Abu Donkey Doo! [Archive] - Motorsport Forums

Dave B

13th November 2011, 15:40

Donkey of the race today: Maldonado for getting in everybody's way and picking up a drive through for his troubles - plus he's being investigated (along with Alguersuari) after the race for another block.

Honourable mention for Donkey goes to Massa, he's getting totally destroyed by Alonso and his spin put pay to any chance of fighting with Webber.

Robinho

13th November 2011, 15:52

Close between Maldanado (for the worst ignoring of cllue fas I've seen in a while) and Massa for being trashed by Alonso and spinning when finally trying to do some decent times in order to stave off Webber.

jens

13th November 2011, 16:11

That Pirelli rear tyre, which was fitted on Vettel's car. Both fresh world champions with the name of Seb had a very weird retirement today.

N4D13

13th November 2011, 17:20

Maldonado by a country mile.

I don't think Massa would have been able to finish in front of better even without his spin. Even though Alonso has outperformed him during the whole season, Massa made a single mistake in a tricky turn where both Ferrari drivers have had problems during the weekend. So I'm not even giving him an (dis)honorable mention.

N. Jones

13th November 2011, 19:17

MAldonado for me. He was a wreck. Do we see two driver changes at Williams for 2012?

jens

13th November 2011, 19:48

MAldonado for me. He was a wreck. Do we see two driver changes at Williams for 2012?

I think the pace of Maldonado is good and IMO he is worthy of another year regardless of the sponsorship support. He has outraced Barrichello for much of the second half of 2011. The manners have been a bit of a problem though and have earned him some penalties before too (Belgium, Korea). Perhaps he will learn.

F1boat

13th November 2011, 20:15

Maldonado...

Ranger

14th November 2011, 08:33

Two penalties in the same race for the same thing is pretty damn ordinary.

The Black Knight

14th November 2011, 08:33

Maldonado. Personally I feel a race ban is in order for being so stupid. It was complete and total ****wittery and nothing more.

Massa also for spinning and proving once again that he is an average driver at best.

DexDexter

14th November 2011, 08:36

The whole race was the donkey. I wouldn't give it to Massa, in fact a half a decent job from a number two driver that gets the leftovers of the team.

donKey jote

14th November 2011, 08:42

Maldonkado :p

The Black Knight

14th November 2011, 09:17

Hilariously, Massa blames his spin on medium tyres and an old friend wing. Nothing to do with the fact that he's just ****e of course.

SGWilko

14th November 2011, 09:49

Hilariously, Massa blames his spin on medium tyres and an old friend wing. Nothing to do with the fact that he's just ****e of course.

I think he ran out of talent mid-corner.......

Back to the Massa of old methinks - oh dear. Ferrari have successfully fubar'd their own driver!

Knock-on

14th November 2011, 10:55

Obviously Maldonado for pathetic driving. I agree with TBK that a race ban is deserved.

As for Massa, what more can be said? Alonso proved that the car is competitive but Massa makes it look a POS. Lacklustre qualifying, poor race pace and a spin to boot. However, I'm not going to give him a Donkey award because this was one of his better performances of the year. :s

Imagine Webber and Massa in the Ferrari. We would really be slating the team for providing an awful car but actually it a pretty good car. Put a decent driver in the seat and Ferrari would be 2nd in the championship.

jens

14th November 2011, 11:44

Imagine Webber and Massa in the Ferrari. We would really be slating the team for providing an awful car but actually it a pretty good car.

Or imagine Webber and Massa were in the Red Bull. :) We would be saying modern F1 is so competitive that no-one is able to design a car that can dominate the championship...

I have to say that if Massa is considered as a donkey of the race, then Webber isn't far from it either. He was nowhere all race in a car that was supposed to win in Vettel's hands.

Knock-on

14th November 2011, 17:07

:up: Yep. I like Webber but you must say he has been woeful this year.

kfzmeister

14th November 2011, 18:13

As for Massa, what more can be said? Alonso proved why he is a two-time champ by driving that POS onto the podium.

