STARTER: Why did you lock the All Danica All The Time thread ???

[SoCalPVguy]

Is it because poor ol' DF complained??? You have done nothing but cater to him from day one !!!

[Dr. Krogshöj]

I have mixed feelings. The idea to have a thread solely for the purpose of bashing a particular driver is pathetic to me but once the season begins all the other threads will be spammed by the Danica posters again.

[Mark in Oshawa]

Starter...it was all that...and it was fun..

Sigh...I hate it when the Moddy has a point.....

[Easy Drifter]

Another member and I discussed this privately.
There is just one race to go this year so if we want to comment we can do a Homestead Nationwide thread in the taxi cab forum.
We thought that maybe next year have a thread in Chit Chat as that can encompass everything she does.
If you have thoughts maybe start a thread in Chit Chat now.

[SUBARUTEAM]

not sure why everyone beats up on danica anyway. how many of you 'posters' have won an indycar race? I beleive its a case of the tall poppy syndrome?

[TURN3]

Is it because poor ol' DF complained??? You have done nothing but cater to him from day one !!!

Bingo!

[Jag_Warrior]

I understand Starter's position and reasons for doing this. But rather than locking the thread, why not just transfer it to the NASCAR forum, or as Easy said, Chit Chat? Being that Danica is more of a celebrity than a racer anyway, maybe Chit Chat would be the most appropriate place to discuss all of the facets of her life. I mean, that's where we discuss other "famous for being famous" celebrities in Danica's league: Paris Hilton, Sarah Palin, Lindsay Lohan, et al.

I vote for the thread to be reopened in Chit Chat... being that I don't have a vote anyway. :dozey:

[Easy Drifter]

Some of us have raced at various levels. I raced against 9 guys with F1 experience including some full time factory drivers. Didn't beat them though!
I support Simona and Sarah.
I think the reason most are anti Danica is the over hype and her delusions of being a top line driver.
It certainly is my reason as she is still clueless in both IC and taxi cabs.

[SUBARUTEAM]

I think the reason most are anti Danica is the over hype and her delusions of being a top line driver.
.

got a link to back that up man?

she has won an indycar race - does that not make her a top line driver?

Don't get me wrong here - i don't follow her at all - but I find all this bashing very interesting. if she was a man, would you lot be so hard on her?

[Easy Drifter]

In her entire 'career' that is the only race she has won at any level. It was a fuel strategy deal at that. She is really a mediocre driver in top line equipment. She drives a race car but very rarely actually races. She drives fairly quickly on ovals in IC but rarely on road courses and she has been very medicore in Nationwide.
In the Nationwide car she is at the best a mid 20's runner in a car that in other hands this year has been a top ten car. In the Nationwide series there are always several 'Start and Park' cars and there were 8 at Phoenix.
Part of the flack on here has been caused by DF's over the top comments and excuses. At a test he said her poor performance was because it was cold. It was the same for all. Just an example.
She gets far more press than her performance warrants although the print press is really backing off now.
If you take a good look at her career you will see what I mean.
Starter please move to Chit Chat.

[SarahFan]

Yawn

[beachbum]

How many of you 'posters' have won an indycar race? If winning an Indy Car race is a prerequisite for posting an opinion about an Indy Car driver on a racing forum, there would be no racing forums. I do know for a fact that there are people posting here who have won more races as various levels than you-know-who.



she has won an indycar race - does that not make her a top line driver?
It made her strategist look like a genius and made her very lucky to have a smart strategist. He showed how to get a driver barely running in the top 10 (in a 18 car field with only 12 cars within 8 laps of the lead) to the lead on fuel strategy.


if she was a man, would you lot be so hard on her?Nope. If she were a man with her record, she probably never would have gotten an Indy Car ride in the first place. Ask Jon Fogarty and Ryan Dalziel (both finished ahead of her in Atlantics). In fact, the ONLY driver from the 2004 Atlantics class who got an Indy car ride was you-know-who (she finished 3rd for the year with no wins). A couple got some rides in that other series, but then moved to sports cars. The 2005 Atlantics class wasn't any luckier. Katherine Legge also finished third for the season and while Kat had a shot in good equipment in that other series for a year, those opportunities dried up as well.

Her teammate at RLR in 2005 was Vitor Meira. Even though he finished 7th for the season to her 12th and had a 3 year contract, he lost his ride because he couldn't bring money. She did, so in a real sense, she is a ride buyer. In her latest endeavor, she certainly is a ride buyer as she wouldn't be driving for JR Motorsports while wrecking cars and running at the back if there wasn't serious money involved. Ask Kelly Bires - he got fired from Jr Motorsports after a 7th place finish and three top-twenty finishes. And he didn't tear up equipment. Or Josh Wise, who kept the 7 car well into the top 30 in points and now drives a start-and-park.

She isn't getting great rides because of talent or results. She is getting great rides because of money generated by sponsors and marketing.

[SUBARUTEAM]

Do you keep going on about mike conway? how is he any different? Oh thats right - he hasn't won a race yet.

so she can bring money to a team and gets a good ride - is that any reason to beat up on her all the time.

but hey - you seam to have all the answers so what ever.

[beachbum]

Do you keep going on about mike conway? how is he any different? Oh thats right - he hasn't won a race yet.

so she can bring money to a team and gets a good ride - is that any reason to beat up on her all the time.

but hey - you seam to have all the answers so what ever.As far as I can see, no one mentioned Mike Conway

[Anubis]

got a link to back that up man?

she has won an indycar race - does that not make her a top line driver?


No, in the same way one win didn't make Olivier Panis a top line F1 driver.

[SoCalPVguy]

A second, but less pressing, reason is that it also became a NASCAR thread. This is the IndyCar forum.

That is because she is now a "Nascar" driver for all intents and purposes. She is irrelevant to ICS and I predict she will be a full time Nascar driver starting as soon as next year for about a year or so until she washes out there and all opportunities are gone. Then of course she can go on to become the co-host of Access Hollywood.

[SUBARUTEAM]

i mention mike conway because he brings money to a team, gets a good ride and doesn't win races. so i'm wondering why you guys don't start a 'i hate mike' thread. whats the difference? the truth is that there is only one difference - danica is a good looking women.

why you keep beating up on danica is beyond me. and as i mentioned earlier, i'm no great fan of danica but i certainly don't waste my life beating up on her in forums where you can hide behind a log in name.

anyway, thats all I'm going to say on the subject.

[ICWS]

If winning an Indy Car race is a prerequisite for posting an opinion about an Indy Car driver on a racing forum, there would be no racing forums. I do know for a fact that there are people posting here who have won more races as various levels than you-know-who.

It made her strategist look like a genius and made her very lucky to have a smart strategist. He showed how to get a driver barely running in the top 10 (in a 18 car field with only 12 cars within 8 laps of the lead) to the lead on fuel strategy.

Nope. If she were a man with her record, she probably never would have gotten an Indy Car ride in the first place. Ask Jon Fogarty and Ryan Dalziel (both finished ahead of her in Atlantics). In fact, the ONLY driver from the 2004 Atlantics class who got an Indy car ride was you-know-who (she finished 3rd for the year with no wins). A couple got some rides in that other series, but then moved to sports cars. The 2005 Atlantics class wasn't any luckier. Katherine Legge also finished third for the season and while Kat had a shot in good equipment in that other series for a year, those opportunities dried up as well.

