M-Sport Ford World Rally Teams [Archive] - Page 8

Simmi

23rd December 2017, 12:55

Essaj

23rd December 2017, 13:48

I don't even want to know how much money Ford needs to pay to have you guys happy :D
And now that Malcolm has brought M-Sport already to this stage I don't event believe that he is willing to let Ford to take the lead anymore.

Fast Eddie WRC

23rd December 2017, 15:42

When M-Sport announced Ogier & Evans as drivers they said news on 3rd car would be coming in next few weeks. A third car will not be a surprise. Who will drive third car may be a surprise.

Ford will be more interested in manufacturer title than driver title. Hyundai & Toyota will get a fight from M-Sport Ford WRT for 2018 manufacturer title

So you expect a full-time 3rd car and driver... who and who's paying ?

And if Ford are 'more interested in manufacturer title than driver title' why are they just giving greater technical support, not a full factory support ?

If they were, they would have had to get serious and paid for Tanak to stay.

jonkka

23rd December 2017, 16:23

I don't know but I assume M-Sport could probably have called themselves this since 2013 if they'd chosen to?

What is *this* you're referring to, use of name Ford in their business?

macebig

23rd December 2017, 16:27

AndyRAC

23rd December 2017, 17:45

Good, glad I'm not the only one that's seen a bit of an over-reaction to this news.

In essence we're talking about a four-letter word on an entry list. It doesn't suddenly mean Ford are 'back'. I don't know but I assume M-Sport could probably have called themselves this since 2013 if they'd chosen to?

Seems like a nod from M-Sport to acknowledge that Ford Performance technical support which should help with updates. I guess you could call it an 'official return' - but it's not really is it. Don't get me wrong it's better than nothing, but it's baby steps.

I agree with you; we only know Ford are back because of the FiA releasing the named Manufacturer entrants for the 2018 WRC season. There is absolutely nothing on their social media platforms, or press releases, etc
Maybe there'll be more in a few weeks time at the Autosport show - but you'd have thought there would have been an announcement about their return.

Simmi

23rd December 2017, 19:11

What is *this* you're referring to, use of name Ford in their business?

Yes. Not their business, but the registered team name in the championship. Happy to be proven wrong though.

Fast Eddie WRC

23rd December 2017, 21:37

Whatever the extent of Ford's involvement, it was enough to make Ogier stay (at M-Sport and in the WRC) so it must be fairly substantial.

Tarmop

23rd December 2017, 22:21

Tanak WANTED to leave. As long as Sebastian was staying, Ott was always going to be second fiddle. He wasn't content with that, so he will try to wrestle Toyota away from JML. And BTW, once again, Ford NEVER left WRC. They just scaled back their involvement after 2012.And, by the looks of it, they are now upping their commitment.

Main problem was the car. No. 1 got all the updates before him due to small budget. Something that wouldn`t or shouldn`t be a problem for Toyota.

jonkka

24th December 2017, 05:40

Yes. Not their business, but the registered team name in the championship. Happy to be proven wrong though.

Without explicit approval from Ford - I would say no.

ESTR

24th December 2017, 08:40

Main problem was the car. No. 1 got all the updates before him due to small budget. Something that wouldn`t or shouldn`t be a problem for Toyota.

But still was nearly faster than him almost everywhere.. I think that money was cause to leave.

Tarmop

24th December 2017, 08:58

You can be faster...and det the updates one day. Money from Toyota was definitely tempting but as he said, not the main thing. Main thing was equal conditions and money to develop the car. He even said that M-Sport made him an offer that wasn`t too bad, but would`ve still meant No. 2.

ESTR

24th December 2017, 09:42

Tarmop

24th December 2017, 10:25

In terms of car upgrades due to budget issues, no. On the stages he is the boss...i hope.

Simmi

24th December 2017, 10:44

And what will he be in Toyota. Still number 2...

I don't see any world champions in that Toyota team...

No reason Ott shouldn't be top dog if the performances are worthy, Finnish mafia or not.

tommeke_B

24th December 2017, 10:50

It's funny how "budget issues" are always mentioned with M-Sport. If this year has proven anything, it's that there are no issues from a lack of budget, at M-Sport...

denkimi

24th December 2017, 10:53

once again, Ford NEVER left WRC.
yes they did. if it wasn't for wilson's desire to go on even without the proper funding, there would be no ford in the wrc.

Main problem was the car. No. 1 got all the updates before him due to small budget. Something that wouldn`t or shouldn`t be a problem for Toyota.

i don't know. even hyundai with their huge budget hade some updates only for neuville.

Barreis

24th December 2017, 10:56

oh, wilson knows his job. he knows where the money is and how to get it. so he didn't stay in wrc just because of good will...

Tarmop

24th December 2017, 11:16

That is what Ott said himself. Ogier definitely got some better diffs before him...3 cars (vs Ott 2 and Evans 1 and that was paid by DMack) What happened with Hyundai in the end of the season is another story i think. Testing for 2018 and referencing with old etc.

er88

24th December 2017, 12:55

If you don't think the main reason Tanak left was due to the big contract he's getting, you're a bit deluded. Doesn't matter how Tanak dresses it up in interviews.

Ofcourse Ogier was going to get car updates a round or two before Tanak this season. What had Tanak done before this year to deserve equal status in every department, with a 4time world champion anyway? With Msport having less financial support it made complete sense to give Seb the updates first. Even in manufacturer teams, sometimes car updates can only go to one car first. See Citroen and Hyundai this season for example. Even in F1 where money is no object for some of the bigger teams, sometimes its only feasible for updates to go on one car first.

Now Tanak is a proven winner and has shown he can be a championship contender, what's not to say he wouldn't have got more updates on the fiesta at the same time as Seb next season, had he stayed? There's more support now to do it with Ford Performance increasing their backing, and he certainly was allowed to fight Ogier on the stages by Malcolm. So he can have no complaints there about team orders, and being what Dani Sordo was to Loeb. Malcolm managed the team well and has done it throughout his career with Jari/Mikko and most notably with Sainz/McRae. We've yet to see how Tommi handles two (maybe 3 big drivers) fighting at the front with each other.

This isn't a criticism of Tanak btw, he has secured his and his family's financial future with this big Toyota contract. Most of us would've done the same in his position im sure.
Still doesn't mean i think it was the best decision for his immediate rallying future however. He left a championship winning team/car, and a car that he developed to go elsewhere. I think he could've given it another year at Msport, having shown this season that he could beat seb with the same car and aim for the championship. He still would've had huge contract offers come the end of 2018 too, what with Hyundai, Toyota, Citroen and Msport all having multiple drivers with their contracts expiring.

Hopefully for Ott he can adapt quickly though, and can prove it was the right sporting decision too. The Yaris is less reliable and less consistent than the Fiesta across a whole season, but Toyota will feel they can improve in the off season with his help. I can't wait to see how he does and would love to see him push even harder for the championship, but he'll certainly be up against it with Jari, Seb and Neuville already familiar with their teams/cars.

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Fast Eddie WRC

24th December 2017, 14:24

It's funny how "budget issues" are always mentioned with M-Sport. If this year has proven anything, it's that there are no issues from a lack of budget, at M-Sport...

You dont know anything, still less have proof.

More testing, more spare parts, more and earlier upgrades would all have been possible with the funds. Having more money in motorsport is always better than having less.

M-Sport produced a kind of miracle in 2017 through sheer hard work and Ogier's skill and professionalism brought to the whole team.

Tarmop

24th December 2017, 14:28

You have to remember that the money and FP wasn`t there, when he made his contract with Toyota.

Fast Eddie WRC

25th December 2017, 11:06

My MS-RT Membership pack I just got for Xmas only gives Ogier and Evans as their Team for WRC 2018.

(They also say they have plans for the BRC & ERC to be announced soon...)

Eli

25th December 2017, 15:39

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/133669/msport-title-changed-perceptions-of-me--ogier

AnttiL

25th December 2017, 16:14

You have to remember that the money and FP wasn`t there, when he made his contract with Toyota.

