Adjustable rear wing for 2011

[christophulus]

The device would increase the straightline speed of the car behind by approximately 15km/h to help overtaking, but could not be used on the opening laps of a race. The car in front would not be able to deploy the system in defence, but would be able to retaliate using the wing once it was following the rival car.

"The flap will be adjustable by the driver," Lowe explained during a Vodafone McLaren Mercedes teleconference. "He can run it however he likes in qualifying, so what we'll actually do is make the flap so it has very low drag, and in qualifying that will allow you to get a better laptime by using it wherever you can.

"In the race, you can't use it for the first two laps at all, but after that if you're within a second of the car in front then you will be able to deploy it.


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/84682

Probably safer than persevering with the F-duct. Add that to some less durable tyres and they may be onto something...

[Big Ben]

There's something I don't get. The car in front is not allowed to use the device?

[e2mtt]

That's a stupid bunch of rules! Apparently the people who invent this stuff are mainly familiar with racing via video games.

I like adjustable wings... but not allowed to use on the first lap? not allowed to use while leading another car, only trailing? what if you are leading one car & trailing another? What about passing backmarkers? What is the wing fails in the "fast" position?

Another gimmick that won't happen.

[Mark]

That's fine when you have one car on one, but you often have a situation where you have a train of 3 or more cars where the ones in the middle are fighting to get ahead, whilst at the same time defending from those behind!

[Bagwan]

This came from FOTA ?

I get the adjustable wing thing .
But , with the restrictions , it gets phoney and full of potential of problems .

How , for example , does the driver making the pass do so with the wing in that "fast" position , when he's going into the lead , where he's not allowed it's use ?
Does race control automatically shift the wing into the alternate position as they change places ?
Does the driver have a set amount of time to change it to the other position ?
Does he have a set number of corners ?

And when does the leader , as he gets passed , get to go back on attack , with the other setting ?

It seems to be a plan with no way to succeed .
This is just a dopey idea .
Can anyone else here think of a way you could implement this smoothly ?

[Sonic]

Can anyone else here think of a way you could implement this smoothly ?

In a word? No.

Moveable wings is, in my opninion a good idea, but why is everything in F1 bl00dy restricted? Restricted KERS, mandatory tyre stops, now the wing rule!

In an ideal world i'd like no restrictions in these areas, but as that's never gonna happen, I could live with the same rule as regards front wing adjustement with a set number of adjustments per lap. Then it adds an element of tactics to it. When to adjust the wing to defend? Save KERS in case you get mugged on the straight, etc.

[Koz]

Some of the worst ideas I have ever heard of...

Racing where you have to allow the underdog to beat you without defending?

Man... F1 does not need these gmmicks... I'd rather have no overtaking than this fake crap they are pumping out...
What it means is car will be constantly overtaking and then being overtaken without being able to move ahead because the car behind you will always be quicker than you...
I don't like it. If there is no decent way of implementing it, don't allow it FFS.

[Rusty Spanner]

Don't like this. What next, stopping the leading driver using 7th gear? Seems a little contrived and overly complicated.

Mind you, might make the last lap at Monza interesting!

[Sonic]

Don't like this. What next, stopping the leading driver using 7th gear? Seems a little contrived and overly complicated.


LOL. I used to do that on GP2, 3 & 4 to make it a big harder.

[ShiftingGears]

Moronic.

[edv]

Gawd! Why can't they make things simple enough for regular folks to understand? Like giving them a LOT more horsepower and a LOT less brakes. That would promote more overtaking, and would be more easily related to our own driving experiences. No gimmicks please.

[harvick#1]

cant they just install sprinkler systems at all the tracks to recreate wet races :p :

[Sonic]

cant they just install sprinkler systems at all the tracks to recreate wet races :p :

Gods! Don't let Bernie overhear you - he'll think its a brilliant idea! :rolleyes:

As has been said already, we can easily recreate wet weather races by mimicking conditions with rock hard rubber and massive horsepower. Bosh.

[e2mtt]

Driver adjustable bodywork
From 2011, adjustable bodywork may be activated by the driver at any time prior to the start of the race and, for the sole purpose of improving overtaking opportunities during the race, after the driver has completed two laps. The driver may only activate the adjustable bodywork in the race when he has been notified via the control electronics that it is enabled. It will only be enabled if the driver is less than one second behind another at any of the pre-determined positions around each circuit. The system will be disabled the first time the driver uses the brakes after the system has been activated. The FIA may, after consulting all the competitors, adjust the time proximity in order to ensure the purpose of the adjustable bodywork is met.

