M-Sport Ford World Rally Teams

[Danny0405]

Well, a two-car team doesn't really fight for the manufacturers title. As for drivers title, a three-car team could also just give all their test days to the lead driver.

Serderidis and other privateers are most likely outside test day limits as long as they don't drive for manufacturer points. And we saw this in Acropolis 2021: Serderidis drove the third Fiesta WRC but not for manufacturer points. I assume the same would happen this year.

Yep, I’m on the same line; with cars quite close and considering the level of the drivers today, it’s almost impossible to target the Manufacturer title with 2 «*true*» drivers. Serderidis or Bertelli half-time would change nothing to that, it was more a question about how test days works for privateers.
In 2019, Citroen said they will target it in addition to WDC (or at least that it was possible) but it was impossible.
M-Sport is quite honest on that point and on their situation, it’s logical. All on Tanak, a backed driver in the 2nd one and whatever client pays in the 3rd one but not as a manufacturer entry. And even for Loubet, I think he is here because they won’t be credible without a 2nd reasonable car and because they are forced to have a 2nd car everywhere by the regulation; else, they may even have not taken him if they could have.

[seb_sh]

Yep, I’m on the same line; with cars quite close and considering the level of the drivers today, it’s almost impossible to target the Manufacturer title with 2 «*true*» drivers. Serderidis or Bertelli half-time would change nothing to that, it was more a question about how test days works for privateers.
In 2019, Citroen said they will target it in addition to WDC (or at least that it was possible) but it was impossible.
M-Sport is quite honest on that point and on their situation, it’s logical. All on Tanak, a backed driver in the 2nd one and whatever client pays in the 3rd one but not as a manufacturer entry. And even for Loubet, I think he is here because they won’t be credible without a 2nd reasonable car and because they are forced to have a 2nd car everywhere by the regulation; else, they may even have not taken him if they could have.

Loubet also has some budget as far as I know, so he covers part of the cost and has some future potential so is a good fit for the 2nd nominated car.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

The impact of the cost of Tanak on M-Sport's ability to run multiple entries cant be ignored. It's not just all-in with Tanak on the sporting level, but also the financial one.

Everyone is glad they brought him into the team for the sake of the 2023 WRC, so need to cut them some slack in terms of the others they are able to employ.

[EstWRC]

During this quiet time M-sport posted something to watch

Roadbook of Loeb having fun at the Milton keys event https://youtu.be/ATyNvIYP6jM

[EstWRC]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230101/faefe9f17b20bcdc6205d0fb3bde743b.jpg

[WRCStan]

Looks like an ASOS model.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230101/faefe9f17b20bcdc6205d0fb3bde743b.jpg

A very basic suit... no extra sponsors.

[cali]

A very basic suit... no extra sponsors.It's from testing

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[macebig]

Same suit they gave to Fourmaux and Breen in testing/promotional material before 2022.

[seb_sh]

Same suit they gave to Fourmaux and Breen in testing/promotional material before 2022.

I hope they washed it inbetween! :P

[Sulland]

As said here, only a testsuit. Team has still not presented team and sponsors for 23 yet.


https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230101/faefe9f17b20bcdc6205d0fb3bde743b.jpg

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Test suit was plain Sparco...

https://static.wixstatic.com/media/89553f_b3680365a974476cb6d4407d5ef90650~mv2.jpg/v1/fill/w_640,h_960,al_c,q_85,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01,enc_auto/89553f_b3680365a974476cb6d4407d5ef90650~mv2.jpg

[cali]

Test suit was plain Sparco...

https://static.wixstatic.com/media/89553f_b3680365a974476cb6d4407d5ef90650~mv2.jpg/v1/fill/w_640,h_960,al_c,q_85,usm_0.66_1.00_0.01,enc_auto/89553f_b3680365a974476cb6d4407d5ef90650~mv2.jpgHav en't you considered there's more than one suit available? And they haven't only tested once?

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[Sal yet again]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230101/faefe9f17b20bcdc6205d0fb3bde743b.jpg

Looks like no expense was spent on photoshopping Ott's head onto a stock picture..

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Haven't you considered there's more than one suit available? And they haven't only tested once?

Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

He has only tested once by all accounts and said he preferred to rest with his family before the new season starts.

https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/tanak-would-rather-rest-than-test-puma-this-year/

[cali]

He has only tested once by all accounts and said he preferred to rest with his family before the new season starts.

https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/tanak-would-rather-rest-than-test-puma-this-year/Photoshop? Like I said there's many options that we do not know or are unaware of. It's too early to jump to any conclusions and in a few weeks time we will definitely find out.
Also don't believe everything they are putting out to the media, especially Tänak has been many times misleading the media, playing his own game.
Patience my friend.

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[wyler]

if this is leading to a black livery as one from history, i'll be pretty happy!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

This would look cool...

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRmk9ikWnalzIgfTnU920FeBEPobAFqZ woOgw&usqp=CAU

[EstWRC]

Ready for tomorrow
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230106/8532882211116f6c581f1728a8cc88b7.jpg


As I understand Loubet will be first and Tänak later

Pic Source https://twitter.com/planetemarcus/status/1611402565362614273?s=46&t=0PVbMIl2XiEfvimqi6kDFw

[becher]

Ready for tomorrow
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230106/8532882211116f6c581f1728a8cc88b7.jpg


As I understand Loubet will be first and Tänak later

Pic Source https://twitter.com/planetemarcus/status/1611402565362614273?s=46&t=0PVbMIl2XiEfvimqi6kDFw
Looks nice in the testing "livery"

[Managarium]

Finally

[Fast Eddie WRC]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fl3UxcsXEAIZZ_3?format=jpg&name=large

[Eli]

By the way, a small trivia detail, it’s the first time since 2004 the ford cars are carrying the #7 & #8, the only difference being the country flags which are the opposite (Duval was No. 8 back then).

[AnttiL]

By the way, a small trivia detail, it’s the first time since 2004 the ford cars are carrying the #7 & #8, the only difference being the country flags which are the opposite (Duval was No. 8 back then).

Duval had Belgian flag and Loubet has French flag

[Eli]

Duval had Belgian flag and Loubet has French flag

Well then, good thing we have Gilsoul ;)

[Andre Oliveira]

Since they implemented that bullshit of chosen numbers… that type of info lost value.

[AnttiL]

Since they implemented that bullshit of chosen numbers… that type of info lost value.

This year we would have

1 Rovanperä
2 Evans
3 Katsuta / Ogier
4 Neuville
5 Lappi
6 Sordo / Breen
7 Tänak
8 Loubet
9 Serderidis
10+ Katsuta, Bertelli etc

[EstWRC]

IMO it’s not a bullshit system

Back in the day you had to get used to the drivers having new numbers again from time to time

Now I’m so used that Thierry is 11, Ott is 8 and etc

[Eli]

This year we would have

1 Rovanperä
2 Evans
3 Katsuta / Ogier
4 Neuville
5 Lappi
6 Sordo / Breen
7 Tänak
8 Loubet
9 Serderidis
10+ Katsuta, Bertelli etc

Will we get to see Rovanperä wearing no. 1 for the first time this year?

[Andre Oliveira]

He would be crazy if not pick 1 instead of child option 69.

[AnttiL]

He would be crazy if not pick 1 instead of child option 69.

#KR69 is a big brand for him though. I mean, the permanent numbers were created for this reason, to be brands.

But personally I agree with you, champion should be #1.

[EstWRC]

lol dude is really mad at this system

[becher]

He would be crazy if not pick 1 instead of child option 69.
But what if he's up side down?

[Eli]

He would be crazy if not pick 1 instead of child option 69.

and yet he went for no.69.

[Franky]

IMO it’s not a bullshit system

Back in the day you had to get used to the drivers having new numbers again from time to time

Now I’m so used that Thierry is 11, Ott is 8 and etc

I still haven't bothered to learn their numbers.

[SubaruNorway]

If Toyota can't manage to put flags on their cars this year, I'm gonna loose it. I can barely tell who it is skipping frames in my video's!!!

[240RS]

If Toyota can't manage to put flags on their cars this year, I'm gonna loose it. I can barely tell who it is skipping frames in my video's!!!

I really do miss the large door numbers. Would probably care for who picks what number if they brought back those. .

