Watkins Glen race thread [Archive]

MD24

13th August 2011, 20:01

1 18 Kyle Busch
2 43 A.J. Allmendinger
3 9 Marcos Ambrose
4 48 Jimmie Johnson
5 42 Juan Montoya
6 39 Ryan Newman
7 14 Tony Stewart
8 99 Carl Edwards
9 56 Martin Truex Jr.
10 78 Regan Smith

11 47 Bobby Labonte
12 2 Brad Keselowski
13 20 Joey Logano
14 1 Jamie McMurray
15 51 Boris Said
16 6 David Ragan
17 24 Jeff Gordon
18 4 Kasey Kahne
19 33 Clint Bowyer
20 83 Brian Vickers

21 87 Joe Nemechek
22 5 Mark Martin
23 29 Kevin Harvick
24 17 Matt Kenseth
25 88 Dale Earnhardt Jr.
26 13 Casey Mears
27 22 Kurt Busch
28 16 Greg Biffle
29 37 Scott Speed
30 55 J.J. Yeley

31 7 Robby Gordon
32 27 Paul Menard
33 66 Michael McDowell
34 150 T.J. Bell
35 32 Andrew Ranger
36 71 Andy Lally
37 60 Mike Skinner
38 36 Ron Fellows
39 00 David Reutimann
40 31 Jeff Burton

41 34 David Gilliland
42 11 Denny Hamlin
43 38 Terry Labonte

Did Not Qualify
44 135 Dave Blaney
45 46 Brian Simo
46 177 P.J. Jones

Sparky1329

14th August 2011, 05:18

It might rain Saturday afternoon, Sunday, and Monday. At least we might get one race this week.

EDIT: Two if you count sports cars.

The weather forecast is not at all looking good.

Shifter

14th August 2011, 18:07

They had wipers and rain tires for the Busch..erm...Nationwide series, but not for the Cup cars?

00steven

14th August 2011, 18:15

They had wipers and rain tires for the Busch..erm...Nationwide series, but not for the Cup cars?

That is Brian France for ya'.

Alfa Fan

14th August 2011, 20:13

Its ridiculous they won't run on a wet track on a road course. It's sort of understandable why they don't run wet oval races, although personally I think it would be possible, but not run in a little bit of rain on a road course is silly. This isn't a dig at NASCAR, although they are still the worst offender, closely followed by IndyCar and F1 to a lesser extent.

djparky

14th August 2011, 20:30

errggg oh well- will watch the tennis or Indy Car instead- this relly does make NASCAR look stupid- they should be able to run in the wet on a road course

MD24

14th August 2011, 21:40

Race is rescheduled to Monday 10.00 am

Jonesi

14th August 2011, 21:41

Race 10am Monday, if it doesn't rain again.

call_me_andrew

15th August 2011, 01:42

The weather forcast for tomorrow calls for a 60% chance of rain all day. Tuesday looks pretty good though.

I don't see why Goodyear can't have rain tires available for Wakins Glen. They already have 1,000 made for the Nationwide Series and they would share tires anyway. And given it's high center of gravity, the COT would probably take to the rain better than the old car.

raybak

15th August 2011, 12:57

Turned on the TV this morning to watch the race and there was a repeat on, thought did I put my pickems on for the wrong race or what, was a bit worried for second or so until I checked the forums to see it was to be run Monday due to some precipitation. I think NASCAR need to man up and put wipers on these cars, give them some Goodyear wets and let them at it. Maybe we would see 25 cautions, maybe not :)

Ray

00steven

15th August 2011, 17:00

ESPN sucks! How many passes for the lead and crashes can they miss?!

00steven

15th August 2011, 17:39

Shifter

15th August 2011, 18:12

It looks like a major change will need to take place at turn two. There is no reason for a wall to come out like that. Fortunately, nobody got hurt.

I've felt that way for years. At least they could have padded it with tires on both sides, that wouldn't have taken much effort.

Lee Roy

15th August 2011, 18:59

Stuck at work. Does anyone know what happened to Kurt Busch to make him finish so far back in the pack?

Second place for Keslowski. That boy could be a champion some day.

