Rally Italia Sardinia 2017

[EightGear]

This was Neuvilles chance to get some big points on Ogier...

[Lead]

Didnt expect crying from Latvala

[stefanvv]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

#10
https://www.ewrc-results.com/flags2/finland.pngLatvala Jari-Matti - Anttila Miikka (https://www.ewrc-results.com/entryinfo/36018-rally-italia-sardegna-2017/1467522/)
"If I don't get the time back I lost because of Ostberg, I stop rally driving!"

[Eli]

Never heard Latvala that upset in stage end.

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[mknight]

Didnt expect crying from Latvala

In Portugal he was on the other side, so that's why he thinks he deserves the same treatment.

[BigWorm]

Shit. Not good this.

[abxyz]

Gutted for Neuville, with Ogier's puncture he could have reduced the gap in the championship massively

[EstWRC]

what a drama in this stage, Paddons rally to loose now

[EstWRC]

i wonder how happy Paddon now is behind Neuvilles dust, it didnt seem to bother in the morning

[Eli]

Shame for Thierry, could have capatilized on Ogier's situation.

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[KKS]

Neuville have time compensation from Portugal?

[abxyz]

He only lost a minute, the third split time was wrong

[stefanvv]

Now Paddon is in Neuville's dust, ironic.

[Eli]

No breaks.... Shame

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[mknight]

Neuville have time compensation from Portugal?

He got back 12s he lost in Latvala's dust in Portugal.

[PLuto]

flash info (10 - Latvala Jari-Matti / Anttila Miikka): If I don't get the time back here, when I am in dust behind Ostberg and fighting so hard, I will stop this sport.

And this is the result of FIA policy when they started to giving notional times for "sporting" issues. So we will see request for notional times (because of dust or catching slower car or any similar rally issues) more and more...

[EstWRC]

Shame for Thierry, could have capatilized on Ogier's situation.

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he can still take a lot of points back, without power stage he would take 6 points back at the moment.

[KKS]

He got back 12s he lost in Latvala's dust in Portugal.
OK, so it's fair. -12sec in Portugal, +60sec in Sardegna.... it's some justice in a sport :D

[BigWorm]

Still 4th O/A and in front of Ogier. That's still valuable so hoping the mechanics will fix his car so he can bring it to the end like that.

[Eli]

he can still take a lot of points back, without power stage he would take 6 points back at the moment.
He needs to demolish the 22 points lead Ogier has come Rally Finland, if he can get there leading, would be great.

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[EstWRC]

and theres still a long way to go, the stages will be even rougher in the afternoon

[Rallyper]

Paddon deserves a victory. Still long time to go ...

[mknight]

In terms of Championship this really was Neuville's best chance to reduce the gap massively
- slow twisty rally where Hyundai excells, lots of cleaning
- Poland and Finland have less cleaning and both Ogier and Ford are fast on that kind of roads
- Germany and Spain are at best equal, possibly advantage Ogier

[Eli]

In terms of Championship this really was Neuville's best chance to reduce the gap massively
- slow twisty rally where Hyundai excells, lots of cleaning
- Poland and Finland have less cleaning and both Ogier and Ford are fast on that kind of roads
- Germany and Spain are at best equal, possibly advantage Ogier
As I said before, shame for the championship... Hopefully Hyundai will manage to cut the gap from M-Sport despite it all.

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[BigWorm]

The championship is far from over.

[EstWRC]

exactly, we are just half way through!

[Mirek]

Interestingly usually there is way more drama among R5 cars but today while WRC crews suffer from punctures or techical issues the top R5 crews keep unusually strong and tight. On these three stages Kopecký was 1,3 sec. faster than Camilli and 4,7 faster than Veiby. None of them suffered any important issue and they were near equal in all stages.

[Watson]

I can just imagine Neuville trying to hunt the leaders down and crash. He can get very angry and erratic.

[Zeakiwi]

Does Tanak know the Fiesta is supposed to be not as fast as a Hyundai on the twisty roads?

[SubaruNorway]

Kees Burger overdoing Mickey's jump "a bit"
https://www.facebook.com/tor.andre/posts/10154493115017624?ref=notif&notif_t=like&notif_id=1497086467749190

[dimviii]

Tanak

https://twitter.com/RallyingUK/status/873472442643230720

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Had to go out this morning... have I missed anything ? ;)

[dimviii]

Citroën Racing‏*@CitroenRacing
#WRC #RallyItalia SS12
@Craig_Breen: "The car was doing all sorts of things. Something transmission related I think. I drove at road speed."

[EstWRC]

Does Tanak know the Fiesta is supposed to be not as fast as a Hyundai on the twisty roads?

Yes, he said after Mexico that this is the area they have to work and improve a lot

[A FONDO]

Not necessarily. On form Paddon comfortably has the measure of Neuville OFF FORM. Assuming Nandan gives him a car that can go the distance, today's stages will show whether he's regained his peak.

Let him clean the road for two days and he will be down the drain as usual.

[seb_sh]

Wow another wild rally, I honestly thought Sardinia would be a bit less crazy but looks like 2017 isn't having it!

[dimviii]

Jari-Matti Latvala‏
Not blaming @MadsOstberg for what happened this morning. He doesn't have radio in the car so he couldn't know that we were behind him #WRC

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB86UxzXoAA2vNi.jpg

[SubaruNorway]

Almost sad listening to Mikkelsen after the stages.
"Scared to death, rear is all over the place"
"Dampers are really bad, bouncing all over the place, I've got zero control"

[skarderud]

Almost sad listening to Mikkelsen after the stages.
"Scared to death, rear is all over the place"
"Dampers are really bad, bouncing all over the place, I've got zero control"
He is probably pointing at the problems here.

Sent fra min XP7700 via Tapatalk

[KKS]

Almost sad listening to Mikkelsen after the stages.
"Scared to death, rear is all over the place"
"Dampers are really bad, bouncing all over the place, I've got zero control"
And some people blaming Meeke for that rear-end loosing in:
- Sweden
- Argentina
- Sardegna

[Mirek]

Almost sad listening to Mikkelsen after the stages.
"Scared to death, rear is all over the place"
"Dampers are really bad, bouncing all over the place, I've got zero control"

When did he say that?


