[WRC] News & Rumours (part V) 2017 [Archive] - Page 10

AnttiL

7th September 2017, 17:08

it's all about 2018. And Tanak move to Toyota and Mikkelsen 3 rally for Hyundai. It's just warm-up and practive with a car for 2018

But Tänak would have like 4 months to learn Finnish if he needed to.

Usually estonians already know finnish quite well as our languages are very similar ;)

I remember trying to talk English to a taxi driver in Tallinn and he said he speaks better Finnish than English. But it's that for the older generations who grew up in the Soviet years and could only see Western TV by tuning to Finnish stations and learning the language that way.

BTW I was thinking further about the language factors in Toyota. It could even be a problem if a part of the team speaks Finnish and some people don't understand it, even worse if there's a Finnish clique and an Estonian clique. I think Juho Hänninen said they try to remember to speak English at all times. But of course it could help the Finnish drivers with their limited English skills for the crucial discussions with the team managers, or trying to explain technical things to the engineers. Can't imagine how it's for Meeke and Breen at Citroen, and how it will turn if Ogier joins the team.

er88

7th September 2017, 19:32

Im sure i either read, or was told, that everyone speaks English at Toyota, for the most part. So there's no cliques that form.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

KKS

7th September 2017, 21:53

But Tänak would have like 4 months to learn Finnish if he needed to.

He already can start learn it :)

About Clark twitter and Sordo, I think it's a huge possibility of 4 car team for GB or maybe even for Australia for Hyundai, especially after Nandan interview to wrc.com. Dani know so he don't be dropped for GB/AUS , and reacted so aggressively

pantealex

8th September 2017, 07:52

About Clark twitter and Sordo, I think it's a huge possibility of 4 car team for GB or maybe even for Australia for Hyundai, especially after Nandan interview to wrc.com. Dani know so he don't be dropped for GB/AUS , and reacted so aggressively

I don´t see 4 cars in Australia, too costly and complicate.
But for Wales 4 is highly possible and also for some rallies in 2018.

Simmi

8th September 2017, 14:00

EstWRC

8th September 2017, 14:04

Ah that's why Noel said that ogier will be in a fiesta.

Big troubles ahead for PSA

cali

8th September 2017, 14:24

Here we go again ...

Rally Power

8th September 2017, 14:31

Story in the last couple of hours shows PSA might be on the verge of another Dieselgate scandal.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-peugeot-diesel/french-probe-alleges-2-million-psa-cars-had-engine-cheats-le-monde-idUSKCN1BJ12J?utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Co ntent&utm_content=59b275da04d3010185c8cdab&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter

We all know how that went for VAG.

Relax. VW was fu..ed big time just in the US and PSA don't sell cars there. No european government will undermine a european manufacturer. Besides, there’s a general perception that all manus were somehow involved in cheating emissions schemes…

Sulland

8th September 2017, 16:18

Story in the last couple of hours shows PSA might be on the verge of another Dieselgate scandal.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-peugeot-diesel/french-probe-alleges-2-million-psa-cars-had-engine-cheats-le-monde-idUSKCN1BJ12J?utm_campaign=trueAnthem:+Trending+Co ntent&utm_content=59b275da04d3010185c8cdab&utm_medium=trueAnthem&utm_source=twitter

We all know how that went for VAG.

All Manufacturers have challenges with high performance diesel engines and pollution. Pure physics!

mknight

8th September 2017, 18:12

All Manufacturers have challenges with high performance diesel engines and pollution. Pure physics!

Yes and no. The basic principle is true, higher combustion temperatures = more NOX. However, there is no real reason that AdBlue tanks need to be (fixed) small size and refilled over 20k km or so. Using more you could drop the emissions down, so it's partly manufacturers own choice to be close (or above) the limits.

Anyway as a last point on this off-topic subject I totally agree with Rally Power. VW got hurt because of US. European regulators barely give a warning to own manufacturers.

Rally Power

9th September 2017, 13:29

Besides Rovanpera, there’s another teen trying to get into WRC2 next year. Marco Bulacia, the 16yo Bolivian champ, was at Skoda and is planning to visit other teams during the next monthes. Meanwhile, he’ll continue to compete in the Italian gravel series.
https://www.facebook.com/MarquitoBulacia/

pantealex

19th September 2017, 08:09

Kalle Rovanperä is planning to do both Wales and Australia if he gets his driving license.
Co-driver will be Jonne Halttunen
Car Fiesta R5 from M-Sport.

Eli

19th September 2017, 16:26

https://www.motorsport.com/wrc/news/loeb-set-for-citroen-gravel-test-on-wednesday-955330/

Loeb will test on gravel tomorrow.

Tarmop

20th September 2017, 15:12

pantealex

21st September 2017, 10:06

https://www.motorsport-news.co.uk/news/rallying-news/wrc/rovanpera-secures-wrc2-deal-with-m-sport/

Umm, i remembered that being 17, he can`t compete on most of the wrc2 events and that Hyundai thing is just "for fun". What am i misunderstanding?

Story says that he can compete in 6 WRC2 events, I don´t think he would have much more even if he is 18y. He is still bid "wild card".

dimviii

29th September 2017, 15:47

RallyingUK *
TIDEMAND: Where next for Pontus? “We’ll meet some people in Spain next week” says @VeibyErik ▶︎ https://www.vf.se/rally/nu-ar-pontus-nasta-pusselbit/*… #WRC @VFHedlund

BleAivano

30th September 2017, 08:34

RallyingUK *
TIDEMAND: Where next for Pontus? “We’ll meet some people in Spain next week” says @VeibyErik ▶︎ https://www.vf.se/rally/nu-ar-pontus-nasta-pusselbit/ #WRC @VFHedlund

Fixed your link.

KiwiWRCfan

30th September 2017, 08:58

tommeke_B

30th September 2017, 14:01

French newspaper Le Dauphine Libere has a lead story on possible changes to Rally Monte Carlo from 2019 in particular a return to Valence http://www.ledauphine.com/drome/2017/09/30/avant-le-rallye-le-criterium-du-dauphine-et-le-tour

A few years ago they said that Monte Carlo would return to Valence in 2017... I think as long the region of Gap supports the event nothing will change. ;)

Essaj

2nd October 2017, 10:13

Buagsports‏ @buagsports
Congratulations @KalleRovanpera !The Drivers Licence is yours!

Kalle Rovanperä has succesfully completed his driving test!

AL14

2nd October 2017, 11:14

Buagsports‏ @buagsports
Congratulations @KalleRovanpera !The Drivers Licence is yours!

Kalle Rovanperä has succesfully completed his driving test!

It should've been hard for him. Congrats!

liposh

2nd October 2017, 11:49

Would be quite funny in case of not passing the test :D On the other hand it must be big pressure that everybody expects him to pass, so hats off.

sindroms

2nd October 2017, 12:05

Would be quite funny in case of not passing the test :D

It was funny - when 5 years ago Vasiliy Gryazin did not succeed to get his driver licence several times in a row. One of "reason" in one of the unsuccessful occasions was announced - "he doesn't feel car good enough" :D

AnttiL

2nd October 2017, 12:06

electroliquid

2nd October 2017, 12:08

AnttiL

2nd October 2017, 12:09

This video just in :D https://twitter.com/KalleRovanpera/status/914812486880317442

AnttiL

2nd October 2017, 12:10

So maybe some rallies in Latvia and/or Finland?

Neste Rally Finland for sure. Not sure if Latvia has anything to give for him anymore?

electroliquid

2nd October 2017, 12:16

I'm also not sure, but as they say "practice makes perfect", also ERC should be good enough if there no better options...

AnttiL

2nd October 2017, 12:21

I'm also not sure, but as they say "practice makes perfect", also ERC should be good enough if there no better options...

But he can only do rallies in Finland, GB and Latvia in Europe. Mexico, Argentina and Australia have a lower age for driving, that's why he's going to those events.

electroliquid

2nd October 2017, 12:25

Yes, I know that, I meant ERC Liepaja event in Latvia, it should be in calendar next year. Also Latvia and Finland has snow/ice events, witch could be useful to improve skills on that surface.

tommeke_B

2nd October 2017, 12:26

But he can only do rallies in Finland, GB and Latvia in Europe. Mexico, Argentina and Australia have a lower age for driving, that's why he's going to those events.

Why? I know with an Estonian license for example you can drive wherever you want at the age of 17. Karl Kruuda has done JWRC and plenty of European rallies at the age of 17. Also PJM Cracco did WRC Portugal at the age of 17 and everything was fine. If you have a valid driver's license, and you have a valid competitor's license, you can drive.

AnttiL

2nd October 2017, 12:30

Why? I know with an Estonian license for example you can drive wherever you want at the age of 17. Karl Kruuda has done JWRC and plenty of European rallies at the age of 17. Also PJM Cracco did WRC Portugal at the age of 17 and everything was fine. If you have a valid driver's license, and you have a valid competitor's license, you can drive.

with S1600 cars, yes. That would be going backwards for Kalle at this point.

sindroms

2nd October 2017, 12:35

Neste Rally Finland for sure. Not sure if Latvia has anything to give for him anymore?

