Wales Rally GB 2013

[ilsit]

What do you all think of this? http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/2013/01/16/wales-rally-gb-set-to-move-from-cardiff-to-north-wales-55578-32614710/

[Mintexmemory]

Meh, still going to involve some treks if Epynt is used. As for the range of 'accomodation' available, I can just see Loriaux in a B&B in Rhyl. Someone better tell the hoteliers quick before they book their close season sun holidays!! Deeside ain't no location I ever heard of (Sam L Jackson voice) - Ssssh whisper it - Chester!! (It's almost welsh)

[ilsit]

Meh, still going to involve some treks if Epynt is used. As for the range of 'accomodation' available, I can just see Loriaux in a B&B in Rhyl. Someone better tell the hoteliers quick before they book their close season sun holidays!! Deeside ain't no location I ever heard of (Sam L Jackson voice) - Ssssh whisper it - Chester!! (It's almost welsh)

Deeside is in Wales the last time I checked mate :)

[Mintexmemory]

Deeside is in Wales the last time I checked mate :)

Yes I know like Teeside is in England... but it is an area NOT a location, or did they build Deeside New Town from the wreckage of Connors Quay and Flint when I wasn't looking? ;)

Don't think moving from Cardiff to Conwy will encourage any greater numbers of fans compared to the 2011 event. Still going to need a remote at Builth too, I shouldn't wonder.

[AndyRAC]

No were near radical enough - needs a complete overhaul! And while the Welsh Assembly provide backing, I'm not sure that's possible.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

About time, if this comes off... :)

Masses of rally fans in the Midlands and Northern England will be much more likely to attend if based in N.Wales - me for one. ;)

[Fly_Half]

Personally I can't see the logic in the move - with Clocaenog and Dyfnant out of bounds due to massive windfarm developments there isn't the stage mileage available in the North anymore, so it'll be more or less as you were with regards to stage usage.

Plus Wrexham is a total ****hole.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Set a reminder now - 20:00 27 Jan BBC2 Top Gear - see @krismeeke (https://twitter.com/krismeeke) & @JamesMayTopGear (https://twitter.com/JamesMayTopGear) test a Bentley through Sweet Lamb at Wales Rally GB 2012... :bounce:

[Prisoner Monkeys]

If they do go ahead with it, hopefully they can plan a decent route.

[ste898]

Makes no difference its still in Wales so wont be going till it comes back up North

Roll on the proper RAC Roger Albert Clark

[Prisoner Monkeys]

Maybe, but if it went north. there would be no Clocaenog or Resolfen or the Dyfis or Gartheniog or half a dozen other brilliant stages.

[Fly_Half]

Having now done both the RAC and WRGB, there's no doubt in my mind that the better stages are in Wales.

[MJW]

I just realised it was 1995 that a full status WRC GB had a forest stage outdide Wales. OK '96 was due to rotation not a full WRC status. 1997 out if Cheltenham had the stately homes and silverstone day but all forest stage kilometres were run in Wales. Just to think that as (of last year) the wrc's elder statesmen of Seb Loeb and Petter havent driven a forest stage in GB wrc outside Wales. Looking back at the history books the 1996 entry list is vastly different to now. To think Seb Loeb, who in a short period of time has totally dominated the sport and will probably be classified as the best rally driver ever has only done stages in Wales.

[AndyRAC]

Yes, though is Radnor Wales?

However, he’s missed the delights of’ Killer’ Kielder, Dalby, Langdale, Grizedale, Dalbeattie, Ae, Craik, etc
I would like to see 3 year rotation return – so 3 years in the North, then Midlands, and the South – you’d still have Welsh stages for 6/9 years, apart from the North years. That way the event can be taken around to the public – all it needs is a commercial sponsor.
Sadly, it can’t happen.

[Brynmor Pierce]

Just sitting here in work looking at my address which definitely states 'Deeside', 'Flintshire'...Flintshire being a Welsh county....