Yes. Plus Ott almost signed with Toyota already for 2017, but was still under contract with M-Sport.

the sniper

26th December 2017, 16:19

Essaj

26th December 2017, 16:34

Andre Oliveira

26th December 2017, 17:33

But is smart enought to collect points. I can see him doing something.

Mirek

26th December 2017, 17:54

He is not even fast enough for WRC2, so no.

I would not say he is not fast enough. He simply has zero experience with WRC events and that's something You can't gain in a weekend. Anyway he is too old to give him let's say two seasons to gain experience.

AnttiL

26th December 2017, 18:06

Surely Lotos can provide funding?

Is Lotos interested in promoting on the WRC countries?

Also, M-Sport not having a permanent third driver should not have an effect on available cars for paying drivers. Look at this year, they had many fourth cars.

26th December 2017, 18:15

Maybe M-Sport will subsidise the third car so suitable drivers don't have to find the full budget? Bouffier on Monte, Mads in Sweden etc.

AnttiL

26th December 2017, 18:43

Maybe M-Sport will subsidise the third car so suitable drivers don't have to find the full budget? Bouffier on Monte, Mads in Sweden etc.

Would make more sense to support Suninen and Camilli do half seasons for developing into M-Sport's future permanent drivers.

the sniper

26th December 2017, 21:16

I would not say he is not fast enough. He simply has zero experience with WRC events and that's something You can't gain in a weekend. Anyway he is too old to give him let's say two seasons to gain experience.

I should elaborate when I say what I perceive as 'the third car situation'. It's starting to look like that seat won't be allocated on talent/future prospects alone, or Suninen and Camilli would surely already be confirmed to split it between them at least. Maybe the third car this year will be used by M-Sport as a promotional vehicle for 'customers'. So you could be looking at Bouffier in Monte, Mads in Sweden, Kremer in Germany, Kajto somewhere else, with Suninen and Camilli getting in on rounds where there are no other takers?

Is Lotos interested in promoting on the WRC countries?

Certainly not all of them. But I imagine any WRC round gets more media coverage in Poland than any ERC round, other than perhaps the one taking place in Poland itself? Which would get more media attention in Poland, winning an ERC round abroad or debuting in a 2018 WR Car and doing a couple of rounds in the top class? I don't know, but it might make sense to them.

AnttiL

26th December 2017, 21:58

It's starting to look like that seat won't be allocated on talent/future prospects alone, or Suninen and Camilli would surely already be confirmed to split it between them at least. Maybe the third car this year will be used by M-Sport as a promotional vehicle for 'customers'. So you could be looking at Bouffier in Monte, Mads in Sweden, Kremer in Germany, Kajto somewhere else, with Suninen and Camilli getting in on rounds where there are no other takers?

My guess is that Camilli/Suninen was the initial plan but Camilli didn't get funding for Monte in time, thus leaving the seat open. Otherwise Bouffier would have just been the fourth car. I'm surprised if Teemu isn't there in Sweden.

But I imagine any WRC round gets more media coverage in Poland than any ERC round, other than perhaps the one taking place in Poland itself? .

Also is more expensive, probably worth 3 ERC R5 rallies

Jarek Z

26th December 2017, 22:17

Looking at how this thrid car situation is going, can anyone else see Kajetan Kajetanowicz doing a few rounds in the third car this season? He's basically done everything he can in the ERC. Surely Lotos can provide funding?

On the one hand - I'm afraid Kajetanowicz is not fast enough for WRC, plus he has zero experience at this level, plus he is already a little too old (38).

On the other hand - Bouffier, Breen and Lefebvre got their chances at WRC level and Kajetanowicz proved many times that he is a better driver than they are, so why not? :)

Mirek

26th December 2017, 23:05

On the other hand - Bouffier, Breen and Lefebvre got their chances at WRC level and Kajetanowicz proved many times that he is a better driver than they are, so why not? :)

When did Kajto prove he was better driver than Bouffier? Sorry, that's complete nonsense.

Jarek Z

26th December 2017, 23:22

When did Kajto prove he was better driver than Bouffier? Sorry, that's complete nonsense.

Maybe here?
https://www.fiaerc.com/season/2017/?p=standings#section-erc-drivers

Mirek

27th December 2017, 00:47

Maybe here?
https://www.fiaerc.com/season/2017/?p=standings#section-erc-drivers

8 starts against 4. Points per start 19,5/21 for Bouffier. Direct fights 2/2. Wins per start 12,5%/50% for Bouffier. SS wins per start 2,5/2,75 for Bouffier. So how did You come to a conclusion that Kajto is much better?

... (and Bouffier won on Kajto's home soil).

EstWRC

27th December 2017, 08:02

Allez Andruet

27th December 2017, 08:31

maybe some finnish guys here can shed some light why Suninen isnt doing a full season? Is it because of the budget or inexperience?

I think it is right to put him to an R5 for Monte but from Sweden onwards he should participate on every round with a WRC machine.

I think it's a combination of both - budget and inexperience. Sure, he has a Timo Jouhki backing, so the millions are there, but Jouhki does what he thinks makes the most sense for him and his driver, also from the financial point of view. If the cost of the "additional rounds" (not included in the plan of 6-8 rallies) is not reasonable, then Jouhki won't do that. Probably the best deal (considering all different elements of it) Jouhki could get from Wilson for Suninen in 2018 is what has already been rumoured: 6-8 outings in WRC and the rest in R5.

seb_sh

27th December 2017, 09:57

That's not a bad deal for Suninen to drive the WRC on his strong rallies to get confidence and drive the rest in R5 to learn them and improve himself. Also he is young so he should be in no rush to push for a full works seat, better that he shows good results in the WRC and gets picked up on merit.

As for MSport Ford I think they will focus on Sebastian. Evans should be consistently in the points and they'll take whatever they can get from the third car so they may be in the manufacturer's fight as well. However in terms of parts, evolutions, support, new cars and so on I assume Ogier will be prioritized, since the team is still limited in budget and so it makes sense to maximize the effort to have one car ahead of everyone instead of spreading it out over several cars that could be slightly slower.

Fast Eddie WRC

27th December 2017, 11:43

I agree... Ogier and the Drivers' Title will be the M-Sport priority in 2018. The strength of the factoy teams will be even greater and really hard to compete against.

If Ford wanted to help retain the Manu's Title they needed to comeback fully and fund a 3rd car and driver.

Jarek Z

27th December 2017, 11:50

8 starts against 4. Points per start 19,5/21 for Bouffier. Direct fights 2/2. Wins per start 12,5%/50% for Bouffier. SS wins per start 2,5/2,75 for Bouffier. So how did You come to a conclusion that Kajto is much better?

Maybe I know maths better?

Kajto:
145 / 6 = 24,16 points per start
or, if you want to calculate all points (not using the 6-best-results rule):
151 / 7 = 21,57 points per start

Bouffier:
84 / 4 = 21 points per start

Summing-up:
24,16 > 21

Mirek

27th December 2017, 13:54

Maybe I know maths better?

Kajto:
145 / 6 = 24,16 points per start
or, if you want to calculate all points (not using the 6-best-results rule):
151 / 7 = 21,57 points per start

Bouffier:
84 / 4 = 21 points per start

Summing-up:
24,16 > 21

The table on ERC website is wrong (Liepaja is missing - even when Kajto retired for very understandable reason).

Anyway playing with tenths of points is completely pointnless. Just admit that saying that Kajto proved himself many times to be better than Bouffier (Your exact words) has no factional backing. I have also forgot to mention that Kajto had works car...

Andre Oliveira

27th December 2017, 13:59

Alex009

27th December 2017, 14:16

On the other hand - Bouffier, Breen and Lefebvre got their chances at WRC level and Kajetanowicz proved many times that he is a better driver than they are, so why not? :)

It's about the money, not the results. If Kajetanowic wants to drive WRC, he have to buy it or rent it for some events.

AnttiL

27th December 2017, 14:27

It's about the money, not the results. If Kajetanowic wants to drive WRC, he have to buy it or rent it for some events.

