Who should replace Schumacher ? [Archive]

Ari

21st April 2010, 00:23

*facepalm*

1. Please do not start a fictional thread with 'CONFIRMED' in the title.

2. Please do not insult a 7 time WDC with a replacement consideration of Sato.

3. Please do not give my heart beat any more issues than it already has.

Koz

21st April 2010, 02:50

RMLCruzeing82

21st April 2010, 02:57

Button.

He'll realise that the only reason he won last year was because of Ross and the car and nothing to do with any driving skill, so he'll go back before Lewis kicks his butt anymore.

ERM sorry mate but whose leading the championship lewis or button? whos kicking whose butt because if im not wrong its button leading the championship so i think its button that kicking lewis's butt

Roamy

21st April 2010, 03:01

Well they should get his ass out of there and give the ride to Villeneuve !

maximilian

21st April 2010, 03:40

Obviously there is only ONE driver who would replace MSchu, and that's Nick Heidfeld.

Mark in Oshawa

21st April 2010, 04:46

Well they should get his ass out of there and give the ride to Villeneuve !

One washed up ex champ for another?

Azumanga Davo

21st April 2010, 05:34

So, this is not truth, BUT a good thread to say our idea who would be the best to replace him if he decide to rescue some of his career records...

Why not Takuma Sato?

tell your opinion.

You utter plank.

Easy Drifter

21st April 2010, 06:17

You mean no one is going to suggest the 'Brand'? :eek: :eek: :eek:

Not me, not me, not me!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

Valve Bounce

21st April 2010, 06:20

I have asked the mods for this thread to be deleted and this member banned.

F1boat

21st April 2010, 07:52

Obviously there is only ONE driver who would replace MSchu, and that's Nick Heidfeld.

I think that it will be either Heidfeld or di Resta, if Michael is indeed replaced.

Mia 01

21st April 2010, 08:23

It will be Mark Webber.

Dzeidzei

21st April 2010, 08:24

As I predicted in the crazy prediction for the season thread, he will be replaced by the Iceman, who will go on to win the WDC when McLaren are once again confirmed as cheaters, Fred and Massa take each other out, and RedBull have more sparkplug and brake problems.

End of story.

Theres a small prob. He has a longterm contract with Red Bull. Now who will buy that out? Is there another Santander lurking in the Merc garage?

But it would make it funny: he´s now one of the best paid F1 drivers altho he´s paid not to drive. Can he do it 2 years in a row?

:)

ShiftingGears

21st April 2010, 08:36

Obviously Heidfeld.

Ranger

21st April 2010, 09:08

No one. Even current drivers struggle to adapt to new cars with no testing.

See: Fisichella and Alguersuari in 2009.

ShiftingGears

21st April 2010, 09:19

Obviously Heidfeld.

I should add: I still think it is preemptive to replace Schumacher.

BeansBeansBeans

21st April 2010, 09:49

Schumacher is not yet, and may never be, back to his best, but to suggest that Takuma Sato would do a better job is madness.

turismo6

21st April 2010, 10:04

Schumacher will not be replaced mid season

CNR

21st April 2010, 10:35

Adrian Sutil to pay for the Mercedes engines

History repeats ?

Retro Formula 1

21st April 2010, 10:48

Schumacher is not yet, and may never be, back to his best, but to suggest that Takuma Sato would do a better job is madness.

You are seriously joking?

If Sato went in, I would expect him to score at least 1/2 the points of Nico for the first 4 races. Not a 1/5th!

Any driver, ANY, that was being destroyed 5 to 1 by their team mate would normally be ridiculed and Takuma was never ridiculed in latter years.

BeansBeansBeans

21st April 2010, 10:54

You are seriously joking?

Seen any Indycar races this season? Sato was fairly poor throughout his whole F1 career and is now stinking things up stateside. People tend to overstate the significance of a handful of good results in the Super Aguri, partly because they were seen as underdogs and he a likeable bloke.

I can't believe someone is asking me if I'm serious about Michael Schumacher being better than Takuma Sato.

