Hungarian Grand Prix - goulash!!

[Saint Devote]

I hate to say it but this is Lewis Hamilton's track. When his car is fine he will almost inevitably win pole AND the grand prix.

I reckon a win for the Granadian-Brit on Sunday.

We have gone from the Red Bull estrangement into an uneasy ceasefire - and into an explosive situation a few doors down.

Massa could barely look at Alonso and he was totally cold towards the Ferrari management. Alonso THRIVES in this environment providing HE has the management on his side - totally opposite to what he had at Mclaren.

This is going to be a battle extraordinaire because Alonso loves the Hungaroring and for Massa it is the track where he almost got brained a year ago.

So we have situations now in TWO of the top teams and really only Jense and Lewis at Mclaren where nothng has happened - YET?

Ferrari's updates are working well and Alonso could well be the driver to beat Lewis to pole on Saturday.

Jense races well at this track too.

I thought qualifying at Hockenheim would be electric - at Hunagroringon Saturday it is going to be a virtual thunderstorm!

Aint grand prix racing just wonderful right now?

:D

[Tazio]

I hate to say it but this is Lewis Hamilton's track. When his car is fine he will almost inevitably win pole AND the grand prix.

I reckon a win for the Granadian-Brit on Sunday.

We have gone from the Red Bull estrangement into an uneasy ceasefire - and into an explosive situation a few doors down.

Massa could barely look at Alonso and he was totally cold towards the Ferrari management. Alonso THRIVES in this environment providing HE has the management on his side - totally opposite to what he had at Mclaren.

This is going to be a battle extraordinaire because Alonso loves the Hungaroring and for Massa it is the track where he almost got brained a year ago.

So we have situations now in TWO of the top teams and really only Jense and Lewis at Mclaren where nothng has happened - YET?

Ferrari's updates are working well and Alonso could well be the driver to beat Lewis to pole on Saturday.

Jense races well at this track too.

I thought qualifying at Hockenheim would be electric - at Hunagroringon Saturday it is going to be a virtual thunderstorm!

Aint grand prix racing just wonderful right now?

:D :s ailor: It should be another good track for "The Scuds", and RB's with the possibility of The Boss sticking in in the front two rows. Bunsen is driving very well this season but has to improve his quali pace, especially at this track. Perhaps this is the race where McLaren get their upgrades to work! Dark horse.... Kubinski!

[F1boat]

I think that Ferrari might just win again.

[52Paddy]

I think that Ferrari might just win again.

I'm thinking the same. They've been through enough controversy over the years not to be demorialised by a fine. Personally, I'd like Webber or Button to get their championship campaign back to the front.

[wmcot]

Yeah. I can't wait to get on with the business/sport of F1! ;)

[Retro Formula 1]

Can't see anyone but Bulls and Horses dominating this one. Would be nice but their pace is so much above everyone else.

Of course, if McLaren manage to emulate the effect of their front wings, it could be different.

[AndyL]

Of course, if McLaren manage to emulate the effect of their front wings, it could be different.

I can't imagine they'll have had enough time to do that. More likely at Spa I reckon.

[Saint Devote]

I wonder how Virgin and HRT will approach the weekend after BCE said he expects at least TWO teams to leave the grid:

.... in general this year has been a bit of a nuisance because it has cost money to keep these [struggling] teams in. It has cost a lot of money to pay for them to compete.

The bottom line is they haven't really and truly given us value for being there. If suddenly these teams don't turn up at races then I don't think the crowds will get any smaller, or the TV sets will turn off, or the newspapers will stop writing, will they?

I agree with him. And Bernie never speculates - these teams are COSTING - they are gone!

[Dave B]

We're assuming he means the two slowest teams, but Renault have reportedly asked Bernie for an advance on their TV money and there are rumblings about another team with major sponsorship from a certainly recently baled-out bank.

If it is Virgin and HRT then it would be a shame. Maybe you wouldn't miss them, but for me they add vital character and more importantly four extra race seats to the grid.

[Saint Devote]

We're assuming he means the two slowest teams, but Renault have reportedly asked Bernie for an advance on their TV money and there are rumblings about another team with major sponsorship from a certainly recently baled-out bank.

If it is Virgin and HRT then it would be a shame. Maybe you wouldn't miss them, but for me they add vital character and more importantly four extra race seats to the grid.

I prefer a third car for comopetitive teams.

Bernie explained what the Renault money was about - yes, he is referring to Virgin and HRT.

He said TEN teams are fine as far as he is concerned. He is pleased with Lotus.

[Dave B]

The press conference schedule is interesting: Massa's in on Thursday (along with Barrichello, Kovalainen, Kubica and Yamamoto); then on Friday Stefano Domenicali will have some searching questions to answer when he joins Renault's Eric Boullier, HRT's Colin Kolles, and the man who was most scathing of his criticism after Hockenheim: Christian Horner.

[TMorel]

A third car?
Blimey, Alonso will flip his lid having to demand that TWO cars pull over for him !

[Dr. Krogshöj]

Massa should be strong at the Hungaroring. He was very quick in 2008, only an engine failure robbed him of a dominant victory No hard tyres from Bridgestone this time, but probably a lot of commitment after what happened at Hockenheim.

[Shifter]

I could certainly see Lewis doing well on the Hungaroring -- His cut 'n thrust driving style will really suit the circuit.

[I am evil Homer]

Well he won it in a dog of a car last year so it should go well...Button needs to up his game though.

[DexDexter]

I think that Ferrari might just win again.

Me too, Ferrari were very strong in Hungary last year with a poor car.

[Tazio]

It's looking more and more like it could be a wet one:

http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=379668&FS=F1

http://news.bbc.co.uk/weather/forecast/5004

[Garry Walker]

hopefully alonso crashes out (no injury of course)

[Tazio]

hopefully alonso crashes out (no injury of course)

:s ailor:

[Saint Devote]

A third car?
Blimey, Alonso will flip his lid having to demand that TWO cars pull over for him !

:eek: :D
Didn't think of THAT!!

[Saint Devote]

I'm thinking the same. They've been through enough controversy over the years not to be demorialised by a fine. Personally, I'd like Webber or Button to get their championship campaign back to the front.

I agree with you there.

The biggest disappointment this season so far for me has been Button's retirement from the Monaco GP - to his credit he did not utter a single criticism of his crew publicly or in the garage - but then that is Jenson's style even during the morale sapping difficult days of Honda he never did anything like that.

[Saint Devote]

:s ailor: It should be another good track for "The Scuds", and RB's with the possibility of The Boss sticking in in the front two rows. Bunsen is driving very well this season but has to improve his quali pace, especially at this track. Perhaps this is the race where McLaren get their upgrades to work! Dark horse.... Kubinski!

I would not be surprised to see real tussle between the Mclarens durng qualifying because both drivers have done well at the track and bith have their strengths in different areas.

Whitmarsh has indeed put together the best pairing in f1 today - its a reflection of Whitmarsh who is definitely, with Ross Brawn, the best in f1 as well.

[woody2goody]

I think Massa will struggle this weekend. He's only ever had one decent race at the Hungaroring, and last year he didn't race at all, so I can't see him getting on the podium, even though I hope he can.

In theory this should be Red Bull's track, and Webber qualified 2nd on the grid for Jaguar in 2003, so he has proved he can be good there. I wouldn't count out Mclaren completely but they won't be able to use their top speed advantage here, so they may be 5th and 6th this weekend. Which order they finish in I'm not sure because it is a drivers' track, favouring Hamilton, but Button has won here before.

It will be interesting to see who sits in the HRTs this week - I'm hoping for Klien and Chandhok but it's pretty difficult to predict their driver lineup these days.

