Snow Tires

[Gregor-y]

I'm needing a new set this year and thought it would be interesting to see what other people use, if they use them at all. I need dedicated winter rubber because of a few rallies plus a drive between Chicago and Denver and back. In addition to snow at rallies there is always the chance of blizzards and ice storms on this long trip. So I do feel I need separate winter tires. Plus it lets me choose better tires for the rest of the year.

[donKey jote]

I only use my own brand, be it summer or winter :bandit: :p

[Bolton Midnight]

Tyres

[donKey jote]

England

[Bolton Midnight]

No no it is Ingerland, listen to the songs

[donKey jote]

fyre
hyre
dyre
spyre

listen to the words

[Bolton Midnight]

Get over yourself, it is not Tire it is Tyre, just helping the OP type proper English

[donKey jote]

tire and tyre are both proper English depending on where you're posting from.

as is nowt in your part of the woods

[Bolton Midnight]

Nowt is slang, tire is wrong where ever you are.

[BDunnell]

Nowt is slang, tire is wrong where ever you are.

And 'wherever' is usually the correct form. If you are to lecture others on language, better make sure your own use of English is up to scratch. I feel sorry for the original poster who asked a perfectly polite question.

[Gregor-y]

And 'wherever' is usually the correct form. If you are to lecture others on language, better make sure your own use of English is up to scratch. I feel sorry for the original poster who asked a perfectly polite question.
It's my fault for not prefacing the question with 'After you work yourself into apoplexy over the US spelling,'
But I thought all the English speakers elsewhere had culture and education to go with their fancy accents, could get past the difference and provide useful information. ;)

[BDunnell]

It's my fault for not prefacing the question with 'After you work yourself into apoplexy over the US spelling,'
But I thought all the English speakers elsewhere had culture and education to go with their fancy accents, could get past the difference and provide useful information. ;)

And I'm sure some will.

[schmenke]

Greg, what car are you driving?
I get the feeling that the requirements for your vehicle are different than the Michelin Ice-somethingorothers that we've mounted on the family mini-van :uhoh: :p : .

[Firstgear]

Not sure if you really wanna go there, but there's about 24 pages of stuff in this thread from about a year ago.

http://www.motorsportforums.com/showthread.php?t=136181

[Gregor-y]

They do change a bit year to year but thanks for the link; I'll take a look. This is for a seven year old Subaru that uses the stock 205-55-16 size, though I'm considering narrowing the size to 195-60-16. It will under report speed a small bit but isn't too serious.

[Bolton Midnight]

I feel sorry for the original poster who asked a perfectly polite question.

Me too because it is being cluttered up by clever dicks who think they know what's what. When in reality they are mostly clueless.

I know of some UK available winter tyres not sure re USA though.

[dyfi1]

Greetings from the UK. I use winter tyres on my Volvo S40 SE year round. The rim size is 205/ 50/17. Tread wear is higher than that of summer tyres, but that is to be expected due to the softer compound utilised. I keep a close eye on tyre pressures and have the tracking checked twice a year to maximise tyre life. I neglected to do this once and paid the price. I shredded the front pair on a round trip to Finland and Sweden in February 2010. They were Vredestein Wintrac Xtreme (their spelling, not mine) and performed brilliantly on snow, but you have to be a little careful when there`s ice or ice under snow. The car has stability control and abs, so I`m sure that helped a lot towards the sure footed feeling.

Incidentally I am of course refering to unstudded tyres. My current tyres are Nokian WR G2, just fitted ready for Scottish skiing season, Roger Albert Clark rally and Rally Sweden 2012. I`ve used Michelin Pilot Alpin, Vredestein Wintrac Xtreme and Nokian in the past and my choice is Nokian from now on. Why? Best price and longevity. The looks on the faces of those who use summer tyres, slipping and spinning wheels on snow and slush, as you breeze by at 40mph is priceless.

[schmenke]

Greetings from the UK. I use winter tyres on my Volvo S40 SE year round. ....

:confused: :?:

[Bolton Midnight]

Goodyear ULTRA GRIP 8 195/60 R15 88T
Bridgestone Blizzak LM-20 175/65 R13 80T
Linglong Radial 650 Winter Hero 175/65 R15 84T
Kumho XLKW23 185/60 R15 88T

Few recommendations from MyTyres.co.uk

[dyfi1]

:confused: :?:

Well, UK summers don`t last that long, and the temperatures rarely get that hot, and depending on where you`re located it can snow anytime from October thru May. Scotland had a dusting of snow just a few days ago on the higher parts. Mostly the snow doesn`t last too long, but while it does, I keep moving. My folks live in Perthshire so I get good use out of my winter boots visiting them. The Highways people can be slow off the mark gritting too, so untreated roads prove less of a problem.

[schmenke]

Well, UK summers don`t last that long, and the temperatures rarely get that hot, and depending on where you`re located it can snow anytime from October thru May. Scotland had a dusting of snow just a few days ago on the higher parts. ...

Did you notice my flag? :p :
I'd hazard a guess that winter conditions around here no better than your neck of the woods ;) . Our "higher parts" are often snow covered all year long!

I use summer tires for as long as I can during the year, swapping to winters only just before the snow starts to fall.
I don't like running winters during summer months because the tread design typically is not suited for warm pavement, and can be hazardous in wet weather. Not to mention, fuel consumption is slightly increased.

Having two sets of ti(y)res maximizes the longevity of both :)

[donKey jote]

Having two sets of ti(y)res maximizes the longevity of both :)

exactly

[donKey jote]

Goodyear ULTRA GRIP 8 195/60 R15 88T
Bridgestone Blizzak LM-20 175/65 R13 80T
Linglong Radial 650 Winter Hero 175/65 R15 84T
Kumho XLKW23 185/60 R15 88T

Few recommendations from MyTyres.co.uk

thanks for that great advice, specially the Linglong :laugh: :rolleyes:

[donKey jote]

They do change a bit year to year but thanks for the link; I'll take a look. This is for a seven year old Subaru that uses the stock 205-55-16 size, though I'm considering narrowing the size to 195-60-16. It will under report speed a small bit but isn't too serious.
Steer well clear from any funny names and you should be ok.
Any of the top brands of Winter tyres will be decent. Specially Continental (WinterContact TS830) or Goodyear (UltraGrip8 I think is the latest). Michelin only if you favour mileage over wet and winter grip.

[BleAivano]

either go with the latest edition of Gislaved Nordfrost or the latest edition of Nokian Hakkapelitta.

[Eki]

Steer well clear from any funny names and you should be ok.

You think Linglong is a funny name?

Linglong and prosper!

[donKey jote]

either go with the latest edition of Gislaved Nordfrost or the latest edition of Nokian Hakkapelitta.
both Nordic tyres, i.e extreme Winter. Depends on what greg wants...
they'd be better on snow and specially ice but much worse in the wet or dry and will wear quickly on snow-free roads.

