Sebastian Vettel 2013 World Champion

[henners88]

Well done Seb, fully deserved. :)

[Whyzars]

Well done Seb, fully deserved. :)

+1 :)

[henners88]

Wow, what an awesome celebration too!! I hope to god he doesn't get in trouble for it. Superb for the show and for the fans.

[Dave B]

Hmmmmm donuts :D

[steveaki13]

Seb will get a fine for the donuts and stuff. Just another example of no common sense in F1.

Anyway it was worth it, brilliant too see.

Congrats to Seb on a wonderful Championship.

[webberf1]

Super congrats to Vettel. A deserving WDC, and a great drive today to do his season justice. And some nice celebratory flair.

[donKey jote]

Wow, what an awesome celebration too!! I hope to god he doesn't get in trouble for it. Superb for the show and for the fans.
don't think he'll be too bothered about anything other than if they dock him of all his points :p

[Tazio]

Congrat's to Seb. He took it in style.

[henners88]

Wow, what an awesome celebration too!! I hope to god he doesn't get in trouble for it. Superb for the show and for the fans.
don't think he'll be too bothered about anything other than if they dock him of all his points :p
A grid penalty or a fine would be worth it I'm sure. I like seeing that in motorsport so no complaints from me. :)

[Koz]

Congrats Super Seb!!

[steveaki13]

I think Seb should set no time in Quali in UAE and see if he can win from the back.

[donKey jote]

hehe yep.

or start from the pits after eating an icecream :D

[Parabolica]

Congratulations to Vettel.

A true great of the sport.

Congratulations to Red Bull.

A fantastic team.

[jens]

Congrats. Superb stuff! A superb season! To sum up the consistency of his campaign, his worst race of the whole year has probably been Hungary, in which Hamilton probably genuinely outdrove him, although there is a strong argument that RBR strategy department didn't really perform well either, sending Seb repeteadly back into traffic. However, if your worst drive of the season means getting onto the podium, I'd take it any day of the week.

And it is good to add Brundle quote here I just heard. "And he is the best driver at the moment too. I have no doubt about that."

Very good emotions now. But hopefully 2014 will bring something unusual, because some of Vettel's dominations have finally started to wear on me too. But at least the action behind him has been pretty interesting recently, making up for it.

[jens]

Oh, and big congrats to Red Bull Racing as well. The team has written itself right into the history books of Formula One in a golden way.

The silver Mercedes' domination of 54-55, the Chapman's innovative dominating Lotuses, McLaren-Honda's great run of 1988-1991, the great Williams cars from 1991 to 1997. Ferrari's run from 2000-2004. Red Bull Racing is right alongside those legendary teams in historical perspective. It may have been boring to some, but we have been witnessing something absolutely sublime.

[donKey jote]

Oh, and big congrats to Red Bull Racing as well. The team has written itself right into the history books of Formula One in a golden way.

The silver Mercedes' domination of 54-55, the Chapman's innovative dominating Lotuses, McLaren-Honda's great run of 1988-1991, the great Williams cars from 1991 to 1997. Ferrari's run from 2000-2004. Red Bull Racing is right alongside those legendary teams in historical perspective. It may have been boring to some, but we have been witnessing something absolutely sublime.

^^like
good point

[Parabolica]

And, just as with the aforementioned teams, it is up to their rivals to do a better job in order to beat them.

I think it is sad that some people would wish to belittle the achievement of Vettel by claiming it is because of the car.

[henners88]

And it is good to add Brundle quote here I just heard. "And he is the best driver at the moment too. I have no doubt about that."
I don't have an awful lot of respect for Brundle but what he is saying is very true judging by your quote. The best driver over a season wins the championship. The best team over a season wins the championship. One without the other doesn't win usually. There are a few other drivers on the grid I would put on the same level as Vettel, but with F1 being very much a team effort, the drivers ability tells us nothing if the tools are not there.

Vettel has joined the greats in terms of championship wins and he fully deserves it. We look to 2014 now to see if the other top teams can adapt to the new regulations better than Red Bull. The likes of Alonso, Kimi, Hamilton, and Rosberg will be hoping their hard work will shine through if they land in the kind of car Red Bull have been producing I'm sure. We are lucky in this era we have so many good drivers on the grid. A shake up next year will be very welcome. :)

[gm99]

I think Seb should set no time in Quali in UAE and see if he can win from the back.

