Rwc 2011

[Retro Formula 1]

Well, he are are again. Just over 2 weeks to go till the start.

First RWC in the last 3 I won't be going too :( but can't wait till the start.

Official RWC 2011 Site - Home (http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/)

(Might see if Knock-on wants to be let out of his cell for the occasion ;) )

NZ are looking pretty strong and sharp but usually peak a couple of months early, Aus look there or there abouts while SA seem to be getting better each game. Of the Northern hemisphere sides, I think we will struggle. England can't find their identity, France have no consistency and Ireland don't have the longevity to win.

My money, unfortunately, is on the Kiwi's. :bigcry:

:D

[steveaki13]

I think its one of the three main southern sides, with New Zealand the absolute front runners.

I am looking forward to it. I enjoy seeing the great teams but also seeing how the lesser nations are progressing

[Daniel]

I think its one of the three main southern sides, with New Zealand the absolute front runners.

I am looking forward to it. I enjoy seeing the great teams but also seeing how the lesser nations are progressing

Problem is that the Kiwi's always seem to choke.

As long as the English get spanked I'll be happy, but I'll be even happier if the Boks win again.

[steveaki13]

Could do. They are still very strong. I think the european sides will be outclassed this time round.

[Daniel]

Could do. They are still very strong. I think the european sides will be outclassed this time round.

Yep and they were very much playing themselves into form just as they started the RWC back in 2007

[555-04Q2]

The All Blacks are not the favourites at all for the smart people, maybe in the opinion of the rugby writers, commentators etc though. The reality is Australia and South Africa know how to win world cups, the Kiwi's don't. The All Blacks need to learn that defense and kicking win world cups, not expansive play. This is where South Africa are strong with our forwards and our kickers as well as Australia who have grown a very young side into an impressive outfit though the Auzzies lack a reliable kicker ( sorry Cooper :) ). Bar the 2003 world cup the All Blacks have had the best team every time, but don't play the type of rugby that wins the cup. Hopefully this time they learn, but I'm doubtfull. Our successful campains in 1995 and 2007 were based on defense and kicking as was Englands in 2003, Australia in 1999 etc etc.

Either way I am looking forward to a fantastic edition of the RWC this year and hopefully some big upsets :)

[Daniel]

I'm sorry, but I really do think that the 2007 campaign was FAR less based on kicking than England in 2003.

It's going to be interesting nevertheless. Part of me would like to see a country that has never won before take it. I've always had a soft spot for France, but then again they're never consistent enough.

[Retro Formula 1]

Well, for the first time in 3 tournaments, I don't think we will make the final.

Hope I'm wrong.

[Rollo]

NZ's run in the Tri-Nations wasn't promising:

40-7 win against Sth Africa (Wellington, NZ)
30-14 win against Australia (Eden Park, NZ)
5-18 loss against Sth Africa (Port Elizabeth, SA)
20-25 loss against Australia (Lang Park, Aus)

When they did switch it on, they looked unstoppable but when they flagged, they looked inadequate. If NZ decide to settle on Carter, McCaw and Thomson as Fly-Half, N8 and Flanker, then that seems to give the side the leadership and directional play it needs. Muck up those three and NZ are toast as far as Billy Webb Ellis is concerned.

[schmenke]

Well, for the first time in 3 tournaments, I don't think we will make the final.

Hope I'm wrong.

Is Wilkinson on the squad?

[Retro Formula 1]

Yep but I wouldn't put all our hope son one player.

[Daniel]

Yep but I wouldn't put all our hope son one player.

Worked in 2003 though ;)

[Rollo]

Worked in 2003 though ;)

No it didn't. Elton Flatley wasn't good enough and Australia LOST :D

[Daniel]

No it didn't. Elton Flatley wasn't good enough and Australia LOST :D

Is that directed at me? :p When it comes to Rugby my blood is most certainly GREEN ;)

[Retro Formula 1]

Is that directed at me? :p When it comes to Rugby my blood is most certainly GREEN ;)

I know you're in Taffy Land but not even you would stoop so low as to support Wales. Does explain a few things though :p

[Daniel]

I know you're in Taffy Land but not even you would stoop so low as to support Wales. Does explain a few things though :p

If you moved somewhere else you wouldn't instantly start supporting their Rugby team would you? I've always supported Sarf Efrica and always will. The fact that they're darn good and play exciting rugby also helps. Even the biggest England fan will admit that they didn't play the most exciting Rugby back in 2003. They still won, but it still wasn't hugely exciting.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

If you moved somewhere else you wouldn't instantly start supporting their Rugby team would you? I've always supported Sarf Efrica and always will. The fact that they're darn good and play exciting rugby also helps. Even the biggest England fan will admit that they didn't play the most exciting Rugby back in 2003. They still won, but it still wasn't hugely exciting.

I put the lack of excitement down to the fact they were playing Rugby :p

I'll probably follow the RWC but will probably only watch it if it's on in the pub when I'm in the pub.

[Daniel]

I put the lack of excitement down to the fact they were playing Rugby :p

I'll probably follow the RWC but will probably only watch it if it's on in the pub when I'm in the pub.

I put the fact that you don't like Rugby Union down to the fact that you have no taste. League, I can not stand as it's a silly game which is just back and forth, but Union really has a fantastic flow to it when you've got 2 good nations playing.