And some people blaming Meeke for that rear-end loosing in:
- Sweden
- Argentina
- Sardegna

Do You believe overdriving a slow car until the point of uncontrolled accident is a good thing? The car may be bad but pushing it into a big crash everytime is a pure gamble. Moreover a gamble which helps nothing.

[dimviii]

Colin Clark‏*@voiceofrally
I think we need to be a bit careful when crucifying @krismeeke after his off yesterday. Best wait to hear exactly what happened

[Mirek]

By the way I fail to see how the two Japanese guys can make it in Toyota WRC team.

[seb_sh]

By the way I fail to see how the two Japanese guys can make it in Toyota WRC team.

yeah i was thinking the same, I assume Toyota will pay for extra cars for these guys, even keeping Hanninen would be better.

[wrc2017]

Mikkelson needs to watch whats he says..
or Citroen wont have him back..... :)
Almost sad listening to Mikkelsen after the stages.
"Scared to death, rear is all over the place"
"Dampers are really bad, bouncing all over the place, I've got zero control"

[mknight]

Do You believe overdriving a slow car until the point of uncontrolled accident is a good thing? The car may be bad but pushing it into a big crash everytime is a pure gamble. Moreover a gamble which helps nothing.

What he said.

Also who spend most of last year preparing? Citroen and Meeke. Who developed the car and sets it up for himself? Meeke.

As I have written many times this year it's very interesting that Citroen does not have a good setup for every other section and every second rally. Not testing enough/wrong? Hard car to set-up?

Starting to look like the last option. Then again this year we see test vids from Ford and Hyundai all the time, but not so much from Citroen. (that by itself doesn't mean they test less though)

[wrc2017]

The concept of the car was designed by Citroen Racing.. and mostly touring car engineers.. before Meeke or Breen even sat in it. There is major homolgation issues with the car that cannot be changed. And to prove the point.. the car is mega on Corsicia becuase that is utimately what is was designed for.

Also i heard that Citroen have cancelled a development test


What he said.

Also who spend most of last year preparing? Citroen and Meeke. Who developed the car and sets it up for himself? Meeke.

As I have written many times this year it's very interesting that Citroen does not have a good setup for every other section and every second rally. Not testing enough/wrong? Hard car to set-up?

Starting to look like the last option. Then again this year we see test vids from Ford and Hyundai all the time, but not so much from Citroen. (that by itself doesn't mean they test less though)

[BigWorm]

Some very protective comments regarding Meeke.

Time for him to sit out an event and restart his mind. Even if the car is faulty and bad, he's definitely not helping.

[Mirek]

Also who spend most of last year preparing? Citroen and Meeke. Who developed the car and sets it up for himself? Meeke.

I prefer to be careful with blaming him for that. It is possible that the Citroën engineers just know better if You understand what I mean.

[wrc2017]

Maybe do no harm..
But it looks like without Meeke the car would have been classified to Room 101 long before now.
Some very protective comments regarding Meeke.

Time for him to sit out an event and restart his mind. Even if the car is faulty and bad, he's definitely not helping.

[Mirek]

Maybe do no harm..
But it looks like without Meeke the car would have been classified to Room 101 long before now.

But does it help anything to crash it everytime? The answer is simple - no. It costs money, it takes plenty of working hours to rebuild the cars again and again, it brings health and lives in risk and it brings neither points nor testing data. And finally it gives no real wake-up call to the team that something is fundametally wrong when they see some good times and after that a crash (of course it is possible that the team would try to replace drivers first - in a way Škoda did in their WRC times but sooner or later they must realize that the car is uncompetitive if nobody delivers).

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Just reading back the people's comments here from this morning seeing so many with support and sympathy for Neuville for not 'taking advantage' of Ogier's puncture.
So Ogier has to open the road and have problems in order for Neuville to catch him in the Championship. Not very sporting..

[macebig]

Most of us here, have pointed a finger to C3's deficiencies since Sweden.Too much drag/ not enough downforce on the front and serious suspension issues.Meeke isn't doing himself any favors by trying to overdrive this car, which 9 times out of 10 ends in tears.It looks like Mikkelsen (who has a bad mindset to be fair, but thats another discussion..) is just trying to bring the car home at the safest pace possible.Major changes are needed for Citroen to be truly competitive again.

[wrc2017]

If he was driving at Mikkelson pace he'd be sacked. If he drove at the limitation of the car, maybe where Breen is at, people would be questioning his ability. Ive watched the video and seen the images and the fact is the rear of the car steps out of line on a flat rh corner while following the clean line of drivers infront. Its not as if he was over committing. If an accident can happen on that corner.. then it can happen on 100 others every day.
But does it help anything to crash it everytime? The answer is simple - no. It costs money, it takes plenty of working hours to rebuild the cars again and again, it brings health and lives in risk and it brings neither points nor testing data. And finally it gives no real wake-up call to the team that something is fundametally wrong when they see some good times and after that a crash.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

If the C3 is that bad on gravel how did Meeke win in Mexico ?

Autosport:
'It was no flash-in-the-pan, no running-order miracle. The speed was coming from the C3 working very well on gravel, where the WRC spends five of its next six rounds.'

[mknight]

When did he say that?


There are bits after flying finish on every stage onboard, before they turn off the intercom. Didn't hear the exact quotes SubaruNorway wrote but it was generally in that direction.


I prefer to be careful with blaming him for that. It is possible that the Citroën engineers just know better if You understand what I mean.
Well true. Impreza S12 and then S14 does come to mind. "Rally cars are getting so complicated that drivers can't understand them". Think it was David Lapworth who said that.

Makes the whole Citroen thing smell more and more like Subaru and we know how that went.

[wrc2017]

Exactly...amazing! :)


If the C3 is that bad on gravel how did Meeke win in Mexico ?

[macebig]

He got seriously lucky on the final corner, remember that.A metre to the left or to the right and the C3 goes head on the parked vehicles..

