Xbox One vs PS4

[Bezza]

I see no thread about this...so thought I'd bring it up now as excitement builds for these two console leviathans!

Xbox one released the other week, to mixed response. The Xbox fanboys loved it, but the wider public were unhappy that old games cannot be traded in, second hand games will carry extra costs, the console will need an always-on internet connection and thing is butt ugly.

PS4 was announced in February, but we still haven't seen it! The specs are very similar to each other - full launch on June 10th.

At this point, its a PS4 walkover for me. The PS3 was superior to the X-Box, Microsoft's over-belief in themselves costing them again it seems. Of course, the PS3 cost more than the X-Box, but I think that extra cost was worth the difference.

DISCUSS!

[Brown, Jon Brow]

I'll probably stick with Xbox because many people I race against online will be sticking with Xbox as well. Plus the Xbox gats Forza Motorsport and Halo. :D

[tfp]

I see no thread about this...so thought I'd bring it up now as excitement builds for these two console leviathans!

Xbox one released the other week, to mixed response. The Xbox fanboys loved it, but the wider public were unhappy that old games cannot be traded in, second hand games will carry extra costs, the console will need an always-on internet connection and thing is butt ugly.

PS4 was announced in February, but we still haven't seen it! The specs are very similar to each other - full launch on June 10th.

At this point, its a PS4 walkover for me. The PS3 was superior to the X-Box, Microsoft's over-belief in themselves costing them again it seems. Of course, the PS3 cost more than the X-Box, but I think that extra cost was worth the difference.

DISCUSS!

I always was an Xbox "fanboy", I never liked the way Sony used their vast amounts of money to bully away their competition in the beginning. But I guess that's business.
And the 360 would always, always be my console of choice.
But after all the Xbox one announcement I'll probably convert. The mere fact that the devs will be paid twice or more for every second hand game you buy is just ridiculous. And the always online thing, is also another stupid idea.
But then again we still don't know for certain if the ps4 will need a code for secondhand games. So for me the ps4 is winning so far(and that's something I thought I'd never ever say) but we will see what the future brings.

uppppppppppppppppp
Múi giá»

[schmenke]

I’ve never been a “fanboy” of either console, although I’ve owned an Xbox since its first generation. I did once borrow a PS3 console gave it a good workover for a couple of weeks. My two issues with it were:
1. Poor quality graphics: I played the same racing sim on each console and the Xbox graphics were noticeably superior.
2. Terribly non-ergonomic controller. My hands would hurt just after a few minutes :s .

I like to think the poor graphics were a result of the sim, not the console, but unless Sony introduces a better-shaped controller, I’ll stick with Xbox.
I don’t see why the fact that the new console is always online is an issue. My current ‘box is always on-line via wi-fi anyways :mark:

[Bezza]

I’ve never been a “fanboy” of either console, although I’ve owned an Xbox since its first generation. I did once borrow a PS3 console gave it a good workover for a couple of weeks. My two issues with it were:
1. Poor quality graphics: I played the same racing sim on each console and the Xbox graphics were noticeably superior.
2. Terribly non-ergonomic controller. My hands would hurt just after a few minutes :s .

I like to think the poor graphics were a result of the sim, not the console, but unless Sony introduces a better-shaped controller, I’ll stick with Xbox.
I don’t see why the fact that the new console is always online is an issue. My current ‘box is always on-line via wi-fi anyways :mark:

Now, you see schmenke, I disagree.

1. I've played both and find the PS3 to have better graphics than the X-Box, albeit only marginally, they are both pretty good.

2. I have the same issue with the X-Box controller. Think simply a matter of preference!

[henners88]

I've owned a PS3 since 2007 and shall buy the PS4, but not close to launch. I'll have to save hard once I know how much it is and sell my old console. Not really considering the X Box to be honest. :)

[CaptainRaiden]

2. Terribly non-ergonomic controller. My hands would hurt just after a few minutes :s .


2. I have the same issue with the X-Box controller. Think simply a matter of preference!

It's a matter of getting used to it. I have jumped from a PS3 controller to an Xbox 360 one and then a Logitech F710 for PC which is sort of a mish-mash of both, and each time my hands hurt. But as I spent more time playing, I got used to each one of them. The same happened with playing simulation games with a steering wheel. My shoulders and forearms hurt like hell at first, but eventually the body got used to it.

These companies spend a whole lot of dough into researching ergonomics and comfort, and the controllers are a result of many, many man hours spent on trial-and-error testing, so I doubt one controller is that much better than the other. Like Bezza said, it can also be simply down to preference.

[CaptainRaiden]

As for the topic on hand, I too am leaning more towards a PS4 at the moment.

But I'm also leaning towards a monster gaming PC around the same time. The octo-core processors are just coming in and it would be the right timing for next gen games. Yes, it would be much more expensive, but it will also be future proof for at least the next 5-6 years, also because I use the PC for many other things than gaming, it would make sense for me.

[henners88]

I gave up trying to keep up with PC gaming in 2003, plus I like my house to be as minimalist as possible and can bung a laptop in a cupboard out of the way when not using it lol. Its good to see it still has a healthy following though. I remember LAN parties on Quake, COD, and Doom all those years ago, good times. :)

I haven't turned my PS3 on for two months now, well apart from watching a couple of films. I don't have much time for games these days with too much DIY and baby prep, but when I do I really enjoy it. Got permission to save for a PS4 so would be rude not to have one :p

[pino]

As a long time Sony loyal user, will of course buy the PS4. Hopefully stupid Codemasters will finally make a real rally game before I will be too old to play it :s :p :

[CaptainRaiden]

I gave up trying to keep up with PC gaming in 2003, plus I like my house to be as minimalist as possible and can bung a laptop in a cupboard out of the way when not using it lol. Its good to see it still has a healthy following though. I remember LAN parties on Quake, COD, and Doom all those years ago, good times. :)

I'm going to stick with the PC solely because of the sim racing bug I have. I've always had it, but now it's gone even deeper. :p What I have found to be the best way to beat work related stress is some adrenaline pumping racing. This keeps me away from alcohol and comfort food as well. :laugh: I did real racing when I was younger, and even recently, but it's proven to be just way too expensive lately (including the traveling + kits + license fees etc.). And as of now, all the best sim games are on the PC, namely iRacing, rfactor 2, Project C.A.R.S (soon), Assetto Corsa, Simraceway etc.

I've taken on building my own sim rig as a pet project now, and a PC is an important part of it. Could build it around a console too, but then it would be too limited to semi-sim or arcade racing games. Got permission from my lovely wife too as she knows how much I love racing. :D I'm gonna source parts for it over a year or so, and when finished, it should look something like this, hopefully with a much better wheel:

http://photo.vitsco.com/temp/Racing-1.jpg

I will post progress pics in case anybody will be interested.

[airshifter]

I've never really been a gamer. To me both controllers aren't very comfortable or natural at all. I think I could make a more ergonomic controller myself. No kidding.

We have a PS3 that is really my daughters, and having seen/used the Xbox as well it seems both are very capable systems. Graphics quality is mostly based on the game IMO, as both seem to have the hardware to support high end graphics.

[henners88]

Wow Captain is that your setup in the pic!!?? :eek:
Or is it the intended finished rig you plan to build? It looks amazing I have to say. I wouldn't be allowed anything like that as my wife likes every room in our house to look like its in a catalogue lol. I'd love a space where I could have a sim stashed away. I just play F1 2012 on the PS3 from time to time but appreciate it lacks some of the real style physics. I'm also not very savvy when it comes to understanding the building of computers even though I use them for my job and order them for certain products. The closest I get to racing is going Go-Karting a few times a year and try to rediscover some of my past skills. I used to go kart as a junior and won a few races, but it all go very expensive and my parents forced me onto other things.

I hope F1 2013 comes to the PS4 as I can imagine the graphics will look amazing. Unfortunately I'll likely be a new father by then and its more likely I'll be buying a new console well into next year. An article in the paper today suggests the PS4 will be around £230, so a lot cheaper than the £425 I once paid for the PS3. :)

[CaptainRaiden]

Wow Captain is that your setup in the pic!!??
Or is it the intended finished rig you plan to build? It looks amazing I have to say.

No, it isn't my setup. My setup is a Logitech Momo bolted onto my desk and a dinky screen. :p But yes, that is what I envision the outcome to look like, but like I said, with a better wheel, for example, one of the best in the world right now, Thrustmaster T500RS with the Ferrari rim:

http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/images/G/02/uk-videogames/2011/dp/B005NH6L44/image1_large._V151891330_.jpg

It's very expensive at the moment, but like I said, I will source parts over a year and a half or so, along with a better seat, and some added peripherals to complete it.


The closest I get to racing is going Go-Karting a few times a year and try to rediscover some of my past skills. I used to go kart as a junior and won a few races, but it all go very expensive and my parents forced me onto other things.

That's too bad, but yes, motorsports have always been the playground of millionaire kids. The expense of it all held me back too. I qualified for a couple of national races during the Rotax Max Challenge in my country, won in the rookie category. But if you wanna go higher, the price, politics and commitment, all go up. Then by chance or by luck I dabbled in a couple of races in a spec series, Chevrolet powered single seater formula cars. And so then once you have driven a single seater 1600cc car or 2 stroke Rotax karts, the underpowered 4 stroke rather "safe" mall karts just don't cut it anymore. :D Besides, what I really was missing was the thrill of competition, which time trialing or running circles around my newbie friends on karts wasn't giving me.