[Retro Formula 1]

If you moved somewhere else you wouldn't instantly start supporting their Rugby team would you? I've always supported Sarf Efrica and always will. The fact that they're darn good and play exciting rugby also helps. Even the biggest England fan will admit that they didn't play the most exciting Rugby back in 2003. They still won, but it still wasn't hugely exciting.

Remembering back to the forum in 03, there were a lot of Kiwi's, Boks and Aussies giving out sh^t about how they were going to kick our asses in the Investec challenge. Then when they whimpered back, the cry was that we could only win in Fortress Twickenham and it's only the RWC that mattered.

So, I think we played Rugby that we needed to do to succeed. No team plays exciting rugby all the time but a great team knows when to and when to play sensible. I don't remember the Boks show-boating too much but that was probably because they didn't get that far, did they? ;)

[Daniel]

Remembering back to the forum in 03, there were a lot of Kiwi's, Boks and Aussies giving out sh^t about how they were going to kick our asses in the Investec challenge. Then when they whimpered back, the cry was that we could only win in Fortress Twickenham and it's only the RWC that mattered.

So, I think we played Rugby that we needed to do to succeed. No team plays exciting rugby all the time but a great team knows when to and when to play sensible. I don't remember the Boks show-boating too much but that was probably because they didn't get that far, did they? ;)

Of course. A win is a win and you can't argue with that really. But if I wanted to watch kicking I'd watch Aussie rules football :p

The Boks were shocking in 2003 and never played themselves into form. I was worried about the same happening in 2007 as they were wobblier early on than their results show.

[Rollo]

I put the fact that you don't like Rugby Union down to the fact that you have no taste. League, I can not stand as it's a silly game which is just back and forth, but Union really has a fantastic flow to it when you've got 2 good nations playing.

:up: Hear hear.

Rugby League is a logically stupid game. Even if you hold possession for six tackles, the operation of the rules forces you to give the ball over for no damn good reason at all. Even American Football rewards possession by giving the team with the ball another four downs if they achieve ten yards on the drive.
The excuse usually given is that it forces the team with the ball to do something with it. I think that that argument is dumb, because the team with the ball already wants to score with it. The rules merely result in run for 5 tackles and then kick.
I've had the benefit of watching matches from the 1960s before the tackle count on Australia's ABC2 and the game flowed much better.

Rugby I think allows for a number of different styles of play and the game is much better for it.

[cali]

What's wrong with Wales?

[Retro Formula 1]

What's wrong with Wales?

Nothing wrong with Wales in much the same way there is nothing wrong with France :D

Naw, seriously Cali, it's a bit of Rugby humour that went over Dans head. The English and Welsh have a deep seated rivalry in Rugby the same as NZ and Aus. As for the French, nobody likes them. :laugh: Well, at least until the final whistle when it's one big celebration and genuine camaraderie and friendship between all Rugby fans.

[Daniel]

Oh I'll support Wales if they're playing England :p

[555-04Q2]

Is that directed at me? :p When it comes to Rugby my blood is most certainly GREEN ;)

Good man :up: :)

[Daniel]

:up: Hear hear.

Rugby League is a logically stupid game. Even if you hold possession for six tackles, the operation of the rules forces you to give the ball over for no damn good reason at all. Even American Football rewards possession by giving the team with the ball another four downs if they achieve ten yards on the drive.
The excuse usually given is that it forces the team with the ball to do something with it. I think that that argument is dumb, because the team with the ball already wants to score with it. The rules merely result in run for 5 tackles and then kick.
I've had the benefit of watching matches from the 1960s before the tackle count on Australia's ABC2 and the game flowed much better.

Rugby I think allows for a number of different styles of play and the game is much better for it.

Exactly. I know some on here like League but I think that's more because of geographical ties like the fact that League originated in the North of England.

It's a silly game like you say which gives the team who doesn't deserve posession the ball. I'm the sort of person who, if the Boks are playing like crap wants to see them punished with no posession rather than given the ball purely because they tackle a few times.

Plus I've never seen a union player stick his finger up another players you know what..... I'm looking at you Hopoate......

Anyway, there are very good reasons why the Union World Cup gets such good coverage and most people only notice that the league world cup is on after it gets mentioned in the sports section on the news.

Union is such a beautiful sport and after motorsport it's my favourite sport to watch :)

[Daniel]

As for the French, nobody likes them. :laugh: Well, at least until the final whistle when it's one big celebration and genuine camaraderie and friendship between all Rugby fans.

That's the great thing about Union. I've NEVER been to a match where there's ever been anything more than lighthearted banter. Contrast that to football where for instance I worked with a girl who was always getting into shouting matches in her local with fans of other teams.

I think Union fans just love Rugby...... and although we all want our team to win, I think there's an overwhelming desire to just see a good game regardless of who wins. I know there appears to be a lot of animosity in the F1 forum, but if this were a football forum and instead of it being RBR vs Mclaren it was Liverpool vs Manchester :mark: Seriously get the hell over the whole team thing and just enjoy the sport :)

[Retro Formula 1]

I would say that Aus and Nz have the easiest groups.

England have Scotland that want to bash lumps out of us, Romania and Georgia that are more than capable of bashing lumps and Argentina who only know how to bash lumps :laugh:

I think we will go through as group leaders OK but with how many men???

