorber etc dealer for nz.
https://www.facebook.com/paddonrallysport/

[GravelBen]

Ah yes I forgot about that - new workshop is in Cromwell isn't it? Much cheaper land than Wanaka and not far away. Maybe even at Highlands might make sense.

[dimviii]

The masterful move to seize the services of Sebastien Loeb brings collateral damage. It has been the bombing of the transfer market and, without a doubt, a success for the Hyundai team, but now it is time to recompose the organization chart that was already established. Having all the square logistics, have happened to find a kind of 'tetris' difficult to solve.

The first problem has been to fit the formation for the inaugural event of the season, the Monte Carlo Rally. With the arrival of Loeb the logical thing would have been to sacrifice Andreas Mikkelsen, with a palmarés much poorer than that of Dani Sordo in the Principality. But the Norwegian has enforced his contract, it is even speculated that by throwing his hands on his lawyers, with what Spanish is left out.

And the problem is more expensive to the second appointment, Sweden. To this day there is no driver for the third i20 WRC, since Loeb and Sordo, a priori, do not want to run in the snow, and Hayden Paddon, who was the wild card, has rejected the possibility. If they do not change their minds, Loeb or Sordo, the other possible option is to take hold of the 'junior' driver of the team, the Finn Jari Huttunen.

But the problems do not end there. Loeb wants to run in several of the tests that were originally assigned to Sordo, such as the rallies in France, Germany, Chile or Spain. If Mikkelsen does not give up his pretensions to make the whole championship by enforcing his contract, the Spanish program will be very compromised. A pity, because until the arrival of the French star he had secured 10 participations.
And, going further, imagine that Loeb wins in Monte Carlo and decides to go also to Sweden. If the leader of the Nordic event were to leave, he could change his initial plans to do only six rallies, and consider fighting for a tenth world title running all the tests. Then the task would be total for Sordo, to which the arrival of his friend of so many years ago is complicating life very much.

https://as.com/motor/2018/12/15/mas_motor/1544893355_613458.html?id_externo_rsoc=comp_tw

[kiil]

Well, Rally Sweden entries closes one week before Monte, so a potential Sweden entry will not be decided by a Monte win.

[Tarmop]

Rally Sweden has tweeted already, that Loeb will drive there?

[dimviii]

some well known twitters have confirmed
https://twitter.com/F_Gustavsson/status/1074007349210304512

http://planetemarcus.com/sebastien-loeb-a-signe-chez-hyundai-en-2019/

[Andre Oliveira]

If Andreas did that... 2019 is last season on Hyundai for sure.

[EstWRC]

if he keeps performing like he did in 2018 then it will be his last season in wrc anyway