I'm going to predict a good weekend for Sauber - Pedro de la Rosa finished 2nd here in 2006, and their car seems to prefer the twistier and more technical tracks.

Jaime Alguersuari made his debut at this track last year, and finished ahead of his team-mate (who had problems) in a very unspectacular but solid drive. Who would have thought that he would have turned into as good a driver as he has become this year? Hitting Buemi at Hockenheim was his only blemish of the year so far, but I'm not convinced that was completely his fault, as a few cars checked up in front of him.

My predictions for this race: 1. Webber, 2. Vettel, 3. Alonso, 4. Massa, 5. Button, 6. Hamilton, 7. Schumacher, 8. Kubica, 9. Rosberg, 10. de la Rosa

[Tazio]

I would not be surprised to see real tussle between the Mclarens durng qualifying because both drivers have done well at the track and bith have their strengths in different areas.


:s ailor: Schumacher has also done well at this track but we are talking about 2010. Bunsen needs to improve his qualifying, and McLaren need to get their evolutions to work. Otherwise I see Bunsen's only chance at a podium is if it's a wet race, and or the safety car helps him with pit strategy!

[Sonic]

Red Bull all the way this weekend. No monster straights to highlight their "weak" engine and a middle sector that will suit their mega aero package.

McLaren seem at sea with these new wings with at least two senior team members saying they can't get their heads round the designs let alone copy them yet.

[Dave B]

For the latest weather forecasts it's worth bookmarking this page and refreshing often:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/weather/ianfergusson/2010/07/formula-one-weather-forecast-h.shtml

[Tazio]

For the latest weather forecasts it's worth bookmarking this page and refreshing often:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/weather/ianfergusson/2010/07/formula-one-weather-forecast-h.shtml

:s ailor: Great Link Dave...Thanks :up:

[Andy Harrison]

Last week's race was pretty average. The most exciting thing anyone could talk about was 'Team Orders', even though everyone expected it to happen during the race anyway.

Hungary is going to be a different story - I think it could shape up to be be the race of the season...?

Massa is going to have something to prove and I hope it's Hamilton/ Massa/ Webber

Lewis Hamilton on Hungary - http://www.grid1.tv/videos/featured/hamiltons-guide-to-hungary

[555-04Q2]

My top ten prediction:

Vettel, Hamilton, Webber, Massa, Button, Kubica, Alonso, Rosberg, Sutil, Schumacher.

:D

[Saint Devote]

Red Bull all the way this weekend. No monster straights to highlight their "weak" engine and a middle sector that will suit their mega aero package.

McLaren seem at sea with these new wings with at least two senior team members saying they can't get their heads round the designs let alone copy them yet.

Mclaren is definitely asthmatic looking at the German Grand Prix. It does look as though Hungary might be a Red Bull v Ferrari race.

Although both Jense and Hamilton go very well at the Hungaroring - but they have expressed concern that between Silverstone and Hockenheim Mclaren has lost RACE pace.

Strategy could come into its own for example with Jense perhaps going as well as he did on the softs. The Hungaroring is so similar on cars to Monte Carlo acturally.

The essential difference is one that we have seen often with top drivers - Jense always drives within his limit while Hamilton pushes to his limit - in the not so distant days drivers like Hamilton tended not to be around for too long.

[Saint Devote]

:s ailor: Schumacher has also done well at this track but we are talking about 2010. Bunsen needs to improve his qualifying, and McLaren need to get their evolutions to work. Otherwise I see Bunsen's only chance at a podium is if it's a wet race, and or the safety car helps him with pit strategy!

Jense outqualified Hamilton in Germany and afterwards Lewis said that it was as quick as he could go.

People have to understand that Jenson naturally drives within his limit and he will get pole if it coincides - Hamilton pushes all the the time which leaves nothing for error and this is why Lewis' porridge tally is so high relative to Button.

This is a difference between them. For Jense the car HAS to be right and he is more sensitive than Hamilton to changes such as wind direction.

Being able to test in F1 would work extremely well for someone like Jense and possibly this is one of the issues that Schumacher is findiing tough.

[Saint Devote]

In the preview this week to Hungary, Autosport cannot help itself from attacking Ferrari and diminishing Schumi.

But those of us around the world will not be suprised because the British press have always HATED the Scuderia and especially Schumi - especially that Hamilton sycophant, Mark Hughes.

[ShiftingGears]

RBR need a 1-2 here. They need to start taking points off Hamilton because the McLaren team and drivers have been very good at making the most out of their opportunities.

[Tazio]

This is a difference between them. For Jense the car HAS to be right and he is more sensitive than Hamilton to changes such as wind direction.

Being able to test in F1 would work extremely well for someone like Jense and possibly this is one of the issues that Schumacher is findiing tough.

+1
They need to have at least 2 or 3 in-season tests imo

[Tazio]

RBR need a 1-2 here. They need to start taking points off Hamilton because the McLaren team and drivers have been very good at making the most out of their opportunities.
It's not time to get desperate at RBR. They are only 28 points behind the McLarens with 8 races to go, that amount could be made up in one race.
Or they just need to outscore McLaren by a combined 3.5 points a race in these last 8 races, and finish with more race wins. Right now RBR has 5 wins to McLaren’s 4.
What they can't afford to do is lose ground!

[Dave B]

It's nice and dry at the track, with a few hazy clouds around looking distinctly unthreatening. Standard installation laps for everybody, no drama so far apart from a large amount of smoke from the back of Trulli's Lotus.

[Tazio]

Does Button have a problem? and why is the Ferrari making a TC sound through turns?

[Dave B]

Spin for Petrov coming out of the final corner, he stops on the racing line right across the start/finish straight. A few squeaky bum moments as drivers including his team mate blast past him, but he's on his way again.

[Dave B]

Chequered flag.

VET WEB KUB BUT BAR DLR ALO ROS MSC HUL SUT MAS PET KOB DIR BUE ALG HAM TRU KOV GLO DIG SEN







YAM

[Andy Harrison]

Chequered flag.

VET WEB KUB BUT BAR DLR ALO ROS MSC HUL SUT MAS PET KOB DIR BUE ALG HAM TRU KOV GLO DIG SEN







YAM

Nonsense!
Ferrari and Hamilton will be contenders here. McLaren have won the last the races!!!

[Dave B]

It's only practice, we have no idea (well, a few hints ;) ) what programmes the teams are running.

Here are the times:


Pos Driver Team Time Laps
1. Vettel Red Bull-Renault 1:20.976 29
2. Webber Red Bull-Renault 1:21.106 + 0.130 27
3. Kubica Renault 1:22.072 + 1.096 21
4. Button McLaren-Mercedes 1:22.444 + 1.468 17
5. Barrichello Williams-Cosworth 1:22.601 + 1.625 25
6. de la Rosa Sauber-Ferrari 1:22.764 + 1.788 24
7. Alonso Ferrari 1:22.772 + 1.796 25
8. Rosberg Mercedes 1:22.777 + 1.801 25
9. Schumacher Mercedes 1:22.792 + 1.816 26
10. Hulkenberg Williams-Cosworth 1:22.966 + 1.990 25
11. Sutil Force India-Mercedes 1:23.003 + 2.027 19
12. Massa Ferrari 1:23.007 + 2.031 26
13. Petrov Renault 1:23.249 + 2.273 24
14. Kobayashi Sauber-Ferrari 1:23.327 + 2.351 23
15. di Resta Force India-Mercedes 1:23.520 + 2.544 19
16. Buemi Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:23.780 + 2.804 22
17. Alguersuari Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:23.868 + 2.892 28
18. Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes 1:24.075 + 3.099 15
19. Trulli Lotus-Cosworth 1:25.032 + 4.056 22
20. Kovalainen Lotus-Cosworth 1:25.210 + 4.234 23
21. Glock Virgin-Cosworth 1:25.990 + 5.014 21
22. di Grassi Virgin-Cosworth 1:26.686 + 5.710 17
23. Senna HRT-Cosworth 1:26.990 + 6.014 34
24. Yamamoto HRT-Cosworth 1:28.157 + 7.181 24

[Tazio]

The Boss was on an interesting program 15 laps and obviously very heavy :confused:

[Dave B]

Can we rename this team Farce India after another tyre cock-up, this one resulting in a fine:



Force India has been fined 5000 Euros for using a set of tyres on Paul di Resta's car in first practice that were not supposed to be used before Saturday.