Thankfully simulation games these days have gone anal over simulating almost every aspect of a real racing car (except g-force of course), so it was the next thing to try. And judging by recent experiences, I wonder why I didn't get into it before. But yeah, to be competitive, it requires a hell of a lot of practice and for you to be thoroughly updated, which is a pain in the neck.


I hope F1 2013 comes to the PS4 as I can imagine the graphics will look amazing. Unfortunately I'll likely be a new father by then and its more likely I'll be buying a new console well into next year. An article in the paper today suggests the PS4 will be around £230, so a lot cheaper than the £425 I once paid for the PS3. :)

I think it releases in September and most probably will be on PS3. But I also hope it comes on PS4, as the graphics need to be overhauled, and because of the jump in hardware maybe they can deliver better physics too. Should be exciting. :)

[CaptainRaiden]

I wouldn't be allowed anything like that as my wife likes every room in our house to look like its in a catalogue lol. I'd love a space where I could have a sim stashed away.

Talk about coincidence, henners. I was checking to see if a certain product I wanted to buy was finally in stock or not, and I ran into this:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gjo06A2Ddb0]

[schmenke]

...

http://photo.vitsco.com/temp/Racing-1.jpg

...

Mrs. schmenke would kill me :p :

[Jag_Warrior]

Mrs. schmenke would kill me :p :

Schmenke, you get one of those and you can come live with me. You don't need her! I'll cook and press your shirts, but there ain't gonna be no funny business!

I've been wanting to build a racing simulator for years. I even bought a Logitech Momo force feedback wheel/pedal setup and some steel tubing (which a buddy of mine was going to powder coat for free) once upon a time. I had picked out a Momo racing seat but stopped myself just before placing the order. I think that was back when F1 2001 or 2002 came out... long time ago. Just never got around to it and the fascination sort of died away. I'd still like to build one though - I like the idea anyway. So yeah, I'd love to hear about CaptainRaiden's progress.

As for the game consoles mentioned... sorry, I don't even know what they are. I don't know one from another.

[CaptainRaiden]

I've been wanting to build a racing simulator for years. I even bought a Logitech Momo force feedback wheel/pedal setup and some steel tubing (which a buddy of mine was going to powder coat for free) once upon a time. I had picked out a Momo racing seat but stopped myself just before placing the order. I think that was back when F1 2001 or 2002 came out... long time ago. Just never got around to it and the fascination sort of died away. I'd still like to build one though - I like the idea anyway.

That's cool. Although you wouldn't have needed a racing simulator back in those days, because there was no decent sim game around. F1 2001 or 2002 were at best arcade games, which would be played better on a keyboard, seeing as they didn't have accurate physics and no force feedback. Even RBR (Richard Burns Rally) the first true simulation game came out in 2004. But with hardware getting faster and faster, now is the golden age of sim racing, with plenty of awesome simulation games to choose from (majority for PC though), stuff that some real F1 teams have based their simulators on (see rfactor). In fact, if you ever decide to get started, these links should be of interest. I've been looking at them for my research:

DIY sim rig for under $100


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nEhsLcjZDew


Unfortunately I don't have any carpentry skills, or any handy skills for that matter. :D So, when I looked at the overall cost of it all, and the fact that there are no junkyards around where I live to find a cheap second hand seat, properly built gaming seats like in the links below made more sense actually as they end up being cheaper than if I were to build one myself.

Playseat gaming seat, the best place to put your steering wheel! | Playseat (http://www.playseat.com/)

Humanracing Co., Ltd. | WE ARE HUMAN, WE ARE HERE TO RACE. (http://www.humanracing.co.th/)

GT Omega Racing Simulator Cockpits - The Ultimate Driving Simulator Gaming Chairs seats, Best Race Cockpit Rig Sim, PS3 Xbox 360 PC, GT5, Forza 3, seat, chair, simulation cockpit, Fanatec T500RS TH8RS G27, Fanatec CSR Clubsport (http://www.gtomegaracing.com/)



So yeah, I'd love to hear about CaptainRaiden's progress.

Cool. I'll make a thread when I've got something together. Will take a while though, so don't hold your breath. ;)

[CaptainRaiden]

Second video, since it won't let me include two videos in one post:

DIY sim rig for under $200


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9eOHHUhMWo

[henners88]

Loving the Playseat Captain, I still wouldn't get away with it though. I need a man shed with power I'm thinking and a declared no woman zone. :)

[gloomyDAY]

Bezza, you forgot the most superior console of all, which is the Nintendo Wii U!

PS4 and XB1 are too similar to a PC for me to have any interest in them. I have an old PC sitting underneath my desk that provides more power and graphics capability than either the PS4 or XB1. The current PC that I use makes either console look like complete garbage, and especially for the estimated price. Here's how I rank the newest generation of consoles:

1) Nintendo's Wii U

The best console does not have to be the most powerful. The Wii beat both Xbox 360 (my current console which just sits next to my TV gathering dust) and the PS 3 in worldwide sales. Why? Nintendo is not an arrogant company and realizes that people buy consoles to play games!

The Wii U is following a similar formula. Their current sales aren't that strong, but a new lineup of 1st party games such as Zelda & Mario Kart will get the old school gamers back to buy the Wii U. Also, the Wii U will still center around people who want to play on a split-screen. The Playstation and Xbox barely have any games that are geared towards more than 1 person unless it's multiplayer.

The Wii U will also undoubtedly be less expensive than the PS4 and XB1 come the holiday shopping season, so it's an easy choice for people with less money to spare. Times are tough right now and if someone wants to dish out cash for a console that offers fun and the same online features as Sony and Microsoft, then there's no need to pay more.

Nintendo is also the least restrictive company towards independent game developers. You can build your own game, send it to Nintendo, and if they pick it up...score! Nintendo has already given developers the tools to make games and online access to their eStore for publishing.

The best reason to buy a Wii U? Women love Nintendo. Girls aren't too fond of hardcore games, but they do love a bit of the ol' Nintendo titles. Wii U + girls/drinks = :)

2) PS4

Sony learned a hard lesson the last generation by ditching their core gamers. There were barely any games that Sony offered on the PS3, the price point was too high, and as a result Sony found out that gamers are not loyal. The PS3 sat on the shelves with their fancy new hardware, and lost money while the Wii and Xbox 360 ate its lunch.

PS4 is now on the right track! Sony has now offered the most powerful console in terms of processing, memory, and graphics. It's now ready to take under its wing the people it stabbed in the back about a decade ago. The PS4 will now come with one of the most sought out exclusive games in years, The Last of Us. Sony realized, like their Japanese counterparts, that they need to get the attention of gamers to sell consoles.

The PS+ is an excellent online store. Currently they offer $50/year subscription which allows you access to a variety of AAA title games. If you do not pay a subscription, then you can still use your PS4 to roam around the internet at no additional expense.

Sony has also seen the light and made sure to make life for developers a lot easier. The PS4 will not be as inviting to independent developers as Nintendo, but making games for PS4 won't be such a pain as it was for the PS3. 3rd party developers stayed away from the PS3 because if was such a difficult system to work with until later in its cycle. Not so with the PS4! Developers will be able to extrapolate every bit of power to use for their games on the Playstation.

3) Xbox One

I swear, I had flashbacks of the PS3 debut and thought I'd reverted to a pimply faced teenager. The Xbox One is a complete regression from what was on offer with the Xbox 360. I'm not exactly sure as to what they're trying to sell! There was only one game that was demonstrated for the Xbox One, and that was Call of Duty: Insert Arbitrary Secondary Title of an Over Saturated Game. When the Xbox 360 came out it offered Halo 3 as an exclusive, and Xbox Live allowed players to communicate with one another, which was unique at the time for console gamers. Yes, Xbox Live had to have a subscription, but it was worth the price at the time.

Today, Xbox Live is definitely not worth the cost. It angers me that I can hop online on my PC and play a game without having to pay an additional cost, and communicate just fine with my friends. Since I no longer have a subscription on Xbox 360, then I can't play online games or watch Netflix on my TV. Xbox One will stick with the same subscription standards even though these online features are completely free on the Wii U and Playstation.

The Xbox One has a massive emphasis on TV, which is my least favored entertainment medium. I don't have cable because I hate Honey Boo Boo, and my choices online are better suited to what I like to watch. As a result, the geniuses at Microsoft have decided to place a "Kincet" device bundled into your purchase of a console to allow for easier transitons between watching TV and playing video games. The Xbox One also has 3 separate operating systems to handle the useless additions, but still heavily underpowered compared to the PS4. This will not only make the Xbox One the most expensive of this current generation, but you'll have an always-on apparatus with a microphone and camera. Here's a demonstration of the Operating System (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ifa9Q7ATfVA) on the Xbox One. I think it's staged like the Xbox One debut, and I think it's crap. Even Microsoft thinks that their new console is crap because they just canceled their E3 post-press conference (http://www.gameranx.com/updates/id/15191/article/microsoft-cancels-e3-post-press-conference-roundtable-with-media/) to avoid any questions. No thanks Microsoft!

My predictions: the Wii U will get better sales with the new titles coming around in time for Fall, PS4 will likely be the best selling console and rake in cash with The Last of Us, and the Xbox One will sit on the shelves while the Wii U and PS4 eat its lunch.

