FIFA World Cup 2014 !

[gadjo_dilo]

Who? :dozey:

Frau Merkel :p

[odykas]

Arghhhhhh offside :mad:

[Tazio]

Balls :dozey:

[odykas]

Frau Menkel :p

:eek:

[gadjo_dilo]

Torres Fan Club
-------------------------
1) Higuain :mad:
I'm already dizzy. Just posted this on a wrong thread. :laugh:

[gadjo_dilo]

:eek:
I meant Merkel.

[odykas]

Torres Fan Club
---------------------
1) Higuain
2) Howedes

[pino]

Bravo pino, you just missed first half :mad: thought it would start at 10 pm, as usually :crazy:

[Storm]

Torres Fan Club
-------------------------
1) Higuain :mad:

I had exactly this on my mind as I came back to my laptop at half time now :angryfire


donkey of the race err Final? Pino :D

[steveaki13]

Bravo pino, you just missed first half :mad: thought it would start at 10 pm, as usually :crazy:

Oh no.

You've missed a decent game so far. Germany camped in Argentina's half with possession, but Argentina look dangerous on the break. Could go either way.

[dj_bytedisaster]

Bravo pino, you just missed first half :mad: thought it would start at 10 pm, as usually :crazy:

You didn't miss much, unless you fancy full-contact karate.

[steveaki13]

donkey of the race err Final? Pino :D

+1

[steveaki13]

You didn't miss much, unless you fancy full-contact karate.

To be fair I think its been OK. Germany though in truth could have been down to 10 men.

Anyway both teams look good in certain areas and should make for a good second half.

Maybe not as easy for Germany as many pundits and alike were saying.

[pino]

Lol guys ! :p:

[Storm]

It's been a surprisingly engaging final actually.. Germany building the better attacks but good defense (mostly) and the woodwork saving them. Argentina look pretty good upfront on counter (except when presented with as easy a chance as you might ever expect). Messi also looks quick today with a couple of good runs down the right side. Nothing on the left since no Di Maria.

steve, those same pundits (and idiots who usually do not watch football) also thought Brasil would win easily as would Netherlands...it does not often happen that way just because you win 1 match easily that you will also win the next one the same way (atleast in a cup comp)

[gadjo_dilo]

Bravo pino, you just missed first half :mad: thought it would start at 10 pm, as usually :crazy:
:laugh:
If you had been with us on the forum you would have realised the match had started.

[donKey jote]

Hay gurlz wasssuuuuupppp :D

[pino]

:laugh:
If you had been with us on the forum you would have realised the match had started.

Sorry, I had a nice woman to please :p:

[donKey jote]

Messi missi

[odykas]

Torres Fan Club
---------------------
1) Higuain
2) Howedes
3) Messi :mad:

[pino]

How could Messi miss this ????

[gadjo_dilo]

Sorry, I had a nice woman to please :p:
You were kinda quick......:confused:

[pino]

I have just figured out, Germany isn't at the same level, as they were vs Brazil...

[gadjo_dilo]

Hay gurlz wasssuuuuupppp :D
Where have you been? In Pino's fan club? :laugh:

[pino]

You were kinda quick......:confused:

That was the antipasti ;)

[steveaki13]

Messi was feeling his leg. That would be so cruel if he is injured

[gadjo_dilo]

Schumacher-Battiston reloaded.....

[odykas]

Nice kick boxing.

Stupid Italian ref :mad:

[donKey jote]

Kung foo Fighters :dozey:

[pino]

Stupid referee :p:

[journeyman racer]

Harald Schumacher has had a shave and a haircut.

[pino]

This is not the same Germany have seen in the tournament so far !

[donKey jote]

They're playing more dutch today.... De Jong dutch :devil:

[pino]

If only Messi was the usually Messi, Germany wouldn't have a chance...

[donKey jote]

You mean the usual messi of other years :p

[pino]

You mean the usual messi of other years :p

Yes ;)

[steveaki13]

Messi is not as fit or sharpe as he was in pre 2012.

I think he has tweaked a leg muscle in the second half. I suspect he is proper injured.

[donKey jote]

I think he has tweaked a leg muscle in the second half. I suspect he is proper injured.
Must be bad... Even the spanish commentators have noticed it :p

[dj_bytedisaster]

Messi reportedly vomited on the field

[gadjo_dilo]

Messi reportedly vomited on the fieldAgain? :confused:

[gadjo_dilo]

Don't you think that Schurle looks like donkey jote? :p

[pino]

What a misser !!!