Retro Formula 1

21st April 2010, 11:10

Seen any Indycar races this season? Sato was fairly poor throughout his whole F1 career and is now stinking things up stateside. People tend to overstate the significance of a handful of good results in the Super Aguri, partly because they were seen as underdogs and he a likeable bloke.

I can't believe someone is asking me if I'm serious about Michael Schumacher being better than Takuma Sato.

Nobody suggested Sato is better than Schumacher. At the very pinnacle of their careers, Schumacher would have destroyed Sato.

I just think that now, Schumacher is having the embarrassing and painful swansong that Hill experienced which is very sad to see. The body's willing, the minds as sharp, there's nothing physically stopping him apart from a spark that he cant reignite and probably never will. As with Hill, it's like watching a RTA in slow motion all over again :(

So yes, I think Sato would be a lot more competitive in that car. There may not be many Sato fans out there, and he was a liability in the early days, but he matured into a competent little racer.

BeansBeansBeans

21st April 2010, 11:20

So yes, I think Sato would be a lot more competitive in that car. There may not be many Sato fans out there, and he was a liability in the early days, but he matured into a competent little racer.

I find it hilarious that people think Sato was a liability in the early days but suddenly matured at Super Aguri. Perhaps the truth is that the Super Aguri was a better car than people made out.

Hawkmoon

21st April 2010, 11:24

Ralf of course. Mercedes hired the wrong Schumacher.

Placid

21st April 2010, 15:12

Sutil would fit perfectly for Mercedes GP.

Roamy

21st April 2010, 15:53

the need to dust off old Villeneuve so we can have a comparison. that is the only sporting thing to do.

For christ's sake forget Sato he has not won anything nor will he.

If you want the future go for Jamie Alg

But I am not writing off MS until I see the new cheater car he is getting. I would not be at all surprised to see him win at Barcelona.

Retro Formula 1

21st April 2010, 16:47

I find it hilarious that people think Sato was a liability in the early days but suddenly matured at Super Aguri. Perhaps the truth is that the Super Aguri was a better car than people made out.

I think I might have been a bit inflammatory in my first statement. After reading it again, I apologise if i was a bit abrupt.

If I might restate my opinion in a slightly less provocative manner, i would say Sato was pretty wild and reckless when he started but in my opinion, calmed down a lot with maturity. At SA he did a very credible job. OK he wasn't perfect and was never the fastest but pretty competent for a mid field driver.

I just think if you put him in the Merc, he would do a better job.

steveaki13

21st April 2010, 18:00

I dont think any driver who has been away for a similar length of time to Schumacher would do a better job.

I think the problem is not Schumachers Age but the length away and maybe design of Car.
I can't see Villeneuve or Sato who have missed a few years doing better than Michael.

steveaki13

21st April 2010, 18:02

I forgot to add if Schumacher was replaced I would like to see Nick Heidfeld get the seat.

ioan

21st April 2010, 18:11

Well they should get his ass out of there and give the ride to Villeneuve !

Who's Villeneuve?!

ioan

21st April 2010, 18:13

I forgot to add if Schumacher was replaced I would like to see Nick Heidfeld get the seat.

Same here, but MS will not be replaced. Haug believes he is doing much better than the detractors like to claim.

steveaki13

21st April 2010, 20:11

Same here, but MS will not be replaced. Haug believes he is doing much better than the detractors like to claim.

I think he's doing OK.
We will see what happens but I think it would be a bit unfair to judge him so early. We know he had it once, I suspect he still has it, it may just be a case of finding it. (Form I mean)

Roamy

21st April 2010, 20:16

Who's Villeneuve?!

He is the guy that stamped "Goodyear" all over the side of your boy's car.
He is the guy who passed your stone on the outside at Portugal

Stuartf12007

21st April 2010, 20:21

stupid question

but if it happened it would be Heidfeld as he is the reserve

21st April 2010, 20:21

He is the guy that stamped "Goodyear" all over the side of your boy's car.
He is the guy who passed your stone on the outside at Portugal

And has done feck all since.