SA have hard games against Wales and Samoa but Fiji should just be dynamic and not too physical and a freebee against Namibia.

Aus have an easy run apart from Ireland and NZ just need to dispatch France.

Predictions for Quarters are:

Aus / Wales

Eng / France

Sa / Ire

Nz / Arg

[Retro Formula 1]

The Motorsport forum is mostly just high spirits. Some people get a bit upset but I can only think of one member who went as far as physically threatening violence and being quite serious. He was a bit of a fantasist anyway :D

I might be the only one that likes Leaque. I like watching it and think it makes a great training exercise for Union. Teaches people how to tackle, break and offload which is so much more of the modern game than the 2003 kicking game.

[555-04Q2]

I might be the only one that likes Leaque.

Not to worry old chap...not everyone can be perfect...we need the occassional odd ball such as yourself to make things interesting :p :

[cali]

Nothing wrong with Wales in much the same way there is nothing wrong with France :D

Naw, seriously Cali, it's a bit of Rugby humour that went over Dans head. The English and Welsh have a deep seated rivalry in Rugby the same as NZ and Aus. As for the French, nobody likes them. :laugh: Well, at least until the final whistle when it's one big celebration and genuine camaraderie and friendship between all Rugby fans.

LOL, good answer :D

[Daniel]

The Motorsport forum is mostly just high spirits. Some people get a bit upset but I can only think of one member who went as far as physically threatening violence and being quite serious. He was a bit of a fantasist anyway :D

I might be the only one that likes Leaque. I like watching it and think it makes a great training exercise for Union. Teaches people how to tackle, break and offload which is so much more of the modern game than the 2003 kicking game.

Yes, but then you get guys like Sandy Bot who do damage to your head without the need for physical violence. I think he is the only person I've seen on here who has truly had everyone (even Button fans) united squarely against him.

[Retro Formula 1]

Anyway, back to Rugby.

With a bit of luck, we will put a dynamic team against Arg that will run around them without having to get involved with too much pack work. Let Manu run around them :D

[steveaki13]

I think that first match against Argentina is going to be a real battle, if we can get a win I will be delighted. I think this is our hardest game. (That one's for the Scots. ;) )

I am really looking forward to it.

[steveaki13]

For fun which game will provide us with the largest win. The record was Aus v Namibia 148-0 I believe in 2003?

So which game will be the most one sided.

Australia v Russia or South Africa v Namibia I suppose. All the other teams I think are too good to be smashed by 120+

[Knock-on]

I think that first match against Argentina is going to be a real battle, if we can get a win I will be delighted. I think this is our hardest game. (That one's for the Scots. ;) )

I am really looking forward to it.

Depends what sort of team we field. Needs to be fast to keep out of the physical game.

[MrMetro]

Sorry to be negative, but I do wish people(particularly the media) would refer the Rugby Union world cup as the Rugby Union world cup instead of just, the 'Rugby World cup'. There are two codes of rugby and a rugby leagure world cup.

[Daniel]

Sorry to be negative, but I do wish people(particularly the media) would refer the Rugby Union world cup as the Rugby Union world cup instead of just, the 'Rugby World cup'. There are two codes of rugby and a rugby leagure world cup.

League is very much the 2nd most popular form of Rugby so you're wrong.

[MrMetro]

League is very much the 2nd most popular form of Rugby so you're wrong.

Your evidence please?

[MrMetro]

League is very much the 2nd most popular form of Rugby so you're wrong.

In Wales and Southern England, yes. That place called 'the north', well, I will dispute your claims most vigorously.

[Daniel]

In Wales and Southern England, yes. That place called 'the north', well, I will dispute your claims most vigorously.


Um red donkey far up dumpster poo poo?

[MrMetro]

Um red donkey far up dumpster poo poo?

What?

[Daniel]

What?

Exactly what I thought when I read your post above mine.

[MrMetro]

Exactly what I thought when I read your post above mine.

I was saying that Rugby League is more popular than union in the north. Happy?

[Daniel]

I was saying that Rugby League is more popular than union in the north. Happy?

What if in my household we feel that rallying is the most popular form of rugby? Does that matter?

[MrMetro]

What if in my household we feel that rallying is the most popular form of rugby? Does that matter?

Um, no. All I was trying to get at is that I would like both codes of rugby to be called their proper names.

[GridGirl]

Rugby Union. Seventy minutes of doing nothing, chatting and group hugs with about 10 minutes of actual rugby being played. The only reason players have such long careers on Union is because they never do anything. Wake me up when it's all over! ;) :p

[Knock-on]

I dare you to start arguing with Retro.. :p

Rather intelligent chap that Retro ;)

[Knock-on]

Um, no. All I was trying to get at is that I would like both codes of rugby to be called their proper names.

Rugby is Rugby Union. There is an off-shoot called Rugby League but it is a much smaller sport. There are 40,000 registered League players in this country. According to the International Rugby Board, England has 1,900 rugby union clubs; 6,060 referees; 362,319 pre-teen male players; 698,803 teen male players; 121,480 senior male players (total male players 1,182,602) as well as 11,000 senior female players.

I really would rather this thread was a celebration of all the Rugby codes but to be fair, League is not that popular outside the M62 corridor.

