Bernie Still Wants Medals

[ArrowsFA1]

Bernie Ecclestone plans to make a fresh push to introduce his gold medal system into the sport, after suggesting that the new points system introduced this year has not improved matters.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/86878

[Mark]

and he knows where he can shove his medals too!

[I am evil Homer]

How is having any one of 5 drivers fighting for the title not improved things? Drivers won't start over taking because they'll get gold instead of silver.

[Sleeper]

Further proof that Bernie is well and truly off his rocker.

[V12]

FFS - wish he'd just let it go. If it aint broken, etc.....

If I could make a list of everything that was wrong (or could be improved) in F1 right now, the points system would be nowhere near it.

[Tazio]

Nonsense :dozey:

[Dave B]

Shut up and go away, Bernie.

Nobody wanted this stupid system two years ago, and nobody wants it now. Remind me how close the title battles have been in recent seasons - this year it's particularly wide open - and explain why any sensible person would want to trade in a perfectly good scoring system for Ecclestone's barmy idea.

[Retro Formula 1]

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Go away you silly little man!

[Eunos]

The Medal system was a stupid idea back then, and it's still a Stupid idea now..

Why is that little Troll still going around?, We have 5 Drivers still well in contention for the Title, I fail too see how that is not impressive?

[Robinho]

he says that under the old scoring this season would be the same so therefore the scoring change has not changed things. However it is stupidly close and any 1 of 5 could definately still win.

With the Medal system only really Webber, Alonso and Hamilton on 4, 3 and 3 wins would really be in it, as its unlikely that Vettel or Button are going to be able to pick up 2 wins without any of the other 3 getting at least 1, but with the points as they are the guy who pops up on the podium 3 times, hopefully on the top at least once will probably win it now.

It was a stupid idea then and its still a stupid idea now. he tsill thinks the drivers will try to overtake more with the medal system, failing completley to realise that the cars are too closely matched to make passes in normal circumstances on normal circuits. when they sort the aero out maybe you'll see more passing. another change in the points system won't acheive it.

Bernie, you are becoming a parody of yourself

[gloomyDAY]

Not this crap again!

[Firstgear]

I wonder how implimenting a medal system might change team orders. Would Massa have moved over for Alonso this year if a gold medal was at stake instead of just 25 points?

With the current points system, 2 - second place finishes are worth more than a win right?

but.....

One Gold (win) is worth more in the standings than 20 Silvers (second), so Massa may have been more inclined to stick to his guns and take the win.

[SGWilko]

and he knows where he can shove his medals too!

Ooohhh - does that idea involve Max Mosely? ;)

[steveaki13]

He needs to do something more useful like finding us a Grand Prix in Bhutan :p , to keep his mind busy and stop talking these stupid ideas up.

[inimitablestoo]

Funny how he mentioned this before 2009, and again now, but not 12 months ago, when Jenson would have clinched the title under the medal system well before he actually did...

[F1boat]

Hem, he is bored and wants to annoy people, that's all.

[Nikki Katz]

This is a really terrible idea that he's still trying to railroad through even though he seems to have lost control compared to a couple of years ago.

I doubt that this will pass now - he decided last year that the teams signing the Concorde agreement meant that he could introduce any rules that he liked, so introduced this one by the back door. But it didn't work then and clearly showed that he can't just stomp all over the teams any more. I see no reason why it would work now unless he's prepared to make some other sort of concession.

This is probably Bernie's worst idea, second in recent bad ideas only to Max's suggestion that drivers swap teams every race.

[AndyL]

Shut up and go away, Bernie.

Nobody wanted this stupid system two years ago, and nobody wants it now. Remind me how close the title battles have been in recent seasons - this year it's particularly wide open - and explain why any sensible person would want to trade in a perfectly good scoring system for Ecclestone's barmy idea.

The explanation is simple: Lewis beat Felipe to the title two years ago, and apparently that was such an appalling injustice that the system under which it happened must be torn down.

