[WRC] News & rumours (part III)

[Eli]

http://m.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121623/2016-wrc-schedule-still-in-limbo no agreement on the dates yet.

[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CS5IGyxUkAEPk6D.jpg

[jonkka]

Up to 14 events, yesh!

[Reis Eduardo]

The Rally of Australia at the end of the championship will be the advertised end. The interests in China speak louder.

[Andre Oliveira]

Bad, bad and bad finnish at overseas. Super error, entry list will be poor :(

And the question is: Ogier champ at germany or china?

[Eli]

last time something like this happened was back in 1999/2003/2005(China Round/14 Rounds & Australia @ end of season, respectively)

[AndyRAC]

Australia get the final round; they shouldn't even have a WRC round, it should be NZ. RallyGB is far too early - no chance of any 'wintry weather'; really needs to be end of Nov/ early December.

[focus206]

I agree, I don't like Australia as final round, I think GB round is perfect for that...

[Wim_Impreza]

Yves Matton said at the RTBF (Belgian television) that the Australian round this year was in September, because it isn't very hot then. Next year in November it will be extremely hot there...

[EstWRC]

you're not the only ones, i dont like it too. and NZ should be back!

[Simmi]

RallyGB is far too early - no chance of any 'wintry weather'; really needs to be end of Nov/ early December.

Last time we had anything approaching winter conditions I was sat in a cancelled double run of Hafren. Didn't go back for a couple of years after that.

In this day and age a snow/ice-hit Rally GB would be a farce so it's probably for the best.

[AndyRAC]

I too was in Hafren, but I thought it was to do with the ridiculous tyre regs that the stages were cancelled. The tyres were picked months beforehand - and couldn't be changed; plus there was the 'safety issues'.
It just seems as if everything that once made the event great & unique have gone. Saying that, I ordered my tickets the other day....

[Jack4688`]

If it ran in March wouldn't there be greater chance of wintry conditions?

[COD]

2004 GB was early (september) and the weather was just as cold, rainy and miserable as in november. Wales will never disapoint in that sense

[Grundo Farb]

That ending in Rally Australia is a joke. Typical Australian lobbying and positioning and selling "a gala dinner at the end in Sydney". Personally I think that is pretty arrogant, who cares about the dinner? The rally lacks personality, history, spectators, entries, interest fullstop. They manufacture stupid jumps on the stages for the 5 spectators who are there - it isn't a world rally event it is marketing and promotion.

This article from maxrally sums up the Australian approach:
http://www.maxrally.com/2015/10/31/its-new-zealand-versus-australia

I hope the World Champions are known in all categories before the event and it is a flop with nobody there. It would serve their arrogance right.

[sollitt]

It would do nobody any good to have an event, any event, "flop".

There's a few inaccuracies in that article. Rally NZ was not originally the Motogard. It was originally the Shell Silver Fern and then the Heatway Rally and the Radio NZ Rally before Motogard took naming rights in '78 ... the year after Bacchelli won in the Fiat.

Those who would champion NZ over Australia need to remember that it was NZ who stepped away from the year about arrangement. You step out of the queue and take your chances at the next available opening.

[Grundo Farb]

It would do nobody any good to have an event, any event, "flop".

There's a few inaccuracies in that article. Rally NZ was not originally the Motogard. It was originally the Shell Silver Fern and then the Heatway Rally and the Radio NZ Rally before Motogard took naming rights in '78 ... the year after Bacchelli won in the Fiat.

Those who would champion NZ over Australia need to remember that it was NZ who stepped away from the year about arrangement. You step out of the queue and take your chances at the next available opening.

If it flopped people wouldn't go back, sounds good to me.

The inaccuracies don't actually make any difference to the article, there was a rally in NZ for 38 years, who cares what it was called?

And the year about arrangement was dumb. Trying to retain sponsors and a management organisation for every second year was a stupid idea that any normal person would re-negotiate - which they did. And who isn't to say the year about arrangement would have been honoured by the Australians?

My point (which you have missed) is they are making it into a "show" rather than a Motorsport event. Formula one here we come which I think isn't what the fans want and why they walk for 2 hours to find the best spot to watch in the middle of a field

[raybak]

We need both Rally NZ and Rally Aus in the WRC. I love the roads in NZ but also enjoy the Rally Oz roads. I think the big thing about getting into the calendar is how much power your FIA delegate has. Having a strong person as your nations FIA delegate can make a big difference.

On the idea of running Aus in November, I think I may have to have a special on cool suits (I run a racegear shop) Going to be hot, the smaller stature drivers may suffer as they can't retain as much fluids, the guys that are moonlighting at Dakar in January might have a better chance:)

Anyway I'll be there next year competing in something but that's for another thread.

Ray

[AndyRAC]

That ending in Rally Australia is a joke. Typical Australian lobbying and positioning and selling "a gala dinner at the end in Sydney". Personally I think that is pretty arrogant, who cares about the dinner? The rally lacks personality, history, spectators, entries, interest fullstop. They manufacture stupid jumps on the stages for the 5 spectators who are there - it isn't a world rally event it is marketing and promotion.

This article from maxrally sums up the Australian approach:
http://www.maxrally.com/2015/10/31/its-new-zealand-versus-australia

I hope the World Champions are known in all categories before the event and it is a flop with nobody there. It would serve their arrogance right.

That is a good article. Motorsport in Australia is all about the V8 Supercars. There was a V8 race the same weekend as the Rally; guess which got all the coverage??
The event in Perth was fantastic, with the unique ball bearing surface. Coffs Harbour is another gravel event.......

[raybak]

That is a good article. Motorsport in Australia is all about the V8 Supercars. There was a V8 race the same weekend as the Rally; guess which got all the coverage??
The event in Perth was fantastic, with the unique ball bearing surface. Coffs Harbour is another gravel event.......

No V8 clashes for 2016. This has been a pet hate of mine for years. They try to say that it's different fans, it's not!!! Some of the series organisers in Australia live in their own fantasy land.

[Simmi]

I too was in Hafren, but I thought it was to do with the ridiculous tyre regs that the stages were cancelled. The tyres were picked months beforehand - and couldn't be changed; plus there was the 'safety issues'.

Yes tyres were the reason. But has anything changed to prevent the same thing happening again?

[sollitt]

If it flopped people wouldn't go back, sounds good to me.

The inaccuracies don't actually make any difference to the article, there was a rally in NZ for 38 years, who cares what it was called?

And the year about arrangement was dumb. Trying to retain sponsors and a management organisation for every second year was a stupid idea that any normal person would re-negotiate - which they did. And who isn't to say the year about arrangement would have been honoured by the Australians?

My point (which you have missed) is they are making it into a "show" rather than a Motorsport event. Formula one here we come which I think isn't what the fans want and why they walk for 2 hours to find the best spot to watch in the middle of a fieldThe inaccuracies, of which there are several, actually do make a difference to the validity of the article ... which is clearly written with some bias.

The question which the article asks, and then attempts to answer is "what can Australia give us that NZ can't?". The correct answer to that question is - confidence and capability.

Whatever you may think of the year about arrangement, Australia is in the box seat today because it delivered on it's commitments at a time when NZ declared it was incapable of doing so.
In order for NZ to regain a position on the calendar it would need to be able to demonstrate a capacity, venue and resources, to stage multiple events over a committed number of years. Whether it can is yet to be seen.

The real point, which you appear to miss, is that the FIA and promoter's position is completely understandable. In a world in which you are only as good as your last game, NZ's was a 'no show'.

[tomhlord]

As an aside, Hyundai will surely have a car next year better than current. Thus, Citroen and M-Sport will find it harder to get podiums IMHO. Maybe a driver shuffle up is a good thing?

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

[jbmarcus21]

My Highlights of 2014 2015 Hayden Paddon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9mdk9m9Jf4

[tomhlord]

My Highlights of 2014 2015 Hayden Paddon
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9mdk9m9Jf4
Good stuff JB!

[makinen_fan]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121679?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

But Capito dismissed the latest wave of rumours that it would be cutting down from three to two Polo R WRCs next season.
"If I had to save money, I would save it somewhere else other than on the third car," said Capito.
"For me, the third car is vital to win the championship and we have contracts with three drivers.
"You can never know what happens the next day, but there is no absolutely no indication that we have to do anything that is reducing our competitiveness."

While VW is unlikely to reduce its team to three cars, the chances of current Skoda driver Esapekka Lappi being installed in a fourth Polo next year also look to have waned.
"There is no chance of any more drivers or cars for us next year, but I think Lappi is ready for a world rally car no matter what that is," said Capito.
"We are following his progress closely and he is definitely one of the next drivers we would take."
He added that Volkswagen would not be running any semi-works cars or selling Polos to private teams in the future.
"We are a factory team," he said. "We are here to win."

[PLuto]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121679?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

But Capito dismissed the latest wave of rumours that it would be cutting down from three to two Polo R WRCs next season.
"If I had to save money, I would save it somewhere else other than on the third car," said Capito.
"For me, the third car is vital to win the championship and we have contracts with three drivers.
"You can never know what happens the next day, but there is no absolutely no indication that we have to do anything that is reducing our competitiveness."