Didn't he start from last position there last year and finish 3rd?

[Parabolica]

Could I also add that, if Sebastian wins again next year, it would be fantastic.

I'm Ferrari, not Red Bull, but that makes me appreciate the skill, talent and ability it takes to win multiple championships.

It is something that should be hoped for, in a way, since perfection is what all F1 teams should be seeking. It is something that should be truly admired.

And if somebody else wins, then they have beaten one of the elite. Which will, in itself, be a fantastic achievement.

[henners88]

I think Seb should set no time in Quali in UAE and see if he can win from the back.

Didn't he start from last position there last year and finish 3rd?
He did yeah but it would be cool to see him do the same this year without safety cars :p

It's clear he would finish well in the points whatever the situation :)

[steveaki13]

Oh, and big congrats to Red Bull Racing as well. The team has written itself right into the history books of Formula One in a golden way.

The silver Mercedes' domination of 54-55, the Chapman's innovative dominating Lotuses, McLaren-Honda's great run of 1988-1991, the great Williams cars from 1991 to 1997. Ferrari's run from 2000-2004. Red Bull Racing is right alongside those legendary teams in historical perspective. It may have been boring to some, but we have been witnessing something absolutely sublime.

So True Jens.

Another piece of F1 history to rival or even better those in the past. Sensational. Congrats to both Seb and Red Bull they are awesome.

[steveaki13]

I think Seb should set no time in Quali in UAE and see if he can win from the back.

Didn't he start from last position there last year and finish 3rd?
He did yeah but it would be cool to see him do the same this year without safety cars :p

It's clear he would finish well in the points whatever the situation :)

Absolutely.

I think though both he and the car are better than previous years. So I think if he did it again he would have a real chance to win. Depending on how fast Mark was that day in his Red Bull. He would maybe be the only thorn in a 22nd to 1st.

[zako85]

I think Seb should set no time in Quali in UAE and see if he can win from the back.

Didn't he start from last position there last year and finish 3rd?

I thought it was a little farcical. That 3rd place was probably a courtesy of the DRS system, which makes passing slower cars so much easier. Plus, the Toro Rosso cars jumped out of his way as usual.

[F1boat]

Fantastic year and phenomenal championship for Vettel. At 26, he is now equal to Prost. Simply amazing.

[pino]

Vettel a well deserved champion, congrats to him :up:

[jarrambide]

I don't like Vettel that much. I don't dislike him, but I'm not a fan. One thing is sure, 30 years from now, I will tell people I saw him drive in person.

[tjoepie]

Bravo! A ruthlessly clinical season!

[The Black Knight]

And, just as with the aforementioned teams, it is up to their rivals to do a better job in order to beat them.

I think it is sad that some people would wish to belittle the achievement of Vettel by claiming it is because of the car.

As must as I've lot to hail Vettel as one of the all time greats, and believe me I want to, I can't do it. Alonso could have won the last 4 titles in that car. Hamilton probably could have as well. Yes, Seb has made the most of it but he has had it too easy in my book for him to be regarded as an all time great of the sport as he was just handed the best car.

Anyway, a big congratulations to him. He is the deserved champion for this year and has driven fantastically well. A truly brilliant driver no doubt but I reserve handing out the all time great label until such time as I can see what he can do with a car that is not the fastest on the grid :)

[jarrambide]

And, just as with the aforementioned teams, it is up to their rivals to do a better job in order to beat them.

I think it is sad that some people would wish to belittle the achievement of Vettel by claiming it is because of the car.

As must as I've lot to hail Vettel as one of the all time greats, and believe me I want to, I can't do it. Alonso could have won the last 4 titles in that car. Hamilton probably could have as well. Yes, Seb has made the most of it but he has had it too easy in my book for him to be regarded as an all time great of the sport as he was just handed the best car.

Anyway, a big congratulations to him. He is the deserved champion for this year and has driven fantastically well. A truly brilliant driver no doubt but I reserve handing out the all time great label until such time as I can see what he can do with a car that is not the fastest on the grid :)
You could easily say most champions have been handed the best car.

[The Black Knight]

And, just as with the aforementioned teams, it is up to their rivals to do a better job in order to beat them.

I think it is sad that some people would wish to belittle the achievement of Vettel by claiming it is because of the car.