[odykas]

Torres Fan Club
---------------------
1) Higuain
2) Howedes
3) Messi
4) Kroos

[steveaki13]

What ever the reason. Messi vomits several times a month lately.

[donKey jote]

Maybe he's preggers...

[pino]

Still can't believe stupid Sabella, left Tevez at home ! :crazy:

[pino]

Boring match, I go back to bed :p:

[odykas]

Still can't believe stupid Sabella, left Tevez at home ! :crazy:

I think Sabella = Messi :dozey:

[donKey jote]

Boring match, I go back to bed :p:
Time for dessert yet? :andrea:

[pino]

Ups, have just figured out that, if Germany wins, they will have 4 WC wins, same as Italy :s Vamos Argentina !!! :p:

[odykas]

Ups, have just figured out that, if Germany wins, they will have 4 WC wins, same as Italy :s Vamos Argentina !!! :p:

Do you count 1990 as victory?

[pino]

Do you count 1990 as victory?

Yes !

[pino]

Palacio !!!!!

[donKey jote]

Palacio fan club :mad:

[odykas]

Torres Fan Club
---------------------
1) Higuain
2) Howedes
3) Messi
4) Kroos
5) Palacio :mad:

[pino]

What you expect, he's an Inter- Milan player :p:

[odykas]

Argentina could not afford that many in Torres fan club.

[veeten]

some match, eh? :p

[donKey jote]

I want to got to bed... Please somebody score :dozey:

[veeten]

another shoot-out coming. :s

is gadjo asleep again?... :p

[veeten]

oooohhh, blood! :eek:

[Tazio]

Another round of headaches! :arrows:

[gadjo_dilo]

another shoot-out coming. :s

is gadjo asleep again?... :p
Only on the extra time. Just wake up

[donKey jote]

About bloody time :dozey:

[odykas]

Elephant balls :mad:

[veeten]

and just in time, too...

[dj_bytedisaster]

This final game is brought to you by the Ultimate Fighting Federation. Argentina is getting away with murder here. Does Schweinsteiger need to die before the ref does anything about the pub brawl??

[donKey jote]

Hehe neighbors going bonkers... With a 5sec lag on my Spanish feed :p

[gadjo_dilo]

Ooops. Just wake up and........goal.

[veeten]

gadjo-Germany's good luck charm. :p

[donKey jote]

Missi again

[veeten]

Game over.

[Tazio]

Congrat's to Germany and their fans1

[donKey jote]

Rocket time :p

[pino]

Deserved win for Germany, although they have not impressed in the final !

[veeten]

and now, the Argentinians go 'boo-hoo-hoo...'

[donKey jote]

Don't cry for me .... :Argentina:

[odykas]

Too big Torres list for Argentina, plus Messi was not the real Messi again.

[donKey jote]

Despite the rockets, it's so much quieter here than when I was in Spain for the last World Cup :dozey:

[donKey jote]

Ah it's getting a bit louder now :D

[gadjo_dilo]

Once again Germany is über alles. Congrats.
Argentina..... Feel sorry for them but Messi is not Kempes (:kiss:) or Maradona.
Don't cry for me Argentinaaaaaaaaaa.....

[dj_bytedisaster]

Brutal final, but I'll take the result...

[donKey jote]

So when's shakira on :andrea:

[gadjo_dilo]

Sadly, this WC is over. Thank you guys, I had a great time here with you (despite sleeping a lot of time :p)
For me it was the most entertaining thread since I'm here. From tomorrow I'm back to my dull life.
See you in 2018 in Russia! :wave:

[gadjo_dilo]

So when's shakira on :andrea:
Was before. :p

[gadjo_dilo]

Messi is golden balls. :eek:

[donKey jote]

Balls I could have been in bed hours ago :mad:

[veeten]

handing out the hardware. Messi doesn't look so cheerful.

Wonder why?... ;) :p

[dj_bytedisaster]

Mutti hugging all the players - that final really IS brutal.... :D

[donKey jote]

We'll done Germany

donkeys of the WC: Brazil and Spain

[gadjo_dilo]

Donkey of the WC - Messi who wasn't able to score in the KO stage

Player of the WC - Torres who despite going home very early managed to get the biggest fan club. :devil:

[donKey jote]

Goodnight gadji, was fun with y'all :wave: :kiss:

[Storm]

big donkey balls :dozey:

The best world cup I have seen till the 113' of the final...Messi tried really hard not to cry at the end. Perhaps should have tried harder to score a goal considering all the Torres clones around.