[Daniel]

Rugby is Rugby Union. There is an off-shoot called Rugby League but it is a much smaller sport. There are 40,000 registered League players in this country. According to the International Rugby Board, England has 1,900 rugby union clubs; 6,060 referees; 362,319 pre-teen male players; 698,803 teen male players; 121,480 senior male players (total male players 1,182,602) as well as 11,000 senior female players.

I really would rather this thread was a celebration of all the Rugby codes but to be fair, League is not that popular outside the M62 corridor.

Couldn't agree more. League is, by nature of its history an offshoot of Union and there's not much else to say.

[Knock-on]

And so it starts. NZ already look as sharp as a pin.

[Daniel]

And so it starts. NZ already look as sharp as a pin.

They are playing well. Absolute textbook stuff. But to me they big test will be once they get out of the pool games. New Zealand always do well in the pool games where usually there's only 1 strong oponent in the group and then when it comes to playing rugby against quality opposition they always seem to go in with an air of confidence and wind up coming out of one of the finals as a loser.

[speedhog]

Well just for your info.. The Hurt Locker is currently on Sky Movies in New Zealand.. So is that game i have no interest in..

But seriously for all you Folks that are lucky enough to be out of this country you have been spared cheesy ads and continual mind washing of everyone that the Rugby world cup is here.. (wooo.....)
For someone who perfers to watch league (the warriors in the NRL)...... I wish i was somewhere else.....
Oh Yay the french have buggered up in Rally Aus :D :D and haydon paddon is 7th.

[555-04Q2]

Sorry to be negative, but I do wish people(particularly the media) would refer the Rugby Union world cup as the Rugby Union world cup instead of just, the 'Rugby World cup'. There are two codes of rugby and a rugby leagure world cup.

Union has existed for over 100 years, League for only 20 or so. Union IS rugby, League is a poor offshoot.

[555-04Q2]

And so it starts. NZ already look as sharp as a pin.

We say this every year about the AB's and every year they trip up. Is this their best chance to change that? They should have had 4 RWC titles by now.

[Knock-on]

Best to underestimate NZ and let them be overconfident than underestimate them ;)

[Daniel]

Best to underestimate NZ and let them be overconfident than underestimate them ;)

Eh? :p

[MrMetro]

Union has existed for over 100 years, League for only 20 or so. Union IS rugby, League is a poor offshoot.

Incorrect.

[Daniel]

One thing that amuses me slightly is that Victor Matfield if back. So basically no one else will be getting lineout ball against the Boks :D

And in other news the Welshies are dreaming :laugh: Save your steam for winning the other 3 games that you should be able to win.....
Adam Jones says Wales can beat South Africa - News - 2011 Rugby World Cup - ITV (http://www.itv.com/rugbyworldcup/2011/news/wales-eye-south-africa-scalp/)

[MrMetro]

I don't want to cause a heated debate about League and Union, so just ignore my comments.

[Daniel]

I don't want to cause a heated debate about League and Union, so just ignore my comments.

I was already doing this. I'm quite sure most others were as well. The day when someone with South African blood in him takes lessons on Rugby from a Norwegian......

[steveaki13]

Good solid start for New Zealand, I was hoping Tonga could get more into them and make it a real battle, lets see what tomorrow brings

[Rollo]

The telling thing about the New Zealand - Tonga match, is that apart from one ball crossing between the goalposts, Tonga got nothing at all over the New Zealand try line for the whole match; not even deep kicks to force the Kiwis back.

[steveaki13]

Fiji 45-25 Namibia

Scotland 34-24 Romania * Not the most impressive result from the Scots.

[Rollo]

England looked almost scared playing against Argentina. They didn't seem to play well in their mauling game, and didn't look composed when stringing the ball out wide.
Ben Youngs only managed to score a try in the 67th minute, and Johnny Wilkinson only put the ball over the bar twice from seven attempts.

I fear that if England meet any stiff competition at all based on this performance, they're sunk.

[Daniel]

England looked almost scared playing against Argentina. They didn't seem to play well in their mauling game, and didn't look composed when stringing the ball out wide.
Ben Youngs only managed to score a try in the 67th minute, and Johnny Wilkinson only put the ball over the bar twice from seven attempts.

I fear that if England meet any stiff competition at all based on this performance, they're sunk.

Thing is, the Boks didn't look that great early on in the last RWC, sometimes having a tough oponent early on helps you to raise your game.

[Knock-on]

Eh? :p

LOL, I think I left a "not" and a "rather" out of that sentence.

Best not to underestimate NZ and let them be overconfident rather than underestimate them

[Daniel]

LOL, I think I left a "not" and a "rather" out of that sentence.

Best not to underestimate NZ and let them be overconfident rather than underestimate them

That's better ;)

Of course this could be the RWC where they break the pattern, but something always seems to go wrong for the All Blecks. Something tells me that a team like Australia or South Africa or England or France who might not have the all out brilliance of an All Black side, but who can lift themselves for a world cup and play a good game when the need arises will knock them out.

Queue the All Blacks steamrolling everyone on their way to a RWC........

[Daniel]

Anyhoo, watched the France v Japan game this morning. WHAT A GAME! The Japanese (with the aid of a few Kiwi's) put up a fantastic fight and whilst I'm sure people will say it shows France as being weak, I think Japan were fantastic and most teams would have struggled to make it a one sided contest.