Her teammate at RLR in 2005 was Vitor Meira. Even though he finished 7th for the season to her 12th and had a 3 year contract, he lost his ride because he couldn't bring money. She did, so in a real sense, she is a ride buyer. In her latest endeavor, she certainly is a ride buyer as she wouldn't be driving for JR Motorsports while wrecking cars and running at the back if there wasn't serious money involved. Ask Kelly Bires - he got fired from Jr Motorsports after a 7th place finish and three top-twenty finishes. And he didn't tear up equipment. Or Josh Wise, who kept the 7 car well into the top 30 in points and now drives a start-and-park.

She isn't getting great rides because of talent or results. She is getting great rides because of money generated by sponsors and marketing.

Your post should be case closed, but there will still be more posts arguing against you. Let me say something about Mr. Conway; he won a Formula Renault UK Championship (2004) and was the British Formula 3 Champion in 2006, so he has at least won something that he can put on his resume. And while his overall performance wasn't that great in GP2, he nevertheless won one race (Monaco, 2008). His reward for doing these things is a spot on Dreyer & Reinbold's team, a team that has had only one IndyCar win in its 11-year history (Robbie Buhl in 2000 at Walt Disney World Speedway).

Meanwhile, Ms. Patrick won several karting championships, but nothing in the junior series that she competed in (Formula Ford, Formula Vauxhall, Skip Barber Pro Series, and Toyota Atlantics).

[TURN3]

i mention mike conway because he brings money to a team, gets a good ride and doesn't win races. so i'm wondering why you guys don't start a 'i hate mike' thread. whats the difference? the truth is that there is only one difference - danica is a good looking women.

why you keep beating up on danica is beyond me. and as i mentioned earlier, i'm no great fan of danica but i certainly don't waste my life beating up on her in forums where you can hide behind a log in name.

anyway, thats all I'm going to say on the subject.

The reasons for bashing Danica are endless and several have already been pointed out to you. You want links? Google "Danica Patrick" and find me something to make YOUR argument that she's worth a damn. It is far more compelling to engage a driver that never won anything at a single junior level yet still ended up with one of Honda's trick engines on one of the top 2 teams of the times. Without the dire need the IRL had at the time for a marketing gimmick, she's gone after year 1...and should've never been there to begin with.

Most of today's ride buyers have won races and championships at various levels on their way up. Danica has nothing. Her talent level is dependant upon a track with as little throttle interaction as possible. You want links? Just check the results in her NASCAR and Indycar races over the past 5 years...check that, just look at results for her entire professional career. The occasional respectable result normally happens on tracks where lifting isn't necessary and attrition gains her 5 to 15 spots. The NASCAR "experiement" is proof enough. While all the excuses in the book have been used up twice, 1-timers step on the track week after week and run top 10 and 15 all race long, on the lead lap....and no fanfare because the superstar driver with all the talent is 5 laps down...AGAIN. Yep, she sucks alright. When you don't perform, you get what you deserve. And she doesn't perform, period. Now go away unless you have a valid point to make.

[slorydn1]

I understand Starter's position and reasons for doing this. But rather than locking the thread, why not just transfer it to the NASCAR forum......

I vote for the thread to be reopened in Chit Chat... being that I don't have a vote anyway. :dozey:

That's because there already is one in the NASCAR forum, and feel free to post in it anytime you like, just don't insult other posters in the process; I'd hate to have to lock it in there, too, seeing that I am the one guilty of starting it :p :

It was never meant to be a thread of opportunity for everyone to T-off on one poster or another. It was meant as a place to vent against the way the media was forcing Danica down our throats as the second coming of Michael Schumacher and Dale Earnhardt all rolled up into one, a driver worthy of an update every time she shifts the gear lever; hence the title "OMG-Danica broke a nail!!" thread (which can be found here, by the way):

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=863116#post863116

The answer to the question "Why did (insert Mod's name here) lock the thread about (insert topic here)?" is really quite simple. It's because it becomes a tedious pain in the seat cushion to have to constantly go in and edit post after post to remove the insults posters direct at one another-it just becomes much more expedient to close thread and just be done with it.

And you do have a vote...you may feel free to open a thread on this subject anytime you wish in the Chit Chat forum.....

[slorydn1]

Some of us have raced at various levels. I raced against 9 guys with F1 experience including some full time factory drivers. Didn't beat them though!
I support Simona and Sarah.
I think the reason most are anti Danica is the over hype and her delusions of being a top line driver.
It certainly is my reason as she is still clueless in both IC and taxi cabs.

Well said. I have almost zero racing experience, except for being a fan of all forms of motorsport since I was a very young child. It's the overhyping that makes my blood boil.

[SUBARUTEAM]

The reasons for bashing Danica are endless and several have already been pointed out to you. You want links? Google "Danica Patrick" and find me something to make YOUR argument that she's worth a damn. It is far more compelling to engage a driver that never won anything at a single junior level yet still ended up with one of Honda's trick engines on one of the top 2 teams of the times. Without the dire need the IRL had at the time for a marketing gimmick, she's gone after year 1...and should've never been there to begin with.

Most of today's ride buyers have won races and championships at various levels on their way up. Danica has nothing. Her talent level is dependant upon a track with as little throttle interaction as possible. You want links? Just check the results in her NASCAR and Indycar races over the past 5 years...check that, just look at results for her entire professional career. The occasional respectable result normally happens on tracks where lifting isn't necessary and attrition gains her 5 to 15 spots. The NASCAR "experiement" is proof enough. While all the excuses in the book have been used up twice, 1-timers step on the track week after week and run top 10 and 15 all race long, on the lead lap....and no fanfare because the superstar driver with all the talent is 5 laps down...AGAIN. Yep, she sucks alright. When you don't perform, you get what you deserve. And she doesn't perform, period. Now go away unless you have a valid point to make.

dario didn't win anything in nascar either so i guess by your estimation - he's a crap driver too.

i said i wasn't going to post here again but you set the chellange

Danica has 1 win, 16 top 5s, and 46 top 10 finishes. in addition, she has 3 pole positions, she finished 2nd in bell isle in 2007 and her win was at Twin Ring which anyone will tell you is a drivers oval.

and you lot think she is not qualified to be there. come on - give me a break!!

[SoCalPVguy]

and you lot think she is not qualified to be there. come on - give me a break!!

I do not think any one in this forum " thinks she is not qualified to be there".. What I and most forum posters chafe at is the over-hype by the media and certain posters that think she will be winning very pole, every race, every championship, when the past performance indicators are in no way even close to that level of performance.