Still fun thread (as always for a foot competition!) and stick around for the season starts soon enough :p:

[gadjo_dilo]

Goodnight? Won't you go out to celebrate? I wouldn't miss the chance.......:s

[gadjo_dilo]

big donkey balls :dozey:

The best world cup I have seen till the 113' of the final...
:eek:
You haven't seen too many then......:confused:

[veeten]

Goodnight? Won't you go out to celebrate? I wouldn't miss the chance.......:s

Tomorrow - workday.

Now, go to bed. :p

[Storm]

As overall world cup - not the final !!!
I told you I have seen every since 90 and even something from 86 but I do not remember anything from that except that a guy called Maradona owned everyone :D England especially.

I don't think there is any realistic chance of watchig Messi do that in 18 though. He would be playing as a defensive pivot by then :dozey:

oh and good night...its 0353 now. I hate the world cup. for now.

[gadjo_dilo]

Tomorrow - workday.

Now, go to bed. :p
I don't go to work tomorrow.:s

[steveaki13]

There we have it.

Sad for Messi, he is ill/not fit/struggling for form. I still love Leo. I hope he wont be crushed by this.

Don't know how he won the golden ball???? Rodriguez deserved that for me.


Well I will say bye bye and its been a great month chatting to y'all. See you in 2018.

Back to normal quiet motorsport forum life now. :(

[dj_bytedisaster]

See y'all in the F1 forum folks :)

[Rollo]

When an irresistible force meets an immovable object, the immovable object doesn't move but crumbles.
The titans of Germany took on the giants of Argentina; making them both appear normal sized.

I thought that this final was basically two sides which cancelled each other out; until one finally blinked. Germany deserved to win through sheer cussedness I think.

[Ranger]

Congratulations Germany, deserving winners.

Pretty gruelling game, was pretty glad the game wasn't decided by penalties!

[janneppi]

It was one of the best 0-0 games I've seen in a long time(until the 1-0 of course ;) ). Both teams had a clear idea what to do and managed to defend quite well. Argentina defended better and but couldn't challenge Germany's slow defenders enough times with only Messi at the wheel. It think this time the better offensive team won, and showed that you can't go all the way with just one world class striker.

The best part for me was that Müllër didn't score in the final, I got bit tired of his Robbenesque arm flailings. :D

Looking forward seeing Finland in the WC in 2050.

[pino]

Just in : Scolari has resigned, now let's hope Sabella will do the same !

[pino]

Btw please someone explain me, what Messi did, to get FIFA WC player award :confused: :crazy:

[gadjo_dilo]

Btw please someone explain me, what Messi did, to get FIFA WC player award :confused: :crazy:
Numberless ads for Adidas. :p

[journeyman racer]

Looking forward seeing Finland in the WC in 2050.

Against Australia?

[pino]

Against Australia?

Nope, San Marino :p:

[janneppi]

It will be a hell of a semifinal match :D

[gadjo_dilo]

It will be a hell of a semifinal match :D
The winner will lose the final against Moldova.

[Storm]

ok, I will bite

winning goal in group phase game 1
winning goal (in injury time!) vs Iran in game 2
2 goals vs Nigeria
topping the group and getting easier team in rd 2 because of this.,
rd of 16, pass for the match winning goal.
QF - good game vs Belgium
SF - quiet game compared to earlier matches but still crucial first penalty in shoot-out
Final - ok game, 1/2 great passes but not finished and missed a couple of chances as well.

What else was he supposed to do? Yes I know he has done much more for his club, but it was not to be for his national team...who else would you choose? Please do not say Robben or even worse....Muller!

[steveaki13]

Btw please someone explain me, what Messi did, to get FIFA WC player award :confused: :crazy:

I'm a big Messi fan, but he did not deserve the award.

Mind you Forlan in 2010 got 5 goals but only finished 4th and Zidane in 2006 after 3 goals (2 Pens) and headbutting someone in the Final.

So its not unusual for someone to win it who was not the best player.