We were privileged here in Latvia to see young star rising and we would like to see him to continue here. But I totally agree to AnttiL - Kalle has taken now from Latvia everything Latvia could give. It's time to move further - different rallies, different surfaces, different experience.

Tarmop

2nd October 2017, 13:01

Special permissions from local FIA represenatives. The legal age for a full licence is still 18 in Estonia. You can make a "limited license" at the age of 16, but they are only valid in Estonia and with a co-passenger with real B-cat. license for atleast two years (and he or she has to be a parrent or authorized by one). There have been cases in the local championship, were a youngster had, but couldn`t compete with a 4wd N group car...maybe this became a rule later, because i remember him doing a couple of events. Anyway he spent another season or 2 in a 2wd.

Essaj

2nd October 2017, 13:13

Kalle also still has his permit to drive in Italian championship so he might do couple more rounds in there also.

the sniper

2nd October 2017, 17:11

Kalle's BRC season will probably be quite short. The two first events are at the same time as WRC rallies of Mexico and Argentina, which he will prefer. Then the third event is Ypres, where his driver's license is not valid for rallying(?). Then he can do Ulster, Isle of Man and of course Wales WRC rally.

When they said Kalle would do the British Rally Championship it struck the fear of God into the BRC organisers... 'Oh no, some spectators might turn up, ruining our non-event rallies!'. Luckily they were able to configure the Championship calendar to ensure the BRC stays as an irrelevant private clubmans series...

macebig

2nd October 2017, 17:47

When they said Kalle would do the British Rally Championship it struck the fear of God into the BRC organisers... 'Oh no, some spectators might turn up, ruining our non-event rallies!'. Luckily they were able to configure the Championship calendar to ensure the BRC stays as an irrelevant private clubmans series...

Why would they do that? British Rally Championship was the most important national rally championship in the world, once upon a time. Won't the organizers try everything in their power to restore the championship to its former glory?

the sniper

3rd October 2017, 02:30

Why would they do that? British Rally Championship was the most important national rally championship in the world, once upon a time. Won't the organizers try everything in their power to restore the championship to its former glory?

I've been losing faith in them since 2016 and this calendar situation is incomprehensible. Excluding Rally GB from both Championships, there are 5 rounds of the BRC, 12 rounds of the WRC... How the heck and for what reason have they managed to clash with the WRC for not one, but two rounds?!

I think it's more polite to assume that there's a MSA conspiracy to inhibit the popularity of the BRC so they can more easily implement the changes of the spectator safety review than acknowledge the probable reality, that the organisers of the BRC neither have the vision, resources or ability to allow the BRC to do anything but just about survive, rather than thrive...

Kalle Rovanpera coming to the BRC was like a free gift for the 'promoter', it looks like they've managed to squander that opportunity before we even get to 2018.

sonnybobiche

3rd October 2017, 04:07

The modern British character is particularly weak after decades under the yoke of health and safety experts running their lives for them. The MSA has no backbone to fight the forest commission or any other unelected bureaucrat who wants to get rid of rallying. It's managed decline, like everything else in Europe.

The MSA are just go-along get-along goo with no fight in them. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I won't be.

SubaruNorway

3rd October 2017, 07:47

But i guess 5 of 7 rounds will also count next year in BRC?

Archie Gillaine

3rd October 2017, 07:56

I've been losing faith in them since 2016 and this calendar situation is incomprehensible. Excluding Rally GB from both Championships, there are 5 rounds of the BRC, 12 rounds of the WRC... How the heck and for what reason have they managed to clash with the WRC for not one, but two rounds?!

I think it's more polite to assume that there's a MSA conspiracy to inhibit the popularity of the BRC so they can more easily implement the changes of the spectator safety review than acknowledge the probable reality, that the organisers of the BRC neither have the vision, resources or ability to allow the BRC to do anything but just about survive, rather than thrive...

Kalle Rovanpera coming to the BRC was like a free gift for the 'promoter', it looks like they've managed to squander that opportunity before we even get to 2018.

IMS aren't great at promoting, the BRC in it's revamp hasn't been a spectacular success. As for Kalle, he'd have made little difference to the popularity of the BRC, not even Ogier et al can do anything when the sport is completely invisible.

Archie Gillaine

3rd October 2017, 07:57

The MSA has no backbone to fight the forest commission or any other unelected bureaucrat who wants to get rid of rallying. It's managed decline, like everything else in Europe.

The MSA are just go-along get-along goo with no fight in them. I'd love to be proven wrong, but I won't be.

There's the main problem with British Rallying....the MSA.

Barreis

3rd October 2017, 16:18

What's this, BRC or WRC thread?!

the sniper

4th October 2017, 01:46

As for Kalle, he'd have made little difference to the popularity of the BRC, not even Ogier et al can do anything when the sport is completely invisible.

I don't entirely agree. Kalle at least attracts the interest of the hardcore who follow rallying, like us on this forum. Maybe the buzz around him would interest the people who more causally follow rallying, but are currently uninterested in the BRC 'product'. There is an audience for rallying in the UK, the WRC highlights on Channel 5 usually get around 300k viewers. Look how many people make the effort to turn out for Rally GB each year or the Roger Albert Clark, or at least have done historically in the case of the latter.

The greatest embarrassment for the BRC is that it barely attracts the interest of even the hardcore rally fans! The worst thing is, I just don't feel this even concerns IMS...

What's this, BRC or WRC thread?!

Indeed, sorry! I've vented now, I'm done. :D

dimviii

5th October 2017, 18:42

any news?

http://forum-rallye.com/uploads/monthly_10_2017/post-157-0-64442300-1507184608.jpg

Rally Power

5th October 2017, 22:42

any news?

First part Neuville talks about the title chances and his commitment to get it, plus some considerations on the season, the i20 and the team. Second is a series of unpleasant comments on Ogier (the permanent moaning, the lucky errors, etc), revealing they’re not the best friends. Funny to see that he says Ogier often tries to destabilized his competitors but he's clearly using this interview to piss off Ogier…

focus206

5th October 2017, 23:32

First part Neuville talks about the title chances and his commitment to get it, plus some considerations on the season, the i20 and the team. Second is a series of unpleasant comments on Ogier (the permanent moaning, the lucky errors, etc), revealing they’re not the best friends. Funny to see that he says Ogier often tries to destabilized his competitors but he's clearly using this interview to piss off Ogier…

Is he saying he thinks he has 70% of chances to become champion? As much as I want Thierry to win the championship this year, it'll hardly happen if Ogier won't hit trouble. And from the way Neuville is driving, he's more likely to hit trouble than Seb.

dupanton

6th October 2017, 06:57

More than 70% even... He needs to be confident to have a shot ;)

jparker

6th October 2017, 07:40

AnttiL

6th October 2017, 07:45

In Ogier's defense, his car is not up to the job, but that's something Ford boys are constantly denying.

The car "not up to the job" is going to win the manufacturer's championship, even if Ogier does not become driver's champion.

er88

6th October 2017, 07:46

Neuville is the champ for 2017 in my book. I know consistency is part of the game, but without those silly mistakes in the beginning, we wouldn't talk about Ogier at all now. Also, there were few events where things were fare and square for both of them, and Neuville won easily. In Ogier's defense, his car is not up to the job, but that's something Ford boys are constantly denying. In any case, we can all see that Ogier (and probably Loeb) are not super humans if they don't have superior machinery in their hands.
There's so much wrong with this post. Congratulations...

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

macebig

6th October 2017, 08:01

Man, your hatred for Ford clearly needs to be taken care of..

jparker

6th October 2017, 08:33

The car "not up to the job" is going to win the manufacturer's championship, even if Ogier does not become driver's champion.

Yes but why? Because is better, or because all other teams had plenty of tech issues?

jparker

6th October 2017, 08:36

Man, your hatred for Ford clearly needs to be taken care of..

Well, you tell me why Ogier is not dominant this year then? Because he lost his driver's skills, or because of the car? Explain to me, I'm open for opinions.

AnttiL

6th October 2017, 08:37

Yes but why? Because is better, or because all other teams had plenty of tech issues?

Having as little tech issues as possible is a major part of winning the championship.

greencroft

6th October 2017, 08:37

Yes but why? Because is better, or because all other teams had plenty of tech issues?

I would think that NOT having tech issues is a big part of being better.

AnttiL

6th October 2017, 08:39

Well, you tell me why Ogier is not dominant this year then? Because he lost his driver's skills, or because of the car? Explain to me, I'm open for opinions.

It's always difficult to jump into new team and new car. Also, the new cars made the situation more equal for all teams, everyone started from scratch.

jparker

6th October 2017, 08:43

I would think that NOT having tech issues is a big part of being better.

It depends what are you looking for. Car can be fast, reliable, or both. In terms of reliability, Ford started bad, but got it sorted and the end result is visible.
But in terms of speed and handling (Citroent excepted) , Ford is way back.

AnttiL

6th October 2017, 08:44

But in terms of speed and handling (Citroent excepted) , Ford is way back.