[donKey jote]

You think Linglong is a funny name?

Linglong and prosper!
Safety fears over budget tyres - Autocar.co.uk (http://www.autocar.co.uk/News/NewsArticle/AllCars/237396/)

[Eki]

both Nordic tyres, i.e extreme Winter. Depends on what greg wants...
they'd be better on snow and specially ice but much worse in the wet or dry and will wear quickly on snow-free roads.
Greg said he wants to use them in rallies, so he probably didn't just mean wet or dry tarmac.

[Mark]

Not sure if you really wanna go there, but there's about 24 pages of stuff in this thread from about a year ago.

Should we be using winter tyres in the UK? (http://www.motorsportforums.com/showthread.php?t=136181)

But that's Winter Tyres, different to snow tyres. Although they are often confused.

[donKey jote]

Greg said he wants to use them in rallies, so he probably didn't just mean wet or dry tarmac.
he also said something about denver to chicago, so he probably didn't just mean rallies.

[donKey jote]

But that's Winter Tyres, different to snow tyres. Although they are often confused.
Look for the snowflake symbol on the sidewall and you have a winter/snow tyre with a minimum snow grip performance compared to a standard reference tyre (SRTT). Anything else (fancy wintery name, M+S on the sidewall etc) in no way defines a tyre's Winter/snow performance (or lack of).
How good the performance is, is like the shades of blue. There's no such thing as different shades of blue either, they're all blue :erm: or bluey green, whatever :confused: :p

[Firstgear]

But that's Winter Tyres, different to snow tyres. Although they are often confused.
Well, with 24 pages worth of posts, maybe there's a slight chance that we may have wandered off topic a bit (I know - very unlikely - doesn't happen around here :p ) and discussed snow tyres as well. :)

Being a Canadian prairie boy, winter pretty much means snow.
But I just stick with my all-season's.

[Wasted Talent]

either go with the latest edition of Gislaved Nordfrost or the latest edition of Nokian Hakkapelitta.

I'd go with the Gislaveds as well if you can get them. Excellent in snow

WT

[donKey jote]

I thought the NordFrost was studded...
oh I see... "studdable"

I'd go for the ExtremeWinterContact if I were on the other side of the pond:
Continental ExtremeWinterContact (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Continental&tireModel=ExtremeWinterContact)

[janvanvurpa]

he also said something about denver to chicago, so he probably didn't just mean rallies.

I believe he intends to drive to rallies....although in Ontario and Quebec and the one US winter rally in Northern Michigan, the surfaces are usually pure ice and so everybody with a clue has fresh, new modern "Ice" road tires, not FIA or Swedish/Finnish spec real studs.
The 3 winter nationals i did when i was out East I had good new snow compound tires and was massacred.
A Subaru with diffs still working should work well with anything and he's right, go slightly narrower, and look for or make the shoulders square-er.

[Gregor-y]

Driving to the rally I can expect some bad snow near Lake Michigan, and snow covered roads around the rally (and of course on the stages). Normally there is enough newly fallen snow to get traction, and I will go down most stages before the competitors turn them to ice slicks. For the long drives to Colorado the weather is always a complete mystery. It may be perfectly clear or there may be fog, ice and blizzard conditions for a few hundred miles. I've been stranded in Colorado due to highway closures on the plains before, but I can think of wose places to be stuck.

I'll take a look at the Continentals; in my size the price looks very agreeable and I've always had good service from the Tire Rack.

[Eki]

I changed my winter tires on today. I didn't remember their brand earlier, but now I do. They are Michelin X-Ice North.

[Eki]

Donkey was wrong about Finnish tester being partial to Nokian. In the winter tire test of a Finnish magazine Tekniikan maailma, Continental ContiIceContact was deemed the best studded winter tire:

Tekniikan Maailma talvirengastesti 2011 (http://www.rengasvertailu.fi/talvirengastestit/tekniikan-maailma-talvirengastesti-2011.html)

2011 Talvirengastestin lopputulokset:

Nastarenkaat:

1 Continental ContiIceContact 8,7
2 Nokian Hakkapeliitta 7 8,4
3 Bridgestone Noranza 2 8,3
4 Pirelli Winter Carving Edge 8,3
5 Michelin X-Ice North XIN2 8,1
6 Goodyear UltraGrip Extreme 7,8
7 Vredestein Arctrac 7,7
8 Hankook Winter IPike 7,3
9 Agi Sarek 2 7,0
10 Yokohama IceGuardStud ig35 7,0

[Gregor-y]

I'd go for the ExtremeWinterContact if I were on the other side of the pond:
Continental ExtremeWinterContact (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Continental&tireModel=ExtremeWinterContact)
I ordered them this afternoon. Next week they'll be going on the original wheels that came with the car; those have been in storage for the last seven years.

[donKey jote]

Do give me some feedback in due time so I can kick the responsible engineer in the ass if they don't meet your expectations ! :p

[schmenke]

Tried to swap the semi-annual swap over the weekend, only to discover that I have a warped stud-bolt on the right front so I can't remove the wheel :dozey: .
Thankfully there's no snow in the forecast for the next few days... :mark:

[Gregor-y]

It's snowed to the west and snowed to the east, but Chicago hasn't gone below freezing yet. Yesterday I only needed a light jacket.

[donKey jote]

I was supposed to be in Ivalo (~300km north of the Arctic Circle) today with a UK TV motoring program filming an item on Summer tyres vs. Winter tyres in a pair of M3's.
We had to cancel again due to lack of snow - above freezing means it's even too warm for their snow cannons :dozey:

[janneppi]

Yeah, it's couple of degrees warmer than usual here.
I feel a bit silly running studded tyres when it's +8C. :)

[donKey jote]

Not looking forward to our next Winter event in Sweden beginning of December... we can forget the shortcut across the lake for a start ! :p

[Zeakiwi]

Not looking forward to our next Winter event in Sweden beginning of December... we can forget the shortcut across the lake for a start ! :p

The short cut across the lake will still be possible if you take an aquada, hovercraft or other amphibious vehicle.

[Eki]

Not looking forward to our next Winter event in Sweden beginning of December... we can forget the shortcut across the lake for a start ! :p
Just inflate the tires so much that the car will float.

[driveace]

Eki ,when we came to do the hannki rally in 1980,we used "Kometa Tyres",can you still get theses tyres in Finland yet ?

[Eki]

Eki ,when we came to do the hannki rally in 1980,we used "Kometa Tyres",can you still get theses tyres in Finland yet ?
Not as far as I know, but Nokian Kometa Hakkapeliitta was once superior studded tyre:

More than 75 years of Nokian winter tyres (http://www.nokiantyres.com/first-winter-tyres)


The history of Nokian Hakkapeliitta winter tyres is colourful and prestigious. Manufactured since 1936, Hakkapeliitta tyres achieved worldwide fame in the legendary Monte Carlo rallies in the 1950s and 1960s. Cars equipped with studded Kometa Hakkapeliitta tyres were superior on snowy and icy mountain roads. Finnish drivers continued to do well in rallies, giving rise to the notion of "Flying Finns". Hakkapeliitta tyres proved their unique features and were soon coveted by competitors from many different countries.