And he can do it with M-Sport whether they have two or three factory cars entered.

Jarek Z

27th December 2017, 14:30

The table on ERC website is wrong (Liepaja is missing - even when Kajto retired for very understandable reason).

I don't know what you mean. I see all results in my browser and Liepaja is not missing.

Jarek Z

27th December 2017, 14:37

Bryan Bouffier

1999 FFSA Rallye Jeunes winner
2002 Volant Peugeot winner
2007/08/09 3x Polish Champion
2010 French Champion
2011 Rallye Monte-Carlo winner
2014 Rallye Monte-Carlo 2nd in privateer Ford Fiesta RS WRC (winner Ogier, Ford not the strongest car)

Yes, impressive. But why did you forget to list Kajto's titles for comparison?

2008 Polish Rally Champion in group N
2010 Polish Rally Champion in group N
2010 Polish Rally Champion
2011 Polish Rally Champion
2012 Polish Rally Champion
2013 Polish Rally Champion
2014 FIA ERC Gravel Master
2015 FIA ERC Gravel Master
2015 FIA ERC Ice Master
2015 European Rally Champion
2016 European Rally Champion
2017 European Rally Champion

Andre Oliveira

27th December 2017, 14:51

Same way i didn’t added class wins of Bryan. Everyone know Kajto champs :)

Simmi

27th December 2017, 15:31

Nothing like a pointless debate to bring in the New Year ;)

Andre Oliveira

27th December 2017, 15:33

Yes. Keep us entertained.

Fast Eddie WRC

27th December 2017, 16:19

Reading on Twitter that Bouffier is confirmed for 3rd M-Sport car in Monte !?

Mirek

27th December 2017, 16:41

I don't know what you mean. I see all results in my browser and Liepaja is not missing.

It is. It's 8th start with 5 points, i.e. 156/8=19,5.

PLuto

27th December 2017, 17:52

It is. It's 8th start with 5 points, i.e. 156/8=19,5.

No, results on fiaerc.com are correct. Due to one stupid FIA rule his zero points from Liepaja are correct.

Allez Andruet

27th December 2017, 18:31

Come on, get the guy spamming the thread with absurd Kajetanowicz BS out of here.

KiwiWRCfan

27th December 2017, 18:57

Reading on Twitter that Bouffier is confirmed for 3rd M-Sport car in Monte !?

Who confirmed Boufffier ? Have see several rumour tweets but nothing that could be viewed as officially confirmed

BigWorm

27th December 2017, 20:03

All rumours at the minute. But would be nice to see him having a go in the new cars.

Andre Oliveira

27th December 2017, 20:14

Bouffier / Degout

AnttiL

27th December 2017, 21:25

maybe some finnish guys here can shed some light why Suninen isnt doing a full season? Is it because of the budget or inexperience?

I think it is right to put him to an R5 for Monte but from Sweden onwards he should participate on every round with a WRC machine.

There isn't really any other guys doing a privately funded whole season. Not even Mads Østberg. The current WRC cars are more expensive than ever and getting sponsors is more difficult than in the previous decades.

It's another question why Malcolm does not want to invest in him? Maybe all his investment money is put into Ogier's salary?

er88

27th December 2017, 23:58

Why doesn't Mads just pay Msport to run him as the 3rd car on most of the events?

Yes it wouldn't be an exciting choice, as you know what you're getting with Mads. He doesn't have the potential that Suninen/ Tidemand etc have, but he's usually pretty reliable and brings money. He'd maybe collect useful points for the manufacturers championship on most gravel events, but just struggled this year as he couldnt get the best out of the car by running it privately.

Or he could pay PH Sport, but he probably doesn't want to go anywhere near that C3 :D.

I'd much rather see a younger driver instead, but I'm surprised if Malcolm isn't trying to sort something out with Mads who comes with a lot of backing.

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Watson

28th December 2017, 07:03

@er88 maybe Mads will get the third car in certain events. I think it will take as long as this before every rally before we know who gets the third car.

AnttiL

28th December 2017, 07:50

@er88 maybe Mads will get the third car in certain events. I think it will take as long as this before every rally before we know who gets the third car.

Last year Suninen announced his program for the whole year before the season started. Maybe DMack quitting their support of a full WRC seat took the team and some drivers by surprise?

Fast Eddie WRC

28th December 2017, 11:44

Who confirmed Boufffier ? Have see several rumour tweets but nothing that could be viewed as officially confirmed

Several websites (mostly Italian) and one or two other sources saying the rumour is confirmed.

ESTR

28th December 2017, 15:25

Or he could pay PH Sport, but he probably doesn't want to go anywhere near that C3 :D.

Interesting that a while ago he said that DS3 wasn't drive so well at least for him.. But he finished 4th on drivers championship. Next he was in Fiesta and he showed nothing...

Watson

28th December 2017, 19:38

That was mainly because he didn't get info on how to set it up. You'll find the sweetspot of the new generation cars mainly in the central differential. M-Sport had three drivers constantly testing the car and gathering experience during the events. Also his private team paid for all the broken parts so he had to be careful. Judging him on his results compared to the 'works' Fiesta drivers is not fair.

Simmi

28th December 2017, 21:18

Rally Power

28th December 2017, 23:02

Last year Suninen announced his program for the whole year before the season started. Maybe DMack quitting their support of a full WRC seat took the team and some drivers by surprise?

Maybe, still all previous rumours only mentioned 6 events on a WRC car for Suninen during 2018; if those were right, entering WRC2 alongside can be seen as a positive thing.

pantealex

29th December 2017, 08:10

It will be more than 6 rallies with WRC18 for Suninen, trust me :)

Rally Power

29th December 2017, 12:12

It will be more than 6 rallies with WRC18 for Suninen, trust me :)

That would be great!

Alex009

29th December 2017, 15:55

It will be more than 6 rallies with WRC18 for Suninen, trust me :)

Source? Or own opinion?

pantealex

29th December 2017, 18:41

Source? Or own opinion?

Not own opinion...

Fast Eddie WRC

30th December 2017, 12:07

New one hour Elfyn Evans documentary from S4C TV (with English subtitles) :

http://beta.s4c.cymru/clic/c_level2.shtml?programme_id=539480902

Barreis

30th December 2017, 14:14

New one hour Elfyn Evans documentary from S4C TV (with English subtitles) :

http://beta.s4c.cymru/clic/c_level2.shtml?programme_id=539480902

can't watch it in my country. any other link, please?

Watson

30th December 2017, 14:54

can't watch it in my country. any other link, please?

I don't speak Welsh but I think I have the same problem.

Fast Eddie WRC

30th December 2017, 22:36

Install Hola VPN on your Chrome browser to watch any foreign website video.

Watson

31st December 2017, 08:20

Install Hola VPN on your Chrome browser to watch any foreign website video.

Cheers mate.

AnttiL

5th January 2018, 11:57

http://www.urheiluuutiset.com/suniselle-huippusopimus-ura-jatkuu-rallin-mm-sarjassa-mestaritallin-vahvuudessa/

Suninen does at least 8 events in the third Fiesta, starting from Sweden. He does Monte and Deutschland with R5 and skips Tour de Corse.

The news article also says M-Sport will have a number of drivers on the third car.

Andre Oliveira

5th January 2018, 12:04

Great news :)

AnttiL

5th January 2018, 12:08

I think it's pretty sure he'll do Sweden, Portugal, Sardegna, Finland, Spain and Wales. Probably one or two of the long hauls, he won WRC2 in Mexico in 2016. Turkey is also a big question mark.

Andre Oliveira

5th January 2018, 12:22

I want see him here for sure :)

BigWorm

5th January 2018, 12:24

WRC-2 for Östberg then?

AnttiL

5th January 2018, 12:26

WRC-2 for Östberg then?

He could always be in the "fourth car" as well.

BigWorm

5th January 2018, 12:32

He could always be in the "fourth car" as well.

I doubt it though, didn't he put up his car for sale?

AnttiL

5th January 2018, 13:10

I doubt it though, didn't he put up his car for sale?