[Fast Eddie WRC]

None of this is M-Sport news...

[Managarium]

If Toyota can't manage to put flags on their cars this year, I'm gonna loose it. I can barely tell who it is skipping frames in my video's!!!

They had a small ribbon on door mirrors.

Evans red one, Ogier and Lappi white one and as I can see, Rovanpera did not had any.

[SubaruNorway]

They had a small ribbon on door mirrors.

Evans red one, Ogier and Lappi white one and as I can see, Rovanpera did not had any.

I know, even those are hard to see especially the red against black. Katsuta also black but some different stickers.

[krzaki]

Could you explain me why Loeb not start on Monte?
This is big mistake.....

[AnttiL]

Could you explain me why Loeb not start on Monte?
This is big mistake.....

- Dakar
- Tänak

[krzaki]

- Dakar
- Tänak

OK
Strange decision because experience Loeb`s on Monte is better than Ogier....
Tanak could be learn from Loeb about Monte...

[Sulland]

We wont see changes in manning until after Mexico. Maybe for Mexico if Loubet goes off in the two first rallies.

[HKSjbg]

Loeb doesn’t have enough time to finish Dakar then get over to do the Monte recce, nothing can be done by M-Sport or Loeb about that

[becher]

Also i doubt that a top line driver needs help even if said help would come from Loeb.

[Rallyest]

What i think is little bit of worrying before the new season, is that Both Hyundai and Toyota have upgraded their cars in one way or another, but Ford has not done anything, atleast i dont see any changes and no info about it anywhere also. maybe they are waiting for some feedback and instructions from Tänak so they wouldnt rush with pointless updates, but i guess we will see after Sweden, Monte is not so much about car performance as it is about driver skill and knowledge of the rally.
No info even about the engine update anymore

[cali]

What i think is little bit of worrying before the new season, is that Both Hyundai and Toyota have upgraded their cars in one way or another, but Ford has not done anything, atleast i dont see any changes and no info about it anywhere also. maybe they are waiting for some feedback and instructions from Tänak so they wouldnt rush with pointless updates, but i guess we will see after Sweden, Monte is not so much about car performance as it is about driver skill and knowledge of the rally.
No info even about the engine update anymoreThey don't have to talk about updates all the time. I'm sure they have work in progress

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[EstWRC]

What i think is little bit of worrying before the new season, is that Both Hyundai and Toyota have upgraded their cars in one way or another, but Ford has not done anything, atleast i dont see any changes and no info about it anywhere also. maybe they are waiting for some feedback and instructions from Tänak so they wouldnt rush with pointless updates, but i guess we will see after Sweden, Monte is not so much about car performance as it is about driver skill and knowledge of the rally.
No info even about the engine update anymore

Team: Toyota
Upgrades: engine modifications, loosing the massive air scoops, modifications to rear wing

Team: Hyundai
Upgrades: aero modifications all through the car with massive futuristic rear wing

Team: M-sport
Upgrades: Tänak

[Rallyest]

Team: Toyota
Upgrades: engine modifications, loosing the massive air scoops, modifications to rear wing

Team: Hyundai
Upgrades: aero modifications all through the car with massive futuristic rear wing

Team: M-sport
Upgrades: Tänak

Well if you put it that way, then M-sport has made the biggest and best upgrade possible

[TWRC]

Team: Toyota
Upgrades: engine modifications, loosing the massive air scoops, modifications to rear wing

Team: Hyundai
Upgrades: aero modifications all through the car with massive futuristic rear wing

Team: M-sport
Upgrades: Tänak
Do we know if M-Sport will implement their engine developments aleady, or are they waiting for later in the season?

[Zoli]

Well if you put it that way, then M-sport has made the biggest and best upgrade possible

Well, a good driver can drive at the limit of the car, but if that limit is far below the other two cars'...

[Andre Oliveira]

Hope a decent livery.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

M-Sport still hopeful of Loeb WRC deal...
https://www.autosport.com/wrc/news/m-sport-still-hopeful-of-loeb-wrc-deal-/10420344/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=RSS-WRC&utm_term=News&utm_content=uk

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Well if you put it that way, then M-sport has made the biggest and best upgrade possible

And the most expensive...

[EstWRC]

Seems that some kind of retro livery is coming https://twitter.com/msportltd/status/1614626491215785986?s=46&t=_rV2RW3cyh_cZaT93AqBNA

[macebig]

Hints to the blue Escort RS1700 T Wilson owns. Very possibly the base colour for the 2023 season.

[wyler]

Seems that some kind of retro livery is coming https://twitter.com/msportltd/status/1614626491215785986?s=46&t=_rV2RW3cyh_cZaT93AqBNA

can we already assign the world title of best com team??

[wyler]

Hints to the blue Escort RS1700 T Wilson owns. Very possibly the base colour for the 2023 season.

looking at rally2 test, blue seems very likely...

[manthey]

Seems that some kind of retro livery is coming https://twitter.com/msportltd/status/1614626491215785986?s=46&t=_rV2RW3cyh_cZaT93AqBNAis The initial data 1984 referred to something important in M-Sport?

[Kenneth]

Maybe Fourmaux's test livery can be a little hint?

2361

[Jarek Z]

Seems that some kind of retro livery is coming https://twitter.com/msportltd/status/1614626491215785986?s=46&t=_rV2RW3cyh_cZaT93AqBNA

I like such music and imagery, reminds me of old sci-fi movies, such as "Tron" :)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wOi9i1vqJ60

[Jarek Z]

is The initial data 1984 referred to something important in M-Sport?

Presentation of Ford RS200?
https://rallygroupbshrine.org/the-group-b-cars/rally-cars/ford-rs200/

[Kenneth]

Maybe Fourmaux's test livery can be a little hint?

2361

On the other hand, WRC and WRC2 liveries were different in last years. This one looks like tweeked Rally 1 livery from last year, so maybe it shows nothing.

On the other hand, it fits the theme of that trailer better than for example RS200 livery.

[EstWRC]

Suit looks very nice and Red Bull!

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230115/c62f10680439230a80cb7b437d0db2a4.jpg

[TypeR]

Quite an as5hole post/move from pirelli..

[seb_sh]

Yeah that's quite weird isn't it? I would attribute it to incompetence first rather than jump to intentional malice. Probably some PR person jumped the gun.

Anyway given the teaser from MSport and the big Red Bull branding on Martin I would assume the colors will be similar to last year but maybe with a different layout. Red bull has had some shade of purple for several years on it's F1 cars and purple is also a typical color for the synthwave retro style like their teaser was. My prediction is it will not be all that different from last year but should look good. Now I keep wondering what this forum would be like in the 90's and 00's when Subaru kept showing up with the same thing for 10 years straight :D

[TypeR]

Subaru's livery was simple, but really cool(even today, when blue-gold subie drives by)..

Another thing is, neither Tanak nor Loubet was a RB guy.. have things changed now?

[EstWRC]

Quite an as5hole post/move from pirelli..

I’m actually surprised that M-sport hasn’t revealed the livery already

Recce starts tomorrow and The service park is ready and I think tomorrow they will roll the cars out and believe me, once it happens there will be photographers and the pic of the car will be leaked in minutes

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Hints to the blue Escort RS1700 T Wilson owns. Very possibly the base colour for the 2023 season.

The Escort 1700T which didn't make it as an official car was my thought too.

"Nostagia for a time that never was..."

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/96/Ford_Escort_RS1700T_Msport.jpg

[TypeR]

I’m actually surprised that M-sport hasn’t revealed the livery already

Recce starts tomorrow and The service park is ready and I think tomorrow they will roll the cars out and believe me, once it happens there will be photographers and the pic of the car will be leaked in minutes
I agree that they haven't revealed it..


Pirelli has taken the story down.. but it's too late man :D

[EstWRC]

I agree that they haven't revealed it..


Pirelli has taken the story down.. but it's too late man :D

They have? Lol

It’s everywhere already now :D

[EstWRC]

Tomorrow at 09.00 CET the revealing

https://twitter.com/msportltd/status/1614696246689554433?s=46&t=_rV2RW3cyh_cZaT93AqBNA

[Kenneth]

Quite weird decision to do reveal in the morning instead of this evening.

[rallyfiend]

Quite weird decision to do reveal in the morning instead of this evening.