[markabilly]

close one thread bashing and arguing over whatever, if any, talent DP possesses, a thread that spanned a total of three months. Only to start another thread about why we can not continue bashing her in the old thread, because she is so baaadddad.

well as long as there are things such as this, and folks watching, there will always be her:

[size=100]"Watch now to discover the upside of failure through Danica Patrick"
http://googleads.g.doubleclick.net/aclk?sa=L&ai=B_wMGEE7jTJ7ZDM6e6QbGkZGlDfyzqtsBmveLpA7AjbcB8O YXEAIYAiCT2v8BKAM4AFCplsePA2DJrouN5KTAE7IBGHd3dy5t b3RvcnNwb3J0Zm9ydW1zLmNvbboBCTcyOHg5MF9hc8gBAdoBPm h0dHA6Ly93d3cubW90b3JzcG9ydGZvcnVtcy5jb20vZm9ydW1z L3Nob3d0aHJlYWQucGhwP3Q9MTQwMzc5yALU1LcVqAMByAMX6A O0AegDpwboA78B9QMAAwDE&num=2&sig=AGiWqtzg2AudhcxZFUjNgBkgLL6NwCCyRA&client=ca-pub-5542204104698391&adurl=http://pixel1097.everesttech.net/1097/rq/3/c_13fd657d4955d47d10e1ea8a99fcb0dc_3740177008/url%3Dhttp%253A//dreams.honda.com/stories/failure-the-secret-to-success/&nm=22

(right off our very own website is the ad, as she is even helping to pay to keep this old forum going....you all are such a bunch of folks lacking proper gratitude :o

of course, I just watch the signature, and wonder who dropped the soap... :eek:

[TURN3]

dario didn't win anything in nascar either so i guess by your estimation - he's a crap driver too.

i said i wasn't going to post here again but you set the chellange

Danica has 1 win, 16 top 5s, and 46 top 10 finishes. in addition, she has 3 pole positions, she finished 2nd in bell isle in 2007 and her win was at Twin Ring which anyone will tell you is a drivers oval.

and you lot think she is not qualified to be there. come on - give me a break!!

Correct, she is not qualified to be racing at the top level of motorsports based on my criteria. It is a sad fact that sponsorship is the SOLE qualification these days. You posted her stats, yet you obviously are oblivious to some of the circumstances surround them. For example, 3 poles. Do you have any idea how many of those she actually won? Try me on that one. How many of those results have come at a time when the series had 17 cars with only 6 competitve ones? How many came while Honda admitted to having their most advanced technology in her car? How many other drivers had a "test" steering rack on road courses (yes at Detroit)? How have those road course results been without that steering rack? Her lone professional win, quietly swept under the rug how the entire field and Tim Cindric assumed she was a lap down. How many on track passes has she made the past 3 years on road courses? At Indy? How often is she at the front challenging for he lead? How often is she on "alternate strategy"? Why would somebody be on "alternate strategy". Why has every team she's ever been on gone backwards from where they were before she got there? Why are those teams always in turmoil?

It is pretty simple to see. Auto racing is entertainment these days, no longer a sport. What Indycar has offered us with Danica is "entertainment", not athletic ability. You don't see female drivers like Simona getting all the trick gadgets to get her to mid-pack in one of the most well funded cars on the grid. Yet she has impressed all of her peers. Why is it that Danica's peers can't stand her. Ed Carpenter for one has never held anything back with her. Scott Dixon calls her a menace on national TV (before Versus, lol). Dario has been heard on the radio saying if she ever blocks him like that again he'll put her in the wall. Yep, Dario Franchitti who is as calm and collected as anybody.

Speaking of Dario and his NASCAR foray, his Cup team never had a chance according to Chip. Key word...CUP. Danica is jerking around with a championship caliber crew and equipment in NATIONWIDE. Dario ran quite well in limited Nationwide races, usually on the lead lap and had led laps with a couple of top 10's and a top 5. And that was in less than 14 races, Danica hasn't finished a race yet for Christ sake.

She is not a professional caliber driver, period. There are 20 free agent and up & coming drivers available out there that would put at least 1/3 of today's grid to shame. Shame is the perfect work for her. The Carl Pavano of auto-racing. Getting paid with no results.

Get some facts that actually support your point or don't post about this topic. You obviously don't know the dept of what you're talking about.

[glauistean]

Starter...it was all that...and it was fun..

Sigh...I hate it when the Moddy has a point.....

And there you go again.

[downtowndeco]

I'm w/you Subaru. It's beyond me why there is so much animosity and jealosy towards her. She's a decent, solid driver who can stay out of trouble and more times than not bring home the car in a decent position.

Wasn't it the 09 season that she beat all of her teammates in the final points? That has to be worth something. And her run against Kannan in the last race? Come on, that was a solid run. That her critics can't even begin to be fair minded about it says much more about their insecurities than it does her abilities as a driver.




dario didn't win anything in nascar either so i guess by your estimation - he's a crap driver too.

i said i wasn't going to post here again but you set the chellange

Danica has 1 win, 16 top 5s, and 46 top 10 finishes. in addition, she has 3 pole positions, she finished 2nd in bell isle in 2007 and her win was at Twin Ring which anyone will tell you is a drivers oval.

and you lot think she is not qualified to be there. come on - give me a break!!

[downtowndeco]

Danica Patrick? Gets a big check to run in Indycar & just ran a heck of a race against a very strong teammate & beat him, has run damn well in the Indy 500 and almost won it, is the highest paid personality in AOWR & is willing to lay her ass on the line at 225 mph 2" away from the wall.

Her critics? Keyboard jockies.

Viva Danica & DF. : )


Correct, she is not qualified to be racing at the top level of motorsports based on my criteria. It is a sad fact that sponsorship is the SOLE qualification these days. You posted her stats, yet you obviously are oblivious to some of the circumstances surround them. For example, 3 poles. Do you have any idea how many of those she actually won? Try me on that one. How many of those results have come at a time when the series had 17 cars with only 6 competitve ones? How many came while Honda admitted to having their most advanced technology in her car? How many other drivers had a "test" steering rack on road courses (yes at Detroit)? How have those road course results been without that steering rack? Her lone professional win, quietly swept under the rug how the entire field and Tim Cindric assumed she was a lap down. How many on track passes has she made the past 3 years on road courses? At Indy? How often is she at the front challenging for he lead? How often is she on "alternate strategy"? Why would somebody be on "alternate strategy". Why has every team she's ever been on gone backwards from where they were before she got there? Why are those teams always in turmoil?

It is pretty simple to see. Auto racing is entertainment these days, no longer a sport. What Indycar has offered us with Danica is "entertainment", not athletic ability. You don't see female drivers like Simona getting all the trick gadgets to get her to mid-pack in one of the most well funded cars on the grid. Yet she has impressed all of her peers. Why is it that Danica's peers can't stand her. Ed Carpenter for one has never held anything back with her. Scott Dixon calls her a menace on national TV (before Versus, lol). Dario has been heard on the radio saying if she ever blocks him like that again he'll put her in the wall. Yep, Dario Franchitti who is as calm and collected as anybody.

Speaking of Dario and his NASCAR foray, his Cup team never had a chance according to Chip. Key word...CUP. Danica is jerking around with a championship caliber crew and equipment in NATIONWIDE. Dario ran quite well in limited Nationwide races, usually on the lead lap and had led laps with a couple of top 10's and a top 5. And that was in less than 14 races, Danica hasn't finished a race yet for Christ sake.

She is not a professional caliber driver, period. There are 20 free agent and up & coming drivers available out there that would put at least 1/3 of today's grid to shame. Shame is the perfect work for her. The Carl Pavano of auto-racing. Getting paid with no results.

Get some facts that actually support your point or don't post about this topic. You obviously don't know the dept of what you're talking about.

[Easy Drifter]

Yes I am a keyboard jockey now. But I raced for 9 years in the 60's and had several friends killed. Too many.
It was a h--- of a lot more dangerous then but racing is always going to be dangerous. In one car my right knee rested against one of my aluminum fuel tanks which was outside the chassis protected only by the fibreglass body. Lap belts only. No full face helmets and no nomex at first. Track safety was very questionable.
It was the norm.
I do not question that Danica can drive a race car fairly fast. I do question if she can actually race except on very rare occasions.
Quite few people on here know my real name as I write under it on the blog and I do get paid to write there.
There are several other ex racers on here.

