Donkey of the Race? Spain 2011

[steveaki13]

For Dave B

Who wanted a Donkey Thread.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

The TV dicktator seemed cut away from the action to the pitlane too much.

[N4D13]

It's difficult to pick a driver. I'd rather choose Pirelli. But if it needs to go to a driver, I'd pick Kovalainen - the only driver who crashed out today. I don't know whether it was his fault, though.

[steveaki13]

My Donkey was....

Well Massa had a poor race, but he may have had issues.

Also Maldonado. 8th on the grid to 15th.

Rubens Barrichello: Had loads of fresh tyres and could only make it up to 17th.

Williams: Sadly a very slow car.

Although to be honest there were no stand out Donkey's for me.

[Dave B]

I picked Massa, simply becuase he was anonymous all race. He seemed to make it easy to pass him, had a spin, and eventually binned it. It's the sort of performance which makes you wonder whether the car was working properly, but nobody has hinted at any such problems.

[wedge]

First of all I'll be happy to admit of being a donkey for posting this until prove wrong - Massa. Had a torrid time in a torrid car and looked like he did a Mansell and parked and gave up.

[ioan]

I picked Massa, simply becuase he was anonymous all race. He seemed to make it easy to pass him, had a spin, and eventually binned it. It's the sort of performance which makes you wonder whether the car was working properly, but nobody has hinted at any such problems.

He didn't bin it, he parked it probably because some mechanical problem was sighted. I wonder what we will learn from these problems.

[markabilly]

The real donkey, belongs to whoever or whatever the strategy was that took Fred from 1st place with an outstanding start (the best, although one could argue MS was best as well, hard to choose) down to fourth many many seconds behind....................

[Mark]

The Stewards, yet again. For being spineless.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

The real donkey, belongs to whoever or whatever the strategy was that took Fred from 1st place with an outstanding start (the best, although one could argue MS was best as well, hard to choose) down to fourth many many seconds behind....................

That would be Nicholas Tombazis, for designing a car that is 1.5 seconds a lap slower than the McLarens and Red Bulls.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

The Stewards, yet again. For being spineless.

Another Blunder by Blundell?

[wedge]

I picked Massa, simply becuase he was anonymous all race. He seemed to make it easy to pass him, had a spin, and eventually binned it. It's the sort of performance which makes you wonder whether the car was working properly, but nobody has hinted at any such problems.

He had a crap car all weekend which he could never sort or keep on top of. Horrendous mid-corner understeer and the car wanting to snap into oversteer. No wonder he had no confidence defending his position.

[N. Jones]

I would have to agree with the Massa "supporters". He was pretty bad.

[truefan72]

The TV dicktator seemed cut away from the action to the pitlane too much.

he has been bad all weekend

[truefan72]

The real donkey, belongs to whoever or whatever the strategy was that took Fred from 1st place with an outstanding start (the best, although one could argue MS was best as well, hard to choose) down to fourth many many seconds behind....................

exactly. That would be my donkey as well

[truefan72]

He had a crap car all weekend which he could never sort or keep on top of. Horrendous mid-corner understeer and the car wanting to snap into oversteer. No wonder he had no confidence defending his position.

and thats the difference between massa and alonso
one can drag his car up the grid, the other can't do a thing without smedley walking him through every lap

[ioan]

and thats the difference between massa and alonso
one can drag his car up the grid, the other can't do a thing without smedley walking him through every lap

I might have missed how Alonso dragged his car up from 4th to 5th (i.e. 1st to 5th) today, or maybe up was on the other direction on the grid?!

[keysersoze]

For me it's Petrov, or his strategist, or both. How he goes from 5th, gapping the Mercs and Felipe, and 40 seconds up on his teammate to 11th, lapped, out of the points, and 25 seconds behind Nick is staggeringly pathetic.

[Robinho]

Massa was nowhere, Ferrari for designing a car that went from on the leaders pace on soft tyres to finishing a lap down after the 2nd stop. Webber for turning pole into 4th. But on the whole i don't think there was an overwhelming Donkey today

[ioan]

For me it's Petrov, or his strategist, or both. How he goes from 5th, gapping the Mercs and Felipe, and 40 seconds up on his teammate to 11th, lapped, out of the points, and 25 seconds behind Nick is staggeringly pathetic.