[mknight]

Clearly it can be fast sometimes, remember that in mexico all others had overheating issues. Anyway on quite a few stages gravel stages and even powerstage in Sweden Meeke was on par with Ogier/Neuville/Latvala without it looking like some epic attack.

[EstWRC]

When did he say that?



Do You believe overdriving a slow car until the point of uncontrolled accident is a good thing? The car may be bad but pushing it into a big crash everytime is a pure gamble. Moreover a gamble which helps nothing.

+1

Meeke has an perfect example how things should be done and that example is Ogier. OK, the Ford isnt bad as Citroen but clearly Ogier struggled with the car in the beginning of the season and is struggling again this rally. But the master chose the pace he could afford and is still leading the championship and has two wins.


Urmo Aavas prediction before the season was right, he said Meeke and Hanninen are too old to change and he expects them to continue like they did and it rightly has been so.

[Mirek]

If he was driving at Mikkelson pace he'd be sacked. If he drove at the limitation of the car, maybe where Breen is at, people would be questioning his ability. Ive watched the video and seen the images and the fact is the rear of the car steps out of line on a flat rh corner while following the clean line of drivers infront. Its not as if he was over committing. If an accident can happen on that corner.. then it can happen on 100 others every day.

First it's Mikkelsen not Mikkelson.

Meeke is pushing harder than the car can go because he has such nature. I don't blame him for trying to fight. He has always been like that. The point that he doesn't help his team in solving the issue stays though.

Look at Ogier. Is he happy with the Fiesta every time? I dare to say no. But he is able to bring it home everytime and make it better step by step. He knows well that rolling the car in the middle of first day would hardly help him getting better one next time.

On the other hand Citroën has in the team three drivers who are all well known for their flamboyant driving. That is in my eyes a sort of management failure because they need somebody like Sordo who is able to get the car to the finish no matter what. In the past Citroën cars were developed with drivers like Bugalski, Loeb or Bouffier who are of different kind than Meeke or Breen.

[Watson]

Autosport:
'It was no flash-in-the-pan, no running-order miracle. The speed was coming from the C3 working very well on gravel, where the WRC spends five of its next six rounds.'

This sounds really cynical in hindsight. Shame on me for chuckling quite a while on it.

It seems the stars aligned for the C3 in Mexico. Whatever the problem is with that car they were able to temporarily get rid of it there, maybe by accident and now they can't reproduce it or it simply hasn't worked on the other rallies.

It's weird how Breen kept praising the car in Portugal and now it's all down the drain again. Really, really weird.

[BigWorm]

If the C3 is that bad on gravel how did Meeke win in Mexico ?

I remember the first stage was a complete chaos with mechanical failures, the only one who didn't have a overheating car was Meeke. He basically won the rally on that stage.

[dimviii]

Εvans and cows
https://twitter.com/OfficialWRC/status/873506411296292864

[doubled1978]

I have to say I have also watched the onboard, and I don't think Meeke did much wrong. From the very start of the stage the car looks like its trying to get away from him from the rear. In fact it has looked like that pretty much all season, except Corsica. If you watch he is always trying to open the steering angle to stop it getting away from him. His Monte crash in my opinion was because he carried a bit too much speed and just couldn't trust the car to throw some lock in to try and save it, and ran out of road on the outside.
I also don't agree that just driving round slow is telling his engineers anything at all, just a waste of money. Better to go the speed you need to and work out whats wrong.
Incidentally watching Lappi, Ostberg and Paddon (the three fastest) through the same stage, all of those cars look way more stable than the Citroen, especially the Ford and Toyota. All 4 drivers make a small lift in the same place, and the Citroen pitches Meeke in bank.

[SubaruNorway]

When did he say that?

After SS 7 and 8. Hard to hear on the other stages because of the bad audio.

Also Mexico is a much less rough rally than Sardinia at least on the wide roads.

[dimviii]

#Tyre info - Day 2 afternoon
Mikkelsen/Neuville/Paddon/Ogier: 6 Michelin LTX Force H4
Breen/Tanaak/Sordo/Toyota: 5H


https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB9XD0VWAAAQ_Sb.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB9W575XoAAlzCH.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB9W60vWsAAJEii.jpg

[Grundo Farb]

Let him clean the road for two days and he will be down the drain as usual.

Down the drain as usual? Wow. What colour is the sky of the world you live in?

[KKS]

Ott in good mood :)
https://twitter.com/MSportLtd/status/873497612305006593

[KKS]

Do You believe overdriving a slow car until the point of uncontrolled accident is a good thing? The car may be bad but pushing it into a big crash everytime is a pure gamble. Moreover a gamble which helps nothing.
I belive noone know where that point. It's not a road car that if you not confident - drive slowly. It's a rally, and Meeke risking drive stage fast and sometimes that "point" come on very low speeds in flat corners.

[Grundo Farb]

Anyone watch the red bull TV summary of day 1? Neuville came across as an arrogant prick when asked about the speed of the car relative to others and he said "if you looked at my team mates then no its not fast but if you look at me then yes". Webber said that needs to be managed strongly by the team management because if he is saying that to the media it is likely to be a lot worse amongst the team.

Again, I have never heard Sordo or Paddon say anything against Neuville like that.

Another subject, no-one has commented on the very bad reliability of the Hyundais. They have had a very large amount of reliability problems (well Paddon and Sordo have). Citroen crashes and people analyse but Hyundai have had many failures. Turbos, Power Steering, Electrics etc and now Neuvilles brakes.

[steve.mandzij]

No time compensation for Latvala?

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[Fitz]

Anyone watch the red bull TV summary of day 1? Neuville came across as an arrogant prick when asked about the speed of the car relative to others and he said "if you looked at my team mates then no its not fast but if you look at me then yes". Webber said that needs to be managed strongly by the team management because if he is saying that to the media it is likely to be a lot worse amongst the team.

Again, I have never heard Sordo or Paddon say anything against Neuville like that.

Another subject, no-one has commented on the very bad reliability of the Hyundais. They have had a very large amount of reliability problems (well Paddon and Sordo have). Citroen crashes and people analyse but Hyundai have had many failures. Turbos, Power Steering, Electrics etc and now Neuvilles brakes.