[electron]

some of you are so obsessed with this chick and the bashing hobby, it hurts the brain.
but as someone else already said, the same some of you always have the witty replies, so whatever.

[beachbum]

Yes I am a keyboard jockey now. But I raced for 9 years in the 60's and had several friends killed. Too many.
It was a h--- of a lot more dangerous then but racing is always going to be dangerous. In one car my right knee rested against one of my aluminum fuel tanks which was outside the chassis protected only by the fibreglass body. Lap belts only. No full face helmets and no nomex at first. Track safety was very questionable.
It was the norm.
I do not question that Danica can drive a race car fairly fast. I do question if she can actually race except on very rare occasions.
Quite few people on here know my real name as I write under it on the blog and I do get paid to write there.
There are several other ex racers on here.I am pretty much in the same boat, having been involved in motorsports in various capacities for about 15 years, mostly with 2 wheels. Lost a few friends to accidents along the way, got to know many nobodies, became friends with quite a few champions, and worked for a profession female racer. Now, just a fan. But working on either side of pit wall does give a different perspective than most fans ever see.

A agree with your assessment. There is little doubt in my mind that Danica has natural talent. When she was first pushed on the scene, I was impressed with her very quick hands and car control. On tracks that are pretty much flat out, her ability to hold the throttle down and hang on when others backed off was / is impressive. Initially, she looked like maybe one female who could contend at the front. Even today, she still has some of that as she showed at Texas and Homestead this year. So why don't I like her?.

Like many, I am tired of the hype, especially when it is pretty easy in the modern age to dig behind the PR and find other information. All PR embellishes he facts, but some of hers goes beyond embellishment and contradicts the known facts, and some seems almost completely manufactured. Having been in racing and understanding the psychological requirements and maturity needed to race at the professional level, I was a bit shocked by her almost child like attitudes and behaviors. That goes from the foot stomping to pleading with Rahal on TV to let her try to go for the pole in her first Indy, when her previous run was very much on the edge and conditions had deteriorated. Rahal knew that was recipe for disaster, but she didn't. Some have praised her for her confrontations with other drivers, but to me they seem more like a pouting child whining when they don't get their way. I noticed that most other racers didn't run close to her or race her very hard in the early days in Indy Car. In my mind, that is a clue that they didn't trust her. Carpenter was probably the first to race her hard and then her lack of racing skills really became obvious as she almost always backed off or wondered off the racing line.

She can drive, and when she is running alone, she does ok. But racing others? It is almost amazing to me that after 10 years of professional racing, she still hasn't learned some of the fundamentals, such as setting up a pass, running in a pack cleanly, the give and take in traffic, and basic car setup skills. She certainly hasn't learned to "play well" with others and still drives like she is the only driver on track with no consideration for anyone else. IMHO, that is why she has had so many incidents in NASCAR. She seems almost oblivious to other drivers. She seems to think she is "special".

Someone is bound to bring up the usual statistics, and the handful of good runs to "prove" how good she it. Did she outrun TK at Homestead? Yes, she did. She also ran him all over the track and a lessor driver than TK would have had them both in the wall. She has had moments of "red mist" where the raw talent shows. That is not the issue. She has also shown how to cruise in mid pack and collect points.

But she has one other advantage that very few racers have had for a full career. Staring in FF, she has always driven top equipment, often superior equipment. Unlike most young racers, she hasn't had to work her way up the ladder by proving herself at every stage and worrying that any failure could mark the end of that effort. When she picked up Rahal as a mentor, she knew she was going to Indy Car, regardless of results. In one sense, she is also an embarrassment to women in racing who worked for decades to be taken seriously as equals and professional racers. Instead, she played the "tramp" card to get attention, and then never had to really prove her racing skills.

I said in a forum early this year that the foray into NASCAR would be a big story. These guys don't care what the hype is, and deficiencies are very hard to hide. Either she was going to prove she is a professional racer, or prove she is a poser with a modicum of speed but few racing skills. If she had done well and progressed, it would have been a huge positive story, and many of her detractors would be eating crow. Instead, she lived up to her history and now many NASCAR fans look at her as an annoying novelty act lingering at the pack of the pack with the low budget teams and start-and-parks and getting caught up in avoidable incidents.

She may be a celebrity, but IMHO, she isn't a top professional racer.

Instead, she detracts from my enjoyment as a racing fan as I have to be subjected to the manufactured attention she doesn't deserve, while real talent often get ignored. I have noticed a trend in the NASCAR coverage, even on ESPN, to talk more about other young drivers who are showing true racing talent. Perhaps that is one good thing to come out of this Danica experiment. Maybe the only good thing.

But I do have to admit that reading what the celebrity worshipers and polishers write about her is often entertaining. The efforts they go to to attack anyone who disagrees with their blind adulation is often "out there" :)

[SarahFan]

Honest question for the class.....*starter? Why no poll option here?

Had the sport not been split, had sponsors and manufacture dollars not dwindled to zero, had top level paid drivers never became a thing of the past, had tv ratings not reached all time lows... Etc


Who here thinks Danica would have made it to, and spent the amount of time she has, at the percieved top level of American open wheel racing?

[beachbum]

Honest question for the class.....*starter? Why no poll option here?

Had the sport not been split, had sponsors and manufacture dollars not dwindled to zero, had top level paid drivers never became a thing of the past, had tv ratings not reached all time lows... Etc


Who here thinks Danica would have made it to, and spent the amount of time she has, at the percieved top level of American open wheel racing?Good question. But the clock can't be rolled back to change the past. It is what it is.

Speculating on the past, if a bunch of racers hadn't crashed on the last lap of a certain FF race in England, would this thread even exist?

[SoCalPVguy]

Just to bring the discussion back to the original point. The thread was NOT closed because of any posts for or against Danica. It was closed because of the insults aimed directly at another member of this board. Have at Danica all you wish (keeping it decent of course).

Three things:

1. You need to go back and re-read the 303 or so messages in that thread before you locked it. For the first 300 nobody bashed anybody, no poster insulted another poster. Yeah there was some Danica bashing going on... but besides she probably deserves it for her hubris, mediocre talent and over sized hype that doesn't match the results... but -hey- we have the right to comment on the ICS talent or lack of it as we see fit - that's the purpose of the board.

Then a certain un-named poster- who has already said he is going to avoid this very thread because the he didn't like the content finally posts a rediculous post making up what he preceives happened in a race that he could not possibly have facts about on Post #301. He gets slapped down in VERY MILDLY in posts 302, 303. And they you shut down the thread.

Time and time again this un-named poster makes provacative statements that are challenged by the forum members. He (or she as the case may be seeing as we are talking about an un-named person) continually "trolls" for criticism by making outrageous statements and then comes crying and whining back to you about "insults" and time and time again you defend him by issuing private messages, warnings and sanction points. I've seen some poster comment much more insultingly towards others with no reprisal in other cases. Point 1: You give this un-named poster favorable treatment.

2. I am a huge USC Trojan fan. Sometimes for "fun" I post on the ucla bruins message board. Those morons beat me up pretty good !!! If I shared what some of those lamebrains wrote, you'd lock up every thread after the first sentence !!! Ha ha !!! I think its funny !!! Point 2: People that have may stalker creepy rooms with locks of hair and wall photos of a certain married female and post outrageous comments (hypothetically speaking of course, no one specifically in mind) are just asking for a response - Nut up and take it, don't come crying to "daddy" to beat up the bullies.