Oh, sorry, you said any sensible person ;) OK the real explanation is, Bernie wants to put up a stupid idea that everyone will hate so he'll have something to give up in exchange for something else that he actually does want. :vampire:

[VkmSpouge]

I guess this is just a typical Bernie Ecclestone ploy in the world of F1 politics but it really is one of the most annoying ones he keeps using. Also his logic that the medals would close the 2010 championship up is flawed.

[UltimateDanGTR]

F1 2011 the video game should come with a mini game 'run bernie down' mode. would be fun.

[truefan72]

Bernie needs to go

[Jag_Warrior]

OK the real explanation is, Bernie wants to put up a stupid idea that everyone will hate so he'll have something to give up in exchange for something else that he actually does want. :vampire:

That's probably it. :up:

[V12]

This is a really terrible idea that he's still trying to railroad through even though he seems to have lost control compared to a couple of years ago.

I doubt that this will pass now - he decided last year that the teams signing the Concorde agreement meant that he could introduce any rules that he liked, so introduced this one by the back door. But it didn't work then and clearly showed that he can't just stomp all over the teams any more. I see no reason why it would work now unless he's prepared to make some other sort of concession.

This is probably Bernie's worst idea, second in recent bad ideas only to Max's suggestion that drivers swap teams every race.

To be fair, as bad as the medals idea is, it's not even in the same ballpark as the swapping drivers idea.

I'd say Max's standard engine idea was worse too.

And there's plenty worse ideas that HAVE been implemented, like the mandatory pit stop/option tyre thing, control tyres, engine freeze, engine/gearbox change grid penalties, qualifying on the same tyre or fuel load, and the adjustable rear wings due for next year, etc.

The most annoying thing about the medals is that Bernie just won't go away with it, this is the second major time he's brought it up, and it's been roundly panned every time...take the hint...

Still, not defending the medals idea though, its kind of like saying I'd rather get syphillis than AIDS.

[Allyc85]

Bernie still wants shooting!

[Somebody]

Joe Saward's got an interesting theory on why His Name Was Bernie won't shut up about this... http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2010/09/23/bernie-f1-medals-and-the-olympic-games/

[gloomyDAY]

Joe Saward's got an interesting theory on why His Name Was Bernie won't shut up about this... http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2010/09/23/bernie-f1-medals-and-the-olympic-games/An Olympic sport?

Yeah, and how are 2nd and 3rd world countries supposed to come up with a few hundred million dollars to develop and build an F1 car? Honestly, I think F1 can do without the Olympics and instead focus on exploiting the "internet" and "HD television" to hook more fans.

[Tazio]

So if F1 becomes an Olympic sport they would most assuredly give medals :rolleyes:

Since the event won't resemble an entire F1 season what good would bringing them into a proper season do? :dozey:

[Valve Bounce]

I just thought I'd share this with you, and this thread about Bernie seems the most appropriate place to do so. There is an absolute farce going on in Delhi's preparation for the Commonwealth Games and the Delhi Chief Minister's name is Sheila tihskiD, the last name is spelt backwards so that it will not be censored out. She must be related to Bernie in a previous life. :p : :D :rotflmao:

[Saint Devote]

I agree with Bernie.

This sport is about winning - at least thats what Villeneuve and Senna thought and so does Schumi.

Gilles openly did not care about the championship and Senna was only interested in winning - along with Ron Dennis that "second is the first of the losers".

I would be very surprised if Schumi was not positive about the idea.

True, times change but really - even if points are given for 10th place - its still 10th and nothing to be proud of.

ACBC always stated that the champion ought to be the driver that won the most GP's - and I am sure Mansell would have gone for it.

The driver with the most wins is champion and medals instead of those ugly trophies that belong in the 19th century - the trophies from Interlagos 2009 were an utter diagrace - excellent idea.