While VW is unlikely to reduce its team to three cars, the chances of current Skoda driver Esapekka Lappi being installed in a fourth Polo next year also look to have waned.
"There is no chance of any more drivers or cars for us next year, but I think Lappi is ready for a world rally car no matter what that is," said Capito.
"We are following his progress closely and he is definitely one of the next drivers we would take."
He added that Volkswagen would not be running any semi-works cars or selling Polos to private teams in the future.
"We are a factory team," he said. "We are here to win."

So this means definitely no four VW cars next year as it was planned. For me title of this article is bad, better should be: Volkswagen is dropping fourth WRC car amid emissions scandal

[liposh]

One more season in WRC2 won´t kill Lappi :-)

[RS]

So this means definitely no four VW cars next year as it was planned. For me title of this article is bad, better should be: Volkswagen is dropping fourth WRC car amid emissions scandal

Did they plan that then? For Lappi full time?

[French_Paulo]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121679?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

But Capito dismissed the latest wave of rumours that it would be cutting down from three to two Polo R WRCs next season.
"If I had to save money, I would save it somewhere else other than on the third car," said Capito.
"For me, the third car is vital to win the championship and we have contracts with three drivers.
"You can never know what happens the next day, but there is no absolutely no indication that we have to do anything that is reducing our competitiveness."

While VW is unlikely to reduce its team to three cars, the chances of current Skoda driver Esapekka Lappi being installed in a fourth Polo next year also look to have waned.
"There is no chance of any more drivers or cars for us next year, but I think Lappi is ready for a world rally car no matter what that is," said Capito.
"We are following his progress closely and he is definitely one of the next drivers we would take."
He added that Volkswagen would not be running any semi-works cars or selling Polos to private teams in the future.
"We are a factory team," he said. "We are here to win."

No Polo for a private team, that's a shame... it's like with the Touareg at Dakar Rally ! :rolleyes:

[PLuto]

Did they plan that then? For Lappi full time?

It is too complicated. There was plan that one driver from "A" team will leave, Mikkelsen will go to "A" team and Lappi to "B" team. Then they decided to keep that driver one year more, so they have changed plans - to have two drivers in "A" team and two drivers in "B" team. Now it looks like they are forced to change plans again...

[makinen_fan]

It is too complicated. There was plan that one driver from "A" team will leave, Mikkelsen will go to "A" team and Lappi to "B" team. Then they decided to keep that driver one year more, so they have changed plans - to have two drivers in "A" team and two drivers in "B" team. Now it looks like they are forced to change plans again...

Maybe his failure to deliver in WRC 2 also helped to decide against a WRC seat for him. Too many mistakes and he had the best car with factory support

[Simmi]

In light of what has happened how could VW possibly have justified adding a fourth car to the line-up next year? They will be lucky to keep the current set-up at the existing level.

PLuto - all current VW drivers have contracts through 2016 though - correct? I figured those shifts would happen in 2017 where so far they only have a deal with Mikkelsen. Likely scenario could be Latvala moving on to Toyota for example. Then you shift Mikkelsen up and add Lappi in. Best scenario for VW is to put Lappi on a similar deal to Abbring. Let him do a lot of test kms next year and hope that by the end of 2016 there is scope to give him 1-2 rallies.

Of course if the VAG link begins to weaken then you'd have to imagine Lappi/EVEN will start looking around.

[AL14]

I think there aren't any solid news about the original idea of VW to go with 4 cars in next years.
So I don't think there isn't any step back in keeping the 3 cars.

Or have I missed something?

[RS]

I think there aren't any solid news about the original idea of VW to go with 4 cars in next years.
So I don't think there isn't any step back in keeping the 3 cars.

Or have I missed something?

PLuto knows stuff.

[Quad]

rumours says Kubica in DTM+third driver possibly at Citroen in DS3WRC

[AndyRAC]

rumours says Kubica in DTM+third driver possibly at Citroen in DS3WRC

How does that work? BMW, Audi or Merc have no connection with Citroen/ PSA group.....

[tomhlord]

It is too complicated. There was plan that one driver from "A" team will leave, Mikkelsen will go to "A" team and Lappi to "B" team. Then they decided to keep that driver one year more, so they have changed plans - to have two drivers in "A" team and two drivers in "B" team. Now it looks like they are forced to change plans again...
Damn, would have liked either 4 VWs or Lappi in the 3rd.

[Jack4688`]

How does that work? BMW, Audi or Merc have no connection with Citroen/ PSA group.....

Why do those two parts of Robert Kubica's motorsport activities have to be linked?

[JUF]

Somewhere I heard that Robert could do some WRC and WTCC rounds with Citroën next year. Then he decides if to go on in rallying or touring cars (maybe DTM).

[tomhlord]

Somewhere I heard that Robert could do some WRC and WTCC rounds with Citroën next year. Then he decides if to go on in rallying or touring cars (maybe DTM).
This would only work if Muller goes to Volvo in WTCC I think.

[Arnold Triyudho Wardono]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121679?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter


He added that Volkswagen would not be running any semi-works cars or selling Polos to private teams in the future.

M-Sport & Citroen wins.. :p

And I hope Codies will be able to have current WRCars licenses for Dirt Rally.

[vino_93]

This would only work if Muller goes to Volvo in WTCC I think.

Muller could leave WTCC to do World RX. He did Lohéac with Albatec, and then tested the Audi S3 of Münnich Motorsport.

More or less no chance to see him going to Volvo ... if he wants to go to another team, I think it could be Lada (as Lapierre will focus on WEC).

[Fast Eddie WRC]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTNTLHDXAAUo-0p.jpg

[Roy]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CTNTLHDXAAUo-0p.jpg

What say Malcolm Wilson? 'There comes other drivers on the market.' I see Lappi next year in a M-Sport Ford.
The Finn has a opportunity to gain experience. Wilson gets money from the financial backers of Lappi (i am sure) for that 'education year.'
Everyone happy.

I was thinking about this after I read the interview with Capito on Lappi.

[sete]

I am thinking that lappi is confirmed to continue in Škoda in WRC-2 for next year.But Dieselgate should change everything.
For me personally is too early to put Lappi in WRC.This year he made a lot of mistakes.

[Mirek]

Not only this year. In APRC he lost against Gill, in WRC2 he lost against Al Attiyah (and several others) and in ERC he nearly lost against Wiegand. Only the accident of Wiegand on Tour de Corse 2014 saved him from loosing three times in a row against opponents which he shall have easily beaten and moreover also against his own teammates/support drivers.

[Munkvy]

2012, 2013 and 2014 in an S2000, most of it as part of the Skoda team, then a year in R5 this year plus who knows how much testing? If he isn't ready/good enough by now to try a WRC car, will he ever be?

[tomhlord]

The time is right for Lappi, but the time is wrong for VW. Unfortunate.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

[AL14]

A second year in WRC2 learning some more discipline can only be good for Lappi. He's 24 and in the next years factory teams will be hungry for new drivers. No reason to be in a hurry for a WRC car, especially if that car is a VW.

[EstWRC]

That guy is so overrated. The finnish flag behind your name makes wonders sometimes.

[N.O.T]

The problem is that ERC is a ladies cup with no real competition and if you get stuck in there you end up like Hanninen...

[Hartusvuori]

The problem is that ERC is a ladies cup with no real competition and if you get stuck in there you end up like Hanninen...

Hänninen got stuck with Skoda, even if with Skoda he won everything. Hopefully the same won't happen to Lappi.

I'm biased in Lappi's case being a fellow Finn, but don't give up on him just yet. I realise he has made a lot of mistakes on tarmac, simple mistakes with similar pattern - for example crashes in Ypres 2014, Zlin 2013 and 2014, Corsica 2014, Germany 2015 and Catalunya 2015 were all on righthand corners �� He definitely should've shined on those moments when he hasn't, all whick Mirek mentioned.

But he still got the raw speed when all goes well. If he could transfer the speed and confidence in which he drove circles around his opponents in this year's Rally Finland to all events, he would turn out to be an unstoppable force. He was not apologizing for his performance in an unlikely Finnish manner, but full of positive confidence. That's how you win things. (Now you say it was in Finland. Sure he won all FRC events with Fiesta S2000 in 2012, but since then he has competed in Finland only 2013 with than inferior Fabia S2000 and now 2015 and as far as I recall, tested here with Skoda only on six days, of which two day already in 2013 with the first R5 test mule. Not too much of a homefield advantage apart from what comes from mother's milk.)

I think another year with an R5 does good for him, but he is on his way to WRC car sooner or later.

[French_Paulo]

The problem is that ERC is a ladies cup with no real competition and if you get stuck in there you end up like Hanninen...


A ladies cup... LOL ! So take the start of an ERC round and win it ;)
Not the best championship, but a good training with some good drivers !

[WUff1]

With Lappi it´s a bit the same like with Lefebvre, both are not ready for WRC, even if Lefebvre in the meantime gets more and more opportunities to drive a WRC-car. At the moment I´d even rate Lappi faster than Lefebvre, but with more mistakes.

[Rallyper]

What they need is driving driving, and ... driving WRC cars in rallies. The only thing that makes you faster after your talent has reached maximum. Only way to make it to the top.

[HaCo]

What they need is driving driving, and ... driving WRC cars in rallies. The only thing that makes you faster after your talent has reached maximum. Only way to make it to the top.

That is why I think teams should be able to score with the 2 best results of all their cars. It becomes more interesting to have a third or fourth car, thus having more seats available for guys like Lappi or others...