I personally think Rodriguez should have got it. 5 games, scored in all 5 and scored 6 goals and 2 assists and probably got the best goal of the tournament.

[gadjo_dilo]

ok, I will bite

winning goal in group phase game 1
winning goal (in injury time!) vs Iran in game 2
2 goals vs Nigeria
topping the group and getting easier team in rd 2 because of this.,
rd of 16, pass for the match winning goal.
QF - good game vs Belgium
SF - quiet game compared to earlier matches but still crucial first penalty in shoot-out
Final - ok game, 1/2 great passes but not finished and missed a couple of chances as well.

What else was he supposed to do? Yes I know he has done much more for his club, but it was not to be for his national team...who else would you choose? Please do not say Robben or even worse....Muller!Ok, I'll not say Robben but the Diver. He did more than Messi. Not to mention he played two sports -football and diving-in one

[steveaki13]

ok, I will bite

winning goal in group phase game 1
winning goal (in injury time!) vs Iran in game 2
2 goals vs Nigeria
topping the group and getting easier team in rd 2 because of this.,
rd of 16, pass for the match winning goal.
QF - good game vs Belgium
SF - quiet game compared to earlier matches but still crucial first penalty in shoot-out
Final - ok game, 1/2 great passes but not finished and missed a couple of chances as well.

What else was he supposed to do? Yes I know he has done much more for his club, but it was not to be for his national team...who else would you choose? Please do not say Robben or even worse....Muller!

I agree Storm.

Let me go through some stuff.

Messi played a good tournament. AS you point out he was key until his quiet game v Netherlands. I am sure in the final he picked up a niggle.

Generally Messi gets too much grief. People expect the insane performance levels of 2010-2012 for Barca, but thats not on. He is truthfully not at that level anymore or at the moment and yet people act as though he is a disgrace. Where as most players would be happy with that world cup.

Also he has been under immense pressure for 4 years, he has been looked at by all Barca & Argentina fans as the player who no matter how bad the team is should win each game single handed. Thats just impossible. He is not a God.

All in all people are slagging Messi off, but why cant they leave him alone. He is a great player that is not in his best condition or form at the moment.


Plus he appears ill in some way. Vomitting every match and lacking any great fitness. I personally think he is just running on emotional, mental and physical empty.

Lets hope he feels better and finds his very best form again. I love the guy and think he actually did pretty well considering his form.

All this comparing to Maradonna is BS. You cannot compare players of different times and people seem to bash him with that rather than enjoy his career.

[gadjo_dilo]

Steve you're right but he was just average, why was he considered the player of the tournament? Last night he ran and passed less than any of his colleagues. He played ok in the group but it was against Iran. Nigeria and Bosnia, hardly football superpowers.
After 20 years nobody will remember this WC as the WC of Messi. But people still remember that the WC 82 was of Paolo Rossi, 86 of Maradona, 70 of Pele, 78 of Kempes, etc.

[steveaki13]

Steve you're right but he was just average, why was he considered the player of the tournament? Last night he ran and passed less than any of his colleagues. He played ok in the group but it was against Iran. Nigeria and Bosnia, hardly football superpowers.
After 20 years nobody will remember this WC as the WC of Messi. But people still remember that the WC 82 was of Paolo Rossi, 86 of Maradona, 70 of Pele, 78 of Kempes, etc.

I know he wasn't player of the tournament that was wrong IMO too.

However Messi is just in poor form. There's nothing that can be done. People shouldn't say he has never been very good. Thats just a lie. When he was at his peak in 2009-2012 he was unbelievable.

Yet people seem to forget that because he was in a dip in form for 2 crucial games. That doesn't undo what he has achieved as a player.

[pino]

Messi got the award because he's Messi and play for Barca. Rodriquez deserved more period.

[janneppi]

IMO, Neuer should been warded the best player, or atleast been nominated. Rodriquez maybe for best striker.

[steveaki13]

Messi got the award because he's Messi and play for Barca. Rodriquez deserved more period.

thats what I said, but so many seem to blame Messi. Where's the logic. Blame Blatter and his mates.

Not you Pino, just people generally on social media and press seem to pummelling Messi right now. Generally seems to tad unfair. He didnt choose himself as Golden Ball winner and he was in poor form. its one of those things.

It doesn't diminish his previous achievements. but thats what I have seen, people saying "well he was never that good really" and IMO thats nonsense.