Yes agree with the mechanical comments & also last night & this morning this was also my impression of him.

Saying to MW seemingly I'll come back & win the next one.

Interestingly at the SS on thurs eve his co driver was arguing ferociously with the time keepers.

All a bit worrying.

[KKS]

but clearly Ogier struggled with the car in the beginning of the season and is struggling again this rally.
Did he struggle to keep car on the road? - nope
He struggle to go quicker - that was an issue.

Completely opposite to Citroen problems

[GigiGalliNo1]

Fantastic rally so far!

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170610/ff8081c72e214a3897c6333f72cc3c0d.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170610/618d84637f03c713d2e7fd0a3e88c9a3.jpg

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20170610/8d9c82cb8587696d1e14043e8e267c1a.jpg

[BigWorm]

Anyone watch the red bull TV summary of day 1? Neuville came across as an arrogant prick when asked about the speed of the car relative to others and he said "if you looked at my team mates then no its not fast but if you look at me then yes". Webber said that needs to be managed strongly by the team management because if he is saying that to the media it is likely to be a lot worse amongst the team.

In my eyes, I think that was pretty true for the start of the season. It's now we're seeing Paddon getting up to speed, took a while but he's getting there now. Sordo is there sometimes but that's when the conditions are right.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

That's how it is at every event. There's no such thing as a 'red bull stage', it's just a different lead-in and closing to a standard TV stage.

Not always. Often only WRC+ shows the same stage as Red Bull not the TV channels eg. on the last rally Portugal:

Sat 20 May
SS 12 Amarante 1 – 11h10 – RTP 1
SS 13 Vieira do Minho 2 – 15h00 – WRC Plus, Red Bull TV
SS 15 Amarante 2 – 17h10 – RTP 3

[dimviii]

4 minute time internals for first 10 cars

[mknight]

Anyone watch the red bull TV summary of day 1? Neuville came across as an arrogant prick when asked about the speed of the car relative to others and he said "if you looked at my team mates then no its not fast but if you look at me then yes". Webber said that needs to be managed strongly by the team management because if he is saying that to the media it is likely to be a lot worse amongst the team.

All I have to say is LOL at Webber commeting on that.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Isnt Monte Lerno (with Mickeys Jump) usually shown as a live tv stage ?

[Mirek]

Did he struggle to keep car on the road? - nope
He struggle to go quicker - that was an issue.

Completely opposite to Citroen problems

No, it's not completely different issue. Ogier would likely also go off in every event if he tried to push like crazy but he has different mindset - and that's also why he is multiple world champion and Meeke isn't.

[Watson]

@Grundo Farb: It's no secret he is really full of himself. From a guy who thinks it's okay to wear orange specs this is hilarious.

[KKS]

No, it's not completely different issue. Ogier would likely also go off in every event if he tried to push like crazy but he has different mindset - and that's also why he is multiple world champion and Meeke isn't.
It not survival question. If Ogier go harder and crash it cuz overrun own limit.
If you drive C3 you never know when you have a problem even if you don't push at all. And Mikkelsen times prove that. If Mikkelsen drive C3 - time was good, if C3 drives Andreas - he has +30sec per stage.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Sordo pushing hard clipping a bank.

[abxyz]

Technical difficulties..

[Fast Eddie WRC]

No dust issues here unlike this morning...

[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB9luGmXkAAkTZs.jpg

[Mirek]

It not survival question. If Ogier go harder and crash it cuz overrun own limit.
If you drive C3 you never know when you have a problem even if you don't push at all. And Mikkelsen times prove that. If Mikkelsen drive C3 - time was good, if C3 drives Andreas - he has +30sec per stage.

You see what You want to see. Let's move on.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Technical difficulties..

Tyre off the rim after early run wide.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Ha ha Sordo in denial :D

[N.O.T]

sordo 2 seconds slower than his morning time.

[Simmi]

Ha ha Sordo in denial :D

Made me laugh. Makes you wonder how many other drivers who 'never hit anything' in reality know exactly what happened.

[steve.mandzij]

Lappi destroying Mikkelsen's time!

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

[mknight]

I find it a bit funny when they call Lappi for "kid". He is 26, only 1 year younger than Breen and 2 than Mikkelsen..

[Mirek]

I find it a bit funny when they call Lappi for "kid". He is 26, only 1 year younger than Breen and 2 than Mikkelsen..

And a father already ;)

[KKS]

Did Mikkelsen adept of "nose end first" technique? :D

[stefanvv]

It not survival question. If Ogier go harder and crash it cuz overrun own limit.
If you drive C3 you never know when you have a problem even if you don't push at all. And Mikkelsen times prove that. If Mikkelsen drive C3 - time was good, if C3 drives Andreas - he has +30sec per stage.

Ogier had offs few times this year, remember?

[stefanvv]

I find it a bit funny when they call Lappi for "kid". He is 26, only 1 year younger than Breen and 2 than Mikkelsen..

It's funny in my language if You change the last letter of his last name, it becomes synonym for 'kid'.

[macebig]

Huge understeer for Mikkelsen at that hairpin.Much less for Lappi and Hanninen and nearly no understeer at all for Ogier.Lets see how the i20 fares there.

[EstWRC]

and in our language if you take last letter out of his last name means "patch"

[Mise]

No, it's not completely different issue. Ogier would likely also go off in every event if he tried to push like crazy but he has different mindset - and that's also why he is multiple world champion and Meeke isn't.

Think he learned that from the best. Loeb never risk his champ title for one rally. And of course it's World Championship title u fight for, not one rally win. Again Marcus Gronholm lost at least one title to that reason. He wanted to win every rally and crashed in one of them, losing the title too

[rallye-vid]

Ostberg many times faster than Ogier.. Wtf 🤔

[stefanvv]

Huge understeer for Mikkelsen at that hairpin.Much less for Lappi and Hanninen and nearly no understeer at all for Ogier.Lets see how the i20 fares there.

If he wants to tame that C3, he needs a bit understeering more.