If Villeneuve was a race horse he'd have been shot in 2003.

driveace

21st April 2010, 20:40

MS will run the full season,and in my opinion will improve,after his time off.Heidfeld was good at holding other drivers up behind him,or getting a result by less pits stops than others.The irish would love to see Ben Collins in the car,but Heidfeld is the reserve driver SO!

SGWilko

21st April 2010, 20:47

And has done feck all since.

And wise he is to do that too - cos Mick is making a muppet of himself right now.

Haug is not helping either. Setting the 'champ' up for potentially an ever biger fall if the new chassis is just the same, what with him talking Shergar up at every TV opportunity.

SGWilko

21st April 2010, 20:49

MS will run the full season,and in my opinion will improve

Hope so, cos right now watching Schumi is like a Whitney Houston comeback tour - hit and miss.

ioan

21st April 2010, 21:23

He is the guy that stamped "Goodyear" all over the side of your boy's car.
He is the guy who passed your stone on the outside at Portugal

Sorry I don't remember him. Did he drive in F1?

ioan

21st April 2010, 21:23

And has done feck all since.

If Villeneuve was a race horse he'd have been shot in 2003.

:D :up:

Mark in Oshawa

21st April 2010, 21:38

And has done feck all since.

If Villeneuve was a race horse he'd have been shot in 2003.

He'd be shot as a former WDC. Takuma Sato cant say that.....

THE_LIBERATOR

21st April 2010, 21:42

As someone has already suggested Ralph Schumacher, I'll suggest Nigel Mansell.

Big Ben

21st April 2010, 22:16

gm99

21st April 2010, 22:33

Mika Salo - he has experience replacing Schumi.

Luca Badoer - he has recent experience of jumping into an F1 car and doing tremendously well almost instantly :D

CNR

22nd April 2010, 01:41

Same here, but MS will not be replaced. Haug believes he is doing much better than the detractors like to claim.

2005 ret 7 ret 2
this year 6 10 ret 10
the question is how will rosberg go once they change the car to sute michael

Roamy

22nd April 2010, 03:30

well my theory goes as such.. MS drive a soft car > MS drives a cheater car.
So at worst the new chassis will be softer than soft. That is why Nico ain't getting one. Now get the cheater **** from TAD and you boy will be right there. Especially if it rains. I better get over to the sig betting thread. I might clean up

truefan72

22nd April 2010, 03:43

we are at least 7 months away from any kind of discussion regarding this matter.

markabilly

22nd April 2010, 04:04

I am thinking Looka howBadur....

wmcot

22nd April 2010, 06:33

Yuje Ide for sure!

F1boat

22nd April 2010, 07:02

Heidfeld was good at holding other drivers up behind him

Yes. So many ruined races for Alonso... BUT NO MORE :evil grin:

ShiftingGears

22nd April 2010, 09:25

And has done feck all since.

If Villeneuve was a race horse he'd have been shot in 2003.

LOL

SGWilko

22nd April 2010, 09:38

Mika Salo - he has experience replacing Schumi.

Luca Badoer - he has recent experience of jumping into an F1 car and doing tremendously well almost instantly :D

Ooohhh, wouldn't it be ironic if that happened.....

...and he was faster :eek:

SGWilko

22nd April 2010, 09:40

Yes. So many ruined races for Alonso... BUT NO MORE :evil grin:

That's maybe the fault of Fred being unable to get by, not Nick for holding him up.

F1boat

22nd April 2010, 10:33

That's maybe the fault of Fred being unable to get by, not Nick for holding him up.

Of course, Nick is a very good defender and was doing his job, although I think that sometimes he is simply stubborn. I mean the 2008 Canadian GP - when the BMW team told him that if defensive driving costs him time he should let Alonso and race for time. As a result for his truly admirable defense the Renault overheated and retired, but I think that Nick lost so much time that Kubica had his victory guaranteed.
And, of course, as an Fred's fan I am happy that a rival, who was never a championship contender, but happened to pop up in front of him in the wrong time, is out of the picture.

HereIam

22nd April 2010, 11:19

The Stig!