Sunday is not a good day to announce anything...

[Kenneth]

Is Monday 9 am any better, though?

[wyler]

Is Monday 9 am any better, though?

it is, if u close a deal a week before the first race of the year...

[AnttiL]

Also likely pictures start leaking from the service park on Monday

[Oraamat]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FmlCRPPWQAEzeCP?format=jpg

[mknight]

Have to say I am a bit confused.
RedBull even more prominent than before.

Wasn't Tanak a Monster guy?

No Loeb (who is RedBull) on Monte and rumors MSport wants too much money. Fourmaux (RedBull) kicked to Rally2.

Weird.

[Oraamat]

I think Ott and Monster was only rumors.

Ott in his Fb page post
"RedBull �� OT
I am happy to announce that from 2023 I’m joining with the Red Bull family. Bring it on, 2023! ��
#RedBull #GivesYouWings #Partnership #MSPORTERS #Ford"

[AndersX]

Oho, unexpeced move - OT and RB

[EstWRC]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230116/6dfe3dcc0edf9731d408feac38a60ebf.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230116/c2e42b6409e127a395066e62761202eb.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230116/96ba9c4d58b0b18d7a83ea28a1e6d337.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230116/f351f5ba1f0f4ee5ec1bd3d9fef1d8c3.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[mknight]

Ok, that makes more sense.

RedBull pays (for)Tanak and there is not much money left for Loeb/Fourmaux.

[flat_right]

Have to say I am a bit confused.
RedBull even more prominent than before.

Wasn't Tanak a Monster guy?

No Loeb (who is RedBull) on Monte and rumors MSport wants too much money. Fourmaux (RedBull) kicked to Rally2.

Weird.

AFAIK Ott has never been a Monster guy.

[EstWRC]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230116/0740631105fe6850d136f31fb3293bd9.jpg
https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230116/e3329a667922b798ad561a91f0934dc3.jpg


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[EstWRC]

The extension of Red Bull’s backing will mean both Tanak and Loubet will now be inducted as official Red Bull athletes.

[AndersX]

The extension of Red Bull’s backing will mean both Tanak and Loubet will now be inducted as official Red Bull athletes.

Makes very good sense: edgy, mind speaking, standing out, champion, a brand... perfectly matches RB. Strange though, that it happened so late in his carrier.

[Sulland]

Very nice livery with the shiny blue tones.

[EstWRC]

Video presentation https://youtu.be/3ggvzstDC5A

Not a huge change, they have swapped the purple with Estonian blue but like Sulland says, looks so beautiful and beats the others by far

[spyros]

Best livery by far.

[bomber21]

Can't wait to see this beauty live in action!

[EstWRC]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230116/4ad4d4727138f2d47d1e71b664592050.jpg

[Fast Eddie WRC]

“Inspired by synthwave music, and maintaining its electrified look as a nod to the hybrid era, 2023’s livery features neon bolts of vibrant pink and electric blue across a canvas of the iconic Ford blue,” read a statement from the team press release.

“The team takes the success of 2022’s stunning livery and takes it one step further, hoping to make an impact in both colour and performance in 2023.”

[Jarek Z]

It's a beautiful livery indeed, but what does it have to do with nostalgia, 1984 and "the time that never was"?

[AnttiL]

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20230116/4ad4d4727138f2d47d1e71b664592050.jpg

Bluu Ford :)

[spyros]

I wish for a win at Monte.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

The extension of Red Bull’s backing will mean both Tanak and Loubet will now be inducted as official Red Bull athletes.

Big thanks to Red Bull. It seems they were crucial to making the deal happen.

Note from the livery that there's still not a single new sponsor on the M-Sport cars.

[Kenneth]

On the other hand, same livery, but no Red Bull on Fourmaux's car. His livery was masked by duct tape, but here is no yellow color and no RB logo on the hood.

[Managarium]

So, they did present again Puma with rounded exhaust.


https://i.postimg.cc/FKLWqxLG/merge-from-ofoct-1.jpg (https://postimg.cc/sB34G7KZ)

[AndyRAC]

The extension of Red Bull’s backing will mean both Tanak and Loubet will now be inducted as official Red Bull athletes.

Loubet??? What for? I honestly don't understand how RB pick some of their athletes. Some make absolutely no sense (Fourmaux), yet there are others who you think should be, and they're not.

[Andre Oliveira]

Yes, Bernardo Sousa has more instagram followers than some of those.

[Andre Oliveira]

Pic of Keiron Bowness

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fmm5ysnWQAAcO66?format=jpg&name=medium

[rallyfiend]

Loubet??? What for? I honestly don't understand how RB pick some of their athletes. Some make absolutely no sense (Fourmaux), yet there are others who you think should be, and they're not.

Same reason Breen became an 'athlete'. He's no longer Red Bull.

Because the stickers were on the cars.

It happened with Lappi, Suninen and countless others. They were considered an athlete only as long as they were driving for a team that had a deal with Red Bull

[dimviii]

https://twitter.com/MundoRallyes/status/1615010679789862917/photo/1

[EstWRC]

Pic of Keiron Bowness

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fmm5ysnWQAAcO66?format=jpg&name=medium

seems they wont colour the roof scoops in drivers national flag colours. Ott has his OT signature and Loubet has AEC racing Team?

[Fast Eddie WRC]

:D
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FmrYxTyaEAACfJP?format=jpg&name=medium

[mknight]

Same reason Breen became an 'athlete'. He's no longer Red Bull.

Because the stickers were on the cars.

It happened with Lappi, Suninen and countless others. They were considered an athlete only as long as they were driving for a team that had a deal with Red Bull

Yes but for some others it is the other way around.
They get RedBull cap and are RedBull athletes with some support (likely not very big), yet there is nothing on the car itself.

[Jarek Z]

Haha that Mr Bean picture is so accurate! :)

[Jarek Z]

Yes but for some others it is the other way around.
They get RedBull cap and are RedBull athletes with some support (likely not very big), yet there is nothing on the car itself.

I think Solans was such kind of driver. RedBull never appeared on his cars.

[Kenneth]

There are a lot of guys like that. Actually most of Rally1 drivers are Red Bull athletes. Rovanpera, Ogier, Evans, Sordo, Katsuta... Also Rally2 drivers like Mikkelsen, Cais, Gryazin, Fourmaux still.. And none of them have Red Bull on the car.

[Jarek Z]

That's strange. What kind of advertisement is it when nobody knows about it?

[seb_sh]

They wear the cap during interviews. You're so used to it you don't notice.

[Kenneth]

Yes, as seb said, it's all about keeping that Red Bull logo on people's eyes. You see Red Bull logo during interviews, you see it on onboard footages, you see Red Bull logo everytime, everywhere.

You may not actively be noticing it. But when Kalle won title last year or Ogier year before, the first thing you can see after doors of their car opened was Red Bull branded logo. And when they got out, they put a Red Bull cap on their had. And all these things are on all the images.

[cali]

And I haven't still bought a can of RB for at least 15 years, maybe more.... Nor haven't bought a Monster or any other kind of energy drink

Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

[seb_sh]

And I haven't still bought a can of RB for at least 15 years, maybe more.... Nor haven't bought a Monster or any other kind of energy drink

Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

They had over 8 billion euros revenue in 2021 so it works for some people. Like others posters have said their strategy is to have the brand always on show and associated with success and extraordinary events. I'm sure there are people who drink 1 or 2 a day.

[cali]

They had over 8 billion euros revenue in 2021 so it works for some people. Like others posters have said their strategy is to have the brand always on show and associated with success and extraordinary events. I'm sure there are people who drink 1 or 2 a day.I'm well aware of this. Just to point out that although I'm not the target group, I'm still thankful they have invested so much over the years in rallying.


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[Kenneth]

Yeah, you are not the target group. Target group are people that are tired, go to store and buy the brand they know most. Or people drinking vodka and red bull hah

[Rallyest]

M-Sport paying tribute to Ken Block
2365

[EstWRC]

Longer vid by Red Bull how the livery is wrapped on to the car https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4sTLtCpdCs

[EstWRC]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fmx32UPWYAA11KH?format=jpg&name=large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fmx32UrXgAAKds5?format=jpg&name=large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fmx32URWAAEdnXM?format=jpg&name=large
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fmx32UOXkAEtYi1?format=jpg&name=large

[flat_right]

Now that Monte is basically over for M-Sport, has anyone else heard this rumor that M-Sport will come to Otepää's Winter Rally and use it as PET for Sweden? Or it is too late for that?