[seb_sh]

I like the RedBull production, commentators are good, nice preshow, good interviews, nice to have experts in the form of ex drivers present, short interviews during the stage, little cutting away from the action...

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Great job Tanak !

[N.O.T]

paddon +20 bye bye

[KKS]

Ogier had offs few times this year, remember?
overdrive himself.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Agh Paddon.

[macebig]

Paddon hit a bank!

[BigWorm]

Tänaks time is now.

[stefanvv]

Paddon, ouch

[Eli]

God damn it!!! So so gutted!!!

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Again TV missed the off..

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Sad.

[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB9vhJ5XsAAJ239.jpg

[macebig]

Paddon out by the looks of it...

[rallye-vid]

Ott, bring it home now....

[EstWRC]

Ott, bring it home now....

Latvala just 16 secs behind.

[dimviii]

nice time from Breen

[Watson]

Come on now Ott, easy does it.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Lucky Neuville up another place after Paddon's drop.

[mknight]

nice time from Breen

Clearly there is some speed in the car... sometimes. Just the stage before he lost 53s and complained what a disaster it was to drive.

[Eli]

Sad.
Very, devastating blow for the Manu. Championship and of course very sad for Paddon, did deserve better

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[steve.mandzij]

RBTV not showing neither Evans nor Breen :(

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[BigWorm]

Lucky Neuville up another place after Paddon's drop.

Could have been leading

I wouldn't say losing a minute because of no brakes is lucky

[stefanvv]

Is Latvala going to regain some time?

[abxyz]

Terrible job from WRC+ (RBTV gets their images from them), would have been interesting to see more of Paddon repairing the car

[macebig]

To come back to my previous comment about understeer, Tanak was nearly identical (and maybe ever cleaner) to Ogier, Neuville(the only healthy i20) had just a pinch of understeer (middle ground between Fiesta and Yaris), unfortunately no footage from Breen.

[Eric]

Nooooo Paddon. You needed this victory.. Im a little bit worried Hyundai will change their line up for next year if he keeps going on like this.

[dimviii]

https://img4.hostingpics.net/pics/526342Sanstitre.png

[Eric]

"#Paddon: damage on the car not possible to repair. Team on the way to recover the car. #WRC #RallyItalia"

[steve.mandzij]

"#Paddon: damage on the car not possible to repair. Team on the way to recover the car. #WRC #RallyItalia"
Nooooo

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[mknight]

While I feel sorry for Paddon given that he had good speed even today on similar road position, overall his season is quite a disaster. For very different reason than Meekes but the results in terms of points is very much the same, and no win either.

[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB9xL_PXkAAy9R5.jpg

[KKS]

RBTV not showing neither Evans nor Breen :(

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RBTV didn't show nothing by herself, they show only what show WRCTV

[Watson]

"#Paddon: damage on the car not possible to repair. Team on the way to recover the car. #WRC #RallyItalia"
That was pretty obvious. There was no way they could even patch the car up well enough even to get to the next stage.

[Eric]

While I feel sorry for Paddon given that he had good speed even today on similar road position, overall his season is quite a disaster. For very different reason than Meekes but the results in terms of points is very much the same, and no win either.

Exactly. I think Hyundai still is keeping an eye on Mikkelsen. They did not let him drive the car just for fun

[KKS]

"#Paddon: damage on the car not possible to repair. Team on the way to recover the car. #WRC #RallyItalia"
I guess it possible to repair if there was only road sections ahead. But two long stages this car can't drive.

[stefanvv]

"#Paddon: damage on the car not possible to repair. Team on the way to recover the car. #WRC #RallyItalia"

Beside the obvious suspension damage, it looked without read diff/propshafts.

[Lord_Shaitan]

Yes! Come on Ott!!!

[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB9y7HrXUAEGXTO.jpg

[KKS]

Paddon on move now

[Eric]

#WRC Hyundaï Motorsport confirmed Paddon retirement after crash SS13 #RallySardegna ... Sorry for u @HaydenPaddon #nevergiveup

[BigWorm]

Shame for Paddon. A victory here was very much needed.

But now Tänak needs to keep it on the road. If this stands, Tänak and Latvala are back in the race for the title.

[dimviii]

nice aerial
https://twitter.com/CitroenRacing/status/873544254961876992

[SubaruNorway]

That was pretty obvious. There was no way they could even patch the car up well enough even to get to the next stage.

If it could do 140kph with that it could reach the stage no problem. My bet is that the top ear of the part on the damper that connects to the hub broke and it was just hanging by the lower bolt.

[KKS]

Looks like Paddon drive to start next SS. It's clever, if he drove a stage more than 7min he can retire on next SS anyway.

[Watson]

If it could do 140kph with that it could reach the stage no problem. My bet is that the top ear of the part on the damper that connects to the hub broke and it was just hanging by the lower bolt.

You can do 140 kph with no rear wheels at all but for how long is the question.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

At least Paddon being right out and not just dropping time means all move up a place, not just the leaders & Neuville.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Great splits by Ogier !

[Watson]

Great splits by Ogier !
Very fast till the end. The stage before he said something felt wrong in the car. Couldn't have been so bad it seems.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB9vFl9WAAERGjc.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB9vII5XoAA2cwV.jpg

[AnttiL]

So, Latvala and Tänak are the only drivers without any mistakes, technical failures or punctures so far. I think in Portugal Ogier and Neuville were the only ones without any problems.

[dimviii]

Lets compare them with Tanak to see how fast they are(Ogier splits)

[Watson]

Dang Ott not letting off. I hope he's not risking too much.

[AnttiL]

Dang Ott not letting off. I hope he's not risking too much.

This. He needs a win.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Lets compare them with Tanak to see how fast they are(Ogier splits)

Ott is a bit quicker so far but does have the better road position.

[dimviii]

where is EstWRC?

[onemanband]

where is EstWRC?

Drinking Saaremaa vodka with sardines.

[steve.mandzij]

Oof! If the places stay as they are then I hope Latvala wins the Power Stage at least. Don't want him to drop to fourth in the championship.

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[Fast Eddie WRC]

where is EstWRC?