3. Request (respectively of course) that you un-lock the "ALL Danica ALL the Time" Thread and let us have at it and if any person who may not like the content should not post or read, just like I avoid that darn huffington post . LOLzzzz.

[SarahFan]

Good question. But the clock can't be rolled back to change the past. It is what it is.

Speculating on the past, if a bunch of racers hadn't crashed on the last lap of a certain FF race in England, would this thread even exist?


Not attempting to rewrite history....

For me, and I suspect I'm not alone....

Danica represents all that was utterly ****ed up about the sport I love....

The time has come for healing.... And the sooner danica moves on the better off the sport will be

IMO of coarse

[beachgirl]

Not attempting to rewrite history....

For me, and I suspect I'm not alone....

Danica represents all that was utterly ****ed up about the sport I love....

The time has come for healing.... And the sooner danica moves on the better off the sport will be

IMO of coarse

I'm right with you on this one!

[Mark in Oshawa]

Not attempting to rewrite history....

For me, and I suspect I'm not alone....

Danica represents all that was utterly ****ed up about the sport I love....

The time has come for healing.... And the sooner danica moves on the better off the sport will be

IMO of coarse

I support women in racing....but not this one. This one, has taken every step the other women wont take in terms of debasing the role of women in the sport (using sex and her female status as a weapon in marketing AND demands on the others). Danica quite frankly wants special treatment in how she is raced against. Anyone who has seen her "stomping Danica" act in pitlane and her pouts knows damn well she is performing for the cameras. The hype, the drama and the attitude demeans the role of women in this sport. It is simple, women want to race, then race, and be one of the boys when the flag drops. If things go sour, as they often do, don't pull the hard done by female whine and complain about how the boys are mean. Danica has always asked for respect, but she has never given it.

If the press didn't hype the hell out of her efforts over the years, she probably wouldn't be as hated as she is...

With her latest lack of results in Nationwide, it is clear the NASCAR press isn't as enamored with her as the ICS press are......

Oh yes...my support of Women races around here is known to all my friends and fellow volunteers at Mosport. I have always been supportive of young women trying to break into racing, and it has always bothered me that women haven't gotten always the opportunity but they have to get it the way any of the guys do. Danica is the only female racer really that played the game different, and some might argue that she made it so who cares? I say, if you cant do it the right way, really who are you kidding?

[Jag_Warrior]

Honest question for the class.....*starter? Why no poll option here?

Had the sport not been split, had sponsors and manufacture dollars not dwindled to zero, had top level paid drivers never became a thing of the past, had tv ratings not reached all time lows... Etc


Who here thinks Danica would have made it to, and spent the amount of time she has, at the percieved top level of American open wheel racing?

Assuming there had been a sleazy company like GoDaddy willing to put her in a car, I think she could have gotten a ride in the old CART series (early-mid 90's, let's say). Heck, Dick Simon would put a chimpanzee in a car if it could write a big enough check. But no top team would have had her and there's no indication she would have been anything but an also-ran in the higher horsepower/lower downforce formula on ovals, and I think she would have been pretty Milka Duno-like on the roadies (heck, that's about all she is in these GP2 like cars they run now).

Like Paris Hilton and certain others who plague our society, Danica is basically a media creation. Many of us hold that opinion. Danica even refers to herself (or her efforts in racing) as "the brand". I don't take it as far as Turn 3; I can't say that she's not qualified to race at this level. But the reason I feel that way is because "this level" is no longer very high. Gone are the days when Formula One WDC's come here and race. Gone are the days when the best F3000/GP2 drivers come here for a few years. Gone are the days when good drivers get good paychecks. We're in the era of ride-buyers and horrible TV contracts. Only in this unhealthy environment is Danica seen as anything special. I guess the Nationwide Series is just using the free PR of having this slouch in a car.

For Electron, Downtowndeco, DanicaFan and anyone else, my issue with Danica is just what I've always said it was: an inordinate amount of attention is paid to a driver whose resume and accomplishments do not support that level of attention. Slorydn1's thread in the NASCAR forum is well titled: "OMG, Danica Broke a Nail!" So when Rusty Wallace and Brad Daugherty gush all over Danica for dropping a puck ("That Danica just ain't afraid of anything, is she?"), of course we roll our eyes. What did Rusty think was going to happen? If Danica had suited up and taken a shot, that would have been one thing. But she dropped the little disk and walked off the ice. What was there to be afraid of? Maybe we do go too far in taking dumps on Danica. But IMO, it's just a counter to the hyperbole that surrounds "The Danica". When supposed automotive or racing writers falsely claim that Danica has been offered an F1 contract and Danica has suggested that she was ready to jump right into NASCAR Sprint Cup a couple of years ago, yeah, it is fun to walk into a room and pop the balloon heads.

P.S. Why do Danica defenders always bring up that she's won more races than some/many of her critics? I criticize Michael Schumacher and people don't say that. Danica has won more pro races than I have and she's faster in an IRL car than I would be... but then again, so is Milka Duno. So their point is lost on me.

[TURN3]

Three things:

1. You need to go back and re-read the 303 or so messages in that thread before you locked it. For the first 300 nobody bashed anybody, no poster insulted another poster. Yeah there was some Danica bashing going on... but besides she probably deserves it for her hubris, mediocre talent and over sized hype that doesn't match the results... but -hey- we have the right to comment on the ICS talent or lack of it as we see fit - that's the purpose of the board.

Then a certain un-named poster- who has already said he is going to avoid this very thread because the he didn't like the content finally posts a rediculous post making up what he preceives happened in a race that he could not possibly have facts about on Post #301. He gets slapped down in VERY MILDLY in posts 302, 303. And they you shut down the thread.

Time and time again this un-named poster makes provacative statements that are challenged by the forum members. He (or she as the case may be seeing as we are talking about an un-named person) continually "trolls" for criticism by making outrageous statements and then comes crying and whining back to you about "insults" and time and time again you defend him by issuing private messages, warnings and sanction points. I've seen some poster comment much more insultingly towards others with no reprisal in other cases. Point 1: You give this un-named poster favorable treatment.

2. I am a huge USC Trojan fan. Sometimes for "fun" I post on the ucla bruins message board. Those morons beat me up pretty good !!! If I shared what some of those lamebrains wrote, you'd lock up every thread after the first sentence !!! Ha ha !!! I think its funny !!! Point 2: People that have may stalker creepy rooms with locks of hair and wall photos of a certain married female and post outrageous comments (hypothetically speaking of course, no one specifically in mind) are just asking for a response - Nut up and take it, don't come crying to "daddy" to beat up the bullies.

3. Request (respectively of course) that you un-lock the "ALL Danica ALL the Time" Thread and let us have at it and if any person who may not like the content should not post or read, just like I avoid that darn huffington post . LOLzzzz.

Well put, and spot on.

[TURN3]

Not attempting to rewrite history....

For me, and I suspect I'm not alone....

Danica represents all that was utterly ****ed up about the sport I love....

The time has come for healing.... And the sooner danica moves on the better off the sport will be

IMO of coarse

Your opinion is shared here.