[Saint Devote]

What a bunch - all this badmouthing Bernie and worse ..... you people are class acts.

This board is a disgrace.

[Valve Bounce]

I wonder if Jody Scheckter would agree with Bernie's concept.

[Saint Devote]

I guess this is just a typical Bernie Ecclestone ploy in the world of F1 politics but it really is one of the most annoying ones he keeps using. Also his logic that the medals would close the 2010 championship up is flawed.

Its no ploy.
Why is his reasoning that the medals would close the 2010 flawed?

After all the current point system skews points history as well as giving a misleading picture at first look of the championship tally and, scores points for places that have no business to be considered an achievement.

Inflation, whether currency or anything else, in this case points, devalues and discourages - why fight for 6th whe 10th gives the point needed?

[AJP]

What a bunch - all this badmouthing Bernie and worse ..... you people are class acts.

This board is a disgrace.

If this board is such a disgrace...why are you here?

[Valve Bounce]

What a bunch - all this badmouthing Bernie and worse ..... you people are class acts.

This board is a disgrace.

Boo hoo hoo :bigcry:
Now I'm upset, weally weally upset
That bad, bad pudy tat made us cry :bigcry:

[Tazio]

I wonder if Jody Scheckter would agree with Bernie's concept.

:s ailor: Or Rudolf Caracciola!!!! :kiss:

[Saint Devote]

I wonder if Jody Scheckter would agree with Bernie's concept.

I have no idea what Jody would say.

But Jody's approach was to win the title according to the rules and approach required.

In the same vein, any championship that excludes the name Stirling Moss is deeply flawed.

But honestly, I dont care about the championship - however it has become inflated and nowadays, GP wins are secondary so it seems - Bernies idea would refocus and make winning the REQUIREMENT.

[Saint Devote]

If this board is such a disgrace...why are you here?

I am not a quitter.

[AJP]

I am not a quitter.

Oh please...

[Valve Bounce]

I have no idea what Jody would say.

But Jody's approach was to win the title according to the rules and approach required.

In the same vein, any championship that excludes the name Stirling Moss is deeply flawed.

But honestly, I dont care about the championship - however it has become inflated and nowadays, GP wins are secondary so it seems - Bernies idea would refocus and make winning the REQUIREMENT.

Oh! that' s not what you said about how happy you were that Jody Scheckter won the championship in a Ferrari at Monza. But according to Bernie's points system and your reasoning, Alan Jones would have been champion that year.

[BUT[/b] you are allowed to change your story to suit the circumstance - we all understand. :rolleyes:

[Valve Bounce]

Bernie is a greedy weasel!!

[Tazio]

I am not a quitter.
If you suddenly disappeared I swear to god I would kick the $h1+ out of anybody that called you a quitter.
I'm talkin' KnuckleSandwhices raining down like hailstones in Oklahoma baby!! :arrows: :s mokin:

[F1boat]

What a bunch - all this badmouthing Bernie and worse ..... you people are class acts.

This board is a disgrace.

This is pure trolling. In democracy people have the right to express their opinion and the opinion of the majority is that Bernie's suggestion is absolutely stupid. If you agree with him, all power to you, but I personally think that consistency is equally important to winning. And about what drivers think... Michael is here and we can wait to hear his opinion, the other guys you mentioned are dead and it is pointless to speculate what they would have said. Besides, I am stunned that you care so much what Senna thinks as in other posts who have badmouthed him badly and seem to like Alain Prost (who, BTW, had a sensible approach, balanced between winning and consitency).

[Big Ben]

This is pure trolling. In democracy people have the right to express their opinion and the opinion of the majority is that Bernie's suggestion is absolutely stupid. If you agree with him, all power to you, but I personally think that consistency is equally important to winning. And about what drivers think... Michael is here and we can wait to hear his opinion, the other guys you mentioned are dead and it is pointless to speculate what they would have said. Besides, I am stunned that you care so much what Senna thinks as in other posts who have badmouthed him badly and seem to like Alain Prost (who, BTW, had a sensible approach, balanced between winning and consitency).