A good warmup there for France.

Didn't get to see the England game which seems a pity as it sounded quite a bruising contest.

[Knock-on]

That's better ;)
Something tells me that a team like Australia or South Africa or England or France who might not have the all out brilliance of an All Black side, but who can lift themselves for a world cup and play a good game when the need arises will knock them out.


I will cheer and hope and pray but I somehow don't feel England will be the fly in the ointment :(

In my heart of hearts, I'm afraid it will be the Kiwi's who prevail and nothing will shut them up for the next 4 years :D

[Daniel]

Predictably the Aussies thumped the Italians after a slow start. USA v Ireland on the 10th anniversary of 9/11. I'd love to see the USA but I just hope the Irish don't resort to tripping to win like England did last rwc....

[steveaki13]

Predictably the Aussies thumped the Italians after a slow start. USA v Ireland on the 10th anniversary of 9/11. I'd love to see the USA but I just hope the Irish don't resort to tripping to win like England did last rwc....

Ireland 22-10 USA.

A good result for the States. On a difficult day for them a very respectable performance and a nice try to celebrate at the end with.

As for Ireland not great but a win.

[Daniel]

Not a great match from the Boks. They showed power early on but just lost intensity.

[Knock-on]

Not a great match from the Boks. They showed power early on but just lost intensity.

I must have missed that game. The one I saw, the Boks were outclassed by Wales and somehow sneaked a win. Pretty lucky if you ask me.

[Daniel]

I must have missed that game. The one I saw, the Boks were outclassed by Wales and somehow sneaked a win. Pretty lucky if you ask me.

I think we saw the same match. I agree they were lucky. This seems rather reminiscent of their start to the last RWC where they had a bad game or two, I just hope they play themselves into form like they did later on last time.

"Not a great match from the Boks (as in they played badly). They showed power early on (in the first 5 minutes) but just lost intensity."

Which I think was a fair way to sum the match up and which the after game punditry seemed to agree with my way of summing it up.

Tbh if I was Wales whilst I would be heartened, that would be tempered by disappointment because if it was that close against a big team like the Boks, if an England or a France or a New Zealand had the run of the field like that you'd be looking at a cricket score.

[ArrowsFA1]

Wales really should have won that game. They were quite superb, and it was almost as if the SA's expected a win then were bemused by being outplayed. Still, like the champions they are, they managed to get the win.

Good performance or not it's still a loss for us, and Samoa is going to be a tough game :dozey:

[555-04Q2]

I was already doing this. I'm quite sure most others were as well. The day when someone with South African blood in him takes lessons on Rugby from a Norwegian......

:laugh: :up:

[555-04Q2]

Yeah Wales were the better team IMO. Alot of happy faces around Cardiff this morning even though they lost. Wales certainly sent out a message with that performance. :)

Thats why they will remain losers. We are not happy at all with the game even though we won, that says something. For any Welshman to be happy even though they lost is crazy.

[Knock-on]

I think both SA and England need to find some form or will be out in the quarters.

SA looked sharp for the first 5 minutes as you said Dan but as soon as Wales started asking questions, the self belief evaporated. It was as if they were unsure what they were trying to do and as Arrows said, they just expected to win.

The other problem is that the SA team are no spring chickens and as always with older players, susceptible to injury more than younger players. I don't know how many Boks picked up injury and niggles but it seemed quite a few of them did.

[Daniel]

Thats why they will remain losers. We are not happy at all with the game even though we won, that says something. For any Welshman to be happy even though they lost is crazy.

Exactly. For the Boks to do anything other than crush a 2nd tier team like Wales on the scoreboard is not acceptable.

[Daniel]

I think both SA and England need to find some form or will be out in the quarters.

SA looked sharp for the first 5 minutes as you said Dan but as soon as Wales started asking questions, the self belief evaporated. It was as if they were unsure what they were trying to do and as Arrows said, they just expected to win.

The other problem is that the SA team are no spring chickens and as always with older players, susceptible to injury more than younger players. I don't know how many Boks picked up injury and niggles but it seemed quite a few of them did.

If Matfield is out that's a big problem. Their dominance of the lineout was a big factor in their success in 2007.

I think the Boks have sufficient depth of talent to play without 2 of their best players though.

I must say I thought Burger played well but as always he's a liability when it comes to giving away penalties. He was hitting hard against Wales and I was always worried about when he'd start hitting people in the head. Fantastic player when he's doing the right thing but he seems a bit of a thug....

[555-04Q2]

I think both SA and England need to find some form or will be out in the quarters.

SA looked sharp for the first 5 minutes as you said Dan but as soon as Wales started asking questions, the self belief evaporated. It was as if they were unsure what they were trying to do and as Arrows said, they just expected to win.

The other problem is that the SA team are no spring chickens and as always with older players, susceptible to injury more than younger players. I don't know how many Boks picked up injury and niggles but it seemed quite a few of them did.

Actually the Springboks are not old at all. Besides Matfield, Smit and James and one or two others the rest are either 30 or below 30 years of age, which is not old! They seem old because they have played so many games already. A guy like Frans Steyn is still in his mid 20's yet has played almost 50 games!

[555-04Q2]

Average age of the current Springbok squad is 28 years according to current squad statistics I found on the web.