So Ogier, Tänak, Evans, Østberg and Suninen are superior drivers to make all those stage wins and podiums?

AMSS

6th October 2017, 08:44

It depends what are you looking for. Car can be fast, reliable, or both. In terms of reliability, Ford started bad, but got it sorted and the end result is visible.
But in terms of speed and handling (Citroent excepted) , Ford is way back.

Are you really serious?? Please inform us others where Ford/M-sport has been is way back in terms of speed before Catalunya?

jparker

6th October 2017, 08:47

Are you really serious?? Please inform us others where Ford/M-sport has been is way back in terms of speed before Catalunya?

On all events where Meeke, Latvala, Neuville had tech issues and had to retire.

AnttiL

6th October 2017, 08:49

On all events where Meeke, Latvala, Neuville had tech issues and had to retire.

Meeke in Tour De Corse, Latvala in Poland and Finland, Neuville in...? M-Sport didn't win those three rallies.

macebig

6th October 2017, 08:50

Let's see. The Polo was tailor made to Ogier's driving style (like the DS3 and the C4 were to Loeb's). On the other hand, the Fiesta was developed by different drivers (mainly Tanak, Matt Wilson and to a lesser extent Ostberg). Ogier had to adapt to a pre existing situation. Plus, the M Sport Fords were always made to work with different styles of driving and not purpose built for a single driver like the VW and the Loeb Citroen. So, this explains why Ogier is not dominant anymore. On the contrary, this year the car that has been proven to fit someone like a glove is the i20.

jparker

6th October 2017, 08:54

Meeke in Tour De Corse, Latvala in Poland and Finland, Neuville in...? M-Sport didn't win those three rallies.

Well, you are actually further more making my point here, thanks.

AMSS

6th October 2017, 08:55

Meeke in Tour De Corse, Latvala in Poland and Finland, Neuville in...? M-Sport didn't win those three rallies.

It`s not worth showing the facts that M-sport currently has a top car both speed and reliability vise on all surfaces to someone who apparently has been bullied as a kid by some Ford owners or failed to get Malcom Wilsons autograph sometime or whatever the reason is for not seeing what`s going on. I`m not a M-sport/Ford fan by no means but still it`s clear they have a very good car.

jparker

6th October 2017, 08:57

AnttiL

6th October 2017, 08:58

Are you saying Ogier needs to get use to team and car for entire season? What kind of cham is he then? Mikkelsen drove Citroen few times, and got 2nd in Germany. Please stop this silly excuses.

Mikkelsen did two full rallies before that. Ogier won his first rally in the Fiesta.

er88

6th October 2017, 08:59

Mikkelsen did two full rallies before that. Ogier won his first rally in the Fiesta.Yep, plus Andreas was absolutely nowhere in his first two outings in the C3.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

jparker

6th October 2017, 09:00

It`s not worth showing the facts that M-sport currently has a top car both speed and reliability vise on all surfaces to someone who apparently has been bullied as a kid by some Ford owners or failed to get Malcom Wilsons autograph sometime or whatever the reason is for not seeing what`s going on. I`m not a M-sport/Ford fan by no means but still it`s clear they have a very good car.

If you measure potential of WRC car based on ranking, you are way off. Ford will be cham, so what? Does it make it best car? Of course not. Proper Tech Benchmarking will put Ford way back.

jparker

6th October 2017, 09:01

Yep, plus Andreas was absolutely nowhere in his first two outings in the C3.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

So what? He needed one event to get use to it. Ogier need how much? 2-3 years?

AMSS

6th October 2017, 09:04

If you measure potential of WRC car based on ranking, you are way off. Ford will be cham, so what? Does it make it best car? Of course not. Proper Tech Benchmarking will put Ford way back.

Ok please show us all the Proper Tech Benchmarking

AnttiL

6th October 2017, 09:05

So what? He needed one event to get use to it. Ogier need how much? 2-3 years?

No, he's leading the championship. Mikkelsen is nowhere near that level.

jparker

6th October 2017, 09:08

No, he's leading the championship. Mikkelsen is nowhere near that level.

Ok, I give up, you win. Lets follow the rally now.

dupanton

6th October 2017, 12:41

Listening to the pre event interviews, it seems that drivers are quite harsh towards there team management.
Meeke said the team is unstable becaue of the decisions by the management and they really need stability now.
Also, Sordo stating it's not fair to drop Paddon. They should have had more patient with him, as often the lack of result was due to technical problems.

A FONDO

7th October 2017, 10:42

Neuville is the champ for 2017 in my book. In Ogier's defense, his car is not up to the job, but that's something Ford boys are constantly denying. In any case, we can all see that Ogier (and probably Loeb) are not super humans if they don't have superior machinery in their hands.

Boy, you are totally helpless :laugh:

Frostmourne

9th October 2017, 10:38

In my book, M-Sport deserve the championship for all those years commitment to the WRC and the sport in general. Although I wished others driver would get the championship... but Ogier was super consistent and driving smartly where others were fast and maybe driving recklessly..

denkimi

9th October 2017, 13:28

ESTR

9th October 2017, 15:42

This was neuvilles championship to win, but he lost it because of his own mistakes. 20+ points in monte, 20+ points in sweden, +-20 points in spain. He could have been leading the championship by a big margin.

True about Neuville. That cut in Germany says a lot and then 3 more in Spain. And still we see a lot of cutting by Sordo and Mikkelsen in powerstage, like they have learned nothing by the weekend... Sorry but better have a little slower time than retiring immediately. And more chances for beating Ogier

N.O.T

9th October 2017, 16:14

This was neuvilles championship to win, but he lost it because of his own mistakes. 20+ points in monte, 20+ points in sweden, +-20 points in spain. He could have been leading the championship by a big margin.

exactly... potato dog is nothing... he lost the championship to the slowest ford of the season... back in the potato field where he belongs.

ESTR

9th October 2017, 16:31

But what about his performance in Argentina? He did pretty well. Like Ogier last year in Spain. He took all and win

Tarmop

9th October 2017, 16:35

What about it? He has won three times this season and he still is where he is...

spiderem

9th October 2017, 17:10

“It’s not important how many times you fall down, it’s more important how many times you stand up again" well Kris, thanks for the facebook inspirational quote but at some point stakeholders at high level will not accept anymore your falls down... arsh cruelty of sport (and life).

rhm

9th October 2017, 17:17

... at some point stakeholders at high level will not accept anymore your falls down... arsh cruelty of sport (and life).

A win now and again definitely helps

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

ESTR

9th October 2017, 17:28

And everyone bet on Tanak next year, like on the start of season everyone was on Paddon, because of his rise previous years. And look him now he is frustrated and down the leaderboard. No one said that Kris would be real contender next year. Maybe next year Breen (if Citroen would not dump him for half of season) would be even better. We will see. And Hanninen was pretty bad at the start now he is shining for Toyota. Last rallies also Lefebvre come to pretty good results for him (no retirements).

One guy that bother me is Suninen. Sorry but that kid is so ungrateful. He always complains and is so hard on himself. He is doing great and he still are not happy. If he won World CHampionship he would be saying that this is not enough haha

spiderem

9th October 2017, 17:29

A win now and again definitely helps

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

it helps for sure but stakeholders want championships...

Rallyper

9th October 2017, 18:11

True about Neuville. That cut in Germany says a lot and then 3 more in Spain. And still we see a lot of cutting by Sordo and Mikkelsen in powerstage, like they have learned nothing by the weekend... Sorry but better have a little slower time than retiring immediately. And more chances for beating Ogier

I´m not sure the cut in Spain has been talked thru completely yet. That cut was not extraordinary. The car let him down. And maybe it has done it more times this year. I think Hyundai has a lot of details to improve stregth on.

Tarmop

9th October 2017, 18:28

Well, there was quite a big rock and if you think about his broken wheels in recce...
His car has also saved him quite a bit this year. Was it Argentina where he was going sideways in a rough ditch, almost rolling, but saved it+ won the stage?

mknight

9th October 2017, 19:04

Yeah I do wonder why ESTR has to go deep into the cuts ;)

Watch a few onboards from spain, everyone took cuts, specially in the one that cost Sordo and Mikkelsen their wheels. Every single one of the top drivers was in the cut, Tanak even as much as Sordo. (and got broken - trough rim from that).

dimviii

9th October 2017, 19:08

we don't know how deep they cut the other drivers.Few centimetres can be crucial at this cut, considering the big photo from the cut I posted before some pages.If we had video from other driversfrom another angle maybewe could understand more.

mknight

9th October 2017, 19:14

Plenty of onboards on WRC+ (promo code is in the other thread), Tanak vs Sordo comparison was even in the daily highlights.

Even though it looks similar there can off course also be differences in the angle of the frontwheels. As I said on Saturday the Hyundais are probably likely to turn the wheels more due to the understeering issue they had.