Jokes apart, Michael said after qualy in China that he doesn't like the way his car is set-up... he likes it "pointy" and they will try and fix this in Europe... to me it's very clear that he doesn't like the way the car drives. It's not to his liking at all and he is struggling, because this is on top of everything else. Give him a car he likes, and he will be back on form... we'll just have to wait and see...

Alfa Fan

22nd April 2010, 11:33

This thread demonstrates to me that sadly a sizable minority on this forum are no more knowledge than stereotypical Sun reading man in the street.

HereIam

22nd April 2010, 12:09

This thread demonstrates to me that sadly a sizable minority on this forum are no more knowledge than stereotypical Sun reading man in the street.

I have to agree with this... it's impossible to know why Michael is not performing... there so many different factors. Obviously, he is not at ease with the new cars, they are just too different now. He is not a young driver, who got to drive in F1 with this generation of cars or has been driving for the last few years, like Button. He has a wealth of knowledge he goes back to and it's the wrong kind of knowledge! He has to erase everything in his brain and reset himself... it took him ages to get on top and it's a bit ridiculous to expect him to jump in a completely different car and win races... even Fisi could not get used to KERS last year... the testing ban doesn't help either...

markabilly

22nd April 2010, 13:06

It is not age per se, but I think there is a mental zone or groove that he is not quite into as of yet. And as I said before many posts ago, MS has always preferred oversteer, and not understeer, a preferance just the opposite of Button who won a wdc driving these cars last year. Button does not like twitchy cars, esp twitchy rear ends...I have always wanted rear ends to twitch myself...as long as they were female.......

Big Ben

22nd April 2010, 14:51

SGWilko

22nd April 2010, 15:19

This thread demonstrates to me that sadly a sizable minority on this forum are no more knowledge than stereotypical Sun reading man in the street.

I gave up reading in the street - bumped into too many people it was becoming a hazard.......

SGWilko

22nd April 2010, 15:21

Wouldn't it be boring if everyone had the same level of technical knowledge and agreed with one another.....

....that a major leaflet campaign 'Mike's still got it, vote for Mike' is the way forward.......

SGWilko

22nd April 2010, 15:22

Give him a much faster car than anyone else's and a soft team mate and he will be back on form. Trust me. I know.

Nudge nudge, wink wink, know what I mean????? :D

HereIam

22nd April 2010, 17:07

Give him a much faster car than anyone else's and a soft team mate and he will be back on form. Trust me. I know.

I've seen plenty of drivers with a much faster car than anybody else's in the past who failed to deliver...

SGWilko

22nd April 2010, 17:14

I've seen plenty of drivers with a much faster car than anybody else's in the past who failed to deliver...

Shall we snick reliable in there too, just in case.

BTW, who d'ya have in mind then???

ioan

22nd April 2010, 18:18

we are at least 7 months away from any kind of discussion regarding this matter.

People have no patience nowadays. They want to have everything yesterday! ;)

ioan

22nd April 2010, 18:19

This thread demonstrates to me that sadly a sizable minority on this forum are no more knowledge than stereotypical Sun reading man in the street.

Excellent point.

HereIam

22nd April 2010, 19:12

Shall we snick reliable in there too, just in case.

BTW, who d'ya have in mind then???

All the World Champions' team mates? ;)

Mia 01

22nd April 2010, 20:41

The bottom line is that MS has to up his game very soon. It seems as he knows that, but not so much his fans.

rohanweb

26th April 2010, 20:03

hmmm let me think... how about Juan Pablo Montoya :-)

ioan

26th April 2010, 21:59

hmmm let me think... how about Juan Pablo Montoya :-)

He'd need an XXL size tub. ;)

donKey jote

26th April 2010, 22:54

Carlmetro´s dad ?

jens

26th April 2010, 23:14

No one. Even current drivers struggle to adapt to new cars with no testing.

I suspect that too. I'd give Schumacher a bit more time though, but I'd love to see Heidfeld back in F1 again in a competitive car. But unless the car perfectly suits his driving style and he clicks with it straightaway (like Kobayashi with Toyota in '09), I'm afraid we could end up by replacing one struggling driver with simply another one. And the later Heidfeld gets brought in, the less time and chances he has to find pace and put in any respectable drives during 2010.