Maybe this was his value today when not everything went perfectly for him. It can happen to anyone. At least he kept away from driving into other cars today.

[truefan72]

forgot about that one too

well said

[donKey jote]

No real donkeys this time.
2 stints for Alonso on hards was borderline and Massa wasn't a donkey... he was just being himself :p

[Sonic]

No Donkey's for me today. Several bellow par performances for sure - Webs, Massa, Williams as a whole - but they qualify for the Golden tortoise award rather than anything downright donkeyish.

[wedge]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91641

Gearbox problems for Massa - apparently (wearing my cynical hat on but its not the first Ferrari covering Massa - remember him spin off in Malaysia on his own some years ago)

[truefan72]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91641

Gearbox problems for Massa - apparently (wearing my cynical hat on but its not the first Ferrari covering Massa - remember him spin off in Malaysia on his own some years ago)
yup I am a bit cynical too,

what advantage does he have by not finishing the race with respect to components on the car for the next race?

[Warriwa]

Webber's side of the garage. Why follow Alonso into the pits three times in a row? Confusion reigns.

[Dave B]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91641

Gearbox problems for Massa - apparently (wearing my cynical hat on but its not the first Ferrari covering Massa - remember him spin off in Malaysia on his own some years ago)

If true I retract my donkey nomination. My donkeynation, if you will. But the fact remains that Massa is starting to let Alonso regain the advantage within the team.

[N4D13]

Now that I think about it, Petrov finishing outside of the points while Heidfeld came in eighth deserves an honourable mention.

I'm impressed by Petrov - he's matured from being a mediocre, mistake-prone driver into a mediocre driver.

[MrJan]

Vettel for that f***ing celebration, what a c**t.

[SGWilko]

Vettel for that f***ing celebration, what a c**t.

:confused: He was just very happy! We seem to forget just how young some of these guys are.

Let him have his celebrations.

As an aside, it was nice that he gave a lot of his time to Aunty for the post race Forum program. He still does not come across as arrogant.

[truefan72]

Now that I think about it, Petrov finishing outside of the points while Heidfeld came in eighth deserves an honourable mention.

I'm impressed by Petrov - he's matured from being a mediocre, mistake-prone driver into a mediocre driver.

spoken like someone who did not watch the race
probably still angry that Alonso could not get passed that "mediocre" driver in abu dhabi LOL

I guess under your own system, Alonso would also qualify as a mediocre driver then
Took the lead and ended up a lap down from the winners with no spins, pitstop problems or mechanical problems
mediocre, right?

[pino]

I guess under your own system, Alonso would also qualify as a mediocre driver then
Took the lead and ended up a lap down from the winners with no spins, pitstop problems or mechanical problems
mediocre, right?



Spoken like someone who did not watch the race...Alonso did lost between 2/3 sec per lap, due to his tyres :p :

[truefan72]

Spoken like someone who did not watch the race...Alonso did lost between 2/3 sec per lap, due to his tyres :p :

you do know I was being sarcastic and just hoisting him on his own petard
I know that Alonso suffered from poor tyres and poor strategy...just like petrov
:)

[Mia 01]

You was not friend with your car this race Felipe!

[ioan]

You was not friend with your car this race Felipe!

Excellent! :up:

[N4D13]

you do know I was being sarcastic and just hoisting him on his own petard
I know that Alonso suffered from poor tyres and poor strategy...just like petrov
:)
I would appreciate it very much if you kept my nationality and the fact that I support Alonso away from what I write in this forum. I'm a fan of Alonso, but I'm not the kind of guy who would flatter him all the time. And BTW, rather than upset, I'm just disappointed that he doesn't have a car which allows him to race for the victory.

That said, I've regarded Petrov as rubbish ever since his debut. He isn't particularly fast, neither is he consistent. I don't know about Petrov's strategy - if the team messed up his strategy, then I'll withdraw my previous comment. But then again, he qualified in eighth place, but in the end he didn't score a single point, while Heidfeld came in eighth from last in the grid. So if you can tell me that Petrov's wretched result was the team's fault, then I'll take it.

[Allyc85]

Vettel for that f***ing celebration, what a c**t.

Haha love it, so true!

Also JB for his shocker of a start?!