[henners88]

I don't really care about worldwide sales when choosing a console. I bought a Wii, had it a year and used it only a handful of times. It was a good console but not for my tastes. I like the PS3 because it plays games of all genres and you don't have to upgrade it to play certain games, they just work for purpose. I think you have to be into computers to really be into PC gaming and that's something that doesn't interest me. I don't have the space for desks, so a cheap console is the way for me. If a top of the range gaming PC can be built for £230 (PS4 estimated UK price) then that's impressive, but won't tempt me in that direction though. :)

[gloomyDAY]

I don't really care about worldwide sales when choosing a console. I bought a Wii, had it a year and used it only a handful of times. It was a good console but not for my tastes. I like the PS3 because it plays games of all genres and you don't have to upgrade it to play certain games, they just work for purpose. I think you have to be into computers to really be into PC gaming and that's something that doesn't interest me. I don't have the space for desks, so a cheap console is the way for me. If a top of the range gaming PC can be built for £230 (PS4 estimated UK price) then that's impressive, but won't tempt me in that direction though. :) £230? You're dreaming, son! The PS4 will cost more money than that, but it's probably the best option for you. Do yourself a favor and stay the hell away from the Xbox One. I'm just going to stick to my PC and make a HTPC out of the one sitting underneath my desk.

[henners88]

That's the price discussed in the paper today and on a gadgets review the other day. It might be a start price or launch but its not my dream. I have no intention of getting an X box don't worry. Sod building a PC, I'm off to bed :p

[henners88]

Will the Xbox One and PS4 cost less than $400? | News | TechRadar (http://www.techradar.com/news/gaming/consoles/will-the-xbox-one-and-ps4-cost-less-than-400--1156214)

Article is a prediction but mentions the £230 price tag discussed in yesterdays news. I would imagine this is the starting price and models with a large HD will retail closer to £300 which is not bad.

[CaptainRaiden]

Loving the Playseat Captain, I still wouldn't get away with it though. I need a man shed with power I'm thinking and a declared no woman zone. :)

Oh come on, grow a pair henners. :p

*Psst! Besides, when you're done, it can fold and go under the bed and hide. It will be your secret affair. ;)

[henners88]

The only seat I'm going to be buying in the next 4 months a pushchair lol. Perhaps I'll get one I can fit in and strap a steering wheel to? :p

[Mark]

You can bet that if it's $400 in the USA it'll be close to £400 here!

[Mark]

The only seat I'm going to be buying in the next 4 months a pushchair lol. Perhaps I'll get one I can fit in and strap a steering wheel to? :p

And the worst thing is that you can get an XBox for the price of them things!

[henners88]

You can bet that if it's $400 in the USA it'll be close to £400 here!
I Don't know. I'm expecting it to be closer to £300 but it has been stated that the cost of materials is significantly less and with more competition this time around the price point is intended to be lower. I don't expect to be buying it until next year anyway so hopefully if the price is launched high, it'll come down to a sensible level by the time I'm interested.

[henners88]

And the worst thing is that you can get an XBox for the price of them things!
You could probably buy two to be honest! The pram, pushchair, car seat combo my dearly beloved has her eye on is nearly £800!! Luckily we have two sets of grand parents who are presently fighting over what they can buy us. Its looking likely I won't be spending anything on it :D

[CaptainRaiden]

I don't expect to be buying it until next year anyway so hopefully if the price is launched high, it'll come down to a sensible level by the time I'm interested.

Yep, if I'm buying either console (leaning heavily towards PS4 ATM) I will wait at least between 6 months to a year after all the reviews are in, especially looking at the exclusive games each one of them has.

[schmenke]

You could probably buy two to be honest! The pram, pushchair, car seat combo my dearly beloved has her eye on is nearly £800!! Luckily we have two sets of grand parents who are presently fighting over what they can buy us. Its looking likely I won't be spending anything on it :D

C’mon henners, have a bit of imagination :D :p :

Buggy fast! Dad builds world (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/4582037/Buggy-fast-Dad-builds-worlds-speediest-pram.html)

[CaptainRaiden]

Oh boy, things are not looking good for the new Xbox:

News: Microsoft confirms 'pre-owned fee' for Xbox One - CVG UK (http://www.computerandvideogames.com/407912/microsoft-confirms-pre-owned-fee-for-xbox-one/)

Xbox 360 controllers, accessories won't work on Xbox One - GameSpot.com (http://m.uk.gamespot.com/news/xbox-360-controllers-accessories-wont-work-on-xbox-one-6408716)

From what I have heard from a lot of console gamers since the announcements, they are moving to PC. For simulation racing, it's a no-brainer, PC is king at the moment. But there are a lot of exclusive games that it's worth buying a console for. What I have decided ATM is to build a monster gaming PC a month after these two consoles are released, and then wait 8 months to a year and buy the PS4 for games like the Tekken series or exclusive games like GOW.

[CaptainRaiden]

I am quite liking the new PS4. Not only is it $100 cheaper than the Xbox, but it also lets you play used games, and also no 24 hour authentication required. All to wait for now are specs, reviews and comparison of exclusive games each console has. But I'm already sold on the PS4.

http://cdn0.mos.techradar.futurecdn.net///art/games_consoles/PlayStation%204/PS4%20official%20photos/PS4%20with%20controller-900-75.jpg

Sony's PS4 to cost $399 in the US, £349 in the UK | News | TechRadar (http://www.techradar.com/us/news/gaming/consoles/sony-s-ps4-to-cost-399-in-us-349-in-the-uk-1157925)

[Bezza]

Well now it is definitely PS4. Xbox's stubbornness has killed them off from reality I think!

I'll be getting a PS4, probably 6-12 months after release, once I've completed GTA V, Assassins Creed Black Flag and Last of Us, and maybe some others :) It is well-priced and doesn't have stupid rules about old games / always online. Microsoft's "entertainment console" is bollocks because the PS3 already did that, with iPlayer, LoveFilm, internet access, Youtube and so on.

I am not interested in the Kinect. I like to sit / lie on the sofa playing on the Playstation. I do not want to be playing Call of Duty / FIFA stood up looking like a tool! The Kinect is for party gaming, and once the novelty wears off, it is a clear waste of money - the Wii age has been and gone in my opinion.

Same applies for PC. Yes you can have great graphics, great power - but I have to sit in front of a computer screen to use it. Also a powerful one to cope with the level of gaming required is upwards of £600 - which is not realistic.

So, it is PS4! Bring it on.

[CaptainRaiden]

Same applies for PC. Yes you can have great graphics, great power - but I have to sit in front of a computer screen to use it.

Eh? Dunno if you're being serious or joking. You can play games on PC in the same way as consoles. The TV connects via an HDMI cable, and both Xbox360 and PS3 controllers connect to the PC via USB and work on all games. And there are loads of other gamepads from Logitech, Razer and plenty other manufacturers available on the market. So, a wide variety of pool to choose from and you're not limited by just the proprietary one.

I have finished games like Skyrim and Assassin's Creed games lying on my bed using a Logitech F710 I own - http://www.amazon.co.uk/Logitech-Wireless-Gamepad-F710-Windows/dp/B0042YXSZO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1370952870&sr=8-1&keywords=logitech+f710

And if you wanna play an FPS game with higher accuracy, you have the option of a mouse and a keyboard as well. As far as graphics go, yes, they are far superior to a console.


Also a powerful one to cope with the level of gaming required is upwards of £600 - which is not realistic.

Untrue again. You can make a potent gaming PC for £500, which gets you:

1. Far superior graphics.

2. Mods; nuff said. Huge amount of mods updated daily. Just take a look at some of the brilliant mods for F1 2012.

3. Wider pool of controllers to choose from. Ability to manage and change a wider variety of settings, especially for steering wheels.

3. All the best simulation racing games on the planet are exclusive only to PC.

4. Ability to do many more things than just playing games. It can double as a media center, graphic designing/editing workstation AND can also work as a console.

[Bezza]

Eh? Dunno if you're being serious or joking. You can play games on PC in the same way as consoles. The TV connects via an HDMI cable, and both Xbox360 and PS3 controllers connect to the PC via USB and work on all games. And there are loads of other gamepads from Logitech, Razer and plenty other manufacturers available on the market. So, a wide variety of pool to choose from and you're not limited by just the proprietary one.

I have finished games like Skyrim and Assassin's Creed games lying on my bed using a Logitech F710 I own - http://www.amazon.co.uk/Logitech-Wir...=logitech+f710

And if you wanna play an FPS game with higher accuracy, you have the option of a mouse and a keyboard as well. As far as graphics go, yes, they are far superior to a console.

I was serious. I am aware you can adapt these things and have third party stuff, but realistically I don't havethe want, desire or time to do any of that. And how do you propose I hook up my PC from upstairs to the 42" Plasma in the front room? Thats a long HDMI cable.

I find the graphics argument questionable. Especially for the amount of money you say. Graphics cards can produce fantastic graphics (of course) but from experience a decent monitor is required for this to have effect. Which brings me onto your next point:


Untrue again. You can make a potent gaming PC for £500, which gets you:

1. Far superior graphics.

2. Mods; nuff said. Huge amount of mods updated daily. Just take a look at some of the brilliant mods for F1 2012.

3. Wider pool of controllers to choose from. Ability to manage and change a wider variety of settings, especially for steering wheels.