As must as I've lot to hail Vettel as one of the all time greats, and believe me I want to, I can't do it. Alonso could have won the last 4 titles in that car. Hamilton probably could have as well. Yes, Seb has made the most of it but he has had it too easy in my book for him to be regarded as an all time great of the sport as he was just handed the best car.

Anyway, a big congratulations to him. He is the deserved champion for this year and has driven fantastically well. A truly brilliant driver no doubt but I reserve handing out the all time great label until such time as I can see what he can do with a car that is not the fastest on the grid :)
You could easily say most champions have been handed the best car.

For sure, that's not what I was saying though.

[Zico]

Congrats on your 4th title Seb. You did a great job once again this year and will now be mentioned alongside the greats. Some will say you had the best equipment and that you owe most of your success to being given such a great car and I can't disagree with that but then Fangio probably suffered similar detractions back then... maybe? :stareup:




PS. You'd better not win it again next year cause that would really piss me right off! :evil: Give someone else a chance! ;)

[Triumph]

Well done Sebastian! I won't be surprised if he makes it title No.5 by the end of next year.

I hope the booing choir work on tightening up their harmonies for 2014 though. Their performance this year has been second-rate.

:)

[The Black Knight]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/110948

This is the transcript of the post race press conference. It's a very humble interview and I'm impressed by Seb and his maturity. He really does seem to appreciate where he is in life and what he has.

[Rollo]

A grid penalty or a fine would be worth it I'm sure. I like seeing that in motorsport so no complaints from me. :)

If they fined him or gave him a grid penalty in advance, I'm almost sure that there'd be a sign on the rear wing of his car saying "IT WAS WORTH IT" or something to that effect.

This is going to sound strange but I'm not entirely convinced that Seb has the best equipment. As weird as this sounds, I suspect that the Mercedes are actually better but that the little 1%ers that Seb does are better; such as getting on the throttle earlier etc. all those 1%ers add up.
2014 will be interesting as it marks a new range of engines. I suspect though that this will favour Seb even more because as we saw in the 1980s, turbo power comes in all at once.

Even so, Vettel deserves this title. Say what you like about the machinery under him, a driver still has to exploit it.

[N. Jones]

Yay. He won a fourth.

[rjbetty]

Much congrats to Seb. Regardless of the car I think he has done the best job of any driver this year.

I very much dislike what happened in Malaysia but I have to give the guy his due.

I have been most impressed by his consistency and his willingness to learn and improve, as he just continues to do. It has been on my mind for a while that Vettel is very disciplined and hardworking. He is not fazed or distracted by the trappings of the world and though I do think there is some arrogance there (I believe this is the influence of Helmut Marko) he does seem to have at least some genuine humility too - a high amount for someone in his position. So easily could he get wrapped up in the world of being a celebrity, but he has a pure desire for racing which seems higher than his rivals, and I really respect this.

Though I do have reservations about him, the are probably more about the team and their treatment of Webber. I agree with Truefan that Alonso would have taken these 4 titles had he been driving the Red Bull, and I expect 2009 as well. But I agree that regardless of the quality of the car, Seb has really deserved this title.

I am also impressed by how gracious everyone is being on this thread. I hope we don't get some slurs to spoil it.

[airshifter]

Well done by both Sebastian and the team. It was obvious he was just starting to really come to grips with having that 4th title just before he hit the podium, and during the interview with DC.

I think the other manufacturers better put in the extra work now and hope like hell they can design a car that has a chance of keeping up with the RB and Vettel combo next year. And even if one or more of them does.... we might get a chance to see just how much of this equation has been pure driver talent.

Well done to both team and driver. I feel they have many more records coming in their direction.

[steveaki13]

I am also impressed by how gracious everyone is being on this thread. I hope we don't get some slurs to spoil it.

You're congradulations suck....... :devil: ;) :p

[555-04Q2]

Well done lad :) Another great performance...perfect!

[rjbetty]

I am also impressed by how gracious everyone is being on this thread. I hope we don't get some slurs to spoil it.

You're congradulations suck....... :devil: ;) :p

So does your spelling! :devil: :p

[steveaki13]

I am also impressed by how gracious everyone is being on this thread. I hope we don't get some slurs to spoil it.

You're congradulations suck....... :devil: ;) :p

So does your spelling! :devil: :p

Oh yer. So it does. whoops.

Anyway stick em up. :blackeye: :D

[anfield5]

Well done Seb. The bast car and driver combo by a long way.

