Race lengths

[NaBUru38]

I've read that some are pushing for shorter Nascar races. The 2011 schedules are like this:

Superspeedways:
o- Daytona (2.5mi): 500 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 250 Trucks (February) - 400 Cup, 250 Nationwide (July).
o- Talladega (2.5mi): 500 Cup, 312 Nationwide, 250 Trucks.
o- Indianapolis (2.5mi): 400 Cup
o- Fontana (2mi): 500 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.
o- Michigan (2mi): 400 Cup, 250 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.
o- Pocono (2.5mi): 500 Cup, 138 Trucks.

To me, Daytona's different lengths are fine. I'd leave Talladega and Indianapolis as they are now. I'd leave copy Michgan's lenghts to Fontana and shorten one of the Pocono races to 400 miles.

High-banked intermediates:
o- Charlotte (1.5mi): 600 / 500 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.
o- Texas (1.5mi): 500 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 250 / 220 Trucks.
o- Atlanta (1.5mi): 500 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.
o- Las Vegas (1.5mi): 400 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 220 Trucks.
o- Darlington (1.3mi): 500 Cup, 200 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.

I'd shorten the Charlotte October race to 400 / 250 / 160 miles, shorten the Darlington Truck race to 160 miles, shorten the Texas Truck races to 220 / 200, leave the rest as they are now.

Mid-banked intermediates:
o- Kansas (1.5mi): 400 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 250 Trucks.
o- Kentucky / Chicago (1.5mi): 400 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 225 Trucks.
o- Homestead (1.5mi): 400 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.
o- Nashville (1.3mi): 300 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.

I'd shorten one of the Kansas Cup races to 350 miles, leave Nashville untouched, shorten the rest of the Nationwide / Truck races to 250 / 200.

One milers:
o- Dover (1mi): 400 Cup, 200 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.
o- Phoenix (1mi): 312 Cup, 200 Nationwide, 150 Trucks.
o- New Hampshire (1mi): 318 Cup, 212 Nationwide, 185 Trucks.

I'd shorten one of the Dover races to 350 / 200 / 160 miles, leave the rest as they are.

Sub milers:
o- Iowa (.875mi): 220 Nationwide, 175 Trucks.
o- Richmond (.75mi): 300 Cup, 190 Nationwide.
o- Indianapolis (.686mi): 138 Nationwide, 138 Trucks.
o- Martinsville (.5mi): 263 Cup, 132 / 108 Trucks.
o- Bristol (.5mi): 267 Cup, 160 / 133 Nationwide, 108 Trucks.

I'd lengthen the Indianapolis Nationwide race to 170 miles, leave the rest as they are.

Road courses:
o- Road America (4.05mi): 200 Nationwide.
o- Watkins Glen (2.45mi): 220 Cup, 200 Nationwide.
o- Montreal (2.71mi): 208 Nationwide.
o- Sears Point (1.99mi): 200 Cup.

I'd shorten the Nationwide Montreal race to 160 miles and the other two Nationwide races to 180 miles.


In short, my proposal is:

Superspeedways:
o- Daytona (2.5mi): 500 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 250 Trucks (February) - 400 Cup, 250 Nationwide (July).
o- Talladega (2.5mi): 500 Cup, 312 Nationwide, 250 Trucks.
o- Indianapolis (2.5mi): 400 Cup
o- Michigan / Fontana (2mi): 400 Cup, 250 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.
o- Pocono (2.5mi): 500 / 400 Cup, 138 Trucks.

High-banked intermediates:
o- Charlotte (1.5mi): 600 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 200 Trucks (May) - 400 Cup, 250 Nationwide, 160 Trucks (October).
o- Texas (1.5mi): 500 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 220 / 200 Trucks.
o- Atlanta (1.5mi): 500 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.
o- Las Vegas (1.5mi): 400 Cup, 300 Nationwide, 220 Trucks.
o- Darlington (1.3mi): 500 Cup, 200 Nationwide, 160 Trucks.

Mid-banked intermediates:
o- Kansas (1.5mi): 400 / 350 Cup, 250 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.
o- Kentucky / Chicago / Homestead (1.5mi): 400 Cup, 250 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.
o- Nashville (1.3mi): 300 Nationwide, 200 Trucks.

One milers:
o- Dover (1mi): 400 Cup, 200 Nationwide, 200 Trucks (one) - 350 Cup, 200 Nationwide, 160 Trucks (other).
o- Phoenix (1mi): 312 Cup, 200 Nationwide, 150 Trucks.
o- New Hampshire (1mi): 318 Cup, 212 Nationwide, 185 Trucks.