[SUBARUTEAM]

we agree on one point - danica is far from the best driver in this sport, but she is also not the worst either and does not deserve all the critic she receives.

yes - she is pushed into the media by the series and sponsors - is that her fault?

she gets big money thrown at her - should she say thanks but no thanks and give all the money back?

yes - she is smoking hot - is that a bad thing? should she go to mcdonalds every night to put on some weight?

yes - she has good equipment but so does penske and chip's cars - why do you think they keep winning? is that her fault? should she ask for a crap car instead? she earns a living driving cars - which is a dream job for anyone.

what does she need to do to make you guys happy?

anyway, enough said by me. thanks for the debate guys - it certainly keeps life interesting :-)

[downtowndeco]

As the worlds smallest violin plays I'll just file this under "Boo Hoo isn't life unfair?"


).
For Electron, Downtowndeco, DanicaFan and anyone else, my issue with Danica is just what I've always said it was: an inordinate amount of attention is paid to a driver whose resume and accomplishments do not support that level of attention.

[TURN3]

yes - she is smoking hot - is that a bad thing? should she go to mcdonalds every night to put on some weight?

This is a matter of opinion. Personally, I prefer women that have...well, woman parts. And I've been in the checkout line with her at Whole Foods and believe me, she isn't what the pictures end up looking like.

Yes, Chip and Roger have great equipment and more importantly, they have a great team. AGR did too before Danica got there.

And there has not been enough said by you. You haven't even attempted to answer a single question I asked a couple posts ago.

[garyshell]

what does she need to do to make you guys happy?

Oh that is just too easy of a setup, are you Ed McMahon?

The answer: race. Not just drive around and "bring the car home", race the damn car.

Gary

[SoCalPVguy]

Personally, I prefer women that have...well, woman parts.

I am pretty sure Danica has "woman parts" LMAO

[TURN3]

I am pretty sure Danica has "woman parts" LMAO

LOL, I was trying not to be too specific. How's this, A's are not at the top of the list here. :dozey:

[ICWS]

we agree on one point - danica is far from the best driver in this sport, but she is also not the worst either and does not deserve all the critic she receives.

yes - she is pushed into the media by the series and sponsors - is that her fault?

she gets big money thrown at her - should she say thanks but no thanks and give all the money back?

yes - she is smoking hot - is that a bad thing? should she go to mcdonalds every night to put on some weight?

yes - she has good equipment but so does penske and chip's cars - why do you think they keep winning? is that her fault? should she ask for a crap car instead? she earns a living driving cars - which is a dream job for anyone.

what does she need to do to make you guys happy?

Until the IndyCar Series rebuilds itself as a purely professional racing series (rather than the entertainment series that is has become), like it was before the CART-IRL split, Danica will have trouble making us happy.

IndyCar needs to do several things: they need to make sure all the cars weigh the same (no weight advantages), that the cars are fast enough with minimal downforce so they can't go full-throttle on oval tracks, that all the drivers in the series are there for talent reasons and not for sponsorship reasons, that the drivers receive coverage from the press for their results moreso than for their public image, and that the tracks they race on are on a variety of tracks (short ovals, superspeedways, street courses, road courses) that are all unique and test the drivers' skills to the fullest.

If these things were to happen, and Danica manages to maintain her ride and posts good results through her own talent, then the criticism towards her will go away dramatically. But until this series grows out of the current entertainment-style series (I agree with you on this, Turn3) that it is, there is very little reason for us critics on these forums to back off of our criticism directed towards her and others like her.

I'm glad that Mr. Bernard is taking the series into the right direction and is attempting to restore some of the lost professionalism that IndyCar had; amazing considering he is new to this sport. But those things I listed are some of the biggest keys to making IndyCar more respectable as a racing series.

[Jag_Warrior]

As the worlds smallest violin plays I'll just file this under "Boo Hoo isn't life unfair?"

You can fold it five ways and I'll give you another place you can file it. :)

It has nothing to do with life being fair or unfair. Maybe it's not fair that I was born in a country that offered me more opportunities than if I'd been born in a slum in India. And I'm not going to restate my point for the 50th time... for those who didn't get it the other 49 times. But in short, I believe this series may once again (re)gain the attention of "real" racing fans (and not just those who read People Magazine like it's the Bible) when it is able to promote racers based on their merits and not just on their Q ratings.

[electron]

consider your point is maybe not *the* point. to state it like 50 times (or in 50 threads on maybe 50 boards...) in itself makes it grotesque.

[Anubis]

consider your point is maybe not *the* point. to state it like 50 times (or in 50 threads on maybe 50 boards...) in itself makes it grotesque.

DanicaFan take note...

[downtowndeco]

The difference, and it is a huge difference, is that he is a fan of a driver and enjoys getting out there & cheering his driver on. He does not endlessly post smack about other drivers he does not think are as talented or deserving as his favorite. One is positive energy. The other is negative.


DanicaFan take note...

[SarahFan]

The difference, and it is a huge difference, is that he is a fan of a driver and enjoys getting out there & cheering his driver on. He does not endlessly post smack about other drivers he does not think are as talented or deserving as his favorite. One is positive energy. The other is negative.



But as usual you would be wrong...

Danica fan ..... From his/her cubicle somewhere in brand central has regularly posted the exact same posts slamming milks across a multitude of boards


Danicafan like Indycool before him/her isn't real

[downtowndeco]

One, no need to make a personal insult.

Two, could you please provide the proof that DF is not a real fan/poster?


But as usual you would be wrong...

Danicafan like Indycool before him/her isn't real

[SarahFan]

Who made it personal..... It's a fact, your are wrong more than right

Are you suggesting I wasn't right about Indycool

[downtowndeco]

You want to make it personal? OK. I've been wrong more than right? This coming from a guy who said CART would bury the IRL, that the 500 wouldn't start 33 (just about every May this comes up), CCWS would bury the IRL, the IRL would never be able to get a pay TV deal, the IRL would never be able to get a series sponsor, Sao Paulo would be cancelled, the IRL would be lucky to start 18 cars in 2010 and that there was no way, no how that any other manufacturer would be willing to join the IRL because the ROI was way too low.

Yeah I got it wrong about whether anyone would ever venture to run a new street race here in the US. But I'd still put my record against yours any day.

I don't know Indycool & I don't have any idea whether he was real or not. Furthermore I didn't ask about him. Again, what is your proof DF is not a real fan?



Who made it personal..... It's a fact, your are wrong more than right

Are you suggesting I wasn't right about Indycool

[SarahFan]

You seriously have trouble following along don't you

[downtowndeco]

If you don't want to answer the question ("What proof do you have to your claim that DF isn't real?"), then don't.

If you want keep changing the subject, fine with me. It's no skin off of my back, everyone can see that's what you're trying to do.

But again, please don't feel that you need to be insulting just because we have a difference of opinion.

And with that I'm walking away from this one. You may, if you like, have the last word.


You seriously have trouble following along don't you

[SarahFan]

All the best too you d....see ya at the races!

oh wait. you dont go to races...

I guess we we will just have to settle with discussing the races here on the forum(s)

oh wait again.... you dont ever discuss what actually happens on track ...

OKOKOK... i got it we will just have to settle with discussing Tony's leadership of the sport...

damn, thats not going to work either as he was fired by his sisters....

I guess we will just talk about all the ovals.....that should get us thru half the season anyhow right

[garyshell]

Are you suggesting I wasn't right about Indycool

Yes, I am suggesting that. As much as I disagreed with him I actually became friends with him and exchanged direct emails back and forth. We agreed to disagree and were able to carry on civil discussions of each others views.