Nokian Tyres still use the brand name Hakkapeliitta, but I haven't heard about Kometa recently.

hRTEkrt1EO0

[Viking]

I trust the Finns…. When it comes to wintertyres and vodka :)

This is under my car


Nokian Hakkapeliitta R (http://www.nokiantyres.com/tyre?id=10924176&group=1.01&name=Nokian+Hakkapeliitta+R)

[Eki]

Donkey, have you ever considered testing tyres in a ski tunnel?

Vuokatin urheiluopisto > Current Information (http://www.vuokattisport.fi/showpage.php?id=116)

[donKey jote]

yes, many times ;)

[Eki]

yes, many times ;)
Well, have you ever tested tyres in a ski tunnel?

[donKey jote]

yes of course, mainly for simple objective tests like traction or braking (handling is extremely limited :p ) :)
it's nowhere near as efficient or comprehensive as testing on proper outdoor tracks, but can be used for a small program quickie if necessary.

For ice tests we also test regularly in ice rinks... for what it's worth of course, as the ice conditions can obviously be quite different to outdoor tracks.

[Eki]

I was supposed to be in Ivalo (~300km north of the Arctic Circle) today with a UK TV motoring program
What' s the program called? Donkeys on Ice?

[schmenke]

....
For ice tests we also test regularly in ice rinks...

:eek:

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6224/6328940935_b1225eeb08.jpg

[donKey jote]

:laugh:

[ioan]

...Summer tyres vs. Winter tyres in a pair of M3's...

Is that useful? :p

[donKey jote]

I was supposed to be [...] in a pair of M3's.
not in both at the same time of course, I'm not god :p
useful? definitely not! :p

[donKey jote]

:eek:

:andrea:
2841

[Eki]

not in both at the same time of course, I'm not god :p
useful? definitely not! :p

I think ioan meant to ask if it's useful to put the tyres in a car instead of on the car?

[DonJippo]

I was supposed to be in Ivalo (~300km north of the Arctic Circle) today with a UK TV motoring program filming an item on Summer tyres vs. Winter tyres in a pair of M3's.
We had to cancel again due to lack of snow - above freezing means it's even too warm for their snow cannons :dozey:

Was that to be on Test World's tracks or some other? Or what ever it's called now a days I think I read sometime ago it was sold to new owners?

[donKey jote]

Yes, it's still TestWorld :)

[donKey jote]

I think ioan meant to ask if it's useful to put the tyres in a car instead of on the car?
I thought so too ? :p

[Eki]

This thread has been good advertising for Linglong:


continental contiicecontact review, contiicecontact review, linglong radial 650 winter hero review, talvirengastesti 2011, continental contiicecontact winter tires, continental contiicecontact, linglong r650 winter tyres test, ultra grip 8 trees, winter hero linglong test results, forum linglong r650 winter hero, forum linglong 650 winter hero, wikipedia blizard lm20 tire, goodyear ultra grip 8 19560 r15 88t review, finnish magazine tekniikan maailma, linglong radial 650 winter hero 17565 r15 84t, vredestein wintrac, national tyres good year ultra grip 8 195 65r15, linglong 17565 r15 84t test

[donKey jote]

Bad publicity is good publicity :p

[donKey jote]

:eek:
http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6224/6328940935_b1225eeb08.jpg

=>
http://i41.tinypic.com/rshmcp.jpg
:D

[donKey jote]

Well, have you ever tested tyres in a ski tunnel?
->
http://i41.tinypic.com/24x4aq0.jpg
:)

[race aficionado]

:eek:

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6224/6328940935_b1225eeb08.jpg

I know it's off topic but that is a pretty old picture of the donks, right?

Much, much more slimmer days indeed. I would even venture some working out was involved in those days . . . .

a long time ago . . . . . indeed . . . . .

:s mokin:

[Eki]

->
http://i41.tinypic.com/24x4aq0.jpg
:)

That looks like Monaco Grand Prix in winter.

[ioan]

I think ioan meant to ask if it's useful to put the tyres in a car instead of on the car?

Right. ;)

[Bolton Midnight]

Avon Ice Touring

Kumho I'zen KW23

Lassa Snoways

Hankook W440 Ice Bear

Hankook Winter I'cept Evo

[janneppi]

Time to drag one of the winter tyre discussions back to front page. :D

Swapped to winter tyres yesterday, not a real need at this time but I was going to store one set of tyres to my parents storage building so might as well put away the summer tyres. I'm bit nervous to be honest, the new car had studless Contisomethingsomethings instead of studded tyres I've used for 14 winters. I guess I'll just have to be more careful and hope for suitable winter conditions.

[Jag_Warrior]

I've had Kumho Ecsta ultra high performance all season tires for over two years. They have been the worst tires (as far as dry weather cornering, especially off camber turns with slight bumps) that I have ever owned. The sidewall flex was horribly extreme and made my car (modified WRX) dangerously unpredictable in certain corners! I will NEVER buy this brand again! If someone gave me a brand new set, I would sell or give them away - preferably to someone I really didn't like.

In a few weeks I'll be going back to my old, reliable Falken ZE-512's or ZE-612's that I had been buying every couple of years. The treadwear and longevity is not that great. But the handling characteristics and sidewall flex are a world better than the Kumhos. I should have never switched brands!

A better plan would have been to buy another set of wheels when the car was new and swap summer tires for all season tires as the seasons changed. But the car is older now and I'm not going to invest in wheels for a car that I might not be driving for that much longer.

IMO, for the price, Falkens are hard to beat.

[BleAivano]

The tests i have read have had:

Nokian Hakkapeliitta 7 och Continental ContiIceContact as either 1st or 2nd when it comes to studded tires.

With Continental ContiVikingContact 5 & Nokian Hakkapeliitta R in top for unstudded tires.

[donKey jote]

The tests I have read have the Falken 512's down as a big no-no in the wet :eek:

[Jag_Warrior]

The tests I have read have the Falken 512's down as a big no-no in the wet :eek:


I've had two (soon to be three) sets of them and I've found their wet weather handling to be solid, and most importantly, predictable - that's the biggie for me. I don't care for sudden, unexpected moves. But my car is AWD, so maybe their structure is better suited to my car than a RWD or FWD car. Not sure. And in the snow, the only thing that stops me on those tires is if the snow starts scraping the bottom of the spoiler. I actually went up a snow and ice covered hill that a 4WD SUV couldn't go up - and that's when the Falkens were almost worn out.