3. All the best simulation racing games on the planet are exclusive only to PC.

4. Ability to do many more things than just playing games. It can double as a media center, graphic designing/editing workstation AND can also work as a console.

1. Potent gaming PC for £500 ? Are you including a decent monitor / TV in that? I don't think so. You need a high-end monitor to gain the benefit. Add to that the load times, the unreliability of PC's running on Windows OS's, virus protection - it is a very costly way of doing things.

2. Don't care about mods.

3. The Playstation controller is all I am interested in. The Xbox one is OK, but I'm used to the PS one. I do like steering wheels, but thats another £120 and you can get these for PS3 / Xbox anyway.

3 (!). I've not mentioned I want to play any simulation racing games if I'm honest. Although I love F1, I'm not bothered about racing games like I used to be. I much prefer GTA type games and Assassins Creed, Bioshock, etc.

4. Well, yes. It is a PC after all. But then an iPad can do most of that, at a fraction of the price, and be portable and easy to use, and I already have one of them.

[henners88]

You have to be pretty committed to being a PC gamer and it requires a lot of time and money to keep up I always found. At least with a console you can buy it and the only extras over the next few years are the games themselves. You know full well when you buy the new Battlefield, or Far Cry you'll be able to play it because its designed to one type of hardware spec. That doesn't mean PC gaming is inferior in any way, its just more than I need or am willing to commit. I said before I turn my PS3 on two or three times a week in a good week and go weeks, sometimes months without playing on it. Its good for watching films on and is a good all round entertainment system for the more lazy gamer. As far as computers go, if its bigger than a laptop I ain't interested lol. :)

[CaptainRaiden]

I was serious. I am aware you can adapt these things and have third party stuff, but realistically I don't havethe want, desire or time to do any of that. And how do you propose I hook up my PC from upstairs to the 42" Plasma in the front room? Thats a long HDMI cable.

Simple, bring the PC next to the TV. :p


I find the graphics argument questionable. Especially for the amount of money you say. Graphics cards can produce fantastic graphics (of course) but from experience a decent monitor is required for this to have effect.

:confused: I think you're confusing yourself here. The same argument is true for consoles too. High end gaming monitors have a much faster refresh rate and response time compared to any LCD or LED TV. So, playing games using a high end monitor will result in much better gaming performance, regardless of whether it's a PC or a console, because it's the monitor which improves the quality.

The reason why PC is lauded for having superior graphics is because many games are graphically scaled down for consoles. This is especially true towards their end of life period, because consoles have to last for at least half a decade and can't be upgraded. And so they just can't compete with the computing power of a good gaming PC. Generally PC version of the same game will allow the user to use max graphics settings, whereas a console doesn't. People I know have built PCs that are already superior to the so called next gen consoles which haven't even released yet. So, expect games to continue to look much better on a PC.


1. Potent gaming PC for £500 ? Are you including a decent monitor / TV in that? I don't think so. You need a high-end monitor to gain the benefit. Add to that the load times, the unreliability of PC's running on Windows OS's, virus protection - it is a very costly way of doing things.

Well, of course I didn't include a monitor. Do you get a monitor or a TV bundled with your console? Also, you are wrong about needing a high end monitor. A good gaming PC will perform better than a console regardless of if you're using a monitor or a TV, period.


3. The Playstation controller is all I am interested in. The Xbox one is OK, but I'm used to the PS one. I do like steering wheels, but thats another £120 and you can get these for PS3 / Xbox anyway.

Steering wheels will cost the same whether you buy them for PC or consoles. With PC you can play around with a LOT of extra settings in the profiler software provided by the manufacturer. You can't do this on a console.

And everybody says they don't care about mods........until they use them. :D


4. Well, yes. It is a PC after all. But then an iPad can do most of that, at a fraction of the price, and be portable and easy to use, and I already have one of them.

A tablet can never do things that a PC can. Touch based apps, yes. Basic apps, yes, but almost everything else, a PC will do better, simply because tablets just don't have the same computing power at the moment. That's why I didn't mention the everyday basic stuff.

[CaptainRaiden]

In the end, the same old adage is true. People will buy what suits them. But actually putting down a platform without even trying it, based on assumptions or hearsay is wrong IMO.

I have known many console gamers unwilling to move to PC gaming, even though they weren't getting what they wanted from consoles, just because it seemed very overwhelming to them. Ultimately many were forced to move and were pleasantly surprised how easy the transition was. Things have changed dramatically in this space in the last decade. It's like any transition, it takes a little time to get used to it, and then it becomes second nature.

I built a gaming PC in Jan 2009 which is still good to play games at max settings and does video editing and graphic designing without so much as a squeak. So, the notion of constantly having to upgrade is also untrue in this case.

[henners88]

Anybody know the actual date the PS4 is available? Seem to find conflicting dates.

[CaptainRaiden]

I think both are slated for summer 2013? I'm not too fussed as I'm gonna wait at least 6 months before buying one. :D

[henners88]

Cheers. The BBC news tonight didn't give a great impression of the X Box this evening. I think the price is the major factor plus the used game situation. Microsoft need this to work for them badly after the disappointment of Windows 8 and the lukewarm reception their other recent products have produced. It'll no doubt be a great console but will it again fail to outsell the Playstation? Everyone I know who is remotely interested in gaming seems to be leaning towards the PS4.

[steveaki13]

I normally always end up behind the new console releases, but I might try to get a new one soon.

I have had a PS2 and Ps3, but am thinking about an Xbox One, as Xbox has Forza.

Anyone know what the new consoles will offer in terms of game improvements.

I am a bit of a novice about the details of such things.

[henners88]

I normally always end up behind the new console releases, but I might try to get a new one soon.

I have had a PS2 and Ps3, but am thinking about an Xbox One, as Xbox has Forza.

Anyone know what the new consoles will offer in terms of game improvements.

I am a bit of a novice about the details of such things.
Something to consider is the PS4 promises the new Gran Turismo. Now I know Gran Turismo 5 was possibly the worst racing game ever in terms of the amount of hype and 7 years in development rubbish, but 6 is apparently supposed to be very good. According to the early hype at least lol. Gran Turismo 5 was effectively 4 with a few in car views and the graphics turned up a bit. I borrowed it off a friend and played it several times before giving it back. Never bought it. I might be tempted by the next one though and its Playstation exclusive still I believe. They said the PS4 is designed more for the gamer whereas the Xbox One has a few more options. You'd expect that though with the price difference.

[CaptainRaiden]

I normally always end up behind the new console releases, but I might try to get a new one soon.

I have had a PS2 and Ps3, but am thinking about an Xbox One, as Xbox has Forza.

Anyone know what the new consoles will offer in terms of game improvements.

I am a bit of a novice about the details of such things.

At this time, based on the tech specs released of both consoles, they are far superior to their predecessors as far as hardware goes. What does this mean for you as a consumer?

1. Much better graphics and better framerate because of the new hardware. The new games will run smoother at much higher FPS (frames per second) and clearer (at higher resolutions than they currently do).

2. Better hardware allows game developers to achieve higher levels of photo-realism, so expect much more realistic looking next-gen games.

3. Simulation racing games are so far exclusive to the PC because it requires a lot of processing power to accurately simulate real car physics in a game. With the new consoles bridging the gap somewhat, expect better and probably more realistic car physics and handling in racing games.

-------------------------------------

Another plus in PS4 at the moment is the ability to upgrade your HDD in case it gets full. It comes with a standard 500 GB but you can upgrade it to 1, 2 or 3 terabytes if need be. Xbox one meanwhile doesn't seem to support this function.

[SGWilko]

I used to have the original Play Station. I'd be happy with one again with the following games;

Wipeout/Wipeout 2097
Formula 1 (He's right up tight and pushing hard)
Bust a Move
Ridge Racer (You're the greatest)
Abe's Odyssey/Exodus (follow Me)

I'd have my mate round with the link cable and his PS1 and two telly's.

Aaaahhhh, them were the days.... ;)

[henners88]

There was a Playstation 1? God you're old! :p :)

[steveaki13]

There was a Playstation 1? God you're old! :p :)

Must have been a clockwork machine I guess. :p

[airshifter]

Looks like the daughter is already interested in the PS4. She's got plenty of cash for one, I'll have to wait and see if she springs for it sooner rather than later...

[henners88]

My wife has said I can get one for my birthday, obviously depending on when it is released. I was going to wait but its not everyday you get the green light on such things. Plus I might get a month or twos use before its just an unused black box under the TV.

I had to laugh reading some of the gamer reviews where the complaints were that the two consoles are ugly. Who gives a damn what it looks like? Mine will be virtually out of sight and used for what it does rather than bring used as an attractive ornament. :)

[slorydn1]

I've had 2 PS's, 3 PS2's (2 large and 1 small) and a PS3. I've always waited for about a year or 2 after release for the price to come down and the inventory of games to fill out a little bit. I will be getting a PS4, eventually.

My kids have had both the xbox and 360. I have tried playing with them a couple of times and I hate the controllers. The graphics were marginally better on the 360 than the PS3, yes. But it doesn't cost me a thing to fire up GT5 and go online with it.

GT6 has now been announced by Sony, and it will apparently be released on the PS3 and not the PS4 :eek:
I guess they have something else planned for the PS4 a year or 2 after release, which will suit my MO just fine. :D

[SGWilko]

There was a Playstation 1? God you're old! :p :)

I recall I bought it about the same time Channel 5 launched........