The race stewards found that Force India had been in breach of Article 25.4 of Formula 1's sporting regulations when it used a set of prime tyres that should only have been run from Saturday morning's final practice session.

Full story: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85661

[Saint Devote]

First practice does not bode well for anyone other than the RB6 drivers. RBR are never in qualifying trim this early - this IS a Brawn-like dominance.

Nice showing from Kubica - as we should expect.

Looks like Hamilton id doing the race preparation this session and Jense the qualifying.

This circuit is like Monte Carlo without the finesse required at Monaco.

If Jense can work good strategy with his tyre ability - he can win Sunday :-]]

[Saint Devote]

Can we rename this team Farce India after another tyre cock-up, this one resulting in a fine:


Full story: http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85661

I tell you one thing - Adrian Sutil deserves MUCH better than this. I like Petrov and Boullier is satisfied with him, but it will be a travesty if Adrian has to spend another season at FI.

The Mclaren person on loan is is no longer there this season - that is the differerence. The sort of error made at Hockenhein is symptomatic of a much wider disorganization I say.

[Tazio]

FP2
Pos. Driver Team Time Laps
1. Sebastian Vettel Red Bull 01:20.087 33
2. Fernando Alonso Ferrari 01:20.584 34
3. Mark Webber Red Bull 01:20.597 36
4. Felipe Massa Ferrari 01:20.986 33
5. Vitaly Petrov Renault 01:21.195 33
6. Lewis Hamilton McLaren 01:21.308 30
7. Robert Kubica Renault 01:21.375 37
8. Nico Hulkenberg Williams 01:21.623 41
9. Jenson Button McLaren 01:21.730 33
10. Michael Schumacher Mercedes Grand Prix 01:21.773 31
11. Pedro de la Rosa Sauber 01:21.809 38
12. Rubens Barrichello Williams 01:21.844 36
13. Nico Rosberg Mercedes Grand Prix 01:22.039 28
14. Kamui Kobayashi Sauber 01:22.212 37
15. Jaime Alguersuari Scuderia Toro Rosso 01:22.469 43
16. Adrian Sutil Force India F1 01:22.507 22
17. Sebastien Buemi Scuderia Toro Rosso 01:22.602 38
18. Vitantonio Liuzzi Force India F1 01:23.138 36
19. Jarno Trulli Lotus F1 01:24.553 37
20. Timo Glock Virgin Racing 01:25.376 35
21. Lucas Di Grassi Virgin Racing 01:25.669 32
22. Bruno Senna HRT F1 Team 01:26.745 33
23. Sakon Yamamoto HRT F1 Team 01:26.798 32
24. Heikki Kovalainen Lotus F1 01:27.705 5

[Tazio]

If Jense can work good strategy with his tyre ability - he can win Sunday :-]]
:s ailor: Your dreaming!! :rolleyes: :s mokin:

You better be praying for rain! :wave: :p :

A downbeat Button said: "Qualifying is going to be very tricky.

"The Red Bull is just so fast. They did a one minute 20 (seconds), and we didn't get near the low one minute 21s, so I don't know where that time is.

"I feel reasonably happy with the balance of the car, and although there's still more to improve, we're never going to find a second.

http://www.sportinglife.com/others/news/story_get.cgi?STORY_NAME=others/10/07/31/AUTO_Hungarian_Button.html

[mstillhere]

Wow, look at Ferrari. Of course we have to wait for tomorrow but so far it seems that it is going to be a Red Bull Vs Ferrari affair. Alonso was saying that overnight they might be able to balance the car better so that they can get closer to the Red Bull's times. http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/85676

[donKey jote]

I reckon "balance the car better" is code for "fiddle the wing better" :p

[Tazio]

I reckon "balance the car better" is code for "fiddle the wing better" :p

:s ailor: I don't think I like your attitude mister ;)

[Dr. Krogshöj]

I don't think anyone will be able to touch Red Bull but we can always hope that it will be a tight race between Webber and Vettel, hopefully with some wheel to wheel action.

[DazzlaF1]

I don't think anyone will be able to touch Red Bull but we can always hope that it will be a tight race between Webber and Vettel, hopefully with some wheel to wheel action.

Its a good thing the 107% rule isnt in force this year otherwise all 6 of the newbie cars would be well and truly screwed all down to Red Bull being so good around here (if it were the 105% that some people wanted then it would be more than those 6 in trouble). Reminds me in a way of Australia 1997 when the 2 Lola's were already well off the 107% time then Villeneuve put in that stonker of a lap nearly 1.5 seconds faster than everyone else which then gave a DNQ to Diniz (he was later allowed to race)

And it makes me think, with the 107% rule coming back next year, would that give extra incentive for the leading cars to go faster in Q1 in an attempt to make the race easier for themselves (in their eyes) by eliminating potential backmarkers?

Take the Red Bulls out of the equation and at least Virgin and Lotus look at best respectable

[AJP]

Final Practice..

Webber 1:19.574
Yamamoto 1:27.176

The difference between the front and back is just silly.

[spudrsca]

Mclaren should focus on Hamilton for the rest of the year.
Do whatever upgrades you like and give it to Hamilton, they have no other options.
If they do things to please the two drivers, they will penalyse Hamilton as Button is never happy with a car.

[steveaki13]

It looks a bit ominous for the rest 2 sessions in the weekend where Red Bull well over a second faster.

Watching Practice the Rest can't get close to Red Bull in the middle sector.

Lets hope I am wrong but I will be amazed if its not a Red Bull 1,2

[DazzlaF1]

BASED ON THIS MORNING'S FP3

Drivers who would fail to qualify on 107% and 105%

1. Mark Webber - Red Bull ................ 1m 19.574
-------- 105% TIME : 1m 23.558 (+ 3.984) --------
18. Vitantonio Liuzzi - Force India ................ + 4.134
19. Lucas di Grassi - Virgin ................ + 4.973
20. Jarno Trulli - Lotus ................ + 5.002
21. Heikki Kovalainen - Lotus ................ + 5.049
22. Timo Glock - Virgin ................ + 5.231
-------- 107% TIME: 1m 25.144 (+ 5.570) --------
23. Bruno Senna - Hispania ................ + 6.905
24. Sakon Yamamoto - Hispania ................ + 7.602

And if you took the Red Bulls out of it

1. Fernando Alonso - Ferrari ................ 1m 20.724
-------- 105% TIME: 1m 24.760 (+ 4.036) --------
20. Timo GLock - Virgin ............... + 4.081
-------- 107% TIME: 1m 26.375 (+ 5.651) --------
21. Bruno Senna - Hispania ................ + 5.755
22. Sakon Yamamoto - Hispania ................ + 6.452

[steveaki13]

I no alot of people think 105% would be better than 107% but I feel 107% is enough. In the old days 107% kept out Yoong, Marques and Rosset on their poor days, but let the Minardis and Tyrells race on the whole where 105% would have seen them miss out to much.

