News & rumours

[Buzz Lightyear]

what is this all about????

http://translate.google.com/translate?sourceid=navclient&hl=en&u=http%3a%2f%2fwww%2erallye%2dmagazin%2ede%2fr%2fw m%2fd%2fn%2fd%2f2008%2f05%2f07%2floriaux%2dbilder% 2dgegen%2dburger%2findex%2ehtml

[aircologne]

nothing serious: In the last issue of "Rallye" a german Rallye magazin is a story about the 4 wheel gear of Ford, and thats the story how the magazine gets this "secret information" by payng a meal to the Ford guy at burger King.
so thats all - no rumours, please. I havent read the google translation of this german text, I read it only in original language, so I thik it could be a crazy mixture with this bablefish translators...

see ya at Portugal rallye tomorrow

[Jaanus]

Markko Märtin could do some events this year:

http://www.serviceparknews.com/?c=118&a=1435

[leno]

Markko Märtin could do some events this year:

http://www.serviceparknews.com/?c=118&a=1435

wow!thx for that!

[grugsticles]

Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Please Pleeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeease let it happen!

[HaCo]

That would be awesome!

[PuddleJumper]

Markko Märtin could do some events this year:

http://www.serviceparknews.com/?c=118&a=1435

I hope their source for this story is more reliable than the one who provided them with this:


Since the accident in 2005 Martin has only contested one rally, the 2006 Rally of Portugal which was being staged as a candidate event for the WRC.

What about his excellent 2nd place finish on the 2006 Cork International?

[Brother John]

Now plans for Marcus to drive Rallye Finnland.
Maybe next year a snow rally, but also no plans at the moment!

http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2008/05/13/groenholm-schnee-statt-spruenge/index.html

[Daniel]

Now plans for Marcus to drive Rallye Finnland.
Maybe next year a snow rally, but also no plans at the moment!

http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2008/05/13/groenholm-schnee-statt-spruenge/index.html
Another year to wait for Loeb to win in Finland?

[Brother John]

Another year to wait for Loeb to win in Finland?

I ment NO plans for Marcus to drive Rallye Finnland. My mistake. ;)

[AlfaWRC]

Another year to wait for Loeb to win in Finland?

Mikko's last years comment after rally finland: Loeb will never win in finland! And he had a lot of fun announcing his prediction...

[Daniel]

Mikko's last years comment after rally finland: Loeb will never win in finland! And he had a lot of fun announcing his prediction...

Well if anyone is going to win out over Loeb it won't be Mikko.

[AlfaWRC]

Well if anyone is going to win out over Loeb it won't be Mikko.

You want to bet on that?

[Daniel]

You want to bet on that?
Latvala eats guys like Mikko for breakfast :)

[AlfaWRC]

Latvala eats guys like Mikko for breakfast :)

OK! We will hear us after finland....

Just keep on underestemating Mikko & take a look on the final standings at the end of the championship. You will be incredibly surprised...

[Daniel]

OK! We will hear us after finland....

Just keep on underestemating Mikko & take a look on the final standings at the end of the championship. You will be incredibly surprised...
I don't think I will be. By the end of the championship the drivers will have found their level give or take a place or two. I predict 3rd at best for Mikko.

[OldF]

The CEO of AKK Motorsports (Finnish ASN) Jarmo Mahonen told when he returned from the meeting of the rally commission that: ” No decisions where made concerning the 2010 WRC calendar”. The calendar has been approved by FIA but Mahonen told that the manufacturers weren’t happy with the 2010 calendar. He also told that the manufacturers couldn’t understand why NORF wouldn’t be in the calendar for some year. Mahonen commented to that: “Nice to hear, we agree”.

By the same source Autosport tells that some manufacturers could withdraw from WRC because of the calendar. Morrie Chandler told to Autosport that. “ All the new contests will remain in the calendar if they don’t voluntary retreat or not get approval by FIA”.


Source: http://www.hs.fi/urheilu/autourheilu/artikkeli/Autonvalmistajat+eiv%C3%A4t+halua+luopua+Suomen+MM-rallista+vuodeksikaan/1135236339374

[A.F.F.]

Time to compromize...

[Daniel]

Time to compromize...
To to not be dumbarses and drop good rallies like NORF.

[urabus-denoS2000]

http://www.hrautosport.com/portal/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1281&Itemid=22
This might be interesting.Fiat Abarth announced their new project called Fiat Abarth 500 Asseto Corse,which is a 200 BHP 1,4 liter turbo at 930 kg.It is for circuit racing but maybe Fiat could make a similar version for rally like Renault and the new Clio.

[Daniel]

http://www.hrautosport.com/portal/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1281&Itemid=22
This might be interesting.Fiat Abarth announced their new project called Fiat Abarth 500 Asseto Corse,which is a 200 BHP 1,4 liter turbo at 930 kg.It is for circuit racing but maybe Fiat could make a similar version for rally like Renault and the new Clio.
It's not for track racing. It's for the Mille Miglia.

[duff]

To to not be dumbarses and drop good rallies like NORF.

I'm sure you mean - THE BEST RALLY IN THE CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

[Tom206wrc]

It looks more and more there will be an austrian team entering WRC09 with whales as cars(Bozian??)and with Manfred Stohl and Andy Wimmer as drivers :bounce: :bounce:

[DonJippo]

It looks more and more there will be an austrian team entering WRC09 with whales as cars

There are rumours also about Red Bull WRC team for next year, drivers, Andreas Aigner and Sebastien Ogier, car Citroen WRC C4.

[AlfaWRC]

There are rumours also about Red Bull WRC team for next year, drivers, Andreas Aigner and Sebastien Ogier, car Citroen WRC C4.

Where did you hear those rumours?
That would be absolutely fantastic!!!

[DonJippo]

You want to bet on that?

I'm with you but be carefull Daniel is slow on paying bets. I'm still waiting my rallysausage package from last year... :)

[Daniel]

I'm with you but be carefull Daniel is slow on paying bets. I'm still waiting my rallysausage package from last year... :)

Well you were gone by the time I got back to Himos ;) I haven't forgotten though. One pack of blue cheese makkara is yours when I come to Finland next :)

[DonJippo]

Well you were gone by the time I got back to Himos ;) I haven't forgotten though. One pack of blue cheese makkara is yours when I come to Finland next :)

Why not make it double or nothing? I bet Mikko is faster than JML in NORF this year :D

[Daniel]

Why not make it double or nothing? I bet Mikko is faster than JML in NORF this year :D

Hmmmm. OK I'll take you up on that one ;)

[DonJippo]

Where did you hear those rumours?
That would be absolutely fantastic!!!

It was in "Veikkaaja" magazine few weeks back.

[Viking]

It looks more and more there will be an austrian team entering WRC09 with whales as cars(Bozian??)and with Manfred Stohl and Andy Wimmer as drivers :bounce: :bounce:


There are rumours also about Red Bull WRC team for next year, drivers, Andreas Aigner and Sebastien Ogier, car Citroen WRC C4.

There are also plans(long term maybe) in Norway for turning the Subaru Rally Team Norway/ Adapta/ Østberg team into an M2 team.

[DonJippo]

There are also plans(long term maybe) in Norway for turning the Subaru Rally Team Norway/ Adapta/ Østberg team into an M2 team.

Yes this was also in "Veikkaaja" few weeks back. I hope it comes true Østberg is such a driver that one enjoys seeing him on stages :up:

[CEORacingLions]

Mikkelsen in Ford if Miko or Latvala not win the Drivers Champ.

One of both goes to Citroen , Sordo out .......Red Bull or official team.

Mikkelsen go out of school , now is a 100% pilot.

But well , will see.

[Woodeye]

Mikkelsen in Ford if Miko or Latvala not win the Drivers Champ.

One of both goes to Citroen , Sordo out .......Red Bull or official team.

Mikkelsen go out of school , now is a 100% pilot.

But well , will see.

Do you have a link for this or are you just speculating?

[tmx]

Mikkelsen in Ford if Miko or Latvala not win the Drivers Champ.

One of both goes to Citroen , Sordo out .......Red Bull or official team.

Mikkelsen go out of school , now is a 100% pilot.

But well , will see.

Bs.

[Helstar]

Bah Mikkelsen is good but I don't think he will take soon a seat from Hirvonen or Latvala ... and anyway even if so he'll never beat Loeb.

We'll have a new World Champion when the French Bot retires ^^

[J.Lindstroem]

Mikkelsen in Ford if Miko or Latvala not win the Drivers Champ.

One of both goes to Citroen , Sordo out .......Red Bull or official team.

Mikkelsen go out of school , now is a 100% pilot.

But well , will see.

takes more than that to recive respect on this forum, buddy ;)

[CEORacingLions]

J.Lindstroem i think is the same on last pages when some mate talks about Red Bull Team with Citroens and Aigner and Ogier for pilots.

Mikkelsen out of school to try a professional pilot is 100% true. Ask some Mikk fan or other person about it.

Sordo out from Citroen is 60-80% and is rumour can be convert in fact if Sordo can't be one place better Jari or Mikko on Drivers Champ.

Mikk have a very nice contacts with Ford and people wants to give a opportunity for him.

The love with "fly mans" and Citroen are not a new.

But yeah mate , it's RUMOUR based in personal contacts.

I'm not here to look for respect , buddy :)

If in the end of season you want to talk about it , can be a pleasure :P

Sorry about my english , is difficult to explain my opinion with my bad english.

Like Gigi Galli english lol :)

[Buzz Lightyear]

J.Lindstroem i think is the same on last pages when some mate talks about Red Bull Team with Citroens and Aigner and Ogier for pilots.

Mikkelsen out of school to try a professional pilot is 100% true. Ask some Mikk fan or other person about it.

Sordo out from Citroen is 60-80% and is rumour can be convert in fact if Sordo can't be one place better Jari or Mikko on Drivers Champ.

Mikk have a very nice contacts with Ford and people wants to give a opportunity for him.

The love with "fly mans" and Citroen are not a new.

But yeah mate , it's RUMOUR based in personal contacts.

I'm not here to look for respect , buddy :)

If in the end of season you want to talk about it , can be a pleasure :P

Sorry about my english , is difficult to explain my opinion with my bad english.

Like Gigi Galli english lol :)

mikkelson works driver?? what has he done to deserve anything? crash test dummy for fords RD roll cage divison? no doubt ford will hang a big "works driver carrot" infront of mr. snr. mikkelson.. maybe in 2012... after by which time, ford have profitted €5m euros, from rebuilds and accident damage. clever.

sordo out. interesting. i notice the team boss of citroen said recently that they had doubts about dani, but his performance in jordan helped him to maybe change his mind. well, sardinia propably undone that good work... sordo was well off the pace, and not very good at all, so I can see how his position could be under pressure, but his sealed surface events come at a good time in the year... silly season, and he looks good on tarmac. but again, he is soo far behind seb, and things are soo tight at the top, that he will not even be allowed to put seb under pressure, never mind beat him. mr.wilson might be interested in sordo. sordo is in his 3rd full season, in the best team ever to grace wrc, and is even further away from winning on gravel than ever.

if citroen want a good no.2, they will not pick solberg, but mikko, who will be losing interest getting beat by JML. solberg will get even more fustrated with new subaru, and could goto ford for a one year contract.....

the other option with the Redbull Citroen team, is the fully works team will disappear, and replaced by a private team funded by RB.

ahhh... silly season comes early!

[CEORacingLions]

mikkelson works driver?? what has he done to deserve anything? crash test dummy for fords RD roll cage divison? no doubt ford will hang a big "works driver carrot" infront of mr. snr. mikkelson.. maybe in 2012... after by which time, ford have profitted €5m euros, from rebuilds and accident damage. clever.

sordo out. interesting. i notice the team boss of citroen said recently that they had doubts about dani, but his performance in jordan helped him to maybe change his mind. well, sardinia propably undone that good work... sordo was well off the pace, and not very good at all, so I can see how his position could be under pressure, but his sealed surface events come at a good time in the year... silly season, and he looks good on tarmac. but again, he is soo far behind seb, and things are soo tight at the top, that he will not even be allowed to put seb under pressure, never mind beat him. mr.wilson might be interested in sordo. sordo is in his 3rd full season, in the best team ever to grace wrc, and is even further away from winning on gravel than ever.

if citroen want a good no.2, they will not pick solberg, but mikko, who will be losing interest getting beat by JML. solberg will get even more fustrated with new subaru, and could goto ford for a one year contract.....

the other option with the Redbull Citroen team, is the fully works team will disappear, and replaced by a private team funded by RB.

ahhh... silly season comes early!