This is real. Quoted straight from the formula1.com

This is pure stupidity. They have just enabled a "push-to-pass" type system that's use is governed by rules & marshals. How long before an overtake gets protested (or overturned) because of improper use of the "fast" wing?

It"s a given that McLaren's use of the wing will be much more restricted then Ferrari's.

[Sleeper]

I can see this having more problems than Vista.

[MrMetro]

Some of the worst ideas I have ever heard of...

Racing where you have to allow the underdog to beat you without defending?

Man... F1 does not need these gmmicks... I'd rather have no overtaking than this fake crap they are pumping out...
What it means is car will be constantly overtaking and then being overtaken without being able to move ahead because the car behind you will always be quicker than you...
I don't like it. If there is no decent way of implementing it, don't allow it FFS.

I agree 100%, this is the pinnacle of motorsport for god's sake.

[truefan72]

That's a stupid bunch of rules! Apparently the people who invent this stuff are mainly familiar with racing via video games.

I like adjustable wings... but not allowed to use on the first lap? not allowed to use while leading another car, only trailing? what if you are leading one car & trailing another? What about passing backmarkers? What is the wing fails in the "fast" position?

Another gimmick that won't happen.

:up:

[truefan72]

Don't like this. What next, stopping the leading driver using 7th gear? Seems a little contrived and overly complicated.

Mind you, might make the last lap at Monza interesting!
i can see races where the car on 2nd position will sit just behind the leader for long stretches and then in the final lap decide to make his move leaving the car who was leading with no opportunity to fight. This is just a dumb rule and as usual the FIA overcomplicated the whole issue. Besides, different teams have different wing settings thus making their adjustable wing movement different from car to car. just allow the thing to be implemented without restrictions and let the engineers go at it.

[Saint Devote]

I hate this bs - and who are the nameless cretins that think this rubbish up?

If the F1 teams had any backbone they would stand against these "rocket science" geeks!

[SGWilko]

I can see this having more problems than Vista.

...or ME..... ;)

[ioan]

F1 is ruled (FIA, mophead and team principals) by a bunch of idiots who should be making rules for Wrestling shows not motorsport.
Their ideas are getting crappier by the day.

I sure would love to have LMS and ALMS race every other week end.

[truefan72]

I can see this having more problems than Vista.

I bet you the fIA are running their computers on VISTA and despite everyone telling them the system is ridiculous, continue to use it to "save face"

[nigelred5]

Gods! Don't let Bernie overhear you - he'll think its a brilliant idea! :rolleyes:

As has been said already, we can easily recreate wet weather races by mimicking conditions with rock hard rubber and massive horsepower. Bosh.

I seem to recall BE went even further in the past suggesting just as harvick#1 said. The suggestion was to randomly turn the sprinklers on unannounced at various races.

Doesn't Paul Ricard have such a sprinkler system for testing?? ;)

[Jag_Warrior]

Gosh, this is going to be a cluster####!!! :rolleyes:

The people who think this foolishness up must smoke a whooooooole lot of dope, I'm guessing.

[ArrowsFA1]

FFS, can the FIA and the teams not come up with aero regulations as a whole, rather than these kind of gimmicks? :rolleyes:

[Garry Walker]

This is just so stupid. I am speechless.

[scaliwag]

I agree with most of the comments so far, the idea is a nonsense, if they seriously wish to improve overtaking opportunities simply restrict the fuel allowance and equip the motors with a boost button, use the boost to much you ain't going to make it to the finish.

Scaliwag.

[speeddurango]

If it improves the show, bitchings will become compliments. FIA should go on with the trial and I support it.

[V12]

Completely pointless. Might as well stick all the drivers names in a raffle and decide the results that way.

[Koz]

If it improves the show, bitchings will become compliments. FIA should go on with the trial and I support it.

Formula 1 does not need silly gimmicks. This is F1.

To overtake you need one thing - a pair of massive cast iron Columbian balls... That I'd pay to watch.
Some silly stuff about wings that some can use or can't sure, yeah...