[EstWRC]

We don’t even have winter here at the moment

When is it planned?

I really doubt so

[Eli]

If this year's opener opposite (in terms of M-Sport's result) to last year, we can be hopeful the rest of the year will also be the opposite? ;)

[Managarium]

Do drivers get an helmet deal?
we can see Ott using Stilo helemet and Pierre-Louis using Bell helmet?

So obviously it's not an team deal.

[flat_right]

We don’t even have winter here at the moment

When is it planned?

I really doubt so

There is winter at the moment (if you mean temperatures) but let's see how it is going to be in a couple of weeks. Weather forecast looks quite OK-ish.

Otepää Winter Rally should take place on 4th of February.

[sinepikohv]

Now that Monte is basically over for M-Sport, has anyone else heard this rumor that M-Sport will come to Otepää's Winter Rally and use it as PET for Sweden? Or it is too late for that?

Wilson said to Autosport that M-Sport won't enter national rallies. It's a question of funds.

[EstWRC]

They have to wake up from the winter vacation.

No updates and still the same old problems and gremlins

[tcrown]

Now that Monte is basically over for M-Sport, has anyone else heard this rumor that M-Sport will come to Otepää's Winter Rally and use it as PET for Sweden? Or it is too late for that?

yup, have heard

[sinepikohv]

They have to wake up from the winter vacation.

No updates and still the same old problems and gremlins

There are updates. Chris Williams talked about new parts for aero, engine and other parts but he wasn't too specific, unfortunately.

[EstWRC]

There are updates. Chris Williams talked about new parts for aero, engine and other parts but he wasn't too specific, unfortunately.

where did you read that interview btw?

I guess they are/were also waiting Tänaks feedback before going on with the updates

[sinepikohv]

https://www.autohebdo.fr/actualites/rallye/wrc/chris-williams-avoir-ott-avec-nous-est-un-supplement-de-motivation.html

[240RS]

Was Ott Tanak sandbagging through Saturday/Sunday?

That was the question on my mind when he "suddenly" found 19 seconds in 15km on the final stage of the event.

Tanak is obviously an intelligent man. He seemingly worked out he didn't have the package to take on the Toyotas without serious risk and elected to play a percentage game. Saturday afternoon and early Sunday, he must have been cruising waiting to assess the Pumas real potential on the power stage. And register some useful championship points.

Get the feeling he will have worked out the true potential, and based on that, we will either see a bullish positive Ott, or a sulky withdrawn individual in the next event. My suspicion is that it will be the former.

[EstWRC]

He wasn’t sandbagging.

On Saturday he had the power steering problem the whole day apart from first stage.

And on Sunday he just preserved his tires for the PS stage.

And all in all, he just wanted to make sure he gets decent points on the table. Seems the past 3 years with 0 points made him really scared for this event. At least it Seemed so to me

[flat_right]

Was Ott Tanak sandbagging through Saturday/Sunday?

That was the question on my mind when he "suddenly" found 19 seconds in 15km on the final stage of the event.



On Sunday yes, but on Saturday he had a power steering issue. IMHO the times were OKish on Saturday with the issue he had.

But Finnish and Dirtfish "experts" only looked at the times and thought that Tänak was a shadow of himself. Yes, Ford is behind but we have to remember that this was the first rally for him in Puma. On Thursday I think he did really well. Even Kalle said that it was difficult to open the road because of the salty (dusty) tarmac. On Friday, the set up was wrong as the car wasn't racy enough (clearly some understeer). On Saturday he got his set up a bit better but it was hindered by the power steering issue. And on Sunday, he saved his tires for the PS. Overall, I don't think the situation is bad. They are behind and there is work to do but looking at how Hyundai was driving then I think Puma has more potential. At least Tänak said he feels comfortable and now is a matter of set up and getting some updates.

[Eli]

Honestly if M-Sport can eliminate their technical gremlins, then I’m sure it won’t be long until we’ll see Tänak on that top step of the podium. Besides, he always said that the objective was to finish Monte-Carlo with points, it was pretty obvious he wasn’t going to risk it all like he would’ve done back in his Toyota days.

[EstWRC]

Ott Tanak has conceded M-Sport faces “quite a big job” to close the gap to World Rally Championship rivals Toyota and Hyundai, but is confident it can be achieved.

https://www.motorsport.com/wrc/news/tanak-m-sport-can-pull-off-quite-a-big-job-to-catch-wrc-rivals/10423675/

[cali]

That mid corner understeer eats up the tires and doesn't give the driver much confidence to push.

Just to remind that this same mid corner understeer took out Adrien and Craig in Ypres in the same corner. Both of them started to correct the input in mid corner and at some point steering was in a full lock but it didn't save them.

Someone here mentioned this in the forum earlier as well that the Puma turns in well but then suddenly loses grip which results in heavy understeer. That's what I'm seeing as well. Chassie and/or suspension modifications needed imho though I'm no engineer

Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Strange how happy Loeb was with the Puma in Monte 2022 straight out of the box. And he made literally no set-up changes at all during the rally...

[bandit12]

Loeb is not 9 times world champion because of luck...

[Eli]

Strange how happy Loeb was with the Puma in Monte 2022 straight out of the box. And he made literally no set-up changes at all during the rally...

Loeb wouldn’t have been as happy had he’d suffer the same power steering issue that plagued Ott, and after all, Loeb is the goat.

[EstWRC]

Strange how happy Loeb was with the Puma in Monte 2022 straight out of the box. And he made literally no set-up changes at all during the rally...

You really think it’s exactly the same car was it was a year ago?

[spyros]

And after one year Toyota and Huyndai made mega progress

[cali]

Strange how happy Loeb was with the Puma in Monte 2022 straight out of the box. And he made literally no set-up changes at all during the rally...Different drivers and different styles, Loeb was there to have fun etc.

This mid corner understeer was present throughout 2022 tarmac rallies. You have to be almost blind not to see it. Also I pointed this out in Monte test vids that the front lacks grip.

Also teams have had time to develop their cars and both TGR and HMSG have improved tremendeously. Especially the Yaris looks like it's glued to the surface and it's incredible to watch how confident it makes his drivers. This new engine upgrade seems to be also very nice as it pulls very well throughout the rev band. Though I must say that the i20 looks very clumsy.

But I'm hopeful that M-Sport will sort these issues out. That was the whole point why Ott moved to M-Sport that the team would build the car for his needs. This wasn't gonna happen in Hyundai

Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

[Fast Eddie WRC]

You really think it’s exactly the same car was it was a year ago?

So they have actually made it worse with all the understeer now ?

Breen was also very happy with the Puma in Monte '22 and Fourmaux did great times in Croatia.

Seems until we see Loeb in the car again we won't know how good it is.

[AnttiL]

And after one year Toyota and Huyndai made mega progress

And we can compare the stage times to see this. It was like 2 s/km faster on the shakedown already.

[AnttiL]

Seems until we see Loeb in the car again we won't know how good it is.

This claim is just ridiculous.

However, to me it seems M-Sport lacks more in reliability than performance. Most of the rally Ott couldn't drive at 100% because he had some issues.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

This claim is just ridiculous.

However, to me it seems M-Sport lacks more in reliability than performance. Most of the rally Ott couldn't drive at 100% because he had some issues.

Why, when Loeb can be the benchmark after his events last year ?

I don't think Tanak could push here anyway due to unfamiliarity with the car and testing in such different conditions.

[doubled1978]

Different drivers and different styles, Loeb was there to have fun etc.

This mid corner understeer was present throughout 2022 tarmac rallies. You have to be almost blind not to see it. Also I pointed this out in Monte test vids that the front lacks grip.

Also teams have had time to develop their cars and both TGR and HMSG have improved tremendeously. Especially the Yaris looks like it's glued to the surface and it's incredible to watch how confident it makes his drivers. This new engine upgrade seems to be also very nice as it pulls very well throughout the rev band. Though I must say that the i20 looks very clumsy.