But if Official Citroen disappear and born a new private team , Loeb and Sordo fired ? If Loeb go out from Citroen , goes where ?

Ogier and Aigner ? Please ..... Ogier is a nice pilot , but with WRC , is the same ? Don't Know.....

Mikkelsen almost WRC driver. The experience and marketing point here are much important.

Why Aigner and Ogier is possible to Citroen Red Bull Team and Mikkelsen not for Ford ?

Citroen (Official or Private ) gives very very good opportunity if Loeb goes out , to Ford won the Champ ? :rolleyes:

Or you have doubts that the ford pick him ?

Sordo last perfomance like Xavier Pons or other like that ! Second pilot not that !!!!!

He can't steal points from Ford team in normal conditions .....

[J.Lindstroem]

sordo out. interesting. i notice the team boss of citroen said recently that they had doubts about dani, but his performance in jordan helped him to maybe change his mind. well, sardinia propably undone that good work... sordo was well off the pace, and not very good at all, so I can see how his position could be under pressure, but his sealed surface events come at a good time in the year... silly season, and he looks good on tarmac. but again, he is soo far behind seb, and things are soo tight at the top, that he will not even be allowed to put seb under pressure, never mind beat him. mr.wilson might be interested in sordo. sordo is in his 3rd full season, in the best team ever to grace wrc, and is even further away from winning on gravel than ever.


Sordo is astonishing on Tarmarc, there he really can beat Sebastien Loeb. On tarmarc and in the rough gravel rallies he is in the pace, and there he deserves his place in the official team. But i have always been questioning Citroens tactics when choosing Dani for points-scorer on the faster events like Finland, Sweden, New Zeeland or UK. Off course he should drive but if Citroen really was interested in winning the Manucaftors championship (wich they clearly was very interested in in 2003?), they whould have nominated another driver on those events. It could be any driver, Juuso Pykalisto, Manfred Stohl? Now Dani starts to get the pace up in the faster evetns, you could see it in Sweden this year, so dropping him now whould be really strange. like a waste of time or something. I think we will see him on Citroen untill the end of the teams time in Wrc.

I have always been hoping to see Thomas Rådström in Citroen in Sweden, but time has learned me that that will not be the case! haha ;)

Any way, i vote for no changes in Citroen. =)

[J.Lindstroem]

Why Aigner and Ogier is possible to Citroen Red Bull Team and Mikkelsen not for Ford ?


You know rallying nowadays is as much about sponsorship that it is about pure speed. Mikkelsen doesn't have the sponsors and money to recive a place in the Ford-team. If he did, he whould already be driving full season besides Henning and Wilson. So next year from him is very unlikely, but in the future, why not? The guy is 19 years old so i think whe shouldn't judge him to hard and call him a can-opener!

Anyway, Aginer (i don't know about ogier but hes got the contacts with citroen.) has Red Bull as sponsors and when the time comes when Red Bull enters the world rally team, aigners place in RBR is as natural as Manfred Stohl in a OMV-team.

So im sorry but i whouldn't compare these two!

[VFTS]

You know rallying nowadays is as much about sponsorship that it is about pure speed. Mikkelsen doesn't have the sponsors and money to recive a place in the Ford-team. If he did, he whould already be driving full season besides Henning and Wilson. So next year from him is very unlikely, but in the future, why not? The guy is 19 years old so i think whe shouldn't judge him to hard and call him a can-opener!


Lindström: I dont think you know so much about Mikkelsen and his money.
If his dad had wanted it already he would have no problems to finance a seat in the Ford-team. But he is taking it step by step. And I can assure that his father and the team already are making plans for next season.

And there is no lack of money....

[Koppomsbo]

And there is no lack of money....

No, i dont think the guy would have 5 wrc cars standing if he didnt have the money ;)

[Viking]

You know rallying nowadays is as much about sponsorship that it is about pure speed. Mikkelsen doesn't have the sponsors and money to recive a place in the Ford-team. If he did, he whould already be driving full season besides Henning and Wilson. So next year from him is very unlikely, but in the future, why not? The guy is 19 years old so i think whe shouldn't judge him to hard and call him a can-opener!


Buying a seat in Stobart/M-sport was one of the options but Mikkelsen Sr bought Ramsport (at lest a big chunk of it) instead, so he could be in control of were the money went (yes body-parts I know :) ). Also testing would be more limited in an M2-team.
My guess is that Andreas still has several rallies to do this season before they make the decision for next year in their 5-year plan to make him WC :up:

[Tomi]

My guess is that Andreas still has several rallies to do this season before they make the decision for next year in their 5-year plan to make him WC :up:

when did this 5 year plan start?

[Viking]

when did this 5 year plan start?

I have to moderate myself, their long term plan was a medal in 2011 :)

[VFTS]

Buying a seat in Stobart/M-sport was one of the options but Mikkelsen Sr bought Ramsport (at lest a big chunk of it) instead, so he could be in control of were the money went (yes body-parts I know :) ). Also testing would be more limited in an M2-team.
My guess is that Andreas still has several rallies to do this season before they make the decision for next year in their 5-year plan to make him WC :up:

It was no option to buy a seat this year, because Andreas must finish school first and because of the school the plan was only to compete in Europe in 2008 .Thats why they didnt compete in Argentina due to an offer from Wilson to compete in an Stobart-car.

In these weeks he has his final exams, and thats why he wont start i Acropolis, but he is back in Turkey. Before that he will compete in the next championship-rally in Norway(7.june).

His dad speaks with Malcolm Wilson regurarly and Malcom and Matthew also spent their christmas at Mikkelsen BIG cabin at Geilo in the norwegian mountain last christmas.

I can promise you that the Mikkelsen-team has several interesting plans for the rest of the season and for next year.

[CEORacingLions]

You know rallying nowadays is as much about sponsorship that it is about pure speed. Mikkelsen doesn't have the sponsors and money to recive a place in the Ford-team. If he did, he whould already be driving full season besides Henning and Wilson. So next year from him is very unlikely, but in the future, why not? The guy is 19 years old so i think whe shouldn't judge him to hard and call him a can-opener!

Anyway, Aginer (i don't know about ogier but hes got the contacts with citroen.) has Red Bull as sponsors and when the time comes when Red Bull enters the world rally team, aigners place in RBR is as natural as Manfred Stohl in a OMV-team.

So im sorry but i whouldn't compare these two!

Mate , you also have reason , certainly.
I said in my posts , Rumours ..... not facts.But you can see people in better position than me , what they say.

Malcolm , Mikk father , and himself talks about the project in future , and the future can be one of all projects that people say here.

In rallys you believe in impossible ? In rallys exist more or less impossible , but not 100% impossible. Like Sainz on England :(
Ogier have a nice contacts with Citroen too , Seb love to compete with him on the same team.
But well , is the first season on PWRC and WRC competition. To do better than Sordo , not easy . Aigner is a nice pilot too , have contacts , but i suspect he can't do better than Sordo. 3rd car ? Not impossible.

What you say ? Nowadays there are things more important than marketing,sponsor and.... ? :eek:
Mikkelsen have speed , sometimes is difficult to keep the car on the road , is a young boy mate !!!!! With 16-17 years old already led WRC cars. And you think father is a poor guy ? :p

Tell me the champs that no longer have their accidents? It's normal , or not ?

I say again , you have your reason and i have what i heard

I came here share with the people.

True or false ? Don't know , as I point out , only rumour.

[DonJippo]

Two Subaru teams next year...

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/67795

Also rumours of Subaru having four new cars in NORF getting stronger day by day, drivers being normal works team plus Xavi Pons and MM ;)

[ProRally]

Two Subaru teams next year...

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/67795

Also rumours of Subaru having four new cars in NORF getting stronger day by day, drivers being normal works team plus Xavi Pons and MM ;)

I like the last line ...."....... We're not looking to make money with this team, just to cover the costs."

Yeah, right... :hot:

[CEORacingLions]

Anton Alen ?

Sorry fans , the father figure was better even with 57 years old.

[J.Lindstroem]

Lindström: I dont think you know so much about Mikkelsen and his money.
If his dad had wanted it already he would have no problems to finance a seat in the Ford-team. But he is taking it step by step. And I can assure that his father and the team already are making plans for next season.

And there is no lack of money....

Your right, i don't know anything about Mikkelsens money. I just ment that Aigners contacts with the RBR is greater than Mikkelsens contacts with Ford. Therefore Aigner is obvious for the RBR official team, and Mikkelsen not for the Ford official team.

[tmx]

MM ;) OH RLY. This new Subaru team is enticing, more drivers, Mark Higgins could be a good candidate, or Kris Meeke.

[JRodrigues]

I bet on an italian driver, with Vodafone sponsorship

[A.F.F.]

Anton Alen ?

Sorry fans , the father figure was better even with 57 years old.

Yep, you ought to be sorry.

[Karbonyl]

I think there is a strong chance that Ostberg gets one of the seats.

[Buzz Lightyear]

This is no faster British driver than Meeke. He also got very close to test role for subaru. Hopefully DR shows a leap of faith he last did with Colin, and gives him a chance.

[duff]

I agree. In my opinion Meeke should be the next in line for WRC drive - in any team. He has incredible speed

[wwbroe]

I also agree with you guys, Meeke surely has the speed to become a contender for the rest, maybe Mark Higgins could be also a contender, for the rest i don't see too many Britisch drivers that could challenge the two above mentioned. Ostberg might have an advantage with Subaru as he is allready a paying client but i doubt he has the necessary speed. Maybe they can take Duval into consideration, i am sure he is the best bet if you want to beat the Fords and Citroens. :D

[bluuford]

but what about Wilks? He is as fast as Meeke but in my opinion, he is little bit more consistent.

[J.Lindstroem]

but what about Wilks? He is as fast as Meeke but in my opinion, he is little bit more consistent.

Yes i think that is the case. But i think Subaru should give Meeke a chance anyway, let him crash a little bit and learn his limits, maybe he can build up somethinkg like Atkinson..!

[N.O.T]

Yes i think that is the case. But i think Subaru should give Meeke a chance anyway, let him crash a little bit and learn his limits, maybe he can build up somethinkg like Atkinson..!

the thing is Atkinson had the funds to back all these crashes...i don;t think Meeke has that luxury

[Tomi]

It's a bit of a problem to find that good drivers at the moment who could help petter and atkinson, Richards said he is looking for a Brittish driver in the first place, well there is not any really good ones also Alen is not yet good enough, to challenge Galli for instance. But I think this news about a new team will make more privateer entrys to the rest of the seasons events, because now there is a reason why to spend money for drives again.

[Buzz Lightyear]

It's a bit of a problem to find that good drivers at the moment who could help petter and atkinson, Richards said he is looking for a Brittish driver in the first place, well there is not any really good ones also Alen is not yet good enough, to challenge Galli for instance. But I think this news about a new team will make more privateer entrys to the rest of the seasons events, because now there is a reason why to spend money for drives again.

ok here we go again. there is "no good ones". if meeke or wilks had 40/50 WRC events like latvala, hirvonen or atkinson has had paid for them, am sure they could cut it.

[J.Lindstroem]

the thing is Atkinson had the funds to back all these crashes...i don;t think Meeke has that luxury

that's very true! =)

Its a pity that money is such abig part of the sport!

[DonJippo]

ok here we go again. there is "no good ones". if meeke or wilks had 40/50 WRC events like latvala, hirvonen or atkinson has had paid for them, am sure they could cut it.

Ofcourse they could but the problem is as that they don't have those events and therefore team managers can't really be sure if they are good enough or not.

[Tomi]

ok here we go again. there is "no good ones". if meeke or wilks had 40/50 WRC events like latvala, hirvonen or atkinson has had paid for them, am sure they could cut it.