[555-04Q2]

Anyone want to bet against Seb equalling The Shoe's record of 13 wins in a season? Looks like he's gonna do it!

[Mia 01]

Seb, and Seb alone deserved the victory this year.

Well done and on to the next one (if not Kimi i like it to be you).

[henners88]

Seb, and Seb alone deserved the victory this year.

Well done and on to the next one (if not Kimi i like it to be you).
What about Jenson Mia?

He was you favourite when you first came here. :)

[Finski]

Came in expecting to read a bunch of hate, but was pleasantly surprised.
I love seeing respect for all drivers and teams in F1, I believe that is what real fans are all about. Loving the sport, no hate. :)

I am a Kimi fan and then Webber fan, but have a huge respect for vettel and what he has done (as well as every other F1 driver and their abilities to even be in F1) A big congrats to seb and RBR, well deserved.

[airshifter]

Great point on driver ability Finski. The worst drivers on the F1 grid are probably twice the driver most of us "mortals" could hope to be, and as much as we bicker and rail on them at times on the forum they all still retain great respect from me regarding their abilities.


As for Seb, the only think lacking IMO is someone else on the team that we all know is a great driver to show us where on the yardstick he measures exactly. Certainly you just don't luck into such success and his skill level is way up there in the pack, and it's often hard to find any flaws at all in his driving.

A couple years back one of the Speed TV commentators made reference to his focus and intensity when watching the onboard shot that showed his helmet and face. I did a remind and slow motion on the DRV, and at one point in a technical section of the track he didn't blink his eyes for over 45 seconds. I think he is going to catch up and pass a lot more records. Only time will tell for sure.

[555-04Q2]

Came in expecting to read a bunch of hate, but was pleasantly surprised.

Oh poor form, apologies. I will rectify that now!

Seb is an overrated, useless, unworthy champion and he's secretly an undercover Australian cross dresser posing as a German F1 driver. He should be thrown into a small room with Ben Stiller who can torture him with re-runs of his pointless and unfunny comedy movies until Seb's head explodes :p: :D

Resume discussions :)

[Bagwan]

Sebastian and his team clearly did a far , far , better job out there than anyone else in the paddock .
There was no comparison .

My only disappointment was just that . There was no driver/car combo out there to match him .
It leaves a sort of hollow feeling to his achievement , not through any fault of his own , but simply because his mettle wasn't thoroughly tested in the process .

So , good job(maybe too good) to Seb and his team .

[555-04Q2]

So , good job(maybe too good) to Seb and his team .

You can never do a job too good. You either do it right, or not right at all. In my opinion, RBR and Seb did the job right, the rest did theirs wrong :)

[steveaki13]

Came in expecting to read a bunch of hate, but was pleasantly surprised.
.

Come back another day when a certain poster is around and you will change you're tune.

He rather feels Sebs Car gives him a 10-20 second advantage. :D :laugh:

[anfield5]

It does!...Doesn't it? :kiss:

[steveaki13]

easily. He would barely be on lap 45 by the time Alonso won a 60 lap race.

[call_me_andrew]

If only someone had predicted this 2 years ago. (http://www.racing-reference.info/showblog?id=898)

[Tazio]

Lucky guess! :stareup: ;)

[555-04Q2]

Came in expecting to read a bunch of hate, but was pleasantly surprised.
.

Come back another day when a certain poster is around and you will change you're tune.

He rather feels Sebs Car gives him a 10-20 second advantage. :D :laugh:

Nah, it's more than that, like 4 WDC more :D

[jens]

I am also impressed by how gracious everyone is being on this thread. I hope we don't get some slurs to spoil it.

I agree. I have to say the athmosphere of this forum has made a significant change in the last few months. Obviously influenced by the fact that some people, who enjoyed putting Seb down at every opportunity, have gone missing.

But I have to say at the moment it is quite enjoyable to write and discuss here. While there have been times, when I was pondering, why on earth should I bother coming here at all.

[555-04Q2]

True, generally the atmosphere has been friendly and positive. There are a number of members missing lately too, which may have contributed to the improvement mentioned :)

[Bezza]

In my opinion Vettel has moved ahead of Hamilton in terms of ability now after this particular season. Hamilton by contrast seems to be regressing gradually, I put it mainly down to off-the-track distractions. F1 is not his ultimate priority and it shows.