[DazzlaF1]

Here we go, it'll be a Red Bull massacre but it'll be interesting as to who's the "best of the rest"

[DazzlaF1]

Vettel could be in trouble, Trulli's complained of Vettel holding him up while Vettel was on his slowing down lap.

Its now Schumacher who looks like going out in Q1 and Rosberg in 16th, Mercedes really struggling this weekend

[DazzlaF1]

Vettel quickest in Q1 and Glock wins the battle of the newbies, Kobayashi elimianted but he was held up on his fast lap by suprise...suprise...Yamamoto

[DazzlaF1]

Top 10 shootout

Webber
Vettel
Alonso
Petrov
Rosberg
Massa
Kubica
Hamilton
De La Rosa
Hulkenberg

Button out and starts 11th

[ioan]

Horrible performance from Schumacher, 0.8 seconds/lap slower then Rosberg.
He better get this sorted out soon.

[Tazio]

http://img808.imageshack.us/img808/847/rai220100731144231.jpg

[ioan]

Well done Vettel! :up:

[Tazio]

Nice work by The Boss putting it 5th!
What's up with Petrov? :up:

[DazzlaF1]

Vettel got it and the final gap between Red Bull and the rest, a monstrous 1.214 seconds (0.803 where Webber's concerned) If they replicate this sort of dominance in the race, they may very well lap the entire field.

FINAL GRID

ROW 1: 1st Sebastian Vettel (Red Bull), 2nd Mark Webber (Red Bull)
ROW 2: 3rd Fernando Alonso (Ferrari), 4th Felipe Massa (Ferrari)
ROW 3: 5th Lewis Hamilton (McLaren), 6th Nico Rosberg (Mercedes)
ROW 4: 7th Vitaly Petrov (Renault), 8th Robert Kubica (Renault)
ROW 5: 9th Pedro de la Rosa (Sauber), 10th Nico Hulkenberg (Williams
ROW 6: 11th Jenson Buton (McLaren), 12th Rubens Barrichello (Williams)
ROW 7: 13th Adrian Sutil (Force India), 14th Michael Schumacher (Mercedes
ROW 8: 15th Sebastien Buemi (Toro Rosso), 16th Vitantonio Liuzzi (Force India)
ROW 9: 17th Jaime Alguersuari (Toro Rosso), 18th Kamui Kobayashi (Sauber)
ROW 10: 19th Timo Glock (Virgin), 20th Jarno Trulli (Lotus)
ROW 11: 21st Heikki Kovalainen (Lotus), 22nd Lucas di Grassi (Virgin)
ROW 12: 23rd Bruno Senna (Hispania), 24th Sakon Yamamoto (Hispania)

[Dave B]

Staggering pace from Red Bull - I doubt Vettel will get penalised for blocking. Petrov outqualifies Kubica for the first time, and poor old Schumacher... words fail me.

Button's actually not in as bad a position as you might think, he can at least bolt fresh tyres on for the start and reckons he's got plenty of unused sets.

[DazzlaF1]

Staggering pace from Red Bull - I doubt Vettel will get penalised for blocking. Petrov outqualifies Kubica for the first time, and poor old Schumacher... words fail me.

Button's actually not in as bad a position as you might think, he can at least bolt fresh tyres on for the start and reckons he's got plenty of unused sets.

And he'll be on the clean side of the grid too.

[djparky]

RBR should walk the race tomorrow with that kind of performance advantage- assuming they both get off the line well- Vettel has his problems with that and Webber is on the dirty side of the track

but if they make it the first corner 1-2 then only unreliablity or some race incident can stop them from running away with it

and how good it is to see Williams back in the Top 10 again and Schumi trundling roound like a midfielder again- he's not looking so good now he doesn't have a car advantage over the rest of the field- worst for him Rosberg is doing much better in the other car

give it up mate and let Heidfeld have a go

[Tazio]

Button's actually not in as bad a position as you might think, he can at least bolt fresh tyres on for the start and reckons he's got plenty of unused sets.

:s ailor: And he's going to have to get past the Petrov, Kubica, de la Rosa, Hulkenberg train ;)

[Dave B]

:s ailor: And he's going to have to get past the Petrov, Kubica, de la Rosa, Hulkenberg train ;)
Good point, you're suggesting it may take 2 or 3 corners to get into the top six. :p

[Tazio]

Well done Vettel! :up:

http://img828.imageshack.us/img828/7706/rai220100731150042.jpg

[markabilly]

should be a great race with vettel and webber consistently 1 second plus faster than the rest of the field.

Hahaha

one lap at the top=about 1m and 20 seconds, and it is easy to calculate:70 laps x one second per lap, gives a 70 second lead (1 min 10 secs)

At that pace, Vettel and webber at over 70 laps, should be very close to lapping FA at the end of the race...assuming FA can keep his pace....if not, then the third place car may well get lapped, unless the 2 RB drivers crash into themselves....

[Tazio]

Vettel got it and the final gap between Red Bull and the rest, a monstrous 1.214 seconds (0.803 where Webber's concerned) If they replicate this sort of dominance in the race, they may very well lap the entire field.

:s ailor: The 1.2 is on new options with no fuel :rolleyes: On primes In race trim on the RBR's will be ahead, but I'm saying only .5 to The Scuds. and possibly The Boss! If he can really ring that things neck and find some traction in S2 :burnout:

[markabilly]

:s ailor: The 1.2 is on new primes :rolleyes: In race trim the RBR's will be well ahead, but I'm saying only .5 to The Scuds. and possibly The Boss! If he can really ring that things neck and find some traction in S2 :burnout:
actually throughout all of practice....the red bulls have consistenly been about one second ahead of everybody else.
Indeed RB probably could have taken pole running on the hard compound over Ferrai being on softs

I see little hope for ferrari except third place, in the absence something going wrong with RB

[markabilly]

according to speed, the 19.5 for both RB cars in q2 was on hard tires....compared to ferrari best of 19.9 by FA in q3

in q1, vettel was faster, again on hards, then massa time on softs in q3

all to do with car advantage, cause vettel is not that good....

[Tazio]

actually throughout all of practice....the red bulls have consistenly been about one second ahead of everybody else.
Indeed RB probably could have taken pole running on the hard compound over Ferrai being on softs

I see little hope for ferrari except third place, in the absence something going wrong with RBBS I watched every minute of all the practices and in fp2 RBR and Ferrari ran high fuel on soft compounds at the end of the session and there was hardly anything between them.
:s ailor: Get your facts straight mister :vader:

[markabilly]

BS I watched every minute of all the practices and in fp2 RBR and Ferrari ran high fuel on soft compounds at the end of the session and there was hardly anything between them.
:s ailor: Get your facts straight mister :vader:
final practice...1.1 second advantage to Red bull.....
in friday, while messing around in practice 2, the closest gap at the end was .5 second

as to other times in practice , that is always hard to say, because the times, driving, engine settings and fuel loads can all be different...

There were times when Schuie was not all that fast in practice when he was at ferrari, but then it was deliberate as they would run laps where he only took certain sectors at max, and the rest at less speed.....

i go by qualifying, because that is the only time the cars are going max all the way around and you can have some meaningful comparison

[Tazio]

final practice...1.1 second advantage to Red bull.....
in friday, while messing around in practice 2, the closest gap at the end was .5 second

as to other times in practice , that is always hard to say, because the times, driving, engine settings and fuel loads can all be different...