From what I gather there are two options for the actual service area, within a stones throw of Toyota's factory....as regards to subjecting the towns hereabouts to abuse, bit harsh really...the closure of massive steelworks absolutely ripped the heart out of the area in the late 70's and it's taken this long to rebuild them...Wrexham too is really trying to pull it's image up.

Yes i'm biased living here but from a logistical point of view. Manchester and Liverpool airports within 45 minutes...large cities (Manchester/Liverpool/Leeds/Birmingham) all within a 2 hour radius, loads of hotels etc....

The good having something like this would do for the area and indeed the N Wales relationship with Welsh assembly cannot be underestimated....that's before you think of the stage possibilities.

Just on a slight tangent...comparisons with the Roger Albert Clark seem somewhat unfair....it's a different event becuase it's classics but it actually uses an almost identical route format. 2 bases with cloverleaf route (repeat stages) and central service...the only difference being the geographical locations in the UK...

[BDunnell]

I would like to see 3 year rotation return – so 3 years in the North, then Midlands, and the South – you’d still have Welsh stages for 6/9 years, apart from the North years. That way the event can be taken around to the public – all it needs is a commercial sponsor.

I believe the Wales-only route is the main reason, even beyond the lack of a top-line British driver, for the decline in interest in the UK. Even the day of spectator stages, derided at the time but which attracted enormous crowds, now seems hugely worthwhile compared to some crappy blast around a stadium.

[MJW]

I believe the Wales-only route is the main reason, even beyond the lack of a top-line British driver, for the decline in interest in the UK. Even the day of spectator stages, derided at the time but which attracted enormous crowds, now seems hugely worthwhile compared to some crappy blast around a stadium.

Different era mate, I am worried about thelong term viability of all motorsports. General public just are not interested. Plus this and previous governments attacks on motoring in general is making youngsters turn away from cars. To blame the demise of interest on the route and the fact there is no British driver takes no account of internet / facebook distraction etc. you try insurining a basic car for a youngster, motoring is being priced out of their reach and they have found alternative interests. When we were st the Mid Wales Rally forum with Ari and DR as guests a quick look around the audience and we were virtually all male 40 to 50 something year olds.

[Brynmor Pierce]

There was a bunch of us in our 20's and 30's down the front of the audience..lol

[BDunnell]

Different era mate, I am worried about thelong term viability of all motorsports. General public just are not interested. Plus this and previous governments attacks on motoring in general is making youngsters turn away from cars. To blame the demise of interest on the route and the fact there is no British driver takes no account of internet / facebook distraction etc. you try insurining a basic car for a youngster, motoring is being priced out of their reach and they have found alternative interests. When we were st the Mid Wales Rally forum with Ari and DR as guests a quick look around the audience and we were virtually all male 40 to 50 something year olds.

Lots of other outdoor events show no overall decline in attendance in spite of these new distractions. I think taking rallying further away from large sections of the attending public was a big mistake.

[Macd]

I'll never consider it Rally GB unless it includes stages outside Wales. Bring back Kielder!

[Kielder]

I'll never consider it Rally GB unless it includes stages outside Wales. Bring back Kielder!

Bring it back!

[AndyRAC]

If any event is BIG enough, then people will come out to watch. That was most obvious during the Olympics. The Goodwood Festival of Speed, Goodwood Revival meeting get massive crowds, and very good media coverage. As recently as last week, the Chris Evans Carfest sold out in hours. As long as anything has the feel of an EVENT, people will turn up.


And that is the problem with RallyGB – To be blunt it’s not an Event. Despite the hard work of many volunteers, it just doesn’t have the look and feel of a big event. In all honesty, it needs major changes – but I’m not sure IMS want to really make them. And what is Wales RallyGB?? Is it the Welsh Rally? The Rally of Wales? You didn’t have to be a Rallyfan to know what the RAC Rally was.

Think back to it’s heyday; it was a minority sport, but every November huge crowds came out to watch the event. TV,Radio, newspapers gave it generous coverage – everything sponsors and Manufacturers want. So why do you change a winning formula??

Put on more casual fan friendly stages (racecources, country house, etc) , sensible ticket prices, entertainment, stores, food, exhibitions, etc Make it a family day out.

The deal between IMS/Welsh Assembly might be good for both parties, but is it good for the event, and the sport?

[big_sw2000]

I'll never consider it Rally GB unless it includes stages outside Wales. Bring back Kielder!


So what would make it Rally GB, if it was just in England. Or on the borders.

Steve

[Mintexmemory]

So what would make it Rally GB, if it was just in England. Or on the borders.

Steve

Either a cross- border event (Wales / England or England / Scotland) or a rotation around GB. Even a stately home day to take the rally from Birmingham or York to a Welsh rally HQ for the forests would be an improvement.
Why not an expanded Circuit of Ireland?

[rallyfiend]

Clearly they need to replace the marketing / management of the event. Because whatever / whoever they have their right now just isn't working.

[big_sw2000]

Either a cross- border event (Wales / England or England / Scotland) or a rotation around GB. Even a stately home day to take the rally from Birmingham or York to a Welsh rally HQ for the forests would be an improvement.
Why not an expanded Circuit of Ireland?

Yep Cheltnham race course. Or even Chester, You got accsess to the statley home stages. And the mid Welsh stages could be used as well.
Cant it run to a 4 day format similar to Monte. 2 Days up north. Then a long drive down south, with the odd speccy stage. Then a day in Wales to finish.

Steve

[BDunnell]

If any event is BIG enough, then people will come out to watch. That was most obvious during the Olympics. The Goodwood Festival of Speed, Goodwood Revival meeting get massive crowds, and very good media coverage. As recently as last week, the Chris Evans Carfest sold out in hours. As long as anything has the feel of an EVENT, people will turn up.


And that is the problem with RallyGB – To be blunt it’s not an Event. Despite the hard work of many volunteers, it just doesn’t have the look and feel of a big event.

I don't necessarily think being a big event is sufficient on its own. Some big events (and I'm not just talking motorsport here) can also struggle. Rather, it has to be the right sort of big event. In the past, the old RAC Rally was just that, and I think you're right in that this, in large part, was because of its sheer reach.


And what is Wales RallyGB?? Is it the Welsh Rally? The Rally of Wales? You didn’t have to be a Rallyfan to know what the RAC Rally was.

It's much less of a test, in my eyes, than was the old Welsh International Rally!

You're certainly right about Rally GB having no public profile. The RAC Rally came up when talking to friends in the pub the other week, funnily enough. One, not interested in motorsport, said: 'It used to go all over the country, didn't it?' To me, that rather proved a point.



Think back to it’s heyday; it was a minority sport, but every November huge crowds came out to watch the event. TV,Radio, newspapers gave it generous coverage – everything sponsors and Manufacturers want. So why do you change a winning formula??

And, for much of that time, the possibility of a British driver winning was, in all honesty, pretty remote. So, that's one argument for the current slump in interest out of the window. Rather, it was a proper national event, and rallying then was in the wider public consciousness. People tuning in to the likes of 'World of Sport' and 'Grandstand' saw the sport on a regular basis. British championship rallies, too, achieved crowds much bigger than anything we've seen for over a decade now, because they were worth seeing. Today, rallying is all but invisible in Britain.



Put on more casual fan friendly stages (racecources, country house, etc) , sensible ticket prices, entertainment, stores, food, exhibitions, etc Make it a family day out.

This is all very sensible. And, crucially, the event needs to have a wider reach. What is the current catchment area for Rally GB? Pretty small, I'd wager, excluding the die-hard rally enthusiasts. That certainly wasn't the case when Sutton Park was packed out every November.

[Mintexmemory]

Decided to tootle around on Google Maps this afternoon.
Cheltenham Race Course
Longleat
Blenheim
Banbury test track
Silverstone
Sutton Park
Bewdley
Trentham Gardens
Then off to North Wales

I'd go !!

[BDunnell]

Decided to tootle around on Google Maps this afternoon.
Cheltenham Race Course
Longleat
Blenheim
Banbury test track
Silverstone
Sutton Park
Bewdley
Trentham Gardens
Then off to North Wales

I'd go !!

I'd go for a start in Chester, followed by:

Knowsley
Chatsworth
Clumber Park
Donington
Sutton Park
Weston Park
Trentham Gardens

And on into Wales.

[Prisoner Monkeys]

I'll never consider it Rally GB unless it includes stages outside Wales. Bring back Kielder!
I suppose that might be possible if the start of this year's rally is moved to the north. If Kielder is within a reasonable distance of the new base, it might be possible.

[Mintexmemory]

I suppose that might be possible if the start of this year's rally is moved to the north. If Kielder is within a reasonable distance of the new base, it might be possible.

'Reasonable Distance' - Kielder in GB terms could never be described as that except from Wark! (use the map). Still a significant drive from Newcastle and hours from places like Chester. Only possible to include in modern terms if the whole rally is based at York, Newcastle or Edinburgh (C'mon Salmond do something innovative for once in your miserable sassenach-bashing existence).

[Brynmor Pierce]

I'd go for a start in Chester, followed by:

Knowsley
Chatsworth
Clumber Park
Donington
Sutton Park
Weston Park
Trentham Gardens

And on into Wales.

Urmmm people do realise Wrexham is only 18 miles form Chester don't they?...you could actually have spectator stages within Wales as there are several country estates quite capable of holding them. Until another area funds it, it's going to be in Wales we can't change that sorry

[AndyRAC]

Another area funding it is just going to bring the same issues. Why can’t a few regions combine to fund a real event? The whole funding/ organisation of the event needs looking at. In an ideal world, the event would have a major commercial sponsor ....

[go mads]

when are people going to realise that without sponsorship from wales there will not and would not of been a wrc round for years in the uk.what on earth would wales get out of having spectator stages in england and stages in northern england/scotland.i feel that rally fans in this country (gb) should grow up and get on with it! gb does not have a god given right to a round and if it keeps getting poor turnouts then i fear wales will pull the plug and we will be left with nothing.while i respect everybodies personel views i cant see how watching 50 odd 40 year old cars being driven by amatuers(rac) can be compared to watching the worlds fastest drivers in the worlds fastest rally cars(rallygb). while you can get out most weekends to watch escorts being chucked around the forest (which i do by the way) the wrc comes once a year so lets not knock it. by the way i am by no means saying the event is perfect (ie pricing,advertising etc) but it is still better than the uk not having a round at all!

[BDunnell]

when are people going to realise that without sponsorship from wales there will not and would not of been a wrc round for years in the uk.what on earth would wales get out of having spectator stages in england and stages in northern england/scotland.

That's precisely the point. This should, ideally, not just be a Welsh event.


i feel that rally fans in this country (gb) should grow up and get on with it!

The fact that it wouldn't have taken place without the support of Wales is no reason not to say that it's become a crap event. Which, in my opinion, it has.


gb does not have a god given right to a round and if it keeps getting poor turnouts then i fear wales will pull the plug and we will be left with nothing.

And whose fault would that be?


while i respect everybodies personel views i cant see how watching 50 odd 40 year old cars being driven by amatuers(rac) can be compared to watching the worlds fastest drivers in the worlds fastest rally cars(rallygb). while you can get out most weekends to watch escorts being chucked around the forest (which i do by the way) the wrc comes once a year so lets not knock it.

If you respect everyone else's opinion so much, why do you then in the same breath say that no-one should criticise Rally GB?


by the way i am by no means saying the event is perfect (ie pricing,advertising etc) but it is still better than the uk not having a round at all!

To me, the UK may as well not have a round at all, for all I care about its current incarnation. Worse, in this format it is sure never to generate any sort of wider interest.

[rallyfiend]

I personally believe that the fact that IMS / MSA has been able to pull so much profit from the event on the back of the Welsh Government cash means that the event has been run in to the ground.

As such, there's nothing left for them to offer any other region, so no one else wants it.

This is a management issue.

[go mads]

bdunnell, if you dont care about it why read the thread and why make posts?

[big_sw2000]

That's precisely the point. This should, ideally, not just be a Welsh event.



.

Why not. Wales is part of the UK. It also has some of the best stages in the country.
Rally Spain , Germany, or any other event, are not spread nation wide. There not even spread of an area the size of GB. So why should Rally GB be spread nation wide. Or move, just because people up north dont like it in Wales.
Good help people that live in the wrong part of Germany, or France, and have to travel.
The days of nation wide RAC have gone. Yes i know its a pity. In my eyes, the essance of the sport died then.
But people should just grow up. Rally GB is still a great event, when you can be botherd to get off your ass and get in to the forests.

Steve

[BDunnell]

bdunnell, if you dont care about it why read the thread and why make posts?

Because I do care about it, inasmuch as I wish to see the British round return to something approaching its former glories. I would have thought this obvious.

[BDunnell]

Why not. Wales is part of the UK. It also has some of the best stages in the country.
Rally Spain , Germany, or any other event, are not spread nation wide.

I think all the short routes of today's WRC have not only diluted the sport unduly, but are also deeply counterproductive in terms of reducing the public's ability to watch the events.



But people should just grow up. Rally GB is still a great event, when you can be botherd to get off your ass and get in to the forests.

In order to encourage people to do that, the sport needs to be in their consciousness; they have to want, for some reason, to do it. So long as Rally GB remains Wales-only, its appeal will be strictly limited. No way can it grow beyond its current niche status.

[big_sw2000]

I think all the short routes of today's WRC have not only diluted the sport unduly, but are also deeply counterproductive in terms of reducing the public's ability to watch the events.



.
I accutally cant agree with you any more on that point.

But what im saing is. Once your in the trees, its still the same event. Best cars, being driven by the best drivers.

Steve

[BDunnell]

I accutally cant agree with you any more on that point.

But what im saing is. Once your in the trees, its still the same event. Best cars, being driven by the best drivers.

Steve

Point taken. However, if the event is to grow again, this simply isn't enough.

[AndyRAC]

The speed and commitment of the top drivers is awesome - and that is why I continue to go. However, high ticket prices, poor promotion, etc have slowly sunk the event.

People need to look at the bigger picture - the event can't survive relying on the 'hard core' supporters. The event HAS to change. The casual fan has to be catered for. It has to be something the media want to cover again, sponsors want to be involved with.
Manufacturers are in it to sell more cars - and therefore as wide a number of people need to be connected with he event.

The lack of TV coverage of the WRC isn't entirely unconnected; low viewing figures as people aren't interested/ or don't know about the sport. Which is why the British WRC round has to reconnect with Joe Public.

[BDunnell]

Let's turn part of this discussion on its head. For which reasons would people argue the RAC Rally in its old form was so popular with the public? I've already offered my view on the subject.

[MJW]

Wow, its still january and there is a WRGB thread if 3 pages, by the time the rally comes it could have the record number if pages for a wrc rally ;-)

[Franky]

However, high ticket prices, poor promotion, etc have slowly sunk the event.


Had an idea to attend the rally last year but when I found out the ticket price. I'd rather attend two mainland European events than pay that sum. The ticket price is seriously mad, in my opinion.

[MJW]

Had an idea to attend the rally last year but when I found out the ticket price. I'd rather attend two mainland European events than pay that sum. The ticket price is seriously mad, in my opinion.

Totally agree, ticket prices is just ridiculous, IF the admission charges are reasonable we will then see people come back to watch.

[big_sw2000]

The RAC, was something special. Chasing the cars all round the countrie. Paying £5 to park the car. There was just something romantic, special about the event. Obviously will never happen again.

But if the current event, held in Wales on some of the best stages in the country, with the best drivers in the world, had some advertising. Then maybe more people will go.
I live 35 mile from Cardiff. 25 mile from the closest forest stage. 15 mile from Celtic Manor. If i had not been a rally nut, then there was no way i would know the event was on. My dad marshelled in his day, and still had to ask me, right up to the event. What date it was.
Promotion = 0, nothing.
And then when someone casual fan dose manage to hear about it, and decides to go. Hes hit with a minimum price of £25 per person ticket.

I love the event, and will always go, where ever it is in the country, but lets be honest, its a rip off.

Steve

[Brynmor Pierce]

The biggest issued with WRGB is promotion....that is engagement of both local clubs/business and the casual observer. I won't go into vast detail as there are matters for discussion at relevant meetings but the engagement of local clubs as a start needs to vastly improve. The advertising even to the extent of roadside signs etc needs to step up, (approaching Llandudno last year there was nothing)....there needs to be a desire to turn the rally into an 'event'...not just another rally.
I act as Clerk of the course on our clubs rally and firmly believe that we're running an 'event' and not just a rally...

Ticket pricing needs looking at, the comparison to other world class events doesn't wash really....

One area that needs improving is a move back to the old pre-rally forums etc...back in the 90's when the event was in Chester...the week before most Main dealer showrooms had some kind of forum/rally related evening then of course Ford used to run the big rally forums also...it needs that engagement again. I actually think running Thursday to Sunday doesn't help and it should be Saturday to Monday...Monday being fairly quiet newswise and Tuesday morning papers always being very empty...

Simple things really and just a change in thinking..

[driveace]

Who goes to watch Wales Rally GB now ? I honestly think the only people that go are from Wales,and I understand the guy who says without sponsorship from the Welsh Tourist Board,we may not have WRC round in the UK.BUT what about the guys from up north ,and Scotland,who wish to see a good rally without travelling 300 miles? What these guys usually do is go to the McRea stages or the Roger Albert,yes its a lot of old cars Escort ,Chevettes Kadettes,etc but these guys are out to win and enjoy themselves.OK they dont get to see Loeb,or Solberg,or Hirvonen etc but in the old RAC days the good drivers ran into the 20s,not the first 6 or 8.In my opinion if its the GB rally it should be all of the Mainland of GB,not just a small corner.And without coverage in the media or on TV the WRC will die !

[go mads]

People need to realise that no wrc events currently tour the whole of any country, the rally of Italy is usually held on Sardinia for example. I bet the people complaining about low attendances were the ones moaning "in the good old days" about traffic jams, long walks stages being cancelled because of overcrowding.I do agree though the sport needs spectators , but this just needs to be addressed by cheaper admission and greater promotion.but moving from one area to another want make any difference.imo the Welsh stages are the best and if any of you guys haven't been for a while you really are missing out.

[big_sw2000]

Who goes to watch Wales Rally GB now ? I honestly think the only people that go are from Wales,and I understand the guy who says without sponsorship from the Welsh Tourist Board,we may not have WRC round in the UK.BUT what about the guys from up north ,and Scotland,who wish to see a good rally without travelling 300 miles? What these guys usually do is go to the McRea stages or the Roger Albert,yes its a lot of old cars Escort ,Chevettes Kadettes,etc but these guys are out to win and enjoy themselves.OK they dont get to see Loeb,or Solberg,or Hirvonen etc but in the old RAC days the good drivers ran into the 20s,not the first 6 or 8.In my opinion if its the GB rally it should be all of the Mainland of GB,not just a small corner.And without coverage in the media or on TV the WRC will die !


Bujt why is it only the brits that moan about travling to watch a rally. As i said earlier, if you lived in the wrong part of Spain, France Germany, or any other country that holds a WRC event. You have much further to travel to go spectate. Whats wrong with travling down from the Boarders to Wales.
I know if the event moved to Kielder, i would not hesitate in travling from South Wales.

Steve

[BDunnell]

People need to realise that no wrc events currently tour the whole of any country, the rally of Italy is usually held on Sardinia for example. I bet the people complaining about low attendances were the ones moaning "in the good old days" about traffic jams, long walks stages being cancelled because of overcrowding.I do agree though the sport needs spectators , but this just needs to be addressed by cheaper admission and greater promotion.but moving from one area to another want make any difference.imo the Welsh stages are the best and if any of you guys haven't been for a while you really are missing out.

Again, I say you're rather missing the point. No-one is saying the old RAC covered the whole of Britain, but at least it covered more of it than a small corner of Wales. Yes, the Welsh stages are superb, but clearly the event isn't attractive enough as it is, and I feel this is for reasons beyond lack of advertising and expensive ticket prices. Rally GB will never expand its spectator catchment while rallying remains a niche sport, and while its route is so restricted. People won't just go and see it because the stages are good — that isn't enough to attract more than a small band of die-hard enthusiasts.

[big_sw2000]

Ok, for those who live up north.
What are the reasons for not travling to Wales to spectate.
Is it just price.
Lack of advertising, (Rally fans still know its on)
You dont like us Welsh. We are nice people. Unless it comes to rugby.

Serious though, what reasons is there for not travling down, to watch, the best drivers in the world, on fantastic stages.

Steve

[BDunnell]

Ok, for those who live up north.
What are the reasons for not travling to Wales to spectate.
Is it just price.
Lack of advertising, (Rally fans still know its on)
You dont like us Welsh. We are nice people. Unless it comes to rugby.

Serious though, what reasons is there for not travling down, to watch, the best drivers in the world, on fantastic stages.

The whole thing simply doesn't interest me in its current format. Several of driveace's comments above ring very true with me, especially those regarding the lack of depth in the entry.

[big_sw2000]

The whole thing simply doesn't interest me in its current format. Several of driveace's comments above ring very true with me, especially those regarding the lack of depth in the entry.
But would you go if it was 3 days in Kielder. Or 3 days around the lake district. Or dose the rally all together not intrest you in its current format. Just wondering, as i see we are a similar age. And other than paying silly money, i enjoy my Rally GB.

Steve

[BDunnell]

But would you go if it was 3 days in Kielder. Or 3 days around the lake district. Or dose the rally all together not intrest you in its current format.

The latter, more than anything, coupled with what I think is a lack of strength in depth and variety in modern entry lists.

I wouldn't especially want to go if the event spent three days anywhere, either. It needs to get around more. Impossible currently to envisage, I know, but it's what's needed if the rally is again to grow.

[Mintexmemory]

Have to diverge from BD's view here. I love watching the top guys on the limit (sorry if anyone has heard this before) and want to witness the spectacle whether it's on tarmac or gravel. However, when I can go and watch Rally Italia for the same money as I'd spend on WRGB then it's all about the disposable income bang for your buck. Didn't bother in September 2012 as Goodwood Revival is always going to win out but got my fix of 5 days in Spain for 270 quid (TOTAL!). Additionally, it is actually easier for me to travel to Spain than Wales.
Regarding no other country having the round country route - Valence to Monaco is quite a distance with all the competitve mileage in France and then the lucky salopards get another dose in Alsace! -Both events free to view!

[catty]

Have to diverge from BD's view here. I love watching the top guys on the limit (sorry if anyone has heard this before) and want to witness the spectacle whether it's on tarmac or gravel. However, when I can go and watch Rally Italia for the same money as I'd spend on WRGB then it's all about the disposable income bang for your buck. Didn't bother in September 2012 as Goodwood Revival is always going to win out but got my fix of 5 days in Spain for 270 quid (TOTAL!). Additionally, it is actually easier for me to travel to Spain than Wales.
Regarding no other country having the round country route - Valence to Monaco is quite a distance with all the competitve mileage in France and then the lucky salopards get another dose in Alsace! -Both events free to view!
Cardiff to Llandudno isnt a short journey either.
Yes it would be great if Rally GB took in Kielder and Yorkshire and the like but the current route takes in some of the worlds best stages and anyway its not like Portugal, Spain, Trier (sorry Germany) or France tour the whole country either is it?

[BDunnell]

Cardiff to Llandudno isnt a short journey either.
Yes it would be great if Rally GB took in Kielder and Yorkshire and the like but the current route takes in some of the worlds best stages and anyway its not like Portugal, Spain, Trier (sorry Germany) or France tour the whole country either is it?

Again, I say that the old RAC never covered the whole country, and that short routes are symptomatic more generally of a malaise in modern rallying.

[big_sw2000]

Again, I say that the old RAC never covered the whole country, and that short routes are symptomatic more generally of a malaise in modern rallying.

You genally had Kielder, and Wales, with in between on the same event. Thats the whole country in rally terms.
In fact in the Network Q days, with the Cheltnham start. You had the statley homes, then 3 days in Wales. And that worked. People traveld down from up north, so what was the diffrance, other than the rip of price these days.
Steve

[wwbroe]

Last round of the championship, Rally Wales, is leaving Cardiff and moving to Wrexham.

Source: Wales Rally GB verlässt Cardiff*:: rallye-magazin.de (http://www.rallye-magazin.de/rallyes/wm/nachrichten/news-detail/d/2013/02/07/wales-rally-gb-verlaesst-cardiff/index.html)

[Mintexmemory]

Last round of the championship, Rally Wales, is leaving Cardiff and moving to Wrexham.

Source: Wales Rally GB verlässt Cardiff*:: rallye-magazin.de (http://www.rallye-magazin.de/rallyes/wm/nachrichten/news-detail/d/2013/02/07/wales-rally-gb-verlaesst-cardiff/index.html)

This is just a bit of lazy journalism re-treading the newspaper story that is the first post in this thread. As Fly Half said, in more basic welsh, - Wrexham is not a very nice place!! I'll believe a start and finish in Llandudno when I see it!

[matt91]

Just read through this thread then and i have to agree with the reason why it's going down the pan a bit, ticket prices are crazy i can only afford to make it to a few stages due to the price of tickets. i live 5 miles away from cardiff and i've never seen a single bit of promotion or something advertising the event not even a week before it starts. I feel like the wrc is dying off a bit it's not been the same since they've gone down to being 1.6's to many restrictions and not enough promotion is destroy the sport i love and grow up watching.

[rjbetty]

Just read through this thread then and i have to agree with the reason why it's going down the pan a bit, ticket prices are crazy i can only afford to make it to a few stages due to the price of tickets. i live 5 miles away from cardiff and i've never seen a single bit of promotion or something advertising the event not even a week before it starts. I feel like the wrc is dying off a bit it's not been the same since they've gone down to being 1.6's to many restrictions and not enough promotion is destroy the sport i love and grow up watching.

I have to say I pretty much agree with this. I think the new cars are a real step down for the WRC. I hope they are proving cheaper cos I feel the WRC isn't really the WRC so much anymore with the 1.6 cars. It doesn't help that the WRC suffers from a lack of truly top drivers, unlike F1. It's funny how a decade or so ago it was the other way round. The WRC had a massive glut of champions and winners and F1 only had a few (one?) truly creme de la creme driver.

I'll also bring up the topic of Superrally again. Dear FIA, I respectfully ask that you bin it as soon as and allow 3 cars to be nominated for points - for those teams who wish to do so.