[Big Ben]

Vettel for that f***ing celebration, what a c**t.

that's a little rough but I did wonder why I didn´t turn the volume down a bit as I knew he was going to scream again.

[Big Ben]

spoken like someone who did not watch the race
probably still angry that Alonso could not get passed that "mediocre" driver in abu dhabi LOL

I guess under your own system, Alonso would also qualify as a mediocre driver then
Took the lead and ended up a lap down from the winners with no spins, pitstop problems or mechanical problems
mediocre, right?

Petrov is a lousy driver and this is just another race that proves it. He's there only because he brings in the roubles. Abu Dhabi was one of his best races, not because he did anything special but because it was one of those rare ones when he didn´t f*** it up. It´s ridiculous to suggest that the same tires on the same car takes one driver from 26th to 8th and the other from 8th to where ever he ended up.

But since Petrov is just a pay driver and Renault needs him for the money I will just ignore him and say that Massa was the donkey. I don´t even care what problem may or may not have had in the end. He was lame from q1 to the moment he parked his car. And some actually thought he was gonna beat the living days out of Alonso. It's just shows how much hatred can blind some people.

[CNR]

Vettel for that f***ing celebration, what a c**t.
Crazy Frog Racer : Tournament : Gold

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JDEdFYldYpM&feature=related

[ioan]

That said, I've regarded Petrov as rubbish ever since his debut.

Rather sad way to look at things.

[keysersoze]

IThat said, I've regarded Petrov as rubbish ever since his debut. He isn't particularly fast, neither is he consistent. I don't know about Petrov's strategy - if the team messed up his strategy, then I'll withdraw my previous comment. But then again, he qualified in eighth place, but in the end he didn't score a single point, while Heidfeld came in eighth from last in the grid. So if you can tell me that Petrov's wretched result was the team's fault, then I'll take it.

He qualified 6th, for the 2nd time this season. He's up 4-1 on Heidfeld in qualifying this season, and in the final race of the 2010 season Vitaly outqualified Kubica.

Rubbish? Not even close. Nick has said he's been shocked by Vitaly's pace, and Lewis Hamilton has described Petrov's form as "fantastic."

[keysersoze]

Petrov is a lousy driver and this is just another race that proves it. He's there only because he brings in the roubles.

It's just shows how much hatred can blind some people.

That, my fellow posters, is the very definition of irony. :rolleyes:

[truefan72]

That, my fellow posters, is the very definition of irony. :rolleyes:

:up:

[truefan72]

I would appreciate it very much if you kept my nationality and the fact that I support Alonso away from what I write in this forum. I'm a fan of Alonso, but I'm not the kind of guy who would flatter him all the time. And BTW, rather than upset, I'm just disappointed that he doesn't have a car which allows him to race for the victory.

That said, I've regarded Petrov as rubbish ever since his debut. He isn't particularly fast, neither is he consistent. I don't know about Petrov's strategy - if the team messed up his strategy, then I'll withdraw my previous comment. But then again, he qualified in eighth place, but in the end he didn't score a single point, while Heidfeld came in eighth from last in the grid. So if you can tell me that Petrov's wretched result was the team's fault, then I'll take it.

It was tyres if you would bother to understand the race.

There have been several drivers with decent cars that have been forced to start from the back
and in all those cases had sets of fresh new tires and all stormed through the field
Webber, Kobayashi, and Heidfeld now

...and being a fan of Alonso seems to make you view petrov's race as disastrous while nary a word about the guy who took the lead , stayed there for some time and ended up being lapped by the top 4 cars that finished ahead of him. So just because you do not like a driver does not mean you can rubbish his race while your favorite driver fails in the identical strategy and conditions and you have nothing to say about that performance.

[Big Ben]

That, my fellow posters, is the very definition of irony. :rolleyes:

Actually it's not since I don't hate the guy. I just don't think he's good enough which is why I don't really care about him either way. Can I think that about someone without hating him? I don't like Vettel or Hamilton but I still think they are excellent drivers, them + FA are at least a class above the rest of the field right now. I quite hated MS too but I wouldn't say RB would have whipped the floor with him if we he had been allowed.... so instead of picking sentences from here and there just to insult someone you spend more time looking in the mirror.

[MrJan]

:confused: He was just very happy! We seem to forget just how young some of these guys are.