It could be the AWD thing. Several of the guys who I met doing auto-x had Falkens on their WRX's, STI's and Evos. That's where I found out about them back in 2005 or so. I'd never heard of Falkens before that.

[Gregor-y]

I had (and still have, actually) Falken 612s on a set of seventeen inch wheels, but when they wore out I was tired of the large wheels and started using Continentals on a sixteen inch set I had lying around from my first Impreza from 2000. The 612s were pretty good, even when it was wet. I had some Kumho MXs when I bought my current car in 2004 and they were loud, hard, and sloppy in the rain. The Contis have been very nice for the last two years, though since it will be in the 70s this week (lower 20s for the metric minded) the winter wheels are staying in storage a little longer.

[donKey jote]

ah I think I get it now... the tests were of course European tests. The "acceptable" wet grip levels here are different to what you're generally used to over the pond.
As a trade-off you do tend to get better mileage though :)

[Nornbugger]

I've had Kumho Ecsta ultra high performance all season tires for over two years. They have been the worst tires (as far as dry weather cornering, especially off camber turns with slight bumps) that I have ever owned. The sidewall flex was horribly extreme and made my car (modified WRX) dangerously unpredictable in certain corners! I will NEVER buy this brand again! If someone gave me a brand new set, I would sell or give them away - preferably to someone I really didn't like.

In a few weeks I'll be going back to my old, reliable Falken ZE-512's or ZE-612's that I had been buying every couple of years. The treadwear and longevity is not that great. But the handling characteristics and sidewall flex are a world better than the Kumhos. I should have never switched brands!

A better plan would have been to buy another set of wheels when the car was new and swap summer tires for all season tires as the seasons changed. But the car is older now and I'm not going to invest in wheels for a car that I might not be driving for that much longer.

IMO, for the price, Falkens are hard to beat.

If you tyres are so bad why have you stuck with them so long? Odd decision, I wouldnt drive a 1.6 Impreza on tyres I didnt like for 2 weeks let alone a WRX for 2 years

[D-Type]

I'm finding this discussion educational. In Britain we don't generally have winter conditions severe enough to merit changing to special tyres so I've no idea what the merits and demerits are. For a starter, is there a difference between a "winter tyre" and a "snow tyre". And are studded tyres different again?

[Mark]

Yes. Winter tyres have a compound such that they give superior grip a temperatures below 7C. So they will find grip in icy conditions which summer tyres will not.

Snow tyres are usually the types with studs and illegal in the UK. It doesn't help that people often call Winter tyres Snow tyres.

[donKey jote]

Winter tyres, snow tyres, call them what you want. There is no legal definition so they don't exist :p
Any tyre can be marked M+S (mud and snow), it doesn't mean anything. Tyres with a snowflake symbol have a guaranteed minimum snow performance as measured against a 14" Standard Reference Tyre, but that doesn't necessarily mean much either.
Studs are good for ice, but have no advantage over friction winter tyres on snow.

The main characteristics of a winter tyre are that it's tread rubber undergoes the glass transition at lower temperatures (whereas a high performance summer compound can already "freeze" around 5-10C), and that it's tread pattern is heavily siped for better grip on slippery surfaces.

7C is a rule of thumb, it's not like 8C is ok for a "summer" tyre and for 6C you need a "winter" tyre. By the way, it's not only grip that is affected by the temperature, but also tyre wear.
In Germany another rule of thumb is winter tyres from O(ctober) to O(stern) -Easter.
I'll be switching within the next a couple of weeks. :)

[Jag_Warrior]

If you tyres are so bad why have you stuck with them so long? Odd decision, I wouldnt drive a 1.6 Impreza on tyres I didnt like for 2 weeks let alone a WRX for 2 years

It took roughly a month for me to discover that it was the tires and not my suspension settings or alignment. The car has a full aftermarket, tuned suspension, so I figured that going to a different brand/type of tire may have affected the handling vs. the tires that were on it when I had the suspension tuned. That wasn't it. Once I confirmed that it was the tires, I tried to sell them but no one would buy them - my mechanic tried, but to no avail. And I wasn't inclined to flush $400 plus mounting & balancing down the toilet. The car is a daily driver, not a competition car. So I simply moderated my driving habits. As I collect birthdays, the need and desire to drive at 8/10th's + has lessened. :)

[BleAivano]

I'm finding this discussion educational. In Britain we don't generally have winter conditions severe enough to merit changing to special tyres so I've no idea what the merits and demerits are. For a starter, is there a difference between a "winter tyre" and a "snow tyre". And are studded tyres different again?

In Sweden its mandatory by law of use winter tyres for the period of December 1st to March 31st if there are winter conditions.
Studded tires are allowed from October 1st to April 15th. Exceptions if the weather/road conditions requires it.

However the city of Stockholm came up with the really bright idea to ban studded tires but only on one single street
in the entire city. The street is Hornsgatan at Södermalm. (http://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hornsgatan#Luftf.C3.B6roreningar_och_dubbd.C3.A4ck sf.C3.B6rbud)

Vinterdäck - Wikipedia (http://sv.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vinterd%C3%A4ck#Datumbest.C3.A4mmelser)

[J4MIE]

I am not sure if I will get winter tyres as it'd mean either going back to my 13" steel wheels, or buy another set of alloys.

Might put it off another year....

[janneppi]

Well, today was the first -1C day in souther Finland, roads were dry in my commute, but we took a trip up to Tampere and it was quite slippery in some places. It's nice how some modern cars are so quiet, I could barely hear the studs scraping asfalt on my co-workers Audi. compared to my old civic there's probably 20 decibel difference at 120kph. :)

[Gregor-y]

In Chicago today it's 23C. Insanity, I know. 1000 miles to the west and a little to the south it's -2 where my parents live. The temperature here will be dropping all afternoon to about 4 by midnight. I can't wait!

[Daniel]

I am not sure if I will get winter tyres as it'd mean either going back to my 13" steel wheels, or buy another set of alloys.

Might put it off another year....

Cheaper to do it with your steelies jamie :) Plus winter is when you're more likely to hit kerbs and steel wheels are far better for that :)

[Jag_Warrior]

Cheaper to do it with your steelies jamie :) Plus winter is when you're more likely to hit kerbs and steel wheels are far better for that :)

Do you still have a Subie in your family, Daniel? What type/brand of tires are you running now?

[Daniel]

Do you still have a Subie in your family, Daniel? What type/brand of tires are you running now?

We do yes. I keep on meaning to book it into the blasters to get the rust sorted out..... Currently it's got 2 Vredesetin Sportrac's up front, a Conti Premium Contact 2 and some Infinity thing on the back. Had 2 Conti's but Caroline picked up a puncture from an absolutely massive masonry bolt! :mark:

[MrJan]

IMO, for the price, Falkens are hard to beat.