Hold your horses boy... this ain't no speculation, mister saint is the messenger of all the dead drivers. didn't you know that?... after all, all saints are dead so he must be annoying them too, I think... fortunately only this one decided to spend the eternity flooding this disgraceful forum

And back to the topic... I think BE must senile by now or he's having some real plans behind this idea. How about that sainty? How does that make you look if BE is only pushing this ridiculous ideas to make everyone accept a little less stupid one?

[inimitablestoo]

I've had a thought about Bernie's logic... perhaps he's got a surplus of gold, silver and bronze knocking around and needs to offload it somehow. Most people of his age sit around watching daytime TV, where there are constant ads telling you you can get large amounts of cash for your gold - maybe he could get in touch with them!

On a similar vein, Hispania might try getting in touch with webuyanycar.com ;)

[Saint Devote]

:arrows: :s mokin:

:D

[Saint Devote]

This is pure trolling. In democracy people have the right to express their opinion and the opinion of the majority is that Bernie's suggestion is absolutely stupid.

Which is why no free nation is a democracy. Have you forgotten the lesson of Aristotle who extolled the rationality of constitution - he wrote 138 as I recall.

Hence, it is not what the majority declare, it is what a Constution based on reason and not emotionalism [what the majority says] that rules.

It is why the Athenian, Solon the Lawgiver invented the Supreme Court - the problem that Aristotle always wrestled with being judges appointed for life!

The remark above about Bernie, you imply, is the truth, because the majority say so. Ptolemy is smiling and Copernicus is crying for you have just declared that the sun rises and sets.

[Saint Devote]

I've had a thought about Bernie's logic... perhaps he's got a surplus of gold, silver and bronze knocking around and needs to offload it somehow. Most people of his age sit around watching daytime TV, where there are constant ads telling you you can get large amounts of cash for your gold - maybe he could get in touch with them!

On a similar vein, Hispania might try getting in touch with webuyanycar.com ;)

Bernie is not like people his age - he has never been like anyone his age, from the time at the age of 13 he setup his first business and sold it for millions, through his time at university leaving as a BSc graduate, his following businesses including the biggest motorcycle auction business in the UK, to property development and back into f1 where he has built it into the mega industry it is today.

Bernie had never been like other people his age - what a compliment you have bestowed upon Mr. Ecclestone :D

[inimitablestoo]

Most people his age aren't spouting such regular nonsense for another few years, either... ;)

[Saint Devote]

Most people his age aren't spouting such regular nonsense for another few years, either... ;)

I disagree with you about BCE - but your comment is very funny :D :rotflmao:

[Saint Devote]

I see what you are saying. Its the short silver haired guy, who is slightly odd, not like anyone else, who eventually graduates (this I wasn't aware of as I thought he left school at 16), and works his way into promoting the worlds most prestigious form of motorsport, and a championship you don't care about. Not bad really, its the little ones you have to watch.. :p

:D "About half-actual size" [as DSJ used to quip] - you DEFINITELY have to watch those!

Napolean and Jenks too??!!

[555-04Q2]

The medals idea is such a stupid idea no sane person would ever agree to it. I can't see drivers or teams agreeing to it.

[Valve Bounce]

Bernie is still a sleazy greedy weasel.

[jens]

At times I feel Bernie is just trying to create controversy and headlines, and isn't thinking those things seriously.

[F1boat]

Which is why no free nation is a democracy. Have you forgotten the lesson of Aristotle who extolled the rationality of constitution - he wrote 138 as I recall.

Hence, it is not what the majority declare, it is what a Constution based on reason and not emotionalism [what the majority says] that rules.

It is why the Athenian, Solon the Lawgiver invented the Supreme Court - the problem that Aristotle always wrestled with being judges appointed for life!