Holding hands with other fans on Estonian forum. ;)

[BigWorm]

Oof! If the places stay as they are then I hope Latvala wins the Power Stage at least. Don't want him to drop to fourth in the championship.

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It does give him better opportunities come Rally Poland/Finland though

[Watson]

Latvala red hot quick on the last two sectors.

[dimviii]

lets see how Tanak will manage his tyres at next long one stage.

[steve.mandzij]

It does give him better opportunities come Rally Poland/Finland though
Yeah, I was going to say that too. Also, maybe it'll pay off to conserve second. He's blisteringly quick in Poland and I expect him to win Finland like he's done so many times before so perhaps he'll snatch some more points in the second half of the year as he always does (did).

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[Fast Eddie WRC]

Top job again Ott... keep it going.

[salamaja]

Lol at Neuville so sure he would be first. Said that 2 times at least now

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Three Toyota's in the Top 5 now.

[Simmi]

Come on Ott bring it home!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Thierry Neuville‏ @thierryneuville
SS14 "Good stage for us. I'm enjoying. I decided to keep good tyres for the Power Stage tomorrow so I have to be more careful now"

[stefanvv]

Lol at Neuville so sure he would be first. Said that 2 times at least now

So far he must be happy with his car having almost no issues (this season). Sordo & Paddon can't say the same.

[Watson]

Three Toyota's in the Top 5 now.
It only took 2 Citroens, 2 Hyundais and 2 Fords to go to destination fucked for them to achieve that.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

It only took 2 Citroens, 2 Hyundais and 2 Fords to go to destination fucked for them to achieve that.

Ouch.. harsh ! :D

[Tsiiem]

It only took 2 Citroens, 2 Hyundais and 2 Fords to go to destination fucked for them to achieve that.

Actually 3 Citroens and 3 Fords...

[dimviii]

Sat 17:03 - SS14: Breen
Ongoing handling concerns for Craig in the C3. "It's the same. When we have the correct roads the car is awesome but the window is so fine..."

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Hanninen slow !! I jinxed the Toyota's...

[dimviii]

Hanninen on problems

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Front diff broken for Mikkelsen.

[Watson]

Mikkelsen some 30 sec off the pace of Sordo on the 4th split as well.

[KKS]

another gift for Ogier?

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Ogier just cruising now I think... cant catch those ahead on pace.

[dimviii]

Lappi will change positions with Hanninen now

[Watson]

Ogier just cruising now I think... cant catch those ahead on pace.
Yeah he's best chances of climbing now are others to drop out, which we have seen this afternoon.

Edit: He is only 15 sec clear of Østberg though.

[Mirek]

After SS14 exactly one second between Camilli and Kopecký.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Yeah he's best chances of climbing now are others to drop out, which we have seen this afternoon.

Edit: He is only 15 sec clear of Østberg though.

Think he'll settle for these positions and hope to win the power stage.

[Watson]

Wow Tanak on it again. I'm so scared he drops out when I see those splits.

[Eli]

I think it's 3rd time a lucky charm, hopefully Tanak wins, although for the championship it would be best if Neuville or/& Latvala finish as ahead as possible.

[Watson]

SS15 Ogier

"We came across the rear bumper of Lappi's car in the middle of the road. I had to slow. It's been a hard weekend so far."

It was actually Hanninens bumper.

[Mirek]

No power steering for Hänninen.

[mknight]

SS15 Ogier

"We came across the rear bumper of Lappi's car in the middle of the road. I had to slow. It's been a hard weekend so far."

It was actually Hanninens bumper.

Hanninen drives after Ogier. Some sort of teleport?

[dimviii]

Βreen slow 1st split

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Shit Tanak hit chicane ! Phew no problem.

[Watson]

Hanninen drives after Ogier. Some sort of teleport?

My bad. I assumed it was cause it said in Live Text that Hanninen lost his.

[dimviii]

so 24 sec for 42 stage km away from his first win.

Where is EstWRC?????????????????????????

[Watson]

Latvala now complaining he was stuck in Østbergs dust and hoping to get time back. This is a silly new trend. Thanks Neuville.

[macebig]

I think EstWRC had a heart attack when Paddon dropped out....

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Another stage win for Lappi.. impressive !

[abxyz]

Another stage win for Lappi

[stefanvv]

Guess what - Neuville would be leading the rally (still):D

[AnttiL]

Guess what - Neuville would be leading the rally (still):D

Not if Mikkelsen was in a Polo

[mknight]

Yes very good job from Lappi.

Consistently faster than Hanninen (even if you remove issues both had). Clearly without road position advantage stage times were a bit worse compared with yesterday but still some good ones.

Hope he keeps it up, his attitude is very Gronholm-like which is fun.

[Watson]

Not if Mikkelsen was in a Polo
Or Meeke wouldn't have a 'bad patch'.

[Watson]

SS15 Tanak

He completes 4.3sec quicker than Latvala and his overnight rally lead is up to 24.3sec. "This afternoon was surprisingly good. It has been good to drive up to now with a safe margin. Now we can push more. Tomorrow I don't see any reason my Latvala should be any quicker." Game on!

Push harder? Hold your horses man.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Link to Estonia rally forum, might be fun: http://www.rallifoorum.ee/foorum/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=5979&start=480

[mknight]

Not if Mikkelsen was in a Polo

I find this quote retarded, very much on same level as some troll I long ago have blocked.

[steve.mandzij]

Latvala now complaining he was stuck in Østbergs dust and hoping to get time back. This is a silly new trend. Thanks Neuville.
I hated the argument when Neuville did it, but I totally understand Latvala's frustration. After all the shit he got from Neuville in Portugal he ought to think it would be fair to get equal treatment.

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[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB-HduBXcAAR_qd.jpg

[steve.mandzij]

Hold on, wasn't Suninen supposed to be in a 2017 car, or was that for Poland?

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[Watson]

I hated the argument when Neuville did it, but I totally understand Latvala's frustration. After all the shit he got from Neuville in Portugal he ought to think it would be fair to get equal treatment.