Let him have his celebrations.


that's a little rough but I did wonder why I didn´t turn the volume down a bit as I knew he was going to scream again.

He can have celebrations, I'll even let him have that irritating finger thing, but doing an impression of the crazy frog 5 years after it was 'big' is completely inexcusable. As for being young, try watching MotoGP. Much as I hate Lorenzo he is just as young as Vettel and has had some pretty inventive celebrations, the same goes for Rossi a few years ago.

[SGWilko]

He can have celebrations, I'll even let him have that irritating finger thing, but doing an impression of the crazy frog 5 years after it was 'big' is completely inexcusable. As for being young, try watching MotoGP. Much as I hate Lorenzo he is just as young as Vettel and has had some pretty inventive celebrations, the same goes for Rossi a few years ago.

But it was an ongoing joke between Vettel and his engineer - the FIA chose to broadcast it, so that is not Seb's problem.

[Dave B]

As for being young, try watching MotoGP. Much as I hate Lorenzo he is just as young as Vettel and has had some pretty inventive celebrations, the same goes for Rossi a few years ago.

As the Beeb observed on their gridwalk, it's a shame F1 doesn't let the drivers do donuts for the crowd, instead forcing them straight into parc fermé and thence onto the podium.

[MrJan]

:confused: He was just very happy! We seem to forget just how young some of these guys are.

Let him have his celebrations.

As an aside, it was nice that he gave a lot of his time to Aunty for the post race Forum program. He still does not come across as arrogant.


But it was an ongoing joke between Vettel and his engineer - the FIA chose to broadcast it, so that is not Seb's problem.

It's not Seb's problem that he's an idiot? Hmm, not sure I agree on that one. Ongoing joke or not, anyone that makes the noise of the crazy frog should have their hands chopped off. Like I said, it's inexcusable.

[SGWilko]

It's not Seb's problem that he's an idiot? Hmm, not sure I agree on that one. Ongoing joke or not, anyone that makes the noise of the crazy frog should have their hands chopped off. Like I said, it's inexcusable.

Maybe he is a pal of Ronnie Ringding, the throttle happy chappie - slowing down to a set of lights his hairdryer (sorry, motorbike) goes ring ding ding ding.......

[Mark]

As the Beeb observed on their gridwalk, it's a shame F1 doesn't let the drivers do donuts for the crowd, instead forcing them straight into parc fermé and thence onto the podium.

True, but we could have the situation like in American racing where they just get mobbed at the end of the race and you get a few words out of the drivers after they get a microphone pushed into their face - horribly undignified :p

[The Black Knight]

I picked Massa, simply becuase he was anonymous all race. He seemed to make it easy to pass him, had a spin, and eventually binned it. It's the sort of performance which makes you wonder whether the car was working properly, but nobody has hinted at any such problems.


I agree with you completely here. Massa was nowhere all race. He wasn't good enough. He keeps blaming the car but at the same time Alonso is completely out performing him. There's only so much excuses on can make and it seems to be the same old car excuse we hear from Felipe all the time. While it may be true I feel he must up his game considerably or he will be departing Maranello.

[MrJan]

Maybe he is a pal of Ronnie Ringding, the throttle happy chappie - slowing down to a set of lights his hairdryer (sorry, motorbike) goes ring ding ding ding.......

To quote Homer* "What the hell are you talking about?"








*Simpson.

[DexDexter]

Actually it's not since I don't hate the guy. I just don't think he's good enough which is why I don't really care about him either way. Can I think that about someone without hating him? I don't like Vettel or Hamilton but I still think they are excellent drivers, them + FA are at least a class above the rest of the field right now. I quite hated MS too but I wouldn't say RB would have whipped the floor with him if we he had been allowed.... so instead of picking sentences from here and there just to insult someone you spend more time looking in the mirror.

Your problem is you never change your opinion, whether it be about Petrov or Kimi or somebody else. Petrov has driven well this year, there is just no way around it.

[truefan72]

Your problem is you never change your opinion, whether it be about Petrov or Kimi or somebody else. Petrov has driven well this year, there is just no way around it.

exactly

[ioan]

As the Beeb observed on their gridwalk, it's a shame F1 doesn't let the drivers do donuts for the crowd...