And why is Sato brought up as an option? :p : He is a likable bloke, but quite frankly his days in F1 are numbered for good by now. Hasn't raced for two years in F1 and if any underfinanced backmarker team would want to take a gamble on him, I don't see him setting the world alight any more.

SGWilko

27th April 2010, 09:40

He'd need an XXL size tub. ;)

He IS an XXL tub now!!!!

goodf1fun

27th April 2010, 18:58

best driver to replace the best driver of f1? pathetic topic!!! (LOL)

DexDexter

27th April 2010, 19:55

Who should replace Schumacher? NOBODY. Come on the guy has has a couple of mediocre races, I'm sure he will bounce back.

ioan

27th April 2010, 20:03

He IS an XXL tub now!!!!

That was exactly my point.

DexDexter

27th April 2010, 20:16

I suspect that too. I'd give Schumacher a bit more time though, but I'd love to see Heidfeld back in F1 again in a competitive car. But unless the car perfectly suits his driving style and he clicks with it straightaway (like Kobayashi with Toyota in '09), I'm afraid we could end up by replacing one struggling driver with simply another one. And the later Heidfeld gets brought in, the less time and chances he has to find pace and put in any respectable drives during 2010.

And why is Sato brought up as an option? :p : He is a likable bloke, but quite frankly his days in F1 are numbered for good by now. Hasn't raced for two years in F1 and if any underfinanced backmarker team would want to take a gamble on him, I don't see him setting the world alight any more.

Sato is like Ant, keeps popping up for no obvious reason... :rolleyes:

SGWilko

28th April 2010, 09:45

That was exactly my point.

Errr, yes. Did that little moment of humour whoosh over your head? ;)

janneppi

28th April 2010, 15:35

Carlmetro´s dad ?

Lolström. :D

No need to replace the old man(MS) yet, if he bounces back, it's all good, if not, all the better. ;)
Then Merc can replace Rosberg with Häkkinen and run them as sort of old man's team. It wouldn't lead to wins, but i'm sure there are plenty of people who might want to see that.

Koz

29th April 2010, 01:16

Lolström. :D

No need to replace the old man(MS) yet, if he bounces back, it's all good, if not, all the better. ;)
Then Merc can replace Rosberg with Häkkinen and run them as sort of old man's team. It wouldn't lead to wins, but i'm sure there are plenty of people who might want to see that.

I wouldn't care if it was Hakkinen and MS in the same team and were fighting it out for 18th place. I'd still watch. Happily. :)

Mia 01

3rd May 2010, 20:30

It´s time for him to deliver this wekeend. The team have put in some huge effort to help him.

4th May 2010, 14:52

It´s time for him to deliver this wekeend.

Maybe in your eyes, but as your not Norbert Haug what you think isn't relevant.

SGWilko

4th May 2010, 15:05

If I were Haug, having to report to Merc board on the current form of the Shoe, if he does not improve I would be worried if my bosses' money was being well spent.

ArrowsFA1

4th May 2010, 16:19

Both DC and Webber have said that we'll know what his form really is after Monaco so let's see...

Having said that:

Things will only get harder for Michael Schumacher as the season progresses, reckons his former team boss Flavio Briatore.
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/83319

4th May 2010, 16:29

If I were Haug, having to report to Merc board on the current form of the Shoe, if he does not improve I would be worried if my bosses' money was being well spent.

You evidently haven't got the first idea about the value of publicity.

So long as Michael is big news, and the performance of the Mercedes car is ok with Rosberg getting results, the amount of press coverage that Rosberg beating Schumacher attracts means money well spent.

Mercedes aren't losing out on the marketing front because of Schumacher's lacklustre performances.

SGWilko

4th May 2010, 20:06

You evidently haven't got the first idea about the value of publicity.

So long as Michael is big news, and the performance of the Mercedes car is ok with Rosberg getting results, the amount of press coverage that Rosberg beating Schumacher attracts means money well spent.

Mercedes aren't losing out on the marketing front because of Schumacher's lacklustre performances.