There were times when Schuie was not all that fast in practice when he was at ferrari, but then it was deliberate as they would run laps where he only took certain sectors at max, and the rest at less speed.....

i go by qualifying, because that is the only time the cars are going max all the way around and you can have some meaningful comparison

Thats fine and dandy but the cars start the race on full tanks, and managing soft rubber is a factor. They may blow the field away, but as far as I'm concerned Vettel and Webber are two above average drivers in a very fast car! Both subject to catastrophic brain fade. Vettel may become great but he still has a lot of maturing to do! :grenade:

And that guy Fred, he is a rather clever fellow :dozey:

[Ent]

Nice work by The Boss putting it 5th!

Is Verstappen still racing? Or is a current driver too lazy to get his own name?

[ioan]

And that guy Fred, he is a rather clever fellow :dozey:

He sure knows how to whine. :D

[Ent]

If Vettel gets another poor start off the line, there could be chaos at the first corner. If he does get a slow start, he's likely to try and chop across Webber while the two Ferraris swamp him. Could be interesting.

[steveaki13]

For a better race obviously, we need Alonso to get ahead, and see how long it takes the Red Bulls to get past.

With Vettel struggling off the line lately and Webber on the dust, it could yet be a competative race.

[steveaki13]

Was the last pair of cars to lap the field the Mclaren's in 1998.

If the Bulls lap average 1 second a lap faster and they are aloud to race the who distance then thats about a lap isn't it.

Wow

[markabilly]

wat happened to possible penalties on ms and vettel?
was there not some discussion about blocking by them?

[F1boat]

Red Bul are way too fast. Congrats for the guys in the factory.

[Daika]

As always (well most of the times) Schumacher will make a better start than Rosberg and they will be around 8th or 9th, after the first pitstop Rosberg move into 5th place and schumacher will be putting a fight for the last points somewhere between 9th and 11th place. Hope Massa wins.

[DazzlaF1]

wat happened to possible penalties on ms and vettel?
was there not some discussion about blocking by them?

Nope, just Kobayashi got a 5 place penalty for not going to scrutineering after Q1

[Mia 01]

The Newey cars is leading, and it shall stay so for the rest of the year.

[steveaki13]

I am not sure, but if the cars in their current spec went straight to Belgium, the Red Bull's may have an even bigger advantage.

Discounting the Mclaren's straight line speed, the many high speed corners including Eau Rouge, Pouon, Blanchimont as well as the rest of the circuit.

I am not sure whether I am right, but Red Bull should be mighty strong there.

[Hawkmoon]

Red Bull's huge advantage is track specific. One week ago Ferrari easily had their measure and now they're 1.2 seconds slower. Nothing Red Bull could have done in less than a week (short of bolting on a turbo charger) could have improved the car that much.

Spa is the complete antithesis of this god-awful Hungaroring so I very much doubt that Red Bull will be over a second quicker in Belgium.

[Saint Devote]

Is Verstappen still racing? Or is a current driver too lazy to get his own name?

:D There is only ONE "Boss" in f1 and he is the very close friend of Schumi: Jos "The Boss" Verstappen.

I think I saw he was driving GT cars a while back. I wonder of he still has the largest fan club out of all the drivers?

[Saint Devote]

An unusual grid really - could be an unusual race ahead. There are drivers in the first ten that do not race as well as the qualify - or START for that matter.

Including strategy by other teams - while the RB6's look dominant, between Vettel and the team, they remain their OWN biggest threat.

[Valve Bounce]

Smedley to Mark: Mark! the car behind you is faster than you! do you understand, Mark! Alonso is faster than you! :D

[Wasted Talent]

For a better race obviously, we need Alonso to get ahead, and see how long it takes the Red Bulls to get past.

With Vettel struggling off the line lately and Webber on the dust, it could yet be a competative race.

We need Massa to get ahead............. ;) ;)

WT

[ShiftingGears]

We need Massa to get ahead............. ;) ;)

WT

Haha!

The start is going to be crucial here. If the RBR cars fluff the start then I think theres only one other chance at passing, and that's pitpassing.

[ShiftingGears]

Congratulations to Vettel for the win :p :

[gm99]

Boooring!

And Yamamoto getting lapped on lap 14...

[ioan]

WTF?
SC for a piece of front wing?!

[ioan]

Kubica and sutil manage to colide in the pit lane.

Rosberg without a rear wheel!

Looks like the SC has been released to spice up the show! :down:

[Daniel]

f me!

[christophulus]

Kubica and sutil manage to colide in the pit lane.

Rosberg without a rear wheel!

Looks like the SC has been released to spice up the show! :down:

Wow, I'm expecting a ton of penalties there. Very, very dangerous.

[ioan]

Why didn't RBR call Webber in too?!

[Daika]

Just what the race needed.

[Hawkmoon]

Wonder if Rosberg's wheel clocked anyone as it was bouncing around the pitlane?

[christophulus]

I wonder what penalty Mercedes are going to get, very lucky no one got hurt. Renault initially got a ban from the next race for doing the same to Alonso last year.

[ioan]

I wonder what penalty Mercedes are going to get, very lucky no one got hurt. Renault initially got a ban from the next race for doing the same to Alonso last year.

Let's not jump to conclusions.
Renault got a ban (initially) because they sent him out knowing fully well that the wheel was not properly on.
Just a small detail that makes a huge difference.

[ioan]

Webber doing the part for jumping Alonso at his coming pit stop.

[ioan]

Another useless penalty, this time for Renault and Kubica! :laugh:

[christophulus]

Let's not jump to conclusions.
Renault got a ban (initially) because they sent him out knowing fully well that the wheel was not properly on.
Just a small detail that makes a huge difference.

Fair point. Still, I expect a fine at least.

Kubica gets a stop/go penalty - kind of pointless seems how he's last.

[ioan]

Disaster for Hamilton. :(

[christophulus]

Vettel under investigation for lagging behind Webber at the restart. Bet they'll be hoping the FIA take a while to decide :p

[Daika]

Alot is happening, not because they are racing wheel to wheel

[christophulus]

Drive-thru for Vettel!

[Daniel]

Doh for Vettel.

[Daika]

How can they blame Kubica for the collision? blame the team (lollipop guy).

[Daniel]

Rofl @ Vettel :D

[ioan]

So now they will penalize Vettel for daring to protest?!

[christophulus]

How can they blame Kubica for the collision? blame the team (lollipop guy).

It's the responsibility of the driver to avoid a collision.

[ioan]

Doh for Vettel.

Stupid rules, stupid consequences.
How are you supposed to keep within 5 car lengths from the guy in front when he is the one deciding when he backs up the field and when he accelerates again?!

[ioan]

Go Webber!

[Daika]

It's the responsibility of the driver to avoid a collision.

Impossible if you are in the pitstop, Kubica is told when to go (lollipop guy).

[Ranger]

Stupid rules, stupid consequences.
How are you supposed to keep within 5 car lengths from the guy in front when he is the one deciding when he backs up the field and when he accelerates again?!

Unlucky as all hell for Vettel. He was monstering this GP.

[christophulus]

Impossible if you are in the pitstop, Kubica is told when to go (lollipop guy).

Rules are rules



23.1 j) It is the responsibility of the competitor to release his car after a pit stop only when it is safe to do so.

[Daika]

Places between 5th and 13th are about equal in laptimes.

[markabilly]

whySC???

Speed never said, although that could have been said during one of the many commercials that we have constantly

Is it now NASCAR time in F1??

[ioan]

It's the responsibility of the driver to avoid a collision.

Not really as he can not see to much because of the mechanics standing beside the car and the lollipop man is 100% responsible for releasing the driver.

[ioan]

whySC???

To create some artificial show, why else?!
Big :down: to this so called sport.