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Two wrong decisions don't equal one correct one, especially in a sport where there are more than two competitors facing each other.

[Watson]

Hold on, wasn't Suninen supposed to be in a 2017 car, or was that for Poland?

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Poland and Finland.

[dimviii]

Camilli will be on Raux dust probably

[DonJippo]

I find this quote retarded, very much on same level as some troll I long ago have blocked.

But it is not, it is just a joke.

[Mirek]

So after second leg Kopecký 0,9 seconds ahead of Camilli. Nice fight!

[AnttiL]

I find this quote retarded, very much on same level as some troll I long ago have blocked.

Sorry, couldn't resist :p but I think that's enough of those jokes for me :)

For the record, I was happy to see Andreas back, and I wasn't expecting a top result. Still a disappointment after all the hype.

EDIT: Another point - if Citroen offers Mikkelsen more drives, does he even want them anymore in that problematic car?

[AnttiL]

So after second leg Kopecký 0,9 seconds ahead of Camilli. Nice fight!

Although Camilli is not running for WRC2 points so Kopecky ignores his results

[Mirek]

Although Camilli is not running for WRC2 points so Kopecky ignores his results

Theoretically, but I don't think he does. Kopecký doesn't do whole WRC2 and for him it's about individual events not about championship.

[BigWorm]

Latvala now complaining he was stuck in Østbergs dust and hoping to get time back. This is a silly new trend. Thanks Neuville.

This is nothing new. Whinish yes, but drivers before this season have complained in same circumstances.

[stefanvv]

Two wrong decisions don't equal one correct one, especially in a sport where there are more than two competitors facing each other.

Yes they do. Latvala is fighting for the win as much as Neuville was in Portugal. They're still wrong decisions though and Neuville won't be justified.

[KKS]

Interesting to read new in-car stage end comments from Mikkelsen

[EstWRC]

https://image.ibb.co/eT5S0v/Photo_10_06_2017_19_17_07.jpg

[Eric]

https://image.ibb.co/eT5S0v/Photo_10_06_2017_19_17_07.jpg

Stop it Neuville. Embarrassing

[Allez Andruet]

https://image.ibb.co/eT5S0v/Photo_10_06_2017_19_17_07.jpg

Pathetic. Grow up, please.

[Watson]

hahahaha I thought one of you guys faked it.

[wrc2017]

Has he really only the mental capacity of a 4 year old? I didnt know that
Pathetic. Grow up, please.

[dimviii]

https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/41/27/Rallye-Sardinien-2017-080_412767_593bb1689.jpg
https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/41/28/Rallye-Sardinien-2017-077_412811_593bb16c6.jpg
https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/41/27/Rallye-Sardinien-2017-076_412749_593bb166e.jpg

[mknight]

Sorry, couldn't resist but I think that's enough of those jokes for me

For the record, I was happy to see Andreas back, and I wasn't expecting a top result. Still a disappointment after all the hype.

EDIT: Another point - if Citroen offers Mikkelsen more drives, does he even want them anymore in that problematic car?

Well was a bit retarded reaction from me as well.


Anyway to the last point, I was thinking about exactly the same thing.

After today I think we can conclude that Citroen indeed is a problematic car.

As late as after Portugal I was arguing how car is just fine and only Meeke is a problem, based on Breen's performance.

Now I agree car has issues, based on Breen's and Mikkelsen's performance.

Mikkelsen's progress was very limited and the comments and reactions not good (not talking about the comments for media with happy face on).
Breen was 1s away from winning a stage only to complain about undriveable car on next and loosing 1 min on the last (even without a spin that's really slow).

So car is difficult to setup and/or has a very narrow "sweetspot".

This still does not change my opinion about Meeke crashing. Retiring after 3 stages in consecutive rallies clearly doesn't help in car setup and development and yes you can try driving a bit safer. And no Mikkelsen didn't suddenly forgot how to drive after winning his last WRC round beating Ogier and Latvala in same car in straight fight.

The two questions:

1. If Citroen offered Mikkelsen contract for whole next year+, should/would he accept?
Based on this event so far the clear answer is no. He can risk getting stuck in twitchy car, then without a seat if Citroen pulls out, with people doubting his speed (after multiple rallies with bad car). Atkinson comes to mind.

I don't remember how the contracts are but even now there are at least 2 seats in other teams that are not so safe.

Hanninen - clearly slower than Lappi (not to mention Latvala), crashing.
Paddon -being in one of the two best if not the the best car and only having one 5th place after 7 rallies.

I don't see any other driver ready to step in that is clearly faster driver than these two. Sunninen probably is the nearest with potential, but he was decimated by Mikkelsen in the WRC2 rounds this year.

2. If Citroen offers him more rallies this year without further commitment should he accept?

This one is more difficult. You could say that sitting at home for a rally is worse than driving it...
I'd say yes but with one or both of these conditions:
- it would have to be a rally where C3 is likely to be fast and Mikkelsen is known to perform good in (so Poland, Germany, Spain, maybe Finland)
- proper test for setting up the car will be included

If none of these two is satisfied then I'd say no.

[Watson]

Maybe it is still slightly too early to slag Citroen off. It is Mikkelsens first rally in it let's not forget. Maybe over the course of three events with intesive testing he could get it more to his liking - maybe not.

If the C3 really turns out to be a dog though I wonder if Lefebvre is by far not as bad as he looked as well.

[BigWorm]

Mikkelsen definitely needs more time in the car. Swap duty with Meeke for Poland perhaps? Meeke deffo needs a reset, he hasn't done well in Poland in the past and his championship is over anyway. Mikkelsen on the other hand knows Poland well, give him some decent testing and a decent enough result might be on the table.

[mknight]

Maybe it is still slightly too early to slag Citroen off. It is Mikkelsens first rally in it let's not forget. Maybe over the course of three events with intesive testing he could get it more to his liking - maybe not.

If the C3 really turns out to be a dog though I wonder if Lefebvre is by far not as bad as he looked as well.

I would agree with that, if it wasn't for Breen's performance on SS 13-14-15 and his comments.