[steveaki13]

I know the subject and World Cup is over, but I thought this was a nice piece which says alot in my opinion.







The great paradox that will unfairly define Lionel Messi
by Jen Evelyn | Posted on Monday, July 14th, 2014


Lionel Messi’s Argentina came closer to a World Cup title on Sunday than they have been in the last 24 years. The only minutes they were behind in the tournament were the seven minutes after Mario Götze’s goal at extra time, in the final. The sight of Messi walking past the World Cup trophy with an empty glare in his eyes will stay in the collective memory of the world of football, and paradoxically, unfairly, define him.


Messi didn’t win on Sunday, and the feel remains that he can’t ever really win anyway. In the World Cup, he didn’t fight against any player of his time, not against any team. He fought against a myth.


That myth is the great paradox that could end up defining Messi. That myth is called Diego Maradona. With a win in the World Cup, many would have been ready to put Messi to where Maradona is – to the cloud of immortality that time has sweetened.


But the reality is that Messi should be there with or without a World Cup. The reason he isn’t, is because the myth he was supposed to match was not of this World.


When you think of Maradona, you think of his goal against England. You think of the images of him lifting the World Cup. Even if you never lived in his era, that’s what the world around you has fed you. The idea of a perfect player who won on his own. The idea of the mythical God-figure who never failed. A bit of a rough-edged footballing rockstar who was forgiven for all his flaws because he was and is Maradona.


That’s because when we think of Maradona, or Pelé for the matter, we see the icing on the cake, not the entire cake itself. We see the documentaries and highlight-reels of their greatest matches, their greatest goals. We don’t see their failures. Their matches aren’t on the Internet, maybe except for the greatest ones. The historical ones. From Messi, we see everything.


In the last years it’s been easier to get bored of Messi’s brilliance because it’s fed to us in larger doses. It’s been fed to us every weekend, and after that, we’ve been able to go back for more, see it all again on the web. With no more than a click.


The bad matches are within that click too. The bad matches that Diego Maradona and Pelé played, too, but that the legend doesn’t remember. How many, in the modern day, can say that they saw Maradona as much as they see Messi now? Every weekend, with his club, with his country, throughout the year? Would the legend be different if Maradona lived in Messi’s era? Would the collective memory trace of his career be different, if it contained every single match? Was he ever – as great as his peak was – ever as consistently mind-blowing as Messi at his best has been?


And that’s the great paradox of Messi that he will never overcome. We see more of him. We see all of him. All of his goals, all of his solo-goals, all of his countless moments of genius. From Barcelona, and yes, from the international matches too. Because of that, he should be the most celebrated footballer of our time. Those moments – one could argue – put him on par with the corresponding moments of Maradona. I would go as far as saying that Messi has more of those moments than Maradona.


But still, in the day and age when we see every single match Messi plays, when we can celebrate his moments of heavenly brilliance over and over again, the collective will judge him by the seven games he played in Brazil. More radically, by the final he played in Rio De Janeiro. The final he lost.


Messi is in a place that none of us can really imagine. The media is on his skin like the defender that man-marks him and kicks him a bit too hard, just to kick him again because the man refuses to fall down. Perhaps the greatest and most radical example of the myth is that Messi has faced enormous criticism because he doesn’t run as much as the rest on the pitch. Maradona, on the other hand, used cocaine, and at the end of his career, had quite a belly to show for a wild lifestyle. That only made his legend stronger.


That’s why Messi is the most criticized player that has ever touched a football. It doesn’t matter what he does, there’s always a but. Even when he lead his team to the final, there was the “yeah, but”. “He didn’t score in the knockout matches”. As if the collective was already preparing an excuse in case he happened to win. There would still have been a “yeah, but”.


And when you look at what Messi has achieved whilst being the most criticized player in the world, it’s mind-boggling. Six La Ligas, three Champions Leagues, two Club World Cups, Olympic Gold, Under-20 World Cup, four Ballons d’Or, three European Golden Shoes. Add to that the goalscoring records, the amount of assists, and he’s achieved more than anyone, except for the one thing that will forever define him: the World Cup.


The seven games in the midst of hundreds will define him.


When he hangs up his boots one day, or maybe only decades later, we’ll really understand. We’ll live decades, realizing that no one quite matches what he did. Then we’ll look at the Youtube clips and documentaries made of him, and say “goodness, he was amazing. He scored more than anyone. He won more than anyone.” And maybe then the collective will realize that they won’t see a greater player in their lifetime.