[henners88]

I recall I bought it about the same time Channel 5 launched........
I had mine in the mid 90's too. F1 1998 was one of the best racing games I've played, absolutely loved it.

[steveaki13]

It seems like a lot of games are being newly released on Ps3 more than Ps4.

I assume as soon as Ps4 or xbox 1 is released the new games will be made for both?

[slorydn1]

I had mine in the mid 90's too. F1 1998 was one of the best racing games I've played, absolutely loved it.

My favorite was the version after that, F1 2000 is what I think it was called, by EA Sports. Not really realistic, though. One could keep it on the mat a from Nordkurve all the way to the beginning of the stadium section at the old Hockenheim if one got the line just right through the bunkers next to the chicanes at Clark and Ostkurve-the sand would slow you down just enough. :eek:

It was that F1 game that really got me to watch F1 every time it came on. I still have my PS1 buried in a box somewhere in the attic.

[Ari33]

Horses for courses but neither are for me, the last console I bought was a PS2 which ended up sitting just gathering dust. :(

I already have a half decent gaming PC (I5 2500K at 4.3Ghz + 560TI) which I built last year, it probably already performs similar to the next gen consoles graphically so I couldn't justify forking out £300-£400 even if I was tempted... I think I'd rather put the cash towards a Nvidea GTX Titan. :s mokin:

[odykas]

Chuck Norris plays PS4 games on Xbox One.

[Koz]

1. Much better graphics and better framerate because of the new hardware. The new games will run smoother at much higher FPS (frames per second) and clearer (at higher resolutions than they currently do).
2. Better hardware allows game developers to achieve higher levels of photo-realism, so expect much more realistic looking next-gen games.
I am not so sure about "resolution". PS3/Xbox 360 all claimed 1080p. However 99% of the game were at most 720p. I can't think of a single 1080p game. Even GT5, wasn't 1080p (1280, it was a typical marketing lie.
The hardware won't come close to rendering anything in 4k. We'll be lucky to have everything at native 1920x1080.




3. Simulation racing games are so far exclusive to the PC because it requires a lot of processing power to accurately simulate real car physics in a game. With the new consoles bridging the gap somewhat, expect better and probably more realistic car physics and handling in racing games.

Errr. The CPU will still be worse off than two year old budget Core i3 Sandy Bridge chips. AMD is immensely lagging behind Intel.
As for the GPU performance, it also be on par with a 2 year old mid range chips (close to 560 Ti and 6870).

Of course, you will get slightly better performance than on a PC with these specifications due to optimization. But these technologies were inferior to high end PC component from 2 years ago, how far will they be in 2 more?
At least, the PS3 and Xbox 360 were on par with top technology of when they were released.

Sure there will be improvements, but they will not be game changing revolutionary "photo realism". On par with a mid-to-high end PC of 2 years ago. In a neat little package.

[CaptainRaiden]

I am not so sure about "resolution". PS3/Xbox 360 all claimed 1080p. However 99% of the game were at most 720p. I can't think of a single 1080p game. Even GT5, wasn't 1080p (1280, it was a typical marketing lie.
The hardware won't come close to rendering anything in 4k. We'll be lucky to have everything at native 1920x1080.

I don't remember either PS3 or X360 adverts claiming 1080p. IIRC they claimed 720p from the start. I think both PS4 and Xbone should be able to handle initial games at 1080p least, with both of them going into the teraflops region compared to the gigaflops of their predecessors. Of course, in the coming years upcoming games will be optimized so that their hardware continues to be able to 'handle' them.


Errr. The CPU will still be worse off than two year old budget Core i3 Sandy Bridge chips. AMD is immensely lagging behind Intel. As for the GPU performance, it also be on par with a 2 year old mid range chips (close to 560 Ti and 6870).

The AMD processor on both of them is a wimpy 8 core one, yes, but I think it is slightly better than a Sandy Bridge Core i3. I maybe wrong, but it is more comparable to a Core i7 from the same architecture. Also, they seem to have offloadeded most of the task on the GPU this time and opted to make it more powerful, and so don't need the processor to be that spectacular. Games will be developed accordingly.

Besides, I never said the new consoles will be better or at par with current gaming PCs, did I? I said they're only bridging the gap somewhat compared to their predecessors. PC gaming still reigns supreme as far as quality and outright power goes, and always will, until someone comes up with a monster console, which is highly unlikely for their price range.


Of course, you will get slightly better performance than on a PC with these specifications due to optimization. But these technologies were inferior to high end PC component from 2 years ago, how far will they be in 2 more?

I think it's no secret that at the price tag of $400, you will not be getting a PC beater in any way, shape or form, even if console fans would like to believe so. And like I said earlier, people have already built far superior monster gaming PCs than these "next-gen" consoles six months before they even release. So, actually only good news for PC gaming fans, because this means their rigs will continue to be able to play games far longer. The annoying thing though is because of the rampant piracy in PC games, almost all developers go first to console, and so many of the games coming to the PC are annoying console ports that are badly optimized. But things have gotten much better in the last two years.


Sure there will be improvements, but they will not be game changing revolutionary "photo realism". On par with a mid-to-high end PC of 2 years ago. In a neat little package.

Won't be game changing, won't be revolutionary either, but they will definitely be better compared to their predecessors, as I said in my reply to steveaki who wanted to know what will be the main differences between the consoles.

[CaptainRaiden]

OMG. Trying to make their graphics look better. Microsoft is dropping the ball on this BIG time!

Xbox One E3 Games Running On Windows 7 NVIDIA PCs? - Tech of Tomorrow - Tech of Tomorrow (http://www.techoftomorrow.com/2013/pc/xbox-one-e3-games-running-on-windows-7-nvidia-pcs/)

The Xbox One is fast becoming one of the biggest fails in recent history, might even give Apple "Maps" a run for its money. :p

[henners88]

I hear X Box have done a massive U-turn in respect to their proposed used games policy.


"We have listened and we have heard loud and clear from your feedback that you want the best of both worlds."


BBC News - Microsoft U-turn in Xbox One games row (http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22980973)

It was always a stupid idea to try and kill the used games market IMO and has contributed to some of the negativity towards the new X box.

[dj_bytedisaster]

It was always a stupid idea to try and kill the used games market IMO and has contributed to some of the negativity towards the new X box.

It was a stupid idea, but then again it was typical Microsoft business practice. Only difference is that in this day and age, where people are so connected and can quickly gather a lot of like-minded people, they can no longer apply their shady methods from ages past.

[henners88]

I think it's no secret that at the price tag of $400, you will not be getting a PC beater in any way, shape or form, even if console fans would like to believe so. And like I said earlier, people have already built far superior monster gaming PCs than these "next-gen" consoles six months before they even release.
I think consoles provide good enough graphics to satisfy a good chunk of the market. I'm not au fait with the militant console gamers out there and don't occupy gaming forums as I'm only a casual gamer myself. Most of it goes over my head which is probably why console graphics are good enough for me and just about everybody I know who enjoys the odd gaming session. :)

[henners88]

It was a stupid idea, but then again it was typical Microsoft business practice. Only difference is that in this day and age, where people are so connected and can quickly gather a lot of like-minded people, they can no longer apply their shady methods from ages past.
Indeed. You're quite right about this day and age. Social media and the ability to spread opinion online means a voice can quickly gather momentum. Microsoft like many large companies (Apple, Samsung) attempt to use bully boy tactics but its always nice to see the consumer win a battle or two. I'm guessing Sony's policy on not restricting the use of used games, combined with their pricing being undercut meant Microsoft are entering a damage limitation period. Just like the X Box 360, Microsoft appear to have been more keen to beat Sony to the announcement, they've made a few errors in the process. They never quite matched the Playstaion 3 in worldwide sales and this edition hasn't exactly got off to the best of starts.

[CaptainRaiden]

I think consoles provide good enough graphics to satisfy a good chunk of the market. I'm not au fait with the militant console gamers out there and don't occupy gaming forums as I'm only a casual gamer myself. Most of it goes over my head which is probably why console graphics are good enough for me and just about everybody I know who enjoys the odd gaming session. :)

Never said consoles aren't good enough. That's why, being a PC gamer, I myself am interested in buying the PS4 as well for its exclusive games and other console exclusives. They are good for the market and the consumer they're intended for. Consoles make sense that way as they're cheaper, hassle free, and get the job done as far as gaming goes. Piracy is low on console titles as well, that's why so many developers rush to consoles first.

If you're not a quality connoisseur or a pixel hound, then it doesn't matter which platform you choose. For example, compare F1 2012 on DirectX 11 on a top end gaming PC with the console version, and prepare for your jaw to drop on the floor. But if that kinda thing doesn't concern you, then the console is perfect for your needs.

[henners88]

Never said consoles aren't good enough. That's why, being a PC gamer, I myself am interested in buying the PS4 as well for its exclusive games and other console exclusives. They are good for the market and the consumer they're intended for. Consoles make sense that way as they're cheaper, hassle free, and get the job done as far as gaming goes. Piracy is low on console titles as well, that's why so many developers rush to consoles first.