Might get lots of column inches - but being slow and talked about a lot wont help much towards the constructors title.

4th May 2010, 20:09

Might get lots of column inches - but being slow and talked about a lot wont help much towards the constructors title.

Which isn't worth as much as the column inches.

SGWilko

4th May 2010, 20:23

Which isn't worth as much as the column inches.

So, as a team owner, digging deep in your pockets for little financial return in a time of significant financial constraint, you would welcome negative press over a 'world' championship trophy representing 'brand' success?

4th May 2010, 21:06

So, as a team owner, digging deep in your pockets for little financial return in a time of significant financial constraint, you would welcome negative press over a 'world' championship trophy representing 'brand' success?

Publicity is a financial return.

Saint Devote

5th May 2010, 01:12

If I were Haug, having to report to Merc board on the current form of the Shoe, if he does not improve I would be worried if my bosses' money was being well spent.

You are forgetting that Schumi has something in excess that no other driver brings to F1: publicity value. That is what he is currently being paid for.

Viewership in Germany alone has doubled since his return. The media still seek out Schumacher and will continue to do so.

Bernie understands and wants this. So the odds of Schumacher being prematurely "canned" are non-existent right now.

Schumacher races and no matter how long he takes, unless he decides to leave first, he is going to be part of the grid.

The Mercedes money IS being well spent.

Shalafi

5th May 2010, 07:23

If publicity is the most important thing they should fire Rosberg and hire Tiger Woods in the second Mercedes. That way they would have more publicity in US also. And MS would be nr 1 once again in his team. Everyone would win. Except Rosberg, but there is always someone to be sacrificed for the greater good.

wmcot

5th May 2010, 08:09

Sato is like Ant, keeps popping up for no obvious reason... :rolleyes:

...and ruining picnics!

F1boat

5th May 2010, 08:59

All valid points but I can't help but think having an underperforming Schumacher in the team is a consolation prize at the moment. Anything with Schumacher associated is going to draw attention, publicity, and revenue, but Mercedes still hired Schumacher with the intention the fight for the championship. With Jensons surprise exit from the team, they sort a driver who knew how to get the job done, and there is nobody better at that than Schumacher. Or so they thought, but a number of factors have stood in the way of this almost naive early expectation.

I have no doubt we are going to see an improved Michael in the coming races with additional changes to the car to suit his style. One podium finish in the next couple of races will silence the critics IMO. I don't think we are going to see Schumacher dropped this season. Mercedes have too much respect for him to do that. If his underperformance continues, I think he'll step down at the end of the season on his terms. If there is a vast improvement his motivation will excel and he may be a significant factor in deciding the championship this year also. Its still too early to tell IMO... :)

Excellent post.

SGWilko

5th May 2010, 09:11

All publicity is good publicity.

Tell that to Gordon Brown....

Dr. Krogshöj

5th May 2010, 10:24

Norbert Haug said in a recent interview: "I can only say that our investment in the purchase of Brawn GP paid off. No other team had more exposure over the winter than the rebirth of the real Silver Arrows."

Bernie Ecclestone replied: "In the future Mercedes should pay for their participation in the F1 world championship, considering how much publicity they’ve received lately. (Laughs.)"

http://www.formula1.com/news/interviews/2010/4/10690.html

5th May 2010, 14:40

http://motorsport.nextgen-auto.com/Berger-backs-Schumacher-amid-comeback-negativity.html

http://motorsport.nextgen-auto.com/F1-should-wait-before-assessing-Schumacher-comeback-Todt.html

This quote is interesting...from Bridgestone’s Hirohide Hamashima....

"The tyre of 2006 was developed mainly by Schumacher," the Japanese told Switzerland’s Blick. "Now that the front tyre is a lot weaker, it doesn’t really fit his style."

ellinawilliams

7th May 2010, 11:10

Hi
If Super Aguri really drop out from F1 then I think Sato will go street racing in Japan. Cue Fast and Furious music and look out Japan! But on a more serious mode, I think he'll be looking into another series. He could drive in a Japan GT or something.