I had a set of Falkens (couldn't tell you the model number) on the rear of my old MR2 once went through them in about 7000 miles :eek: Needless to say the next time I had to get new tyres I went for cheapy Nankangs, lasted for ages and you just had to alter your driving style a bit (e.g gentle with the loud pedal in the wet or be ready for a bit of opposite lock). Besides being cheaper I actually enjoyed the Nankangs more, I knew they were a bit loose but could be smooth enough that it wasn't a problem. Might have been a bit different in the snow, but then a RWD car is always going to be lively in snow.

[schmenke]

Mounted the winter rims on the swagger-wagon on Sunday, just in time for the 15cms that fell in the last couple of days :s

[Jag_Warrior]

We do yes. I keep on meaning to book it into the blasters to get the rust sorted out..... Currently it's got 2 Vredesetin Sportrac's up front, a Conti Premium Contact 2 and some Infinity thing on the back. Had 2 Conti's but Caroline picked up a puncture from an absolutely massive masonry bolt! :mark:

Good deal. Not to go off-topic, but I want another Subie so bad it's not funny. I didn't realize they stopped making the Baja when I was looking for a late model used Baja. I think 2006 was the last year. :( On something like a utilitarian, but fun, Baja, I think a decent touring or maybe even a mid-grade all-season would be just fine. On that, I would be looking for long tread life as opposed to all-out performance.

As Mr. Jan mentioned above, Falken high performance tires tend not to last all that long compared to a harder tire - I assume he had all seasons, as Falken makes all variety of tires. But then again, no all season tire is going to last very long if you run it year round. A fellow I know who had an earlier model NSX went through a set of Pirelli V or Z rated summer tires in 5K miles!!! I think he had some sort of medical problem with his right foot that may have contributed to that though. ;) The Bridgestone RE92's that came on my car didn't last as long as the first set of Falkens, and they became worn enough to notice a difference within 14K miles. I can usually get about 20K from Falkens. I'm OK with that. The problem with the Bridgestones, in addition to not being all that grippy, was also the price. The Falkens are less than $90/tire. The price on the Bridgerocks was close to $280/tire even back in '06 or so! :eek:

[Daniel]

Good deal. Not to go off-topic, but I want another Subie so bad it's not funny. I didn't realize they stopped making the Baja when I was looking for a late model used Baja. I think 2006 was the last year. :( On something like a utilitarian, but fun, Baja, I think a decent touring or maybe even a mid-grade all-season would be just fine. On that, I would be looking for long tread life as opposed to all-out performance.

As Mr. Jan mentioned above, Falken high performance tires tend not to last all that long compared to a harder tire - I assume he had all seasons, as Falken makes all variety of tires. But then again, no all season tire is going to last very long if you run it year round. A fellow I know who had an earlier model NSX went through a set of Pirelli V or Z rated summer tires in 5K miles!!! I think he had some sort of medical problem with his right foot that may have contributed to that though. ;) The Bridgestone RE92's that came on my car didn't last as long as the first set of Falkens, and they became worn enough to notice a difference within 14K miles. I can usually get about 20K from Falkens. I'm OK with that. The problem with the Bridgestones, in addition to not being all that grippy, was also the price. The Falkens are less than $90/tire. The price on the Bridgerocks was close to $280/tire even back in '06 or so! :eek:

Funny thing is that the Bridgestone Potenza's on my car have lasted really well. If not for the fact that the dealer messed up the tracking which meant the car murdered the fronts in 3k miles after having some warranty work done, I'd still have originals on the front and they'd have made it to 40k miles easy. I think tyres differ greatly between the US and the rest of the world.

[Daniel]

Good deal. Not to go off-topic, but I want another Subie so bad it's not funny. I didn't realize they stopped making the Baja when I was looking for a late model used Baja. I think 2006 was the last year. :( On something like a utilitarian, but fun, Baja, I think a decent touring or maybe even a mid-grade all-season would be just fine. On that, I would be looking for long tread life as opposed to all-out performance.
Utilitarian cars are fun :) I bought this a bit over a month ago not sure if I want to keep it or sell it on for a profit in the winter if the weather hits. 4x4 Panda's go for silly money when the white stuff falls :) http://oi49.tinypic.com/2dhgoyr.jpg

[janneppi]

Had to drive the car today as the guy who was supposed to pick me up had summer tyres on and couldn't get out of his neighborhood. Good thing he didn't, it was pretty slippery the whole day and it would be stupid to end up in a ditch as some of the care free spirits did today.

One of the garage's here had quite a few customers, four hour waiting in the peak time. :D

[A.F.F.]

I changed my tyres in the nick of time couple of days ago. It was much nicer to leave work after nightshift when there was semiwinter in the morning. I have Nokia Hakkapeliitta 5 and I've been very happy with them.

[schmenke]

To make a long story short… I’ve recently replaced my previous ~10 year old Hyundai POS with a new 2013 Hyundai ~POS for which I’m now in search of winter ti(y)res.
A local tire shop has recommended these, at a really good price:

CHAMPIRO ICEPRO - GT Radial Canada (http://www.gtradial.ca/en/product-details.asp?mastertireid=ChinaPattern000387)

I've never heard of this rubber brand before. Does anyone know anything about it? :s

[donKey jote]

Personally never heard of them but Champiro was way at the bottom of the ADAC test sheets and in the category "Billigreifen" (billig= cheap, not only in price as opposed for example to günstig= cheap as in value for money) ;)
ADAC Test 2011 Winterreifen 195/65 R15 (http://www.adac.de/infotestrat/tests/reifen/winterreifen/2011_Winterreifen_Test_195_65_R15.aspx)
The pattern may look like a winter tire but ff you want proper winter performance you should get one of the premium brands. :)

I'm fitting mine today btw, we have the first freeze forecast for the weekend. :bandit:

[schmenke]

Thanks Donks. Yeah, I had my doubts about those Chumpiros.
I don't see the Michelin X-Ice Xi3 on that list. Another tire, albeit much more expensive, recommended to me.

The Contientals are availalbe at Tirerack.com for what appears to be a reasonable price.

[Gregor-y]

I'm going to put mine on after work today. Since the summer wheels are covered in brake dust I figured I'd change them the next time I wash the car but I haven't done that for months so I need to just clean the wheels and change over before it's too late. Plus I need to take a look at the underside of the car before I start my long distance trips. For mid-December I've scheduled a week off (had to use it or lose it since I can only transfer two weeks over the new year) and am driving to Montreal and Quebec City. Between that and visiting family in Colorado there are at least four thousand miles to be added next month.