[555-04Q2]

Exactly. For the Boks to do anything other than crush a 2nd tier team like Wales on the scoreboard is not acceptable.

Sad part is that in the 70's Wales were a powerhouse like the SANZAR members of today.

[Daniel]

Sad part is that in the 70's Wales were a powerhouse like the SANZAR members of today.

Sports change over time though and of course back in the day guys like JP Peterson and Bryan Habana wouldn't have been playing for SA because of Apartheid so the balance changes on both sides.

Football is also more popular than ever here in Wales due to people with single digit IQ's being able to earn zillions and whilst Rugby will always be the top game, having other sports around stealing talented players is always going to affect your squad.

[Daniel]

I don't share that view I'm afraid. For a country with only 3 million people in it to nearly beat a world class team like South Africa with a population of 50 million, I think they were pleased they forced it so close. The disallowed kick was an awful decision but one thing you'll notice if you ever visit Wales is the national pride you see around you. In other words they are good sports. :)

There were other decisions which weren't right either so i don't see the point of dwelling on the penalty.

[555-04Q2]

I don't share that view I'm afraid. For a country with only 3 million people in it to nearly beat a world class team like South Africa with a population of 50 million, I think they were pleased they forced it so close. The disallowed kick was an awful decision but one thing you'll notice if you ever visit Wales is the national pride you see around you. In other words they are good sports. :)

New Zealand proves the theory of population vs ability very wrong. They do just fine with a fraction of the population of nearly every other rugby union nation.

It could also be argued that we only have around 4.5 million people to choose from as the other 45 million odd are poor and play soccer, not rugby. That is a legacy of our Apartheid days, but it is a relevant, sad fact.

What I cannot dispute is their passion as you pointed out, which is great to see :)

Finally don't dwell on one penaly, we had a penaly against us for holding on when the tackler had clearly not released our player and they kicked the penaly over. The penaly that was not awarded was justice for me :) Still doesn't detract from the fact that Wales should have won as they were a far better team than the Springboks on Sunday.

[Daniel]

Fair point, we can leave that to the fans of the losing side.

*sigh* As 555 points out, there were decisions which should have gone South Africa's way which didn't.

[Daniel]

I'm pretty sure I agreed. *sigh*

No, it seemed like you were saying that it's easy for me to not dwell on the penalty because my team won.

[Daniel]

Well lets just say that wasn't my intention. :)

OK no problems then :)

[Knock-on]

Did Courtney Lawes deserve a 2 match ban?

Lawes désosse Tiesi et Ledesma... Video (http://www.mefeedia.com/watch/44208716)

The first tackle was marginally late and he was committed to the tackle (which was an excellent one). It was a penalty at worse.

The second one just looked like an unfortunate collision. Clumsy I admit but hardly malicious.

Did he deserve a 2match ban?

[Daniel]

Did Courtney Lawes deserve a 2 match ban?

Lawes désosse Tiesi et Ledesma... Video (http://www.mefeedia.com/watch/44208716)

The first tackle was marginally late and he was committed to the tackle (which was an excellent one). It was a penalty at worse.

The second one just looked like an unfortunate collision. Clumsy I admit but hardly malicious.

Did he deserve a 2match ban?
Definitely. IMHO the second one was the worst. He'd gone down and Lawes chose not to try and make his way over the player which results in a knee to the head for the Argentinian player. Any considerate player would have tried to make his way over. Not malicious, but sometimes it's the clumsy collisions which could have been avoided which cause the head and spinal injuries.

I think players like Burger and Lawes need to be penalised when they play like that. Burger played like a thug against Samoa (iirc) at the last RWC and got a match ban which I think was well deserved.

Rugby is a physical game but I really don't see the need to drop your knee like that or be quite so late with tackles.

Just my 2p :)

[Knock-on]

Definitely. IMHO the second one was the worst. He'd gone down and Lawes chose not to try and make his way over the player which results in a knee to the head for the Argentinian player. Any considerate player would have tried to make his way over. Not malicious, but sometimes it's the clumsy collisions which could have been avoided which cause the head and spinal injuries.

I think players like Burger and Lawes need to be penalised when they play like that. Burger played like a thug against Samoa (iirc) at the last RWC and got a match ban which I think was well deserved.

Rugby is a physical game but I really don't see the need to drop your knee like that or be quite so late with tackles.

Just my 2p :)

That's pretty rich coming from a Bok. Christ on a bike! The Boks are renowned for all or nothing tackling! You might just as well ask Schumy to stop swerving or Footballers to stop diving as ask as a Bok not to be over-committed in the tackle.

Are you sure you're South African? We have a bloke over here called Jeremy that might be able to give you a DNA test ;)

Really, I have seen worse down t the local park than those tackles. They were hard but nothing malicious or premeditated IMHO.

[Daniel]

That's pretty rich coming from a Bok. Christ on a bike! The Boks are renowned for all or nothing tackling! You might just as well ask Schumy to stop swerving or Footballers to stop diving as ask as a Bok not to be over-committed in the tackle.

Are you sure you're South African? We have a bloke over here called Jeremy that might be able to give you a DNA test ;)

Really, I have seen worse down t the local park than those tackles. They were hard but nothing malicious or premeditated IMHO.