Anyway my point now wasn't to argue about centimeters, just to remind that all drivers were cutting.
Btw. remember the cut that almost caused both Tanak and Østberg to crash due to bottoming-out in something like 6th corner of SS7.

jbmarcus21

10th October 2017, 09:02

with 12SS + 20kms adding in timetable, the new Tour de Corse road program is online → http://bit.ly/2g8LZSS

AnttiL

10th October 2017, 10:05

with 12SS + 20kms adding in timetable, the new Tour de Corse road program is online → http://bit.ly/2g8LZSS

2nd stage looks like the second half of Corte-Taverna, the stage that was fatal in 1986. But the tragedy happened on the first half.

jparker

10th October 2017, 16:05

2nd stage looks like the second half of Corte-Taverna, the stage that was fatal in 1986. But the tragedy happened on the first half.
Are you talking about superstition here, or you believe the stage is dangerous? While stages can be classified based of risk factors, tragedy can happen everywhere.

AnttiL

10th October 2017, 16:12

Are you talking about superstition here, or you believe the stage is dangerous? While stages can be classified based of risk factors, tragedy can happen everywhere.

Just an interesting detail. I mean, Corte-Taverna was driven as it was until the 1990's and we didn't get more fatal accidents there, so obviously it's not a super dangerous road

Myrvold

10th October 2017, 20:59

Mikkelsen did two full rallies before that. Ogier won his first rally in the Fiesta.

Still, wouldn't Ogier have had around the same, if not more time in the car before Monte, than Mikkelsen had when he started Germany?

sonnybobiche

10th October 2017, 23:29

Don't worry, guys, Corsica has the lowest average speed in the championship, so it is definitely the safest possible rally.

Unlike that stage in Sweden. Total deathtrap!

wrc2017

11th October 2017, 08:27

those same stakeholders have responsibilty to provide a championship winning car.
it helps for sure but stakeholders want championships...

spiderem

11th October 2017, 15:21

those same stakeholders have responsibilty to provide a championship winning car.
Malcom is excelling in that!

tommeke_B

13th October 2017, 11:49

https://www.motorsport-news.co.uk/news/rallying-news/wrc/junior-world-rally-championship-revamped/ "The decision to reduce the number of rallies is born out of the desire to cut costs involved." Well, 150 000 GBP (roughly 170 000 euros) isn't cheap for 5 events, and it happens to be the same cost as this year for 6 events... Add the personal expenses and it'll cost around 200 000 euros to do the championship. Not very accessible for youngsters, you need huge backing and get almost no return from it.

Simmi

13th October 2017, 12:01

Jewy46

13th October 2017, 12:24

Yeah it's starting to fall apart again is the championship. Rob Duggan is a really talented guy who got shafted this year from what I can see despite supposedly having some of the prize paid for.

Osian Pryce won the title last year and it's not really helped him kick on this year has it. Limited WRC2 'paired' outings with no testing is tough.

It's such a pity guys like Duggan who have serious talent will find it extremely difficult to make a serious impression without massive financial backing.
Unfortunately that's the way it has always been in rallying and I can't see that changing.

The worst thing about Duggan's case was that he was promised money and he planned the whole Championship based around that. Then the promised money didnt come in the way it was supposed to.

More info here: http://www.irishexaminer.com/sport/other-sports/rob-duggans-dream-of-top-flight-racing-fades-456822.html

“Talent doesn’t get you anywhere.” .........Says it all really!!

Of course he is one of a huge number of talented youngsters that may never get their chance

Archie Gillaine

13th October 2017, 13:06

Sadly, having the right passport also helps.....

the sniper

13th October 2017, 19:33

It's such a pity guys like Duggan who have serious talent will find it extremely difficult to make a serious impression without massive financial backing.
Unfortunately that's the way it has always been in rallying and I can't see that changing.

The worst thing about Duggan's case was that he was promised money and he planned the whole Championship based around that. Then the promised money didnt come in the way it was supposed to.

Another one failed by the BRC... Seeing him, Mattias Adielsson and Sindre Furuseth in their R2s were some of my highlights of the 2016 BRC season.

Sorry for dragging up the BRC again!

denkimi

13th October 2017, 20:43

Sadly, having the right passport also helps.....
And the right family.

Rally Power

15th October 2017, 22:49

According to Revista Scracth, future R2 regulations may include the use of a BoP system, to level down car performances. The engine layout (atmo or small turbo) isn’t yet decided, but it seems FIA intention is to make future R2 a bit slower than current ones, in order to establish a bigger difference to R3. RS got this info from Matton, during Rally Catalunya; Citroen boss also told they’ll only decide to make a R2 or R3 C3 after rules become known and the R5 properly developed.

AL14

16th October 2017, 08:28

Kimi Raikkonen said that in 2019 could come back to rally.

jparker

16th October 2017, 08:41

Kimi Raikkonen said that in 2019 could come back to rally.

Yes, they are on F1/WRC rotation with Kubica.

Essaj

16th October 2017, 13:50

Mäkinen confirms that Hänninen is not going to drive in Australia and that they will only have 2 cars there.

ESTR

16th October 2017, 21:18

Nandan at Hyundai says that they have no intererest of sign Ogier for 2018. Quite happy about that. Maybe I'm the only one. I don't care.

dimviii

16th October 2017, 21:41

Teemu / Rallirinki‏*@HartusvuoriWRC
Juha Kankkunen is suggesting his son Niko, 19, "might try" a few rallies next season with car from @TGardemeister. http://m.iltalehti.fi/ralli/201710132200458818_ri.shtml*…

AL14

17th October 2017, 13:21

Nandan at Hyundai says that they have no intererest of sign Ogier for 2018. Quite happy about that. Maybe I'm the only one. I don't care.

It's good for us that will have more chances to enjoy a more leveled championship. But he is going to regret it.

Fast Eddie WRC

17th October 2017, 13:32

If the M-Sport's trounce the Citroen's in GB I think that could tip Ogier into staying...

jbmarcus21

17th October 2017, 17:19

2018 Rally Sweden road program = 19SS + 314.51kms Norway loop DAY1 & new SS Torntorp + Torsby Sprint on DAY2 → http://bit.ly/2ysJSOv

AnttiL

17th October 2017, 17:37

Almost the same as this year, obviously the fast Knon stage replaced with Torntorp and like you said, Torsby Sprint added. Also Norway loop run in different order

SubaruNorway

17th October 2017, 19:00

Almost the same as this year, obviously the fast Knon stage replaced with Torntorp and like you said, Torsby Sprint added. Also Norway loop run in different order

Should be a new start to Hagfors adding about 7km. New start to Torsby also, seems like they've cut the fun part with the jumps...

jiipee64

18th October 2017, 06:53

Tanak confirmed for Toyota.

tommeke_B

18th October 2017, 07:11

Let's hope that leaves a seat for Suninen... :)

cali

18th October 2017, 07:12

And Malcolm starts raising up another youngster....

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

ESTR

18th October 2017, 07:13

Let's hope that leaves a seat for Suninen... :)

I cheer for Pontus instead. If Ogier leave maybe both be up in the game.

cali

18th October 2017, 07:20

Surely this means no deeper involvement by Ford unfortunately.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

EstWRC

18th October 2017, 07:23

i guess so yes but as far as i know Ott made the contract quite early and things may have changed since then but i doubt it.

ELPE

18th October 2017, 07:29

Let's hope that leaves a seat for Suninen... :)

Why not Pontus, he is the winner of WRC2?

tommeke_B

18th October 2017, 07:41

Why not Pontus, he is the winner of WRC2?

Why not Al-Attiyah, he has been winner of WRC2 twice?...

AL14

18th October 2017, 07:51

Suninen is a better prospect than Tidemand. I hope he will get the seat as well.

ESTR

18th October 2017, 07:52

Suninen is a better prospect than Tidemand. I hope he will get the seat as well.

And then Kalle came and took his seat...

bluuford

18th October 2017, 07:57

Surely this means no deeper involvement by Ford unfortunately.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

Dont worry, they are OK for next year, with better involvement;)

cali

18th October 2017, 08:02

Dont worry, they are OK for next year, with better involvement;)You mean for next few years? ;)
Glad to read that as it's essential for the WRC to have strong teams. Personally still going to root for M-Sport in the future as well.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

pantealex

18th October 2017, 08:02

Dont worry, they are OK for next year, with better involvement;)

What about You bluuford ?

Staying or going to TGR ?

ESTR

18th October 2017, 08:04

Dont worry, they are OK for next year, with better involvement;)

Will Ken Block fund programme with Hoonigan. Or Redbull, or maybe Qatar?? OneBet??

bluuford

18th October 2017, 08:10

What about You bluuford ?

Staying or going to TGR ?
Staying with Ott, so, TGR. I just have heard that Ford involvement is increasing, do not know any more details.

Andre Oliveira

18th October 2017, 08:17

Wish you good luck too Bluuford

pantealex

18th October 2017, 08:19

Staying with Ott, so, TGR.

Tere tulemast !

cali

18th October 2017, 08:20

Tere tulemast !You mean Tervetuloa!

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

tomhlord

18th October 2017, 08:35

Staying with Ott, so, TGR. I just have heard that Ford involvement is increasing, do not know any more details.