The remark above about Bernie, you imply, is the truth, because the majority say so. Ptolemy is smiling and Copernicus is crying for you have just declared that the sun rises and sets.

So we have to bow to you opinion, as you seem yourself as the Copernicus of F1.
LFMAO!

[Valve Bounce]

Which is why no free nation is a democracy. Have you forgotten the lesson of Aristotle who extolled the rationality of constitution - he wrote 138 as I recall.

Hence, it is not what the majority declare, it is what a Constution based on reason and not emotionalism [what the majority says] that rules.

It is why the Athenian, Solon the Lawgiver invented the Supreme Court - the problem that Aristotle always wrestled with being judges appointed for life!

The remark above about Bernie, you imply, is the truth, because the majority say so. Ptolemy is smiling and Copernicus is crying for you have just declared that the sun rises and sets.

You forgot Fullabull, the head honcho in your world of bovine manure.

[Saint Devote]

So we have to bow to you opinion, as you seem yourself as the Copernicus of F1.
LFMAO!

:D supportive of his truth - one does not bow to philosphical truth, it is recognized through logic - Aristotle.

And do you know who will be the most philosophical truthful people tomorrow, Sunday? The 24 men in their racing cars.

If you ever read in depth interviews Senna had with Gerald Donaldson, you will see how he spoke in philosophical terms as well as religious. Senna was an intellectual and people such Jo Ramirez called him "The Philosopher" versus Prost "The Professor".

Bernie Ecclestone making f1 into the magnificent success it is, with the most glamorous and beautiful Marina Bay grand prix is a great example too and that he wants medals is the most rational idea too.

I have read here that it would not be popular, but nobody has provided ANY reasons why not.

[maximilian]

Something is not popular when people don't like it. No other reason needed.

For ages, Grand Prix winners have raised some sort of chalice or trophy over their heads, and racers scored points for finishes.

No reasons need to be given for keeping the status quo, as it has been in use, proven and liked by competitors as well as fans over many decades.

Reasons have to be given for changing it, and the resons that have been given were not compelling at all. Thus, the vast majority of people didn't support the idea, including the competitors themselves.

As such, the idea is rubbish! ;)

[Saint Devote]

Something is not popular when people don't like it. No other reason needed.

For ages, Grand Prix winners have raised some sort of chalice or trophy over their heads, and racers scored points for finishes.

No reasons need to be given for keeping the status quo, as it has been in use, proven and liked by competitors as well as fans over many decades.

Reasons have to be given for changing it, and the resons that have been given were not compelling at all. Thus, the vast majority of people didn't support the idea, including the competitors themselves.

As such, the idea is rubbish! ;)

So you say that tradition is a good enough reason.

Well, what about when Dan Gurney was the first driver to spray champagne? Could not the argument be made that it is just not done and it is a waste of good champagne?

I think drivers receiving medals is far more in line with great sporting events and is so much more professional.

The sight at the end of the season with the drivers displaying all the medals around their necks for wins would be a great image.

:D Frequently, people have to be dragged into the future and then they get used to idea. It has always been the case in motor racing.

[maximilian]

So you say that tradition is a good enough reason.

Well, what about when Dan Gurney was the first driver to spray champagne? Could not the argument be made that it is just not done and it is a waste of good champagne?

Tradition is not a good enough reason, as we sadly see only too often in all aspects of life where human rights are trampled in the name of "tradition", but that's a different discussion altogether. :p

The good enough reason is that people like it, and the lack of a real compelling reason to change it at all.