Lol, right out now they would not stand a chance against Galli, i think they would even struggle with Henning too, and if the rumours about Citroen and Stohl are true he would propably beat them as well, I dont mind if either one Wilks or Meeke gets the drive, i just think they cant help Subaru first team very well. (I would choose Wilks, because he has more WRC experience, with WRC car)

[noel157]

If the M2 team goes ahead I presume Richards is essentially looking for a couple of drivers who can bring sponsorship with them or is he hoping to arrange sponsorship and then sign drivers (like the good old days)? His comment - "not wanting to make money just cover costs" - could mean many things. Unlikely to be a pure factory effort as in the M1 team.
Be good if Meeke could make that last step up.

[Tomi]

Finnish Congo is launching a Grönholm stamp.

http://www.posten.ax/files/AlpostenFrimarken_108_finska.pdf

I think it was on page 10.

[cut the b.s.]

but what about Wilks? He is as fast as Meeke but in my opinion, he is little bit more consistent.


check the history of the WRC drives these two have had, heck check Kris's record against anyone in WRC cars and he will be able to stand proud against them, he had accidents in S1600 but apart from an unlucky 'off' in Rally Ireland where I think Loeb was the only person to get round with out some drama his WRC record is excellent. This said Wilks is a great driver but Meeke has the edge on raw speed but no doubt Subaru will have to go with a 'pay as you go' rather than talent so all this becomes irrelivant(can anyone spell that word?)

[SubaruNorway]

If nothing has changed Østberg is running his own M2 team next year, second driver yet to be announced..

[Roy]

..... irrelivant(can anyone spell that word?)

irrelevant ;)

[noel157]

If nothing has changed Østberg is running his own M2 team next year, second driver yet to be announced..

Sub, can anybody set up an M2 team? Is permission / support of the factory team or manufacturer needed?

[Karbonyl]

It can be anybody, but then must enter at least ten WRC events. For example Van Meksteijns plan to do M2 Team with two focuses in 2009.

[PuddleJumper]

Sub, can anybody set up an M2 team? Is permission / support of the factory team or manufacturer needed?
M2 team names must contain the name of the car manufacturer and they will need the permission of said manufacturer for that. When MMSP wanted to run cars for Toni Gardemeister and Khalid Al Qassimi in 2007, Mitsubishi refused to let them use their name in the team and the whole thing fell through.

[noel157]

Thanks for the replies Karbonyl & PJ.

[MikeD]

It can be anybody, but then must enter at least ten WRC events. For example Van Meksteijns plan to do M2 Team with two focuses in 2009.

I have been mailing with Van Meksteijn a couple of times and he told me that Dom Buckley will stay preparing the cars for the entire year, simply because his own crew isn't ready yet to prepare a car for a WRC event properly. So honestly I doubt, he will be able to run an M2 team next year unless Dom Buckley or another private teams is helping out.

[MikeD]

If nothing has changed Østberg is running his own M2 team next year, second driver yet to be announced..

Do you have a guess of who could be the second driver?

[SubaruNorway]

Do you have a guess of who could be the second driver?

Well Anders Kjær was supposed to drive a S10 in theire team this year but didn't get the funding, so he's the biggest guess. But i have a slight hunch on Anders Grøndal too....

[SubaruNorway]

Mads Østberg confirms he's not looking at driving for the Subaru M2 team next year.

http://www.vg.no/pub/vgart.hbs?artid=195803

I think we have to wait for somemore time as there are more changes taking since the past few days

[urabus-denoS2000]

Subaru new coupe Impreza.It will probably come around 2010 in Japan.The top version will be ,of course, an 2.5 liter 300 BHP turbo with 4WD

http://www.autosport.hr/content/view/8281/111/

[DonJippo]

Latest rumours about Janne Tuohino saying he is going to drive MG S2000 in NORF and Wales Rally GB this year.

[Mirek]

Very interesting if that's true.

[Tomi]

Hänninen will drive Kronos Peugeot s2000 in the russian irc event.

[SubaruNorway]

It's done! Østberg will be running his own M2 team next year with support from the SWRT. They say they are hoping for Henning Solberg to join but nothing is clear yet on who will be the second driver.

http://www.nrk.no/nyheter/distrikt/ostfold/sport_nrk_ostfold/1.6093526

[Tom206wrc]

It looks like former WRC driver Daniel Carlsson has been arrested by swedish police with alcohool in blood while driving :confused:

Licence removed I suppose :s

Source http://www.rallyonline.pl/index.php?1&modex=pnews&&s=17412

[Koppomsbo]

It looks like former WRC driver Daniel Carlsson has been arrested by swedish police with alcohool in blood while driving :confused:

Licence removed I suppose :s

Source http://www.rallyonline.pl/index.php?1&modex=pnews&&s=17412

http://paradise.motorsportforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=127901

[Koppomsbo]

It's done! Østberg will be running his own M2 team next year with support from the SWRT. They say they are hoping for Henning Solberg to join but nothing is clear yet on who will be the second driver.

http://www.nrk.no/nyheter/distrikt/ostfold/sport_nrk_ostfold/1.6093526

Great news , good luck to him :up:

[MikeD]

It's done! Østberg will be running his own M2 team next year with support from the SWRT. They say they are hoping for Henning Solberg to join but nothing is clear yet on who will be the second driver.

http://www.nrk.no/nyheter/distrikt/ostfold/sport_nrk_ostfold/1.6093526

Is Team Østberg really able to run an M2 team next year? - or will it be run by Prodrive?

Anyway, it's great news!

[Roy]

I....They say they are hoping for Henning Solberg to join but nothing is clear yet on who will be the second driver.

http://www.nrk.no/nyheter/distrikt/ostfold/sport_nrk_ostfold/1.6093526

What happend with the Expert Money? I understand Solberg has a contract by Ford for 2 years Or has he a contract with Expert for 2 years and that is also the reason for the Ford contract....?

If I was Henning I stay with Ford. Focus is by far better in comparison to Impreza.

[noel157]

What happend with the Expert Money? I understand Solberg has a contract by Ford for 2 years Or has he a contract with Expert for 2 years and that is also the reason for the Ford contract....?

If I was Henning I stay with Ford. Focus is by far better in comparison to Impreza.

Perhaps Henning AND Expert is what they want............

[Viking]

It's done! Østberg will be running his own M2 team next year with support from the SWRT. They say they are hoping for Henning Solberg to join but nothing is clear yet on who will be the second driver.

http://www.nrk.no/nyheter/distrikt/ostfold/sport_nrk_ostfold/1.6093526

70-80% sure in wrc.com

http://wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=101&id ... %20certain (http://wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=101&id=1763&desc=New%20Subaru%20Manufacturer%20Team%20'70%20-%2080%20per%20cent'%20certain)

[Buzz Lightyear]

I read on rallynews.net in ireland, that Kris Meeke is to compete in the IRC, Rally Russia in a Renault Clio (s1600 or r3?), and Guy Wilks in a Honda.

[DonJippo]

I read on rallynews.net in ireland, that Kris Meeke is to compete in the IRC, Rally Russia in a Renault Clio (s1600 or r3?), and Guy Wilks in a Honda.

Guy Wilks is also on the NORF entry list with Honda.

[Roy]

http://www.fia.com/en-GB/mediacentre/pressreleases/wmsc/wmsc08/Pages/wmsc_250608.aspx
Decisions of the World Motor Sport Council:

WORLD RALLY CHAMPIONSHIP

The WMSC has directed the FIA to finalise negotiations for the appointment of a central promoter for the World Rally Championship.

From 2010, Group N and S2000 cars will be renamed Superproduction cars. Group R cars will become known as Production cars.

The Cyprus Rally and Rally Poland have been approved for the 2009 calendar following the observers’ reports.

CALENDAR

2009 Production World Rally Championship

15 February Norway
15 March Cyprus
5 April Portugal
26 April Argentina
24 May Italy-Sardinia
14 June Greece
6 September Australia
25 October GB


2009 Junior World Rally Championship

1 February Ireland
15 March Cyprus
5 April Portugal
26 April Argentina
24 May Italy-Sardinia
28 June Poland
2 August Finland
4 October Spain

[AndyRAC]

It's done! Østberg will be running his own M2 team next year with support from the SWRT. They say they are hoping for Henning Solberg to join but nothing is clear yet on who will be the second driver.

http://www.nrk.no/nyheter/distrikt/ostfold/sport_nrk_ostfold/1.6093526

I presume this is the Subaru 'B' team - the one which DR wanted a British driver. Fat chance than.

[MJW]

http://www.fia.com/en-GB/mediacentre/pressreleases/wmsc/wmsc08/Pages/wmsc_250608.aspx
Decisions of the World Motor Sport Council:

WORLD RALLY CHAMPIONSHIP

The WMSC has directed the FIA to finalise negotiations for the appointment of a central promoter for the World Rally Championship.

From 2010, Group N and S2000 cars will be renamed Superproduction cars. Group R cars will become known as Production cars.

What is superproduction S2000 and Group N? - Where does the S2000+ (the turbo & kit) fit in or is S2000 what we have in 2010? Also what about the 2010 calendar, the one that teh manufactureres are supposedly unhappy about,.... where the allegedly wanted Finland, GB, and some of the traditional events to get permanaent slots with the new events rotating?
Lots of unanswered questions remain.

[c4]

Seems it is S2000+, FIA statement might be wrong and should maybe have read Super Production plus a kit, for the top tier cars.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/68629

BTW think the Ostberg team will be a separate manufacturer team to DR's proposed "B" team.

[SubaruNorway]

I presume this is the Subaru 'B' team - the one which DR wanted a British driver. Fat chance than.

Nope this is their own team, with their own mecanics and crew.

[OldF]

Group R = Production cars

Group N & S2000 = Super production cars

S2000+ = WRC cars?

[bt52b]

Group R = Production cars

Group N & S2000 = Super production cars

S2000+ = WRC cars?

Almost, think this is what they are on about.

Group R = Production cars

Group N & S2000 = Super Production cars

Super Production + Kit = WRC cars


I think Morrie Chandler was quoted in GPWeek on about the name changes. It's just to give the categories, names that are almost self explanatory.

Subaru have said they will not build an S2000, but will build a kit for their GpN car, so are going down the GpN+Kit route.

[dumb]

So why rally needs S2000 if there will be S2000+Kit???

[Saabaru]

Subaru have said they will not build an S2000, but will build a kit for their GpN car, so are going down the GpN+Kit route.

Where can I find this information?

[DonJippo]

So why rally needs S2000 if there will be S2000+Kit???

You can't have S2000+kit without S2000...S2000+kit is for World Championship series, S2000 for Super Production and regional Championships.

[Rallyst3ve]

Renault could be entering WRC in 2010 with a new Megane coupe can only be good news ;)

[Daniel]

Almost, think this is what they are on about.

Group R = Production cars

Group N & S2000 = Super Production cars

Super Production + Kit = WRC cars


I think Morrie Chandler was quoted in GPWeek on about the name changes. It's just to give the categories, names that are almost self explanatory.

Subaru have said they will not build an S2000, but will build a kit for their GpN car, so are going down the GpN+Kit route.

Such silly names.

Imagine explaining to someone who knows nothing about rallying that a Super Production + Kit car is a Super Production car + a kit which costs x amount of euros and can be fitted in x amount of time by x amount of mechanics.

So much for making rallying easier for the everyday n00b to understand :dozey:

[bt52b]

Where can I find this information?






SUBARU World Rally Team Technical Director, David Lapworth, suggested at the Acropolis Rally that Subaru will go the Group N+, rather than the Super 2000+, route in 2011 when the new World Rally Car rules come into force.



GPWeek (http://btccpages.motorsportforum.com/forums/www.gpweek.com)(GP013 (http://www.gpweek.com/PDF/GP013.pdf)), the last couple of weeks have mentioned the WRC rule changes.

Manufacturers now have more routes to build a WRCar. They can go the GpN route, or it they choose go the S2000 route. Hope it means more cars for Super Production and more cars for WRC.