If you're not a quality connoisseur or a pixel hound, then it doesn't matter which platform you choose. For example, compare F1 2012 on DirectX 11 on a top end gaming PC with the console version, and prepare for your jaw to drop on the floor. But if that kinda thing doesn't concern you, then the console is perfect for your needs.
It wouldn't concern me, but then again I rarely watch TV in HD even if some of the channels I have enable me to do this. I don't deliberately choose the lower quality image, I just forget I have it and often don't pay too much attention to the difference. I always forget to watch the Grand Prix in HD even though I have BBC 1HD lol. I don't have an awful lot of spare cash at the moment and when I do I tend to spend it on more important things. The PS4 will be a luxury and I doubt I'll get on it very often. I get enough stick now for being on my PS3 and I've only played on it once since April!

[CaptainRaiden]

I get enough stick now for being on my PS3 and I've only played on it once since April!

Aw, I feel sorry for you henners. :D But I'm sure you find enjoyment in doing other things.

Anyway, I'm lucky in a way because my wife is a gamer too, and we even spend hours playing co-op games together, recently Portal 2. So, if anything, I get encouraged or asked to do more gaming. Fine by me! :p

[henners88]

Aw, I feel sorry for you henners. :D But I'm sure you find enjoyment in doing other things.

Anyway, I'm lucky in a way because my wife is a gamer too, and we even spend hours playing co-op games together, recently Portal 2. So, if anything, I get encouraged or asked to do more gaming. Fine by me! :p
You are lucky. I get stick but its not all done seriously. I think all the games I have had over the past 3 years (5 games) have been bought by my wife. I think I get stick as a tease more than anything but it does wind me up especially when I turn the console on and play for 30 mins, only to be told to get off it and get a life lol. The truth is I just don't get enough time to chill out in front of the TV or play games. I grab the odd half hour or early Saturday morning here and there. My wife used to very occasionally go on Call of Duty years ago but her interest has faded since. The only thing she'll go on now is Singstar and we often do that when friends are over. Plus gaming can be a bit of a passion killer in the evenings if you're not in the same room and enjoying the same hobby. :p

[Koz]

I don't remember either PS3 or X360 adverts claiming 1080p. IIRC they claimed 720p from the start. I think both PS4 and Xbone should be able to handle initial games at 1080p least, with both of them going into the teraflops region compared to the gigaflops of their predecessors. Of course, in the coming years upcoming games will be optimized so that their hardware continues to be able to 'handle' them.

They claimed 1080p capable, just like the modern ones are 4k capable. Both are marketing tricks.



The AMD processor on both of them is a wimpy 8 core one, yes, but I think it is slightly better than a Sandy Bridge Core i3. I maybe wrong, but it is more comparable to a Core i7 from the same architecture. Also, they seem to have offloadeded most of the task on the GPU this time and opted to make it more powerful, and so don't need the processor to be that spectacular. Games will be developed accordingly.
Not true. AMD being 8 cores is irrelevant. Current dual core i3 will beat almost every 8-10 core chips from AMD. The only time when AMD chips can compete with i7 is when the i7 is ultra-low voltage - and/or 3 generations old.

Offloading to GPU, is different. GPUs are terrible at calculating floating points. They are very good at doing a lot of simple calculations in parallel. They exist for different tasks, and this will be a bottleneck.



I think it's no secret that at the price tag of $400, you will not be getting a PC beater in any way, shape or form, even if console fans would like to believe so. And like I said earlier, people have already built far superior monster gaming PCs than these "next-gen" consoles six months before they even release.
For 400? Using two year old parts, you could get pretty close.

The problem is that it isn't 6 months, the problem is that it is already lagging behind about two years.

[CaptainRaiden]

They claimed 1080p capable, just like the modern ones are 4k capable. Both are marketing tricks.

My memory is a little hazy from 2006, but I faintly recall a Sony PS3 billboard saying 720p. But then again, I might be mistaken.


Not true. AMD being 8 cores is irrelevant. Current dual core i3 will beat almost every 8-10 core chips from AMD. The only time when AMD chips can compete with i7 is when the i7 is ultra-low voltage - and/or 3 generations old.

Offloading to GPU, is different. GPUs are terrible at calculating floating points. They are very good at doing a lot of simple calculations in parallel. They exist for different tasks, and this will be a bottleneck.

I agree about the processor, that's why I called it wimpy. No freaking way that AMD is competing with any of the last gen Intel Core i processors.

As for offloading to GPU, I think companies like Sony and Microsoft would have done enough testing on their consoles to rule out the possibility of any bottlenecking? The architecture was relayed to game developers beforehand and they're developing games accordingly. Anyway, even on PC recent games have been more GPU heavy than CPU. Only exception being GTA IV which is a CPU vampire.


For 400? Using two year old parts, you could get pretty close.

I meant for $400, no console will beat any potent gaming PC.

[Daniel]

It's interesting how the forum seems to have decided that the PS4 is in pole position for the next battle of the consoles. After Microsoft's u-turn on pre-owned games, most articles I've seen seem to be talking about the XBox One being top dog.

The thing all console gamers seem to forget is that pretty much everyone has a PC, for the price of a console, you could turn an everyday PC into a gaming powerhouse, for even less if you built it as a gaming PC from the start. Yeah you might want a bigger monitor, but once you get that bigger monitor you'll appreciate how great it is to use it for everyday usage. I've got a 1920*1200 24" LCD monitor and it's fantastic for everyday use and also great for games, it's a higher res than any of the TV's you guys have got (I doubt anyone has a 4k set just now....) and cost me £200 a few years ago.

[Koz]

The thing all console gamers seem to forget is that pretty much everyone has a PC, for the price of a console, you could turn an everyday PC into a gaming powerhouse, for even less if you built it as a gaming PC from the start.

How many people do you know that have bought a desktop in the last 4 years? (Or even actively use one?)

Among my friends, I know maybe 5-6 people who have a desktop, and they are all gamers or coders. Or are have had machines for close to a decade and think gaming means Hearts or Solitaire.

[henners88]

It's interesting how the forum seems to have decided that the PS4 is in pole position for the next battle of the consoles. After Microsoft's u-turn on pre-owned games, most articles I've seen seem to be talking about the XBox One being top dog.

The thing all console gamers seem to forget is that pretty much everyone has a PC, for the price of a console, you could turn an everyday PC into a gaming powerhouse, for even less if you built it as a gaming PC from the start. Yeah you might want a bigger monitor, but once you get that bigger monitor you'll appreciate how great it is to use it for everyday usage. I've got a 1920*1200 24" LCD monitor and it's fantastic for everyday use and also great for games, it's a higher res than any of the TV's you guys have got (I doubt anyone has a 4k set just now....) and cost me £200 a few years ago.
Different tastes and views Daniel. I prefer the PS4 on first glance and as I had a PS3, I will buy the next generation as I'm familiar with the interface and controller etc. For me its not about picking sides really, as I'll probably buy the PS4 and not think about the xBox, just like I didn't with the 360.

The gaming PC argument doesn't really work for me as I stated before. I don't want a gaming PC. My reasons are mainly because I don't want to dedicate space in my house for a desktop PC when I can tuck my laptop away in a cupboard neatly. My house is very minimalist with most of our junk hidden. I don't like bookshelves or hideous DVD collections on display, and have put a lot of thought into how my house looks. That is probably quite sad to some people lol, but I enjoy design and like to show that in my living space. Just bought a brand new build house so in the process of getting that sorted whilst living with the in-laws :eek:

I used own a desktop and used it for gaming but preferred the options consoles offered in terms of available games and I couldn't be bothered to try and keep up with the hardware. I know people here say you can build a PC that will game for years on its present spec, but I can also buy a console that will sit under my TV and play the games I want to which suits my own personal needs. Its not for everyone and I wouldn't try and convert a PC gamer to switch to consoles because it makes no difference to me what they do. I don't game regularly enough these days anyway. I bought 'Grid 2' a couple of weeks ago and finally put the disk in my Playstation yesterday after a day of decorating. I played it for all of 40 minutes and I'll most likely not play it again for a couple of weeks. I don't have the time these days sadly. I'm also told by friends that when your first child comes along, gaming will very much be a thing of the past in any case. I'll grab the odd five minutes and make the most of it while I can :p

[Daniel]

Different tastes and views Daniel. I prefer the PS4 on first glance and as I had a PS3, I will buy the next generation as I'm familiar with the interface and controller etc. For me its not about picking sides really, as I'll probably buy the PS4 and not think about the xBox, just like I didn't with the 360.

The gaming PC argument doesn't really work for me as I stated before. I don't want a gaming PC. My reasons are mainly because I don't want to dedicate space in my house for a desktop PC when I can tuck my laptop away in a cupboard neatly. My house is very minimalist with most of our junk hidden. I don't like bookshelves or hideous DVD collections on display, and have put a lot of thought into how my house looks. That is probably quite sad to some people lol, but I enjoy design and like to show that in my living space. Just bought a brand new build house so in the process of getting that sorted whilst living with the in-laws :eek:

I used own a desktop and used it for gaming but preferred the options consoles offered in terms of available games and I couldn't be bothered to try and keep up with the hardware. I know people here say you can build a PC that will game for years on its present spec, but I can also buy a console that will sit under my TV and play the games I want to which suits my own personal needs. Its not for everyone and I wouldn't try and convert a PC gamer to switch to consoles because it makes no difference to me what they do. I don't game regularly enough these days anyway. I bought 'Grid 2' a couple of weeks ago and finally put the disk in my Playstation yesterday after a day of decorating. I played it for all of 40 minutes and I'll most likely not play it again for a couple of weeks. I don't have the time these days sadly. I'm also told by friends that when your first child comes along, gaming will very much be a thing of the past in any case. I'll grab the odd five minutes and make the most of it while I can :p

I actually agree with all of that Henners, my point was simply that the age old argument that a gaming PC is expensive is somewhat of a lie. Gone are the days when you needed to have anything near a top spec PC to play games. You also never needed to upgrade every year or 6 months. I think there's a perceived complexity with a PC, 6 years ago I taught a work colleague how to build a PC, he invited me over to build his PC and ordered some Domino's. I simply told him how to do it and still took a meat feast in payment. He was quite surprised how easy it was and since then upgraded that original PC and then built himself a new one a year or two ago.