To make a long story short… I’ve recently replaced my previous ~10 year old Hyundai POS with a new 2013 Hyundai ~POS for which I’m now in search of winter ti(y)res.
A local tire shop has recommended these, at a really good price:

CHAMPIRO ICEPRO - GT Radial Canada (http://www.gtradial.ca/en/product-details.asp?mastertireid=ChinaPattern000387)

I've never heard of this rubber brand before. Does anyone know anything about it? http://www.motorsportforums.com/images/smilies/s.gif
The tread looks very similar to some cheap Pirellies I had a few years ago, which themselves looked suspiciously like the Hakkapeliitta 3 or 4. They were great in deep snow, not so good or downright terrible everywhere else.

I tried to buy the Continentals from Tire Rack last year but they were sold out in my size so I ended up with Dunlops.

[Daniel]

Thanks Donks. Yeah, I had my doubts about those Chumpiros.
I don't see the Michelin X-Ice Xi3 on that list. Another tire, albeit much more expensive, recommended to me.

The Contientals are availalbe at Tirerack.com for what appears to be a reasonable price.
Champiro is a product line of GT Radial. GT Radial's were popular in Australia as a lower mid range tyre. Personally wouldn't be my choice.

[donKey jote]

I tried to buy the Continentals from Tire Rack last year but they were sold out in my size so I ended up with Dunlops.
you donkey ! :arrows: :p :andrea:

[donKey jote]

Thanks Donks. Yeah, I had my doubts about those Chumpiros.
I don't see the Michelin X-Ice Xi3 on that list. Another tire, albeit much more expensive, recommended to me.

The Contientals are availalbe at Tirerack.com for what appears to be a reasonable price.

The X-Ice is what we call a nordic tyre - the equivalent Conti would be the ContiVikingContact 5 :andrea:

It seems to be OK (http://x3.xbimmers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12746876&postcount=51), albeit slightly worse than the Conti :andrea: :p

[Gregor-y]

you donkey ! :arrows: :p :andrea:

I just checked and they're still sold out. I guess sixteen inch wheels are losing popularity as new ones are freaking immense to save the proportions caused by tiny greenhouses.

[schmenke]

The X-Ice is what we call a nordic tyre - the equivalent Conti would be the ContiVikingContact 5 :andrea:

It seems to be OK (http://x3.xbimmers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=12746876&postcount=51), albeit slightly worse than the Conti :andrea: :p

"Finnish car magazine tested winter tyres (in Finnish winter) and here are the results:

Tyre size: 205/55 R 16

First the average score and then the mark. They tested all tyres with same "scale", and there was 16 different tests. Tests were done on ice, on snow, on wet asphalt and on dry asphalt.

Studded winter tyres:
8,5 Nokian Hakkapeliitta 7
8,5 Goodyear Ultra Grip Ice Arctic
8,5 Continental ContiIceContact
8,2 Michelin X-Ice North XIN2
8,2 Dunlop Ice Touch
8,1 Bridgestone Noranza 2 Evo
8,0 Pirelli Winter Carving Edge
7,8 Gislaved Nord Frost 5
7,7 Vredestein Arctrac
7,7 Sava Eskimo Stud
7,0 Agi Sarek 2
6,9 Nankang NK Snow SW-7

Winter tyres, no studs
7,5 Nokian Hakkapeliitta R
7,4 Goodyear Ultra Grip Ice
7,4 Dunlop SP Ice Sport
7,4 Continental ContiVikingContact 5
7,3 Vredestein Nordtrac 2
7,3 Michelin X-Ice XI3
7,1 Pirelli Icecontrol Winter
6,9 Bridgestone Blizzak WS70
6,4 Cordiant Winter Drive..."

:dozey:

[Gregor-y]

And done!
http://imageshack.us/a/img11/8269/20121127.jpg

[BleAivano]

"Finnish car magazine tested winter tyres (in Finnish winter) and here are the results:

Tyre size: 205/55 R 16

First the average score and then the mark. They tested all tyres with same "scale", and there was 16 different tests. Tests were done on ice, on snow, on wet asphalt and on dry asphalt.



:dozey:


I've seen pretty much the same results in Swedish tests.

[janneppi]

"Finnish car magazine tested winter tyres (in Finnish winter) and here are the results:

Tyre size: 205/55 R 16

Winter tyres, no studs
7,5 Nokian Hakkapeliitta R
7,4 Goodyear Ultra Grip Ice
7,4 Dunlop SP Ice Sport
7,4 Continental ContiVikingContact 5
7,3 Vredestein Nordtrac 2
7,3 Michelin X-Ice XI3
7,1 Pirelli Icecontrol Winter
6,9 Bridgestone Blizzak WS70
6,4 Cordiant Winter Drive..."

:dozey:
As Tekniikan Maailma(the magazine in question) often suggests, you shouldn't just look at the bottom line result. They do 16 different test, judge them on a scale from 0-10 and show the weight of each result in the bottom line result number. They also have short description and good/bad summary of each tyre.

For example

Nokian Hakkapeliitta R,
Good: grip and driveability in winter conditions
bad: breaking grip on wet tarmac

Continental WC5
good: driveability on snow and ice, grip on snow
bad: grip on wet tarmac

Basically, you should be fine if you don't buy Pingopango SuperIce 5's from you local Chinese dealer. ;)

[schmenke]

Thanks for the info everyone.

I just put in an order for a set of:
Continental*ExtremeWinterContact (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Continental&tireModel=ExtremeWinterContact)

Plus a set of attractive black steel wheels :mark: .

[Gregor-y]

Wheels make all the difference. It's so much easier to swap when the seasons change and over a few years it's less than repeated mounting and balancing costs.

[schmenke]

Yep. In fact if we are experiencing a mild winter, with no snow in the forecast and dry roads, I'll swap back to summer tires. Once snow is in the forecast I'll swap back to winters. Drives the wife mad though...

[Gregor-y]

I'm off to Quebec in a week and a half so I hope it stays that way a little longer. Then again I've been trapped in worse places when highways close.

[BleAivano]

Yep. In fact if we are experiencing a mild winter, with no snow in the forecast and dry roads, I'll swap back to summer tires. Once snow is in the forecast I'll swap back to winters. Drives the wife mad though...

Well tbh, summer tires does not work that well when its colder then +6-7 degrees Celsius.
So unless its gets warmer then that, you should keep the winter tires on.

[donKey jote]

Thanks for the info everyone.

I just put in an order for a set of:
Continental*ExtremeWinterContact (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Continental&tireModel=ExtremeWinterContact)

Plus a set of attractive black steel wheels :mark: .

me donkey ! :arrows: :p :andrea:

(I didn't know the ContiVikingContact5 is called ExtremeWinterContact on your side of the puddle... the tings one learns on t'internet! :laugh: )

[schmenke]

Well tbh, summer tires does not work that well when its colder then +6-7 degrees Celsius.
So unless its gets warmer then that, you should keep the winter tires on.