With those Pirellis?! I think it is a matter of public safety in this case! :D

[airshifter]

With those Pirellis?! I think it is a matter of public safety in this case! :D

Give it some thought before you toss out the idea.

They could easily make a provision where anyone on softs could change tires before or during the donuts. :)

[Retro Formula 1]

Struggling to understand the criticism of Petrov this year. He has really stepped up to the plate if you ask me and is doing a good job. At least he's driving his ass off unlike wasted seats such as Schumy or Massa.

The boy is starting to prove himself despite my initial reservations about him.

[jens]

He's up 4-1 on Heidfeld in qualifying this season, and in the final race of the 2010 season Vitaly outqualified Kubica.


4-1 is unfair considering Heidfeld even didn't participate in quali in Spain. 3-1 would be more appropriate.

As for criticism about Petrov like you lot are discussing here. Well, so and so. Overall he has improved, but his performance in the Spanish GP wasn't indeed much to be impressed about.

[Big Ben]

Your problem is you never change your opinion, whether it be about Petrov or Kimi or somebody else. Petrov has driven well this year, there is just no way around it.

You couldn´t be more wrong. I used to think Kimi was the fastest guy around. I used to think he was much better than that lucky Alonso. i really hoped until it was mathematically impossible that he would beat FA in 2005.. but then he moved to Ferrari and Massa started beating him regularly... and I've never considered Massa a top driver. So you see, I've come to believe that FA is a much more complete driver than KR even though my first impression was that the spaniard was just a lucky boy in the right place at the right time while the finn was the real deal. I have no idea where do you get the impression that I have something against Kimi. I really thing he should be in F1... in MS' place for example.

[airshifter]

You couldn´t be more wrong. I used to think Kimi was the fastest guy around. I used to think he was much better than that lucky Alonso. i really hoped until it was mathematically impossible that he would beat FA in 2005.. but then he moved to Ferrari and Massa started beating him regularly... and I've never considered Massa a top driver. So you see, I've come to believe that FA is a much more complete driver than KR even though my first impression was that the spaniard was just a lucky boy in the right place at the right time while the finn was the real deal. I have no idea where do you get the impression that I have something against Kimi. I really thing he should be in F1... in MS' place for example.

You do leave out a couple of points here. Kimi went to Ferrari and took the WDC title in his first year in the car. Though Massa did beat him the following year, Kimi played a support role when it was clear Felipe was the only contender for the possible WDC for Ferrari.

You also left out that Alonso was beaten by a rookie driver, though without doubt one of the best rookies in a long time. Rather than ever assume a supporting role, Alonso cried that Lewis was getting preferential treatment.

[Arjuna]

Agree with many of you, Ferrari let down Alonso from tremendous start, successfully hold off drivers behind him until Vettel decided to make early pit stop, to the fifth with a lap slower than the winner. Perhaps, they still have problem with tyres and in the process of trying some tyre trial which compositions can deliver the best result at the end. In Turkey Alonso was fairly good at the start, fast in the middle of the race, and get slower after his last pit stop. In Spain he was fast at the start, good in the middle, and poor at the last pit stop. They tend to get slower in the final laps, can be something related too to my guess that they have problem with the car while Red Bull is more reliable to cover the whole laps?..

Good show for Perez for the first point, thought it would be Di Resta, his result wasn't bad though, who would finish in that place if only his pit strategy wasn't awkward. His way of driving saves tyres, in many occasion he comes to pit later than everyone, it is not a wonder if we see him at the front while everyone is pitted. Thought he would make a pit less than everyone in Spain..

[Big Ben]

You do leave out a couple of points here. Kimi went to Ferrari and took the WDC title in his first year in the car. Though Massa did beat him the following year, Kimi played a support role when it was clear Felipe was the only contender for the possible WDC for Ferrari.

You also left out that Alonso was beaten by a rookie driver, though without doubt one of the best rookies in a long time. Rather than ever assume a supporting role, Alonso cried that Lewis was getting preferential treatment.

I think the post was long enough and I didn't want to add things I find irrelevant. The fact KR won the title in 2007 says more about McLaren than about him and the fact that LH beat FA in his first year by as much as 0 points (or is it 0 point?) doesn't really say much about KR... or I could stay that I think LH is better too.