Obviously if you feel that a PC clutters up your house then that's somewhat of a deal breaker!

You can get some fairly minimalist cases though :) I've got myself a nice looking Samsung monitor on my desk and the case below which keeps my PC nice and quiet. Not sure if you'd approve of the rest of the **** on my desk though :mark:

http://www.antecindia.co.in/images/400/P183_quarter.jpg

[Mark]

PC gaming is the best thing for the likes of yourself who knows what they are looking at and can spec accordingly.

But most people just want a box under the tele and to be able to buy games for years to come and know they'll work just as well.

[henners88]

Yeah Mark sums it up for me in a brief sentence lol. I appreciate you can get small PC's these days but I prefer an even smaller laptop for surfing the net and editing photographs. My work give me a decent laptop to run SolidWorks too and I bring that home when I need to do extra CAD work.

We use these: Work Station Specialists Laptop Solidworks (http://www.workstationspecialist.com/laptop/solidworks/)

I dare say it would run many games as it has a mean graphics card but I don't need it for that type of thing. I sold a desk a few years back that used to have my PC on, and don't want another one. Its good to know PC gaming is still alive and well as its easy to assume consoles are the only form. I just prefer a games unit I can hide away until I need it. :)

[henners88]

Google and Apple fancying a piece of the console pie?

"Game" Consoles Are the Final Key to Digital Domination | Gizmodo UK (http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2013/06/game-consoles-are-the-final-key-to-digital-domination/)

I can't see either being successful with the size of the fanbase for both the xBox and PS4, but never say never. For me though its a bit like the mobile and tablet market where established competitors are hard to break, or at least take a lot of time to bridge the gap. We'll see. :)

[Daniel]

Yeah Mark sums it up for me in a brief sentence lol. I appreciate you can get small PC's these days but I prefer an even smaller laptop for surfing the net and editing photographs. My work give me a decent laptop to run SolidWorks too and I bring that home when I need to do extra CAD work.

We use these: Work Station Specialists Laptop Solidworks (http://www.workstationspecialist.com/laptop/solidworks/)

I dare say it would run many games as it has a mean graphics card but I don't need it for that type of thing. I sold a desk a few years back that used to have my PC on, and don't want another one. Its good to know PC gaming is still alive and well as its easy to assume consoles are the only form. I just prefer a games unit I can hide away until I need it. :)

I said I agreed with you and your reasons :p

To Mark, that doesn't really make sense though? What do you do when you need to buy something that you're not clued up on? Personally I'll find a friend who knows about it, just like someone who doesn't know about cars will take a knowledgeable friend with them to go and have a look at a car. Plus these days you can just go on forums and tap into them for advice.

Like I said, there's this perceived complexity around PC gaming, that it somehow requires more skill than just normally operating a computer. With steam, all you need to do these days is put your username and password in and it'll automatically install your games for you. I went back to Perth last December, I fancied a game so I downloaded the steam client (no more difficult than installing firefox and everyone on here can do that) and installed my games and was away and playing in no time :) No scratched discs, no need for a collection of discs sitting out, no need to change discs when you want to play a different game.....

Don't get me wrong, I have a 360 which I use to play Forza 3 and 4 and I do like it for racing, but PC gaming is so much less costly than people make out and so much less complicated. I remember when we got our first PC in 1992, gaming was a bloody minefield!

Did you have enough RAM? Was the RAM actually upgradeable? Was your CPU fast enough? Did you have that port in the back for the joystick? Change to disc 2 now. Gawd, it was terrible! Even when we got our second PC back in 1997 it was still pretty poor, did you have the right version of direct x? The PC didn't have an AGP slot and back in those days onboard graphics was truly woeful.

Nowadays games are self patching, Windows update makes sure you're up to date and you can game with stuff that's 3 or 4 years old, case in point, my graphics card is actually just under 5 years old and still absolutely fine for the job. According to my normal upgrade schedule, I'm due a new PC in February, I won't bother with it though and might just get a new graphics card for 150 quid or so.

[Daniel]

Google and Apple fancying a piece of the console pie?

"Game" Consoles Are the Final Key to Digital Domination | Gizmodo UK (http://www.gizmodo.co.uk/2013/06/game-consoles-are-the-final-key-to-digital-domination/)

I can't see either being successful with the size of the fanbase for both the xBox and PS4, but never say never. For me though its a bit like the mobile and tablet market where established competitors are hard to break, or at least take a lot of time to bridge the gap. We'll see. :)

Personally I think Sony or Nintendo could be knocked out of the game if someone did something amazing, but I doubt it will happen. Gaming gives far too much control to the game developers and Apple would never want to be involved in that and the developers would never submit to Apples wishes, they've already got as big an audience in the console business as they could have with Nintendo, Sony and Microsoft, Apple won't create any significant marketshare so I doubt they will enter the fray and if they do I don't see what they'd add, but hey I was wrong with the iPhone and the iPad....

[JasonPotato]

I have only just recently upgraded my PC, probably spent somewhere around £500 minus the old parts i sold. In the end i now have a top gaming spec PC for around the price of what a new next gen console would cost and this would blow them out of the water. I'm not saying building a gaming PC is going to be cheaper as you wont want to settle for cheap components but for what you get out of a PC compared to a console its far superior. I will still want to upgrade at some point to a solid state drive and maybe a newer Graphics card but this is out of choice and wanting to improve performance further. The new Motherboard i have has HDMI so could quite easily plug it into the LED 3D TV i have and use it like a console but it's so big it's not something i would do.

I may sound like i am a PC fanboy but that strictly isnt true as i own both Xbox and PS3 and have owned every single version of both since i was a kid. The PS3 i now use only as a blu-ray player because the games suck and the less said about the controller the better. I much prefer Xbox except the fact it's owned by Microsoft and you have to pay £40 a year to play online. Despite these i have always preferred Xbox and with games like Fifa 14 and GTA V which come out later this year i for one will be keeping it just for these.

I probably will buy the Xbox One but not right away, will let the price come down first as £420 is OTT and get over the initial hype and bugs. I have read that it comes with a blu-ray drive so will most likely get rid of Playstation altogether and just have the Xbox.

[Daniel]

I have only just recently upgraded my PC, probably spent somewhere around £500 minus the old parts i sold. In the end i now have a top gaming spec PC for around the price of what a new next gen console would cost and this would blow them out of the water. I'm not saying building a gaming PC is going to be cheaper as you wont want to settle for cheap components but for what you get out of a PC compared to a console its far superior. I will still want to upgrade at some point to a solid state drive and maybe a newer Graphics card but this is out of choice and wanting to improve performance further. The new Motherboard i have has HDMI so could quite easily plug it into the LED 3D TV i have and use it like a console but it's so big it's not something i would do.

I may sound like i am a PC fanboy but that strictly isnt true as i own both Xbox and PS3 and have owned every single version of both since i was a kid. The PS3 i now use only as a blu-ray player because the games suck and the less said about the controller the better. I much prefer Xbox except the fact it's owned by Microsoft and you have to pay £40 a year to play online. Despite these i have always preferred Xbox and with games like Fifa 14 and GTA V which come out later this year i for one will be keeping it just for these.

I probably will buy the Xbox One but not right away, will let the price come down first as £420 is OTT and get over the initial hype and bugs. I have read that it comes with a blu-ray drive so will most likely get rid of Playstation altogether and just have the Xbox.

Exactly :) SSD's are fantastic, I still have all my games on a traditional spinning drive, but with the OS on an SSD and the games on another hard drive it's still very fast to load games and the OS loads up in a few seconds from a cold boot :)

My graphics card is so old it doesn't even have a HDMI port on it and it still plays games just fine.

[henners88]

Personally I think Sony or Nintendo could be knocked out of the game if someone did something amazing, but I doubt it will happen.
I doubt we'll see any of the major manufacturers losing out in the short term. If Sony are at risk in your opinion, that must also extend to the xBox surely? The PS3 outsold the 360 last time around and that was even with the disadvantage of not having a head start. Sales aren't everything of course but it at least shows the loyalties in a market with only two major players (at the mo). Its not like there are manufacturers making hardware to suit an operating system and the ability to play games in a widespread sense.