[ioan]

Rules are rules

The competitor being the team as we saw in Valencia 2008.

[ioan]

Come on Webber!
Hope RBR will keep him out until it is sure he gets ahead of Alonso.

[Daika]

I predict a crash Alonso/Vettel

[ioan]

Webber leads by a mile. Now Vettel has to overtake the whiner.

[ioan]

I predict a crash Alonso/Vettel

If that ends Alonso's chances to the title I am all for it.

[Ranger]

Webber ahead of Alonso and Vettel.

Vettel would be right to be pissed, terribly unlucky although he broke the rules.

[Retro Formula 1]

I predict a crash Alonso/Vettel

You and me both. Crazy attempt from Seb is my guess.

[Mark]

No matter who's fault it is it's the driver that gets punished!

[Hawkmoon]

If that ends Alonso's chances to the title I am all for it.

Why so bitter my friend?

Vettel will be furious if it was the team's call that he back off and give Webber space.

[christophulus]

The competitor being the team as we saw in Valencia 2008.

So why did Kubica get the penalty? Imagine they'll be having a look after the race anyway.

Can't see Vettel getting past Alonso, not without losing a bit of front wing.

[ioan]

Why so bitter my friend?

I have a problem with whiners, never liked them.

[ioan]

So why did Kubica get the penalty? Imagine they'll be having a look after the race anyway.

Typical FIA consistency.

[Hawkmoon]

I have a problem with whiners, never liked them.

So you're pissed at Ferrari because they signed a "whiner"?

[Daika]

Doe anybody thinks no refueling=boring race?

[christophulus]

Typical FIA consistency.

Figures :rolleyes:

Apparently one of the Williams mechanics got hit by Rosberg's bouncing wheel. Concussion, taken to hospital. Fingers crossed it's not too serious.

http://twitter.com/f1photos

[ioan]

So you're pissed at Ferrari because they signed a "whiner"?

And because they are whiners too.

[Daika]

Figures :rolleyes:

Apparently one of the Williams mechanics got hit by Rosberg's bouncing wheel. Concussion, taken to hospital. Fingers crossed it's not too serious.

http://twitter.com/f1photos

And that was a safe release? what is your opinion with that regarding the FIA giving a penalty to Kubica?

[christophulus]

And that was a safe release? what is your opinion with that regarding the FIA giving a penalty to Kubica?

Haven't seen a replay so can't comment. Imagine there'll be a large fine for Mercedes, at least.

The Kubica penalty is odd. I thought it was ultimately the driver who took responsibility, but if it is the team's fault then I don't know why the FIA did that. We'll see after the race I guess.

[Daika]

Barichello 2 sec faster than Schumacher!

[Hawkmoon]

Haven't seen a replay so can't comment. Imagine there'll be a large fine for Mercedes, at least.

The Kubica penalty is odd. I thought it was ultimately the driver who took responsibility, but if it is the team's fault then I don't know why the FIA did that. We'll see after the race I guess.

Because the driver and the team are one-and-the-same as far as these things go. You can imagine what would happen if the driver was considered seperate from the team. Team's would be taking the fall for their drivers for just about everything if it mean't the driver escaped a penalty.

[ioan]

Rubens trying to do a Kobayashi.

[Daika]

Because the driver and the team are one-and-the-same as far as these things go. You can imagine what would happen if the driver was considered seperate from the team. Team's would be taking the fall for their drivers for just about everything if it mean't the driver escaped a penalty.

That is not true. There are 2 championship. Drivers and constructors. There are many times that drivers escaped punishment and the team not.

[ioan]

That is not true. There are 2 championship. Drivers and constructors. There are many times that drivers escaped punishment and the team not.

True.

[ioan]

That wasn't fair from MS.

[Daniel]

Jeezus michael..... That really should be a black flag....

[christophulus]

Bloody hell Schumacher, nearly stuffed him in the wall. If he gets away with that.. :mad:

[gm99]

What a dirty move...

[Hawkmoon]

How much do you want to bet that Horner has another whinge about the lack of power from Renault after Vettel's struggles to pass Alonso?

[Mark]

Black and White flag at the very least

[BDunnell]

For that, Schumacher deserves some sort of sanction. I have no problem with hard racing, but that move on Barrichello was disgraceful.

[Hawkmoon]

Poor form Schumi.

[veeten]

I guess former friendships and teammates count for nothing these days. Squeezed him like a lemmon, and Rubens made it past.

Great race by Webber. :) Just showing how well he can do it when the car is suited to him.

[ioan]

Big :down: to F1 where one needs to be 3 seconds a lap faster in order to aspire to overtake the car in front.

[BDunnell]

Big :down: to F1 where one needs to be 3 seconds a lap faster in order to aspire to overtake the car in front.

Crap circuit as well — and one whose continued inclusion on the calendar I continue to find bizarre. It's not as if Hungary has ever been one of the great emerging markets Bernie has been so keen to see staging F1 races.

[truefan72]

so should RBR now throw all their efforts behind Webber? lol
Vettel is a brat. first off, I think there could have been some penalty for entering the pit lane at such a late point, but the actual penalty was well justified. he needs to figure it out for himself.

Terrible weekend for mclaren,
MSC - dirtiest move of the year

overall interesting race, WDC and WCC have tightened up.
Hopefully mac's will be back in spa ;)

[Hawkmoon]

Crap circuit as well — and one whose continued inclusion on the calendar I continue to find bizarre. It's not as if Hungary has ever been one of the great emerging markets Bernie has been so keen to see staging F1 races.

The girls are supposed to be pretty.

[BDunnell]

Vettel is a brat. first off, I think there could have been some penalty for entering the pit lane at such a late point

Why?

[christophulus]

Crap circuit as well — and one whose continued inclusion on the calendar I continue to find bizarre. It's not as if Hungary has ever been one of the great emerging markets Bernie has been so keen to see staging F1 races.

I assume they pay well for the privilege, and at the end of the day that's all that Bernie cares about.

[truefan72]

Why?

i thought that there was some rule about extreme late entry into the pit lane beyond the designated pit entry lines. perhaps it varies from track to track.

Anyway Back to Webber, I pegged him as my dark horse to win the WDC and it seems to be on course to be a true contender. 4 wins is 2 more than anyone else and his pace in that post SC stint was beyond impressive.

[Dave B]

Re the Kubica / Sutil collision, it really should have been the team which got the penalty, not Robert. "Competitor" refers to the team, and we've seen monetary fines for teams before in this sitation. Kubica wouldn't have seen a thing until a giant Kingfisher logo appeared a few inches from his face.

[Dave B]

Why?
I'd need to see a replay but I'm certain Vettel had all four wheels off the track for a moment while he crossed the island into the pit lane, which is a clear breach of the rules.

[VkmSpouge]

An interesting race in Hungary for once but still only a handful of overtaking moves. The safety car certainly spiced things up.
Sebastian Vettel only has himself to blame for losing yet another race from the front. Mark Webber picked up the pieces, put in the lap times and took a well deserved victory. Alonso drove solidly. Lewis Hamilton's retirements here and in Spain could prove to be absolutely crucial towards the end of the season.
Rubens Barrichello was messed up by Williams strategy, he could have scored more points had they brought him in at the safety car and stacked Nico Hulkenberg behind him. As it was Barrichello needed to be 3 seconds quicker than Michael Schumacher in order to pass, quite ridiculous. Also ridiculous was Schumacher's appaulling defensive move almost crashing Barrichello into the wall and then onto the grass. I hope the race stewards penalise him.
Nice to see all the Lotus, Virgins and Hispanias finishing the race.