If he drove his own car, it wouldn't be an M-Sport fourth car, right? I mean he would rent a new Fiesta from M-Sport for certain events and tape it to OneBet livery. I think he would get better results with the improvements M-Sport has made to their cars and the proper service. He had a bunch of retirements last year that were technical faults already fixed on the M-Sport cars, his private car not having the updates. It probably would had been better if he had rented the car all along...

BigWorm

5th January 2018, 14:27

If he drove his own car, it wouldn't be an M-Sport fourth car, right? I mean he would rent a new Fiesta from M-Sport for certain events and tape it to OneBet livery. I think he would get better results with the improvements M-Sport has made to their cars and the proper service. He had a bunch of retirements last year that were technical faults already fixed on the M-Sport cars, his private car not having the updates. It probably would had been better if he had rented the car all along...
He was entered as M-Sport in 2017 but that was just how regulations were so I guess it wasn't a fourth car (unlike the Suninen/Kremer entries?).

I don't know what it costs to rent the car, but if he's planning to do a lot of events would it be cheaper to rent a Fiesta WRC than buying it?

Tarmop

5th January 2018, 14:42

Most definitely cheaper. Pay money and arrive with two hands in his pockets to testing/rally and after go home. No need for personnel, special equipment, equipment, their logistics etc.

AnttiL

5th January 2018, 14:53

He was entered as M-Sport in 2017 but that was just how regulations were so I guess it wasn't a fourth car (unlike the Suninen/Kremer entries?).
True, only registered factory teams were allowed to enter WRC2017 cars, but that changes for this year. However, Østberg had his own team, own mechanics and everything. Suninen was an M-Sport paying driver for the whole season (just alternating between R5 and WRC car) whereas Kremer just rented the car for one event. Suninen's car had an M-Sport livery with just added sponsor decals, Kremer had his own sponsor livery. Not sure about Bertelli, if he had his own mechanics or through M-Sport.

I don't know what it costs to rent the car, but if he's planning to do a lot of events would it be cheaper to rent a Fiesta WRC than buying it?

Not sure about the cost, but he probably would have received better value for his money by renting. I'm pretty convinced he lost podium positions by defects that wouldn't have happened in the official cars.

steve.mandzij

5th January 2018, 18:18

True, only registered factory teams were allowed to enter WRC2017 cars, but that changes for this year. However, Østberg had his own team, own mechanics and everything. Suninen was an M-Sport paying driver for the whole season (just alternating between R5 and WRC car) whereas Kremer just rented the car for one event. Suninen's car had an M-Sport livery with just added sponsor decals, Kremer had his own sponsor livery. Not sure about Bertelli, if he had his own mechanics or through M-Sport.

Not sure about the cost, but he probably would have received better value for his money by renting. I'm pretty convinced he lost podium positions by defects that wouldn't have happened in the official cars.What ever happened to Bertelli? He's been gone since Portugal and I've no idea where he's gone.

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AnttiL

5th January 2018, 18:19

Considering Suninen skips Tour de Corse and Deutschland, those are probably for Eric Camilli? Maybe he's going for a similar program as Suninen did in 2017, WRC2 with two strongest rallies in WRC.

PLuto

5th January 2018, 19:04

What ever happened to Bertelli? He's been gone since Portugal and I've no idea where he's gone.

He had a long break. But he was driving Tuscan Rewind in November last year.

Allez Andruet

5th January 2018, 20:04

What ever happened to Bertelli?
As long as he's not driving one of the 2017/2018-spec WRC's, I'm happy no matter where he is.

Andre Oliveira

5th January 2018, 20:14

Considering Suninen skips Tour de Corse and Deutschland, those are probably for Eric Camilli? Maybe he's going for a similar program as Suninen did in 2017, WRC2 with two strongest rallies in WRC.

I can imagine Bouffier doing that for example.

AnttiL

5th January 2018, 20:21

I can imagine Bouffier doing that for example.

It's just that Camilli announced earlier that he will be doing a mix of WRC2 and WRC this year. But yeah, why not Bouffier either.

nafpaktos

5th January 2018, 20:54

As long as he's not driving one of the 2017/2018-spec WRC's, I'm happy no matter where he is.
i don't think if he does it he will deprive a wrcar from another driver!!!so yes i would like to see one extra wrc in some rounds no matter who drives it.

Andre Oliveira

5th January 2018, 21:04

I have sure that will be 4 or 5 Fiesta WRC at Sweden ;)

AnttiL

5th January 2018, 21:34

I have sure that will be 4 or 5 Fiesta WRC at Sweden ;)

Sounds like Østberg! Or will it be Henning again on the start list? :P

Watson

5th January 2018, 23:27

That's good news indeed. Evernsince Gronholm, Hirvonen and Latvala it felt strange not having a Finnish driver in a Ford. Now M-Sport mainly employ a Frenchman, a Brit and a Finn. Pretty much what you'd expect from a rally driver's squad :D

Jarek Z

6th January 2018, 00:49

As long as he's not driving one of the 2017/2018-spec WRC's, I'm happy no matter where he is.

Me too. Can't believe anybody misses him.

pantealex

6th January 2018, 12:35

I miss all new cars and if there are no drivers then there will be less new cars.

Watson

6th January 2018, 14:26

I miss all new cars and if there are no drivers then there will be less new cars.

The new cars are waisted on Bertelli and the Sheikh. Especially with guys like Østberg and Tidemand out there.

Franky

6th January 2018, 14:28

The new cars are waisted on Bertelli and the Sheikh. Especially with guys like Østberg and Tidemand out there.

Who's got the money, drives. Simple

tommeke_B

6th January 2018, 15:17

The new cars are waisted on Bertelli and the Sheikh. Especially with guys like Østberg and Tidemand out there.

They're not wasted, it only hurts to your eyes a little bit... Without Al Qassimi there probably wouldn't be a Citroën WRT. Also M-Sport is still there largely because they can sell/rent cars to gentlemen drivers. It's not a waste to see a gentlemen driver in a WRC, it's usually because of that person that they've built that car. ;)

Fast Eddie WRC

6th January 2018, 15:53

Watching any 2017 WRC car in action is still a treat for the fans on the stages, whoever is driving. The more the merrier.

If these wealthy guys were only allowed to drive 2016 or R5 cars,
1. They wouldn't pay good money into the Teams
2. They would look crap compared to 2017's and
3. They wouldn't bother

Watson

6th January 2018, 21:49

At the end of the day they are hooning around for a goof and that makes the whole sport look silly.

Fast Eddie WRC

7th January 2018, 12:06

At the end of the day they are hooning around for a goof

If that's all they were doing they could do so much more easily and cheaply than in a 2017 WRC...

Andre Oliveira

8th January 2018, 14:07

Interesting Ford Performance logo. MC and TdC to Bryan :)

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DTBjjvYX4AEISKO?format=jpg&name=small

pantealex

8th January 2018, 14:11

Bouffier 2
Suninen 8
Now we have 10

Germany + 2 still missing

Fast Eddie WRC

8th January 2018, 14:37

Several websites (mostly Italian) and one or two other sources saying the Bouffier rumour is confirmed.

Known since 28th Dec... ;)

Jarek Z

8th January 2018, 14:41

Good luck to this underrated driver!

Andre Oliveira

8th January 2018, 14:52

He is on the clouds :)

https://www.m-sport.co.uk/m-sport-news/fiesta-rs-wrc/bouffier-confirmed-for-monte-and-corsica

BigWorm

8th January 2018, 15:12

Very happy for Bouffier, best of luck to him on the events!

Andre Oliveira

8th January 2018, 15:16

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DTB2BULXkAEUE0F?format=jpg&name=medium

Andre Oliveira

8th January 2018, 15:31

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DTB6aSNXUAAZzFB?format=jpg&name=medium

macebig

8th January 2018, 16:32

Patrick Bernardini throwback livery. Nice.

WUff1

8th January 2018, 16:51

His chicken dealer also got a new logo ;-)

Watson

8th January 2018, 17:25

Is that Bouffier livery real or just a guess?

And is TdC confirmed also?