Will you change your forum name to reeeedwhiiiteblaaacktoyota? ;)

mknight

18th October 2017, 08:37

- Hope Tanak doesn't end like Martin and Duval after switching teams

- now if Ogier stays Citroen has a problem... if he leaves M-Sport has a problem

=> So overall not very happy about this from competition point of view, even at best it likely gives us 2,5 competitive teams next year.

Fast Eddie WRC

18th October 2017, 09:58

So the Tanak rumours were true. Shame for M-Sport but he had to secure his financial future.

I hope he doesnt come to regret it from a competitive point of view.

pantealex

18th October 2017, 15:34

So the Tanak rumours were true. Shame for M-Sport but he had to secure his financial future.

I hope he doesnt come to regret it from a competitive point of view.

Rumours?

Facts!

Many of us got info "deal done with Tänak" in July. Some of you just keep listening wrong guys...

Tarmop

18th October 2017, 15:52

ESTR

18th October 2017, 16:12

Fast Eddie WRC

18th October 2017, 16:34

Ogier confident after good M-Sport test...

https://www.motorsport-news.co.uk/news/rallying-news/wrc/ogier-welsh-test-could-be-key-to-title-success/

Mirek

18th October 2017, 16:51

You really can`t listen to everyone or quite the opposite, have to listen to everyone, as there are allways many who "know" everything and sometimes get it right. Those who really are known and close to teams/drivers, don`t reveal specifics.

You got that right. Now everyone is embrace yourself how they knew from the beginning. But few posts back they were sure about their ''reliable sources'' that he stays. Go with the flow they said...

Sorry guys, I can see that both of You are relatively new to the forum. Many of us are here for years, some of us for more than a decade. After such long time a lot of us know other users personally or at least know who are the trustable guys.

Don't feel offended. That's just how it is.

Tarmop

18th October 2017, 16:58

I know several commentators here who allways give 50-50 answers and in the process have failed or given false answers. Or make themselves interesting by saying/repeating something over and over again (ofc without saying the truth) .And even those who are usually correct, make mistakes. Been here also for a decade or so, just registered now. But you are also correct ofcourse and i didn`t mean to offend anyone also.

Fast Eddie WRC

18th October 2017, 18:19

Rumours?

Facts!

Many of us got info "deal done with Tänak" in July. Some of you just keep listening wrong guys...

Saying you have info is not the same as having facts. A fact requires supporting evidence.

Mirek

18th October 2017, 18:24

Saying you have info is not the same as having facts. A fact requires supporting evidence.

What kind of evidence do You want? A scan of the signed contract?

Get real, Eddie. There is no other way how we can get information before the official release than via rumors. You only need to read, listen and assess them carefully.

Rallyper

18th October 2017, 19:13

Saying you have info is not the same as having facts. A fact requires supporting evidence.

You don´t know how Pantealex gets his facts. Sorry man.

spiderem

18th October 2017, 19:15

Ogier confident after good M-Sport test...

https://www.motorsport-news.co.uk/news/rallying-news/wrc/ogier-welsh-test-could-be-key-to-title-success/

Ogier still the master in communicating and playing mind games...

bluuford

18th October 2017, 19:54

Tere tulemast !

Kiitos! Mutta mina ei puhu suomea, vain ymmärrän.. jotenkuten ;)

Fast Eddie WRC

19th October 2017, 16:28

Colin Clark‏ @voiceofrally
This is very very interesting - Rushbrook in particular knows all about MSport https://www.motorsport.com/nascar-cup/news/nascar-ford-performance-pericak-director-967352/ … via @motorsport

dimviii

19th October 2017, 21:01

Hanninen just before Catalunya found that he will not drive for Toyota for 2018

http://www.ksml.fi/urheilu/mm-ralli/Latvala-ja-H%C3%A4nninen-mukana-Peurunkarallissa/1057737?pwbi=d5a87d093ed479073d5a2e04e294cb3f

AnttiL

20th October 2017, 07:37

What I noticed is that only five drivers are doing a complete season this year: Ogier, Tänak, Evans, Latvala and Neuville. And interestingly, the only team to do so for all its drivers is M-Sport, the only privateer team. And probably that's also going to be the top 5 of the final scoreboard (Evans needs to get two point more than Sordo in two rallies, while Sordo is doing only one of the rallies).

KiwiWRCfan

20th October 2017, 08:02

Rally Australia entry list - still subject to FIA approval
includes Kalle Rovanpera in a Fiesta R5 https://rallyaustralia.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2017/10/Rally-Australia-2017-WRC-Entry-List-002.pdf

rhm

20th October 2017, 13:08

And probably that's also going to be the top 5 of the final scoreboard (Evans needs to get two point more than Sordo in two rallies, while Sordo is doing only one of the rallies).

True, but you would expect drivers who do more events to score more points, except Meeke

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

Barreis

20th October 2017, 16:17

only 19 homologated cars?! 34 cars entry with 15 of national homologation?!?

pantealex

20th October 2017, 16:51

only 19 homologated cars?! 34 cars entry with 15 of national homologation?!?

Yeah!
and out of those 19:
3 are FWD R2/R3 cars and 2 GrN, only 2 R5´s.
11x WRC17 and one old WRC.

Munkvy

23rd October 2017, 21:29

only 19 homologated cars?! 34 cars entry with 15 of national homologation?!?

Yeah!
and out of those 19:
3 are FWD R2/R3 cars and 2 GrN, only 2 R5´s.
11x WRC17 and one old WRC.

And this is why Rally NZ would be a better option, the national field at the last round of our championship had 80 cars, and I would suspect we would easily be able to do that or more if we were part of a WRC round... For such a big country, with huge wealth, I don't understand why Australia doesn't have a better national rally scene! Or maybe its the vast distances you have to cover to do the championship? (and of course I am not a one eyed, disgruntled Kiwi at all!).

fredfush

24th October 2017, 02:52

And this is why Rally NZ would be a better option, the national field at the last round of our championship had 80 cars, and I would suspect we would easily be able to do that or more if we were part of a WRC round... For such a big country, with huge wealth, I don't understand why Australia doesn't have a better national rally scene! Or maybe its the vast distances you have to cover to do the championship? (and of course I am not a one eyed, disgruntled Kiwi at all!).

What you are looking at is the WRC entry list, there will also be a National entry list due out next week. As for NZ it is highly unlikely that many of the local cars would be approved to enter a WRC. How many locals were in the APRC event in Whangarei?

Grundo Farb

24th October 2017, 08:32

What you are looking at is the WRC entry list, there will also be a National entry list due out next week. As for NZ it is highly unlikely that many of the local cars would be approved to enter a WRC. How many locals were in the APRC event in Whangarei?

Er Not entirely true. The majority of the field are ASN class cars which are National/Regional Cars as per the FIA regs. If you look the majority of them are AP4 cars. A lot of these cars would be in the National field as well. The same would apply in New Zealand.

dimviii

24th October 2017, 13:32

BILLIOT Jérémie‏*@planetemarcus
#WRC Sarrazin Motorsport in charge of @HuttunenRacing program for 2018 and debuts in Sweden WRC-2 → http://bit.ly/2xiVEtl

Announced at the end of September as the chosen Hyundai Motorsport Driver Development Program, Jari Huttunen will start his official WRC-2 2018 season with the Wrc Sweden Rally next February under the Hyundai Motorsport banner.

However the Finn's i20R5 will be supported and prepared by Sarrazin Motorsport and the full details of its 2018 program will be revealed later. At first, it will be for the first time driving this car this weekend at the Rally Wrc Britain.

Hyundai Motorsport official release.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DM441MSXkAEWAMY.jpg

AL14

24th October 2017, 16:26

Nice choice. I think it's a win-win for everyone:

1) Sarrazin will make experience as a team manager or similar. I don't understand if he will compete as well. In that case it's bingo :)
2) Huttunen will have full support both from Hyundai and from Sarrazin's squad. Also he can get valuable advise from a very very complete driver!
3) Hyundai will nurture a great talent with huge potential and also will develop its R5 (I guess).

PLuto

24th October 2017, 20:02

raybak

24th October 2017, 20:25

Er Not entirely true. The majority of the field are ASN class cars which are National/Regional Cars as per the FIA regs. If you look the majority of them are AP4 cars. A lot of these cars would be in the National field as well. The same would apply in New Zealand.

There is going to be quite a good field in the attached national round as well as the NSW and QLD State Championship fields.

Ray

AL14

24th October 2017, 20:31

Sarrazin Motorsport was competing this year, also in WRC2. They have Skoda Fabia R5 and Hyundai i20 R5. So no problem...

Nice, thanks for the info, I didn't know it. Anyway this is still a step forward for him. The support of a manufacturer does not come often.

janvanvurpa

24th October 2017, 20:59

2018 Rally Sweden road program = 19SS + 314.51kms Norway loop DAY1 & new SS Torntorp + Torsby Sprint on DAY2 → http://bit.ly/2ysJSOv

Only 314km SS.......oi oi oi...Is it that the kiddies are too tired? Or is there a rule now limiting max SS distance?