[Anubis]

Re the Kubica / Sutil collision, it really should have been the team which got the penalty, not Robert. "Competitor" refers to the team, and we've seen monetary fines for teams before in this sitation. Kubica wouldn't have seen a thing until a giant Kingfisher logo appeared a few inches from his face.

Agree wholeheartedly. The driver has no say in the release, so has to trust the team. Seems very harsh to punish the driver in that situation, given the initial incident probably cost him his race anyway. A fine for the team would seem more reasonable in those circumstances.

[steveaki13]

I said this on the donkey thread, I think the Lollipop man from Renault had his eye on the flying tyre of Rosberg when he released Kubica.

[Somebody]

Listening to the race on the radio, I wondered at the time if Renault had sent Kubica back out as penalty-bait (i.e., trying to take the penalty during a race already lost on a car unlikely to make it to the end, rather than getting a grid place penalty for the next race or a points deduction)

[christophulus]

I said this on the donkey thread, I think the Lollipop man from Renault had his eye on the flying tyre of Rosberg when he released Kubica.

Just watched the replay and I think you've got a point there. Quite hard to focus on oncoming cars when there's a bouncing tyre heading your way.

[Dave B]

I said this on the donkey thread, I think the Lollipop man from Renault had his eye on the flying tyre of Rosberg when he released Kubica.
Eric Boullier has just told the BBC that the lollipop man didn't realise the Force India was coming into its box, and admits it was a simple mistake.

I still don't understand why the driver was penalised, not the team.

[steveaki13]

Just watched the replay and I think you've got a point there. Quite hard to focus on oncoming cars when there's a bouncing tyre heading your way.

Yer, what with that and Rosberg going past with the 3 wheels on and all the other cars weaving in and out.
In these conditions its amazing we don't see it more often.

[Tazio]

A picture is worth a thousand words :s mokin:


http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/377/rai120100801154903.jpg

[ioan]

Vettel is a brat. first off...

So you hate him because he ran over your chihuahua?!
Team up with F1boat and Garry and ground the Vettel haters club, if I might suggest.

[ioan]

A picture is worth a thousand words :s mokin:


http://img827.imageshack.us/img827/377/rai120100801154903.jpg

Oh my oh my. Where are those who were criticizing MS for his victory leap a few years ago?!

I wish Mark could make it look at least a bit less sh!ttier then this.

[ioan]

I still don't understand why the driver was penalised, not the team.

Simple, it is cheaper this way, especially now that Renault are rather cash stripped and begging Bernie for some advance payment.

[Dave B]

I'd need to see a replay but I'm certain Vettel had all four wheels off the track for a moment while he crossed the island into the pit lane, which is a clear breach of the rules.
I've seen a replay. I was wrong. It happens :p

[Dave B]

Mercedes fined $50,000 for Rosberg's wheel not being properly secured.

[Dave B]

Renault the same $50K for unsafe release of Kubica.

[steveaki13]

A nightmare race for Mercedes all round really.

Quite right to penalize both incidents, however I feel a 10 place drop for one race is not proportionate to squeezing someone into a near crash. (And a massive crash at that).

Another thing with Rubens being forced to swurve once clear of the wall, it was very lucky that no one was exiting the pits, that could have made a massive accident into a fatal accident.

[steveaki13]

Question.

I can't recall many actual crashes in the pitlane. I know there have been near misses, but has there been a pitlane crash in recent times?

[ioan]

Question.

I can't recall many actual crashes in the pitlane. I know there have been near misses, but has there been a pitlane crash in recent times?

Canada 2008.

[steveaki13]

Canada 2008.


Oh yer! Duh :rolleyes:

[ioan]

Oh yer! Duh :rolleyes:

Wasn't that a pit lane crash?!

[truefan72]

So you hate him because he ran over your chihuahua?!
Team up with F1boat and Garry and ground the Vettel haters club, if I might suggest.

who said anything about hate?

he acted like a brat before actually figuring out and being man enough to admit his mistake. If you would bother to read posts and other threads you would know I commended him for being classy enough to speak the truth about his situation.

If your only resource in a losing argument is to resort to petty attacks out of context then it seems you are looking for a fight instead of doing what your idol has done and maned up, fessed up and issued his on mea culpa on the whole incident.

...might be too much to ask from you though :rolleyes:

[steveaki13]

Wasn't that a pit lane crash?!

Sorry ioan, I was duh..ing myself for being so stupid as to have forgotten it. :)

[Bruce j]

I just finished watching the Hungarian Grand Prix and what he did to Rubens was way beyond dangerous, deliberate, it was stupid. He watched it unfold in his mirrors and knew exactly what he was doing, it was much more than trying to defend the final points paying position.

As a previous open wheel competitor if that was done to me, I would have hunted him down after the race and I'm not sure what I would do from there. My bottom line is that he should receive more than a grid position hit at the next race he should have his super license revoked for the move.

I have always respected his driving ability but this time he went way over the line. His comeback has tarnished his legacy and this incident has destroyed it beyond recognition.

Bruce

[ioan]

Sorry ioan, I was duh..ing myself for being so stupid as to have forgotten it. :)

No problem, I was just surprised a bit.

[steveaki13]

No problem, I was just surprised a bit.


Cool. :cool:

I also agree with you on the Schumi v Barrichello incident today. All the talk of trying to kill Barrichello and revoking of super licenses is way to over the top.

I personally think a one race ban may have been the solution as I do feel a 10 place drop is a bit weak.

[Tazio]

His comeback has tarnished his legacy and this incident has destroyed it beyond recognition.

BruceWelcme to the forum Bruce.
Mikes move was over-agressive, and deserving of a penalty, but I think your final comment is a little over the top.

[ioan]

Cool. :cool:

I also agree with you on the Schumi v Barrichello incident today. All the talk of trying to kill Barrichello and revoking of super licenses is way to over the top.

I personally think a one race ban may have been the solution as I do feel a 10 place drop is a bit weak.

:)

[Saint Devote]

Sweetest sight: Hamilton retiring. Hungaroring = Monte Carlo for Jense.

The Schumi haters as usual becoming all hyesterical. Rubens still has that massive chip on his shoulders and remains a legend in his own mind - get control of yourself already!

Schumi was holding his defensive line - exactly WHAT gives Rubens the right to expect Schumi to just move over? Why didn't Rubens keep back as they came up to the inside track area?

Schumi penalized? A disgrace. In today's racing Jack Brabham would have been BANNED!

Webber: just superb. It was the drive of a champion and no driver could driven better. His greatest victory I'd say - this man just gets better with age.

Clearly Vettel has issues and there is absolutely a total breakdown in relations between him and Webber. His supporters at RBR had better talk to him before he does something really stupid - this driver does not have the temperament to win the championship.

[Saint Devote]

I dont know what all this bleating about the circuit is all about.

This was a typical sort of race in Hungary -

It was a GREAT grand prix :-]

[steveaki13]

It was a good Grand Prix. I really enjoyed it, but I still think Schumachers move was wrong.

[ShiftingGears]

Congratulations to Vettel for the win :p :

Whoops. That safety car threw a curve ball into what would've otherwise been a standard Hungaroring race.

[Valve Bounce]

I dont know what all this bleating about the circuit is all about.

This was a typical sort of race in Hungary - if you dont like f1 or expect it to be what YOU think it ought to then: DONT GODDAM WATCH!!

It was a GREAT grand prix :-]

This is our forum, and we are all entitled to voice an opinion. AS I have said to you countless times beofre, if you don't like the way we discuss things here, you can always go to another forum. But don't tell us what we can or cannot do or say in this forum.

