BBC2 Racing Legends - Colin McRae - 28/12/12

[whereschris]

Just in case this has been missed on here - I can't find it anywhere.

As it says in the title, BBC doc this Friday presented by Chris Hoy and about Colin McRae. It's part of a series featuring other drivers such as Stirling Moss.

Hope it's good.

[BDunnell]

Racing?

[EightGear]

Since it is a series of 3 documentaries (Moss, Steward and McRae)of whom Colin is the only rally driver, yes.

[Jack4688`]

It hasn't appeared in the TV listings for a while now. Tomorrow (Friday 28th) is the Jackie Stewart one but there is no Colin McRae the day after. Anybody know where it's disappeared to?

[wedge]

I'll watch it even though I've lost some respect for him.

Apologies for trolling but thinking about that accident makes my blood boil even though he was a fantastic driver.

[HaCo]

Thanks for sharing, just programmed this on my digicorder. :D

[dupanton]

According the BBC website, it will be Jacky Stewart tonight. Colin McRae will be on the television "soon"....

[gravelman]

I wonder is it due to the varied feelings surrounding mcraes death why there has been no confirmed time of broadcast. Perhaps families of those lost in the tragedy have objected to its content etc

[bubbaontour]

Im so pissed off.. this is the one program i have been looking forward to all chrismass. Just sat down to watch in and its f**king jackie stewart... I couldn't give a **** about F1. We were up at sweet lamb testing with Danni for spain when they were filming it. Criss Hoy and Jimmy were sliding round the yard in Collins old red sunbeam TI.. Was talking to them about it and have looked forward to it ever since..

Have just made a complaint to the bbc, i surgest everyone does.

And before anyone starts squeaking about controversial deaths, where do you want me to start....

[gravelman]

Just for the record, in case that last post was aimed at me, I have been looking forward to seeing this show too, Colin was and is a huge hero of mine, all I was doing was speculating as to why it has been delayed again.
So if that was aimed at me, please cool the jets

[bubbaontour]

Wasn't aimed at you, hadn't even read your post. just pissed off. I have mixed feelings about it all. I have worked at prodrive for a long time now. I loved Colin, he was great bloke to work with and yes he was a childhood hero. Its a tragedy what happened.

[dupanton]

They will broadcast it later, no panic...

[gravelman]

They will broadcast it later, no panic...
Good.......good

[Humber]

His widow Alison has set up a charity.
Alison McRae says Colin (http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/scottishnews/2831710/Alison-McRae-says-Colins-death-was-a-huge-loss-to-bear.html)

[BDunnell]

I wonder is it due to the varied feelings surrounding mcraes death why there has been no confirmed time of broadcast. Perhaps families of those lost in the tragedy have objected to its content etc

Well, it was still listed in the Christmas issue of the 'Radio Times', so it must have been a fairly late decision not to broadcast it.

[BDunnell]

I'll watch it even though I've lost some respect for him.

Apologies for trolling but thinking about that accident makes my blood boil even though he was a fantastic driver.

I don't think you're trolling at all. It's a perfectly reasonable point of view to have.

[Jack4688`]

They will broadcast it later, no panic...

Is that fact or speculation?

[dupanton]

Is that fact or speculation?

According to the BBC website, a fact ;)

[Jack4688`]

Oooo goodie :D

"There will be 3 episodes. More information coming soon" - BBC Website

[Mintexmemory]

Clearly in the wake of there recent stack of faux pas the BBC has got jittery about showing this at Christmas time, expect it around February.

[BDunnell]

Clearly in the wake of there recent stack of faux pas the BBC has got jittery about showing this at Christmas time, expect it around February.

I really can't imagine why.

[Mintexmemory]

I really can't imagine why.

Excellent dry riposte, happy New Year to you BD

[BDunnell]

Excellent dry riposte, happy New Year to you BD

Happy new year to you too! It genuinely wasn't meant to be a dry riposte, though — I can see no reason at all for the programme to be delayed, even given the BBC's absurd over-sensitivity these days.

[bt52b]

Happy new year to you too! It genuinely wasn't meant to be a dry riposte, though — I can see no reason at all for the programme to be delayed, even given the BBC's absurd over-sensitivity these days.