Out of interest, why do you think Microsoft are in a safer position with the new release? With their tablet and mobile division struggling, I know they need this to succeed, but the PS4 from what I have read appears to have had the better publicity. That is just my general perception from articles and news pieces I have stumbled across and you may disagree. :)

[JasonPotato]

What you need is the Xbox games, online community/features and Xbox controller on the PS4 console. That would be the perfect console. :)

[henners88]

What you need is the Xbox games, online community/features and Xbox controller on the PS4 console. That would be the perfect console. :)
That wouldn't work for me personally, but for a wider audience perhaps. I much prefer the PlayStation controller and don't tend to play online any more. The controller I find more ergonomically pleasing for my tastes, although I have friends who prefer the xBox version. Each to their own. I've also never had an issue with the games as most of the games I buy are available on both consoles, in fact all of them. :)

[Alfa Fan]

My graphics card is so old it doesn't even have a HDMI port on it and it still plays games just fine.

Well it totally depends what sort of game you play. It certainly wouldn't play any of the newer "PC-focused" titles such as Tomb Raider, Bioshock Infinite, Far Cry 3 or Crysis 3 to any decent standard that's for sure.

[BleAivano]

Well it totally depends what sort of game you play. It certainly wouldn't play any of the newer "PC-focused" titles such as Tomb Raider, Bioshock Infinite, Far Cry 3 or Crysis 3 to any decent standard that's for sure.

sure it would. perhaps not with maxed graphics but it would play,

[CaptainRaiden]

Well it totally depends what sort of game you play. It certainly wouldn't play any of the newer "PC-focused" titles such as Tomb Raider, Bioshock Infinite, Far Cry 3 or Crysis 3 to any decent standard that's for sure.

Agree with Bleaivano there. My card is only slightly newer than Daniel's, a Radeon HD 4870 1 GB DDR5, from late 2008 I believe, has an HDMI port and plays all the games you mentioned fine at around medium to high detail. There is some FPS drop and little choppiness if you go to very high or ultra settings, but that's no worry.

In fact I can play some of them at 1920 X 1080 and 60 hz on my 42 inch TV, which is quite remarkable for a 5 year old card.

[Daniel]

Well it totally depends what sort of game you play. It certainly wouldn't play any of the newer "PC-focused" titles such as Tomb Raider, Bioshock Infinite, Far Cry 3 or Crysis 3 to any decent standard that's for sure.

It'll do anything a 360 or PS3 can do :) £150-200 quid and I'll have something fantastic, but tbh I'm not bothered at the moment.

I got my specs wrong, it's actually a HD4870 512. The memory holds it back a little @ 1920*1200 and with the detail turned up, but I don't have to turn things down as much as you'd think and it still looks better than anything a 360 or PS3 can do :)

[Koz]

I don't remember either PS3 or X360 adverts claiming 1080p. IIRC they claimed 720p from the start. I think both PS4 and Xbone should be able to handle initial games at 1080p least, with both of them going into the teraflops region compared to the gigaflops of their predecessors. Of course, in the coming years upcoming games will be optimized so that their hardware continues to be able to 'handle' them.

Oh dear.

Both have to upscale BF4 (720 on Xbox lol, 900 on ps4). At least the PS4 can run COD without upscaling, Xbox at 720 once again.

Considering PC benchmarks indicate the BF4 is playable at 2560x1600 on 2 year old mid range cards, I find this extremely disappointing.

http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/194xzhq ... iginal.png (http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/194xzhqmp4j3wpng/original.png)

[555-04Q2]

Are the PS4 and the Xbox One really required right now? I mean, there is nothing wrong with the current generation consoles, they are still amazing. I know that the PS3 hasn't even really been fully tested yet by most game developers.

The PS4 and Xbox One should only come out in another 2 years or so as far as I'm concerned, but hey if they wanna release them, so be it. The PS4, as was the case with the PS3, seems to be the better option of the two consoles. I know a lot of people that bought the PS3 just for the Blu-Ray facility and the actual gaming feature as an added extra.

[henners88]

I had a reserve fund for a PS4 saved. I started saving about 18 months ago, a tenner here and there but with finances stretched I've had to give it up. It'll be my 5 year old PS3 for a little while longer. :\

[555-04Q2]

I'm in the fortunate position that I can go out and buy both when they release, but I wont! My current PS3 and Xbox are just fine for now thank you very much :)

[Bezza]

I am currently engrossed on GTA V on my PS3. And I have Assassins Creed IV to play yet, along with COD: Ghosts and FIFA 14...

I don't see the need for the PS4 just yet. I think around April 2014 is when I may invest one. Hopefully though here at work I may win one as they always come up as prizes in promotions we do. If I win an Xbox 720 I'll put it up for sale, not interested in that.

[555-04Q2]

I am currently engrossed on GTA V on my PS3. And I have Assassins Creed IV to play yet, along with COD: Ghosts and FIFA 14...

I don't see the need for the PS4 just yet. I think around April 2014 is when I may invest one. Hopefully though here at work I may win one as they always come up as prizes in promotions we do. If I win an Xbox 720 I'll put it up for sale, not interested in that.

I have to admit that I have been spending a lot more time on my PS3 playing GTA V as well. I've finished the storyline part of the game and now just cruising around and making dosh on the stock exchange. It' s a rather addictive game, worse than San Andreas was for me :D It's such a large map that there are still a good few weeks left until I get bored with it :p:

[Finski]

I am not a fan boy of either and have owned both the 360 and PS3, gave my xbox to a friend and use the ps3, mainly for GT5 and F1. To me it seems the PS4 is overall better, was going to turn away from the Xbox One due to having to have the camera on, always online and no game sharing. Now that they have changed that I will buy the xbox first only for Forza 5 and then get the PS4 soon after.

[Mark]

Are the PS4 and the Xbox One really required right now? I mean, there is nothing wrong with the current generation consoles, they are still amazing. I know that the PS3 hasn't even really been fully tested yet by most game developers.
.

The PS3 was originally released 7 years ago! An absolute age in technological terms. Why shouldn't there be a new version?

[555-04Q2]

Are the PS4 and the Xbox One really required right now? I mean, there is nothing wrong with the current generation consoles, they are still amazing. I know that the PS3 hasn't even really been fully tested yet by most game developers.
.

The PS3 was originally released 7 years ago! An absolute age in technological terms. Why shouldn't there be a new version?

Because the PS3 is still a fantastic console and most game developers have not come close to maxing out it's potential yet! I guess they need hardware sales from the PS4 as current console sales have stagnated recently.

[Mark]

So don't buy a new one I guess. Remember that the XBox One and PS4 are designed to be with us for another 7 years at least, maybe a couple of years down the like your PS3 will be looking older compared to the PS4 then being used to its fullest.

[555-04Q2]

Indeed. I could go out and buy both the new consoles, but I just don't see the point yet. My older ones are doing just fine for now and I'll wait until some decent game titles come out for the new ones before getting them :)

[henners88]

[quote="555-04Q2":1vxa9l3j]Are the PS4 and the Xbox One really required right now? I mean, there is nothing wrong with the current generation consoles, they are still amazing. I know that the PS3 hasn't even really been fully tested yet by most game developers.
.

The PS3 was originally released 7 years ago! An absolute age in technological terms. Why shouldn't there be a new version?

Because the PS3 is still a fantastic console and most game developers have not come close to maxing out it's potential yet! I guess they need hardware sales from the PS4 as current console sales have stagnated recently.[/quote:1vxa9l3j]
Absolutely. The PS3 has had very little in terms of games that truly test its hardware and I hope the PS4 lives up to expectations in terms of games. The launch games don't exactly look mind blowing or a huge leap from what we are used to, so I'm happy I'm not jumping in feet first and buying a first gen console that will probably be plagued with issues anyway. I could have bought one after all with Christmas money, but opted for an iPad instead as I'll get more use out of that in the coming months. I can start saving again and hopefully get a PS4 next summer.

[555-04Q2]

Absolutely. The PS3 has had very little in terms of games that truly test its hardware and I hope the PS4 lives up to expectations in terms of games. The launch games don't exactly look mind blowing or a huge leap from what we are used to, so I'm happy I'm not jumping in feet first and buying a first gen console that will probably be plagued with issues anyway. I could have bought one after all with Christmas money, but opted for an iPad instead as I'll get more use out of that in the coming months. I can start saving again and hopefully get a PS4 next summer.

100% The lack of decent launch titles is mystifying to me? Like you say, let them get the gremlins out the new systems and wait a year or so for decent games to be launched :)

[Mark]

I've read that the XBox One launch titles are similarly disappointing. However I have no intention of buying either so don't listen to me, why am I even here ? :D

[555-04Q2]

why am I even here ? :D

Bloody troll! :p: :D ;)

[schmenke]

...
100% The lack of decent launch titles is mystifying to me? Like you say, let them get the gremlins out the new systems and wait a year or so for decent games to be launched :)

Forza 5 looks good, but I said that about Forza 4 when it was first released and it sucked :p: . Seriously, I went back to playing Forza 3 :mark: .

[555-04Q2]

...
100% The lack of decent launch titles is mystifying to me? Like you say, let them get the gremlins out the new systems and wait a year or so for decent games to be launched :)

Forza 5 looks good, but I said that about Forza 4 when it was first released and it sucked :p: . Seriously, I went back to playing Forza 3 :mark: .

So much for progress :p: A lot of people said the same about GT5. I'm sure a whole swath of new decent titles will come out early next year. For now I'll continue to plug away at "old" games on my old PS3 and Xbox 360 :D

[karim007]

I said earlier, people have already built far superior monster gaming PCs than these next-gen consoles six months before they even release.

[Mark]

I said earlier, people have already built far superior monster gaming PCs than these next-gen consoles six months before they even release.


But how much did they pay for them?