[Mirek]

What they need is driving driving, and ... driving WRC cars in rallies. The only thing that makes you faster after your talent has reached maximum. Only way to make it to the top.

That's true but I would add "in WRC events". The issue with driving ERC is not that it would be some lady cup or whatever. In fact a lot of WRC drivers failed in their ERC starts - for example here in Zlín it was Mikkelsen, Neuville, Novikov or Tänak, some of them several times. In Ypres I can remember Grönholm, Sarrazin, Duval, Mikkelsen etc. The problem is that by driving in ERC You don't get experience with particular WRC events. That's the real issue why the drivers who are serious about WRC must go there as soon as possible. You can learn driving in ERC but that is not enough.

[Mirek]

I'm biased in Lappi's case being a fellow Finn, but don't give up on him just yet. I realise he has made a lot of mistakes on tarmac, simple mistakes with similar pattern - for example crashes in Ypres 2014, Zlin 2013 and 2014, Corsica 2014, Germany 2015 and Catalunya 2015 were all on righthand corners ��

That's very interesting thing, Teemu. I have never realized that. For sure it can not be accidental coincidence.

[AndyRAC]

That's true but I would add "in WRC events". The issue with driving ERC is not that it would be some lady cup or whatever. In fact a lot of WRC drivers failed in their ERC starts - for example here in Zlín it was Mikkelsen, Neuville, Novikov or Tänak, some of them several times. In Ypres I can remember Grönholm, Sarrazin, Duval, Mikkelsen etc. The problem is that by driving in ERC You don't get experience with particular WRC events. That's the real issue why the drivers who are serious about WRC must go there as soon as possible. You can learn driving in ERC but that is not enough.

This is it! Experience of WRC stages. Making your pace notes of WRC stages. Because the WRC mainly uses the same stages with slightly different layouts, the current WRC drivers have years of experience of these stages, and years of notes to go back to and improve. A newcomer to the WRC maybe talented, but has nothing else to go back up on.

Another reason I'd like to see events move around a lot more - instead of the same stages year after year.

[Mintexmemory]

That's very interesting thing, Teemu. I have never realized that. For sure it can not be accidental coincidence.

Optician appointment for depth of field check?

[Mirek]

Hard to say. I can only say that due to the driver's seat being on the left side I feel myself a lot more comfortable turning left than right as well.

[Simmi]

I think the expansion to 14-rounds and the new cars coming in for 2017 probably kills the potential for my dream scenario. Three-car teams scoring points with a third driver who has had no more than 18 WRC car starts going into that season.

That way a driver starting fresh like a Lappi, Tidemand or Breen would be able to score points for two seasons.

It would constantly force teams to be bringing new drivers through and evaluating new talent. Like AndyRAC says organisers really need to mix up the rallies too. It's too easy for current crop of WRC drivers to stay in works seats due to the massive experience advantage.

[RS]

That's the real issue why the drivers who are serious about WRC must go there as soon as possible. You can learn driving in ERC but that is not enough.

True, but it's not enough either just to learn the roads in WRC2.

Competing in ERC whilst doing WRC recces, then if you can win ERC moving to WRC2 the following year seems like a good plan.

I am not convinced the plan they are following for Lefebrve will work. They are trying to make him run before he can walk.

Lappi is a very quick driver but realistically he wouldn't have won ERC either if the 208 R5 hadn't been so unreliable (Lappi himself admits this and that is something I like about him)

[RS]

The problem is that ERC is a ladies cup with no real competition and if you get stuck in there you end up like Hanninen...

Maybe not ERC so much the last two years, but certainly IRC was the only serious support championship of recent years. All the recent new WRC event winners (Neuville, Meeke, Mikelssen) spent significant time there.

Hanninen's problem was more his age and lack of WRC seats at the time. I actually think at the end of his Skoda days he was a more complete driver than Lappi is right now.

[Simmi]

For sure a good grounding in the ERC - fighting for victories at the front of international rallies - is very valuable. Even if it could take maybe five years in the WRC before you can be in a position to call upon that experience again.

[sindroms]

Maybe not ERC so much the last two years, but certainly IRC was the only serious support championship of recent years. All the recent new WRC event winners (Neuville, Meeke, Mikelssen) spent significant time there.

Did anyone predicted WRC future for these guys when they were in IRC? Lets wait for, lets say, 3-4 years. Maybe we will tell same about nowadays ERC regulars then.

[Mirek]

I'm biased in Lappi's case being a fellow Finn, but don't give up on him just yet. I realise he has made a lot of mistakes on tarmac, simple mistakes with similar pattern - for example crashes in Ypres 2014, Zlin 2013 and 2014, Corsica 2014, Germany 2015 and Catalunya 2015 were all on righthand corners ��

You can add an off in Rally Bohemia 2015 (to be fair he went off in both right and left hand corners in theat rally :D )


Did anyone predicted WRC future for these guys when they were in IRC? Lets wait for, lets say, 3-4 years. Maybe we will tell same about nowadays ERC regulars then.

Actually yes, everybody was speaking about Mikkelsen or Neuville and their WRC future in that time (at least here). The new one may be Bergkvist. Let's see.

[Rallyper]

Has anyone being so convincing in his early career as Emil? Dont think so. Lets hope money wouldnt be a negative factor here. Teambosses should/must see something special about Emil Bergkvist.

[AL14]

Has anyone being so convincing in his early career as Emil? Dont think so. Lets hope money wouldnt be a negative factor here. Teambosses should/must see something special about Emil Bergkvist.

He should have his chances and is a very interesting promise, but it's better to be prudent on putting too much hopes. We have had a lot of drivers very fast in 2wd cars or in ERC but struggling even in wrc2.

[PLuto]

He should have his chances and is a very interesting promise, but it's better to be prudent on putting too much hopes. We have had a lot of drivers very fast in 2wd cars or in ERC but struggling even in wrc2.

WRC2 is different story, this championship is not about speed, but mainly about reliability...

[AL14]

WRC2 is different story, this championship is not about speed, but mainly about reliability...

I meant that they struggle both in speed and in reliability. Take Camilli for example, or Lefebvre who was very fast with 2wd. Abbring himself, no one were expecting astonishing performance in WRC but he didn't impress neither.
Lappi would not be better than him at the moment in a WRC in my opinion. So, coming back to Berkvist. He is impressing now, no doubts about that but he has a loong way to go and it is not sure, even if he will have the chances, that he will be capable to reach the pinnacle ofo the sport. That's what I wanted to say.

[Rallyper]

What´s unik with Bergkvist is that he performs well on all surfaces. Not many young guys do that so early. He´s doing mature performances and looks to make his pace notes also very exactly.
So let´s hope money will not be an issue for him.

[RS]

I meant that they struggle both in speed and in reliability. Take Camilli for example, or Lefebvre who was very fast with 2wd. Abbring himself, no one were expecting astonishing performance in WRC but he didn't impress neither.
Lappi would not be better than him at the moment in a WRC in my opinion.

Again Abbring is someone who moved on too fast. He never even got a win in ERC let alone a title. I think Lappi has more to show for his efforts so far.

The WRC teams seem so obsessed with finding the next big talent they don't let them develop or prove themselves first.

[denkimi]

Actually yes, everybody was speaking about Mikkelsen or Neuville and their WRC future in that time (at least here). The new one may be Bergkvist. Let's see.

don't forget meeke. he is the only one that was able to beat loix in ypres with equal material.

[Ralph-Mario]

´16, the end of VW ?

[CWJ]

´16, the end of VW ?

Only idiots copy from idiots.

[Mirek]

don't forget meeke. he is the only one that was able to beat loix in ypres with equal material.

Meeke experienced being discussed as young coming star in JWRC not ten years later in IRC...

[Ralph-Mario]

Only idiots copy from idiots.

Many thx. Asshole

[Rallyper]

Many thx. Asshole

Oop, oop, oop! Pls use a more polite tone!

[AL14]

Very bad story from Nicola Arena's Facebook profile.
Arena is the co-driver of Linari, the current leader of the production cup. Here is what he wrote.

Today we speak about Rally GB, last WRC round. Here are some incontrovertible facts:
Fact 1
The rally will be the last round of the Production Cup, open only to group N cars, that next year will be cancelled because of the poor number of followers.
Fact 2
Only three drivers can still win the Cup: Linari (my driver), Rendina (Italian as well) and Carchat (from Andorra).
Linari wins if he finishes the rally.
Rendina wins if he finishes in front of Carchat and we don't reach the finish line.
Carchat wins if he finishes in front of Rendina and we don't reach the finish line.
Fact 3
Last night our rally car was still on the trailer, someone broke the bonnet and poured sand into the engine making it unusable.
That's all with the facts. You can comment if you wish so.

What a stupid move. How will you enjoy your victory if you get it in this way? What's the purpose? Getting some money? They already have them... Sad story...

[Andre Oliveira]

Armindo Araújo was victim of same type of saboutage in 2008 Sharqia Rally :( Stupid and criminal

[dimviii]

unbelievable.
Always at safe parking before rallies.

[N.O.T]

Very bad story from Nicola Arena's Facebook profile.
Arena is the co-driver of Linari, the current leader of the production cup. Here is what he wrote.