Sub milers:
o- Iowa (.875mi): 220 Nationwide, 175 Trucks.
o- Richmond (.75mi): 300 Cup, 190 Nationwide.
o- Indianapolis (.686mi): 170 Nationwide, 138 Trucks.
o- Martinsville (.5mi): 263 Cup, 132 / 108 Trucks.
o- Bristol (.5mi): 267 Cup, 160 / 133 Nationwide, 108 Trucks.

Road courses:
o- Road America (4.05mi): 180 Nationwide.
o- Watkins Glen (2.45mi): 220 Cup, 180 Nationwide.
o- Montreal (2.71mi): 160 Nationwide.
o- Sears Point (1.99mi): 200 Cup.

What do you think?

[Jonesi]

Miles don't really count, it's all about race time. About half of the money Nascar (the organization) gets is from the TV deal, $10-12 million per Cup race. The TV networks make the money back (they hope) by selling commercial time. They can only put ads on 20 minutes per hour, but the cable/satellite provider get 3 or 4 minutes (can't remember which) and if on a broadcast channel, the local broadcaster get 2 minutes. That only leaves about 14-15 minutes to bring in about $3mil an hour in ad revenue. Works out to about $150k a minute.
Then there's the fan in the seats at the track. Given the cost of a ticket, an hour or so getting into and out of the track, (once you are in the area,) how does shortening the race add value and make more people want to come to the race?
Races need to run 3 to 4.5 hours (or add support race(s) on race day.

[slorydn1]

Miles don't really count, it's all about race time. About half of the money Nascar (the organization) gets is from the TV deal, $10-12 million per Cup race. The TV networks make the money back (they hope) by selling commercial time. They can only put ads on 20 minutes per hour, but the cable/satellite provider get 3 or 4 minutes (can't remember which) and if on a broadcast channel, the local broadcaster get 2 minutes. That only leaves about 14-15 minutes to bring in about $3mil an hour in ad revenue. Works out to about $150k a minute.
Then there's the fan in the seats at the track. Given the cost of a ticket, an hour or so getting into and out of the track, (once you are in the area,) how does shortening the race add value and make more people want to come to the race?
Races need to run 3 to 4.5 hours (or add support race(s) on race day.

Thank you, you beat me to it. The race disrtances are fine as they are now, maybe with the exception of the Pocono-though I wouldn't support shortening Pocono, I could understand why some would like that-any sort of delay at all and you are staring at a 5 hour race.

As for making any of the truck races shorter, be careful what you wish for. As it is, at some of the races, if the caution laps fall perfectly, people can (and have) go the distance without pitting....

[jeffconn]

If a track has two races, i'd love to see one race longer than the other. Just so there would be a different 'feel' to each race. Teams approach the Daytona 500 differently than the 400, and Charlotte's 600 mile race has a different feel than the 500 mile race. Truthfully, the June Pocono race (to my untrained eyes) looks and feels exactly the same as the July race. Same with the Martinsville or Texas races. I would like to have at least one race at each track be more like a sprint race. 300 miles at the most. Plus, how many times has the leader at 300 miles NOT won the race, while the eventual winner just sits back and bides his time for 300 or so miles? It would be nice for the top drivers to actually want to lead the early laps.

Okay, end of rant. Just my two cents. YMMV.

[djparky]

some of them are too long- Pocono being the main culprit. The other one is the Coke 600 (or whatever it's called) at Charlotte

Although the end of season events at Texas, Miami were entertaining in general I find races at these type of tracks fairly tedious to watch (also Chicago, Fontana, Michigan, Atlanta, Charlotte). The field gets strung out and you're just waiting for NASCAR to throw one of their dodgy yellows to bunch the field up

It may be different in person- I've been to Daytona a few times and have never really felt that those races were too long

[call_me_andrew]

Most American sporting events are over in less than 3 hours these days. A 3.5 hour race seems out of place. 500 mile races used to be a big deal, but now they've been diluted.

I wouldn't mind seeing the spring Talladega race extended to 600 miles or 1,000 kilometers, but most of the 500's (particularly in the Chase) need to go.

Of course if you read my blog, "Where Silence Has Lease," you would know this already.

[Mark in Oshawa]

I would be all for making a lot of the 500 milers shorter, and taking the idea that shorter races for one of the two events at the tracks with two is a good idea.
That said, Cup racing is about endurance and strategy. Sprint races don't rewards smarter guys who look after their cars. I think if we were a little less liberal with yellows, races would end in that 3 to 3.5 hour window that is the target. How many yellows do you endure and how many extra commercials do we get as a result? I think that is part of the reason the ratings are diving...people get tired of it...