For what he has done in an era that is organized, largely defensive and more tactical than perhaps in the decades before, Messi is quite possibly the greatest player of all times. But because he failed to replicate a myth, he might never get the place in history that he deserves. And that’s simply unfair, but shouldn’t stop us from celebrating his greatness today.


By Jen Evelyn – Follow @JenFCB

[Storm]

Rodriguez had a fantastic tournament no doubts (I loved watching him play too) but perhaps the thought process of giving to Messi is that with his contributions his team made the final. While with JR his team went out in the quarters. Plus in that defeat he wasn't as good as the rest of the games and the goal he scored was a penalty.

I am not justifying that Messi was the most outstanding player but certainly one of the best on display inspite of not having a truly sensational end to the tournament. Take out his 91' goal and the goal vs Bosnia and Argentina might not have qualified for the knock-outs, let alone win the group and avoid France.

A friend said Robben was more of a threat in the box than Messi...people seem to conveniently forget that he DID NOT play as a striker/false 9 as he does for Barcelona. He was also shackled by the tactics for Argentina as well as the intense pressure on him to top Maradona, as well as a certain lack of sharpness or fitness. Playing a game one day after Germany and having the last 3 games all go to extratime did not help either.

[steveaki13]

Rodriguez had a fantastic tournament no doubts (I loved watching him play too) but perhaps the thought process of giving to Messi is that with his contributions his team made the final. While with JR his team went out in the quarters. Plus in that defeat he wasn't as good as the rest of the games and the goal he scored was a penalty.

I am not justifying that Messi was the most outstanding player but certainly one of the best on display inspite of not having a truly sensational end to the tournament. Take out his 91' goal and the goal vs Bosnia and Argentina might not have qualified for the knock-outs, let alone win the group and avoid France.

A friend said Robben was more of a threat in the box than Messi...people seem to conveniently forget that he DID NOT play as a striker/false 9 as he does for Barcelona. He was also shackled by the tactics for Argentina as well as the intense pressure on him to top Maradona, as well as a certain lack of sharpness or fitness. Playing a game one day after Germany and having the last 3 games all go to extratime did not help either.

Its me and you Storm. :)

[gadjo_dilo]

Steve, nobody is in denial of Messi's qualities. But it simply wasn't his WC. I read that article and my opinion is that the author ( a woman :eek:) haven't seen too much football in her life. All that peroration on Maradona myth.....Maradona particpated on 4 WC but he shined only in 86. In82 he was already the most expensive transfer but at WC he was a. disappointment. And all those who knew a thing about football would say he was suspended when he played in Italy and was sent home from WC 94.Maybe we haven't too many records with his modest matches but we already know that at his clubs he hadn't Messi's success ( can't remember anything else than Il scudetto with Napoli ). But Mexico86 was definitely his WC because he proved he could win a match by himself and was an engine for his team.

[pino]

Maradona:"I'd give Messi the sky if I could, but it's not right when a player wins an award simply for marketing reasons"

[Brown, Jon Brow]

I agree for the call to give it to Neuer or Rodriquez.

[pino]

New FIFA ranking list :

1 Germany

2 Argentina

3 Holland

4 Colombia

5 Belgium

6 Uruguay

7 Brazil

8 Spain

9 Switzerland

10 France

11 Portugal

12 Chile

13 Greece

14 Italy

15 USA

16 Costa Rica

17 Croatia

18 Mexico

19 Bosnia-Herzegovina

20 England

[donKey jote]

USA>England :laugh:

[veeten]

and right behind Italy. Watch out, pino... ;) :D

[Rollo]

USA>England :laugh:

And all the world over, each nation's the same
They've simply no notion of playing the game
They argue with umpires, they cheer when they've won
And they practice beforehand which ruins the fun!

The FIFA rankings merely confirm what we all know, that England have always been rubbish at football. Even the only bit of silverware they won, was because it was at home; even then they never scored more than 2 goals in regulation time.

Why stop being rubbish now for? It's called consistency! :D

[steveaki13]

Can't see how Portugal are 11th really.

Generally they seem sensible.

[odykas]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Bs8ueJ9IUAABkud.jpg:large

all true :laugh:

[pino]

Lol ody :up: