The Pastor Vs Massa Thread

[Knock-on]

So, which will earn the rights to be Top Donkey this year.

Massa showed great form in the early part of the season and looked a shoe-in to take the Donkey of the season crown but has really messed up in the last few races whereas Maldonkeyado has really shown his calibre recently with some incredible driving.

Forget team mate battles, this one could go to the wire in Brazil. Can Massa regain his natural form or can Pastor build up an unassailable lead before being banned?

[Tazio]

Button

[donKey jote]

yep. Button.

[janneppi]

I think lately Ferrari has been able to setup the car better for Massa as he doesn't seem so hopeless anymore.

altough today's race is over for him according to one finnish news site, gotta love that photo though. :D

"Massa already given up"
Massa antoi jo periksi - MTV3.fi - Urheilu - F1 - Uutiset (http://www.mtv3.fi/urheilu/f1/uutiset.shtml/2012/07/1584446/massa-antoi-jo-periksi)

[Knock-on]

Button

Want to reconsider after Germany :p

[N4D13]

So far, it's Maldonado. He has been great at times, but he's also had quite a few moments of lunatic self-destruction. Massa has been nowhere in much more races than he should have, but his poor performances haven't been as spectacular as Pastor's. Being slow is too mainstream - being reasonably fast and then crashing into something or someone is much more interesting for viewers and makes Pastor a much more appropriate candidate IMHO.

[jens]

So far, it's Maldonado.

Interestingly I would vote for Massa. Sure it is difficult to compare them, because they are lacking in different areas - speed v racecraft. However, we can take another criteria. Maldonado still has more points than Massa, despite the latter being in a car, which is clearly leading the WDC. :)

[Robinho]

Germany was a draw, they were both ****e

[Knock-on]

Massa mnaged to screw up Lewis's race in Germany where at least Pastor managed not to bash anyone off and just screwed himself.

[markabilly]

Button

yep, then he goes and blows it.

if he had not (well according to Whitemarsh) started running low on fuel, he might have taken Alonso

[odykas]

Button for donkey!

[seppefan]

Interestingly I would vote for Massa. Sure it is difficult to compare them, because they are lacking in different areas - speed v racecraft. However, we can take another criteria. Maldonado still has more points than Massa, despite the latter being in a car, which is clearly leading the WDC. :)

I agree. Massa about 158 gp's vs about 27.

[The Black Knight]

I'm going for Massa on this one. Much as I don't like Pastors stupid maneuvers and inability to be consistent, he did win a race this year at least. I doubt Massa will do the same. Not good considering the experience deficit. But despite his lack of intelligence I guess Pastor does have potential, Massa doesn't really. Congratulations to Massa for messing up again this race.

[Firstgear]

It should be easier to calm aggression, than to strengthen a weak mind.
My vote goes to Massa.

[F1boat]

Obviously it is Jean-Eric Vergne.

[keysersoze]

Here's a frightening thought: Massa and Maldonado could be teammates next season.

[Dave B]

They've both got donkeyesque traits but for different reasons. Maldonado is clearly a fast and fearless driver who needs to channel his aggression, the fact that he won a race in a midfield car is clearly proof that he has speed, but his numerous clashes over the past couple of years have marked him out as being far from the finished article. There's defiantly potential there, mind, if he can stay out of trouble long enough.

Massa just looks like a broken man. I don't think it's entirely down to his accident, I just think he's been so comprehensively beaten by Alonso that he's lost all confidence in himself. Even when he did show the occasional flash of his former self his team made it abundantly clear where he stood, which can't have helped his mindset. He was the last man outside of the new teams to get onto the scoreboard this year, while Alonso leads the championship. He's fighting for his career, and can't seem to handle the pressure. I was genuinely surprised he kept his seat for this year, never mind having a future at Ferrari. If he's still in F1 next season he should consider himself a lucky man.

[CNR]

Massa: I won't stay in F1 to make up numbers | F1 News | Jul 2012 | Crash.Net (http://www.crash.net/f1/news/182342/1/massa_i_wont_stay_in_f1_to_make_up_numbers.html)

Felipe Massa has said he won't compete in F1 next season if he cannot secure a competitive drive.
the worst drivers would have to be the hrt drivers

[Dave B]

The Hungarian GP did nothing to help choose between them. Maldonado forced Di Resta off track and picked up a justified penalty, and Massa limped home quarter of an hour behind his team mate.

Apparently there's a paddock whisper that Massa's been told his services will no longer be required for 2013, and I can't say I'm totally shocked.

[Bezza]

It would be incomprehensible if Massa kept his seat for 2013. He's already kept it at least one year too long. Ferrari need to be more ruthless. I'd argue replacing him now, with Trulli or Sutil, who in my opinion are better drivers without race seats.

He needs a fresh start, a move to Williams might see him back on the podium. The car is capable of much more than it is delivering at the moment, Maldonado is quick but very erratic and Senna is steady, Massa would be a likely improvement.

I expect Kovalainen to go to Ferrari next year, considering recent rumours, as a stopgap for Vettel in 2014.

[donKey jote]

Trulli ? :eek: :crazy:
I'd even consider giving JV a go before Trulli (sorry pino :p )

[Tazio]

Trulli ? :eek: :crazy:
I'd even consider giving JV a go before Trulli (sorry pino :p )
You're smoking something Donks, as bad as JT was, why would you want to bring back a relic.? I think it was the year they raced the China GP and JV had replaced JT because he sucked, plus he'd pissed Flavio off. JV came over the radio and asked where he was losing time and his race engineer said "everywhere" :laugh:

[donKey jote]

as bad as JT was, why would you want to bring back a relic.?
I stand by my statement:
I'd even consider giving JV a go before Trulli
No chance I'd consider giving either a go though ;) :s ailor: :kiss:
plus JT is also a relic :laugh:
err sorry pino :andrea:

[Tazio]

If such thing was being considered (which it is not)
I think a candidate with talent should be brought in,
:s ailor: like "Slash"......................Sutil :s tareup: :p :

[Robinho]

there are probably 10 rookies I'd give a chance before bringing back another 40 something

[CNR]

F1 : Rossi hails Scuderia Ferrari 2012 Formula 1 recovery as Ducati struggle with GP12 (http://www.f1sa.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=34661:f1--rossi-hails-scuderia-ferrari-2012-formula-1-recovery-as-ducati-struggle-with-gp12&catid=1:f1&Itemid=157)
Valentino Rossi has used the Ferrari Formula One team as an example of an Italian racing outfit that managed to emerge from a deep crisis.

how would Rossi go ?

[ArrowsFA1]

how would Rossi go ?
Oh no, not this "Rossi to Ferrari" story again :crazy: :p

It's like the two JV's. Verstappen was always going to get a great F1 drive one day, and Villeneuve was (still is!) going to make a return to F1, if you believed the forum chatter that is.

[anthonyvop]

Massa gets paid big $$$ to drive for Ferrari.


Maldonado gets Chavez to pay big backs to Williams so he can drive.

Just saying.

[TheFamousEccles]

Mal does'nt deserve his seat IMO, he is average at best and got very lucky to score a win. Since then he has demonstrated a startling lack of race-craft, and has been outright donkey for this season.

Massa has been rogered royally by the Ferrari political system, to a point where he is the whipping boy for the "meedja" and other unkind folks ;)

[TheFamousEccles]

Rossi would be ok,but he would be handed his arse by Stoner (wait until I can get my asbestos suit on before flaming - ok ready!)

[tfp]

Rossi would be ok,but he would be handed his arse by Stoner (wait until I can get my asbestos suit on before flaming - ok ready!)

:laugh: Trouble is he might get bored and announce it to everyone before the seasons end :p

[CNR]

Maldonado crashes during 'hero's welcome' run - Yahoo! Eurosport UK (http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/maldonado-crashes-f1-street-demo-200316197.html)


Maldonado, visiting his home country for the first time since becoming Venezuela's first grand prix winner, was due to complete a 12-lap run on the Fuerte Tiunas military parade ground in front of 20,000 fans and numerous political and military VIPs, with team owner Sir Frank Williams and shareholder Toto Wolff also present.
But Maldonado was caught out by the extremely bumpy surface of the show ground and spun his Williams FW33, damaging its suspension on the roadside kerbing

[The Black Knight]

Maldonado crashes during 'hero's welcome' run - Yahoo! Eurosport UK (http://uk.eurosport.yahoo.com/news/maldonado-crashes-f1-street-demo-200316197.html)

I laughed when I read that. Hardly surprising though.

[Koz]

Maldonado's Caracas demo crash gaff Video | F1 Video | Crash.Net (http://www.crash.net/f1/video/182818/1/maldonados_caracas_demo_crash_gaff.html)

Nice video.

[Knock-on]

Blimey, he didn't hit anyone this time :D

[Bagwan]

Poor guy .
Just when everyone is questioning his abilities as an F1 driver , he does this in front of the home crowd .

In his defence , it looks like he had a few things going against him here .
Firstly , it's a cement surface , and doesn't look like it was swept at all , to ready the area for the demo .

Secondly , from the video , it looks to be at the end of a straight , meant to be able to demonstrate speed . Cones are set , restricting his corner entry , far from the crowd on the inside , making it a hard line to take at much more than a snail's pace .

Thirdly , a short time later it rained , ending all the fun , so it's not unlikely that the temperature was changing rapidly at the time he went out .


All that said , he looked a total goon on this one , at a time when there's not a lot of other news to talk about .
Again , he misjudged the grip .

[Garry Walker]

F1 : Rossi hails Scuderia Ferrari 2012 Formula 1 recovery as Ducati struggle with GP12 (http://www.f1sa.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=34661:f1--rossi-hails-scuderia-ferrari-2012-formula-1-recovery-as-ducati-struggle-with-gp12&catid=1:f1&Itemid=157)
Valentino Rossi has used the Ferrari Formula One team as an example of an Italian racing outfit that managed to emerge from a deep crisis.

how would Rossi go ?

Rossi would bitch like a little girl about not having the best car. One of the biggest crybabies in any sport.

[Garry Walker]

I've never got that impression at all. He's no Casey Stoner when it comes to complaining IMO.

You obviously have not been paying attention. Stoner sometimes whines, but Rossi is in a different league. The sooner that douche is out of Moto GP the better, I have taken great enjoyment in seeing him struggle on the same bike Stoner was winning with.

[The Black Knight]

I have watched alot of MotoGP, I just choose to discuss it elsewhere and don't join in on here usually. I also don't think we watch it for the same reasons and enjoy what every rider brings to the sport.

Likewise. It's also a very narrow statement and doesn't even remotely show the whole picture. I love watching Moto GP for, like F1, the racing, not to take enjoyment from others misfortunes. I don't see why people like that watch sports at all, they'd be more entertained by the WWE or something.

Rossi is a great champion and it has been a joy to witness him in his prime. Anyway, at least he doesn't complain so much that he quits the sport ;)

[Knock-on]

VR is one of the most popular and successful riders in the history of the sport. He's no saint but a superb champion and ambassador for the sport. In fact, all the things Schumacher should have been.

Garry's dislike just makes me like the little chap even more :)

[Garry Walker]

I have watched alot of MotoGP, I just choose to discuss it elsewhere and don't join in on here usually. I also don't think we watch it for the same reasons and enjoy what every rider brings to the sport.
I watch MotoGP for the racing aspect and have since Doohan ruled the world.
Rossi is probably the only rider I have ever despised in MotoGP and I can't deny that I laugh everytime he does badly and take great enjoyment from that. When Lorenzo destroys him again next year and wins again it will be very satisfying to see.
Meanwhile, I will enjoy the great battles between Stoner, Lorenzo and Pedrosa (whom I all like very much) who are all far deserving of success than mr.tax fraud.


VR is one of the most popular and successful riders in the history of the sport. He's no saint but a superb champion and ambassador for the sport. He is popular yes, but he makes Bieber look a gentleman.



In fact, all the things Schumacher should have been.Why should Schumacher have been a crying coward who runs away from a team when he is not winning?


Garry's dislike just makes me like the little chap even more :) LOL.

[Garry Walker]

You clearly don't dislike Rossi for being a crybaby then as Stoner, Lorenzo and Pedrosa are all guilty of throwing a hissy fit on a regular basis by those standards. Rossi is far worse than any of those.


Rossi is a great champion and has raised the profile of MotoGP with his dominance and continued commitment to the sport.
He has won a lot yes, but a champion he is not.



If you really take great enjoyment out of a sportman man doing badly, then I pity that to be honest.
I guess I will somehow have to find a way to carry on living now.

[TheFamousEccles]

I blame Steve Parrish for all this "Stoner moaner" rubbish. Anyhoo, back to topic.

Mal is a goose - and my previous comments stand - if not reinforced by the vision of his latest stunt.