But I am not sure exactly what you meant about him, or DF for that matter, not being real. What DID you mean by that?

Gary

[Anubis]

Also missing from the discussion is the realization that what the sport desperately needs is about 100K Danicafans, each rooting for their own favorite driver.

Only if that enthusiasm is tempered with some realism, otherwise it's just zealotry and adds nothing. I'll cheer for Wilson, but I'm not about to convert my flat into a shrine to him. There's a significant difference between being an enthusiastic fan with a favourite driver or team, and copy/pasting the exact same threads to multiple forums over and over again. Every race...same outlandish predictions, same "race thread", same comments, same ludicrous excuses, same format "congratulations to (usually not Danica)", all word for word with no actual discussion about any other aspect of the race. Even his replies are the same over multiple forums, which shows he doesn't actually read any of the threads, he just has a mission to stay on message. When things deviate, he vanishes. That's not enthusiasm, it's PR..

[SarahFan]

Yes, I am suggesting that. As much as I disagreed with him I actually became friends with him and exchanged direct emails back and forth. We agreed to disagree and were able to carry on civil discussions of each others views.

But I am not sure exactly what you meant about him, or DF for that matter, not being real. What DID you mean by that?

Gary



Indycool was on Tony georges irl payroll .... His sole purpose was to divert attention from irl shortcomings and project focus on to cc/carts

Do I have a copy of a paystub or some supersecret internal memo?.... No

But the aowr Internet forum world is a small community.... Maybe 2000-300 strong witha few more fringe posters .... I like you and pretty much every one of the 200-300 knows someone who knows someone..... And indycool posts simply weren't real .... They we propaganda designed to support an agenda

Jan on the other hand.... Nice guy/gap. I exchanged multiple pms and emails with him/her as well

I ammo the opinion that danicafan is employed by the brand..... And his/her posting sole intention is to support the brand and have nothing to co with supporting aowr

I could be wrong

[harvick#1]

Also missing from the discussion is the realization that what the sport desperately needs is about 100K Danicafans, each rooting for their own favorite driver.

no, the sport needs more of 100K fans that root for a driver but has respect for all the other drivers and teams.

when I was at Petit, I was rooting for Audi and not really a fan of the Peugeot but that didn't stop me from talking to the guys from Peugeot in the pre-race and congratulated in the paddock when they won. You may not like a certain team, but you have to show respect to them also for what they do out there.

just IMO, he has the "its never Danica's fault" attitude and when posters saw shes wrong, he blasts everyone that disagrees with her and himself.

[TURN3]

Also missing from the discussion is the realization that what the sport desperately needs is about 100K Danicafans, each rooting for their own favorite driver.

Bulls#*+! This is insulting to me and the other legitimate fans on this forum. What Indycar needs are 100k more fans like us, not some ocd individual out of touch with reality. Starter, whatever your personal fixation is with this poster needs to be set aside. Take a look what everybody are saying here. You make decisions for the forum based on 1 member. There is a certain bias toward the lone person her that doesn't ride the same bus as the rest of us.

Give yourself a demerit for each member having been personally insulted by this comment!

[Jag_Warrior]

consider your point is maybe not *the* point. to state it like 50 times (or in 50 threads on maybe 50 boards...) in itself makes it grotesque.

I already said that I approach the topic of Danica like a mean kid with a sharp pin walking through a room full of balloons. What more do you want? I dated a psychologist (briefly!), so you might as well save the pop psychology implications. She had a PhD. and she couldn't do anything with me. When supposed sports writers (falsely) claim that Bernie Ecclestone offered Danica an F1 seat and others (falsely) claim that Ferrari had her on the short list to replace Schumacher, I consider that "grotesque"... so I guess it all evens out. :p



Also missing from the discussion is the realization that what the sport desperately needs is about 100K Danicafans, each rooting for their own favorite driver.

I don't disagree with that at all. That is what NASCAR Sprint Cup has (and AOWR used to have) that this series does not currently have. On Monday there was a report on CNBC, where an analyst spoke about the reasons that sponsors are giving for continuing to support NASCAR, even with ratings off about 20% this year. And that was it: fan enthusiasm and sponsor/brand loyalty.

Chad/Danicafan is soooo over the top that I've always found him to be kind of a funny, if not an interesting character. Other than the fact that I can't stand his favorite driver, I think we've always gotten along pretty well on here. So yeah, the sport does need more Danicafan-like followers. I just think that the benefit to the sport would be more sustainable if the enthusiasm for various drivers (from media, fans, etc.) was better matched to the actual, RELATIVE accomplishments of said drivers. I mean, some point to NASCAR having the rabid Junior Nation fans. But it also has Tony Stewart, Kevin Harvick, Jeff Gordon, Mark Martin and other drivers with heavy followings. It seems so long ago that it's getting hard to remember, but we used to have that here.

[garyshell]

Indycool was on Tony georges irl payroll .... His sole purpose was to divert attention from irl shortcomings and project focus on to cc/carts

Do I have a copy of a paystub or some supersecret internal memo?.... No

But the aowr Internet forum world is a small community.... Maybe 2000-300 strong witha few more fringe posters .... I like you and pretty much every one of the 200-300 knows someone who knows someone..... And indycool posts simply weren't real .... They we propaganda designed to support an agenda

Jan on the other hand.... Nice guy/gap. I exchanged multiple pms and emails with him/her as well

I ammo the opinion that danicafan is employed by the brand..... And his/her posting sole intention is to support the brand and have nothing to co with supporting aowr

I could be wrong

OK, I see what you mean now. Yes, IC was "on the payroll" at one time and continued to support king George long after he was no longer was working for the speedway. But unlike DF, I do think Jan actually believed what he wrote. And it was after the emails we exchanged and my understanding that he really did believe it that we buried the hatchet and became friends of sorts.

Re: DF, I don't think he works for the brand at all. He is much to delusional for that. I just can't fathom some one shelling out money for that drivel. And to those who suggest we need thousands more like DF, puhleeeeze spare me. We need thousands of realistic fans, not more of DF.

Gary

[SoCalPVguy]

Also missing from the discussion is the realization that what the sport desperately needs is about 100K Danicafans, each rooting for their own favorite driver.

Over the years I have both agreed with some of what you have written, and sometimes I have disagreed with you. I could NOT DISAGREE with you any more about this statement. 100,000 nut cases like the poster in question (no names please as I don't need the sanction points) is exactly what ICS does NOT need !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is more proof positive that you give this poster preferential treatment over us others.

ICS does need: 1. A better TV contract, 2. American drivers, 3. Sponsors, 4. Multiple manufacturers (and note that seems to be starting thankfully). If the stand were full of stalker fans like the person I am suspecting we are talking about I sure wouldn't go.

[downtowndeco]

This board seems like it's turning into one of those where they "countdown" other posters that they disagree with. Mob rule. That's really too bad.

[SoCalPVguy]

This board seems like it's turning into one of those where they "countdown" other posters that they disagree with. Mob rule. That's really too bad.

IMHO the "board" is angry that a perfectly good legitimate discussion thread got locked up by a moderator that favors one poster who baits you and then complains over all the others. just my two cents.

[beachbum]

Also missing from the discussion is the realization that what the sport desperately needs is about 100K Danicafans, each rooting for their own favorite driver.I respectfully disagree. The sport does need 100k fans who cheer for their favorite driver, and even boo at those they don't like. Heck, Indy Car needs 100k fans from anywhere.