Edit: Nevermind I just read the source.

Andre Oliveira

8th January 2018, 17:30

Fast Eddie WRC

8th January 2018, 18:19

MS-RT logo still bigger than Ford on the rear of Bouffier's car. FordPerformance replaces Ford Ecoboost on the sunstrip. A sign of what's to come...

Tarmop

8th January 2018, 18:30

It`s Bouffiers car, no conclusions can be made based on this livery.

Watson

8th January 2018, 18:39

Yes, from his Facebook page:

What a good news insn't it ?
Never i had imagined i would drive a so good car, even in my dreams, and i get the opportunity to do both Monte Carlo and Corsica with M-Sport.
It is just amazing !!!
Great challenge ahead.

Great news indeed. Hands down for those rallies they couldn't really have found anyone more capable anyway. Good to see these kinds of faces, it keeps everything more interesting and exciting. As if we didn't have enough things to look forward to next season anyway :)

PLuto

8th January 2018, 22:19

Known since 28th Dec... ;)

Rumour was here for a long time. Today it was officially confirmed. It is not surprise for lot of people, but finally it is official. And with design.

Fast Eddie WRC

9th January 2018, 11:48

Rumour was here for a long time. Today it was officially confirmed. It is not surprise for lot of people, but finally it is official. And with design.

It's officially confirmed now but earlier it was still confirmed by several sources.

pantealex

9th January 2018, 12:22

It's officially confirmed now but earlier it was still confirmed by several sources.

It was same with Tänak to Toyota, but you decided not to believe before official confirmed.

jacko

9th January 2018, 14:33

It's officially confirmed now but earlier it was still confirmed by several sources.
you can confirm it once, official and by those who are directly involved. All that (rumors) before is not-official so not confirmed. Offcorse, this news was in the line of what was comming up but the one and only real confirmation about this was yesterday. So please, do yourself a favor and stop here before you make things worse for yourself.

PLuto

9th January 2018, 15:45

It's officially confirmed now but earlier it was still confirmed by several sources.

To say the truth, I was in contact with Bryan regarding Monte since October, so I know very well what was the progress of this situation...

Fast Eddie WRC

9th January 2018, 18:25

leighton323

9th January 2018, 19:02

When lots of sources including rally websites say the same thing for days and then say it's "confirmed", then there's no point to still doubt it.

The word of one forum member did not 'confirm' Tanak to Toyota, so it was still a rumour.

@Jacko who asked you ? PLuto can speak for himself and I respect his opinion.Clearly people on this forum know more than others and some are also better at picking out who they are than others. Why do you do this to us, just stop, there is no more to argue.

Sent from my SM-G925I using Tapatalk

Fast Eddie WRC

10th January 2018, 19:12

Whatever... the Bouffier confirmation I heard was proven correct.

Anyway, here's a great podcast interview with Malcolm Wilson & Elfyn Evans on 2017 and the new season.

https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/133834/how-msport-plans-to-stay-on-top-of-the-wrc

AnttiL

11th January 2018, 10:24

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DTQP_ZMXkAAX4RC.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DTQP_ZQWsAAK_Va.jpg
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DTQP_ZLXUAEvxsJ.jpg

EstWRC

11th January 2018, 10:25

Really nice. They made the best one once again

Fast Eddie WRC

11th January 2018, 10:31

Only a tiny little Ford logo on the rear side...

Tarmop

11th January 2018, 10:38

And a FMC numberplate, big Fiesta on the grill+ Ford Performance on the windscreen (+ service logos, fan gear and overalls)

Andre Oliveira

11th January 2018, 10:45

https://fordeurope.blogspot.pt/2018/01/ford-extends-its-commitment-to-wrc.html?m=1

AnttiL

11th January 2018, 10:45

Only a tiny little Ford logo on the rear side...

Back and front as well

macebig

11th January 2018, 10:50

Same livery for Evans? That's great.

Tarmop

11th January 2018, 10:50

Back and front as well

Quite big on the front also.;)

mArvAlcao17

11th January 2018, 11:41

Same livery for Evans? That's great.

And Suninen. No, seriously.

Fast Eddie WRC

11th January 2018, 12:15

Back and front as well

Same as last year.

But the side is the big space and its all Red Bull and MS-RT.

When they asked Wilson how they kept Ogier he said it wasnt with the car... ie. it was money and that must be main sponsor Red Bull's.

AnttiL

11th January 2018, 13:08

Still nothing on Suninen's program or other third car news?

Watson

11th January 2018, 13:37

Still nothing on Suninen's program or other third car news?

Possibly because they still haven't figured out who will take the wheel in Germany, GB and Australia.

Maybe they're contemplaiting to give Suninen an option to take som of those rounds as well if he does very well earlier in the season.

Andre Oliveira

11th January 2018, 14:00

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DTQ7-05XcAAU8o4?format=jpg&name=large

pantealex

11th January 2018, 15:05

Only a tiny little Ford logo on the rear side...

just like toyota has.

Watson

11th January 2018, 15:34

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DTQ7-05XcAAU8o4?format=jpg&name=large

Red Bull livery also for R5? So that confirms his 3rd car programme?

Fast Eddie WRC

11th January 2018, 15:35

just like toyota has.

There's is bigger and on the door.

Fast Eddie WRC

11th January 2018, 16:11

Sooooo :cool:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DTRfNXGW0AIsUte.jpg

seb_sh

11th January 2018, 19:25

I quite like these liveries actually, probably the best overall looking car in the championship followed by Hyundai.

Andre Oliveira

11th January 2018, 22:10

https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/45/70/Ford-Fiesta-WRC-2018-014_457007_5a576efd5.jpg
https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/45/70/Ford-Fiesta-WRC-2018-007_457021_5a576efdb.jpg
https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/45/70/Ford-Fiesta-WRC-2018-008_457023_5a576efde.jpg

Andre Oliveira

11th January 2018, 22:15

https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/45/70/Ford-Fiesta-WRC-2018-011_457025_5a576efe1.jpg
https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/45/70/Ford-Fiesta-WRC-2018-010_457027_5a576efe3.jpg
https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/45/70/Ford-Fiesta-WRC-2018-009_457039_5a576efe7.jpg

Andre Oliveira

11th January 2018, 22:16

https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/45/69/Ford-Fiesta-WRC-2018-001_456983_5a576efbe.jpg
https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/45/69/Ford-Fiesta-WRC-2018-003_456987_5a576efc4.jpg
https://www.rallye-magazin.de/typo3temp/yag-galleries/45/70/Ford-Fiesta-WRC-2018-013_457001_5a576efcd.jpg

steve.mandzij

11th January 2018, 22:45

Spectacular livery! Now that's a diveplane sponsor well placed!

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Watson

12th January 2018, 07:31

https://rallysportmag.com/red-bull-extends-m-sport-backing-2018-wrc/

Red Bull increases the moneyflow towards M-Sport hence the WRC and R5 cars of Ogier, Evans, Suninen and Camilli will sport the same RB livery. (Which is great for my OCD)

News on Suninen's WRC program are expected in the coming weeks.

Andre Oliveira

12th January 2018, 13:20

Confirmation of Teemu Suninen

http://www.m-sport.co.uk/m-sport-news/fiesta-rs-wrc/m-sport-confirm-suninen-for-eight-rounds-in-ford-fiesta-wrc

AnttiL

12th January 2018, 13:28

I think it's pretty sure he'll do Sweden, Portugal, Sardegna, Finland, Spain and Wales. Probably one or two of the long hauls, he won WRC2 in Mexico in 2016. Turkey is also a big question mark.

Well I was close. Suninen confirmed for Sweden, Mexico, Portugal, Sardegna, Finland, Turkey, Wales and Catalunya. :)

Watson

12th January 2018, 13:45

confirmation of teemu suninen

http://www.m-sport.co.uk/m-sport-news/fiesta-rs-wrc/m-sport-confirm-suninen-for-eight-rounds-in-ford-fiesta-wrc

yess!

pantealex

12th January 2018, 15:08

Andre Oliveira

12th January 2018, 15:12

Block at Argentina, Camilli at Germany and Bertelli at Australia eheh

steve.mandzij

12th January 2018, 15:22

3rd WRC18 driver for:

Argentina ?