NickFalzone

15th August 2011, 19:16

Lee Roy

15th August 2011, 19:41

Thanks Nick.

I have high hopes for Kurt in the Chase. I see that Kez moved up 4 spots in the standings. You never know, Kez may move up into the top ten before the Chase starts.

Penske South has really turned around now that they got rid of that guy that Kurt was so upset about at the first Richmond race.

Shifter

15th August 2011, 20:17

Kurt wrecked early on due to a left front that went down, he had been hard on the brakes. Kyle really should have won this though.

Anyone else see the Biffle/Said incident after the race? All I saw was Said trying to punch him, then saying he'd find him later this week and he'd have a black eye for the next race lol. Wasn't joking either.

Yeah, Boris would fit right in with the old school NASCAR crowd. Heard later that Biffle was flipping him off on the cool-down then came and got in a couple of jabs on Said through the window of his car, but then walked off and didn't want to really fight Boris.

slorydn1

15th August 2011, 22:23

Well, Kyle gives another one away. Great job to Ambrose though, it was only a matter of time before he won a race.

It looks like a major change will need to take place at turn two. There is no reason for a wall to come out like that. Fortunately, nobody got hurt.

Actually, I find myself having to....ahem....cough....puke...defend Kyle on this one (God I need a beer for just SAYING that). :beer:

Even if Menard's tire didnt pop causing that late caution I honestly believe Ambrose had the better car there at the end-he was 2-3 tenths a lap faster and was just biding his time riding around behind Kyle, while Kyle's car was visiblly getting looser and looser. His rear tires were going away. It was only a matter of time before Ambrose would have been able to take him in the bus stop or turn 7. He was a sitting duck on that final restart, and the fact that he spun the tires like that tells me his rears were shot as he's passed even Ron Hornaday as the restart king in Nascar. Heck, even if he just gingerly went up through the gears Ambrose and Kes would have torched him down into 1 because he just didn't have the grip.

Amen on the part about turn 2.....heck you could extend that to the whole track. HOW is it in 2011 NASCAR will allow sanctioning to ANY track without SAFER barriers just absolutely eludes me.

slorydn1

15th August 2011, 23:33

He was a sitting duck on that final restart, and the fact that he spun the tires like that tells me his rears were shot as he's passed even Ron Hornaday as the restart king in Nascar.

Xcuse me while I wipe the stoopid juice off my face :facelick:

That's what I get for splitting my attention between Trackpass and the TV. The announcer said "OOOOH He spun his tires" and when I looked up (as Unibrow was slamming Harv in the door coming off of 1) Shrub wasn't in the lead anymore so I assumed it was him. Watching Nascar Now on DSPN I see that he actually cooked the braking zone-tho my point about the rear tires still stands-he no longer had the grip he needed to get it done in 1...Other guys dove it in just as deep as he did (Harv being one of those) and they made it stick so I still blame the lack of grip and not Shrub on that one...

00steven

16th August 2011, 00:25

Boris Said has no business being in NASCAR pulling stupid moves and hooking people head on in to walls. It was entertaining listening to his interview after the race though.

slorydn1

16th August 2011, 00:37

Boris Said has no business being in NASCAR pulling stupid moves and hooking people head on in to walls. It was entertaining listening to his interview after the race though.

Keep in mind that Tstew did EXACTLY the same thing to HIM in the very same spot on the track last year, near the end of the race. How he didnt end up bouncing off the inside wall like Ragan I have no idea. But guys get on the run off area then have to merge back in somehow or eat the turn 2 wall, and both chose to just drive thru the guy in front of him to get back in. Last year Boris was the bug, this year he was the windshield. That wreck wouldn't have happened years ago there because of the gravel trap that was there. Now that it's paved guys go out there at will and use it like an extra lane. Maybe if nascar started penalizing people for going out there to "improve their position" that may curb it some (no pun intended), though I would hate that as much as I hate the yellow line rule at the plate tracks.

Lee Roy

16th August 2011, 01:47

Maybe if nascar started penalizing people for going out there to "improve their position" that may curb it some (no pun intended), though I would hate that as much as I hate the yellow line rule at the plate tracks.