Yah, I think it's a waste of champagne every time, but F1 is wasteful in general, so it fits the image. The reason it caught on, and has remained a new tradition for decades now is, people liked it! :D

[Saint Devote]

Yah, I think it's a waste of champagne every time, but F1 is wasteful in general, so it fits the image. The reason it caught on, and has remained a new tradition for decades now is, people liked it! :D

I would disagree that f1 is wasteful - but people do like the champagne spraying, especially of they are caught IN the spray - mouths open :s mokin:

[maximilian]

I would disagree that f1 is wasteful
I feel that it is in many ways, example, the constant need/requirement to renovate/upgrade tracks and facilities for hundreds of millions of dollars or build new ones for even more when there would have been nothing wrong with using existing established tracks instead, the general opulence displayed by the F1 circus in some countries that often have a large percentage of very poor population, the rate of fuel consumption, the still mostly ridiculously high team budgets, the hubris exhibited towards new entrants and the franchise system in general (exorbitant entry fees and financial requirements just to get a chance to be considered for entry), the fact that if just the simplest thing on a car breaks, it costs like $100,000 minimum to replace it, etc. :D

[F1boat]

I like the fact that F1 is kinda wasteful. For me, it's like the knights' tournaments of old - glamorous, beautiful, majestic. Kinda stupid sometimes, but not for the people involved. Glamorous.
But about the medals - it is a stupid idea not because it is a new one, but because it will simplify the sport immensely. Winning is crucial as it is now - there are 7 points between 1st and 2nd and in a close championship like this one, it matters a lot. Still, consistency is and should be an important part of the racing too - the champion must be up there all the time, his team must be able to plan everything carefully. Only then we will see a true complex battle of speed and intelligence.
The alternative is to create chaos, which will appeal to the uninformed masses, who watch F1 very rarely and will continue to watch it rarely even with the medals.

[Valve Bounce]

I like the fact that F1 is kinda wasteful. For me, it's like the knights' tournaments of old - glamorous, beautiful, majestic. Kinda stupid sometimes, but not for the people involved. Glamorous.
But about the medals - it is a stupid idea not because it is a new one, but because it will simplify the sport immensely. Winning is crucial as it is now - there are 7 points between 1st and 2nd and in a close championship like this one, it matters a lot. Still, consistency is and should be an important part of the racing too - the champion must be up there all the time, his team must be able to plan everything carefully. Only then we will see a true complex battle of speed and intelligence.
The alternative is to create chaos, which will appeal to the uninformed masses, who watch F1 very rarely and will continue to watch it rarely even with the medals.

Yep!! and I am sure Jody Scheckter would agree with you.

[Dave B]

Medals are for the Olympics, nowhere else, and unless you could make a credible plan for motorsport to become an Olympic sport this idea should remain solely in the minds of Bernie and St. D.

A trophy is a wonderful object to hold up at the end of the race, and to display in the team headquarters. (A caveat here, I do exclude the awful corporate turds which are the Santander logos, these should be banished immediately and substituted with trophies which reflect the character and history of the host race).

Aesthetics aside, the mathematics of the scheme are utter rot. Yes a driver should be rewarded handsomely for winning as opposed to cruising for 2nd, but wasn't that exactly what the 2010 points system addressed so well? We're four (or three, Korea) races from the end and there are still five drivers capable of winning the Championship, seperated by the same amount of points as you score for one solitary victory. That's phenomenal, why would you want to flush that away?

[Saint Devote]

Yep!! and I am sure Jody Scheckter would agree with you.

A driver drives according to the rules at the time governing the championship and that is what Jody did.

Today at Marina Bay it is clear that Hamilton did not, while Vettel did.

[Valve Bounce]

A driver drives according to the rules at the time governing the championship and that is what Jody did.

Today at Marina Bay it is clear that Hamilton did not, while Vettel did.

But according to your reasoning and sustained argument, Alan Jones should have been champion. You can't have it both ways.

[Ranger]

What would medals change anyway?

Alonso and Webber both have 4 wins and would both be leading with medals as well.

If it ain't broke...

[Valve Bounce]

What would medals change anyway?

Alonso and Webber both have 4 wins and would both be leading with medals as well.

If it ain't broke...


..........................leave it alone!!! :up:

[Saint Devote]

What would medals change anyway?

