The Philosophy of Race Direction

[cosmicpanda]

This weekend really brought into focus the different views over how a race should be run: when it should be started behind a safety car, when a safety car should be deployed, when it should be red flagged.

James Allen points out that Charlie has become more conservative, preferring to err on the side of safety. Meanwhile, Martin Brundle on the BBC coverage was complaining about this, questioning the decision to start behind the safety car, and questioning the decision to bring out a safety car in response to the weather conditions without waiting for a crash. Brundle particularly asked, is it fair to red flag a race when people have pitted behind the safety car for wet tyres, etc?

Of course, F1 being what it is, some teams gambled on there being a red flag and thus didn't pit.

My questions are: why should this be a gamble - why should race strategy have to take into account the whims of the race director? And is this a good thing or a bad thing? Is 'conservative' race direction preferable to 'liberal' race direction?

[555-04Q2]

My response is simply.......less mucking about, more action please.

[Whyzars]

If they hadn't started behind the safety car Hamilton would've taken out five cars at the first corner.

:)

[555-04Q2]

:laugh: ROTFLMMFAA :laugh:

[schmenke]

As a purist, I like to see the sport less affected by outside influences, like race directors’ discretion, stewards meddling with “investigations” for what in most cases are merely racing incidents, and technological gimmicks that affect the outcome of the race.

I’ve been following F1 for longer than many forum members have been alive, and can honestly say that this past Canadian GP was one of the least enjoyable I’ve witnessed :down: .

[Big Ben]

I couldn't see the race but thanks to the drs there's plenty of other things I would rahter do on a sunny Sunday. So how bad was this rain? I can see a reason for red flagging the race if something like Germany 2007 was going on when cars started to pile up in one corner because there was a lake on the track but if they only did it because it wasn't comfortable for the drivers than that's just lame.

[schmenke]

The decision to red flag the race due to the conditions was entirely appropriate, but to then deploy the safety car and leave it out until such time that rain tires were no longer needed was far too extreme (I believe both Martin and David commented on this too).

Another thread in this forum suggests that the sport is heading to a direction where rain tires are redundant because they will never be used to race. I tend to agree with this, and to take this suggestion to the extreme, perhaps we will never see a F1 cars race again in the wet :mark: .

[555-04Q2]

The decision to red flag the race due to the conditions was entirely appropriate, but to then deploy the safety car and leave it out until such time that rain tires were no longer needed was far too extreme (I believe both Martin and David commented on this too).

Another thread in this forum suggests that the sport is heading to a direction where rain tires are redundant because they will never be used to race. I tend to agree with this, and to take this suggestion to the extreme, perhaps we will never see a F1 cars race again in the wet :mark: .

Some people (including the commentators) argue that the boards under the cars would hit the water and cause the cars to be uncontrollable. But if you watch the race, on lap 23 & 24 under the safety car approaching the hairpin, you can clearly see plenty of clearance between the board and the water on the track. This is the part of teh track that the drivers such as Vettel said were the worst (turns 9 - 13) and caused the red flag 1 lap later on lap 25. I watched my taping of the race, and the cars are well clear of the standing water. The problem lies with the drivers who are less like men and more likes pu$$ie$ these days who whine as soon as it starts to spit :down: Hamilton is about the only driver you ever hear saying lets get on with it, I wanna race.

We have witnessed many races in the 80's, 90's and early 00's where it was 10 times worse, yet the drivers managed just fine and we saw some of the best drives in F1's history by the likes of Schumacher, Senna etc.

Just race the damn cars for darn sakes!

[steveaki13]

The decision to red flag the race due to the conditions was entirely appropriate, but to then deploy the safety car and leave it out until such time that rain tires were no longer needed was far too extreme (I believe both Martin and David commented on this too).

Another thread in this forum suggests that the sport is heading to a direction where rain tires are redundant because they will never be used to race. I tend to agree with this, and to take this suggestion to the extreme, perhaps we will never see a F1 cars race again in the wet :mark: .

I agree.

While the cloudburst bought out the Red Flag at the right time.

The decision to start the race again, should have been the point the RACING started, not another 5 laps behind SC.

The SC should have come in after one lap, as obviously you can't have a standing start mid race.

[call_me_andrew]

I can understand staying cautious given how little expirience teams have with the Pirelli rain tires.


Some people (including the commentators) argue that the boards under the cars would hit the water and cause the cars to be uncontrollable. But if you watch the race, on lap 23 & 24 under the safety car approaching the hairpin, you can clearly see plenty of clearance between the board and the water on the track. This is the part of teh track that the drivers such as Vettel said were the worst (turns 9 - 13) and caused the red flag 1 lap later on lap 25. I watched my taping of the race, and the cars are well clear of the standing water. The problem lies with the drivers who are less like men and more likes pu$$ie$ these days who whine as soon as it starts to spit :down: Hamilton is about the only driver you ever hear saying lets get on with it, I wanna race.

You can't judge ground clearance behind the safety car. Downforce causes the ride height to lower with speed.

[555-04Q2]

I can understand staying cautious given how little expirience teams have with the Pirelli rain tires.



You can't judge ground clearance behind the safety car. Downforce causes the ride height to lower with speed.

Yes, but you can raise the cars ride height with tyres pressures, suspension settings etc. The teams knew it was going to be a wet race, they had time to set the cars up correctly before the race. Modern day F1 drivers and race directors are nothing but pu$$ie$ scared of a few puddles :(

[Brown, Jon Brow]

Yes, but you can raise the cars ride height with tyres pressures, suspension settings etc. The teams knew it was going to be a wet race, they had time to set the cars up correctly before the race. Modern day F1 drivers and race directors are nothing but pu$$ie$ scared of a few puddles :(

Under park-ferme rules they can't adjust the car after qualifying without removing it from the grid, like Torro Rosso did.

[555-04Q2]

Under park-ferme rules they can't adjust the car after qualifying without removing it from the grid, like Torro Rosso did.

Correct, but that is just one rule change that can be made so that cars can be adjusted when they wake up on a Sunday to find wet weather conditions.

[fandango]

I think they were right to stop the race when they did, but I agree that the safety car stayed out longer than was necessary on the restart. However, I think that it was probably the right thing to do from the point of view of the business side of F1. If the race had had to be stopped again due to a pile-up it would have made the sport look very silly. In the end we had a great race, so what's the problem?

[Brown, Jon Brow]

Correct, but that is just one rule change that can be made so that cars can be adjusted when they wake up on a Sunday to find wet weather conditions.

Well that is a fair point. But I like how teams can strategically prepare better for the race conditions whilst sacrificing qualifying performance. Like Mclaren did in Canada.