True, but both our family vehicles are equipped with all-season tires, not summers (sorry, I should have clarified), and I'd rather swap to those for cold dry pavement rather than winters. Or am I just being a donkey? :mark:

[schmenke]

(I didn't know the ContiVikingContact5 is called ExtremeWinterContact on your side of the puddle... the tings one learns on t'internet! :laugh: )

Yeah, and a donkey is called an a__ :p : :laugh:

[J4MIE]

Ordered a set of winter Pirellis, should get them in the next few days. As I have discovered, my street doesn't get gritted and as it has been icy for the past ten days it has been well and truly polished.

As an aside my insurance company want me to pay an extra £250 (nearly double) due to my change of address to a 'high risk area' :bigcry:

[donKey jote]

:eek:

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6224/6328940935_b1225eeb08.jpg

we've got our own ice track and icemaker (donkey can't find the start button :dozey: ) on location now :bandit:
http://i46.tinypic.com/2d6jvoy.jpg

[tfp]

That thing looks awesome, I'd drive it to work if I had it.

[Gregor-y]

I'm in Quebec this week and can't get over the fact everyone with a car is required to have snow tires on. So many new cars on steel wheels. Even when I was living in Colorado most people were too cheap to have a set. That said it hasn't snowed, yet, even up here.

[donKey jote]

steel wheels? Damn those Quebecois are cheap :p :andrea:

[schmenke]

There's typically a lot of salt laid down on our roads during winter which corrodes alloy wheels.

[donKey jote]

salt doesn't corrode alloy wheels as much in Germany... maybe they wash their cars more often ;) :p :andrea:

[schmenke]

-15 deg C temps aren't ideal for car washing ;) . We usually endure the grime until springtime when we can hook up a power washer :p : .

[donKey jote]

I guess hooking up a power washer is cheaper than paying for a car wash :p

[Gregor-y]

I spoke too soon. I drove through an ice storm to find Quebec City under a lot of snow with driving sleet. I need some of those covered wiper blades for ice.
http://imageshack.us/a/img543/3288/icev.jpg

[schmenke]

I guess hooking up a power washer is cheaper than paying for a car wash :p


Especially when I borrow the neighbour's power washer :p :

[donKey jote]

Who's that then, his missus? :p

[skarderud]

i've read some of this tread, i can't resist.

1.rule: only buy snowtyres from a country that actually has snow.
2: if mostly ice and hard snow, wider tyres, most loose snow, narrower tyres.
3. studs is way better than studless, whatever anyone says.
4: never trust the salesman! he's there to **** you.
5: no such thing as "all year tyres"! they are bad on summer, even more bad at winter.
6: 4x4 don't "fix" the gravity. you need to brake and make turns with a 4x4 too.
7: all those 3-letters electronic **** is just for bad drivers and women :)
8: nokian hakkapeliita 5 is the worlds best wintertyre. end of diskusion!

i've drive 40.000km a year in lillehammer, norway. half the year its slippery, so i have tested lots of tyres and cars thru the years. exept of 4x4 (normal one, not those fancy ones not build for snow) rwd with studs is much better than fwd with studless. jeep wrangler and other of that kind is useless on snow and ice.

[donKey jote]

1. agree, unless you mean only Viking, Gislaved, Nokian etc :p
2. agree
3. on your permanently white roads yes.
4. agree
5. agree
6. agree
7. agree. However, 98% of drivers outside Scandinavia are bad :p
8. agree it's one of the better studded tyres, otherwise not end of discussion :)

[skarderud]

actually, this years winner on the wintertyre test on dry tarmac was a tyre with studs :) think it was continental.
studless is quite good on hard snow, but overall studs is better.

[schmenke]

.... jeep wrangler and other of that kind is useless on snow and ice.


I beg to differ. In my driving history I’ve owned both the Jeep Wrangler (“YJ” model) and the Jeep Cherokee, both with similar drive trains. Both were exceptional in winter driving conditions. Never once did I ever get either vehicle stuck in the snow or on ice. Mind you, you are correct that braking and steering must be adjusted accordingly :) .

[skarderud]

Then you never has driven a Volvo xc70 or a Subaru on snow. Yes, you won't get stuck that easy, but it's like trying to throw a sledgehammer with the head backwards. Its spins so easy and is close to a tractor (agriculture one) in feeling :) put some allterrain's on those on snow, and you have a real widowmaker. A friend of mine actually as that combo, he says it best: you don't drive a car, you drive a jeep.

[BleAivano]

1. agree, unless you mean only Viking, Gislaved, Nokian etc :p
2. agree
3. on your permanently white roads yes.
4. agree
5. agree
6. agree
7. agree. However, 98% of drivers outside Scandinavia are bad :p
8. agree it's one of the better studded tyres, otherwise not end of discussion :)


actually, this years winner on the wintertyre test on dry tarmac was a tyre with studs :) think it was continental.
studless is quite good on hard snow, but overall studs is better.


DKJ, as Skarderud says its actually the opposite of what you might think.

Studdless is usually for inland roads where the air is drier which means compact snow but hardly any ice or bare roads.
Like the inner parts of Norrland in Sweden.
Studded tires works better then studdless on icy and bare roads where there is a big risk for "Black ice (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_ice)" which happens
when there is moist on bare roads and the temperature drops. The moist will then freeze and create Black ice.

The big danger with it is that you usually don't notice it until its too late. Especially with tires without studs.
Studdless tires usually have little or no grip at all on it.

[donKey jote]

Yes, black ice is the biggest danger of course, and studs are obviously unbeatable on ice.
What I really meant was on your "nordic winter" roads. Here we barely have snow on the main roads as they are easily cleared, so wet and dry grip in cold conditions are more important. Not that we're allowed studs anyway due to the road wear without the snow or ice cover.

I'd be very interested in seeing those test results though... what was the magazine?
What did the dry tarmac test consist of? I can't imagine the studs lasted very long !

[ioan]

Well there was some snow on the roads yesterday and the conclusion is that snow tires are useless around here because most cars are driven at max 40 km/h when it snows. :s

[donKey jote]

another conclusion is that you're surrounded by bad drivers or women ;) :laugh:

[ioan]

I am tempted to agree with that.

[skarderud]

Test av vinterdekk 2012 - NAF (http://www.naf.no/Alle-saker/NAF-eksperten/Forbrukertester/Dekktest/Vinterdekktest-2012/Vinterdekktest-2012/)

here is one tyretest, but in norwegian. googlish it :)

you need snowtyres anyway, because even in 40km/h you have 20m longer brakingzone with summertyres. imagine in 8:)
and its nice to have some grip when you will pass those, probably with summertyres....

[donKey jote]

ah yes, Jukka Antila from Test World. Thanks ! :up:

[BleAivano]

Yes, black ice is the biggest danger of course, and studs are obviously unbeatable on ice.
What I really meant was on your "nordic winter" roads. Here we barely have snow on the main roads as they are easily cleared,
so wet and dry grip in cold conditions are more important. Not that we're allowed studs anyway due to the road wear without the snow or ice cover.