[stefanvv]

Well Breen certainly isn't a bad driver, and even he struggles this rally with right setup, presuming he has near as much test kms as Meeke. Citroen has 2 major problems, the car, and the leading driver.

[macebig]

Seriously, is Neuville trying to wrestle the whiner's award away from Ogier?WTF is that?"Oh, I fell into someone's dust.Give me time." " Oh, my brakes had a problem, otherwise I win." and the worst of it "My team mates are useless, I am a God for winning". 2015 isn't that far away, Thierry...

[Watson]

I would agree with that, if it wasn't for Breen's performance on SS 13-14-15 and his comments.
Oh the car is definitely pretty crap I mean it more in a 'is it that crap that it would justify Mikkelsen to turn down any more drives this year or a contract for next year' way.

[dimviii]

https://www.ewrc.cz/images/2017/photos/rally_italia_sardegna_2017/tw_3d5k7517.jpg
https://www.ewrc.cz/images/2017/photos/rally_italia_sardegna_2017/tw_3d5k7438.jpg
https://www.ewrc.cz/images/2017/photos/rally_italia_sardegna_2017/tw_3d5k7455.jpg

[Watson]

Does anyone know by what time we would know if Latvala gets time back or not?

[Andre Oliveira]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DB-2Lw3XYAA_wtR?format=jpg&name=large

[AL14]

Hello guys. Too tired to write something about the rally. Will do it tomorrow maybe. But I think this has been the best I've ever seen. The new cars on gravel are amazing! You should go see them if you haven't yet!

So sad for Paddon, really. But I am also happy to see Tanak leading, will not say more because this time I don't want to jinx anyone! :D

[PLuto]

Does anyone know by what time we would know if Latvala gets time back or not?

Depends on stewards. It can be anytime until the posting of final official results.

[SubaruNorway]

In the Citroën live tonight Mikkelsen said the car was more setup for Meeke's driving style with more left fot braking in the corners and that they couldn't change what they needed during the rally.

[Mirek]

That's probably pointing to mapping of center differential.

[mknight]

Does anyone know by what time we would know if Latvala gets time back or not?

I doubt it. There is no clear one sector difference.

Looking at the splits he was 0.3 behind Tanak and some 10s back in the end. So 10s might be the max. Problem is that Paddon at that point was 2.7 ahead of him and in the finish 3.8 ahead. So what are they supposed to do only use Tanak? Who guarantees that he would have kept same pace as Tanak and not same pace as Paddon f.e.?

I watched the replay. Yes he had to back off quite a few places, but the visibility for him was changing all the time, so how would they judge that. Count 0.3s here for lifting off, 0.2 there etc?

The end of the stage is funny. He is so angry he almost runs down the stop-post. Also I heard just about all the Finnish words I know there *Vittu etc :P

[dimviii]

That's probably pointing to mapping of center differential.

they can change center diff mapping at service.

[Mirek]

Yes, but if Mikkelsen's driving style is a lot different then they might not be able to do that without testing.

[steve.mandzij]

I doubt it. There is no clear one sector difference.

Looking at the splits he was 0.3 behind Tanak and some 10s back in the end. So 10s might be the max. Problem is that Paddon at that point was 2.7 ahead of him and in the finish 3.8 ahead. So what are they supposed to do only use Tanak? Who guarantees that he would have kept same pace as Tanak and not same pace as Paddon f.e.?

I watched the replay. Yes he had to back off quite a few places, but the visibility for him was changing all the time, so how would they judge that. Count 0.3s here for lifting off, 0.2 there etc?

The end of the stage is funny. He is so angry he almost runs down the stop-post. Also I heard just about all the Finnish words I know there *Vittu etc :P
Did you see that on WRC+? I've never heard Latvala curse!

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

[Sulland]

they can change center diff mapping at service.

Probably, but Mikkel need more testing km, to test several centerdiff options.
This is more or less same scenario as Ogier coming to Ford, centerdiff did nor suite him at all, but now it is ok.

[stefanvv]

I doubt it. There is no clear one sector difference.

Looking at the splits he was 0.3 behind Tanak and some 10s back in the end. So 10s might be the max. Problem is that Paddon at that point was 2.7 ahead of him and in the finish 3.8 ahead. So what are they supposed to do only use Tanak? Who guarantees that he would have kept same pace as Tanak and not same pace as Paddon f.e.?

I watched the replay. Yes he had to back off quite a few places, but the visibility for him was changing all the time, so how would they judge that. Count 0.3s here for lifting off, 0.2 there etc?

The end of the stage is funny. He is so angry he almost runs down the stop-post. Also I heard just about all the Finnish words I know there *Vittu etc :P

Paddon also lost time in Neuville's dust, I don't understand Your point. Latvalla progressively was losing time against Tanak.

[mknight]

Did you see that on WRC+? I've never heard Latvala curse!


Yes, dunno which of them says it though.

[steve.mandzij]

Paddon also lost time in Neuville's dust, I don't understand Your point. Latvalla progressively was losing time against Tanak.
Ostberg clearly held him up. He went from being just two tenths behind to losing five seconds between splits.

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[steve.mandzij]

Yes, dunno which of them says it though.
Oh, that could be. All I've ever heard Latvala say in the face of adversity was "ei voi ella totta" (I think it's spelled that way)

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[dimviii]

cant wait for the power stage,short one 6,96km,and plenty of crews that they want extra points.

[PLuto]

I doubt it. There is no clear one sector difference.

Looking at the splits he was 0.3 behind Tanak and some 10s back in the end. So 10s might be the max. Problem is that Paddon at that point was 2.7 ahead of him and in the finish 3.8 ahead. So what are they supposed to do only use Tanak? Who guarantees that he would have kept same pace as Tanak and not same pace as Paddon f.e.?

I watched the replay. Yes he had to back off quite a few places, but the visibility for him was changing all the time, so how would they judge that. Count 0.3s here for lifting off, 0.2 there etc?

The end of the stage is funny. He is so angry he almost runs down the stop-post. Also I heard just about all the Finnish words I know there *Vittu etc :P

For me it is stupidity to give notional times for this issues. It is just part of rally...