This! :)

Knock-on

14th November 2011, 18:42

This! :)

When quoting someone, please don't change their original text.

ioan

14th November 2011, 19:02

Button for being trashed like that by Hamilton. Looks like Alonso's pre-race comments got into his head.

Robinho

14th November 2011, 20:56

Henners, you should know better than to let the truth get in the way of a good trolling ;)

ioan

14th November 2011, 21:06

Button was off the pace all weekend by his own admission, but when you read the autosport article about what he had to put up with during the race with loss of KERS, brake bias needing to be changed constantly and him not knowing how the car would react from corner to corner, then I'm sure you'd probably put him as one of the drivers of the race. If I were Jenson I'd be nothing but proud after yesterday's performance.

Other people who get trashed around here might have the same problems yet no one cares, why should I care about Button's excuses?

Being objective other than Vettel's rear right tire, maybe only the RBR crew for screwing Webber's first pit stop could be awarded the donkey prize.

wedge

14th November 2011, 22:38

Maldonado. Personally I feel a race ban is in order for being so stupid. It was complete and total ****wittery and nothing more.

As easy as it is to pick out Maldonado as Donkey he had two penalties and still finished ahead of Jaime and Bruno.

And its debatable how much of a f**kwit PM was

Pastor Maldonado and Bruno Senna slam 'inconsistent' blue flag penalties in Abu Dhabi - F1 news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/96217)

Knock-on

15th November 2011, 09:09

Other people who get trashed around here might have the same problems yet no one cares, why should I care about Button's excuses?

Because you're not interested in the facts perhaps?

If it were Schumacher that had had a serious KERS issue throughout the race where it wasn't working for half the distance and every corner, he wouldn't know if it was going to harvest energy or not so his brake bias was swinging wildly but he still managed to hold onto 3rd, you would be extolling his achievement as mercurial and heroic would you not?

Other people on here are objective and recognise strengths and weaknesses of all drivers but you are so dogmatic that your opinions are practically worthless so why should we care about what you say?

Dave B

15th November 2011, 09:16

And its debatable how much of a f**kwit PM was

It's a pretty short debate if you look at the race footage. He was a mobile roadbock when Alonso came up to lap him, and after his penalty he was too busy fighting with Alguasuari to notice they were in the way for a second time.

wedge

15th November 2011, 12:25

and after his penalty he was too busy fighting with Alguasuari to notice they were in the way for a second time.

I'm not a huge fan of the blue flag system and its an example of how it can troublesome more than its worth. In that instance it should be have at it, boys.

Dave B

15th November 2011, 12:44

I'm not a huge fan of the blue flag system and its an example of how it can troublesome more than its worth. In that instance it should be have at it, boys.

I admit to not being a fan of blue flags either. To my mind if you're good enough to find yourself a full lap ahead then you should be good enough to overtake a slower car. However the rules are what they are and we can't choose to ignore them simply because MAL and ALG were having an entertaining battle.

wedge

15th November 2011, 13:30

I admit to not being a fan of blue flags either. To my mind if you're good enough to find yourself a full lap ahead then you should be good enough to overtake a slower car. However the rules are what they are and we can't choose to ignore them simply because MAL and ALG were having an entertaining battle.

Of course, rules are rules and although he committed two crimes - one has context and to some extent sympathy and therefore does not necessarily make him a donkey let alone a f**kwit.

F1boat

15th November 2011, 15:12

I am very sad for Felipe, he was really fast between 2005 and the crash.

donKey jote

15th November 2011, 17:43

Of course, rules are rules and although he committed two crimes - one has context and to some extent sympathy and therefore does not necessarily make him a donkey let alone a f**kwit.
no sympathy here :
big fat donkey and big fat f**kwit for costing Alonso the couple of seconds he might have needed to briefly get ahead of Lewis :p

donKey jote

15th November 2011, 17:47

I admit to not being a fan of blue flags either. To my mind if you're good enough to find yourself a full lap ahead then you should be good enough to overtake a slower car. However the rules are what they are and we can't choose to ignore them simply because MAL and ALG were having an entertaining battle.
To my mind they should do like in bumps rowing races: get lapped and you're out :p
Blue flags at least mean they can still collect points. :)

The Black Knight

16th November 2011, 08:52

As easy as it is to pick out Maldonado as Donkey he had two penalties and still finished ahead of Jaime and Bruno.