I'd be very interested in seeing those test results though... what was the magazine?
What did the dry tarmac test consist of? I can't imagine the studs lasted very long !

But the thing is DKJ, you are generalizing too much in this case.

The Distance from the southern tip of Sweden at Smygehuk to the North Cape in Norway is the same
as the distance from Hamburg in northern Germany to Messina at the Messina strait in southern Italy.

This means that the variations in climate and weather is actually quite big which also means that the winter roads
you are talking about aren't that common in the southern half the country.
Since even if there is lots of snow (which is far from certain) the larger roads are usually cleared and
those roads that are not cleared eventually becomes very icy.

[donKey jote]

Of course it's a generalisation, you have more snow and ice and lower temperatures in general. "Standard" winter tyres are different to "Nordic" winter tyres for these general reasons. :)

[SGWilko]

Why do my snow tyres keep melting in the sun? ;)

[J4MIE]

Well I got my winter tyres fitted on Wednesday (Pirelli W160) and am far from convinced :s Maybe it's just going back to narrower 13" steel wheels but the understeer around dry roundabouts is horrific :s

Of course, it's now meant to get slightly warmer over the next few days, that's my fault :p :

[DonJippo]

ah yes, Jukka Antila from Test World. Thanks ! :up:

Have had few beers with Jukka during the dark period of my life :D

[donKey jote]

I guess my dark period isn't over yet :laugh:

[ioan]

Test av vinterdekk 2012 - NAF (http://www.naf.no/Alle-saker/NAF-eksperten/Forbrukertester/Dekktest/Vinterdekktest-2012/Vinterdekktest-2012/)

here is one tyretest, but in norwegian. googlish it :)

you need snowtyres anyway, because even in 40km/h you have 20m longer brakingzone with summertyres. imagine in 8:)
and its nice to have some grip when you will pass those, probably with summertyres....

Everyone has winter tires here from November to mid April, it is the law.

[schmenke]

Well, the new Donkinentals are working out just fine :) , although we've had next to no snow since I mounted them :rolleyes: .

[ioan]

I've got some kind of Conti winter tires too, and they are doing fine as long as you take care.
As a side info winter tires are not made to be better on snow, the idea is to have a tire that performs better in terms of grip in the cold (under 7 degrees Celsius) than the usual summer rubber does.

[donKey jote]

As a side info winter tires are not only made to be better on snow, the main idea is to have a tire that performs better in terms of grip in the cold (generally defined as being under 7 degrees Celsius) than the usual summer rubber does.

Fixed ;)
Winter tyres have softer compounds (to mantain friction at lower temperatures, where harder summer compounds "freeze"), and a more structured tread pattern, with plenty of sipes for better grip on low friction surfaces such as ice, snow, and "slippy" wet. :)

[skarderud]

lots of differences on a nordic tyre and a mid-europe tyre.

the nordic tyre is softer compound, and has more sipes. remember that these tyres have to work in both +3 and wet ice to -3:) lots of grip in -30 thought!
i actually put a (probably) mid european continental tyre (ts810?) on one of my cars to test (volvo 850), and its better than summertyres, but nowhere near the nokian (hakka r) i normaly have there. but my other car, a volvo 945 turbo with hakka 7 is a much better car on snow and ice. easier to predict and know where you have it. this morning is was 18cm new snow, no problem to go to work!

[donKey jote]

lots of differences on a nordic tyre and a mid-europe tyre.

the nordic tyre is softer compound, and has more sipes. remember that these tyres have to work in both +3 and wet ice to -3:) lots of grip in -30 thought!
i actually put a (probably) mid european continental tyre (ts810?) on one of my cars to test (volvo 850), and its better than summertyres, but nowhere near the nokian (hakka r) i normaly have there. but my other car, a volvo 945 turbo with hakka 7 is a much better car on snow and ice. easier to predict and know where you have it. this morning is was 18cm new snow, no problem to go to work!
Yes. Nordic tyres are designed for more extreme winter (lower temperatures, more snow and ice) than standard mid-European winter tyres. They are not as good as the standard winter tyres in wet or dry though.

[ioan]

Fixed ;)
Winter tyres have softer compounds (to mantain friction at lower temperatures, where harder summer compounds "freeze"), and a more structured tread pattern, with plenty of sipes for better grip on low friction surfaces such as ice, snow, and "slippy" wet. :)

I am not sure that the more structured thread is of any use on ice, not even on snow, maybe on slippy wet where it improves the evacuation of the fluid between the tire and road surface, but then again this is also the case on summer tires. In the end the friction coefficient is related to the material properties and not to the thread of the tire.
Anyway you most probably knew this as you're the Conti man! ;)

[donKey jote]

Believe me, friction is also about tread pattern and the sipes help on ice and snow :)
Independent of the material properties:
With sipes -> more wheel slip = more traction on snow and ice
Without -> traction increases to a maximum at low slip and falls extremely rapidly
As a side: Nordic tyres have pretty much the maximum sipe density for this effect on ice. Increase it further and you lose again.

The friction coefficient is related to the tire and the surface and there are several grip mechanisms. Adhesion and hysteresis are strongly related to the material properties. Water evacuation or mechanical interlocking with the surface asperities or the deformable surface have less to do with the material and more with the pattern. Then you have pattern-compound-surface interaction, where the tread deformation and hence the surface contact depend on the compound hardness. I won't tyre you with the details ;) :p

[ioan]

Donks that looks pretty much like Ronspeak to me! :p ;)
I'm joking ofcourse.

[Gregor-y]

It's 48 (8) and raining in Chicago. 286 days since the last measurable snowfall. Quebec had plenty of snow, but a policeman told me it's still warm since the shipping channel hasn't started to ice up. My poor Dunlops are going to have nothing to do but wear down.

[Gregor-y]

I had a Continental go flat on my way to work yesterday:

http://imageshack.us/a/img822/7246/tireyz.jpg

Sorry, I don't have a donkey mask in my office, but I was able to borrow a horse...

[janneppi]

Today was probably slippiest(if there is such a word) road conditions this winter, 10 cm of fresh cold snow on the roads, which had already turned into mush by 7am. Gliding all over over the road I really missed my old studded tyres.

[schmenke]

Lingering snow only on our residential side streets (where our city doesn’t plow), but -14 C today and colder forecast for later this week :s .
I’m glad for the softer rubber :mark:

[ioan]

No snow here, most probably it won't be a white Christmas, again. :\

[J4MIE]

I've just made sure there'll be a sudden freeze and white Christmas by changing back from my winter ones. I think they are good in the snow/ice but not the weather it's been lately or forecast to be in the short term :s

[Gregor-y]

A storm with high winds (50 mph along the lake) is coming tomorrow, but it's right around freezing so no idea if it'll be rain, snow or ice.