Alonso and Webber both have 4 wins and would both be leading with medals as well.

If it ain't broke...

Well then, who has the most Silver medals and then Bronze :vader:

[Valve Bounce]

Well then, who has the most Silver medals and then Bronze :vader:

Who cares, Walter, Who really cares!!

[TMorel]

A driver drives according to the rules at the time governing the championship.

Unless the rules involve the banning of team orders?

[inimitablestoo]

I suppose we should be grateful. The way things are these days, we could be asked to vote drivers off and then text in who we want to be World Champion at the end of the year :rolleyes:

[Valve Bounce]

Why don't we have the points as we already do, but award the drivers medals on the podium instead of those hideous trophys? Then everybody will be happy. :up:

[steveaki13]

Why don't we have the points as we already do, but award the drivers medals on the podium instead of those hideous trophys? Then everybody will be happy. :up:

Agree about the throphys

Some of the throphys now are just Logo's of the sponsors and are rather boring.

Not like the good old trophy at the British GP.

[Mark]

I don't agree about giving them medals. That's for the Olympics and athletics world championships etc, it's not Formula 1 and never has been. F1 has it's own traditions which have worked well, no need to adopt those of another sport.

I do agree about giving out proper trophies however, the sponsor logo ones look terrible!

[AndyL]

Agree about the trophies

Some of the trophies now are just Logo's of the sponsors and are rather boring.

Not like the good old trophy at the British GP.

The Australian GP trophy's still the best though I reckon.
At Monza Fernando looked like he'd got a free gift for opening a Santander bank account.

[Dave B]

Agree about the throphys

Some of the throphys now are just Logo's of the sponsors and are rather boring.

Not like the good old trophy at the British GP.
Indeed, with the worst offenders being the awful corporate turds handed out at Santander sponsored events.

In fact the Santander ones may breach the FIA's own sporting regulations (http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.nsf/3C9E78D2AAE9B15DC1257617002CF08F/$FILE/Stable%20Sporting%20Regulations%20-%2024%20July%20-%20CLEAN.pdf):



APPENDIX 3
PODIUM CEREMONY

4. TROPHIES
Only 4 trophies will be presented during the podium ceremony:
a) winning driver
b) a representative of the winning constructor
c) second driver
d) third driver.
The trophies, which must be in the form of traditional cups, will be provided by the ASN and must show:

[Robinho]

Well then, who has the most Silver medals and then Bronze :vader:

except Bernie said that in the event of ties it should come down to the points system which will be run in parallel and will decide the positions other than champion.

i get you will defend to the hilt anything that some people say in F1, purely because of who they are, and that you really are short sighted enough to not look beyond people's acheivements and realise that some people, however great they may be, or may have been, are not excluded from saying or doing something stupid now. nor does current stupidity exclude future acheivments.

i have not seen one shred of support from current or past competitors, team bosses, members, pundits, commentators or journalists for this idea, it simply doesn't work. Medals is for the Olympics, for Athletes, if you remember F1 drivers are not athletes apparently.

should you change the rules of Football (soccer), rugby, American football, Basketball, Ice Hockey, Rallying, Speedway in fact pretty much any other sport run with a league or over a season to determine a champion? no, it is not necessary. Occasionally there may be reason to tweak thing to favour a winner more to stop teams playing for drawers, or from cruising for points, but this is extreme, flawed BS of the highest order and has no place in the sport.