But I'm hopeful that M-Sport will sort these issues out. That was the whole point why Ott moved to M-Sport that the team would build the car for his needs. This wasn't gonna happen in Hyundai

Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

I agree with all of this.
The Hyundai is pretty much the opposite to the Ford, it’s very floaty at the rear, which is probably why it was so good in Japan on all those low speed, tight turns. Also Neuville is particularly good at those type of stages, gravel and tarmac.

The Toyota really does look a good piece of kit now, very impressive.

You’re right, I’m sure MSport will do everything they can to develop the car for Ott, for the sake of the competition, lets hope it’s enough to get him in the game.

[doubled1978]

So they have actually made it worse with all the understeer now ?

Breen was also very happy with the Puma in Monte '22 and Fourmaux did great times in Croatia.

Seems until we see Loeb in the car again we won't know how good it is.


It’s all relative to the pace they are going. All the cars have improved since last year, but at the pace of this year, the understeer was clearly a lot more pronounced.
And don’t forget, Ogier only didn’t win last year because of the puncture. Over the course of the rally, he was actually over half a minute faster than Loeb if you take that out.

The Puma isn’t a bad car, but in dry tarmac trim, it clearly isn’t at the level of the Toyota. Ott has said himself, he can go fast, but not for a whole loop as the tyres (fronts) won’t last.

[becher]

Strange how happy Loeb was with the Puma in Monte 2022 straight out of the box. And he made literally no set-up changes at all during the rally...

Loeb likes understeer if i remember correctly.

[macebig]

Suggesting the Puma can't go is foolish. Loeb was consistently at the front last year, and by his own admission Tanak pushed 100% only at the PS and matched the Toyotas. They need to clamp down on reliability and the package is a contender, no doubt.

[cali]

Suggesting the Puma can't go is foolish. Loeb was consistently at the front last year, and by his own admission Tanak pushed 100% only at the PS and matched the Toyotas. They need to clamp down on reliability and the package is a contender, no doubt.Not at the current state. Why everybody's yacking about last years Monte which was 1) ran in different conditions 2) TGR & HMSG have been really madly developing their cars. M-Sport hasn't used any major jokers so far. Just look at the vids from 2022 tarmac rounds (especially Ypres crashes) and you will see what's wrong with the cars handling. Breen's crashes were not just unprovoked. 3) Loeb likes understeer

Not really a rocket science now isn't it

Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

[manthey]

Did Loeb like understeer because he can find with it the limit of the car and so adjust the exit corner with the rear?

[cali]

Did Loeb like understeer because he can find with it the limit of the car and so adjust the exit corner with the rear?That's my understanding of it yes, if simply put

Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

[becher]

Did Loeb like understeer because he can find with it the limit of the car and so adjust the exit corner with the rear?
I believe so, actually quite similar to Latvala yet they are visually very different.

[AndyRAC]

Did Loeb like understeer because he can find with it the limit of the car and so adjust the exit corner with the rear?

Very much like Rohrl; Tony Fall sat in with him and couldn't get his head around how much understeer he could handle.....And both were useful on circuits.....

[HKSjbg]

https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/tanak-heads-for-otepaa-rally-as-sweden-preparation/

[flat_right]

Now that Monte is basically over for M-Sport, has anyone else heard this rumor that M-Sport will come to Otepää's Winter Rally and use it as PET for Sweden? Or it is too late for that?

Then the rumor was true. Nice!

[EstWRC]

This is great and he needs it.

Remember in 2021 he also contested and found the setup for Arctic

[Rallyest]

Then the rumor was true. Nice!

Well still a rumour till M-sport or Tänak confirms it, but i doubt dirtfish throws something like this out just like that.

4th February just got booked lol

[cali]

Well still a rumour till M-sport or Tänak confirms it, but i doubt dirtfish throws something like this out just like that.

4th February just got booked lolWe already made plans but this is getting even better!

Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

[flat_right]

Well still a rumour till M-sport or Tänak confirms it, but i doubt dirtfish throws something like this out just like that.

4th February just got booked lol

Yeah. But we still need snow. Weather forecast is not very promising in that department but at least it seems it will be some minus degrees and roads will be hard.

[Rallyest]

Yeah. But we still need snow. Weather forecast is not very promising in that department but at least it seems it will be some minus degrees and roads will be hard.

Its official now 2374

[Rallyest]

Yeah. But we still need snow. Weather forecast is not very promising in that department but at least it seems it will be some minus degrees and roads will be hard.

And regarding snow, this picture is taken yesterday or the day before 2373

[flat_right]

FCKING GREAT NEWS!!! 100% will be there!

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Good news indeed and great to see M-Sport funding extra testing at a national event like Hyundai and Toyota.

[er88]

Good news indeed and great to see M-Sport funding extra testing at a national event like Hyundai and Toyota.It is great news, agreed.
You do always like to portray things like it's little old Msport out on their own though.
Ford and Red Bull are also involved in this "Tanak championship project". Sponsorship backing from Red Bull, and assistance with development work, planning & funds from Ford too. Ofcourse they don't have the financial might of Toyota or Hyundai, but Tanak wouldn't be at Msport if it wasn't for Ford and Red Bull working as a genuine joined up partnership with Msport.

[flat_right]

Planetmarcus writes that Serderidis will also join Tänak and participate in Otepää Winter Rally

https://planetemarcus.com/serderidis-rejoint-tanak-a-lotepaa-talveralli/

[bwallace]

Planetmarcus writes that Serderidis will also join Tänak and participate in Otepää Winter Rally

https://planetemarcus.com/serderidis-rejoint-tanak-a-lotepaa-talveralli/
https://www.ewrc-results.com/entries/81096-otepaa-talveralli-2023/
looks like true.

[AnttiL]

https://moottori.fi/ajoneuvot/jutut/rallin-mm-sarja-maineikas-brittitiimi-yha-toipumisvaiheessa-olen-liian-vanha-tallaiseen/

Wilson interview (in Finnish) by the one and only Miika Wuorela. Wilson says that the rumors of Tänak owning now a share of M-Sport is not true.

[cali]

https://moottori.fi/ajoneuvot/jutut/rallin-mm-sarja-maineikas-brittitiimi-yha-toipumisvaiheessa-olen-liian-vanha-tallaiseen/

Wilson interview (in Finnish) by the one and only Miika Wuorela. Wilson says that the rumors of Tänak owning now a share of M-Sport is not true.Go figure when Wuorela himself told me these rumours. Maybe I should downgrade his ratings to "unreliable source" hehe

Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

[mknight]

Lately (1,5 year ago) he predicted that Rally1 cars will be slower than Rally2 in corners in Finland.
Then a year ago before Christmas he predicted that Tanak is retiring.

Hard to take him seriously, specially after that first one.

[cali]

Lately (1,5 year ago) he predicted that Rally1 cars will be slower than Rally2 in corners in Finland.
Then a year ago before Christmas he predicted that Tanak is retiring.

Hard to take him seriously, specially after that first one.Well the problem with him is that he has been right as well in about 50/50 of the information he has been sharing to me. But I feel sometimes he is sharing and mixing his own biased thoughts with factual information.



Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

[Fast Eddie WRC]

It is great news, agreed.
You do always like to portray things like it's little old Msport out on their own though.
Ford and Red Bull are also involved in this "Tanak championship project". Sponsorship backing from Red Bull, and assistance with development work, planning & funds from Ford too. Ofcourse they don't have the financial might of Toyota or Hyundai, but Tanak wouldn't be at Msport if it wasn't for Ford and Red Bull working as a genuine joined up partnership with Msport.

I'm afraid it comes from all the years when it pretty much WAS just M-Sport.

Even in recent years, and the loss of trade due to Covid, they have been left struggling for budget for testing (even with Red Bull & Ford Performance on board).

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Ott Tänak is providing M-Sport Ford with feedback it has never had before...

https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/tanaks-giving-m-sport-feedback-it-has-never-had/

[Rallyest]

So someone here raised the rumor that Tänak now holds some shares of M-sport. Wilson Debunked it but username "tfr" in estonian rally forum pointed out an interesting thing.
Sorry if it has some mistakes, used google translate, too lazy early in the morning to start translating it myself.

I dont if it means anything or is nothing, just an interesting info.

maybe someone from UK can have a say if these changes show if idk comma error is done, or it has to be something bigger for it to be shown like that. Or maybe Tfr you are member here also.

"Unfortunately, the extract from the UK business register only shows that M-Sport Ltd is 100% owned by "M-Sport Ltd Share Release Trust", which is something about which I don't think you can get more detailed information unfortunately. However, it is worth noting that the "Latest update" of the company's data is "16 Jan 2023 - shareholders", i.e. that on 16.01 some change was made in the list of shareholders."

[cali]

So someone here raised the rumor that Tänak now holds some shares of M-sport. Wilson Debunked it but username "tfr" in estonian rally forum pointed out an interesting thing.
Sorry if it has some mistakes, used google translate, too lazy early in the morning to start translating it myself.

I dont if it means anything or is nothing, just an interesting info.

maybe someone from UK can have a say if these changes show if idk comma error is done, or it has to be something bigger for it to be shown like that. Or maybe Tfr you are member here also.

"Unfortunately, the extract from the UK business register only shows that M-Sport Ltd is 100% owned by "M-Sport Ltd Share Release Trust", which is something about which I don't think you can get more detailed information unfortunately. However, it is worth noting that the "Latest update" of the company's data is "16 Jan 2023 - shareholders", i.e. that on 16.01 some change was made in the list of shareholders."Maybe I should upgrade M. Wuorela's status as "reliable" again? :D

Sent from my DN2103 using Tapatalk

[cali]

Also, someone pointed out that Tänak doesn't have that kind of money. The answer is pretty simple - Oleg Gross does have money and a lot of (2022 profit for his main company was 15,1 mil alone) + M.Märtin + O.Tänak and you get your finances straight.

EDIT: And I'm not saying it's 100% true but this finances thing should be now debunked

[EstWRC]

Monte road book https://youtu.be/pnXsvjkKs5A

[DoN_cz]

Monte road book https://youtu.be/pnXsvjkKs5A

Wanted to watch the roadbook, but looks like it was deleted from Youtube... 🤔

[becher]

Wanted to watch the roadbook, but looks like it was deleted from Youtube... 🤔

Couldn't find it as well.

[manthey]

Wanted to watch the roadbook, but looks like it was deleted from Youtube... I wanted too, hoping they will publish again

[EstWRC]

It’s still up on Facebook https://fb.watch/iEIJH_9Opq/

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Perfect beginning to 2023...
https://www.wrc.com/en/news/2023/wrc/millener-tanaks-sweden-win-the-perfect-beginning/

And Millener confirms he isn't worried about the disadvantage on the loose gravel in Mexico...

“I mean, people will already start talking about road position in Mexico but, for me, it’s irrelevant really,” he said. “You’ve got to take the points and the opportunities while you can, and our goals are to take it rally by rally.”

[Sulland]

I feel M-Sport deserved a win now. To get the whole team to be upbeat for a few days is important!
This win could be a turnaround for them. Important to have 3 teams fighting for top step, through 2023!

[sidrun]

Maybe I haven't noticed, but does anyone knows , when will be engine upgrade for M-sport Fords?

[sti123]

Maybe I haven't noticed, but does anyone knows , when will be engine upgrade for M-sport Fords?

Somebody somewhere talked about Portugal, but I can't find any links.

[Jarek Z]

I feel M-Sport deserved a win now. To get the whole team to be upbeat for a few days is important!
This win could be a turnaround for them. Important to have 3 teams fighting for top step, through 2023!

Yes, very important rally. I hope it will be a breakthrough for M-Sport.

It's also important from another point of view. The first 2 rallies clearly showed how slow drivers Loubet and Greensmith are. Tanak comes, jumps in the new car and fights for the win almost from the very beginning.

[sinepikohv]

Yes, very important rally. I hope it will be a breakthrough for M-Sport.

It's also important from another point of view. The first 2 rallies clearly showed how slow drivers Loubet and Greensmith are. Tanak comes, jumps in the new car and fights for the win almost from the very beginning.

I think Loubet was quite decent in Monte when he didn't have any problems. Better than Taka, for example.

Also, as he showed in Greece last year he can be really quick on gravel too with a favourable starting position. Mexico might be a good indicator whether Greece was a one off or has he actually stepped up in terms of pace.

[tcrown]

Yes, very important rally. I hope it will be a breakthrough for M-Sport.

It's also important from another point of view. The first 2 rallies clearly showed how slow drivers Loubet and Greensmith are. Tanak comes, jumps in the new car and fights for the win almost from the very beginning.

I must have missed it but what are plans for Greensmith for 23 season? Is he doing some events with WRC or not? WRC2?

[sti123]

Yes, very important rally. I hope it will be a breakthrough for M-Sport.

It's also important from another point of view. The first 2 rallies clearly showed how slow drivers Loubet and Greensmith are. Tanak comes, jumps in the new car and fights for the win almost from the very beginning.

Quote from Petter Solberg from All Live: "We've been on stages today and watched all drivers. Tänak has been the cleanest from them all." He knew that they lack top speed and performance in general and went for tyre saving option and attacked where he knew others do not have studs left- meaning you can gain more time against others on a short distance. He is one of the best in tyres saving, right after Ogier. I do not think Greensmith or Loubet think about that too much. They destroy tires too early and suffer then all remining rally.

[AnttiL]

I must have missed it but what are plans for Greensmith for 23 season? Is he doing some events with WRC or not? WRC2?

WRC2 with Toksport, starting from Mexico

[Fast Eddie WRC]

I think Loubet was quite decent in Monte when he didn't have any problems. Better than Taka, for example.

Also, as he showed in Greece last year he can be really quick on gravel too with a favourable starting position. Mexico might be a good indicator whether Greece was a one off or has he actually stepped up in terms of pace.

It would be fantastic if Loubet could take advantage and actually support Tanak on the upcoming gravel rallies.

The other vital aspect on this tough surface and temperatures will be car reliability.

[Sulland]

I am hoping that Loubet can get a good result in the next rally, otherwise Malcolm will do something. They need a good wingman to support Tanak, and give input on deveoping the Puma.

[AnttiL]

I am hoping that Loubet can get a good result in the next rally, otherwise Malcolm will do something.

Eh, no....they are doing this season with these two guys, no matter the results.

[seb_sh]

The wingman thing is a bit over rated imo. You need someone to beat Rovanpera, good luck finding anyone. Only one wingman ever made a difference in the last 20 years and that was Sordo for Loeb beating Gronholm and Hirvonen a few times. What they need is a car that is fast enough and the power steering and window defogger doesn't fail. Tanak can do the rest.

[Jarek Z]

I am hoping that Loubet can get a good result in the next rally, otherwise Malcolm will do something. They need a good wingman to support Tanak, and give input on deveoping the Puma.

Didn't they say they put everything on one card this year?

[spyros]

I wiah Loubet learn from Ott nad become a very good driver, he has potential.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Wilson: I knew this was possible – it’s why we did the deal.

https://www.wrc.com/en/news/2023/wrc/wilson-this-is-why-we-did-the-deal/

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Didn't they say they put everything on one card this year?

Yes, in terms of priority for just the one driver to win the Ch'ship... but support from Loubet could still help this to happen.

Loubet may not be faster than other top guys, but if they have problems he could still take points off them if he isn't far behind on times.

[EstWRC]

Interview with Tänaks lead engineer https://www.speedcafe.com/2023/02/16/tanak-will-only-get-stronger/

[TypeR]

Happy birthday, Mr Wilson!
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FkROCNCXgAUxijz?format=jpg&name=small

[mmm]

Interview with Tänaks lead engineer https://www.speedcafe.com/2023/02/16/tanak-will-only-get-stronger/

Seems like tarmac handling is the weakest link they've found in the first 2 rallies.