And its debatable how much of a f**kwit PM was

Pastor Maldonado and Bruno Senna slam 'inconsistent' blue flag penalties in Abu Dhabi - F1 news - AUTOSPORT.com (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/96217)

I don't buy PM and BS's excuses. They are backmarkers and once a blue flag is raised they have to move out of the way of the leaders. Nobody gives a toss about 16th place. Personally, I feel blue flags punishments are too leniant. I honestly feel that if a leader is held up at all, within reason say by anymore than half a second to a second, by a backmarker that the backmarker needs to be penalised. Whether Pastor loses 4 seconds or not is irrelevant, imo.

Knock-on

16th November 2011, 10:55

I don't buy PM and BS's excuses. They are backmarkers and once a blue flag is raised they have to move out of the way of the leaders. Nobody gives a toss about 16th place. Personally, I feel blue flags punishments are too lenient. I honestly feel that if a leader is held up at all, within reason say by anymore than half a second to a second, by a backmarker that the backmarker needs to be penalised. Whether Pastor loses 4 seconds or not is irrelevant, imo.

Totally agree mate. We want nice full grids and we want cars to step up to the Mark and start to challenge the front runners but until that happens, get the hell out of the way of the teams that are challenging the lead.

We know that on some circuits like Monaco, a POS car can easily hold up a leader and just as simply cost someone a win. It's not acceptable Dave for a driver in a 2nd team like STR or with a customer engine like FI to be influencing the leaders and assist their masters.

Christ on a bike, we had enough conspiracy theories recently about whether Mercedes were going to sacrifice a position to get a McLaren on the podium :laugh:

Blue flags need to be there.

Dave B

16th November 2011, 13:10

We know that on some circuits like Monaco, a POS car can easily hold up a leader and just as simply cost someone a win. It's not acceptable Dave for a driver in a 2nd team like STR or with a customer engine like FI to be influencing the leaders and assist their masters.

Christ on a bike, we had enough conspiracy theories recently about whether Mercedes were going to sacrifice a position to get a McLaren on the podium :laugh:

Blue flags need to be there.

I disagree. I strongly disagree. No "like" button for you this time :p

Monaco is an exception, fair enough, but it's a track that simply wouldn't be on the calendar but for its history and prestige. In the case of every other circuit I stand by my point: if you're good enough to get yourself a lap ahead, then you should be good enough to pass that slower car. The existing rules on blocking should be vigourously enforced to prevent any slower car deliberately getting in the way, but to my mind it's an integral part of a driver's skillset that they should be able to deal with slower traffic.

Knock-on

16th November 2011, 13:16

Knock-on

16th November 2011, 13:33

Dave B

16th November 2011, 15:23

We'll agree to disagree then. Likey likey this time.

Knock-on

16th November 2011, 15:27

We'll agree to disagree then. Likey likey this time.

Don't think you can bully me with your 'likeys'. I feel victimised!!!

It's not fair :bigcry:

;)

Garry Walker

16th November 2011, 19:53

Or imagine Webber and Massa were in the Red Bull. :) We would be saying modern F1 is so competitive that no-one is able to design a car that can dominate the championship....
If one of them got the Blonde Turd treatment at Red Bull, either of those guys would easily have taken the title in that car.