[truefan72]

I define F1 the way I see it and would never preseume my view on things are the standard bearer for all things F1. when you confuse your opinions has universal truths, the path to madness is around the corner

[ShiftingGears]

I also think it is worth crediting the RBR strategists for Webber's strategy. It could've ended so much worse than it did.

[Valve Bounce]

I also think it is worth crediting the RBR strategists for Webber's strategy. It could've ended so much worse than it did.

Maybe it was Smedley who came up with it. :rotflmao:

[Daika]

Why was de the SC car on anyway? Yes, debris but from what? Been reading most of the F1 websites, they just say that the SC came on. Like the FIA did it just to make the race better....or did they?

[rsmith16]

Why was de the SC car on anyway? Yes, debris but from what? Been reading most of the F1 websites, they just say that the SC came on. Like the FIA did it just to make the race better....or did they?

I think it came out as there was a large piece of someone's wing or body panel lying in the track... Probably got the wrong incident.

[CNR]

Why was de the SC car on anyway? Yes, debris but from what? Been reading most of the F1 websites, they just say that the SC came on. Like the FIA did it just to make the race better....or did they?
http://i30.tinypic.com/fx6j4w.jpg

[Valve Bounce]

Why was de the SC car on anyway? Yes, debris but from what? Been reading most of the F1 websites, they just say that the SC came on. Like the FIA did it just to make the race better....or did they?

Yeah! Charlie Whiting saw that nearly half the spectators in the stands were asleep. :p :

[ioan]

I also think it is worth crediting the RBR strategists for Webber's strategy. It could've ended so much worse than it did.

Better give credit to the guy who built a F1 car that can be so much faster then the 2nd placed car.

[ioan]

Why was de the SC car on anyway? Yes, debris but from what? Been reading most of the F1 websites, they just say that the SC came on. Like the FIA did it just to make the race better....or did they?

This was certainly no SC incident but sure thing Charlie was easily persuaded by Bernie to spice up the show.

[Saint Devote]

Why was de the SC car on anyway? Yes, debris but from what? Been reading most of the F1 websites, they just say that the SC came on. Like the FIA did it just to make the race better....or did they?

Why shouldn't the SC be deployed when there is a chunk of car on the track as well as carbon fibre shards which have to swept.

It is on the downhill and exactly why should anyone risk their neck running onto the race track with cars merely slowing down using a local yellow?

It is amazing to me that the same people who point their corrosive digits at Schumi question THIS aspect of safety!

Hypocrites!

[Valve Bounce]

Why shouldn't the SC be deployed when there is a chunk of car on the track as well as carbon fibre shards which have to swept.

It is on the downhill and exactly why should anyone risk their neck running onto the race track with cars merely slowing down using a local yellow?

It is amazing to me that the same people who point their corrosive digits at Schumi question THIS aspect of safety!

Hypocrites!

Well, I have to admit that I had previously and strongly condemned SchM for his numerous stupid acts on the track, but I plead not guilty to the deployment of the Safety car. I see absolutely no reason to risk the lives of the marshalls to clear the track of a dangerous piece of debris.

So I guess I escaped from the generalisation of "same people"

[Saint Devote]

Well, I have to admit that I had previously and strongly condemned SchM for his numerous stupid acts on the track, but I plead not guilty to the deployment of the Safety car. I see absolutely no reason to risk the lives of the marshalls to clear the track of a dangerous piece of debris.

So I guess I escaped from the generalisation of "same people"

:D Bravo, bravo Valve Bounce!

[Valve Bounce]

The drivers that I have admired most in all the years I have followed F1: Sterling Moss, Jimmy Clark and Niki Lauda.

Both Sterling and Jimmy were blindingly fast on their day and won races purely by being faster than their opponents. No need to chop or block their way to victory. Niki, I admire because he was, in my mind, the bravest driver ever to put on a racing helmet. His race at Monza after suffering serious burns at his accident at the Nurburgring will always be remembered - when he took his helmet off, his balaclava was covered with blood.

Of today's drivers, and considering on track manners only, the guy I admire is Bunsen - he knows how to behave and race cleanly. That he is not my current favorite is historical - it's because I favored ant, but that's another story.

I never liked Jack Brabham and his driving antics; never celebrated his World Championships.

I have previously discussed SchM in detail in this forum and see no need to go over ancient history - but I will say that this leopard hasn't changed his spots.

That's about it.

[ShiftingGears]

Better give credit to the guy who built a F1 car that can be so much faster then the 2nd placed car.

Strategists always work within their limitations, and risked a lot to vault Alonso, regardless of how good the car is.

[Wasted Talent]

This was certainly no SC incident but sure thing Charlie was easily persuaded by Bernie to spice up the show.

After the Massa incident last year don't you think it was in everyones mind to make sure there was no debris on the track to possibly fly up ....again?

That is a fairly big piece of a Force India.....

WT

[Valve Bounce]

I see I have already made a fool of myself. Of course it should have been Stirling. What was I thinking? :(

[ioan]

Strategists always work within their limitations, and risked a lot to vault Alonso, regardless of how good the car is.

Really? How intelligent do they have to be to tell Webber to pit when he has over 20 seconds advantage?! Sure a cucumber wouldn't have managed it but a well trained chimp would have done rather well at this level.

[ioan]

After the Massa incident last year don't you think it was in everyones mind to make sure there was no debris on the track to possibly fly up ....again?

That is a fairly big piece of a Force India.....

WT

The day will come when the SC will be deployed to clean up one of those visor protective tear offs and people will be happy because it will improve the show.

[Valve Bounce]

Really? How intelligent do they have to be to tell Webber to pit when he has over 20 seconds advantage?! Sure a cucumber wouldn't have managed it but a well trained chimp would have done rather well at this level.

Really, ioan!! :rolleyes:

[Saint Devote]

Niki, I admire because he was, in my mind, the bravest driver ever to put on a racing helmet. His race at Monza after suffering serious burns at his accident at the Nurburgring will always be remembered - when he took his helmet off, his balaclava was covered with blood.

Of today's drivers, and considering on track manners only, the guy I admire is Bunsen - he knows how to behave and race cleanly. That he is not my current favorite is historical - it's because I favored ant, but that's another story.


I agree completely with your view of Lauda.

That has a significant amount to do with what I like Jense. He also has iron-clad self-esteem which was evident when Hamilton just did not know HOW to act after Jense passed him and he the repassed Jense. Hamilton had the same look as Vettel!

Does "ant" by any chance refer to Davidson?

[woody2goody]

Schumacher's 10-place grid penalty for Spa is the perfect punishment.

It now gives him a chance to redeem himself at the track where he made his debut, scored his first win, and delivered many great performances.

From AT BEST 11th on the grid, he will have (what some will say is his last chance) to show his quality is still there, and if he can score a top 6 or top 8 finish (while driving fairly and cleanly) then maybe, just maybe, he will gain back some of the respect he lost this weekend.

Meanwhile, Nick Heidfeld must be constantly cursing. I think he could have beaten Rosberg this year, I really do.

[ShiftingGears]

Really? How intelligent do they have to be to tell Webber to pit when he has over 20 seconds advantage?! Sure a cucumber wouldn't have managed it but a well trained chimp would have done rather well at this level.

They obviously could've pitted him when everyone else pitted.

[Valve Bounce]

They obviously could've pitted him when everyone else pitted.

But then, he would have come out behind both Vettel and Alonso. His aim was to make a break over Alonso as he knew he was faster, and it was mission accomplished.

[ShiftingGears]

But then, he would have come out behind both Vettel and Alonso. His aim was to make a break over Alonso as he knew he was faster, and it was mission accomplished.

Yep, that was the point I was making. There was no guarantee he wasn't going to lose out when they told him to stay out.