Might be waiting for Hoy to come back from Australia

[gravelman]

There's clearly something at play in the backround about ths, I read somewhere else something to do with contractual issues. Would be a great shame if it doesn't make it to our screens.

[BDunnell]

There's clearly something at play in the backround about ths, I read somewhere else something to do with contractual issues. Would be a great shame if it doesn't make it to our screens.

Indeed, one can only imagine it's a legal matter of some description.

[DaveTi]

Morning Gents,
Just joined this forum because you guys are chatting about this programme. The Sunbeam that you will see is actually my old stager. I got approached by a very conveluted route as the BBC were after a Red Ti. Had to be an original Ti. Before you ask it is an original Ti, I got it about 20years ago from the 'original lady owner'.
If you guys are hacked off imagine how I feel. The B' are not very forthcoming with any information. It cost me a bomb to re-commission this car as I am building another Sunbeam (TiMotorsport Sunbeam thread).
Really fancied the Old Girl being a TV star LOL (maybe for 6or7minutes). Dave Gough at TiMotorsport stopped work on my new car and focussed on getting the old girl back in shape. Look at Dave's webb site under workshop (page 2) to see what we had to do.
Have a look and see what you guys think. I am emailing my contact at the B' & hassling for some feedback.
DaveTi
Ps Danni & Co were more interested in the car and driving it than the B'

[Langdale Forest]

Clearly in the wake of there recent stack of faux pas the BBC has got jittery about showing this at Christmas time, expect it around February.


I cannot see any reasons, but I expect the extreme PC BBC would have a reason to say that it is innapropiate..

[BDunnell]

I cannot see any reasons, but I expect the extreme PC BBC would have a reason to say that it is innapropiate..

What does that mean?

[Mark]

A bit of speculation here:
BBC withdraws McRae tribute programme | World Rally Fever (http://worldrallyfever.wordpress.com/2012/12/30/bbc-withdraws-mcrae-tribute-programme/)
But it makes the point that given the current climate around child protection, and the fact that two children died by McRae's actions, it's quite likely some in the BBC thought it inappropriate to be broadcasting a tribute to him.

[bt52b]

A bit of speculation here:
BBC withdraws McRae tribute programme | World Rally Fever (http://worldrallyfever.wordpress.com/2012/12/30/bbc-withdraws-mcrae-tribute-programme/)
But it makes the point that given the current climate around child protection, and the fact that two children died by McRae's actions, it's quite likely some in the BBC thought it inappropriate to be broadcasting a tribute to him.

Pretty nasty idle speculation

[Russ]

I cannot see what problem the BBC have with the Colin McRae tribute. If they go on like this we will never get any programmes about our heros at all, there will always be something in their profile that could upset someone, somewhare.
Another of my heros was Graham Hill, but he was flying the plane that crashed and killed several of his team, will he be wiped from the BBC playlist as well?

[Mintexmemory]

I cannot see what problem the BBC have with the Colin McRae tribute. If they go on like this we will never get any programmes about our heros at all, there will always be something in their profile that could upset someone, somewhare.
Another of my heros was Graham Hill, but he was flying the plane that crashed and killed several of his team, will he be wiped from the BBC playlist as well?

Fundamental difference Hill was legally licenced but had failed to insure himself adequately. He crashed while attempting to land in fog at an airfield that has a history of such incidents.
All his passengers were consenting adults.
Without being too detailed McRae was flying illegally and executing hazardous manoeuvres at low level. Children were killed - something the BBC felt that would leave them open to criticism, especially at Christmas time.

[EightGear]

I can't help but feel this whole 'issue' is typically British... Being too cautious on every possible subject that may upset some viewers.

[dupanton]

I dont understand it neither... They dont even have to talk about the crash. It is a tribute to his career, not a documentary on the crash...

[Mintexmemory]

I dont understand it neither... They dont even have to talk about the crash. It is a tribute to his career, not a documentary on the crash...
You are right it is typically British. The BBC must under its charter always balance the facts they present. This means no tributes to heroes without showing the down side. Clearly the original production was open to criticism in this regard and that is something the BBC needs like a hole in the head at this time!
So actually they do have to mention the crash to ensure 'balance' or else commission a programme just about the crash!

[BDunnell]

Fundamental difference Hill was legally licenced but had failed to insure himself adequately. He crashed while attempting to land in fog at an airfield that has a history of such incidents.
All his passengers were consenting adults.
Without being too detailed McRae was flying illegally and executing hazardous manoeuvres at low level. Children were killed - something the BBC felt that would leave them open to criticism, especially at Christmas time.

In fact, Hill didn't have a valid US pilot's licence, required for him to fly a US-registered aircraft, at the time of the crash. Nor did he have a valid instrument flying qualification, required for him to fly in the conditions experienced on the night of the accident. And the aircraft was officially unregistered at the time, it having been removed from the US registry but not transferred to another one. Whether or not his passengers were consenting adults, and even considering the fact that humans will always make mistakes of judgment, Hill, like McRae, was deeply foolish in his actions.

[stefanvv]

McRae has been always inclined little too much for risk, in his Racing career, but also his life. That made him one of the greatest drivers and we all Rally fans here in the forum admire that. But the risks he takes wouldn't be understood by many. But this was what he was after all, with all pros and cons. Nobody's perfect that's for sure. BBC are probably right not to broadcast the "contradictory" film.

[Langdale Forest]

Why are the BBC so over-sensitive about broardcasting a documemtary? It dosen't even have to go into detail about the helicopter accident.

[Jack4688`]

Doesn't it? We would know if they aired it

[makinen_fan]

@mexav
Good to see that the Colin McRae Motorsport Legend Show with @chrishoy and Jimmy McRae is now on on Sunday the 27th January. #McRae #Legend


Not sure how accurate is this info

[ilsit]

Its true listed on the BBC website for the Racing Legends series.

[Barreis]

Irally says it also.

[Langdale Forest]

Radio Times says that it is on 27-01-2013 at 22:00.

[Formaldehyde]

Hi. Since we are talking about McRae here, can someone please refresh my memory? Yesterday I recalled a memorable McRae episode, but I cannot remember in which rally/year it occurred. Colin and Carlos Sainz were teammates at Subaru. If I'm not mistaken, they were tied in the driver's championship, but Carlos had the "No. 1 driver" status. Colin was leading the rally, but since Carlos was supposed to be No.1, Subaru wanted him to slow down and let Carlos pass. Which was absolute BS of course, since they were both tied in the championship. They first asked Colin to slow down on the radio, but he ignored. Then, if I recall correctly, at some point there was even someone from the Subaru crew holding a sign on the stage, saying "Colin, slow down!" or something similar. Of course, Colin was having none of it and flew past the guy holding the sign like a mad man. If I recall correctly, he ended up winning the rally and possibly the championship. This must have been 94-95. Does anyone remember which rally was it? I would like to rewatch the highlights because this is certainly my favorite Colin moment of all time.

Thanks!

[EightGear]

Catalunya '95.

[Kielder]

@Formaldehyde, that's not the whole story. Here you can understand it perfectly. I couldn't explain it better:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSrpYBt4A0Q

[Mark]

Hi. Since we are talking about McRae here, can someone please refresh my memory? Yesterday I recalled a memorable McRae episode, but I cannot remember in which rally/year it occurred. Colin and Carlos Sainz were teammates at Subaru. If I'm not mistaken, they were tied in the driver's championship, but Carlos had the "No. 1 driver" status. Colin was leading the rally, but since Carlos was supposed to be No.1, Subaru wanted him to slow down and let Carlos pass. Which was absolute BS of course, since they were both tied in the championship. They first asked Colin to slow down on the radio, but he ignored. Then, if I recall correctly, at some point there was even someone from the Subaru crew holding a sign on the stage, saying "Colin, slow down!" or something similar. Of course, Colin was having none of it and flew past the guy holding the sign like a mad man. If I recall correctly, he ended up winning the rally and possibly the championship. This must have been 94-95. Does anyone remember which rally was it? I would like to rewatch the highlights because this is certainly my favorite Colin moment of all time.

Thanks!

IIRC it was because they wanted Carlos to win in his home rally. They weren't tied in the championship at the time, Colin was ahead, but Sainz did in fact win the rally in Catalunya to tie the 1995 championship. This set up a tie in the championship so it was winner takes all on the RAC. Of course McRae went onto win the rally by miles and the championship with it.

1995; when rallying was at it's peak, IMO :)

[greencroft]

IIRC it was because they wanted Carlos to win in his home rally. They weren't tied in the championship at the time, Colin was ahead, but Sainz did in fact win the rally in Catalunya to tie the 1995 championship. This set up a tie in the championship so it was winner takes all on the RAC. Of course McRae went onto win the rally by miles and the championship with it.

1995; when rallying was at it's peak, IMO :)

When questioned before the RAC "What's your strategy for this rally, Colin?", he gave the great response, "Simple, I am going to win the championship and he's [Carlos] not".

I think there may have been an extra word between "the" and "championship" though which indicated what he thought of the question!

[big_sw2000]

IIRC it was because they wanted Carlos to win in his home rally. They weren't tied in the championship at the time, Colin was ahead, but Sainz did in fact win the rally in Catalunya to tie the 1995 championship. This set up a tie in the championship so it was winner takes all on the RAC. Of course McRae went onto win the rally by miles and the championship with it.

1995; when rallying was at it's peak, IMO :)

McRea won Catalunya on the road, but was made to take a time penalty, handing the win to Sainz.

Steve

[Kielder]

McRea won Catalunya on the road, but was made to take a time penalty, handing the win to Sainz.

Steve

First of all, McRae was the most amazing driver I've ever seen live, but...
Do you think too that the car with the number plate "L 555 REP" was as fast as the "L 555 BAT"?
Saying it another way: Do you think too that McRae won the RAC 95 on the road?

[stefanvv]

It's all on the video. This wasn't that nice action from him, not a team player.

[Sladden]

It's all on the video. This wasn't that nice action from him, not a team player.
Any Young hungry driver fighting for the Championship title will be angry at that Point.

[stefanvv]

Any Young hungry driver fighting for the Championship title will be angry at that Point.

Yes, but looks like he decided this on his own, the team is not aware, so Sainz is doing his part of the deal, McRae - not.

[EightGear]

Reminder: It's on tonight in just over 2,5 hours time.

[Kielder]

First reacts: BBC Colin McRae TV programme touches fans (http://www.irallylive.com/ir_news.htm?00002984&10)

http://www.ralsys.com/irally_admin/news_images/2013HoyJimmyMcRae39.jpg

[zormm]

didnt expect chris hoy to handle a car so well

[bennizw]

Anybody know if this show can be downloaded or seen on stream outside the UK?

[Kielder]

For those who are in the UK and want to watch it again: BBC iPlayer - Racing Legends: Colin McRae (http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01pqd7t/Racing_Legends_Colin_McRae/)

[turves]

Anybody know if this show can be downloaded or seen on stream outside the UK?

Apparently not (at present). It seems the BBC have restricted it to UK only. Im sure someone will upload it to YouTube soon.

[irish_tiger]

What are the thoughts about the quality of the show ? I thought it lacked detail , it never mentioned about how he punctured on the RAC in '95 and dropped a minute and a half and had to fix the suspension after the stage or show the video footage . How he nearly won the title again in '97 only for planting the car into a tree in Indonesia while leading well ,which was ultimatly the cause of him not winning the championship .In '98 the unreliability of the Subaru engines giving up while leading rally after rally ....
The clips of the garage with all the rally cars was nice do - they are fairly clean ! ... just wondering do was '95 Championship winning car that Chris Hoy drove the actual car ? I thought it just looked a bit different , with the small number plate on the front etc , ide be slow enough in leaving a car of the value out on the gravel if it as mine ....

[big_sw2000]

What are the thoughts about the quality of the show ? I thought it lacked detail , it never mentioned about how he punctured on the RAC in '95 and dropped a minute and a half and had to fix the suspension after the stage or show the video footage . How he nearly won the title again in '97 only for planting the car into a tree in Indonesia while leading well ,which was ultimatly the cause of him not winning the championship .In '98 the unreliability of the Subaru engines giving up while leading rally after rally ....
The clips of the garage with all the rally cars was nice do - they are fairly clean ! ... just wondering do was '95 Championship winning car that Chris Hoy drove the actual car ? I thought it just looked a bit different , with the small number plate on the front etc , ide be slow enough in leaving a car of the value out on the gravel if it as mine ....

No the Subaru driven by Hoy, was Ryan Champion's car, an ex Latti car. Just with plates changed for tv. Sorry cant rember the reg now, will look it up

Thought the content of the programe was good. No mention of his Citreon or Skoda drives. There was a lot to fit in to an hour

Steve

[MrJan]

didnt expect chris hoy to handle a car so well

My thoughts too, I didn't even know that he was a petrolhead. The way that he chucked the Sunbeam around was quite impressive and he didn't seem too fazed by the Impreza or Dakar car either.

Too much to pack into an hour show and thought that it covered the balance well (as in it catered for rally fans and people that know nothing about the sport), was nice to see things with Jimmy and about the Dakar car as well, after all we can all watch highlights of his career at any time.

[big_sw2000]

he didn't seem too fazed by the Impreza or Dakar car either.

.

As we saw, Was he ment to get quite that much air lol.

Steve

[BDunnell]

My thoughts too, I didn't even know that he was a petrolhead. The way that he chucked the Sunbeam around was quite impressive and he didn't seem too fazed by the Impreza or Dakar car either.

Too much to pack into an hour show and thought that it covered the balance well (as in it catered for rally fans and people that know nothing about the sport), was nice to see things with Jimmy and about the Dakar car as well, after all we can all watch highlights of his career at any time.

Yes, exactly. To criticise it for lack of detail would be to miss the point. This wasn't a show intended for the knowledgeable enthusiast.

[Fly_Half]

I also thought they got the balance about right, covering every aspect of his career would have taken 3 hours or more.

Very impressed with Hoy's car control on gravel, looked a bit of a natural I thought. Be interesting to see him competing.

[dimviii]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BBsR1eCCcAEFees.jpg:large

[Jack4688`]

Thought it lacked detail but as has been pointed out there was a lot to squeeze into one hour. Could have done without the Ken Block bit but then I suppose there needed to be a bit of a segway into the XGames part of his career. The only thing I can properly have a go at was the haphazard way that clips of his driving were cobbled together. As a car nerd I found it annoying seeing the inside of a Focus and hearing the unmistakable Group A Subaru engine note... Though that was only once for about 2 seconds

[userwave]

Just watched it, I really liked it, but both myself and my wife agreed Ken Block didn't really belong in it.

it is what it is

[wedge]

Very enjoyable even after I watched a couple of McRae docs on YT a couple of months ago.

The accident looked as if no doubt it was tacked on at the last minute as it jumps at odds to Hoy's narration "the accident has been well documented" implying it was originally glossed over.


The way that he chucked the Sunbeam around was quite impressive


But how many goes did it take for him get it right? ;)

Not that I doubt his abilities, I knew beforehand he does trackdays in his Lotus 2 Eleven.

Hoy definitely has some talent on 4 wheels. I would love to see him compete after he gives up push bikes.


I cannot see what problem the BBC have with the Colin McRae tribute. If they go on like this we will never get any programmes about our heros at all, there will always be something in their profile that could upset someone, somewhare.


Why are the BBC so over-sensitive about broardcasting a documemtary? It dosen't even have to go into detail about the helicopter accident.

To some and I imagine more so to the family of the deceased child - tributes can be interpreted as a glorification. If it was my niece let alone my child the excuse "at least he was a rally God/legend" would not be suffice. You only have to look at the families whose children have been involved in road traffic accidents that short sentences seem insufficient.

Two kids were killed. One was McRae's son the was the son's friend who allegedly did not have parental permission.

McRae's license had lapsed and the accident verdict deemed that he was flying way beyond his capabilities.

That is a very damning picture especially when you put into context with his driving style and mantra "if in doubt, flat doubt".

As a father and a parent it was not just ill judgement but plain irresponsible.

I think balance is necessary because no one is perfect especially in a complex sport and life that motorsport can afford then one should make their own judgement. Other forums have mixed views on McRae. Very surprised the haters haven't popped in.

[TMorel]

Did anyone notice that yesterday McRae's helicopter crash report was at one point the most read article on the BBC (and then dropped to 5th later in the day).
Clearly the show reached enough of an audience to register on some levels, but not sure if that's a good thing.

[Kielder]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5ZJcfSKmR4

[MrJan]

To some and I imagine more so to the family of the deceased child - tributes can be interpreted as a glorification. If it was my niece let alone my child the excuse "at least he was a rally God/legend" would not be suffice. You only have to look at the families whose children have been involved in road traffic accidents that short sentences seem insufficient.
...

I think balance is necessary because no one is perfect especially in a complex sport and life that motorsport can afford then one should make their own judgement. Other forums have mixed views on McRae. Very surprised the haters haven't popped in.

I look at the two things separately, I don't think that the accident should impact on his ability as a driver, much as his status as a driver shouldn't impact on the fact that the accident was horrific and disgraceful. Should we no longer appreciate his rallying skill because of something he did in his private life?

[wedge]

I look at the two things separately, I don't think that the accident should impact on his ability as a driver, much as his status as a driver shouldn't impact on the fact that the accident was horrific and disgraceful. Should we no longer appreciate his rallying skill because of something he did in his private life?

I do respect that opinion.

There are those who can separate the two and there are those who are uncomfortable with it because he pushed the limits in rallying and ended up in massive shunts and lived life to the limit with disastrous consequences - some would say the two are intertwined. I found that especially in hindsight with his mum worrying about him not knowing the limits as a 19 year old.

[Barreis]

Nobody's perfect. Don't tell me that you never drove drunk. He hadn't valid licence and was very unlucky. It was very tragic and I coudn't believe when saw news on CNN that night that my hero was dead.

[BDunnell]

To some and I imagine more so to the family of the deceased child - tributes can be interpreted as a glorification. If it was my niece let alone my child the excuse "at least he was a rally God/legend" would not be suffice. You only have to look at the families whose children have been involved in road traffic accidents that short sentences seem insufficient.

Very well put.

[BDunnell]

I look at the two things separately, I don't think that the accident should impact on his ability as a driver, much as his status as a driver shouldn't impact on the fact that the accident was horrific and disgraceful. Should we no longer appreciate his rallying skill because of something he did in his private life?

I largely echo what wedge says above. However, would you have the same view of a brilliant sportsman who was, say, convicted of rape, or a child sex offence?

There is no doubt that, in the McRae case, the fact of children being killed puts an entirely different spin on the matter. The same vehemence as is read and heard about McRae's actions never attaches itself to Graham Hill, whose behaviour was actually very similar.

[BDunnell]

Nobody's perfect. Don't tell me that you never drove drunk. He hadn't valid licence and was very unlucky. It was very tragic and I coudn't believe when saw news on CNN that night that my hero was dead.

Very unlucky? He was damn stupid, not unlucky. One might say he was lucky not to have been killed before.

[Mintexmemory]

Just watched it, I really liked it, but both myself and my wife agreed Ken Block didn't really belong in it.

it is what it is

Presumably KB was in it with an eye to syndication in the US

[Jack4688`]

Don't tell me that you never drove drunk

I know that point wasn't aimed at me but NO, I havent! If you ever have driven while under the influence of alcohol you are an utter moron.

It doesn't matter how short a distance you were going or whether at the time you were confident that nothing untoward would happen once you got in that car, it is a massively irresponsible thing to do!

[BDunnell]

I know that point wasn't aimed at me but NO, I havent! If you ever have driven while under the influence of alcohol you are an utter moron.

It doesn't matter how short a distance you were going or whether at the time you were confident that nothing untoward would happen once you got in that car, it is a massively irresponsible thing to do!

Exactly. Not every illegal act is also dangerously stupid.

[MrJan]

I largely echo what wedge says above. However, would you have the same view of a brilliant sportsman who was, say, convicted of rape, or a child sex offence?

Perhaps not, although I think that I'd still have to appreciate sporting achievements. When Chris Langham was caught out for looking at child porn on the internet I lost all respect for him as a person, however I still find People Like Us, The Thick of It and a lot of his other work funny. It's the same with McRae, I no longer respect him as a person in the same way that I did before, but I still respect his achievements and will forever be a fan of his style in a rally car.

[BDunnell]

When Chris Langham was caught out for looking at child porn on the internet I lost all respect for him as a person, however I still find People Like Us, The Thick of It and a lot of his other work funny.

That's a very reasonable point.

[Barreis]

Very unlucky? He was damn stupid, not unlucky. One might say he was lucky not to have been killed before.

He's dead so please don't write about him this way.

[Mark]

Just because someone is deceased does not mean they are not open to criticism.

[stefanvv]

This report was supposed to be celebration of his career and passion for the sport, what has became... We simply have to accept bad things just happen sometimes in life, that's it. I enjoyed this report very much.

[catty]

Disclaimer: While Jimmy was my favourite driver of all time, Colin is the reason I really got into the sport and indeed started rallying


While watching what I thought was a brilliantly put together programme I had a thought;
Colin McRae won his championship in what was the weakest field of the last 20 years (possibly ever). The guys that finished 3rd & 4th were kicked out & the guy that finished 5th only competed on 50% of the rallies.

[Mark]

If you have ever driven drunk then you're a bloody idiot and you need to have to have a long hard think about why you are such a waste of space.

My friends have had two family members killed by drunk drivers. It's a serious matter.

[Jack4688`]

Well said

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Jimmy McRae was my first rally hero and his battles in the British Championship with Russell Brookes in the 1980's really got me into the sport.

Most fans, especially the youner ones, know nothing about him except that he was Colin's dad... this is such a shame and I hope that this programme will help to inform and educate them more about Jimmy.

Winning the British title five times in 1981, 1982, 1984, 1987 and 1988 and being Runner-up in the ERC in 1982 is a great record and his performances in a variety of often out-dated vehicles was impressive.

As for the programme itself it told the rally fans nothing new, Chris Hoy was a strange choice of host and Ken Block had no place in it at all.

Great memories though for those of us who watched Colin go from nowhere to the first British Rally World Champion...

But where is the legacy (no pun intended !) now there isnt a single Brit in the WRC...

[Fly_Half]

Chris Hoy was a strange choice of host

Why? He's one of the highest profile sportsmen in the UK at present, a motorsport nut, McRae was one of this childhood heroes, he's Scottish...what more do you want?

[catty]

Why? He's one of the highest profile sportsmen in the UK at present, a motorsport nut, McRae was one of this childhood heroes, he's Scottish...what more do you want?
Perfect host if you ask me.

Especially when campared to Captain Picard and that fat oaf that presented the jackie stewart one......

[BDunnell]

He's dead so please don't write about him this way.

At risk as I am of invoking Godwin's Law, would you extend the same courtesy to Hitler?

I'm afraid — without wishing to sound rude — yours is a rather morally bankrupt argument.

[BDunnell]

While watching what I thought was a brilliantly put together programme I had a thought;
Colin McRae won his championship in what was the weakest field of the last 20 years (possibly ever). The guys that finished 3rd & 4th were kicked out & the guy that finished 5th only competed on 50% of the rallies.

While this is true, his closest challenger was his own team-mate, one of the greatest drivers of recent eras, and in equal machinery it took team orders to achieve such a close final result. I think this more than balances out the point you make.

[BDunnell]

Jimmy McRae was my first rally hero and his battles in the British Championship with Russell Brookes in the 1980's really got me into the sport.

Most fans, especially the youner ones, know nothing about him except that he was Colin's dad... this is such a shame and I hope that this programme will help to inform and educate them more about Jimmy.

Winning the British title five times in 1981, 1982, 1984, 1987 and 1988 and being Runner-up in the ERC in 1982 is a great record and his performances in a variety of often out-dated vehicles was impressive.

My thoughts exactly. It saddens me rather that the fact — not opinion, but fact — of how great British rallying was in Jimmy's era now seems lost on a whole generation, if not more, of enthusiasts. Any one of the British Open championship events of that time offered a greater challenge than does pretty much any WRC event of today, and a damn sight more interest and excitement. Some of my favourite motorsport memories derive from that period — the epic five-day Circuits of Ireland, Tony Pond's amazing driving in the Vitesse, 1987's utterly unpredictable championship in what were meant to be less exciting Group A cars, McRae finally winning the Scottish in dominant fashion in 1988, and so many more. British motorsport got no better than that.