I applaud your honesty. :+

00steven

16th August 2011, 02:30

Actually, I find myself having to....ahem....cough....puke...defend Kyle on this one (God I need a beer for just SAYING that). :beer:

Even if Menard's tire didnt pop causing that late caution I honestly believe Ambrose had the better car there at the end-he was 2-3 tenths a lap faster and was just biding his time riding around behind Kyle, while Kyle's car was visiblly getting looser and looser. His rear tires were going away. It was only a matter of time before Ambrose would have been able to take him in the bus stop or turn 7. He was a sitting duck on that final restart, and the fact that he spun the tires like that tells me his rears were shot as he's passed even Ron Hornaday as the restart king in Nascar. Heck, even if he just gingerly went up through the gears Ambrose and Kes would have torched him down into 1 because he just didn't have the grip.

Amen on the part about turn 2.....heck you could extend that to the whole track. HOW is it in 2011 NASCAR will allow sanctioning to ANY track without SAFER barriers just absolutely eludes me.

I think you have to blame Kyle for using the tires up so much, which caused a lack of grip as he entered turn 1.

00steven

16th August 2011, 02:33

Keep in mind that Tstew did EXACTLY the same thing to HIM in the very same spot on the track last year, near the end of the race. How he didnt end up bouncing off the inside wall like Ragan I have no idea. But guys get on the run off area then have to merge back in somehow or eat the turn 2 wall, and both chose to just drive thru the guy in front of him to get back in. Last year Boris was the bug, this year he was the windshield. That wreck wouldn't have happened years ago there because of the gravel trap that was there. Now that it's paved guys go out there at will and use it like an extra lane. Maybe if nascar started penalizing people for going out there to "improve their position" that may curb it some (no pun intended), though I would hate that as much as I hate the yellow line rule at the plate tracks.

The problem I have is that they were racing for 20th. If they were racing for the win that's one thing, but there should have been more give and less take in that situation.

call_me_andrew

16th August 2011, 03:18

It looks like a major change will need to take place at turn two. There is no reason for a wall to come out like that. Fortunately, nobody got hurt.

The wall has to be at an angle. That's not just a coner worker's post, that's the main exit for infield parking. One of the tennants of constructing walls for a race track is that the first wall should overlap the second wall to a) conceal the gap and b) conceal the leading edge of wall two. The leading edge of wall 2 will always f*** you up worse than the angle of wall 1.

00steven

16th August 2011, 03:28

The wall has to be at an angle. That's not just a coner worker's post, that's the main exit for infield parking. One of the tennants of constructing walls for a race track is that the first wall should overlap the second wall to a) conceal the gap and b) conceal the leading edge of wall two. The leading edge of wall 2 will always f*** you up worse than the angle of wall 1.

That's what gates are for.

slorydn1

16th August 2011, 04:11

That's what gates are for.

Ask Michael Waltrip and Mike Harmon what the seams in the wall caused by a gate will do to a race car.

slorydn1

16th August 2011, 04:13

I think you have to blame Kyle for using the tires up so much, which caused a lack of grip as he entered turn 1.

I guess I can give ya that :up:

Sparky1329

16th August 2011, 06:22

Ask Michael Waltrip and Mike Harmon what the seams in the wall caused by a gate will do to a race car.

Oh, man! Is that ever the truth! I was watching the race when the Harmon wreck happened. I still don't believe he got out of that one alive.

Anubis

16th August 2011, 19:24

Ask Michael Waltrip and Mike Harmon what the seams in the wall caused by a gate will do to a race car.

Not the same discipline, but look at Blaine Johnson's death as an example of gates / access gaps having tragic consequences.

slorydn1

16th August 2011, 20:30

Oh, man! Is that ever the truth! I was watching the race when the Harmon wreck happened. I still don't believe he got out of that one alive.

I'll never forget Harmon's either. It was actually in practice, but when he caught that seam in the wall off of 4 at Bristol his car just disintegrated into an instant pile of twisted steel, and then Johnny Sauter in the #2 AC Delco car plowed into the wreckage so hard that HIS engine went bouncing all the way to turn 1....I thought Harmon was dead for sure. Then he just stood up in the middle of the wreckage as various team members came running to him from pit road....I was in shock-my wife was trying to talk to me and all I could do was stare.