I have never been Vettel's biggest fan, ever since Turkey 2010 when he drove into Webber and Red Bull's preference to him first appeared. I still think they favour him heavily, every call they make favours him and has done throughout their time year. I can balance that with the fact that Vettel is clearly way ahead of Webber now, although how much overall interest Webber has had since the stressful 2010 campaign is unclear.

However during this 7-race winning streak, Vettel has been peerless. The car is great of course, but his wins have included ones where he hasn't led all the way, and has had to dig deep. He is a fantastic driver. I just wish he didn't do one over on Webber in Malaysia this season, as that showed a lack of class.

Overall, I still think Alonso is the better driver. Some of his drives in rubbish cars really are amazing. Had he won in 2012, and he really should've done, were it not for Grosjean in Spa and Raikkonen in Suzuka, it would have gone down as the greatest championship win of all time.

Right now, I put Alonso at the top, with Vettel a very close second.

It would be very intriguing to see how Alonso and Vettel would do in each others cars. Alonso has never had a car which has been streets ahead of all the others, yet he still has two titles and could have had two more. Vettel has had the best car for four seasons, and won all four - fair play. But would love to see him in a Ferrari of 2012/2013 and see how he does.

[555-04Q2]

In my opinion Vettel has moved ahead of Hamilton in terms of ability now after this particular season. Hamilton by contrast seems to be regressing gradually, I put it mainly down to off-the-track distractions. F1 is not his ultimate priority and it shows.

I have never been Vettel's biggest fan, ever since Turkey 2010 when he drove into Webber and Red Bull's preference to him first appeared. I still think they favour him heavily, every call they make favours him and has done throughout their time year. I can balance that with the fact that Vettel is clearly way ahead of Webber now, although how much overall interest Webber has had since the stressful 2010 campaign is unclear.

However during this 7-race winning streak, Vettel has been peerless. The car is great of course, but his wins have included ones where he hasn't led all the way, and has had to dig deep. He is a fantastic driver. I just wish he didn't do one over on Webber in Malaysia this season, as that showed a lack of class.

Overall, I still think Alonso is the better driver. Some of his drives in rubbish cars really are amazing. Had he won in 2012, and he really should've done, were it not for Grosjean in Spa and Raikkonen in Suzuka, it would have gone down as the greatest championship win of all time.

Right now, I put Alonso at the top, with Vettel a very close second.

It would be very intriguing to see how Alonso and Vettel would do in each others cars. Alonso has never had a car which has been streets ahead of all the others, yet he still has two titles and could have had two more. Vettel has had the best car for four seasons, and won all four - fair play. But would love to see him in a Ferrari of 2012/2013 and see how he does.

I agree about Lewis. Ever since he canned his father as his manager he has been struggling on and off the track. The girlfriend also seems to be a big distraction and why not, she's a pretty + famous chick :) We still haven't seen the best of him yet, I think there are a few good seasons to come when he gets to his early 30's.

Vettel vs Alonso is a no brainer for me. Vettel is a great driver, no doubt about it, and considering he is only 26, scarily for the other drivers his best is yet to come! BUT, as we stand right now Alonso has no peers. He is a class act. Yes he can get worked up at times but as you stated he has delivered some amazing title challenges and race wins when he had no right doing so at all! He is the most complete driver on the grid at the moment.

[jens]

Comparing Alonso and Vettel is tricky due to very different cars, but at the moment I'd put Vettel at least as an equal to Alonso. And in both long-term and historical perspective he is likely going to move ahead sooner or later. If I am speaking from my personal feeling point of view, I think in 5-10 years' time Vettel could legitimetaly included in the group of the all-time legends of Fangio, Clark, Prost, Senna and Schumacher as a sixth member. He leaves an impression of getting there. Getting better each year, his mentality and attitude of finding bits and pieces all the time. And long-term view on competition seems to suit him as well with the influx of paydrivers. If I had to give Alonso a historical perspective, he reminds me more like Lauda. Which is still very good though and nothing to sniff at.

I know sometimes early 2012 season performances are put against Vettel, but every driver has their dips, especially when they are younger. Nobody was a perfect driver at the age of 25, even the greats. Looking at drivers, when they are now older and supposedly at their peaks, you can see for instance Räikkönen hasn't been qualifying well recently, Hamilton's season has had ups-and-downs (like in 2011), Alonso has been outqualified by Massa a lot recently. So none of them is perfect and anyone can be criticized.

I think we won't get a very good answer if we put Vettel straight into 2012 Ferrari and see, how he performs. If we just put him there, then granted, he is likely to perform worse than Alonso. But the point is if he switches teams, what can he do there long-term, how well can he unite with the team and engineers. IMO his abilities on that front are underestimated. From that point of view I view Vettel being made of the same material as Schumacher himself. He could struggle initially, but in third or fourth season could feel very comfortable in the car, conserve tyres very well compared to his team-mate, etc. All we are seeing in RBR now. I think it is no coincidence that not only Red Bull's performance, but also Vettel's performance as a driver tends to come to the fore in the closing stages of a season. He is learning the lessons of a season and how to adapt to the current car well.

[henners88]

In my opinion Vettel has moved ahead of Hamilton in terms of ability now after this particular season. Hamilton by contrast seems to be regressing gradually, I put it mainly down to off-the-track distractions. F1 is not his ultimate priority and it shows.
There's no question Vettel has matured into a very capable racer and has handled having the best car and converting this into a championship winner very well. I don't agree about Lewis and his off track distractions. I think this season we've seen a much more focused Hamilton. A driver who has put all those distractions behind him and is focussing on the job that needs to be done. I also think too much was made of these distractions during his last couple of season's at McLaren and think it was maybe more to do with being unhappy within the team rather than Lewis being unprofessional.

I'm hoping next season we'll see a big improvement. Lewis has exceeded many expectations this year going from a team he is comfortable at, to a team and car that was focussing itself around another driver. Lewis joined fairly late in the development of the current car and I'm hoping next season the car at least has a chance of being designed more to his needs. Its clear at times he's struggled for grip, braking changes, and hasn't been able to maximise the potential of the car. All things we know Lewis is usually very capable of doing, so hopefully next season we'll see a much more improved scenario.

We've got to remember a driver performing at the top of his game in a team who have built themselves around him and who offer the best package on the grid, is very difficult to compare against a driver only enjoying a fraction of the support IMO. I see quite a few people saying Vettel has performed better than Hamilton or Alonso, but for me I really don't know how easy it is to compare? I feel if you put any of the top three in a car of their choosing and offer full support, they'll get the job done. They are all World Champions after all so have all proven they have what it takes.

[Zico]

Lewis is regressing? I don't think so. He never will be as clever and tactically aware as Alonso but make no mistake he is still one of the very quickest in terms of outright pace. Unfortunately F1's endurance/pace balance is askew and does not reward the very quickest drivers half as much as it used to.
If everyone was given Red Bulls for a whole season with tyres that allowed the drivers to push to near max over a whole race distance, I sure wouldn't want to bet against Lewis.. would you?

[steveaki13]

I used to think Seb was 4th in the currant drivers in 2010 when he won the title. Then I thought he was behind Alonso and Hamilton and on par with Kimi, but I have to say now I think Seb is on par with Lewis and Fernando.

On one lap pace I think Lewis and Seb are dead level, but sadly (from my point of view) I see Vettel as able to be more consistant than Lewis over a season. I don't think if Lewis had been in the Red Bull for the last 7 races he would have won 7 in a row.

I love Hamilton, but I think he has a tiny piece missing for that kind of Vettel/Schumi dominance. Even Fernando might struggle with it.

[The Black Knight]

http://www.espn.co.uk/redbull/motorspor ... 34415.html (http://www.espn.co.uk/redbull/motorsport/story/134415.html)

Good interview with Webber here. He said that Seb is the master of the Pirelli tires. I've always personally felt this played a big part in Seb's success as well, that he was able to get to grips with the Pirelli tires so much. That just shows his class though!

[airshifter]

My opinion of Vettel has improved every year. The guy certainly has drive and focus, and it seems one of his few flaws is not always knowing when to listen to his engineer and back off, but so far it's hasn't really bitten him. Certainly if RB develop a lesser car or the competition climbs in comparison we might see how cool he remains under greater pressure, and that might just happen next year with all the rules changes.

As for overall ratings of drivers and team support, very hard to judge IMO. The only of the top drivers we can judge in equal machinery in recent years is Alonso and Lewis and they scored equal points. To me this indicates that Alonso was slipping, or Lewis was still maturing, or any combination of the two. Webber did have a good year with RB when Seb was still less matured, but then faded quickly to the talents of Seb.