But what no performance driven sport are fans who cheer for a driver just because they are a celebrity and not because of performance. That just "cheapens" all of the dedication and hard work others put into becoming great at their craft rather.

When catering to adolescent fantasies is more important than being good, both "professional" and "sport" are lost and racing has become a fake "reality" show on wheels.

[TURN3]

I wouldn't call DF a nut case. Over the top in his enthusiasm, (well, way over the top) sure. He has never been a problem member here. Danica herself doesn't seem to mind, so I really don't get why some of you do. Should she ever slap a restraining order on him, he'll be gone from here too. If you don't like his posts then skip over them and don't read them (put him on your ignore list). I also don't understand what you mean by "preferential treatment". I sanction any poster who is personally insulting toward any other member here, so I don't get the "preferential" part. You keep the personalities, and insults, out of it and you can post most anything you like.

Some times I have to laugh at what goes on over DF. He makes one post about his driver and a group of members make 50 more about that post - thus guaranteeing even more publicity for her. If you want her fame(?)to go away, some of you are your own worst enemy.

BY the way, you don't get sanctioned for talking about Danica or DF. You do for the personal insults. And a second note - contrary to an assertion in one of the posts above, DF does not complain to me about any other poster.

I will say this, DF certainly adds to the entertainment value here much in the same way Danica is in the "entertainment" business. The fact neither adds to the credibility of this forum or Indycar racing happens to be a coincidence I suppose. I think it is sad that this forum has so little street cred and it is basically because of him. Lose him and all others are great, knowledgable fans that can agree and disagree while making logical points.

Please make no mistake though Starter, you absolutely protect DF. I called AnthonyVOP out recently as we went at it along with some others. In good spirit, we're all adults and can handle things within reason. You let those things go. That same type of comment to DF gets a perfectly good thread locked down.

Given that he adds to the entertainment value, maybe you just find it funny to watch what goes on. I can understand that, again it is 50% of the reason I'm here and 100% of the reason I even signed up a few years ago. But he is an adult also. If he's going to blow smack all over the place then you need to let him deal with it instead of beating us all down everytime he pouts. I used the word bias before and that isn't really accurate, you protect him. Maybe you don't realize it but you do. Let him fend for himself for a change. You see how that goes...he pouts and runs off to another forum and gets the same exact treatment. Then we get our street cred back for awhile!

[Easy Drifter]

Ok folks let us just cool it.
I have had a couple of run ins with Starter but he is a very fair mod.
He knows more about racing than most on here do.
This thread is going off topic and beginning to get a little nasty. Can I just ask everyone to cool it.
If DF is not around, and I didn't think he would stay away for long, the predecesor of this thread just about collapsed.
Most of us, but by no means all, have very little use for her, more because of her PR machine than her ability.
I expect I am going to be in a minority here but she is not a bad driver of racing cars. She is, in my opinion, fairly compentent in IC.
But she is not a racing driver!
She drives racing cars and very rarely races.Yes on occassion she does but not often.
DF livens things up. Who cares otherwise?
So after my rambling can we get back to trashing Princess Lapped a Lot and I can go pour another Scotch?

[beachbum]

Ok folks let us just cool it.
I have had a couple of run ins with Starter but he is a very fair mod.
Absolutely agree. With the opinionated people who post here, I would NEVER want to be a mod :)

Besides, you-know-who is quickly becoming yesterday's news. One of the side effect of celebrity is that it can be fleeting when the shine begins to tarnish. And her most loyal fan? On the forums that haven't run him off yet, he is basically treated as comic relief and best ignored. Not a bad idea.

[TURN3]

Starter I'm going to agree and oblige Easy Drifter and move on without commenting on your responses specifically. I do want you to know you're actions have spoken louder than words numerous times and those actions contradict virtually every response you gave. I hope when DF comes trolling back around here again on a regular basis you exercise a little more judgement in terms of what you let him post and/or the responses he gets. It is clear from reading this thread what the loyal and good people of this forum want. I hope that helps. Now moving on.

[garyshell]

It is clear from reading this thread what the loyal and good people of this forum want.

Some of us (me) think if Starter felt there was a need to close the thread then there was a need to close it. I've had my run ins with Starter and suffered my share of the "time outs". But I have never felt he was anything but even handed. YMMV.

Gary

[Mark in Oshawa]

I am for having the Scotch with the Drifter..and saluting DF..who even in his absence can create a stir.

I always find his booster-ism and blind faith in his driver amusing, yet silly; but I think he was just basically harmless. When he attacked other drivers..well it gave us something to talk about.

All I know, is it was great fun while it lasted, but I don't fault Starter's doing what he did....at some point, we have to just pick up and move along.......nothing to see...

[markabilly]

close one thread bashing and arguing over whatever, if any, talent DP possesses, a thread that spanned a total of three months. Only to start another thread about why we can not continue bashing her in the old thread, because she is so baaadddad.

well as long as there are things such as this, and folks watching, there will always be her:

[size=100]"Watch now to discover the upside of failure through Danica Patrick"
http://googleads.g.doubleclick.net/aclk?sa=L&ai=B_wMGEE7jTJ7ZDM6e6QbGkZGlDfyzqtsBmveLpA7AjbcB8O YXEAIYAiCT2v8BKAM4AFCplsePA2DJrouN5KTAE7IBGHd3dy5t b3RvcnNwb3J0Zm9ydW1zLmNvbboBCTcyOHg5MF9hc8gBAdoBPm h0dHA6Ly93d3cubW90b3JzcG9ydGZvcnVtcy5jb20vZm9ydW1z L3Nob3d0aHJlYWQucGhwP3Q9MTQwMzc5yALU1LcVqAMByAMX6A O0AegDpwboA78B9QMAAwDE&num=2&sig=AGiWqtzg2AudhcxZFUjNgBkgLL6NwCCyRA&client=ca-pub-5542204104698391&adurl=http://pixel1097.everesttech.net/1097/rq/3/c_13fd657d4955d47d10e1ea8a99fcb0dc_3740177008/url%3Dhttp%253A//dreams.honda.com/stories/failure-the-secret-to-success/&nm=22

(right off our very own website is the ad, as she is even helping to pay to keep this old forum going....you all are such a bunch of folks lacking proper gratitude :o

of course, I just watch the signature, and wonder who dropped the soap... :eek:


Just to bring the discussion back to the original point. The thread was NOT closed because of any posts for or against Danica. It was closed because of the insults aimed directly at another member of this board. Have at Danica all you wish (keeping it decent of course).


But as usual you would be wrong...

Danica fan ..... From his/her cubicle somewhere in brand central has regularly posted the exact same posts slamming milks across a multitude of boards


Danicafan like Indycool before him/her isn't real


Who made it personal..... It's a fact, your are wrong more than right

Are you suggesting I wasn't right about Indycool


and on and on and on... :dozey: ......my guess, that DF ain't real and is really starter or easy drifter done gone incognitio

OTOH, if IRL had a 100k of solid rock hard fans like DF for rooting for anybody and regardless of who they rooted for, then nobody would be worrying over the future as everyone does now...... :rolleyes:

Indeed, if it were not for DP (and DF), then the number of posts would drop by about 80% around here.....

But back on topic of bashing DP without mercy to which I say, she needs to put a little more curl in her hair as I like that better than the straight hair look........