Australian born from South African parents :)

I didn't say there was anything malicious, I think he was just very careless.

[555-04Q2]

That's pretty rich coming from a Bok. Christ on a bike! The Boks are renowned for all or nothing tackling! You might just as well ask Schumy to stop swerving or Footballers to stop diving as ask as a Bok not to be over-committed in the tackle.

Are you sure you're South African? We have a bloke over here called Jeremy that might be able to give you a DNA test ;)

Really, I have seen worse down t the local park than those tackles. They were hard but nothing malicious or premeditated IMHO.

South Africans are tough b@st@rds, especially our rugga players, and the attitude is if you can't take the occassional hard hit and don't like being smashed around like a rag doll, WTF are you doing playing in an international rugby match, go play soccer. I'm all for hard rugby, but dirty play is not acceptable in my book. Sure, clean out a guy from a ruck, but don't drop a knee on the guy, or bite his ear, or gouge his eyes etc.

[555-04Q2]

Where were you born mate?

South African slang lesson #1:

Its boet, not mate :p :

[555-04Q2]

Is that a cheap brand of Champagne? :)

Nope, we refer to each other as boet (Afrikaans), not mate, buddy etc. Boet loosely translated means brother/friend/pal/mate etc :)

[Daniel]

Cool, as from today I'm Irish lol... Not really I'm English but I could play for both. :)

Identity is an interesting thing. I would say I'm Australian, but when it comes to sport I will always support South Africa. If I were to play Rugby for instance, I'd play for the Boks or no one.

I find the whole sporting identity thing a bit strange. For instance I don't consider Toby Faletau to be Welsh and I don't really see why he can play for Wales tbh.

I think some people are turning international sport into a glorified club game. IMHO Faletau should play for Tonga, Clyde Rathbone - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clyde_Rathbone) should have played for SA if he was good enough and so on......

[Knock-on]

South Africans are tough b@st@rds, especially our rugga players, and the attitude is if you can't take the occasional hard hit and don't like being smashed around like a rag doll, WTF are you doing playing in an international rugby match, go play soccer. I'm all for hard rugby, but dirty play is not acceptable in my book. Sure, clean out a guy from a ruck, but don't drop a knee on the guy, or bite his ear, or gouge his eyes etc.

I totally agree mate and I love the SA approach to Rugby. They are hard bast4rds but pretty fair. The National team has let themselves down a few times with playing a cynical game but overall, play the spirit of the game.

I think Courtney's tackle was one that every SA would love if they had made it. It was fractionally late but he was committed. I don't see anything wrong with it but by the letter of the law, it could have been a penalty.

As for the line incident. I still think it SW clumsy but not something that would warrant a ban. WTF is that all about. A ban should be if you make a malicious transgression of the law. A punch, violent shoeing, gouging, biting. These are things people should be banned for but not something as mundane as a flop over the line.

[Daniel]

I totally agree mate and I love the SA approach to Rugby. They are hard bast4rds but pretty fair. The National team has let themselves down a few times with playing a cynical game but overall, play the spirit of the game.

I think Courtney's tackle was one that every SA would love if they had made it. It was fractionally late but he was committed. I don't see anything wrong with it but by the letter of the law, it could have been a penalty.

As for the line incident. I still think it SW clumsy but not something that would warrant a ban. WTF is that all about. A ban should be if you make a malicious transgression of the law. A punch, violent shoeing, gouging, biting. These are things people should be banned for but not something as mundane as a flop over the line.

When you put it that way I kind of agree. But I still think carelessness like that should be punished. It's the way I feel in F1 when a driver constantly does stupid but non-malicious moves which end in crashes. I think we'll agree to disagree as we obviously have different levels of tolerance to that sort of thing.

Personally I didn't like the first tackle, it was a bit late and IMHO it seemed mostly shoulder. But then again the Argentinian didn't help himself by trying to kick rather than stand up to the tackle..... I think the knee to the head was easily avoidable though.

[Daniel]

Well the Boks showed their true colours today and absolutely steamrolled the Fijians.

The team on the field today was one that could win a wolrd cup :)

[donKey jote]

Cool, as from today I'm Irish lol... Not really I'm English but I could play for both. :)
I'm Irish but I couldn't play for either :p
I think an uncle of mine did though once or twice, back in the 50's or 60's :)

[Knock-on]

Well the Boks showed their true colours today and absolutely steamrolled the Fijians.

The team on the field today was one that could win a wolrd cup :)

They have really stepped up from the woeful performance against Wales. I thought Fiji lacked their normal innovative flair but full credit for that must go to the Boks.

Although they played brilliantly today, their RWC aspirations took a little step back with the defeat of Australia by Ireland. I am sure SA would prefer the perceived easier route of playing Ireland than Australia in the quarters. Mind you, that pool can still spring some surprises!

Still, well done to the old boys and if it's not a home team bringing Old Bill back home, then I will, as always, be firmly behind them :)

[52Paddy]

'mon the lads!!! :D

[Knock-on]

Very unimpressive again against Georgia.

Too many silly penalties and schoolboy errors.

Wouldn't be surprised if France hand us our asses in the Quarters.

[Daniel]

Very unimpressive again against Georgia.

Too many silly penalties and schoolboy errors.