PLuto

24th October 2017, 21:14

I dont understand it too, why they are lowering the ammounts of kms...

AnttiL

24th October 2017, 21:27

http://www.motorsport-total.com/rallye/WRC-Sportliches-Reglement-2016-Englisch.pdf

The total distance of the special stages shall be between 300 km and 500 km.
- A minimum ratio of 25% of special stages shall be respected on the overall distance of the event.
- There shall be no single special stage minimum or maximum distance. However, there shall be no more
than 80 km of special stages between visits to service parks or tyre fitting zones.
- No one stage or part of a stage may be run more than twice in a rally, super special stages excluded.

I think the 80 km rule makes it hard to make longer rallies. If you do 80+80 on a friday, 80+80 on saturday and another 80 on sunday, you get 400 kms, plus some km's for a thursday super special. Or if you can find enough long stages close to a service park, you may have time to do three legs on a day

Rallyper

24th October 2017, 21:36

http://www.motorsport-total.com/rallye/WRC-Sportliches-Reglement-2016-Englisch.pdf

I think the 80 km rule makes it hard to make longer rallies. If you do 80+80 on a friday, 80+80 on saturday and another 80 on sunday, you get 400 kms, plus some km's for a thursday super special. Or if you can find enough long stages close to a service park, you may have time to do three legs on a day

What rule is that? Never heard of it. But I´m getting old ...

KiwiWRCfan

25th October 2017, 01:19

What rule is that? Never heard of it. But I´m getting old ...

13.1.2
The total distance of the special stages shall be between 300 km and 500 km.
- A minimum ratio of 25% of special stages shall be respected on the overall distance of the event.
- There shall be no single special stage minimum or maximum distance. However, there shall be no more than 80 km of special stages between visits to service parks or tyre fitting zones.
- No one stage or part of a stage may be run more than twice in a rally, super special stages excluded

Franky

25th October 2017, 06:21

I think the 80 km rule makes it hard to make longer rallies. If you do 80+80 on a friday, 80+80 on saturday and another 80 on sunday, you get 400 kms, plus some km's for a thursday super special. Or if you can find enough long stages close to a service park, you may have time to do three legs on a day

They don't need to visit service park, it can be tire fitting zone also.
And who says that there can be only two loops and not three loops of 80km?

rallyfiend

25th October 2017, 07:01

They don't need to visit service park, it can be tire fitting zone also.
And who says that there can be only two loops and not three loops of 80km?

Stages can only normally be used twice.

To find a third loop would be expensive and difficult for organisers (equipment, markshalls etc)

AnttiL

25th October 2017, 07:07

They don't need to visit service park, it can be tire fitting zone also.
And who says that there can be only two loops and not three loops of 80km?

Like I said above, you can have more, but usually the liaisons to the service are so long that there's no time to do a third leg. Of course you could do three legs with just refuel and tyre refitting but a rally like that would probably be disliked by the drivers and be dropped from the series.

Stages can only normally be used twice.

To find a third loop would be expensive and difficult for organisers (equipment, markshalls etc)

True. Only Super Specials can be run more than twice. And it's also sadly true that the decreased popularity of rally makes it harder for organizers to find people to run stages. Also longer rallies would be more expensive for the teams which could result in teams dropping out. Also especially more expensive for privateers.

Also adding that rallies have been for a couple of years now 300-370 kms long, usually closer to 300 than 370, it's not like this is a new thing for 2018.

The 80 km per leg rule came into effect in 2010. Before that the maximum length was 400 kms, and even 360 km for some years.

EDIT: I also forgot the limited tyre rule. If you made a really long route with three legs per day, would the cars run out of fresh tyres?
EDIT2: Found another rule concerning tyres: A maximum of 7 tyre changes is permitted on any one rally

Mintexmemory

25th October 2017, 07:30

EDIT: I also forgot the limited tyre rule. If you made a really long route with three legs per day, would the cars run out of fresh tyres?

If it were known in advance that there was to be a long route with three legs the tyre suppliers would have to provide a low wear tyre and the drivers would have to manage them - Just like it used to be!

AnttiL

25th October 2017, 07:41

If it were known in advance that there was to be a long route with three legs the tyre suppliers would have to provide a low wear tyre and the drivers would have to manage them - Just like it used to be!

"Just like it used to be" was that the drivers could get fresh tyres and service between every stage :D

AnttiL

25th October 2017, 08:31

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/e/2PACX-1vQt275EJDsksLV1MRwiN-zly-8kRY3_bIz8jL5aXlgN8S-sgh03aquEV9Mg2nsllE0ByVYmj45gquUl/pubhtml

I had to try to make a Rally Finland itinerary with three legs for friday and saturday, also maximizing sunday, with no more than 7 tyre changes. It's doable and you get to 500 km but it requires long stages and stages run close to each other so the liaisons never get too long. Also I only used stages that are actually been used in Rally Finland, of course you could compose new long stages as well. Also, this would mean almost 250 km of unique roads (everything run twice) requiring stage marshalls and other facilities, whereas the current route has only about 175 kms (some stages are even run only once).

AMSS

26th October 2017, 13:01

Pirelli are aiming at making a return to the WRC and specifically targeting the WRC 2 class next year. They have some open questions still to solve but that`s their target.

Fast Eddie WRC

26th October 2017, 14:02

@thierryneuville
Photoshoot for the #WRC Gala Awards!
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNEPbvDWsAEhCTF.jpg

Ogier at the end laughing... 'But I'll be getting the real trophy !' ;)

Eli

26th October 2017, 15:19

@thierryneuville
Photoshoot for the #WRC Gala Awards!
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNEPbvDWsAEhCTF.jpg

Ogier at the end laughing... 'But I'll be getting the real trophy !' ;)

He's probably right to do so ;)

dimviii

26th October 2017, 17:54

Pirelli are aiming at making a return to the WRC and specifically targeting the WRC 2 class next year. They have some open questions still to solve but that`s their target.

maybe it has to do something with Kalle?(continue the sponsorship to him to wrc2?)

wrc2017

26th October 2017, 18:08

ESTR

26th October 2017, 19:28

Citroen didnt test because of the cost of hiring a test road says Matton. Can they be serious?? Meeke fuming after shakedown.

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/132651/meeke-blasts-citroen-rally-gb-preparations

Few years ago they spread money like crazy...

At the end they will retire from championship because of costs...

AMSS

26th October 2017, 19:39

maybe it has to do something with Kalle?(continue the sponsorship to him to wrc2?)

This I don`t know but it might be a factor yes..

Rally Power

26th October 2017, 19:40

Citroen didnt test because of the cost of hiring a test road says Matton. Can they be serious?? Meeke fuming after shakedown.

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/132651/meeke-blasts-citroen-rally-gb-preparations

It’d be interesting to know if they’ve actually run out the allowed annual test days. Someone mention it before and it makes more sense than this ‘saving money’ version.

ESTR

26th October 2017, 19:52

It’d be interesting to know if they’ve actually run out the allowed annual test days. Someone mention it before and it makes more sense than this ‘saving money’ version.

I think that they realize that they lost this year big time and that don't want to spend any extra funding for remaining events.

AnttiL

26th October 2017, 20:01

It’d be interesting to know if they’ve actually run out the allowed annual test days. Someone mention it before and it makes more sense than this ‘saving money’ version.

They probably wasted a lot of testing days for Mikkelsen

AnttiL

26th October 2017, 20:03

maybe it has to do something with Kalle?(continue the sponsorship to him to wrc2?)

Kalle was selling his stash of Pirelli tyres on facebook a while ago, so I guess he's not on Pirellis anymore

AMSS

26th October 2017, 20:09

Kalle was selling his stash of Pirelli tyres on facebook a while ago, so I guess he's not on Pirellis anymore

I think he`s very much on Pirelli otherwise he should have done the Liepaja rally on Michelin or Dmack as preparation for Wales.. This year he can`t use Pirelli on the WRC events but maybe next year, Pirelli has invested quit heavily in him so it would make sence in that way to continue next year if possible..

dimviii

26th October 2017, 20:20

Kalle was selling his stash of Pirelli tyres on facebook a while ago, so I guess he's not on Pirellis anymore
maybe he is just making some money from free purchased tyres.

AMSS

26th October 2017, 20:24

maybe he is just making some money from free purchased tyres.

Also no tire manufactorer stickers on his car in Wales, probably Pirelli wants so for the future.. I assume he`s on Michelins there

AnttiL

27th October 2017, 07:02

http://www.podbean.com/media/share/dir-qpka5-30880b0

Long Autosport interview with Jari-Matti Latvala about his last year, transition to Toyota, developing the car and also about Wales Rally GB

Duvel

28th October 2017, 19:16

Right in the middle of al rally GB maddnes, i know but one question.

Is it confirmed rally Italy will be in Sardenga again? And wil Alghero be host city Again also?

Thanks!

Eli

28th October 2017, 19:17

Right in the middle of al rally GB maddnes, i know but one question.

Is it confirmed rally Italy will be in Sardenga again? And wil Alghero be host city Again also?