I never saw Waltrip's deal, but they talk about it all the time.

slorydn1

16th August 2011, 20:40

Not the same discipline, but look at Blaine Johnson's death as an example of gates / access gaps having tragic consequences.

I'm trying to place this one-didn't he actually go between the end of one wall and catch the end of the second one?

00steven

16th August 2011, 21:35

Ask Michael Waltrip and Mike Harmon what the seams in the wall caused by a gate will do to a race car.

It would be better than what they have there now though.

Mark in Oshawa

17th August 2011, 18:28

First off, congrats to Marcos. He was full value for the win since he clearly was able to get around there faster than just about anyone and was working on Shrub when the last yellow fell. He might have run out of time to pass Shrub without the yellow, but it was clear to me if he got close, he would find a way by. The restart was classic Shrub over driving the first corner.

AS for the assertions Cup cars could run in the rain, I think the mindset of NASCAR is that there isn't enough contact patch of tire on the road for 850 to 900 hp to get down safely. I am thinking the pace car would need a pit stop by the end of the day....It isn't that I don't think it can be done, but to expect these guys to race in the rain when they can wreck each other easily in the dry says to me NASCAR is scared of the carnage....

As for the track design, the Armco there is at a goofy angle, but they have track access points there for emergency vehicles. They should redesign it. That said, the Armco gave way when the cars hit them. That is like a soft wall effect except it seemed to ricochet the cars back into harm's way. I guess they need to Boris Proof the place...it is clear he can wreck people anywhere....

Biff didn't want to fight Boris because I think he realized he is a little guy and Boris is a freaking moose.....

AS for Boris, well he has always been a meat head. Some defend what he did wrecking Ragan, some don't. Running that hard for 22nd to me just didn't make a lot of sense when you watch the video, but other's see it the other way....but I suspect Boris isn't getting any love from Ragan, Reuti or Ron Fellows either...

wedge

18th August 2011, 12:55

Congrats to Ambrose. That was great win. I honestly think he would've ate Shrub up if the race stayed green.

The Boris Said thing - drivers should be racing hard for whatever position.

Keep in mind that Tstew did EXACTLY the same thing to HIM in the very same spot on the track last year, near the end of the race. How he didnt end up bouncing off the inside wall like Ragan I have no idea. But guys get on the run off area then have to merge back in somehow or eat the turn 2 wall, and both chose to just drive thru the guy in front of him to get back in. Last year Boris was the bug, this year he was the windshield.

Looked like Ragan came down on Said. Racing incident.

00steven

18th August 2011, 14:52

Congrats to Ambrose. That was great win. I honestly think he would've ate Shrub up if the race stayed green.

The Boris Said thing - drivers should be racing hard for whatever position.

Looked like Ragan came down on Said. Racing incident.

To me it looked like said turned right and hooked him head on. I also disagree with you about racing as hard for 20th as you would for a win. Boris should have just backed off and tried to get him going into the inner loop.

Anubis

18th August 2011, 23:21

I'm trying to place this one-didn't he actually go between the end of one wall and catch the end of the second one?

That's my recollection of it, although can't remember if it was a gated gap or an overlapping section. Think it was the latter.

MD24

19th August 2011, 00:33

Second place for Keslowski. That boy could be a champion some day.

Agree.
Too bad Hendricks couldn't keep him.

MD24

19th August 2011, 00:36

Where the heck is harvick#1 he hasn't posted in a few weeks

00steven

19th August 2011, 01:17

Where the heck is harvick#1 he hasn't posted in a few weeks

That's what I've been wondering. I hope everythings ok...

harvick#1

21st August 2011, 16:57

Hey MD and Steve

I moved into my new house about a month ago, and while having no internet right now, (only have it on my phone). I've been busy fixing up some rooms, buying furniture, and work 6 days a week, I dont get much free time being the only person working on my house

Ive been healthy though, just havent gotten to watch any racing in awhile. I still try to check in from time to time

00steven

21st August 2011, 17:26