Today we speak about Rally GB, last WRC round. Here are some incontrovertible facts:
Fact 1
The rally will be the last round of the Production Cup, open only to group N cars, that next year will be cancelled because of the poor number of followers.
Fact 2
Only three drivers can still win the Cup: Linari (my driver), Rendina (Italian as well) and Carchat (from Andorra).
Linari wins if he finishes the rally.
Rendina wins if he finishes in front of Carchat and we don't reach the finish line.
Carchat wins if he finishes in front of Rendina and we don't reach the finish line.
Fact 3
Last night our rally car was still on the trailer, someone broke the bonnet and poured sand into the engine making it unusable.
That's all with the facts. You can comment if you wish so.

What a stupid move. How will you enjoy your victory if you get it in this way? What's the purpose? Getting some money? They already have them... Sad story...

either was sabotage or local chav lowlifes playing around.

[AL14]

It's stupid, I can't understand the reason. How can you feel proud of your achievement if you win like this?

[danon]

The answer to this ugly act is listed in the facts - Who is interested?


Very bad story from Nicola Arena's Facebook profile.
Arena is the co-driver of Linari, the current leader of the production cup. Here is what he wrote.

Today we speak about Rally GB, last WRC round. Here are some incontrovertible facts:
Fact 1
The rally will be the last round of the Production Cup, open only to group N cars, that next year will be cancelled because of the poor number of followers.
Fact 2
Only three drivers can still win the Cup: Linari (my driver), Rendina (Italian as well) and Carchat (from Andorra).
Linari wins if he finishes the rally.
Rendina wins if he finishes in front of Carchat and we don't reach the finish line.
Carchat wins if he finishes in front of Rendina and we don't reach the finish line.
Fact 3
Last night our rally car was still on the trailer, someone broke the bonnet and poured sand into the engine making it unusable.
That's all with the facts. You can comment if you wish so.

What a stupid move. How will you enjoy your victory if you get it in this way? What's the purpose? Getting some money? They already have them... Sad story...

[N.O.T]

where did they put the sand ? in the air intake ?

[Grundo Farb]

You would assume in the oil filler, air intake would be easy to clean out.

[danon]

The fastest and easiest way is through the oil cap on the camshaft cover - 100% success guaranteed!

But that's not the point.

Just imagine the scandal if that happend to some of the works teams...

I still can't believe it.

Sick bastards!

[N.O.T]

The fastest and easiest way is through the oil cap on the camshaft cover - 100% success guaranteed!

But that's not the point.

Just imagine the scandal if that happend to some of the works teams...

I still can't believe it.

Sick bastards!

Works teams only leave the cars with security in park ferme.

[rayh_mx]

Think wrong and be right ... Machiavelli.

Whereas to the Parc Fermé may only enter driver or codriver... it was Max or Joan or their codrivers

[SubaruNorway]

The fastest and easiest way is through the oil cap on the camshaft cover - 100% success guaranteed!

But that's not the point.

Just imagine the scandal if that happend to some of the works teams...

I still can't believe it.

Sick bastards!

That would be pretty easy to get out if it wasn't started though. Doubt it got through the cylinder head and further into the oil passages to the sump.

[dimviii]

That would be pretty easy to get out if it wasn't started though. Doubt it got through the cylinder head and further into the oil passages to the sump.

if you start the engine even for 5 sec everything is finished. We dont know if they started the engine though

[Eli]

http://www.rallye-magazin.de/wm/nachrichten/artikel/d/2015/11/11/zieht-sich-tmg-aus-wrc-projekt-zurueck/ trouble in Toyota's plan??

[itix]

Very bad story from Nicola Arena's Facebook profile.
Arena is the co-driver of Linari, the current leader of the production cup. Here is what he wrote.

Today we speak about Rally GB, last WRC round. Here are some incontrovertible facts:
Fact 1
The rally will be the last round of the Production Cup, open only to group N cars, that next year will be cancelled because of the poor number of followers.
Fact 2
Only three drivers can still win the Cup: Linari (my driver), Rendina (Italian as well) and Carchat (from Andorra).
Linari wins if he finishes the rally.
Rendina wins if he finishes in front of Carchat and we don't reach the finish line.
Carchat wins if he finishes in front of Rendina and we don't reach the finish line.
Fact 3
Last night our rally car was still on the trailer, someone broke the bonnet and poured sand into the engine making it unusable.
That's all with the facts. You can comment if you wish so.

What a stupid move. How will you enjoy your victory if you get it in this way? What's the purpose? Getting some money? They already have them... Sad story...

That's beyond upsetting :(
What a lousy soul to do something like that.

If they could see things like broken bonnet pins or similar they probably didn't start the engine, but if no signs of breaking into the engine bay can be seen, they probably started it as you wouldn't think about the fact that something could have happened (who'd assume all the time that someone would tamper with the engine?).

The clue is that he said the engine was rendered "unusable" making me think that they started it. Even if they poured it in the dipstick neck and straight into the sump, the engine should be fairly easy to clean out, unless they still have this rule that you can't open your engine during an event (I believe in this extreme case though someone at the FIA offices must be able to issue a joker to this rule).

[AL14]

Linari will regurarly take part at Wales Rally since they managed to get a new engine from another driver who give him the one of his recce car.
The article says also that Rendina proposed him to give him his car and renounce to participate but Linari refused.

http://www.provaspeciale.it/2015/riparata-vettura-linari-arena-dopo-sabotaggio-wales-rally-wrc.html

[rallyace]

Kris Meeke on being asked which car has been the best one he has driven yet: "The DS 3 is a fantastic car, but as a driver who wants to win you always want more."

Hmm... would he really comment such a thing if he felt certain that he would stay at Citroën next year?

"I've never driven the Fiesta, the Polo or the Hyundai so at the moment the DS 3 is my best to date."

A hint of what's to come? No later than January we'll know.

[Jack4688`]

either was sabotage or local chav lowlifes playing around.

If it was South Wales I'd it was certain to be chavs. North Wales..... not so sure

[GigiGalliNo1]

A current M-Sport client is bringing money to the table and will be part of a 3 car WRC Team in 2016

[RS]

A current M-Sport client is bringing money to the table and will be part of a 3 car WRC Team in 2016

I hope Kubica, then we can see how he would do with a full works car and without the pressure of running his own team.

And I would like to see the manufacturer scoring rules changed so that the top two finishers from each score.. none of this 'Volkswagen Motorsport 2' nonsense.

[leighton323]

A current M-Sport client is bringing money to the table and will be part of a 3 car WRC Team in 2016
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/11/16/4be38c756e5d89ab4aceb08f599e5409.jpg

No offence but your information hasn't been so reliable in the past.
What's different this time?

[GigiGalliNo1]

Spoke to the team manager (whom the driver is getting the money) to get a feeling from this "rumor", WRCTv Crew and a journalist

[EstWRC]

so Evans and Tänak to stay plus one more car?

[GigiGalliNo1]

I don't have the info on where Tanak and Evans are going... But this driver is joining the M-Sport team

[Grundo Farb]

I don't have the info on where Tanak and Evans are going... But this driver is joining the M-Sport team

Well the only M-Sport client with money is Bertelli isn't it?

[harriswrc]

Well the only M-Sport client with money is Bertelli isn't it? Protasov?

[French_Paulo]

Lotos and Kubica ?

[tommeke_B]

With those "rumors" you hear on service-park and on stages it's always the same. Usually the people who know the least speak the most. The ones really involved will keep it quiet until the deal is done. Another rumor I've heard a couple of weeks ago is that Neuville is going to Citroën next year, but that doesn't mean I believe it's true... :)

[AL14]

This time gigigalli can be right. I've also heard about this driver, that should be Bertelli by the way, in an italian forum.

[MartijnS]

M-Sport serious contender to VW for the manufacturer championship than! ;)

[AndyRAC]

Ah, so we'll have the Prada M-Sport World Rally Team......... Hmm.... Tanak, Evans & Bertelli.....

You have to love these rumours... ;)

[GigiGalliNo1]

So if Voice of Rally speaks of Bertelli joining the M-Sport team you believe him but when I hint of it you don't

[jbmarcus21]

and during this time, Marcus working in Spain
http://planetemarcus.com/et-pendant-ce-temps-la-marcus-travaille-pour-2017/

[b3637853]

Ah, so we'll have the Prada M-Sport World Rally Team......... Hmm.... Tanak, Evans & Bertelli.....

You have to love these rumours... ;)

Is Wilson so desperate that he let Bertelli pay to be part of M-Sport II team or something like that? Money can really do wonders. It would mean that even a complete joke like Bertelli can have facotry seat which should never happen in a normal world.

[manthey]

from the latest MM mag

http://s28.postimg.org/yiqjk021l/Motorsport_Monday_Issue_140_digital_edition.jpg (http://postimg.org/image/yiqjk021l/)

[GigiGalliNo1]

Desperate? If you had at least ONE person offering you money to pay for a drive.... Hrmmmmm yup, you would say no jbmarcus21

[AL14]

If this brings money to M-Sport I think it is good. From a spectator point of view it does not change too much to have him as a privateer or in a B-Team.

It would have been better if the deal was to form this team but with two seat, where Bertelli invested some of his money on a young gun like Tidemand or someone else. But of course he's not a charity and this is nearly impossible to happen.

[WRC1]

bertelli is at least as fast as al qassimi...so where is the problem, al qassimi pays his seat at citroen and his sponsor is also the sponsor of the real drivers...same could happen to m-sport..why not? i like the idea!