[MJW]

GPWeek (http://btccpages.motorsportforum.com/forums/www.gpweek.com)(GP013 (http://www.gpweek.com/PDF/GP013.pdf)),
Bl**dy h*ll thats a good magazine, thanks for the link!

[A.F.F.]

I don't think the names are anymore silly than now :mark:

And I do hope it'll widen the interest of manufactures towards rallying on top level... whatever the name will be :up:

[sollitt]

Such silly names.

Imagine explaining to someone who knows nothing about rallying that a Super Production + Kit car is a Super Production car + a kit which costs x amount of euros and can be fitted in x amount of time by x amount of mechanics.

So much for making rallying easier for the everyday n00b to understand :dozey:

Rather than being silly names or making it harder for lay people to understand, these names seem perfectly reasonable to me.

Surely most people would find it easier to understand that a production car is as produced by the factory, a super production car is the same car with a little heat applied and a WRC car is a more modified car reserved for use in the World Rally Championship.

Contrast that with GrpN or S2000 which mean absolutely nothing and do actually require explanations such as you've shown to provide a clear picture of what they actually are.

[bt52b]

Bl**dy h*ll thats a good magazine, thanks for the link!

Motorsport News (http://www.mnews.com.au/)(Australia) is also pretty good for news on all things down under. Its probably because its was so successful that they launched GPWeek.

[AndyRAC]

I don't think the names are anymore silly than now :mark:

And I do hope it'll widen the interest of manufactures towards rallying on top level... whatever the name will be :up:

I hope you're right. But I won't hold my breath.

There needs to be a Rally version of 'Bernie'. Whether you like him or his methods, you can't deny he has turned F1 from a semi-professional sport into a multi million dollar mega sport - second only to Football. While WRC could never achieve that, it certainly can't do any worse than it is now. That person needs to persuade Manufacturers that the WRC is worth doing. Tough job I know.

[bt52b]

Such silly names.

Imagine explaining to someone who knows nothing about rallying that a Super Production + Kit car is a Super Production car + a kit which costs x amount of euros and can be fitted in x amount of time by x amount of mechanics.

So much for making rallying easier for the everyday n00b to understand :dozey:

No, Super Production + Kit = WRC car ;)

[Maui J.]

Rather than being silly names or making it harder for lay people to understand, these names seem perfectly reasonable to me.

Surely most people would find it easier to understand that a production car is as produced by the factory, a super production car is the same car with a little heat applied and a WRC car is a more modified car reserved for use in the World Rally Championship.

Contrast that with GrpN or S2000 which mean absolutely nothing and do actually require explanations such as you've shown to provide a clear picture of what they actually are.

Well said Sollitt. These names make more sense to the general public.

Just a question. Will R3 (Production) replace JWRC? Therefore will it become 'PWRC'?
Also will Group N & S2000 (Super Production) be 'SPWRC'?


Renault could be entering WRC in 2010 with a new Megane coupe can only be good news ;)

Sounds good. Where did you hear this? Did I miss something? They will need a Megane S2000 first though.

[A.F.F.]

I hope you're right. But I won't hold my breath.

There needs to be a Rally version of 'Bernie'. Whether you like him or his methods, you can't deny he has turned F1 from a semi-professional sport into a multi million dollar mega sport - second only to Football. While WRC could never achieve that, it certainly can't do any worse than it is now. That person needs to persuade Manufacturers that the WRC is worth doing. Tough job I know.

I hope I'm right too. I was reading a rallying book yesterday, the history of Finnish rallying to be exact, and I was thinking the biggest thing that have changed over the past is there is no way for a privateer to build a program for him/herself anymore. Everything is so expensive novadays. What I hope the most is that at least for a short period of time the table would be clean and also privateers could have their hands at competitive car. I hate that the gap between factory cars and customer cars is so huge.

[Rallyst3ve]

Maui J.
Sounds good. Where did you hear this? Did I miss something? They will need a Megane S2000 first though.

It was the top story in Motorsport News in the UK this week. Nothing has been confirmed by Renault yet but its believed there looking into entering the Intercontinental Rally Challange in 2009 before entering the WRC in full in 2010 the WR car looks like it will be based on the new megane coupe here's what it might look like ;)
http://www.carbodydesign.com/archive/2008/03/10-renault-megane-updates/Renault-Megane-Coupe-Concept-at-Geneva-2008-lg.jpg

[Viking]

For those who like to start their winter-rally preparation early :)

Next years Rally Norway will have the sermoniel start and an sss in Oslo 12/2-2009
http://www.rallynorway.no/no/pressemeldinger/rn-2009-apner-i-oslo.html

(seems like there is only Norwegian press release of this)

The sss wil be run at the horse trotting track called Bjerke Travbane where they recently ran “Bjerkeracet” . http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=127819

[Daniel]

Rather than being silly names or making it harder for lay people to understand, these names seem perfectly reasonable to me.

Surely most people would find it easier to understand that a production car is as produced by the factory, a super production car is the same car with a little heat applied and a WRC car is a more modified car reserved for use in the World Rally Championship.

Contrast that with GrpN or S2000 which mean absolutely nothing and do actually require explanations such as you've shown to provide a clear picture of what they actually are.
Perhaps. I just think they should make it simpler and less super duper mega uber production car type :) it just sounds a bit tacky :)

[SubaruNorway]

SWRT boss Richard Taylor meets the Østbergs http://www1.nrk.no/nett-tv/indeks/136129

[jonkka]

Young gun (though 27 isn't so young) Matti Rantanen will drive '06 Focus in NORF this year, run by Ramsport alongside Mikkelsen. Source: Helsingin Sanomat (finnish newspaper): http://www.hs.fi/urheilu/artikkeli/Rantanen+osallistuu+yksityistallin+Fordilla+Suomen +MM-ralliin/1135237453969

[HaCo]

As far as I can see, the Megane Coupe doesn't have enough seats to make it to WRC. But, the regular new megane could do the job:
http://www.autoblog.com/2008/04/29/renault-megane-leaked-in-french-mag/
The timing would be great for Renault, as they introduce a new model. But, isn't the model quite big for an S2000?

But, although it is just a rumour, strangely enough I talked to an Italian mechanic from Grefone in Ypres this afternoon (don't know if he was mechanic/engineer/...) and he was telling me exactly the same thing in his best english. When I asked him if FIAT was working on an S2000+, he told this is not the case, because rules are not clear yet. He also told me it would be hard to add a turbo without electronics.

mag.gpweek.com is indeed a GREAT and FREE magazine!! Pitty about the name, they should call it motorsport or anything but Grand Prix! :)

[Buzz Lightyear]

some major back pedalling from david richards, who was orginally looking to "hire" a british driver.

http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/int/d5/n5/d/2008/06/26/neues-m2-team-2009/index.html

[Brother John]

some major back pedalling from david richards, who was orginally looking to "hire" a british driver.

http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/int/d5/n5/d/2008/06/26/neues-m2-team-2009/index.html

Again they proof, it does not concern what you can, but how much money you can bring.

David Richard looks for British driver.
Promptly announced themselves in Banbury, Guy Wilks and Chris Meeke of Great Britain . But the telephone calls were from short duration: Richard will have asked „how much money you can bring “, . But neither Wilks, are Meeke have sponsors to afford the estimated annual budget between two and three million euros for ten WRC-runs.
Afterwards Richards let the English press know, I see at the moment nobody that really have the necessary international class.

Therefore you have only classe if you have money! :rolleyes:

[AndyRAC]

Hardly a surprise was it. I mean, where was the money going to come from? Trees, thin air? British companies aren't going to sponsor somebody that isn't in F1 - Hell -there are 3 young Brits in 125cc Moto GP - none of them on British owned bikes. If it's not F1/Lewis Hamilton - forget it!

[cali]

Citroen adds New Zealand rally to Urmo Aava's calendar. Plus one bonus testing session before NORF. This is Citroen's gesture to Aava for having a string of good results in the last rallyes. Here is the link as well, but it is only in estonian: http://sport.postimees.ee/?id=18072

[Buzz Lightyear]

Again they proof, it does not concern what you can, but how much money you can bring.

David Richard looks for British driver.
Promptly announced themselves in Banbury, Guy Wilks and Chris Meeke of Great Britain . But the telephone calls were from short duration: Richard will have asked „how much money you can bring “, . But neither Wilks, are Meeke have sponsors to afford the estimated annual budget between two and three million euros for ten WRC-runs.
Afterwards Richards let the English press know, I see at the moment nobody that really have the necessary international class.

Therefore you have only classe if you have money! :rolleyes:

compare that to his comments only 2 weeks ago...

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/67964

Richards ready to hire British driver

Subaru World Rally Team principal David Richards says he is willing to take a risk to develop a British driver in the future.

Richards was the team principal responsible for delivering both of Britain's World Rally Champions - Colin McRae in 1995 and Richard Burns in 2001 – and he says he wants to achieve the same again.

"Yes, I am willing to a take punt on somebody," said Richards. "At the moment, it's difficult to see who it might be. We took a risk with Colin [McRae].

"We picked him up when he was pretty much starting out and we took him all the way to being world champion. If I could see the same in another driver, that's what we're trying to achieve."

"take a risk" what risk is there?

"take punt on somebody"

his comments are looking very silly now, in the context of him looking €3m euros.

[MJW]

Sorry, but I dont get all this DR bashing. Who is supposed to pay for this additional driver, Subaru? Subaru UK, Prodrive, Red Bull? Philip Wilks cars Northumberland, Sydney Meeke Northern Ireland?
Prodrive is a business, a motorsport business, it has mechanics wages to pay, transportation and logistics costs. Very few drivers get free drives and paid drives these days, and as far as I know everyone in year 1 of a "works deal" has been a pay driver since very long ago.

[Buzz Lightyear]

we are using his remarks in autosport 3 weeks ago, as a basis for the discussion... the title of the article is "hire" a british driver.."take a risk". there is NO risk, or hiring, involved in selling in selling a WRC seat.

subaru want to sell cars in uk, and have 'limited edition' burns and mcrae models. if thats what they want, they need to invest. investing means putting money, ie.. nurturing a driver. If Subaru sell 30 STI's cars in UK, that £1m turnover. If they sell 1000 thats £30m, and they need to evaulate their ROI.

why do subaru think that someone would want to drive a subaru anyway. If meeke of wilks have 2/3m euros, id advise them to run a c4.

the fact the DR has had to clarify his comments says it all.

[Tomi]

Sorry, but I dont get all this DR bashing. Who is supposed to pay for this additional driver, Subaru? Subaru UK, Prodrive, Red Bull? Philip Wilks cars Northumberland, Sydney Meeke Northern Ireland?
Prodrive is a business, a motorsport business, it has mechanics wages to pay, transportation and logistics costs. Very few drivers get free drives and paid drives these days, and as far as I know everyone in year 1 of a "works deal" has been a pay driver since very long ago.

Well said, if there is many drivers with about same skill level, only a fool would choose the one without sponsors.

[Tomi]

Citroen adds New Zealand rally to Urmo Aava's calendar. Plus one bonus testing session before NORF. This is Citroen's gesture to Aava for having a string of good results in the last rallyes. Here is the link as well, but it is only in estonian: http://sport.postimees.ee/?id=18072

The test before Finland is a really good thing, way to go, Urmo,Urmo

[Buzz Lightyear]

The test before Finland is a really good thing, way to go, Urmo,Urmo


i think there is a hidden agenda to put Sordo under a bit of pressure. Avva Gravel, Sordo tarmac?

[Buzz Lightyear]

Well said, if there is many drivers with about same skill level, only a fool would choose the one without sponsors.

there are not MANY drivers the same skill level.
there are NO british drivers with sponsors.
David Richards knew that before now.

[A.F.F.]

Promising the moon from the sky is good for a wakeup call when it comes to media interest. Too bad I don't have spare 3 million € :(

[Bazza2541]

Sorry, but I dont get all this DR bashing. Who is supposed to pay for this additional driver, Subaru? Subaru UK, Prodrive, Red Bull? Philip Wilks cars Northumberland, Sydney Meeke Northern Ireland?
Prodrive is a business, a motorsport business, it has mechanics wages to pay, transportation and logistics costs. Very few drivers get free drives and paid drives these days, and as far as I know everyone in year 1 of a "works deal" has been a pay driver since very long ago.

Finally, someone with sense.
Well said. Last I heard SWRT was a business not a charity for second rate british drivers.

[Buzz Lightyear]

Finally, someone with sense.
Well said. Last I heard SWRT was a business not a charity for second rate british drivers.

My defination of second rate is Wilson, Rautenbach, Villarga, Clark etc.

From memory, i was there, Meeke was trading times with Latvala in his very first outing in a WRC car on Rally GB. My point behind that Latvala has left Meeke and Wilks et al behind because of the investment that has bought him the experience to continue to learn. No disrespect to Meeke or Wilks, they are still naturally drivers.

The investment and time involved cannot be argued with. If Subaru want a world champion british driver, why dont they invest?

SWRT would like to consider themselves a championship winning team, but the actually completing on the event is the cheap part. The total budget of a WRC team is say €30m euros, and the cost to run a 3rd car is €2m... ie. 6%.

I think what team bosses need to realise is that gone at the days of McRae and Burns. They are living a wet dream if they think they are going to pick up a nugget from obsecurity and cataplut him to WRC title in 2 years

If they want a pay driver then OK, pick "an Atkinson" and spend 4 years developing him into a race winner, which I believe he has become, and will demonstate that in Germany :) . But would Subaru stop crying about a British driver, when everyone knows there is no support within UK, and they are not willing to support one.

[bt52b]

DR is one of the people largely responsible for the fact that there is so little sponsorship money in the WRC. He had the rights, and screwed it up while he was chasing a customer F1 deal, which went pear shaped.

The sport and the teams should be able to pull in enough money to run the cars, and be free to pick the fastest drivers. The fact the media and sponsorship interest in the WRC is so bad is alot to do with DR.

The works teams should be made sell full-spec cars and spares at a price, that privateer teams car afford. There needs to be at least double the number of works and semi-works cars on the WRC to generate more interest and more of a show. It you make a mistake, it should be harder to get back into the top ten. There should be at least one driver from every country with a WRC round, especially the bigger countries. If the teams can't afford to run the fastest drivers, whats the point of it all, maybe change the name to the World Taxi Championship.

You would nearly need to merge WRC with IRC, to get one proper championship.

With the current points system, its almost impossible for private teams to score points, which can be a useful marketing tool and thus help get more sponsorship. If two or three manufacturers join the WRC, then points down to 15th or 20th will be necessary. Can't have a team do to a reasonable job and get nothing for it. MotoGP, NASCAR & V8Supercar all are well run, super competitive and have points down to at least 15th.

The fact the NorthOne (Simon Long) is being touted as the saviour/promoter of the WRC hardly fills anyone up with excitement...

[AndyRAC]

Or do everyone a favour and just end the WRC.

I really hope that S2000+ is a success, but I'm not too hopeful. Only if the cars are cheap and exciting is there a chance of more Manufacturers joining. Whoever gets the Promoter's job is going to have to work like hell to have success. At the moment the WRC is really struggling,.....

[MJW]

[quote="bt52b

The works teams should be made sell full-spec cars and spares at a price, that privateer teams car afford.[/QUOTE"]
Please get real, Henning had a car from Malcolm last year that was not the same spec as the works cars, even to the point that Marcus had to speak to Henning in Swedish, a common language understood by both, to tell him the differences in the cars. Works cars are for the #1 driver and his (often bring money #2. The rest are pay drivers in hire cars. That rallying and also most motorsport.

[A.F.F.]

Yes but they should was the point.

Back in early group-A, Mikael Sundström build almost faster Mazda 323s than the factory itself in his his team. That should be the case now. That privateers had the chance too. Even in one rally.

[bowler]

The works teams should be made sell full-spec cars and spares at a price, that privateer teams car afford.

How would that come about?

Who would pay for what is inevitably a large difference in price?

[bt52b]

How would that come about?

Who would pay for what is inevitably a large difference in price?

Point is the cars they are building should be cheap enough to do it. Its a bit stupid nobody can buy a proper C4 or a Focus that is the same as the works cars. Rules should say they have to sell it to and a certain price. €200k? The rules are wrong if its too dear to it.

The private teams have to have the capability to win now and again. Its makes the championship so much stronger.

What we have now is they have run most of the good private teams out of the WRC. Its a disaster that the like of Kronos, MSD and like are effectively barred by letting the manufacturer spend too much money, and making winning more expensive than it should be.

Next year will be better with the satellite teams from Subaru and Citroen, but its not enough. I suppose if you add a couple of manufacturers and they have satellite teams too, the numbers start getting better. If you don't have at least 20 or 30 WRC cars that show up at every single event, you don't have a world class show. Otherwise you have less than half of whats needed.

Probably wishful thinking, but compare the WRC to championships that work, and you see how far it has to go.

[jonkka]

Good post!


The fact the media and sponsorship interest in the WRC is so bad is alot to do with DR.

Explain how? Buying ISC from Bernie was a good move, DR supposedly had much more motivation to run the WRC alone than Bernie who mostly concentrated on F1. That DR then got sidelined with other projects should not have had such an impact, he had done that with Prodrive many times (Subaru WRC campaign is only one of the things that Prodrive does). Besides, ISC has done a lot of work to put in place the organisation and equipment that was only dreamed of ten years ago (ISC-T system with safety aspects and split times, consistent footage delivery, facilities at their truck etc). None of that is directly generating turnover but to a large degree it's good to have in place.

They've got several partners for the sport, from Inmarsat (now gone) to Karcher and Abu Dhabi et al. Why teams are struggling with money and so many have left is more down to several bad rule changes of the past (third driver rule got Peugeot screwed, calendar expansion at wrong time).


The works teams should be made sell full-spec cars and spares at a price, that privateer teams car afford. There needs to be at least double the number of works and semi-works cars on the WRC to generate more interest and more of a show. It you make a mistake, it should be harder to get back into the top ten. There should be at least one driver from every country with a WRC round, especially the bigger countries.

No, yes and yes. There should be more teams and more privateers on top cars, more drivers from different countries (in fact this has happened if you look at statistics), that much is obvious. But how would that come about? You say, cheaper cars that more people can afford. Spot-on, the cost is the burden.

But how that can be controlled? On the one hand there is the low-tech approach but for example Peugeot was adamant that they were in to demonstrate their technological prowess and were not interested "group N" WRC. On the other end are the big grN manufacturers Subaru and Mitsu and latter isn't at WRC at the moment (because the mother company has severe financial problems, as does so many automotive companies these days). On the other hand, there is the "increase the show" -approach. If you can't make competiting cheaper, make more out of it and per-view -price comes down. Look at F1, it's hideously expensive but because it's so darn popular, they don't have shortage of sponsors and teams. Can WRC do the same? ISC tried it, throwing ever-increasing viewer figures at potential sponsors but with relatively little success so far.

Note how many of the recent FIA rules have been put in place "in order to promote competition"?


You would nearly need to merge WRC with IRC, to get one proper championship.

If two or three manufacturers join the WRC, then points down to 15th or 20th will be necessary.

You need to provide a reason to merge WRC and IRC, why do that?

About points scale, you are right. Interestingly, in WRC the lowest place where scale has ever extended down to is 10th - so current top-8 isn't that bad in historical perspective. With so reliable cars and consistent drivers, the works teams almost always fill the top eight and leave nothing for others. Even more so if more teams do join. FIA seems to be anxious to keep the scoring scheme consistent between F1 and WRC so I don't see this changing in the foreseeable future.

[Rally Power]

Do WRC really needs super, ultra, extra hitec cars ???

Doesn’t S2000, with contained, effective and affordable technology, should be enough to WRC ???

Like in the glorious 70’s when simple and economical Gr.4 cars allowed privateers to compete factory teams at different levels of rallying (from national to world championships) !!!

Besides Prodrive, Msport and other specialized corporations who else benefits from so much expensive technology nowadays involved at the WRC ???

And one worldwide rally series with the most charismatic rallys of the world wouldn’t be enough ??? Is it necessary to have IRC and WRC competing each other and trying to find the next non yet visited country ???

Wake up people !!! Let’s go back to the basic !!! This is a fantastic sport, not a hitec exhibition or a united nations assembly !!!

[FAL]

Well its not quite what we used to say in the glorious 70s when competing against expensive works cars and most of that time they were Gp2 rather than Gp4 (eg. works Escorts were Gp2 on all major "WRC" type events except for 78 and 79) - but I agree with the principle - rallying does not have a tradition of complicated cars that bear no relation to standard cars if you go back to the golden era.

[Torsen]

Do WRC really needs super, ultra, extra hitec cars ???

Doesn’t S2000, with contained, effective and affordable technology, should be enough to WRC ???

Like in the glorious 70’s when simple and economical Gr.4 cars allowed privateers to compete factory teams at different levels of rallying (from national to world championships) !!!

Besides Prodrive, Msport and other specialized corporations who else benefits from so much expensive technology nowadays involved at the WRC ???

And one worldwide rally series with the most charismatic rallys of the world wouldn’t be enough ??? Is it necessary to have IRC and WRC competing each other and trying to find the next non yet visited country ???

Wake up people !!! Let’s go back to the basic !!! This is a fantastic sport, not a hitec exhibition or a united nations assembly !!!

i understand where your coming from... and obviously you've been into the sport much longer than I have.... however, from a newbie's point of view I really like to see the push toward hitec cars... however... i also loved the group b era... i really like the way it is now is decent... i just would hate to see the cars perform less than what they are at the WRC level...

[grugsticles]

i understand where your coming from... and obviously you've been into the sport much longer than I have.... however, from a newbie's point of view I really like to see the push toward hitec cars... however... i also loved the group b era... i really like the way it is now is decent... i just would hate to see the cars perform less than what they are at the WRC level...

Now dont get me wrong but it sound like your in the 'oh wow' phase where the loudest/fastest cars get your attention. Correct?
I think everyones major gripe is the lack of competition in the WRC.

In Australia the V8 Supercars touring car series is fought out between Ford and Holden(General Motors) - each brand having 5 or 6 major teams. Its a highly followed motorsport series for one basic reason. That reason is that its pretty even between teams.
Sure, there are teams that are ahead of others due to financial backing, but in essence, its all pretty even. Its not uncommon for a smaller team to have podium places, if not wins, on certain races through-out the year.

There are a few major reasons why this is so. These are that parts and their accompanying designes can be bought and sold between teams. This allows the richer teams to on sell their investment made in R and D, while poorer teams can skip the R and D and just buy the best proven part.


Perhaps the WRC needs to look at V8 Supercars, and Im sure other motorsport championships around the world, and reaslise that the only way to bring the sponsors, fans and the excitment to a rally championship back is to make it competitve. So, a message to the FIA/whoever, stop mucking about with technical changes here and there aimed at pegging back the championship leaders of the time and make everything even.

The only way I can see this working is if they have control components like the use of unmodified of the shelf turbo's, strict horsepower regulations, and 2 choices of dampers and tyres.

[Gard]

Now dont get me wrong but it sound like your in the 'oh wow' phase where the loudest/fastest cars get your attention. Correct?
I think everyones major gripe is the lack of competition in the WRC.

In Australia the V8 Supercars touring car series is fought out between Ford and Holden(General Motors) - each brand having 5 or 6 major teams. Its a highly followed motorsport series for one basic reason. That reason is that its pretty even between teams.
Sure, there are teams that are ahead of others due to financial backing, but in essence, its all pretty even. Its not uncommon for a smaller team to have podium places, if not wins, on certain races through-out the year.

There are a few major reasons why this is so. These are that parts and their accompanying designes can be bought and sold between teams. This allows the richer teams to on sell their investment made in R and D, while poorer teams can skip the R and D and just buy the best proven part.


Perhaps the WRC needs to look at V8 Supercars, and Im sure other motorsport championships around the world, and reaslise that the only way to bring the sponsors, fans and the excitment to a rally championship back is to make it competitve. So, a message to the FIA/whoever, stop mucking about with technical changes here and there aimed at pegging back the championship leaders of the time and make everything even.

The only way I can see this working is if they have control components like the use of unmodified of the shelf turbo's, strict horsepower regulations, and 2 choices of dampers and tyres.

you are talking about the pinnacle of rallying. Why should we turn it into veteran car racing? we have many cheap classes, we don't need another.

The problem is lousy TV production and therefore lack of ability to attract sponsors. If you should have control components, it should be gearbox and drive train

[AlfaWRC]

Just read on an Austrian page that Urmo Aava will do NZL this year as a bonus

http://www.motorline.cc/rallye/index.php/article=145659/=Rallye_-_Rallye-WM__Kurznews_-_Neues_aus_der_Rallye-WM.htm

Thats just fantastic. Looking more & more forward to the trip....

[cali]

Just read on an Austrian page that Urmo Aava will do NZL this year as a bonus

http://www.motorline.cc/rallye/index.php/article=145659/=Rallye_-_Rallye-WM__Kurznews_-_Neues_aus_der_Rallye-WM.htm

Thats just fantastic. Looking more & more forward to the trip....

i wrote this news several weeks ago ;)

[Brother John]

Promising the moon from the sky is good for a wakeup call when it comes to media interest. Too bad I don't have spare 3 million € :(

Remember the 1 millon € you lost on me :s mokin:, bring it to Jyväskylä, we will have a big party there. :p :D

[AlfaWRC]

i wrote this news several weeks ago ;)

OK.
Nevertheless great news

[grugsticles]

you are talking about the pinnacle of rallying. Why should we turn it into veteran car racing? we have many cheap classes, we don't need another.

The problem is lousy TV production and therefore lack of ability to attract sponsors. If you should have control components, it should be gearbox and drive train
Hmm, thats missing a whole heap more text :(
WTF?

Anyway, I agree that media coverage and its advertising potential is a major part of the slide of the WRC.
I ment to add that the reason V8's is as popular in Australia and New Zealand is because of the coverage of the big races. I think the last Bathurst 1000 (2007) had about 25 hours of coverage over the race weekend where the race only went for about 7 hours or so.
I admit the coverage of the race is biased to the big teams, but thats the benifit of investing the money in the sport - advertising.
The TV coverage has insight to how technical aspects of the cars work, demonstrations of operating compones out of the cars, insight into race tactics, footage from behind the scenes, proper interviews with team members (not just the 20 second chat with the driver or team boss).
The addition of access to check out broken components after an accident is also a nice touch so the viewer can see what actualy brok rather than some comentator blabbing on about some fancy named chunk of metal.

It is my opinion that Avesco, the V8 Supercars operating board, have got it right on how to market a product and that the WRC should look more in their direction for guidance.

/ end off topic conversation

[Rally Power]

you are talking about the pinnacle of rallying. Why should we turn it into veteran car racing? we have many cheap classes, we don't need another.

The problem is lousy TV production and therefore lack of ability to attract sponsors. If you should have control components, it should be gearbox and drive train


You can invest thousands in TV production, but Rally will never be “telegenic” as circuit racing…
I’ve didn’t follow any rally at the 70’s, but from what I’ve heard, saw and read, WRC was much more interesting at those years.
Each WRC Rally had his own challenging character (not the look alike courses of today), and the low tech cars allowed a greater balance between factory and private teams.
Of course, marketing issues weren’t top concerns, but that didn’t prevent Ford, Lancia, Fiat, Opel, Renault (via Alpine), Nissan and Toyota to enter the series in a permanent way (alongside many others with occasional participations).
This isn’t a melancholic view, just a lesson from the past that could be considered, especially when it’s available the S2000 formula, a very good technical concept that could be perfectly the pinnacle category of the rally sport.

[CABAIO E'LONA]

Suzuki to run third car in New Zealand?

http://www.crash.net/motorsport/wrc/news/165661-0/suzuki_to_run_third_car_in_new_zealand.html

[AndyRAC]

You can invest thousands in TV production, but Rally will never be “telegenic” as circuit racing…
I’ve didn’t follow any rally at the 70’s, but from what I’ve heard, saw and read, WRC was much more interesting at those years.
Each WRC Rally had his own challenging character (not the look alike courses of today), and the low tech cars allowed a greater balance between factory and private teams.
Of course, marketing issues weren’t top concerns, but that didn’t prevent Ford, Lancia, Fiat, Opel, Renault (via Alpine), Nissan and Toyota to enter the series in a permanent way (alongside many others with occasional participations).
This isn’t a melancholic view, just a lesson from the past that could be considered, especially when it’s available the S2000 formula, a very good technical concept that could be perfectly the pinnacle category of the rally sport.

Regarding sponsorship - put yourself in the position of the CEO of a major 'Blue Chip' company. You have money to invest in a worldwide Motorsport - where are you going to put it? F1, Moto GP, GP2, DTM, LMS/ALMS? You certainly wouldn't think about WRC, unless you were a real hardcore fan of the sport, and even then, you would think twice. What benefits would you expect? Having read todays Motorsport News column by Jerry Williams - I agree with his point about the promoter for the WRC - it should be a person ( a la Bernie) - rather than a company - ISC.
Personally, I think the sport has almost to go back to square one with simple cheap cars that lots of Mnaufacturers and Privateers can use, and build it up from there. Add Rallies that are different and challenging, and we may start to get somewere. At the moment the WRC needs a complete overhaul - as it is almost dead.

[Maui J.]

Suzuki to run third car in New Zealand?

http://www.crash.net/motorsport/wrc/news/165661-0/suzuki_to_run_third_car_in_new_zealand.html

Bring it on! The more WRC cars the better, no matter what stable they come from. That would make 16 WRC entries, not too shabby for this part of the woods.

I wonder who the third Suzuki driver could be... Wilks? Or maybe Monster himself?
There was talk of a debut outing for the Suzuki S2000 (possibly driven by Monster) at Rally NZ many months back, but that rumour has seemed to have disappeared.

[ProRally]

Bring it on! The more WRC cars the better, no matter what stable they come from. That would make 16 WRC entries, not too shabby for this part of the woods.

I wonder who the third Suzuki driver could be... Wilks? Or maybe Monster himself?
There was talk of a debut outing for the Suzuki S2000 (possibly driven by Monster) at Rally NZ many months back, but that rumour has seemed to have disappeared.

I think Monster is on his way out at Suzuki....

[Tomi]

I think Monster is on his way out at Suzuki....

Nice if thats true, any ideas whos going to replace him, R.V. ? :)

[Helstar]

Why is that eventually "nice", Tomi ? Poor Monster ... :( so unfair towards him :s

[Viking]

Suzuki to run third car in New Zealand?

http://www.crash.net/motorsport/wrc/news/165661-0/suzuki_to_run_third_car_in_new_zealand.html

3rd NZ Suzuki is BS says Wilding

http://www.crash.net/radioplayer/radioplayer.asp?radioURL=4367.wma

[Tomi]

Why is that eventually "nice", Tomi ? Poor Monster ... :( so unfair towards him :s

I think the development at suzuki is too slow, hopefully they get someone who can put things happen there and someone who focus on the right things.

[Helstar]

I think the development at suzuki is too slow, hopefully they get someone who can put things happen there and someone who focus on the right things.
You are wrong IMHO. Suzuki is in its first WRC year, it would be impossible to win just out of the box. They are 1 sec/km slower compared to people that are in WRC since centuries and that's not bad at all. They just need some more engine power ... (in Monte it appeared they have like 50hp less than C4, says it all).
The only thing that should work at once is the reliability, and it's not there ... BUT I don't think Monster has to be fired for this.

[pucky54]

At Turkey they were just half a sec per km slower. PG set some great times, so its going on in improving speed and reliability. I have a good feeling with this

[koko0703]

Before the season started, I would've guessed Suzuki doing much better because of their JWRC experience, but Suzuki isn't too bad at the moment considering their relatively small budget and lack of experience in building 4WD cars. I hope summer break will give them enough time to fine tune the car so they can fight for 5th or 6th position regularily in the later half of 2008.

[Tomi]

You are wrong IMHO. Suzuki is in its first WRC year, it would be impossible to win just out of the box. They are 1 sec/km slower compared to people that are in WRC since centuries and that's not bad at all. They just need some more engine power ... (in Monte it appeared they have like 50hp less than C4, says it all).
The only thing that should work at once is the reliability, and it's not there ... BUT I don't think Monster has to be fired for this.

What are you talking about, nobody has said anything about wins, are you impressed by their testprogram sofar? I think thats a teambosses issue.

[Buzz Lightyear]

What are you talking about, nobody has said anything about wins, are you impressed by their testprogram sofar? I think thats a teambosses issue.

i think it's a complete under estimation of the resourses and budget required.

[ProRally]

Nice if thats true, any ideas whos going to replace him, R.V. ? :)

Time will tell... :D

[ProRally]

i think it's a complete under estimation of the resourses and budget required.

Or spend in the wrong way ?

Remember Mazda ?

[dimviii]

no budget.....no glory....
since 1981 i watch wrc i can not found a winning/championship car with low budget team/tests/drivers etc

[Tomi]

Or spend in the wrong way ?

exactly, this is what i think too, also i have heard stories that confirms the toughts.

[Zico]

I think the development at suzuki is too slow, hopefully they get someone who can put things happen there and someone who focus on the right things.

Imo they used the wrong chassis platform for their WRC car... too compact (PMI) and possibly even too high (COG)

Might explain the development struggle..

[DonJippo]

Or spend in the wrong way ?

Remember Mazda ?

But wasn't it so that Mazda had a Ford / M-Sport type of structure with Mr Warmbold where as Suzuki has factory owned? Not that it would mean it's not possible to spend given money to wrong direction...

[ProRally]

exactly, this is what i think too, also i have heard stories that confirms the toughts.

Hi Tomi, so we both heard the same :D :D

[ProRally]

But wasn't it so that Mazda had a Ford / M-Sport type of structure with Mr Warmbold where as Suzuki has factory owned? Not that it would mean it's not possible to spend given money to wrong direction...

Like Suzuki with Monster Sport.... IF Suzuki Motor Company take control it will get better....

[DonJippo]

Like Suzuki with Monster Sport....

Ah ok I understand now few things better...pity when this happens. Hopefully Suzuki clears the situation and they get their act together.

[Andy Gregory]

Personally, I think the sport has almost to go back to square one with simple cheap cars that lots of Mnaufacturers and Privateers can use, and build it up from there. Add Rallies that are different and challenging, and we may start to get somewere. At the moment the WRC needs a complete overhaul - as it is almost dead.

I agree - a complete overhaul is what's required to get this sport back on track. It'll be interesting to see what happens when The FIA's new technical regulations for the World Rally Car of the future are complete.

The intention is to reduce the cost of producing a World Rally Car to entice more manufacturers into the sport.

The development of rally car technology has simply gone too far. My personal view is that the WRC car category should be scrapped and the cars should be of a similar spec to a 1995 Group A car - no launch control or semi-auto box. The mid 90's Group A cars were just as spectacular (if not more so) than the current WRC cars - they certainly got more sideways. The Group A cars even sounded better. There would be several benefits to the scraping of expensive and unnecessary technology, including the much needed reduction in cost for teams/manufacturers. You'd also hopefully see the return of the top class cars to the national championships rather than the Group N cars being the weapon of choice. Furthermore, by stripping down the works rally cars, there'd be some actual resemblance to the road going equivalent.

Bring back Group A!

[grugsticles]

I agree - a complete overhaul is what's required to get this sport back on track. It'll be interesting to see what happens when The FIA's new technical regulations for the World Rally Car of the future are complete.

The intention is to reduce the cost of producing a World Rally Car to entice more manufacturers into the sport.

The development of rally car technology has simply gone too far. My personal view is that the WRC car category should be scrapped and the cars should be of a similar spec to a 1995 Group A car - no launch control or semi-auto box. The mid 90's Group A cars were just as spectacular (if not more so) than the current WRC cars - they certainly got more sideways. The Group A cars even sounded better. There would be several benefits to the scraping of expensive and unnecessary technology, including the much needed reduction in cost for teams/manufacturers. You'd also hopefully see the return of the top class cars to the national championships rather than the Group N cars being the weapon of choice. Furthermore, by stripping down the works rally cars, there'd be some actual resemblance to the road going equivalent.

Bring back Group A!
My opinion totally!

That is the basic idea of S2000+ in essence I believe, but with more common components.

[Brother John]

I agree - a complete overhaul is what's required to get this sport back on track. It'll be interesting to see what happens when The FIA's new technical regulations for the World Rally Car of the future are complete.

The intention is to reduce the cost of producing a World Rally Car to entice more manufacturers into the sport.

The development of rally car technology has simply gone too far. My personal view is that the WRC car category should be scrapped and the cars should be of a similar spec to a 1995 Group A car - no launch control or semi-auto box. The mid 90's Group A cars were just as spectacular (if not more so) than the current WRC cars - they certainly got more sideways. The Group A cars even sounded better. There would be several benefits to the scraping of expensive and unnecessary technology, including the much needed reduction in cost for teams/manufacturers. You'd also hopefully see the return of the top class cars to the national championships rather than the Group N cars being the weapon of choice. Furthermore, by stripping down the works rally cars, there'd be some actual resemblance to the road going equivalent.
Bring back Group A!

I agree with most here but you forget 1 matter HERE.
A complete overhaul of the F.I.A. governing board would help certainly in this case. :s mokin:

[ProRally]

I agree with most here but you forget 1 matter HERE.
A complete overhaul of the F.I.A. governing board would help certainly in this case. :s mokin:

Beste BJ,

I also agree, but FIA can't even get rid of their a$$h.le of a president due to too many 'friends' who want to come to the big party's in Monaco at end of the year.

The bigger clubs have 1 vote each, but so do also each ASN of the African nations who give their votes to 1 person who can vote in their name... now it so happens that that person is good friend of the FIA president...

I can understand that USA, Germany, Japan and other ASN are p$ssed off...

But that is democraty on its worse ....

[Zico]

Andy Gregory, Brother John and Grugsticles..

Spot on!

[Tomi]

Beste BJ,

I also agree, but FIA can't even get rid of their a$$h.le of a president due to too many 'friends' who want to come to the big party's in Monaco at end of the year.

The bigger clubs have 1 vote each, but so do also each ASN of the African nations who give their votes to 1 person who can vote in their name... now it so happens that that person is good friend of the FIA president...

I can understand that USA, Germany, Japan and other ASN are p$ssed off...

But that is democraty on its worse ....

About the same said our man in the rally comission too, rally is not important enough to all who can vote, but its a good thing to bargain with, thats why he is speaking for a promoter, to get rid of the politics, and the teams should have more to say too.

[Rally Power]

That is the basic idea of S2000+ in essence I believe, but with more common components.

At the beguining I was a great beliver in S2000+, but with current tendecy of allowing further and further technical evolutions, I think we won't notice great changes from todays WRC cars... :mad:

That's way I defend the promotion of actual S2000 cars to the WRC top level category.

S2000 is a good all purpose rally desingned technical concept, that provides contained and reliable hitec at a affordable cost. It's even more balanced than Gr.A, because it doesn't obligue manufacteurs to higly cost production of street cars homologation units.

There's no need to invent more ;)

[Buzz Lightyear]

With Guy Wilks selling himself for the pay drive.

Is this Subaru "hiring" their British driver?


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/68986

http://www.guywilks.co.uk/500Club.aspx

Has the potential to back fire spectactularly, if there is little interest, but good luck to him.

[Tomi]

With Guy Wilks selling himself for the pay drive.

Is this Subaru "hiring" their British driver?


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/68986

http://www.guywilks.co.uk/500Club.aspx

Has the potential to back fire spectactularly, if there is little interest, but good luck to him.

good luck to wilks, atleast he is trying.

[Saabaru]

I know this is a little off the current topic but I just saw some footage of Volvo doing some testing on a S2000 spec C30, are they planning to entering the WRC or IRC? The car looks really fast and sounds awesome! Would they be able to use a 5cylinder motor under S2000 specs? In the footage the car sounded more like a F1 car than a 4cylinder rally car....

[Roy]

I know this is a little off the current topic but I just saw some footage of Volvo doing some testing on a S2000 spec C30, are they planning to entering the WRC or IRC? The car looks really fast and sounds awesome! Would they be able to use a 5cylinder motor under S2000 specs? In the footage the car sounded more like a F1 car than a 4cylinder rally car....

Volvo belongs to Ford Motor Company. I don't think Volvo steps in WRC.

[DonJippo]

I know this is a little off the current topic but I just saw some footage of Volvo doing some testing on a S2000 spec C30,

Would be intresting to see this footage, is it available online somewhere?

[Viking]

I know this is a little off the current topic but I just saw some footage of Volvo doing some testing on a S2000 spec C30, are they planning to entering the WRC or IRC? The car looks really fast and sounds awesome! Would they be able to use a 5cylinder motor under S2000 specs? In the footage the car sounded more like a F1 car than a 4cylinder rally car....

S2000 Volvo c30 STCC, Swedish verson of WTCC

http://www.polestar.se/default.asp?view ... sp?sida=47 (http://www.polestar.se/default.asp?viewset=1&on='BILDER'&id=&initid=58&heading=BILDER&mainpage=templates/05.asp?sida=47)

[Saabaru]

Volvo belongs to Ford Motor Company. I don't think Volvo steps in WRC.
Yeah, I could see them maybe doing some IRC stuff but not competing against themselves in WRC. Although Volvo has remained pretty independent of ford over the years.


Would be intresting to see this footage, is it available online somewhere?
This is all I could find on the web, it's not much but prettymuch the same footage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwOjA2WXQpM

[DonJippo]

Yeah, I could see them maybe doing some IRC stuff but not competing against themselves in WRC. Although Volvo has remained pretty independent of ford over the years.

This is all I could find on the web, it's not much but prettymuch the same footage: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rwOjA2WXQpM

WTCC.

[Saabaru]

Are WTCC cars the same as S2000?

[DonJippo]

Are WTCC cars the same as S2000?

Yes.

[MJW]

Yes.
Engines yes - transmission no, as S2000 are 4WD, wheras WTCC are 2 WD, mostly FWD but with BMW RWD.

[DonJippo]

Engines yes - transmission no, as S2000 are 4WD, wheras WTCC are 2 WD, mostly FWD but with BMW RWD.

You are right ofcourse but these are often mixed and I do believe Volvo's S2000 car in question is for WTCC considering also the test venue.

[playmo]

great to see another brand entering the WTCC, just in case BMW leaves, this is fresh air!, but i think they will stick only with STCC.
- ups, thought this was the WRC sub-forum - just joking =)
Damn! that c30 is hotter than the pirelli's (the girls).

[Maui J.]

The idea behind the car was a tertiary competition to design a hybrid rally car and compete on the NZRC.
http://www.TORC.org.nz

Not sure if the car will be in the WRC event proper or the Possum Bourne Memorial Rally which runs as a supporting event the same weekend. Probably the latter due to homologation.

The car has been listed for sale on the website below where it does say it will run at Rally NZ.
http://www.trademe.co.nz/Browse/Listing.aspx?id=162649349

[Saabaru]

Yes.

I did not know that. :) Here in the US we are not blessed with such pure forms of racing. All we have is boring nascar and IRL, which IRL is a little better than nascar but not much. I love Rally so I keep up with the WRC and IRC but don't know that much about WTCC. So technically a team could buy a used WTCC car and convert it to rally without much modification?

[Viking]

Engines yes - transmission no, as S2000 are 4WD, wheras WTCC are 2 WD, mostly FWD but with BMW RWD.

Super 2000, also known as S2000, is an FIA specification and classification for production based race cars. The specification is split to cover both rally and touring car racing.

http://www.fia.com/resources/documents/625423190__AppJ_Art_263.pdf

http://www.fia.com/resources/documents/1623371895__AppJ_Art_254A.pdf

[SubaruNorway]

Just read on a Norwegian forum that Prodrive now have their own damper department, still in the earlie stages yet but hopefully the damper problems will be resolved then..

http://www.norsk-rally.com/modules/module_119/debatt.aspx?DiscussionId=4&topicid=79229

[Tomi]

Loeb to drive in the French Carrera Cup, 5.-7. september.

[c4]

See Van Merksteijn Motorsport are close to becoming a MT next year
http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/van-merksteijn-motorsport-mt-wrc/

[Roy]

See Van Merksteijn Motorsport are close to becoming a MT next year
http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/van-merksteijn-motorsport-mt-wrc/

And is Motorsport News a reliable source?
If it is true it will be fantstic! With Duval... WOW!

[AndyRAC]

See Van Merksteijn Motorsport are close to becoming a MT next year
http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/van-merksteijn-motorsport-mt-wrc/

While good news, I hope they will keep their Porsche RS Spyder (LMP2) for Le Mans.

[Motorsportfun]

Andy, I think they've enough money for all the programmes! haha

[wrc_flipper]

Just read on a Norwegian forum that Prodrive now have their own damper department, still in the earlie stages yet but hopefully the damper problems will be resolved then..

http://www.norsk-rally.com/modules/module_119/debatt.aspx?DiscussionId=4&topicid=79229

Yep they are advertising for Damper Technicains on the Prodrive website (http://www.prodrive.com/level3.html?id=58)

[Viking]

http://www.motorsport.no/wip4/mads_kjoerer_s14/d.epl?id=262228

Some more news from Adapta/ team Østberg M2-plans for 2009

They will run two "new" S14 Impreza`s and share transport, logistics, parts, service park and hospitality with SWRT.

Team base will still be in Norway and they will keep their two S12b cars and also drive as much as possible in the Norwegian championship.

No news about who will get the second seat in the team but they are in talk with several candidates and Henning Solberg is one of them.

[Tomi]

http://www.motorsport.no/wip4/mads_kjoerer_s14/d.epl?id=262228

Some more news from Adapta/ team Østberg M2-plans for 2009

They will run two "new" S14 Impreza`s and share transport, logistics, parts, service park and hospitality with SWRT.

Team base will still be in Norway and they will keep their two S12b cars and also drive as much as possible in the Norwegian championship.

No news about who will get the second seat in the team but they are in talk with several candidates and Henning Solberg is one of them.

My guess is Henning, and he get replaced by Mikkelsen at Ford.

[Saabaru]

Could it be possable that Martin could drive one of these S14 cars? I wish we could see hem fighting in the WRC again.

[Roy]

My guess is Henning, and he get replaced by Mikkelsen at Ford.

First Henning needs Expert money. He has a two years deal with that company. I don't know if Expert put more money in him. Why put Expert Norway no money in Mikkelsen?
And why should Mikkelsen come so early to a MT team. A private team is better for the boy. (Not a lot of pressure yet.)

If I was one of these drivers, I had too choose between Subaru or drive in a Ford. I choose the last one. (offcourse, you know I am a fan of the 'Blue Oval') The Focus WRC is a fast car and has a good team.
I think, if Henning has again his Expert money, he drives for Stobart and Mikkelsen goes further with Ramsport, with maybe another driver in MT team.

[Koppomsbo]

I don't know if Expert put more money in him. Why put Expert Norway no money in Mikkelsen?




I think Mikkelsen (his father) have enough money so they dont whant somebody else have their fingers in it.. ;)

[koko0703]

I doubt Henning will be any better in Impreza but I love to see orange Subaru :D

[Roy]

Luis Companc retired after NORF


The forthcoming Rally of Finland will be the last for Argentine Luis Perez Companc, the co-founder of the Munchi’s Ford World Rally Team, who has decided to retire from World Championship rallying.

Companc’s Argentine co-driver, Jose Maria Volta, has also decided to make Rally Finland his last and will instead play more of an organisational role within the Munchi’s squad in future.

After Finland, Henning Solberg will drive the second Munchi’s car on the team’s three remaining rallies: New Zealand, Spain and Japan.

http://wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=101&id=1921&desc=Luis%20Perez%20Companc%20to%20retire%20after% 20Rally%20Finland

[CABAIO E'LONA]

Luis Companc retired after NORF



http://wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=101&id=1921&desc=Luis%20Perez%20Companc%20to%20retire%20after% 20Rally%20Finland

this decicion was taken from the beginning of this year .....

[Roy]

It is still a rumour: Rossi does Rally GB.

Dutch website: Ramsport is 90% sure Roosi does Rally GB in Focus WRC.
http://www.therallysite.com/joomla/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=4529&Itemid=1

Translation:
http://translate.google.be/translate?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.therallysite.com%2Fjo omla%2Findex.php%3Foption%3Dcom_content%26task%3Dv iew%26id%3D4529%26Itemid%3D1&sl=nl&tl=en&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

[mnop901]

There is someone that is coming or passing away in your life around the clock, so you may lose sight of those seen, and forget those remembered. There is gain and loss in your life, so you may catch sight of those unseen, and remember those forgotten. Nevertheless, doesn‘t the unseen exist for sure? Will the remembered remain for ever? ________wow gold (http://www.wowgold1000.com/) wow gold (http://www.wowgold800.com/wow-gold.html) cheap wow gold (http://www.wowgold1000.com/) cheap wow gold (http://www.wowgold800.com/wow-gold.html) buy wow gold (http://www.wowgold1000.com/) from http://www.wowgold1000.com

[Brother John]

Volkswagen sport boss Kris Nissen had a visite on the rally Finland. The WRC-circus hopes for three new A RISERs.

http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2008/08/05/vw-interesse-an-rallye-wm/index.html

[Brother John]

On the Turbocharger is a Restriktor, which does not correspond to the appropriate technical regulations. The young Swede flies upright from the valuation. :(

http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/pwrc-jwrc/d3/n3/d/2008/08/04/flodin-disqualifiziert/index.html

[jonkka]

Volkswagen sport boss Kris Nissen had a visite on the rally Finland. The WRC-circus hopes for three new A RISERs.

So, after trying and failing with Seat and Skoda, VAG intends to try themselves? Well, why not...

[Brother John]

http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2008/08/05/finnland-rallye-in-problemen/index.html

Because of the uncertain calendar planning of the FIA organization boss Jarmo Mahonen already announced an investment stop in the spring, since he counts by the WM-interruption also on the omission of sponsor funds.

-----------------------------------------------------------------

The Finnish Marchals is usually calmly, with restraint friendly actually and speaks rarely flowing English . Above all however it is generally age rather more set, and the problem lies exactly there. :dozey:

[Viking]

Mikkelsen will test Citroën C4 in September, the test will be with Citroën/PH Sport.
Nothing is decided for next season he says, but if we are to change car for next season I want to try it first.

http://www.motorsport.no/wip4/mikkelsen_citro_n/d.epl?id=266084

[MikeD]

Mikkelsen will test Citroën C4 in September, the test will be with Citroën/PH Sport.
Nothing is decided for next season he says, but if we are to change car for next season I want to try it first.

http://www.motorsport.no/wip4/mikkelsen_citro_n/d.epl?id=266084

Could this be a part of Citroën's plans to have an M2 team run next year by PH-Sport?

[HaCo]

Volkswagen sport boss Kris Nissen had a visite on the rally Finland. The WRC-circus hopes for three new A RISERs.

http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2008/08/05/vw-interesse-an-rallye-wm/index.html


The last part of the article is interesting as well:

Während die Fiat-Verantwortlichen schon erheblich am künftigen Reglement mitstricken, um sich einen Weg zum WM-Einstieg zu bahnen, steht bei Renault und Skoda lediglich fest, dass beide Hersteller ein Super-2000-Auto bauen. „Ob Renault den letzten Schritt in die WM dann auch macht, kann bisher niemand sagen“, gesteht David Richards.
In a nutshell: Renault is building an S2000, but Richards doesn't know if they will make the next step into the WRC!

[alleskids]

Could this be a part of Citroën's plans to have an M2 team run next year by PH-Sport?

Mikkelsen en Aava and the C4 would form a big treath to Stobart. And for the BP boys if they make a mistake. Maybe with Oiger as shadow man.

[Simmi]

Mikkelsen en Aava and the C4 would form a big treath to Stobart. And for the BP boys if they make a mistake. Maybe with Oiger as shadow man.

They would probably be a threat for 5 stages on the first day. Saying that Aava has looked promising this year.

[Helstar]

They would probably be a threat for 5 stages on the first day. Saying that Aava has looked promising this year.
Come on it was also Latvala case, and as you can see sometimes this year he has ended ahead of Loeb already ... drivers develop you know :p ? Also testing times are important, the more the better.

[Brother John]

In Germany the team will use the new WRC08 for the first time.
Jari Matti Latvalla tested yesterday in the vineyards to the Mosel the new car and could complete important test kilometers.
http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/g/3794/d/2008/08/06/ford-focus-rekord-und-evo-stufe/index.html

[DonJippo]

Jari Ketomaa is said to be planning to jump up to WRC for 2009, more to come before end of the year.

[Isthmus]

Quesnel also revealed that performance upgrades for the C4 WRC would continue to be introduced throughout the season, even though his lead driver thinks its good enough already. “We have at least 100 engineers working on improving different pieces of the car,” explained Quesnel. “These people are working at least eight hours every day, so the car is always getting better. It just happens. Sebastien said to me don’t touch the car - but we want to work. We are going to make it better.”

Citroën Sport wants to improve the car, but for S.Loeb it is already good "don’t touch the car" :p :
But they are going to make it better ;)

[Isthmus]

Could this be a part of Citroën's plans to have an M2 team run next year by PH-Sport?

It may really happen ;)


What is the latest news regarding Citroen Manufacturer Teams for 2009?
Next year we will get two official cars for Sebastien and Dani and then I would like to have an M2 team as well. I hope to have a young driver in the M2 but I don't have any names for you at this time.

http://www.wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=201&featureid=960&pageid=1021

[Motorsportfun]

Conrad Rautenbach, as I though, confirmed he will not partecipate to Fabaria rally, in Italy, as a pre-event test for Spain.

http://www.racingworld.it/rally/notizia.php?idtitolo=5141&url=tra-esclusivo-rautenbach-smentisce-niente-fabaria-rally


He will do a test next week in France, but I don't know anything. Traxx?? :D

[Brother John]

A little Rallye air taste can never harm, finds also Malcolm Wilson and offers to Raikkönen a WRC test. „It would be a great possibility for us “, says the M-sport-boss in relation to eurosport. Wilson is pleased in addition, about the interest of other Formel-1-Stars such as Lewis Hamilton, or Robert Kubica at the Rallyesport. „It is fantastic that these boys once want to drive a World rally Car and I surely that one of these three drivers will sit at the end behind the steering wheel of a Rallye Car.“

http://www.rallye-magazin.de/r/wm/d/n/d/2008/08/06/wilson-bietet-raikkoenen-wrc-test-an/index.html

[MikeD]

"Next year we will get two official cars for Sebastien and Dani and then I would like to have an M2 team as well. I hope to have a young driver in the M2 but I don't have any names for you at this time."

http://www.wrc.com/jsp/index.jsp?lnk=201&featureid=960&pageid=1021

It could be Ogier or Aigner (via his Red Bull connections) I guess. I hope it will be Ogier. I think he's a star in the making.

[alleskids]

http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/munchis-ford-manufacturer-2009-wrc/

The Munchi’s team will stay a MT in next years WRC. Luis Perez Companc confirmed this after his final WRC event in Finland at the weekend. Companc added that he would like to see a fellow Argentine replace him but conceded that this was unlikely and that a European driver would probably get the seat.

Companc stated:

The team will remain in the WRC at least next year. I would like the second driver to come from Argentina, but because it is difficult for us to find someone with relevant experience and budget, it will probably be a European driver”
Companc in action

[traxx]

Conrad Rautenbach, as I though, confirmed he will not partecipate to Fabaria rally, in Italy, as a pre-event test for Spain.

http://www.racingworld.it/rally/notizia.php?idtitolo=5141&url=tra-esclusivo-rautenbach-smentisce-niente-fabaria-rally


He will do a test next week in France, but I don't know anything. Traxx?? :D
I think these tests are managed by Ph Sport, so I don't know where. But I think about East of France to have similar roads as ADAC

[SubaruNorway]

Mads Østberg not doing Germany due to some complications with the newly rebuildt car. They would have made it for the event but they decided not to do it cos they didn't feel they were good enaugh prepeard. Mads has also got concluded that he has bad sight on one eye which affects his depth sight and just started using glasses wich will take a little while to adapt to. So they are now preparing better to the remaining two NRC events.

http://www.norsk-rally.com/modules/module_123/proxy.aspx?D=2&C=2&I=5552

[CABAIO E'LONA]

http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/munchis-ford-manufacturer-2009-wrc/

The Munchi’s team will stay a MT in next years WRC. Luis Perez Companc confirmed this after his final WRC event in Finland at the weekend. Companc added that he would like to see a fellow Argentine replace him but conceded that this was unlikely and that a European driver would probably get the seat.

Companc stated:

The team will remain in the WRC at least next year. I would like the second driver to come from Argentina, but because it is difficult for us to find someone with relevant experience and budget, it will probably be a European driver”
Companc in action

good news !

[Donney]

Indeed, the more the merrier, now if they found some speed....

[bluuford]

Skoda confirms its Super 2000 depute!
http://translate.google.ee/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://www.rallye-magazin.de/&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=2&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3Drallye-magazine.de%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG

[DonJippo]

Skoda confirms its Super 2000 depute!
http://translate.google.ee/translate?hl=en&sl=de&u=http://www.rallye-magazin.de/&sa=X&oi=translate&resnum=2&ct=result&prev=/search%3Fq%3Drallye-magazine.de%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DG

This been know for some time already, Fabia S2000 used as course car in Barum rally.

[AndyRAC]

This been know for some time already, Fabia S2000 used as course car in Barum rally.

What we really want is a decent Road version of the Fabia. I believe the next vRS is delayed until 2010. Poor decision, it should be out now!!

[Mirek]

Andy, do You realy think that something like road Fabia may look sporty and agressive? :D

[AndyRAC]

]Andy, do You realy think that something like road Fabia may look sporty and agressive? :D

It could be, but probably won't be. The older Fabia vRS was a decent little car 130BHP, got quite good reviews - and you do see a good number in Rally car parks.

[Mirek]

Yes, that's true. I just mean the ugly look of new generation...

[paddocknews]

Subaru WRT to run a third works car for possibly Markko Martin or Xavier Pons on the remaining asphalt WRC rounds .Autosport magazine state that Subaru will run three works Subaru Impreza S14 WRC’s in Corsica and Catalunya. Autosport state their sources within the team have confirmed the three car team.
It is believed that Markko Martin has been offered the seat, but nothing has been officially confirmed. SWRT managing director Richard Taylor admitted he would like to see Martin in the seat, but added that Markko was one of a number of drivers in talks with him.
Taylor stated to Autosport:

In many ways, running Martin would be an ideal scenario, but nothing is confirmed. We are talking to several people and, right now, wehave no definite plans to run another car. Now that could change this week or before the end of the season.”
Xevi Pons is another contender for the drive if Martin declines.
Taylor added:

Spain would make sense for Xavier.”
A decision will be made before August 28th, the closing date for entries on Rally Catalunya.

[paddocknews]

Subaru WRT to run a third works car for possibly Markko Martin or Xavier Pons on the remaining asphalt WRC rounds .

http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/subaru-wrt-third-car-possibly-markko-martin-xavier-pons-asphalt-wrc/

[Brother John]

Subaru WRT to run a third works car for possibly Markko Martin or Xavier Pons on the remaining asphalt WRC rounds .

http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/subaru-wrt-third-car-possibly-markko-martin-xavier-pons-asphalt-wrc/

Entirely the wrong choice of drivers according to me.
Meeke will be a good choice. :s mokin:

[AndyRAC]

Entirely the wrong choice of drivers according to me.
Meeke will be a good choice. :s mokin:

Meeke doesn't have the money - Pons seems to have shedloads!! And we all know that money makes the WRC go round.

[c4]

Kristian Sohlberg states will be back in WRC 2009
http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/kristian-sohlberg-wrc-2009-world-rally-car/

Matti Rantanen looks towards PWRC for 2009
http://rallybuzz.stagetimes.com/matti-rantanen-possibility-pwrc-2009/