Germany ?

Australia ?

Argentina must be driven with same set-up than Mexico, so who has similar driving-style than Suninen ?
or are they just taking rich local ? or Camilli maybe ?Rich local wouldn't be too far fetched I feel. Kremer in Germany, Ligato in Argentina and ??? for Australia

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Fast Eddie WRC

12th January 2018, 15:30

As expected, M-Sport keeping to its history and developing another young driver. Good for him, good for rallying and hopefully good for the Team.

Go Teemu !!

Andre Oliveira

12th January 2018, 16:05

Greensmith in WRC2

http://www.m-sport.co.uk/m-sport-news/fiesta-r5/greensmith-confirms-eight-round-campaign-with-fiesta-r5-and-wrc-2

Myrvold

12th January 2018, 17:11

Block at Argentina, Camilli at Germany and Bertelli at Australia eheh

For some reason, I would not be surprised at all. Maybe play switcharoo with Bertelli and Block.

macebig

12th January 2018, 17:13

Very difficult for Block to reappear in WRC. M Sport is now very close to Red Bull and he is a prominent promoter of Monster Energy.

rallyfiend

12th January 2018, 17:18

Very difficult for Block to reappear in WRC. M Sport is now very close to Red Bull and he is a prominent promoter of Monster Energy.

It's never worried them before and shouldn't be a problem again.

For many years in America, Ken (Monster) and Travis (Red Bull) were in the same team!

macebig

12th January 2018, 17:26

It's never worried them before and shouldn't be a problem again.

For many years in America, Ken (Monster) and Travis (Red Bull) were in the same team!

True, but we are a decade removed from then. Monster wasn't that big and every promotion they would take was fine. Possibly Red Bull didn't think they were much of a threat in those days.

Tarmop

12th January 2018, 18:09

Well, shouldn`t be a problem, there aren`t any RB logos on Bouffiers car either. In Ogier`s and Evans`s case RB is their personal sponsor, maybe they also made a deal with Suninen...or they are sponsoring the whole team... Anyway third car should be considered as a rental, when Suninen isn`t driving it.

steve.mandzij

12th January 2018, 18:19

rallyfiend

12th January 2018, 18:47

Probably similar to VW, where Latvala wasn't a RB driver but the whole team was RB sponsored.

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Latvala was a RB athlete when he drove for VW

steve.mandzij

12th January 2018, 18:52

Latvala was a RB athlete when he drove for VWOh! My bad. I thought he wasn't because his helmet didn't have any RB branding unlike Mikkelsen and Ogier

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Co-driven

12th January 2018, 19:46

Rich local wouldn't be too far fetched I feel. Kremer in Germany, Ligato in Argentina and ??? for Australia

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Ligato retired from rallies at the end of 2017 season, but said that in 2018 he'd like to do Rally Argentina in a World Rally Car (and he will be on the first rounds of the National Championship to be fit).

Maybe, he really would be the guy in the M-Sport car, although his latest rallies with a WRC was with Citroen.

AnttiL

12th January 2018, 19:57

Bertelli announced he's doing one WRC round, so nominating him is better than nothing if the main drivers fail...Bertelli did Argentina last year and retired from gearbox problems from eight place but also there were less works cars (only two Toyotas and two Citroens).

Tarmop

12th January 2018, 20:51

AnttiL

12th January 2018, 21:03

He also rolled.

That was in Mexico

Andre Oliveira

17th January 2018, 21:04

https://scontent.fopo2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/26804453_1997068253655925_8968998021056957852_n.jp g?oh=ff80994caddf9a7d40c716e72cd65763&oe=5AE27EF3

Watson

18th January 2018, 18:06

https://www.motorsport.com/wrc/news/suninen-expanded-m-sport-programme-997118/

Teemu Suninen might get more WRC starts than previously anounced.

He also talks about his chances of winning in Finland as well as his strenghts and weeknesses.

Fast Eddie WRC

18th January 2018, 18:54

I guess it will also depend how well he does in the first half of the season. If he does well it will make sense to give him more rounds as he will have more experience with the car than any 'rich local'...

ESTR

18th January 2018, 19:33

More or less if some bloke shows money he will probably not be in the car for more rounds despite of his strong performance. This is reality.

Fast Eddie WRC

18th January 2018, 20:23

More or less if some bloke shows money he will probably not be in the car for more rounds despite of his strong performance. This is reality.

But this year M-Sport has more Ford support (money) .

If they still need points towards the Championships then why just take money from someone who wont win any..

ESTR

19th January 2018, 02:57

But this year M-Sport has more Ford support (money) .

If they still need points towards the Championships then why just take money from someone who wont win any..

It's because they don't really care about WRC that much. They throw some more bucks into the game and that's it. Still Redbull providing a lot od money. If they were interested, they would immediately reveal not just wait till the dead lines. And for few years not just this one, where Ogier is still in game and they have a chance of another trophy.

AnttiL

19th January 2018, 06:01

But this year M-Sport has more Ford support (money) .

If they still need points towards the Championships then why just take money from someone who wont win any..

Not that much more money. My guess is still that they had reserved some rallies for Camilli, but he's struggling for budget or the team wants to see how the start of the season goes before allocating the third car for the remaining rallies. If they're going to Mexico with three cars it should make sense to do it also for Argentina.

Tarmop

19th January 2018, 09:19

It's because they don't really care about WRC that much. They throw some more bucks into the game and that's it. Still Redbull providing a lot od money. If they were interested, they would immediately reveal not just wait till the dead lines. And for few years not just this one, where Ogier is still in game and they have a chance of another trophy.

FP is also involved in developing. Don`t underestimate it that much. RB seems to be there yes, but in what terms exactly, who knows. Salary maybe.

Franky

19th January 2018, 10:40

Guys, you do understand that you are talking about M-Sport? If the crews are paying, I'm sure M-Sport are ready to use all the cars they have available. After all, that's one way how they earn money.

Watson

19th January 2018, 12:16

Guys, you do understand that you are talking about M-Sport? If the crews are paying, I'm sure M-Sport are ready to use all the cars they have available. After all, that's one way how they earn money.

Suninen's seat will be backed by M-Sport and RB as well. His seat is guaranteed, he'll probably get the third car permanently from 2019 onwards. If someone wants to pay for a seat in those rounds they'll get a fourth car like Østberg, Bertelli and Kremer did last year.

It's not that hard to undetstand guys, keep up.

mArvAlcao17

20th January 2018, 02:04

1499

1500

mArvAlcao17

20th January 2018, 02:12

I wish best of luck to Camilli & Greensmith in WRC 2 this year (not sure about Suninen because he will do more rallies in WRC car)

but tbf i'm not sure 5-year old Fiesta R5 (i know they did some upgrade) can cope against factory Skoda. Just look how Tidemand dominate last year.

Imo, it's just a matter of time for new Fiesta R5 based on new road car to roll on.

ESTR

20th January 2018, 06:10

They have Evo2 edition which I remember they reveal last year. And that's not so long ago. Still much better car than DS3 or 208..

mArvAlcao17

20th January 2018, 06:54

They have Evo2 edition which I remember they reveal last year. And that's not so long ago. Still much better car than DS3 or 208..

not 100% sure if it's compared to Fabia tbh, but still pretty damn competitive

AnttiL

20th January 2018, 07:52

Kalle Rovanperä drove Fabia, Fiesta and 208 last year. He said 208 has so bad torque it's almost like a S2000 car. The Fiesta was supposedly quite different to drive than the Fabia and he had to adjust his driving style.