[EstWRC]

Sweden roadbook

https://youtu.be/Y93FDR3A8RI

[EstWRC]

The YouTube link doesn’t work for some reason https://fb.watch/iOgeFUupl5/

[Rallyest]

The YouTube link doesn’t work for some reason https://fb.watch/iOgeFUupl5/

Love the M-sport Roadbooks, would be awesome if all teams would to a little "review" of the rally for rally fans, im sure it would help to get new people interested in rallying since it gives a little different perspective of what the teams do during the rally and what we dont see on all-live

[EstWRC]

Btw the YouTube link also works now. They uploaded it again

[skarderud]

370 fiesta chassis at M-sport, and then its over
Then what?
A new fiesta in pipeline?

https://www.rallye-magazin.de/int/artikel/m-sport-besitzt-jetzt-370-fiesta-rohkarossen-49845/

Sent fra min SM-S901B via Tapatalk

[AnttiL]

370 fiesta chassis at M-sport, and then its over
Then what?
A new fiesta in pipeline?

https://www.rallye-magazin.de/int/artikel/m-sport-besitzt-jetzt-370-fiesta-rohkarossen-49845/

Sent fra min SM-S901B via Tapatalk

And those bodyshells must be shared between Rally2, Rally3 and Rally4 (and Rally5). But it will probably take a while before they sell all those

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Tänak is pushing M-Sport to work to a new design philosophy, M-Sport technical director Chris Williams has revealed...

https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/tanak-pushing-m-sport-to-work-to-new-design-philosophy/

[Fast Eddie WRC]

The boss drove the Puma...

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FqTAfOAXgAkzZ-S?format=jpg&name=large

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FqTAfODXoAAfY9Q?format=jpg&name=large

[Jarek Z]

The boss drove the Puma...

I'm sure he had better stage times than his Greek works driver :)

[Steve Boyd]

I'm sure he had better stage times than his Greek works driver :)
I think you mean "Greek customer driver"

[bomber21]

Or Greek rally fan who just enjoys his hobby and sponsors young drivers to improve their career, even by sharing with them his almost 1-million worth Ford Puma.

[TypeR]

Or Greek rally fan who just enjoys his hobby and sponsors young drivers to improve their career, even by sharing with them his almost 1-million worth Ford Puma.

Ppl still can't get over him being able to afford driving the top car.. :D

[ictus]

Ppl still can't get over him being able to afford driving the top car.. :D

Thats called jealousy ;)

[mknight]

Yep, when people aren't happy with paying Allive to watch 59 year old narrowly avoiding heart attack while driving at roadcar pace it's jealousy.

[Kenneth]

Nice drinking game idea - everytime someone cries about Serderidis here, take a shot of your favorite alcohol. The person that makes it into end of the rally without alcohol poisoning wins :)

[wyler]

Nice drinking game idea - everytime someone cries about Serderidis here, take a shot of your favorite alcohol. The person that makes it into end of the rally without alcohol poisoning wins :)

already drunk!

[Jarek Z]

Thats called jealousy ;)

Jealousy? Guys, I think you should remove sticks from your butts, because you are much too stiff :)

Do you know the story of Eddie The Eagle? He was one of the worst ski-jumpers in the history of the sport. He was a laughing stock at every ski jump competition he went to. Do you think people were laughing at him because they were jealous?! Or that the comedy about him was filmed because the director and the scriptwriter were jealous?! :)

Do your homework:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddie_the_Eagle
https://www.imdb.com/video/vi655667737/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_5
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXy4vTsWZn0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q44igt-zcvU

Now, which one of all Rally1 drivers reminds you of Eddie? ;)

[Sulland]

Or Greek rally fan who just enjoys his hobby and sponsors young drivers to improve their career, even by sharing with them his almost 1-million worth Ford Puma.

Good, who is he sponsoring this year?

[Jarek Z]

Good, who is he sponsoring this year?

I think it is Munster, not sure though.

[wyler]

Jealousy? Guys, I think you should remove sticks from your butts, because you are much too stiff :)

Do you know the story of Eddie The Eagle? He was one of the worst ski-jumpers in the history of the sport. He was a laughing stock at every ski jump competition he went to. Do you think people were laughing at him because they were jealous?! Or that the comedy about him was filmed because the director and the scriptwriter were jealous?! :)

Do your homework:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddie_the_Eagle
https://www.imdb.com/video/vi655667737/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_5
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXy4vTsWZn0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q44igt-zcvU

Now, which one of all Rally1 drivers reminds you of Eddie? ;)


honestly? yes! maybe more envious than jealous, actually.
people laughed because they saw someone like them or even worse do it, and get frustrated because he had the possibilities (and the balls) to get there. a classic reaction is to diminish that people. when that kind of person feels lesser they try to gain importance through belittling others. the film is the same, they were sure it would stir reactions out of frustrated people, which definitely worked.

[HKSjbg]

I think it is Munster, not sure though.

Correct

https://dirtfish.com/rally/wrc/getting-to-know-wrcs-most-improved-driver/

“And, of course, it further aligns him with Jourdan Serderidis – a personal backer of Munster’s – which is particularly key as Serderidis is at the heart of Munster’s potential Rally1 chance this year.”

[Jarek Z]

honestly? yes! maybe more envious than jealous, actually.
people laughed because they saw someone like them or even worse do it, and get frustrated because he had the possibilities (and the balls) to get there.

Maybe you are a better psychologist than me, but something in your theory doesn't work. Are you suggesting that everybody in Great Britain wanted to be a ski jumper and they were jealous that it was Eddie who made it? I don't think so. It's a niche sport. It's quire popular in Poland, but for sure not in the UK (and most other countries in the world) where nobody cares about it.

If someone doesn't like a movie, it doesn't mean they are jealous of the director.
If someone doesn't like a record, it doesn't mean they are jealous of the saxophonist.
If someone doesn't like Serderidi's driving, it doesn't mean they are jealous of his car :)

[Kenneth]

Also people here are looking at Serderidis thinking they would do better, while in fact they would destroy the car in the first corner :)

[wyler]

Maybe you are a better psychologist than me, but something in your theory doesn't work. Are you suggesting that everybody in Great Britain wanted to be a ski jumper and they were jealous that it was Eddie who made it? I don't think so. It's a niche sport. It's quire popular in Poland, but for sure not in the UK (and most other countries in the world) where nobody cares about it.

If someone doesn't like a movie, it doesn't mean they are jealous of the director.
If someone doesn't like a record, it doesn't mean they are jealous of the saxophonist.
If someone doesn't like Serderidi's driving, it doesn't mean they are jealous of his car :)

well yeah, i was not being so literal. it's not really about a specific sport, is more about the general human way of feeling good being superior to someone else, and i'm not speaking of a general "everyone", but more about the very fed up.

you're right, sometimes dislike s just dislike, but dislike alone is effortless!
when someone dislikes something, a tune, a movie, a car, they just pass over onto other stuff and don't care that much about it.
when it becomes a constant thread, escalates to insults, when is depicted as a problem to the very integrity of the system (like as if a bad movie could ruin the art of cinema...), and when is demanded to the governing body to amend its presence, well, it probably is something more "visceral" than dislike.

anyway, my poor psychology will not affect it, "haters gonna hate" they say! : )

p.s= not so sure about this "If someone doesn't like Serderidi's driving, it doesn't mean they are jealous of his car :)" here around. i'm jealous of that car! :D

[Jarek Z]

p.s= not so sure about this "If someone doesn't like Serderidi's driving, it doesn't mean they are jealous of his car :)" here around. i'm jealous of that car! :D

I'm not. But... had he driven a Lancia Delta, it would have been a different story :D

[bandit12]

Good effort boys.
Really interesting and totally M Sport related conversation once again.

[Jarek Z]

Thank you. I also think it was one of the most interesting discussions on this forum in the recent days :)

[wyler]

Good effort boys.
Really interesting and totally M Sport related conversation once again.

you're welcome!
let's get onto one of your very sharp thread, shall we?

[Norm75]

Jealousy? Guys, I think you should remove sticks from your butts, because you are much too stiff :)

Do you know the story of Eddie The Eagle? He was one of the worst ski-jumpers in the history of the sport. He was a laughing stock at every ski jump competition he went to. Do you think people were laughing at him because they were jealous?! Or that the comedy about him was filmed because the director and the scriptwriter were jealous?! :)

Do your homework:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eddie_the_Eagle
https://www.imdb.com/video/vi655667737/?ref_=nv_sr_srsg_5
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXy4vTsWZn0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q44igt-zcvU

Now, which one of all Rally1 drivers reminds you of Eddie? ;)

Funnily enough Jarek I was going to make the exact same comparison to the plasterer of disaster about a month or so ago when our Greek friend was getting himself in a fluster about his compatriot.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Serderidis' Puma had 3 spins and has held up BRC favourite Keith Cronin on the Malcolm Wilson Stages today..