[GigiGalliNo1]

What advantage would Bertelli let alone Kubica get from sponsoring a Team like M-Sport compared to running their own cars like this year? They would spend more money in sponsorship but not pay logistics for their own team (or sponsors).... Yet still not get paid by a team but by their extra sponsors...

[Arnold Triyudho Wardono]

Ah, so we'll have the Prada M-Sport World Rally Team......... Hmm.... Tanak, Evans & Bertelli.....

You have to love these rumours... ;)
At least it's still better than (insert Japanese manga/anime/game franchise name here)M-Sport. :p

[Andre Oliveira]

Bertelli already tested to events with official test car :)

[Mariusz]

The difference for Bertelli wouldn't be so big actually. He's had his team of mechanics this season, but I think the rally car was owned by M-Sport and as you said he was using M-Sport cars for recce and testing. So I'd imagine he could get into a similar deal what Kubica had in 2014.

[KiwiWRCfan]

The difference for Bertelli wouldn't be so big actually. He's had his team of mechanics this season, but I think the rally car was owned by M-Sport and as you said he was using M-Sport cars for recce and testing. So I'd imagine he could get into a similar deal what Kubica had in 2014.

Wasn't Bertelli doing a one off season in WRC before having to go learn the family business. Was Lorenzo taking a few selfies in Wales in case he is not back in 2016 ?

[GigiGalliNo1]

I remember his last year of WRC2 he said that he has two more years in the sport... so another in WRC spec for 2016.

[manthey]

yes he said he would fight in the top category for few years before work at full time

http://www.corriere.it/moda/news/15_gennaio_06/dal-rally-vertici-prada-ecco-chi-bertelli-junior-dc45eae4-95d3-11e4-9391-39bd267bd3d5.shtml?refresh_ce-cp

[tomhlord]

I recommend watching Bertelli's RallyGB video.

In it he states that it was the last rally for his team but he is positive for the future in terms of continuing in the WRC.

Join the dots I guess.

https://youtu.be/-GHR1iXxUwc

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

[WUff1]

This could be a chance for Kubica too. Bertelli wants to help MW to build a M Sport B-team, as written in German Rallye Magazin.

[jbmarcus21]

Today Dani Sordo testing i20Wrc 2016 on tarmac
#video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zASPY4ptAaA&feature=youtu.be

[bassist]

Today Dani Sordo testing i20Wrc 2016 on tarmac
#video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zASPY4ptAaA&feature=youtu.be

Sounds Quick!

[GigiGalliNo1]

Bertelli crew are saying their thanks you's online for the past two years.... seems like Fnckmatie will end....

[GigiGalliNo1]

Citroen Racing considering only 6-8 rounds in 2016.

Morten Østberg says Mads will be in the WRC in 2016 in either a Citroen or M-Sport car.

[skarderud]

Then its no more Citroën in wrc after 2016 then.

[WUff1]

I already suspected somenthing like this when there were "changes" announced.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Evans hopeful he's done enough for a 2016 seat..

http://www.wrc.com/en/wrc/news/november/evans-future/page/3007--12-12-.html

I think he will be retained my M-Sport. After giving him WRC experience over the last two years what would be the point of then letting him go ?

[Eli]

http://peugeot-media.com/index.php?nav=952&action=view&communique_id=556&langue=en so if Loeb is doing Rally Raid next year what impact will this have on Citroen & DS?

[Sulland]

Then its no more Citroën in wrc after 2016 then.

16 is a testseason for new 2017 car maybe?

[Simmi]

16 is a testseason for new 2017 car maybe?

In Motorsport News today where they mooted the reduced season it was referenced that it is more likely they will re-commit to the WRC long term. So maybe one season of pain before a strong return? I would take that scenario.

[dodge33cymru]

Aye, that would be great news if that's what it takes for them to come back. Would make perfect sense too, when they know second is the best possible for next season otherwise; might as well fight for wins in some key markets but write off the other rounds and overall place to test a new car.

[Simmi]

The biggest issue in all of this is the fact that the WRC Promoter spoke to the teams - who all said developing a brand new car and having 14 rounds next season, with three rallies in October, is just not viable.

Despite that, and against the Promoter's wishes, the FIA Commission voted it through. A dangerous time for the sport really when changes can be made that most of the key players (and not even the so-called Promoter) even want.

[French_Paulo]

RedBull (WRC Promoter) = Bullshit !!

[GigiGalliNo1]

News now is that Citroen taking 2016 off of WRC and will be back in 2017 in new car

[N.O.T]

News now is that Citroen taking 2016 off of WRC and will be back in 2017 in new car

can you please stop posting the voices from your head ? it is creepy...

[skarderud]

can you please stop posting the voices from your head ? it is creepy...
Its several places now, so it can be something in it.
Your voices, thought.....

[AndyRAC]

RedBull (WRC Promoter) = Bullshit !!

Has anything really improved? I think they've been a huge disappointment.

[EightGear]

Citroen could cut its 2016 WRC programme to as little as six events

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121864


So.... This actually says the promotor didn't want 14 rounds but it was the FIA.

[rallyfiend]

http://www.citroenracing.com/en/2015/news/wrc-news/69144/citroen-maps-out-its-sporting-future/

[AP-Racing]

No Citroen in 2016

[noel157]

So now reports saying Citroen are out for 2016. Might be a reduced semi-factory team next season.
WTC gets all the budget.

[EightGear]

Did not see this coming, I really hope they keep some sort of effort into next year.

2017 will be interesting though. VW, Hyundai, Citroen, Toyota all with full factory effort. Or maybe we shouldn't count Toyota.

[noel157]

Meeke in the wrong place at the wrong time again. Hard on the man. Hopefully he'll have something other than testing and development next season.

[GigiGalliNo1]

Citroen out of the WRC until 2017:

http://www.citroenracing.com/en/2015/news/wrc-news/69144/citroen-maps-out-its-sporting-future/

"As it unveiled its future in motor sport, Citroën announced it will be taking part in the World Rally Championship from 2017. The team’s entry will be based on a model designed in line with the FIA’s new technical regulations. In order to dedicate as many resources as possible to development of the new car, the Citroën Racing team will be putting its participation in the WRC on hold next season. In 2016, the Citroën Total team will defend its FIA WTCC world titles with two works Citroën C-Elysée WTCCs, driven by José María López and Yvan Muller.

“We have never hidden our interest in the 2017 WRC regulations and the entire team is extremely motivated by this new challenge,” commented Yves Matton, Citroën Racing Team Principal. “We like the freedom granted to make the cars more spectacular, but also the possibility of reusing development work done on the Citroën C-Elysée WTCC’s engine. With a view to managing our resources efficiently, we have decided to focus all our efforts on designing and developing our new World Rally Car. This is why Citroën will not be competing in the 2016 World Rally Championship as a works team. We will obviously be keeping a close eye on the WRC, both with the organisation of the FIA Junior WRC and with the WRC2 programme for Quentin Gilbert, this year’s JWRC Champion*.”

[Grant_RSA]

Ideal opportunity for Malcolm Wilson to snap Chris Meeke up.

[noel157]

So Ostberg will take his money to Cumbria. Wilson will be happy.

[Doon]

Ideal opportunity for Malcolm Wilson to snap Chris Meeke up.

It's more likely that Meeke will be the development driver for the 2017 car. Citroen need to build a car around him, and he needs lots of miles in it i.e copy the VW method of winning.

[skarderud]

If loeb not competing in wtcc next year, can we hope for a comeback?

[Mintexmemory]

Sure as hell KRIS (note!!) won't be at M-Sport next year as he would have been there if he'd had the cash before the citroen contract!

[HarriK]

For his next challenge, Sébastien Loeb has chosen to take on the Dakar Rally, alongside his long-time co-driver Daniel Elena and as part of the Peugeot Sport team.

[noel157]

Sure as hell KRIS (note!!) won't be at M-Sport next year as he would have been there if he'd had the cash before the citroen contract!

Note noticed. McRae stages.............................

[Mintexmemory]

If loeb not competing in wtcc next year, can we hope for a comeback?
Can't see his ego wanting to compete against the top gun with inferior weapons! It would be a mistake for him to attempt anything other than the Monte

[Mintexmemory]

Note noticed. McRae stages.............................

A test or just a gesture towards the C McR memory?

[EstWRC]

so two fastest guys after the VW's, Tänak and Meeke with no jobs then. Great!:rolleyes:

[noel157]

Non-story, only going next door to Pug:

http://beta.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121867/loeb-parts-ways-with-citroen

[noel157]

so two fastest guys after the VW's, Tänak and Meeke with no jobs then. Great!:rolleyes:

Matton was on about drivers for next season so hope some kind of competitive programme for Meeke, reduced, semi-factory (like 2006) or something. Some truth to Meeke's reference to gardening.....

[maciotacio]

@EstWRC
I would say three: Meeke, Tanak and Kubica.
I really wonder who will be Citroen development driver in 2016 (my wishful thinking is Meeke-Kubica, both of them have tremendous skills in feeling and developing a car)

[EstWRC]

i think everyone waited this decision and now im sure that Evans and Tänak will share one car, Wilson said it is a possibility and now it may come reality. I would like too see Tänak in a Citroen too

[Sch17]

So what will happen to Ostberg and Stephane Lefebvre?

[wia5958]

Cant see meeke stayin to develop a car for citroen unless he gauranteed at least 2 championship campaigns

[EstWRC]

So what will happen to Ostberg?