Wouldn't be surprised if France hand us our asses in the Quarters.
The beauty of the RWC is that you've got 2 more games to play yourselves into form, plus you could end up playing the All Blacks depending on where you finish and how Group A goes. All that matters now is getting to the knockout stages and who knows what can happen there!

No one expected France to sink the All Blecks and I reckon most English supporters probably thought Australia was going to take them out as well and yet they made the final.

[555-04Q2]

I totally agree mate and I love the SA approach to Rugby. They are hard bast4rds but pretty fair. The National team has let themselves down a few times with playing a cynical game but overall, play the spirit of the game.

I think Courtney's tackle was one that every SA would love if they had made it. It was fractionally late but he was committed. I don't see anything wrong with it but by the letter of the law, it could have been a penalty.

As for the line incident. I still think it SW clumsy but not something that would warrant a ban. WTF is that all about. A ban should be if you make a malicious transgression of the law. A punch, violent shoeing, gouging, biting. These are things people should be banned for but not something as mundane as a flop over the line.

100% agree :up:

[Knock-on]

Is anyone watching the Tonga Japan game. Absolute hum-dinger :D

[555-04Q2]

Is it just me or is this RWC sucking badly because of the stupid televised times of the games? Can't braai and drink beer at 5 in the morning :(

Why did they take the RWC to the ar$e end of the world :angry:

[Knock-on]

It is frustrating but there's a couple of million people in Australasia that must be pandered to :laugh:

In 4 years time, the competition comes home and then I am going to save my pennies for Japan. That should be a superb event. Hopefully it will coincide with an Asian GP or 2 :)

[Knock-on]

Still too many penalties but much better England performance. :up:

[Daniel]

Still too many penalties but much better England performance. :up:

Doesn't sound too good for England.

Now for the first big game in a while. France vs the All Blicks.

[Daniel]

Now for the first big game in a while. France vs the All Blicks.

Which is going swimmingly for the All Blicks.......

[Knock-on]

France started well but are now imploding. 3 tries down after 20 mins and to quote a presenter, they are looking like "cheese eating surrender monkeys".

[Knock-on]

What a dazzling little run in torrid conditions by Amorosino to secure Argentina the win. Pity for Scotland as they looked good for the win.

[Knock-on]

Well, on to the quarters.

Northern Hemisphere on Saturday and Southern on Sunday.

England, despite there poor form and incredibly stupid off-field antics should get past a France that has all but imploded. However, you know what France are like. They will probably play out of their skins against us.

I tip Ireland. SA and NZ for the other 3 places although I'm sure we all hope Argentina kick lumps out of the Kiwi's to slow them down a bit :D

[donKey jote]

England, despite there poor form and incredibly stupid off-field antics should get past a France that has all but imploded. However, you know what France are like. They will probably play out of their skins against us.
:laugh: :D



I tip Ireland.
:bigcry: :p

[Knock-on]

:laugh: :D


:bigcry: :p

I was trying to convince myself I think.

England were truly, truly terrible. They showed a bit of spirit for the last 20 mins but apart from that, turned in one of the worst performances I have seen from the national team.

I'm just really disappointing in the team. They are starting to remind me of football players; Primadonnas.

[ShiftingGears]

The Wallabies have eliminated the Springboks 11-9!

[Knock-on]

Well done to them.

NZ are having their customary wobble. Will Argentina be able to keep the pressure on?

[ShiftingGears]

Well done to them.

NZ are having their customary wobble. Will Argentina be able to keep the pressure on?

Nah, Argentina have had hardly any possession in the second half. NZ are surely through.

[Knock-on]

Nah, Argentina have had hardly any possession in the second half. NZ are surely through.

Well, fill your boots. 2003 all over again?

[turves]

An Englishman, Irishman and Scotsman were in a bar, the Welshman were still at Eden Park...

[ArrowsFA1]

An Englishman, Irishman and Scotsman were in a bar, the Welshman were still at Eden Park...
Or...An Englishman, Irishman and Scotsman all walk into a bar...to watch Wales play in semi-finals of the Rugby World Cup. :D

[ShiftingGears]

Well, fill your boots. 2003 all over again?

I suspect the scoreline will be much closer this time around though. No Kurtley Beale for Australia.

Having said that, the Wales v France match was pretty dull. It reminded me of watching England in the 2003 World Cup - gaining possession and then waiting for penalties to be conceded. Boring. I've been watching a lot more Rugby League this year and the match left me quite disappointed.

[Knock-on]

Wales v France was settled in the first part of the match by a shocking refereeing decision. Wales would have won that match without a shadow of a doubt and at least would be worthy finalists which France are not.

It will be a Kiwi walkover in the final.

[Zeakiwi]

France are a bogey team for the All Blacks at times. France has Wolverine playing for them this year. A special consignment of escargots or goose liver pate, jellied eels etc can change the morale of the French tream.
The All Blacks still have time to get sick with the bug that is going around at moment. Some of the All Blacks were off colour for the Australia game.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_rugby_union_matches_between_France_and_ New_Zealand

[Knock-on]

First, a rather overdue congrats to NZ who deserved to win.

England were terrible and deserved to lose. This leaked report doesn't surprise me in the least and adds to the sense of anger I feel about the off field antics.

BBC Sport - Damning England World Cup reports leaked to The Times (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/rugby_union/15853364.stm)