Thanks!Not known yet, even in Rally Travel site it says location TBA.

Sent from my ONEPLUS A3003 using Tapatalk

A FONDO

29th October 2017, 17:45

Neuville is the champ for 2017 in my book. I know consistency is part of the game, but without those silly mistakes in the beginning, we wouldn't talk about Ogier at all now. Also, there were few events where things were fare and square for both of them, and Neuville won easily. In Ogier's defense, his car is not up to the job, but that's something Ford boys are constantly denying. In any case, we can all see that Ogier (and probably Loeb) are not super humans if they don't have superior machinery in their hands.

http://www.podbean.com/media/share/dir-nkxbf-30591b1

Long Autosport interview with Jari-Matti Latvala about his last year, transition to Toyota, developing the car and also about Wales Rally GB

ERROR 404

The page you're looking for is not found. :(

Revman

29th October 2017, 18:10

http://www.podbean.com/media/share/dir-nkxbf-30591b1

Long Autosport interview with Jari-Matti Latvala about his last year, transition to Toyota, developing the car and also about Wales Rally GB

Great piece!

racerx1979

29th October 2017, 20:35

ERROR 404

The page you're looking for is not found. :(

Please provide a working link. I got the same error.

SubaruNorway

29th October 2017, 20:39

https://soundcloud.com/autosport

jparker

30th October 2017, 13:03

ERROR 404

The page you're looking for is not found. :(

You made me listen to the whole interview in order to find out why are you quoting me.
if you want to add JML in the same league as Neuville, sure I agree with that.

AnttiL

30th October 2017, 13:06

Please provide a working link. I got the same error.

http://www.podbean.com/media/share/dir-qpka5-30880b0

Not sure if that link changed...

ESTR

30th October 2017, 16:44

Anyone know if Nasser Al Atiyah give up for Polo? As of the start of the year he was pretty sure he would working on that project during the year..

the sniper

30th October 2017, 17:59

Anyone know if Nasser Al Atiyah give up for Polo? As of the start of the year he was pretty sure he would working on that project during the year..

I imagine what little hope there was of that was killed by the situation in Qatar...

AnttiL

30th October 2017, 18:08

That project is dead. Colin Clark confirmed that on twitter after talking with Al Attiyah at some rally event earlier this year.

https://twitter.com/voiceofrally/status/902081352341827584

jparker

31st October 2017, 09:26

mknight

31st October 2017, 09:59

In the podcast interview, JML said "The moment team stops developing the car, is the moment you start loosing". That was his response of the question how competitive Polo could have been. In such case, why Hyundai, Citroen, and partially M-Sport didn't agree to make exception for VW to join WRC 2017?

Thing is... it probably would have been very competitive for at least first half of 2017. Probably only the Hyundai would have been there with it.

Toyota was slow/unreliable until Poland/Finland. Fiesta had turn-in issues until Portugal/Sardinia. C3 was messy on gravel until the diff changes that started in Poland.

Also note that VW stopped developing the 2016 Polo at the start of that year and did no testing with it, and during last half of 2016 it was not really dominating any more. Which is maybe also the source of Latvala's comment.

dimviii

31st October 2017, 16:49

Gary Boyd‏*@KiwiWRCfan
How many stage wins are needed to win a #WRC drivers title
10 titles with most stage wins
10 titles with least stage wins

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNYK8BXVQAASqOt.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNYK_jDU8AA7dNy.jpg

tommeke_B

31st October 2017, 16:54

Such statistics would only make sense if you divide the number of stage wins by the total number of stages those seasons. I think in the 90s events had much more stages.

MrJan

31st October 2017, 17:06

Such statistics would only make sense if you divide the number of stage wins by the total number of stages those seasons. I think in the 90s events had much more stages.

That is true, but it's interesting to see how few stages Ogier has won this year and still won the championship with an event to spare. Not a huge surprise though, it's been clear that one of his best attributes is consistency and the ability to get good results while others crash etc. Also a big help that the Fiesta has been fairly reliable...at least, as far as I can remember.

AnttiL

31st October 2017, 17:11

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNc_nFLVwAA8emS?format=jpg&name=large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNc_nFOUEAEQqsP?format=jpg&name=large

Gary made them already, by my request

Mirek

31st October 2017, 17:11

That is true, but it's interesting to see how few stages Ogier has won this year and still won the championship with an event to spare. Not a huge surprise though, it's been clear that one of his best attributes is consistency and the ability to get good results while others crash etc. Also a big help that the Fiesta has been fairly reliable...at least, as far as I can remember.

True but Tommeke has valid point. Add to that that nowadays You even have events which are all about one 50 km long stage accompanied by number of shorter ones and a bunch of superspecials. In the end it can be enough to win one stage and to control the rest.

Another point is that we've had a situation this year which is rather uncommon in the history of the sport when the domminant driver (by speed) is making so many mistakes that he can't take the title.

car

31st October 2017, 17:12

Autosport reporting that Evans will be an M-Sport driver in 2018 and that Ogier is likely to be too.
Job well done Malcolm.
Wonder if this means Ford are going to up their stakes in the project.

MrJan

31st October 2017, 17:36

Another point is that we've had a situation this year which is rather uncommon in the history of the sport when the domminant driver (by speed) is making so many mistakes that he can't take the title.

Yep, compare the DNF's for Ogier (I think just Finland) and then what everyone else has had. The same goes for Tanak, I'd say that the guys at M-Sport fully deserve whatever bonus they get for delivering such a reliable car.

spiderem

31st October 2017, 17:36

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNc_nFLVwAA8emS?format=jpg&name=large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNc_nFOUEAEQqsP?format=jpg&name=large

Gary made them already, by my request

I like statistics :) Funny to see Ogier "leading" both!

MrJan

31st October 2017, 17:41

Of course it helps the more recent drivers that they can win stages even after 'retiring' from the rally.

Fast Eddie WRC

31st October 2017, 18:21

Classic case of, "To finish First, first you must finish."

It's no good being fastest if you then crash or break your car.

There's more to rallying than pure speed. A lot more.

Rallyper

31st October 2017, 18:53

True but Tommeke has valid point. Add to that that nowadays You even have events which are all about one 50 km long stage accompanied by number of shorter ones and a bunch of superspecials. In the end it can be enough to win one stage and to control the rest.

Another point is that we've had a situation this year which is rather uncommon in the history of the sport when the domminant driver (by speed) is making so many mistakes that he can't take the title.

One or more drivers can win all stages, but retire one of the days. In all rallies, theoretically oc. But very much what has happened this year with more equal conditions with cars. That gives not many more stages to win for a WDC. I think the Rally2 rules remade the statistics.

AnttiL

31st October 2017, 18:59

Of course it helps the more recent drivers that they can win stages even after 'retiring' from the rally.

Or makes it harder for a single driver to get stage wins because there's more stage winning drivers on the last day

GravelBen

31st October 2017, 19:10

Autosport reporting that Evans will be an M-Sport driver in 2018 and that Ogier is likely to be too.
Job well done Malcolm.
Wonder if this means Ford are going to up their stakes in the project.

Weren't they reporting a couple of weeks ago that Tanak was definitely staying at M-Sport too? I don't put too much faith in Autosport as a source of accurate information, like most of the media they seem to be more about attention-seeking headlines than facts.

ESTR

31st October 2017, 19:27

Weren't they reporting a couple of weeks ago that Tanak was definitely staying at M-Sport too? I don't put too much faith in Autosport as a source of accurate information, like most of the media they seem to be more about attention-seeking headlines than facts.

Agree. When it can be confirmed we will know. This is just predictions out of press conference where Neuville said that guys will have some announcements in few hours, days, weeks... Evans just look Wilson and say nothing. Ogier said he have 3 options, M-Sport, Citroen & to stay at home. He will reveal that in Australia time... Wilson said he is still discus and that Evans will be okay..

Nothing new actually...

car

31st October 2017, 19:32

Agree. When it can be confirmed we will know. This is just predictions out of press conference where Neuville said that guys will have some announcements in few hours, days, weeks... Evans just look Wilson and say nothing. Ogier said he have 3 options, M-Sport, Citroen & to stay at home. He will reveal that in Australia time... Wilson said he is still discus and that Evans will be okay..

Nothing new actually...

Have you actually read the article?

car

31st October 2017, 19:33

ESTR

31st October 2017, 20:01

Have you actually read the article?

Yes. Why? Actually it doesn't matter for me, where they go. Mine favorites are safe and be there in 2018, so I will not be arguing about M-Sport.

Oliverk

1st November 2017, 05:32

Rally Estonia 2018 is back and they are aiming for 2021 WRC Round.
https://sport.postimees.ee/4295061/rally-estonia-naaseb-ja-tahab-murda-2021-aastaks-mm-sarja

dimviii

1st November 2017, 13:36

Rally Paradise‏*@rallyparadise

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNfvCbgX4AYIiBG.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNfvCa8X0AEInbK.jpg

ESTR

1st November 2017, 13:38

Rally Paradise‏*@rallyparadise

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNfvCbgX4AYIiBG.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DNfvCa8X0AEInbK.jpg

wow nice statistics.