M-sport for sure

[noel157]

Cant see meeke stayin to develop a car for citroen unless he gauranteed at least 2 championship campaigns

Well 2017 at least. But there might be news of something soon, I hope.

[makinen_fan]

Interestingly the only name they use is Gilbert for a WRC2 program next year

"We will obviously be keeping a close eye on the WRC, both with the organisation of the FIA Junior WRC and with the WRC2 programme for Quentin Gilbert, this year’s JWRC Champion"

[EstWRC]

Ostberg out, Meeke in talks

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121870

[Francis44]

Autosport now says Meeke is still in negotiations with Citroen, perhaps for a development program and selected rounds. Hopefully they get this together as it would be a shame to have those cars in the warehouse all year. Otsberg definitely out of Citroen.

[JUF]

Not sure, if this is really realistic, but I would like to see Loeb, Solberg and Meeke as Citroën's drivers in 2017... :D.

[Nornbugger]

so two fastest guys after the VW's, Tänak and Meeke with no jobs then. Great!:rolleyes:

two of the fastest, Sordo, Paddon and Neuville(when his head lets him) are every bit as fast

[AP-Racing]

Loeb: J’ai été surpris lorsque j’ai appris que je ne continuerai pas à défendre les couleurs de Citroën Racing en 2016. Nous avons construit ce challenge en WTCC ensemble, avec pour objectif personnel de décrocher le titre Pilotes sous trois ans. Je suis déçu que l’aventure s’arrête après deux années parce que j’avais la volonté d’aller décrocher ce titre et que j’avais montré ma compétitivité à bord de la C-Elysée, avec quatre victoires en 2015 notemmant. Une belle histoire prend fin, mais je n’ai aucun regret. Au contraire, je n’en garde que de supers souvenirs.

[marcosg]

I really hope kubica is a possibility for citroen development program of the 2017 car... I think this is the best thing that could happen to his carreer right now...

[Bartek]

Ogier have contract with VW only for 2016?

I'm pretty sure that Matton has in his head something which will be spectacular...

[bassist]

I hope Kris gets the development job and selected events for 2016, and a full two year contract for 2017/2018 in the new car.

[EstWRC]

two of the fastest, Sordo, Paddon and Neuville(when his head lets him) are every bit as fast

statistics dont lie :p

Stage winners 2015

1. Ogier Sébastien 95
2. Latvala Jari-Matti 47
3. Mikkelsen Andreas 17
4. Meeke Kris 13
5. Tänak Ott 11
6. Neuville Thierry 10
7. Kubica Robert 9
8. Østberg Mads 8
9. Sordo Dani 7
= Paddon Hayden 7

[Fast Eddie WRC]

So M-Sport to have Ostberg as their consistent points scorer and Evans/Tanak going for podiums on their strongest surfaces ? Sounds like a decent plan..

[MrJan]

News now is that Citroen taking 2016 off of WRC and will be back in 2017 in new car


can you please stop posting the voices from your head ? it is creepy...

Hmm, maybe not just voices then?

[Dug83]

I hope Kris gets the development job and selected events for 2016, and a full two year contract for 2017/2018 in the new car.

I'd say he's too old for that sort of deal, going to be 37 next year. He needs to be driving fully time next year which unfortunately doesn't look like it's going to happen.

[GigiGalliNo1]

Ogier will move to Toyota as he'll still be at his peak and still get the money he wants.

[Nornbugger]

statistics dont lie :p

Stage winners 2015

1. Ogier Sébastien 95
2. Latvala Jari-Matti 47
3. Mikkelsen Andreas 17
4. Meeke Kris 13
5. Tänak Ott 11
6. Neuville Thierry 10
7. Kubica Robert 9
8. Østberg Mads 8
9. Sordo Dani 7
= Paddon Hayden 7

You have a simple view on life and I'm not going to try to spoil it on you

[EstWRC]

Cmon, i didnt mean it seriously, thats why i had that smiley.

[markf8691]

Autosport article confirming Otsberg out contradicts itself a bit:

Firstly it said the Citroen representative said the 2016 involvement wont be anything like 2006 however later on in the article it says PH Sport are likely to run a satelite team with significant input from Citroen

Does that not more or less mean that Citroen will have a lot of involvement just like in 2006?



Hopefully Volkswagen wont be so dominant in 2017 - with full factory efforts from Citroen, Hyundai and Toyota, plus semi works effort with Ford/MSport.

[Andre Oliveira]

@SLefebvreRallye: Programme partiel en @OfficialWRC 2016 avec @BPiallat & @krismeeke ! @CitroenRacing
Bonne nouvelle avant 2017 ! https://t.co/lF8aKBmRYT

[tomhlord]

@SLefebvreRallye: Programme partiel en @OfficialWRC 2016 avec @BPiallat & @krismeeke ! @CitroenRacing
Bonne nouvelle avant 2017 ! https://t.co/lF8aKBmRYT
Good spot, now deleted.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk

[dodge33cymru]

Not deleted, it's still there: https://twitter.com/SLefebvreRallye/status/667346679109189632?s=09

[Bartek]

https://twitter.com/F_Gustavsson/status/667347379742445568

[tomhlord]

Not deleted, it's still there: https://twitter.com/SLefebvreRallye/status/667346679109189632?s=09
Definitely deleted. But nay bother, seems like people are running with the news. Good stuff!

[maciotacio]

https://twitter.com/Yves_Matton/status/667359923265789952
not confirmed yet

[tomhlord]

https://twitter.com/Yves_Matton/status/667359923265789952
not confirmed yet
Aha, yup, PR team merry go round.

[RS]

Autosport article confirming Otsberg out contradicts itself a bit:

Firstly it said the Citroen representative said the 2016 involvement wont be anything like 2006 however later on in the article it says PH Sport are likely to run a satelite team with significant input from Citroen

Does that not more or less mean that Citroen will have a lot of involvement just like in 2006?.

I think what the article meant was that it wouldn't be a full programme like it was in 2006.

[Jack4688`]

Autosport article confirming Otsberg out contradicts itself a bit:

Firstly it said the Citroen representative said the 2016 involvement wont be anything like 2006 however later on in the article it says PH Sport are likely to run a satelite team with significant input from Citroen

Does that not more or less mean that Citroen will have a lot of involvement just like in 2006?



Hopefully Volkswagen wont be so dominant in 2017 - with full factory efforts from Citroen, Hyundai and Toyota, plus semi works effort with Ford/MSport.

It's contradictory because David Evans is an imbecile who publishes whatever comes out of his crayon and on to his colouring book. He is a pillock and can't be trusted for anything other than speculation and his own dreams until we see it from another source or an official announcement.

[tomhlord]

It's contradictory because David Evans is an imbecile who publishes whatever comes out of his crayon and on to his colouring book. He is a pillock and can't be trusted for anything other than speculation and his own dreams until we see it from another source or an official announcement.
Harsh from yourself there IMHO because the slightly contradictory bits come from Citroen themselves.

[Rally Power]

Congrats to Maton and PSA boss Tavares for their bold move. Others would prefer to stay as a dominant force at WTCC instead of challenging VW at WRC.

Citroen full commitment to WRC from 2017 it's great to the sport. Now we just need to see Ford backing up MSport like they use to (Wilson deserves it) and a proper promotional job from RB/MH (FIA must simply sack them if major improvements won't happen during 2016), to believe that 2017 will be a epic season.

Also great to heard Citro will keep Meeke. Just hope that Maton manage to get Neuville in 2017. A Meeke/Neuville line up would be amazing.

[AL14]

So, a lot of good news for the future so far: China will make his entrance in the world of WRC. There will be three full manufacturers entries from 2017 and M-Sport will be there as well. If they will fix WRC+ bugs and 2017 cars are not boring like they seem we will have a bright future waiting for us.

[EightGear]

So, a lot of good news for the future so far: China will make his entrance in the world of WRC. There will be three full manufacturers entries from 2017 and M-Sport will be there as well. If they will fix WRC+ bugs and 2017 cars are not boring like they seem we will have a bright future waiting for us.
Are you not counting Toyota?

[EstWRC]

what about Ostberg running a Citroen through his adapta team?

[AL14]

Are you not counting Toyota?

ops, yes I didn't but not in purpose. :)

Let's hope it will remain a mistake tough. It seems their situation is not an easy one.

[AL14]

what about Ostberg running a Citroen through his adapta team?

It seems he will be at M-Sport with Evans and Tanak sharing the same car with no reason.

[EstWRC]

http://www.tv2.no/a/7670831

from this article it seems it isnt so sure that Mads will be at m-sport.

[EightGear]

So if Citroën will do only, let's say, 6 rounds, which ones will that probably be? Will they even bother to go to China after lobbying for them? That would be somewhat hilarious if they wouldn't go there.

I'd personally guess Monte Carlo and Corsica are logical and maybe Argentina as well since they're quite popular there. Anything else is possible except Mexico and Australia.

[dodge33cymru]

Possibly wherever the local dealers pay for it. I couldn't see China, but if I were to guess 6 I'd say Monte Carlo, Corsica, GB, Spain, Germany/Portugal and Poland. Send an R5 or two to Ypres too (wishful thinking).