[Valve Bounce]

except Bernie said that in the event of ties it should come down to the points system which will be run in parallel and will decide the positions other than champion.

i get you will defend to the hilt anything that some people say in F1, purely because of who they are, and that you really are short sighted enough to not look beyond people's acheivements and realise that some people, however great they may be, or may have been, are not excluded from saying or doing something stupid now. nor does current stupidity exclude future acheivments.

i have not seen one shred of support from current or past competitors, team bosses, members, pundits, commentators or journalists for this idea, it simply doesn't work. Medals is for the Olympics, for Athletes, if you remember F1 drivers are not athletes apparently.

should you change the rules of Football (soccer), rugby, American football, Basketball, Ice Hockey, Rallying, Speedway in fact pretty much any other sport run with a league or over a season to determine a champion? no, it is not necessary. Occasionally there may be reason to tweak thing to favour a winner more to stop teams playing for drawers, or from cruising for points, but this is extreme, flawed BS of the highest order and has no place in the sport.

OBOY!! I take it you do not fully agree with StD.

[Rollo]

Bernie is not like people his age - he has never been like anyone his age, from the time at the age of 13 he setup his first business and sold it for millions, through his time at university leaving as a BSc graduate, his following businesses including the biggest motorcycle auction business in the UK, to property development and back into f1 where he has built it into the mega industry it is today.

Bernie had never been like other people his age - what a compliment you have bestowed upon Mr. Ecclestone :D

Bollocks.
If Bernie hadn't been the one to properly market F1, then someone else would have.

Arguably it could be said that Alan Sugar (the then chairman of Tottenham Hotspur), Greg Dyke of LWT and Rupert Murdoch's BSkyB, undertook a far more difficult job in the marketing of English football.
Football in England in particular during the late 1980s suffered from crumbling stadia, hooliganism and image problems which were only made all the more worse by Hillsborough.

The point is that Bernie isn't particularly special and if he hadn't done it, some other international sports marketing management company would have. Furthermore, any normal firm would have had a succession plan or more specifically a "replacement plan" to fill the key role.

Uncle Harry pissing in the bath
Whoa, pissing in the bath
Uncle Harry pissing in the bath
Whoa, pissing in the bath again
- The Living End

[AndyL]

except Bernie said that in the event of ties it should come down to the points system which will be run in parallel and will decide the positions other than champion.

Bernie's suggestion was originally a straight medals system. The wins-then-points system was the compromise proposed by the FIA in the first draft of the '09 rules if I recall correctly.

[Mark]

Bernie's suggestion was originally a straight medals system. The wins-then-points system was the compromise proposed by the FIA in the first draft of the '09 rules if I recall correctly.

Which was a ridiculous mishmash.
The simple solution would just be to rank according to 1st, 2nd and 3rd places, as said, but if tied on that to then use 4th, 5th, 6th places and onwards you could even count DNFs against, it's quite unlikely there would be any tie break situations if you did it this way, and no need for points.

But it's still stupid, personally I think it should go the other way, with the Olympics adopting a points system for medal tables, perhaps 4 points for gold, 2 for silver, 1 for bronze!

[wedge]

Bernie still hasn't learned much from his Brabham days.

Racing is a complex sport and telling every driver to attack is a silly excuse that there is something wrong with the show which everyone else except Bernie (or if you're new to the sport) realised years ago .

[V12]

I think some people are getting too hung up on the physical idea of medals instead of trophies. I don't think Bernie was ever suggesting that drivers will bow down on the podium after the race to have a medal and ribbon hung round their necks Olympic style. The term "medals" has come into use to describe it to make it easier for people to understand in one word - since it is the system used for ranking countries at the Games - no points, just order by firsts, then seconds if equal, then thirds. For F1 this would presumably then carry on to fourth, fifth, sixth etc. for as long as is needed.

This is how positions are currently decided when drivers/teams are tied on points (e.g. with the new teams battle for 10th, with all on zero points, is probably going to be decided by who can get the most 11ths, then 12ths, 13ths etc.)

I don't mean to sound like I'm defending Bernie, and I'm still against the idea, but not because of the thought of medals literally being handed out.

I have to say though I would prefer a clean "medal" system to the awkward hybrid proposed by the FIA (and thankfully dropped) where only first place in the drivers championship would be determined by the "medal" style system, and everything else on points. Either do it completely, or, preferably, not at all.