Fast Eddie WRC

21st January 2018, 20:47

Dont remember if it was already announced but Bouffier has confirmed he has a two rally deal with M-Sport... Monte and Corsica.

racerx1979

21st January 2018, 21:09

dimviii

21st January 2018, 21:15

at Monte plenty depents at tyre choice,so he could have a good result,if the weather/road/tyre choice circumstances allow or favour him
At Corsica i dont think that he can be fast against wrc regulars.

denkimi

21st January 2018, 22:14

Does anyone think Bouffier has the skills to place top 7/8 in those events. He’s obviously a skilled driver but with minimal testing and zero experience in a new spec WR car he will be far off from the rest in my opinion.
of course, if he doesn't crash. there's only 11 factory wrc drivers in monte, and half of them is going to retire.

but i do expect him to be the slowest, especially in the beginning.

A FONDO

22nd January 2018, 08:43

5th place is absolutely achievable on Monte.

seb_sh

22nd January 2018, 10:46

I think Bouffier is like an insurance policy and wildcard for MSport in the Monte. He is expected to finish and could finish well if some cars retire. Furthermore he could be a wildcard if conditions are unpredictable and he gets a good tyre choice.

For Corsica I guess he's a safer option than Suninen, plus maybe he got enough budget for 2 rounds so he chose his home event.

Fast Eddie WRC

22nd January 2018, 11:50

Bouffier cartainly didnt lack for commitment on his Monte PET...

AnttiL

22nd January 2018, 11:55

For Corsica I guess he's a safer option than Suninen, plus maybe he got enough budget for 2 rounds so he chose his home event.

I think Suninen just couldn't get a budget for full season. But on last year's TDC, Suninen was faster than Bouffier on the two stages Bouffier drove before retiring (althougn not sure if he had problems with the car)

Fast Eddie WRC

22nd January 2018, 12:07

MS-RT Monte preview:
http://www.m-sport.co.uk/m-sport-news/fiesta-rs-wrc/cards-on-the-table-for-season-opener-in-monte-carlo

AnttiL

22nd January 2018, 12:08

MS-RT Monte preview:
http://www.m-sport.co.uk/m-sport-news/fiesta-rs-wrc/cards-on-the-table-for-season-opener-in-monte-carlo

M-Sport not MS-RT

pantealex

22nd January 2018, 13:06

M-Sport not MS-RT

are those 2 different companies ?

AnttiL

22nd January 2018, 14:12

are those 2 different companies ?

At least different brands, probably also at least separate subcompanies. MS-RT makes road cars, M-Sport motorsport vehicles.

liposh

22nd January 2018, 14:22

Wau, AnttiL is right. Until today I thought the MS-RT stands for "M-sport Rally Team" ...Frankly I have never wondered what does it stand for.

car

22nd January 2018, 14:42

At least different brands, probably also at least separate subcompanies. MS-RT makes road cars, M-Sport motorsport vehicles.

MS-RT is M-Sport Rally Team

there is also MS-RT Road Technology, which is M-Sport Rally Team Road Technology

(from their website)

AnttiL

22nd January 2018, 14:51

MS-RT is M-Sport Rally Team

there is also MS-RT Road Technology, which is M-Sport Rally Team Road Technology

(from their website)

Where exactly on their website? I found this:

MS-RT are a British collaboration between vehicle specialists Van-Sport and motorsport legend Malcolm Wilson.
---
the MS-RT supported team won the season opener – the Monte Carlo Rally. They also lead both the Drivers and Manufacturers Championships.

https://www.ms-rt.co.uk/about-us/#content-exterior

Most of the news stories also speak about MS-RT supported Ford Fiesta WRC's.

So MS-RT is a World Rally Team which is backed by MS-RT? Does not make sense.

car

22nd January 2018, 15:02

Where exactly on their website? I found this:

https://www.ms-rt.co.uk/about-us/#content-exterior

Most of the news stories also speak about MS-RT supported Ford Fiesta WRC's.

So MS-RT is a World Rally Team which is backed by MS-RT? Does not make sense.

MS_RT Road Technology https://www.ms-rt.co.uk/

MS-RT M-Sport rally team (reference in clothing range) https://www.m-sportstore.com/collections/new-in/products/m-sport-supporters-club-membership-2017-2018

AnttiL

22nd January 2018, 15:20

MS_RT Road Technology https://www.ms-rt.co.uk/

MS-RT M-Sport rally team (reference in clothing range) https://www.m-sportstore.com/collections/new-in/products/m-sport-supporters-club-membership-2017-2018

MS-RT probably just supporting that product. I don't see their logo elsewhere in the store.

car

22nd January 2018, 15:25

MS-RT probably just supporting that product. I don't see their logo elsewhere in the store.

looks clear to me. wouldn't lose any sleep over it mate. Give them a call if it's bugging you that much.

AnttiL

22nd January 2018, 15:29

looks clear to me. wouldn't lose any sleep over it mate. Give them a call if it's bugging you that much.

:)

Fast Eddie WRC

22nd January 2018, 16:02

M-Sport not MS-RT

I now use MS-RT because:

1. That is what everything in my supporter's club pack uses - letter head, membership card, car sticker, keyring & cap

and

2. Its easier to type.

CWJ

22nd January 2018, 16:57

I now use MS-RT because:

1. That is what everything in my supporter's club pack uses - letter head, membership card, car sticker, keyring & cap

and ... still rides with Ott Tanak at Rallyday ;)

AnttiL

22nd January 2018, 17:43

I now use MS-RT because:

1. That is what everything in my supporter's club pack uses - letter head, membership card, car sticker, keyring & cap

MS-RT definitely supports that package.

2. Its easier to type.
A whole of two letters shorter...

Fast Eddie WRC

23rd January 2018, 11:29

A whole of two letters shorter...

And all uppercase..

As the old M-Sport logo is absent from all but the 2018 cap, I think MS-RT is now equally acceptable as the name of the team.

AnttiL

23rd January 2018, 11:32

And all uppercase..

As the old M-Sport logo is absent from all but the 2018 cap, I think MS-RT is now equally acceptable as the name of the team.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DUOHyAfXUAAT7gJ.jpg

You can see both logos on Ogier's car. M-Sport's logo is on the bumper corner. MS-RT is just a sponsor that is connected with the team just like Ford Performance. Also, it clearly says "Road Technology" below MS-RT.

Fast Eddie WRC

23rd January 2018, 11:40

My final word.

My membership card states:
MS-RT Supporters Club.

I dont think I am supporting the Road Technology....

AnttiL

23rd January 2018, 11:56

My final word.

My membership card states:
MS-RT Supporters Club.

I dont think I am supporting the Road Technology....

https://www.m-sportstore.com/products/m-sport-supporters-club-membership-2017-2018

In here it's called M-Sport Supporters Club. Or is that a different club? :P

I remember people wondering how the package can be so cheap (http://www.motorsportforums.com/showthread.php?28825-M-Sport-Ford-World-Rally-Teams&p=1156666&viewfull=1#post1156666). This is the reason, MS-RT pays for it and in exchange gets promotion by people wearing their logos.

Watson

23rd January 2018, 13:30

Anttil is right. MS-RT upgrade Ford vans and trucks. M-Sport is just M-Sport.

pantealex

23rd January 2018, 14:00

My final word.

My membership card states:
MS-RT Supporters Club.

I dont think I am supporting the Road Technology....

Seems to me that you really are supporting Road Technology ;)

seb_sh

24th January 2018, 07:22

3 pages of debating the acceptable name of a team, good thing Monte is starting soon! :D

Alex009

24th January 2018, 12:59

car

24th January 2018, 14:36

Idiots. MS-RT is not the M-Sport rally team. It's road technology company or brand, making Ford vans and that kind of stuff. And supporting the rally team. M-Sport is behind the MS-RT with Van-Sport (british company) but M-Sport rally team is different thing.

Van Sport FB-page (https://www.facebook.com/vansportuk/)

Alex009 - calling people idiots is a bit harsh... And to go one further, you probably feel like a bit of a tail, because you are not correct.

MS-RT actually stands for BOTH M-Sport and Road Technology. M-Sport as a standalone brand no longer exists and they are covering both the rally/ prep side and the Road Technology side with the new MS-RT branding.

sad, but I emailed them to ask..