[Mariusz]

So, a lot of good news for the future so far: China will make his entrance in the world of WRC. There will be three full manufacturers entries from 2017 and M-Sport will be there as well. If they will fix WRC+ bugs and 2017 cars are not boring like they seem we will have a bright future waiting for us.
2016 may be a tough year for WRC+ though. No Citroën, no Kubica (at least nothing is confirmed yet) will affect their subscriber base for sure. For example I cancelled my yearly subscription and I believe there will be plenty people doing the same.

[EstWRC]

a lot of estonians, including me, will also do it if Tänak is dropped.

[Grundo Farb]

2016 may be a tough year for WRC+ though. No Citroën, no Kubica (at least nothing is confirmed yet) will affect their subscriber base for sure. For example I cancelled my yearly subscription and I believe there will be plenty people doing the same.

Rubbish. WRC is WRC, next year could be better than the last three if the Hyundai is competitive. I understand the national fervour part but it's the sport we watch isn't it? Plenty of Portuguese, German, Swedish etc fans, not too many of those drivers at the elite level in WRC. Not much of a fan if you throw your toys out now.

[noel157]

Rubbish. WRC is WRC, next year could be better than the last three if the Hyundai is competitive. I understand the national fervour part but it's the sport we watch isn't it? Plenty of Portuguese, German, Swedish etc fans, not too many of those drivers at the elite level in WRC. Not much of a fan if you throw your toys out now.

They are only saying they will not subscribe to WRC+, don't get too serious about it.

[AndyRAC]

Next year is not shaping up to be a classic. No official Citroen, a dominant VW, Hyundai who need to start getting their act together, M-Sport hanging on….
I think 2016 is one to get through before the promise of 2017.

[Simmi]

For a team that has no budget Citroen managed to send Lefebvre to a lot of rallies during the back end of the year. I'd like to think we'll see DS3s at most European rounds. There are definitely some deals to be done if you throw a few pay drivers into the mix.

Another interesting one will be the future of Abu Dhabi sponsorship. In 2017 Citroen will be diverting significantly more funds back into WRC so it will be interesting to see what becomes of that.

All in all it's quite exciting times at the moment.

[AL14]

2016 may be a tough year for WRC+ though. No Citroën, no Kubica (at least nothing is confirmed yet) will affect their subscriber base for sure. For example I cancelled my yearly subscription and I believe there will be plenty people doing the same.
I don't think there will be plenty of people unsubscribing but maybe yes, some may. It is not a problem tough. They will lose some european people but they will open to a new market like China which is huge if they promote it in a decent way.

[car]

2016 may be a tough year for WRC+ though. No Citroën, no Kubica (at least nothing is confirmed yet) will affect their subscriber base for sure. For example I cancelled my yearly subscription and I believe there will be plenty people doing the same.

I was giving this some thought the other day and I came to the conclusion that the WRC+ service should be free to all. Rallying, as we all know, is struggling for exposure and is facing more and more competition from other televised/ web broadcast motorsport. Making WRC+ free would surely increase interest and viewing figures, giving the manufacturers and sponsors more of what they are in the sport for in the first place.
The WRC really should be doing everything is possibly can to attract as much interest as possible.

[car]

Not sure if this is the right place to post, but this chap is posting 'as-live' updates of the 1995 RAC battle (celebrating 20 years since Colin won). Sainz currently leading by 1:03.
Certainly brings back some nice memories...

https://twitter.com/stu_loudon

[RS]

Another one here won't be renewing WRC+

I wasn't satisfied that some events only had one live stage and that they only show the top 10 World Rally Cars.

I may switch from Sky to BT and then I will get it free anyway.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Another one here won't be renewing WRC+

I wasn't satisfied that some events only had one live stage and that they only show the top 10 World Rally Cars.

I may switch from Sky to BT and then I will get it free anyway.

You need BT TV to get all their channels 'free'...

They switch their channels for WRC coverage a lot so you need them all.

Also WRC+ had other live video on RallyGB that was not on BT.

[RS]

You need BT TV to get all their channels 'free'...

They switch their channels for WRC coverage a lot so you need them all.

Also WRC+ had other live video on RallyGB that was not on BT.

True, BT is not free but I was going to switch from Sky anyway and BT is cheaper. If i do that i can save the additional cost of WRC+.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

I'm with Sky but have BT broadband so got BT free for a year but now they only have BTSport1 free and want an extra £5pm for their other channels.

I dont want the CL football so didnt go for that, but now they have started putting some of the WRC coverage on BTS2, and BTS Euro ! :(

I'm just going to get WRC+ for selected events. :)

[AL14]

Actually you are all right about WRC+ issues (bugs on maps, poor live coverage and so on).

But if you subrscribe annually you pay 35€, it is almost 3€ per month. For me, remember to unsubscribe and then subscribe again for some events is not worth saving 3€. But I'm a lazy guy :)

I really hope they will increase live coverage, and not with that stupid city stages but real ones. Overall it is a good product because you have a lot of onboards, and live maps interface is very nice at least on desktop. Also the highlights are very good. It is worth its price, even if I would pay more if they improve it.

[jbmarcus21]

Full story of Test Days Hyundai with new i20Wrc 2016 (Sordo+Neuville) this week in France .. include galley photos+videos

http://planetemarcus.com/2016-a-debute-chez-hyundai-motorsport

[GigiGalliNo1]

can you please stop posting the voices from your head ? it is creepy...

You're funny

[GigiGalliNo1]

Or am I?

[EstWRC]

You both are but I'm enjoying it.

[Eli]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/121888 some food for thought about Citroen's situation.

[Jack4688`]

Not sure this the right place for it, but I think it qualifies as WRC Rumour:

http://www.pistonheads.com/news/ph-eurocars/abarth-to-take-124-spider-rallying/33329

My initial thought was it would be an R3 car to rival the GT86, unless it's power-to-weight ratio could be at a competitive level for use in RGT. However the story states:

"The car will compete in what's said be a new sports car category"

Seems unlikely, or that they haven't heard RGT is well and truly underway...

[AndyRAC]

Well the R-GT class is underway, but how many have entered? A handful if lucky, and nearly all Porsche. Still think the FiA could do more to encourage others.

[Mirek]

Not sure this the right place for it, but I think it qualifies as WRC Rumour:

http://www.pistonheads.com/news/ph-eurocars/abarth-to-take-124-spider-rallying/33329

My initial thought was it would be an R3 car to rival the GT86, unless it's power-to-weight ratio could be at a competitive level for use in RGT. However the story states:

"The car will compete in what's said be a new sports car category"

Seems unlikely, or that they haven't heard RGT is well and truly underway...

How many times have we had "Fiat/Alfa Romeo coming back to WRC" rumor here over the past few years? I can't count that myself. I remain highly skeptical about the news...

[Frostmourne]

Any news from teams about what the new WRC cars will be? Because according the Autosport report Eli posted Citroen will be using the DS3 but of course with new kit for the new regulation.

[Mirek]

Based on the interview with Matton for Belgian Auto news which isn't very recent they won't use DS mark in WRC anymore starting with 2017 but Citroën instead. That would point to the new C3 which is about to come on the market.

[TWRC]

Any news from teams about what the new WRC cars will be? Because according the Autosport report Eli posted Citroen will be using the DS3 but of course with new kit for the new regulation.
I have read C3 many times instead of the DS3 for 2017. It would make sense now with DS' "total" split from Citroën.

[macebig]

Citroen hang on Loeb for too long.Had they heard Quesnel and support Ogier for 2012 and gave Neuville the 4 rallies that they instead chose to spend on a pointless partial campaign for Loeb in 2013 they would still be conquering WRC.I dont think anyone here believes that an Ogier-Neuville pairing would nt be heavily favored against anything that came on their way.Probably the only youngster that can be close to WR material is Bergkvist.He is very much available and they should give him a year in a R5 car and see how he goes.

[PLuto]

Citroen hang on Loeb for too long.Had they heard Quesnel and support Ogier for 2012 and gave Neuville the 4 rallies that they instead chose to spend on a pointless partial campaign for Loeb in 2013 they would still be conquering WRC.I dont think anyone here believes that an Ogier-Neuville pairing would nt be heavily favored against anything that came on their way.Probably the only youngster that can be close to WR material is Bergkvist.He is very much available and they should give him a year in a R5 car and see how he goes.

Citroen had two choices - support once again french hero Loeb for another year (which was almost sure there will be another title) or give a chance young guns (fast, but still not champions)...

[macebig]

Yes,thats what I wrote.Hindsight is 20/20 but they made the wrong choice(win 1 championship and lose 3 and counting...)

[Rally Power]

I have read C3 many times instead of the DS3 for 2017. It would make sense now with DS' "total" split from Citroën.

The new C3 is due to be released in earlier 2016. It may look even worse than the current one...

http://www.largus.fr/images/images/nouvelle-citroen-c3-3-iii-2016.jpg

Hope they're going for the new C4, but the calendar may not help.

[Andre Oliveira]

Should C3. Cars of same segment.

[Eli]

The new C3 is due to be released in earlier 2016. It may look even worse than the current one...

http://www.largus.fr/images/images/nouvelle-citroen-c3-3-iii-2016.jpg

Hope they're going for the new C4, but the calendar may not help.

yeah hard to see how that's C3 gonna kick the Polo's ass...:(

[Andre Oliveira]

The difference is driver / mechanic... What the hell beauttie means on motorsport performance?