Hell the thing does not even make sense man... Just think about it for christ's sake... It's position swapping, not racing.

Car in second place overtakes car in first place, but can't get away on the next straight same thing happens again...
For the whole 70+ laps. Do you really want to see that kind of bull**** man?

[airshifter]

Forget a moving rear wing. By the time you consider the telemetry, timing points, etc it will be really expensive and stupid to boot.

It would be much easier to simply attach 4 or 5 small parachutes on each car. Limit the transmitter distance, and the car passing can deploy the parachute on the car ahead. The passed car can then counter deploy that cars parachute, and use KERS to pass. Simple really. :laugh:


Personally I think this makes the Indy push to pass system seem simple and worthy.

[Sonic]

If it improves the show, bitchings will become compliments. FIA should go on with the trial and I support it.

Er no, the bitching will remain, as the passes will not be breathtaking side by side battles with the spoils going to the latest of the late on the brakes. No the "overtaking" will happen halfway along the straights and be about as fun to watch as traffic passing on the motorway

.

[ShiftingGears]

Formula 1 does not need silly gimmicks. This is F1.


Exactly.

[ioan]

Whatever the intelligent people that are working for the F1 teams are doing?

[jens]

Well... sounds like a strange rule. One thing is tyre compounds, which are equal to all, but another thing is a flap, which some can use and others can't depending on their track position...

[52Paddy]

I'm all for adjustable wings. I think it's a great addition. But the proposed guidelines that must be adhered to in relation to them is complete trollop! Just give the cars adjustable wings and let the drivers decide on when to use them. They're the ones who'll be using the bloody things after all! :rolleyes:

[steveaki13]

As most have said, these rules are not great.

Personally I am getting tired of all these contrived and restricted devices. There doesn't seem as much scope for natural evolution in F1, as when someone comes up with a great new device its either banned or restricted so everyone has the same thing.

Same with these proposals I feel moveable wings is fine, but again only if this happens and that doesn't..... blah blah, to many restrictions.

To many restrictive rules and to much general tinkering in F1.

Why does F1's rules need to be changed every year.
KERS in for 2009, but no actually wrong so banned for 2010, but maybe it'll be better now so re introduced for 2011.

I can understand if the decision is taken occasionally to cut aero or ban diffusers if they really are making passing unreasonable difficult, but the constant tweaking, like in 2005 one set of tyres per race in, 2006 out
and all the changes to Qualifying from 2003-2005 and now all these new proposals.
Plus this year all start on tyres you qualify on in the top 10 and must make mandatory stops

I just sigh now everytime these things are announced and think "NOT AGAIN"

[Sleeper]

I hate this bs - and who are the nameless cretins that think this rubbish up?

If the F1 teams had any backbone they would stand against these "rocket science" geeks!
This comes from FOTA, so top engineers from McLaren, Ferrari and Mercedes at least.

[Sleeper]

I think Webbers crash hilighted why moveable wings is such a bad idea, there's a good chance we'll see a lot more accidents like that one.

[ioan]

This comes from FOTA, so top engineers from McLaren, Ferrari and Mercedes at least.

All idiots.

[Mark]

All idiots.

LMAO! Mind you, just because you are a world class engineer / team boss etc, doesn't mean you are not an idiot! :p

[Sleeper]

All idiots.
Its amazing how people can be so smart in one way and so dumb/naive in another.

[52Paddy]

All idiots.

You remind me exactly of my Hungarian friend Istvan. I just don't know how you can make those statement but fair play :p :

[wmcot]

Personally I think this makes the Indy push to pass system seem simple and worthy.

And a lot less expensive for the teams to implement! I see this whole moveable wing idea costing a fortune to develop and then being scrapped in a year or two.

[ArrowsFA1]

The moveable rear wing, Whitmarsh admitted, was an idea drawn up in reaction to the lack of overtaking and the comparatively dull race we saw at the first event in Bahrain.
The thing is, many races since have been entertaining, with plenty of overtaking and good battles down the field. The moveable rear wing may be a solution for a problem that no longer exists.
Whitmarsh confirmed that if all the teams agree, the rule will be removed from next year's regulations and F1 will continue with standard rear wings.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8776388.stm

[christophulus]

I reckon with KERS making a reappearance this movable rear wing will be fairly irrelevant anyway. They seem to do the same job only KERS has been (fairly well) proven.