I admit to not being a fan of blue flags either. To my mind if you're good enough to find yourself a full lap ahead then you should be good enough to overtake a slower car. However the rules are what they are and we can't choose to ignore them simply because MAL and ALG were having an entertaining battle.
Blue flags have to be there and backmarkers have to let those who actually can race get past them and not force them to lose any time. I couldnt care less what idiot teams like Virgin or HRT are doing in the race and the quicker they retire the better, but I would hate for any of those drivers to cost time to drivers actually fighting for the win.

wedge

17th November 2011, 15:13

Seriously though Dave, we have seen examples this year where slower drivers have attempted to 'ruin' other drivers race. What would happen if, for example, a FI held up a Red Bull allowing McLaren to win a Championship. OK, Sutil or PdR might get a stop/go or even disqualified but they could do it. Is it so unthinkble when only a few years ago we had a Renault crash out to give Alonso an undeserved win?

The potential for abuse is too tempting ;)

We can disagree on this but I feel the Blue Flags help keep a bit of decorum :)

The system generally works well in oval racing and endurance racing - even the shorter race lengths as in ALMS. Overcoming backmarkers is part of racing IMO.

Of course it is open to abuse as with the likes of Rene Arnoux and Andrea De Cesaris but isn't that what the stewards are their for? If they have the remit to judge a racing accident then surely it could apply to certain backmarker/traffic situations? eg. a degree of leniency when backmarkers are racing each other.

Knock-on

17th November 2011, 15:31

The system generally works well in oval racing and endurance racing - even the shorter race lengths as in ALMS. Overcoming backmarkers is part of racing IMO.

Of course it is open to abuse as with the likes of Rene Arnoux and Andrea De Cesaris but isn't that what the stewards are their for? If they have the remit to judge a racing accident then surely it could apply to certain backmarker/traffic situations? eg. a degree of leniency when backmarkers are racing each other.

I appreciate both yours and Daves view but I don't see what's so bad with the current system. It just ensures that backmarkers do what racing etiquette demands; get out of the way.

Removing the Blue flags will just make the potential for strategic blocking more likely wouldn't it?

wedge

17th November 2011, 16:40

I appreciate both yours and Daves view but I don't see what's so bad with the current system. It just ensures that backmarkers do what racing etiquette demands; get out of the way.

Removing the Blue flags will just make the potential for strategic blocking more likely wouldn't it?

Of course, Le Mans this year is an excellent example. Surely, as I originally referred to, a halfway house solution whereby 'being in the way on an empty track' won't be tolerated vs. leniency when backmarkers are racing each other.

Dave B

17th November 2011, 20:03

I appreciate both yours and Daves view but I don't see what's so bad with the current system. It just ensures that backmarkers do what racing etiquette demands; get out of the way.

Removing the Blue flags will just make the potential for strategic blocking more likely wouldn't it?

There's already a rule against blocking. So long as that was consistently enforced I don't foresee a problem.

Malbec

17th November 2011, 20:05

Donkey of the race today: Maldonado for getting in everybody's way and picking up a drive through for his troubles - plus he's being investigated (along with Alguersuari) after the race for another block.

Apparently Maldonaldo swaggered into the stewards office and was told to go out and come back in in a respectful manner.

Seems like a thoroughly unpleasant bloke who has learned nothing from hitting Lewis in Spa, presumably because he wasn't punished properly for it.

markabilly

18th November 2011, 00:51

my vote for donkey is both the race and the track.. :dozey:

Outside of Seb's puncture, the whole thing was BORING, BORING, :s nore:

SGWilko

18th November 2011, 09:36

my vote for donkey is both the race and the track.. :dozey:

Outside of Seb's puncture, the whole thing was BORING, BORING, :s nore:

Why don't you go off and do something less boring instead? (http://youtu.be/BI14wfWJax8)

ioan

18th November 2011, 17:53

Because you're not interested in the facts perhaps?

Give me your post address and I'll ship you a mirror.

ioan

18th November 2011, 18:01

Apparently Maldonaldo swaggered into the stewards office and was told to go out and come back in in a respectful manner.

Seems like a thoroughly unpleasant bloke who has learned nothing from hitting Lewis in Spa, presumably because he wasn't punished properly for it.

Other than because it was Lewis hitting him in Spa, is there any other reason why Maldonado should have been punished for it?