Simmi

1st November 2017, 13:49

To think the most any driver could achieve this year is four wins is really something. A rare season - and one we'll dig out of the DVD cabinets or hard drives to watch in the future.

steve.mandzij

1st November 2017, 14:14

To think the most any driver could achieve this year is four wins is really something. A rare season - and one we'll dig out of the DVD cabinets or hard drives to watch in the future.I wish we had those season reviews we used to have... I have my 2004 DVD ready to go most of the time :)

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk

Fast Eddie WRC

2nd November 2017, 17:49

Strange rumour following Hyundai re-shuffle with only running 3 cars... Sordo to join Ogier & Evans at M-Sport !

Apparent Red Bull connection.

ESTR

2nd November 2017, 17:53

Sordo to M-Sport?? From where did that come out??? Yes they might shuffle all four drivers, and sordo linked maybe to rallycross thing...

jbmarcus21

2nd November 2017, 18:11

SPECIAL PLANETEMARCUS AWARDS 2017 : Best Driver, Best Rallycar, Best Rally - click and vote → http://bit.ly/2z885d6

Andre Oliveira

2nd November 2017, 19:25

Sordo to M-Sport?? From where did that come out??? Yes they might shuffle all four drivers, and sordo linked maybe to rallycross thing...

Not the first time i heard about it.

SPECIAL PLANETEMARCUS AWARDS 2017 : Best Driver, Best Rallycar, Best Rally - click and vote → http://bit.ly/2z885d6

Ogier, Ford Fiesta WRC and Rally de Portugal for me :)

jbmarcus21

2nd November 2017, 19:33

Marcus Grönholm has tested this week (Tuesday) Proton IRIZ R5 with Team Mellors Elliot Motorsport in Wales → http://bit.ly/2Adpkd2

MrJan

4th November 2017, 12:36

Listen in to hear what sauce Elfyn Evans has on a sausage sandwich http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p05m0wlt

(possibly UK only)

EstWRC

8th November 2017, 17:53

New season to be launched at autosport show with all the teams and drivers

http://www.wrc.com/en/wrc/news/november/wrc-autosport-launch-2018/page/4999--12-12-.html

electroliquid

9th November 2017, 09:22

About WRC drivers salaries: http://www.go4speed.lv/lv/news/wrc/7421-tsm-sportz-ozje-si-gada-alga-35-miljoni-asv-dolaru-tanakam-divi-miljoni/ (Use google translate ;) )
3.5 m (USA dollars) - Sebastian Ogier
2.75 m - Thierry Neuville
2 m - Ott Tanak
1.5 m - Craig Breen
1 m - Jari-Matti Latvala
1 m - Elfyn Evans
1 m - Andreas Mikkelsen
900 k - Hayden Paddon
650 k - Stephane Lefebvre
650 k - Eric Camilli
550 k - Juho Hanninen
500 k - Kris Meeke
500 k - Esapekka Lappi

Could it be real? Hard to believe in M-Sport drivers salaries, and no Sordo in list.

tommeke_B

9th November 2017, 09:26

How could one amateur website suddenly get hold of all WRC driver's salaries? ;) Come on...

Myrvold

9th November 2017, 09:46

Could it be real?

Nope. Mikkelsen have been driving for free this year (personal sponsors not included, but that's supposedly not included in the list either).

Tarmop

9th November 2017, 09:47

:D Joke. Citroen paying 1.5 mil. to Breen, a developing new driver who is greatful of having the chance of driving a WRC car on 10(?) events and only 500k to their main driver, the one who was thought to be fighting for the title in his developed car. Also, Mikkelsen was doing it for free this year if i remember correctly?

sindroms

9th November 2017, 10:34

How could one amateur website suddenly get hold of all WRC driver's salaries? ;) Come on...

Original source is showed in the article - TSM Sportz. Found original one - http://tsmsportz.com/list/highest-paid-rally-drivers/

Imo - way too less for Ogier, way too high for Tanak. Non factory team (Ford) have the highest salary level?! And Tanak is leaving
winning team with higest salary level to weaker team with the low salary level... This is not serious.

Tarmop

9th November 2017, 10:41

Ogier`s salary is realistic, as they didn`t count personal sponsors i believe? 3.5 from Wilson, more from sponsors.

electroliquid

9th November 2017, 11:00

Mikkelsen listed as VW motorsport II driver, in original article, while he isn't anymore..

rhm

9th November 2017, 11:06

sonnybobiche

9th November 2017, 11:12

Original source is showed in the article - TSM Sportz. Found original one - http://tsmsportz.com/list/highest-paid-rally-drivers/

Imo - way too less for Ogier, way too high for Tanak. Non factory team (Ford) have the highest salary level?! And Tanak is leaving
winning team with higest salary level to weaker team with the low salary level... This is not serious.

That article reads like it was written by some underpaid Indian at a content mill. It's just total nonsense based on what we know, and it appears to be mainly based on the championship standings at the time.

Here's my guesstimate for real drivers salaries based on rumors and conjecture. Not including bonuses for wins or sponsor money.

$9.2M - Sebastian Ogier
$1.5M - Jari-Matti Latvala
$1M - Thierry Neuville
$500k - Kris Meeke
$300k - Juho Hanninen
$150k - Hayden Paddon
$100k - Esapekka Lappi
$100k - Dani Sordo
$50k - Ott Tanak
$50k - Elfyn Evans
$0 - Craig Breen
$0 - Andreas Mikkelsen
$0 - Stephane Lefebvre
$0 - Eric Camilli

Thoughts?

EstWRC

9th November 2017, 11:38

Barreis

9th November 2017, 13:59

That article reads like it was written by some underpaid Indian at a content mill. It's just total nonsense based on what we know, and it appears to be mainly based on the championship standings at the time.

Here's my guesstimate for real drivers salaries based on rumors and conjecture. Not including bonuses for wins or sponsor money.

$9.2M - Sebastian Ogier
$1.5M - Jari-Matti Latvala
$1M - Thierry Neuville
$500k - Kris Meeke
$300k - Juho Hanninen
$150k - Hayden Paddon
$100k - Esapekka Lappi
$100k - Dani Sordo
$50k - Ott Tanak
$50k - Elfyn Evans
$0 - Craig Breen
$0 - Andreas Mikkelsen
$0 - Stephane Lefebvre
$0 - Eric Camilli

Thoughts?

LOL for example take Sordo as a points collector and regular finisher, i would never say that he drives whole season, risk his life for 100k$.

MrJan

9th November 2017, 17:02

LOL for example take Sordo as a points collector and regular finisher, i would never say that he drives whole season, risk his life for 100k$.

I agree that it's unlikely, but many will pay $$$$$s just to compete.

N.O.T

10th November 2017, 01:03

Here's my guesstimate for real drivers salaries based on rumors and conjecture. Not including bonuses for wins or sponsor money.

Is your mental condition painful physically as well ??? i can understand the difficulties others have being around you but it would be interesting to see how you feel as well...

sonnybobiche

10th November 2017, 09:35

Is your mental condition painful physically as well ??? i can understand the difficulties others have being around you but it would be interesting to see how you feel as well...

ah, shaddap ya dirty dog

tomhlord

14th November 2017, 10:45

i think this article has things messed up and wrong in many ways...according to rumours Tänak will be getting 2.5 mil in Toyota not in m-sport at the moment....his m-sport salary doesnt even reach 100 000 in a year at the moment. (at least this is what i was told)

This sounds about right.

Also, Elfyn has a job at the garage in-between rallies so clearly not on mega bucks, if any. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jArNseEd_8I

Tarmop

14th November 2017, 13:03

Mikkelsen was asked to pay if he wanted to drive a DMack car (refused obviously), so definitely the only salary would be from his sponsors, according to the article they didn`t take sponsorships into account. Full of rubbish and nothing else.

Fast Eddie WRC

14th November 2017, 15:13

Are WRC driver's the poorest paid at world-level in motorsport ?

rhm

14th November 2017, 15:16

Are WRC driver's the poorest paid at world-level in motorsport ?

I doubt WRX get paid too much, but when you compare it to F1, Indycar, Sportscars, basically any professional circuit racing, I'd say yes.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

MrJan

14th November 2017, 16:30

Are WRC driver's the poorest paid at world-level in motorsport ?

Back in the day McRae was apparently one of the highest salaried sportsmen in the UK. At the time he was on a rumoured £4m+ which would be more than most premiership footballers at the time.

In terms of current stars, I suspect that Latvala would earn more than trials riders or raid drivers. Plus I doubt that any drag racer outside of the US is on much of a salary, given that it costs so much to run the cars.

wrc2017

14th November 2017, 16:52

Are WRC driver's the poorest paid at world-level in motorsport ?

No

its the same in any top level motorsport

those that can win, get paid.

Those that make up the numbers are lucky they get anything.

rumour is Ogier on $6m USD inc bonus, and that excludes personal endorsements.

Mikkelsen & Neuville not living in Monaco for nothing, any less than a few million usd a year, or its not viable.