[GigiGalliNo1]

Loeb has left Citroen for good and gone to Peugeot. They won't bring him back again.... or will they? :D

[rallyace]

The C3 could end up being quite good, actually. I can see the 2017 specifications helping a lot regarding its appearance (even though this obviously has no impact on its performance, yet people are still voicing their concerns about its appeal, which I partially agree with), as making the car wider and more aggressive could make it fascinating to behold.

Also, the C3 chassis could be a lot better for a WRC car than the C4. Just a thought. :)

[rallyace]

I was giving this some thought the other day and I came to the conclusion that the WRC+ service should be free to all. Rallying, as we all know, is struggling for exposure and is facing more and more competition from other televised/ web broadcast motorsport. Making WRC+ free would surely increase interest and viewing figures, giving the manufacturers and sponsors more of what they are in the sport for in the first place.
The WRC really should be doing everything is possibly can to attract as much interest as possible.

This might be a bit of an optimistic and over-idealistic way of seeing the service. I would agree that rallying would likely attract more people if WRC+ were a free service, but the consequences of it being free would be hard not to spot. I can see both positives and negatives coming from this.

First of all there would be advertising during live stages (and probably highlight shows as well). This would be the only realistic way of WRC Promoter earning some cash while they're at it. Also, when you and I pay 39.99 € annually (which isn't much) for our subscription, we're contributing to WRC Promoter to make the service better. This allows for more cameras, more renowned colour commentators (Luis Moya, Craig Breen etc.) and better equipment in general. We help fund these broadcasts through our annual payment.

I do however agree to quite an extent with what you're writing. I just propose a different way of doing it. It's quite baffling to me that you cannot test WRC+ for an extended period of time before purchasing it. The best WRC Promoter has offered all season is "Try one month for 1 € if you sign up for our newsletter". Despite 1 € not being much, it's still hardly a bargain as just one month isn't a long time. You only have about one rally to make up your mind.

The first full year should be free to all. Full stop. Also, they should target new fans of the sport. Why not give schools and other institutions codes to pass onto their students? This could be sort of a "save 50-75% on your subscription for as long as you're in school". This would not only bring in more young fans (and seeing that your friends are enjoying rallying could make you jump on board as well) and let's face it, the youth is the future of the sport. Let's get kids interested in rallying - and schools being able to offer big savings on a subscription (or perhaps even being able to make it free for their students) would be a massive boost to WRC+ as well as our sport in general. This would also (hopefully) secure these fans for the future, where they'd be paying subscribers for a long, long time after they've finished school.

[car]

This might be a bit of an optimistic and over-idealistic way of seeing the service. I would agree that rallying would likely attract more people if WRC+ were a free service, but the consequences of it being free would be hard not to spot. I can see both positives and negatives coming from this.

First of all there would be advertising during live stages (and probably highlight shows as well). This would be the only realistic way of WRC Promoter earning some cash while they're at it. Also, when you and I pay 39.99 € annually (which isn't much) for our subscription, we're contributing to WRC Promoter to make the service better. This allows for more cameras, more renowned colour commentators (Luis Moya, Craig Breen etc.) and better equipment in general. We help fund these broadcasts through our annual payment.

I do however agree to quite an extent with what you're writing. I just propose a different way of doing it. It's quite baffling to me that you cannot test WRC+ for an extended period of time before purchasing it. The best WRC Promoter has offered all season is "Try one month for 1 € if you sign up for our newsletter". Despite 1 € not being much, it's still hardly a bargain as just one month isn't a long time. You only have about one rally to make up your mind.

The first full year should be free to all. Full stop. Also, they should target new fans of the sport. Why not give schools and other institutions codes to pass onto their students? This could be sort of a "save 50-75% on your subscription for as long as you're in school". This would not only bring in more young fans (and seeing that your friends are enjoying rallying could make you jump on board as well) and let's face it, the youth is the future of the sport. Let's get kids interested in rallying - and schools being able to offer big savings on a subscription (or perhaps even being able to make it free for their students) would be a massive boost to WRC+ as well as our sport in general. This would also (hopefully) secure these fans for the future, where they'd be paying subscribers for a long, long time after they've finished school.

Thanks for the reply. A lot of what you say makes sense, but I can't see past the fact that the WRC seems to think it has such a fantastic product to offer that it is worth paying for... I don't think it is at all. The WRC+ coverage is poor and, more importantly, the WRC itself is in a crap state.
I can open my computer and watch a whole afternoon of World Rallycross just by clicking a link. I wouldn't watch Rallycross if I couldn't do this, hence, they have gained another viewer... job done.
WRC needs to provide a good, free, digital service (and yes, like you said, it could be paid for through advertising) so it can start to build a fan-base again, which in turn will generate more manufacturer interest.

[car]

Loeb has left Citroen for good and gone to Peugeot. They won't bring him back again.... or will they? :D


Who knows? Do you have some more 'inside' information again?

[dodge33cymru]

Loeb has left Citroen for good and gone to Peugeot. They won't bring him back again.... or will they? :D
That's like leaving Pepsi for Mountain Dew, it's the same office with a different brand.

[rallyace]

Thanks for the reply. A lot of what you say makes sense, but I can't see past the fact that the WRC seems to think it has such a fantastic product to offer that it is worth paying for... I don't think it is at all. The WRC+ coverage is poor and, more importantly, the WRC itself is in a crap state.
I can open my computer and watch a whole afternoon of World Rallycross just by clicking a link. I wouldn't watch Rallycross if I couldn't do this, hence, they have gained another viewer... job done.
WRC needs to provide a good, free, digital service (and yes, like you said, it could be paid for through advertising) so it can start to build a fan-base again, which in turn will generate more manufacturer interest.

Some very good points. I myself have not watched rallycross other than for a few sporadic moments if I catch it on the TV, so I don't know much about its media presence or how it's promoted. The way you're describing it sounds like a very clever marketing strategy, and I would agree that the WRC could learn from this and try to implement this in the areas where it's possible within the WRC.

Interesting view on the WRC thinking it has a solid product in WRC+. I've personally always been very fond of the service and enjoyed it greatly, but I hear many people with less than positive views. I do agree that it could definitely be a better service, especially if they were to replace Jon Desborough and indeed broadcast other live stages than the "Mickey Mouse stages" run in city centres (thanks for the expression, Luis Moya!). :D

All in all I'm torn. For the past year I've kept telling myself that the 39.99 € that I've spent on WRC+ are the best 40 € I've ever spent, mainly because I spend so many hours on WRC+. How many hours of entertainment would I get if I spent 40 € on something else? It equates to a couple of cinema tickets of perhaps a football match. No thanks. These things wouldn't even be in the vicinity of the enjoyment I get out of WRC+ (for a whole year at that), but yes, it definitely does need improving and it's important that the people at WRC Promoter realize this.

[jonkka]

The WRC+ coverage is poor and, more importantly, the WRC itself is in a crap state.

You nailed it, WRC of these days sucks. There is one driver who wins everything everywhere, there are no tight fights for the win nor for any other positions, there is no excitement, there is almost nothing... but a long tradition to follow it.

After every rally I ask myself, is it really worth to waste three days on it any more?

[GigiGalliNo1]

I'm Happy with paying for the WRC+ service, I only watch the live stuff and rarely watch re-play action of in-car footage as some do, comparing drivers.
I know the logistics of covering a Live stage for the WRC and it's horrendous, unless you guys all just want helicopter views with some live in-car footage for the many 20+km stages! Shorter stages can be done but again, this costs a lot of money and if you guys want to pay nothing or so little for the service, then they should (the promoter) just cancel it!

[car]

I'm Happy with paying for the WRC+ service, I only watch the live stuff and rarely watch re-play action of in-car footage as some do, comparing drivers.
I know the logistics of covering a Live stage for the WRC and it's horrendous, unless you guys all just want helicopter views with some live in-car footage for the many 20+km stages! Shorter stages can be done but again, this costs a lot of money and if you guys want to pay nothing or so little for the service, then they should (the promoter) just cancel it!
Cancel it?? I guess you've never heard the phrase 'speculate to accumulate'? They need as many people tuning into WRC as they can. A lot of services (general TV and sports) are shown on the web these days. If they have a decent platform that opens the WRC up to more viewers they need to let people watch it for free.
Until the WRC enjoys (or gets anywhere near) the kind of audiences it had in the past, they are kidding themselves trying to 'sell' the current WRC+ service.
Yeah, I know there are a lot of people who sign up for it, but how much more exposure could they get if it was free... and then even more if the quality/ content was improved.

[GigiGalliNo1]

My point was, you have to invest in it to get the programming better, or exactly what you want. At the moment, I don't believe the WRC has enough sponsorship money to make WRC+ FREE!!

[car]

My point was, you have to invest in it to get the programming better, or exactly what you want. At the moment, I don't believe the WRC has enough sponsorship money to make WRC+ FREE!!

Hmmm... not sure what you mean when you say they should cancel it/ it needs more investment? Anyway, don't red bull own the rights? Last time I heard, they had a few quid.

[AndyRAC]

It doesn't have enough sponsorship because there is little mainstream exposure. Why sponsor, if it's hidden in PayTV/ Paywall with small audiences......

Look at M-Sport, can't find a main Title sponsor - and why would you?

20 years ago today Colin McRae won the WRC Title: it was reported live on BBCradio, it made the TV news, it was on that nights Sportsnignt programme, it was in the papers, etc
Last weeks RallyGB was virtually invisible to 99% of the country.