And if we're thinking specifically of Jimmy McRae, let's not forget that he won the Circuit of Ireland seven times, four of them when it was a five-day marathon regarded by some as tougher than any WRC event of that time, let alone now.



But where is the legacy (no pun intended !) now there isnt a single Brit in the WRC...

There is none. Simple as that. To my mind, the British round of the WRC virtually ceased to exist as an interesting entity after McRae's 1995 win. That year was, after all, the final one in which the event was staged over a proper, lengthy route.

[stefanvv]

At risk as I am of invoking Godwin's Law, would you extend the same courtesy to Hitler?

Hitler? he wasn't drunk, he was just sick and the Jewels were breathing his air...But lets not continue this discussion.

[sollitt]

I believe the thread was about the BBC documentary on McRae. It's a shame some of you must use it to foist your political or moralistic viewpoints on the rest of us.

The programme was excellent I thought. I agree with those who didn't appreciate the inclusion of Ken Block. It added no value. And I thought the segment about Alister's Dakar special prototype was a bit overdone. But a good programme none the less.
The sport could certainly use a Colin McRae right now.

[pino]

Excellent thread and amazing documentary of a rally legend so let's stay on topic and keep politics off here thank you.

[pino]

As for the documentary it gave me great emotions, brought tears in my eyes and had goose skin whilst watching it. A big thanks to all who made it and I hope they will make a DVD of it :)

[Mark]

Agreed about the Ken Block bit; I'm not sure why they felt the need to shoehorn his 'driving around stuff' thing into it, that isn't rallying.

[Sladden]

I liked it! Nice with comments from different people in his carrer.
Just a shame that the most interesting years... say 1996-2000 Always gets rushed over. Like it was a transition period into Ford. When in fact 97-98 was his absolute best performances ever in rallying.
And the mysteriously bad Citroen year is not mentioned. Would have been nice with some insight into that.. instead of Ken Block!

[AndyRAC]

It’s interesting you mention 1997/98. Both years he really should have won the Title – but was let down by the reliability of the Subaru. Who remembers the strings of retirements due to the same engine problem. Or the final 2 events of 1998 when while leading, the turbo went in Australia, and on the RAC the engine went on the road section to service at Builth Wells.


All too often he is accused of throwing away those championships due to accidents – it was the car. Even 2001, I’d actually argue was lost on the Tarmac rounds – not 1 point scored; the combination of the nose heavy Focus, and poor dry Tarmac Pirelli tyres. It didn’t help that in Australia he missed his time slot for picking the running order – and had to run 2nd on the road after Ford ‘asked’ Delecour to incur time penalties.

[Mark]

It’s interesting you mention 1997/98. Both years he really should have won the Title – but was let down by the reliability of the Subaru. Who remembers the strings of retirements due to the same engine problem. Or the final 2 events of 1998 when while leading, the turbo went in Australia, and on the RAC the engine went on the road section to service at Builth Wells.



One of those years - I forget which - he had a string of retirements, I worked out that if just a single one of those retirements had not happened and he'd finished in his running position he would have been champ that year instead of Makkinen.

[Mark]

The thing that saddens me most is how great rallying was in the late 1990's compared to now.

[grugsticles]

The thing that saddens me most is how great rallying was in the late 1990's compared to now.
Amen. We were up to 7 manufacturers at one stage, all in different periods of developments and varying budgets but essentially you could count on that each rally would have 3-4 drivers with dead-set chances of winning, and a good number of others who would also win if luck went their way.
I hated it at the time, but the whole concept of drivers who were specialists on particular surfaces (Panitzi and Rovanpera come to mind) was actually a good thing.

I also think David Richards was thinking in the right direction with his plan for WRC media coverage etc. but his timing and financial goals good at all.

[Sladden]

And in Corsica 2000 he was on course to move into the Championship lead. Without that one nasy accident... I would guess both 2000 and 2001 was his for the taking.
His strenth was also his weakness. Very natural behind the Wheel and super exiting to Watch. Not keen to do perfect lines or diciplined driving but from somewhere Deep inside a desire to take big risks. To go beyond the limits. That kind of attitude cannot last forever... unlike Loeb who drives perfect and just do the right choices and calculations.