[Jarek Z]

"The Eagle" finishes in the 9th position:
https://www.ewrc-results.com/final/81205-malcolm-wilson-rally-brc-national-2023/

[AnttiL]

"The Eagle" finishes in the 9th position:
https://www.ewrc-results.com/final/81205-malcolm-wilson-rally-brc-national-2023/

And would have been 8th on this interclub event on the same route

https://www.ewrc-results.com/results/79900-malcolm-wilson-rally-interclub-2023/

[Myrvold]

And yet. He's done something right that makes it possible for him to spend his own money on it.

But sure. Get rid of him, his backing for Munster, his previous backing for Bergkvist and other drivers. Get rid of a good customer for manufacturers as well. I am sure that will help everyone in the end.

Sheesh. Serderidis isn't the problem, he is just what highlights the problem.

[Duvel]

And yet. He's done something right that makes it possible for him to spend his own money on it.

But sure. Get rid of him, his backing for Munster, his previous backing for Bergkvist and other drivers. Get rid of a good customer for manufacturers as well. I am sure that will help everyone in the end.

Sheesh. Serderidis isn't the problem, he is just what highlights the problem.

100% correct. People here should stop beeing so negative! especialy about a guy thats sponsoring our sport like that!

[seb_sh]

I am not against Serderidis he can do what he wants with his money. But i am against the morons at the FIA putting him top seed on a WRC event that i then have to watch him struggle on WRC Live. There is no argument in this universe or any other paralel universe that can justify that.

[denkimi]

I am not against Serderidis he can do what he wants with his money. But i am against the morons at the FIA putting him top seed on a WRC event that i then have to watch him struggle on WRC Live. There is no argument in this universe or any other paralel universe that can justify that.
I agree. Anyone should be able to drive what he can afford, but nobody should be forced to watch them drive slowly.

[AndyRAC]

The rich amateur/ gentleman driver has always been a part of motorsport; they quite often fund teams/ help other drivers. We see it in rallying, as well more obviously in Sportscars.....
As others have said, the 'issue' currently is so few top line cars, that we see a rich amateur amongst the top seeds - whereas in other eras he would have been far lower....

Don't blame him but others for this situation.....(FiA/Promoters)

[Fast Eddie WRC]

On something like the BRC or other National events Serderidis should just run as a demo or course car. He definitely shouldn't be seeded and hold up the other real competitors.

[djip]

The rich amateur/ gentleman driver has always been a part of motorsport; they quite often fund teams/ help other drivers. We see it in rallying, as well more obviously in Sportscars.....
As others have said, the 'issue' currently is so few top line cars, that we see a rich amateur amongst the top seeds - whereas in other eras he would have been far lower....

Don't blame him but others for this situation.....(FiA/Promoters)

Spot on. The first example that comes to my mind is Frederic Dor. For a decade he ran fully white (e.g. totally sponsor-free) latest specs GroupA Impreza in almost full campaigns - Never to register a top 10 result. At the same time, there were 20+, sometimes 30+ official/top driven cars, so everybody remembers the nice chap in the white Subaru and nobody complained that he would steal a drive form someone else...

There has been many debates on what the top category should be, now a look at ERC's rally Fafe last weekend is like a blast to the past : 40 WRC2 cars, all pretty much equal machinery, and the best drivers in the front. honestly, speaking, as much as I lovee th Rally1 cars, I wonder why on earth the FIA has not elected to go Rally2 - not Rally2+, just basic Rally2 with the same cost cap as today. would'nt that be awesome to see a young Finn coming from nowhere unexpectedly mix it up with the big guys ? Today's events, aside from being weak in top class entries, are far too predictable. Even if you drive poorly, if you have 1-2 offs, you are ensured to finish in the top 10 if you drive a rally1 car, if not in the top 6.

[PLuto]

Spot on. The first example that comes to my mind is Frederic Dor. For a decade he ran fully white (e.g. totally sponsor-free) latest specs GroupA Impreza in almost full campaigns - Never to register a top 10 result. At the same time, there were 20+, sometimes 30+ official/top driven cars, so everybody remembers the nice chap in the white Subaru and nobody complained that he would steal a drive form someone else...

There has been many debates on what the top category should be, now a look at ERC's rally Fafe last weekend is like a blast to the past : 40 WRC2 cars, all pretty much equal machinery, and the best drivers in the front. honestly, speaking, as much as I lovee th Rally1 cars, I wonder why on earth the FIA has not elected to go Rally2 - not Rally2+, just basic Rally2 with the same cost cap as today. would'nt that be awesome to see a young Finn coming from nowhere unexpectedly mix it up with the big guys ? Today's events, aside from being weak in top class entries, are far too predictable. Even if you drive poorly, if you have 1-2 offs, you are ensured to finish in the top 10 if you drive a rally1 car, if not in the top 6.

It is about money and marketing. They need money from manufacturers, manufacturers needs to invest money. And with all of this, they need exclusivity. They are happy to have 3-4 manufacturers and 10-15 Rally1 cars - each manufacturer has enough media coverage, all their cars are visible in live coverage from every stage, each manufacturer can finish on podium. So all sides (manufacturers, FIA, promoter) are happy with this situation...

[Jarek Z]

each manufacturer has enough media coverage, all their cars are visible in live coverage from every stage, each manufacturer can finish on podium. So all sides (manufacturers, FIA, promoter) are happy with this situation...

That's probably true, but can't they (manufacturers, FIA, promoter) see, that media and viewers lose interest in this sport?

[Jarek Z]

The first example that comes to my mind is Frederic Dor. For a decade he ran fully white (e.g. totally sponsor-free) latest specs GroupA Impreza in almost full campaigns - Never to register a top 10 result. At the same time, there were 20+, sometimes 30+ official/top driven cars, so everybody remembers the nice chap in the white Subaru and nobody complained that he would steal a drive form someone else...

That's a good example with Frederic Dor, but he actually wasn't so completely bad. In 1999 he even managed to win French championship on gravel:
https://www.ewrc-results.com/season/1999/44-france-gravel/

https://www.ewrc-results.com/image/466021/?entry=36635

[Steve Boyd]

On something like the BRC or other National events Serderidis should just run as a demo or course car. He definitely shouldn't be seeded and hold up the other real competitors.
Cronin was only held up on the second stage. He was 3.1 seconds quicker than Formeaux on the third stage but slower than Formeaux on the other three stages losing 28.9 seconds, so even without the second stage delay Cronin lost 25.8 seconds to Formeaux.

It is also worth noting that Cronin only ran behind Serderidis on the first two stages. The Macolm Wilson used UK road timing where the road target time is added to the stage finish time to calculate the arrival time at the next control. This means that once you've passed somebody you start the rest of the rally ahead of them. This is different from the FIA road timing convention where the road target is added to the stage start time to calculate the arrival time at the next control. The FIA system means that the start order never changes until the field is re-seeded and if you catch somebody on a stage you start behind them on the next one, and maybe catch them again.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Cronin was only held up on the second stage. He was 3.1 seconds quicker than Formeaux on the third stage but slower than Formeaux on the other three stages losing 28.9 seconds, so even without the second stage delay Cronin lost 25.8 seconds to Formeaux.

It is also worth noting that Cronin only ran behind Serderidis on the first two stages. The Macolm Wilson used UK road timing where the road target time is added to the stage finish time to calculate the arrival time at the next control. This means that once you've passed somebody you start the rest of the rally ahead of them. This is different from the FIA road timing convention where the road target is added to the stage start time to calculate the arrival time at the next control. The FIA system means that the start order never changes until the field is re-seeded and if you catch somebody on a stage you start behind them on the next one, and maybe catch them again.

Thanks for the info but when a rally is so short starting Serderidis 2nd could easily have cost someone an important place (and worse if they had played their Joker).

[Steve Boyd]

Thanks for the info but when a rally is so short starting Serderidis 2nd could easily have cost someone an important place (and worse if they had played their Joker).
The facts are that it didn't. If it had been a long event with long stages and FIA timing then it could well have been an issue, but it wasn't so there was no affect on the final placings. Give the event organisers credit for knowing how the timing works and what the consequences of seeding are.

[Fast Eddie WRC]

Back on topic (MSport)...

Malcolm drives the Puma:
https://youtu.be/K5yLz_RghAM