Simmi

24th January 2018, 16:29

Thanks car. That's that issue settled then. Can we go back to complaining about the Panasonic sticker on the Toyota now ;)

car

24th January 2018, 16:37

Thanks car. That's that issue settled then. Can we go back to complaining about the Panasonic sticker on the Toyota now ;)

Don’t get me started! First time I saw them, I thought they had just ‘placed’ them there so they could decide what to do with them...

Fast Eddie WRC

24th January 2018, 18:39

Alex009 - calling people idiots is a bit harsh... And to go one further, you probably feel like a bit of a tail, because you are not correct.

MS-RT actually stands for BOTH M-Sport and Road Technology. M-Sport as a standalone brand no longer exists and they are covering both the rally/ prep side and the Road Technology side with the new MS-RT branding.

sad, but I emailed them to ask..

Cheers. I did the same but I couldnt be bothered arguing any more.

EstWRC

24th January 2018, 19:37

https://twitter.com/MSportLtd/status/956248285383217152

this is great!!! one of the guys from estonian forum wanted this to be delivered to Mister Wilson by the estonians who went to Monte and as you can see, it is done :)

dimviii

24th January 2018, 19:47

EstWRC

24th January 2018, 19:53

names of the guys who have been in m-sport, Tänak, Järveoja, Mölder, Sikk and then Thank you and Rally Fans Est 2017

Fast Eddie WRC

24th January 2018, 21:17

names of the guys who have been in m-sport, Tänak, Järveoja, Mölder, Sikk and then Thank you and Rally Fans Est 2017

Very nice touch.

That's how things should be when people move on.

PS. Like the new avatar EStWRC !

Fast Eddie WRC

24th January 2018, 21:22

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DUVWTdDXUAAa4iW.jpg:large

A FONDO

24th January 2018, 21:31

Why ,why someone would crop this photo :(

mArvAlcao17

25th January 2018, 02:32

Why ,why someone would crop this photo :(

it wasn't cropped

Watson

25th January 2018, 18:23

https://www.rallye-magazin.de/index.php?id=6196&tx_yag_pi1%5Brm%5D%5BalbumUid%5D=2127&tx_yag_pi1%5Brm%5D%5BgalleryUid%5D=1202&tx_yag_pi1%5BitemListOffset%5D=5&tx_yag_pi1%5Baction%5D=show&tx_yag_pi1%5Bcontroller%5D=Item&cHash=c13b3c6757fa530b9cbf29d1f23c11b8

I suppose the Cosworth sticker only refers to the electronics?

Sulland

25th January 2018, 18:33

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DUVWTdDXUAAa4iW.jpg:large

Does the WRCar have different rear light layout than the fish hook look of the production car?

Tarmop

25th January 2018, 18:52

No. More powerful lines of a WRC car make it look that way, otherwise std.

A FONDO

25th January 2018, 22:04

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/DUa2b7jXcAkCgfT.jpg:large

A FONDO

28th January 2018, 13:56

Fiesta RS Alpine Cat edition

http://hostthenpost.org/uploads/75e2a363d190f11c1b2ee783512eab12.jpg

Fast Eddie WRC

28th January 2018, 22:31

Monte victory report:
http://www.m-sport.co.uk/m-sport-news/fiesta-rs-wrc/ogier-wins-monte-as-m-sport-ford-lead-the-way

Andre Oliveira

28th January 2018, 23:09

https://scontent.fopo2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/26993782_2010115352351215_7743482258647179598_n.jp g?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&oh=dc941037e1f541cf0ce18e7497879280&oe=5B23844E

N.O.T

29th January 2018, 00:23

"raced is the WRC"

chinless burger should not be allowed near a WRC event again in his life....

Watson

29th January 2018, 04:22

"raced is the WRC"

chinless burger should not be allowed near a WRC event again in his life....

I guess that's the price we have to pay for the Ford Performance backing. Ford USA are so desperate to have him compete somewhere. I wonder why. He's an excellent stuntman. Just leave it at that, it's fine as it is.

RAS007

29th January 2018, 04:33

https://scontent.fopo2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/fr/cp0/e15/q65/26993782_2010115352351215_7743482258647179598_n.jp g?efg=eyJpIjoidCJ9&oh=dc941037e1f541cf0ce18e7497879280&oe=5B23844E

Oh dear.

racerx1979

29th January 2018, 05:35

andyone

29th January 2018, 06:02

Ken is a showman and that’s it. He’s a good driver but lacks WRC skills to compete at top level. I’m sure Ford USA will pay for a few rallies. I was spectating AUS in 2010-11 and remember hearing a roar from the crowd. Thought it was Loeb or something but it was Ken Block. Everyone yelling his name (blockie in Aus) and wearing his hats like he was world champion. Dude is a marketing machine and for that alone they will sponsor the guy. I’m sure he will do a rally or two and come in 10-11th place behind Kopecky and Pontus and then blame it on pace notes as he always has.

lol we who know WRC might not like him on the race. but i can tell you the non WRC fan know him very well. and think he is like the Best in WRC, i once had a serious argument with someone. when i told him. Ken block sucked in rally. he never understood me.

as illustrated with someone. he is more of a show man. and he racing in WRC will bring more viewers to WRC and making it more popular. which makes more sponsorship opportunities. maybe they should give him an R5 so he race with pontus. which he will still loose

L555MAT

29th January 2018, 07:25

lol we who know WRC might not like him on the race. but i can tell you the non WRC fan know him very well. and think he is like the Best in WRC, i once had a serious argument with someone. when i told him. Ken block sucked in rally. he never understood me.

as illustrated with someone. he is more of a show man. and he racing in WRC will bring more viewers to WRC and making it more popular. which makes more sponsorship opportunities. maybe they should give him an R5 so he race with pontus. which he will still loose

This! Anything which will boost the profile of WRC is welcome. Even in a new generation WRC car i think Block would struggle to beat the leading wrc2 drivers let alone the wrc. Still hes more than welcone and his cars usually have a good colour scheme

Eli

29th January 2018, 07:39

This! Anything which will boost the profile of WRC is welcome. Even in a new generation WRC car i think Block would struggle to beat the leading wrc2 drivers let alone the wrc. Still hes more than welcone and his cars usually have a good colour scheme

True that, his liveries are nice to look at and if he's slowest of the WRC cars you'll get a longer look at it ;)

Tarmop

29th January 2018, 07:49

More money for M-Sport is also good.

L555MAT

29th January 2018, 07:58

True that, his liveries are nice to look at and if he's slowest of the WRC cars you'll get a longer look at it ;)

😂😂

A FONDO

29th January 2018, 08:06

I would love to see him again in WRC as I always did. He's certainly not a bad driver and provides multimedia (don't know how to explain this but in 2011-12 he was the first one with daily reports and behind the scenes footage and explanations. People are just jealous that their favorites get less attention despite setting faster times than him. But this is modern marketing.

AnttiL

29th January 2018, 08:49

It's kind of same as Kimi Räikkönen doing WRC. It gives exposure but not competition. Win or lose?

mknight

29th January 2018, 08:59

It's kind of same as Kimi Räikkönen doing WRC. It gives exposure but not competition. Win or lose?

Win, much better than Bertelli for example.

Aquagen

29th January 2018, 09:05

It's kind of same as Kimi Räikkönen doing WRC. It gives exposure but not competition. Win or lose?

Sorry, but I think they are absolutely opposite from the competition point of view. PR fun driver vs F1 circuit professional (doesn't matter Kimi or Kubica).
And of course it will be good to see all of them in WRC - Kimi, Robert, Valentino, Ken, Petter, please welcome :)

AnttiL

29th January 2018, 09:40

Sorry, but I think they are absolutely opposite from the competition point of view. PR fun driver vs F1 circuit professional (doesn't matter Kimi or Kubica).
And of course it will be good to see all of them in WRC - Kimi, Robert, Valentino, Ken, Petter, please welcome :)

Well I see it similar in the way that Kimi and Ken are popular characters and professionals in driving cars fast but not rallying. Kimi's expertise is more in competition but Ken's expertise is closer to rallying than Kimi's.

Is Petter on your list Petter Solberg? If it is, I don't see the logic...