ShiftingGears

7th May 2010, 11:55

Mia 01

7th May 2010, 12:56

You only needs a couple of coins, 50`dollars, cheap.

One WDC and one WCC.

But ofcourse, then it is some rallies.

ArrowsFA1

7th May 2010, 15:08

FP1

1. Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes 1:21.134 21
2. Button McLaren-Mercedes 1:21.672 + 0.538 14
3. Schumacher Mercedes 1:21.716 + 0.582 12
4. Webber Red Bull-Renault 1:22.011 + 0.877 27
5. Vettel Red Bull-Renault 1:22.026 + 0.892 22
6. Rosberg Mercedes 1:22.070 + 0.936 19

FP2
1. Vettel Red Bull-Renault 1:19.965 24
2. Webber Red Bull-Renault 1:20.175 + 0.210 35
3. Schumacher Mercedes 1:20.757 + 0.792 28
4. Alonso Ferrari 1:20.819 + 0.854 30
5. Hamilton McLaren-Mercedes 1:21.191 + 1.226 23
6. Kubica Renault 1:21.202 + 1.237 36
7. Rosberg Mercedes 1:21.271 + 1.306 27

Looks like the old boy is feeling more at home in his new Mercedes :)

Alfa Fan

7th May 2010, 15:13

Yes. Anyone who writes off a 7x WDC after 4 races is a bit of cretin. It's still to early to judge either way!

Roamy

7th May 2010, 17:04

As the "cheater car" advances up the field. Notice the special engine cover. Full of electronics to control the airflow to the engine. TC at is best!!!

ioan

7th May 2010, 17:28

As the "cheater car" advances up the field. Notice the special engine cover. Full of electronics to control the airflow to the engine. TC at is best!!!

:rotflmao:

markabilly

8th May 2010, 15:51

as I said in repsonse to a post, in a thread now closed:

Originally Posted by F1boat http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/images/aria/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showthread.php?p=781942#post781942)
The haterz are the only sad ones here, taking pleasure of a grave, but brave mistake, made by a very old driver

and I responded:

I figure we better have fun now, cause you never know if the old man might suddenly jump up out of the grave and start nailing it....

F1boat

8th May 2010, 20:26

I am very happy for Michael and I hope that he will keep his position in front of Nico tomorrow. I think that with some luck he can fight with Fernando and the McLarens for podium, as Red Bull will likely demolish everyone tomorrow.

turismo6

9th May 2010, 06:08

I think Bertrand Gachot should replace him.

Garry Walker

9th May 2010, 16:11

I wonder if the bashers are on their knees, begging for forgiveness already

SGWilko

9th May 2010, 16:58

I wonder if the bashers are on their knees, begging for forgiveness already

You jest, of course, no?

He made one move the whole race, then became wider than a Honda FRV for the rest of the race, 2 secs a lap off the leading pace.

F1boat

9th May 2010, 17:15

I am very happy for Michael, the old ace made a daring move on the reigning champion and held him with a slower car. :)

ioan

9th May 2010, 17:31

You jest, of course, no?

He made one move the whole race, then became wider than a Honda FRV for the rest of the race, 2 secs a lap off the leading pace.

:laugh:

He made that move on the reigning WDC (a piss poor one as we all know), who couldn't do better than look into his gearbox for 2/3rds of the race and then complain about the pass after the race. :laugh:

ioan

9th May 2010, 17:33

I am very happy for Michael, the old ace made a daring move on the reigning champion and held him with a slower car. :)

Given Button's almost complete lack of overtaking abilities this was a rather logical outcome.

SGWilko

9th May 2010, 17:34

:laugh:

He made that move on the reigning WDC (a piss poor one as we all know)

Agreed, the move was not very good. ;)

ArrowsFA1

9th May 2010, 17:39

I think Bertrand Gachot should replace him.
:laugh:

nigelred5

9th May 2010, 17:41

SGWilko

9th May 2010, 17:49

Nico has to be pissed already that the chassis has been changed to suit Michael's style at the expense of his. I'd think if the SWB chassis fit Him better, they would run both. Ha, who am I kidding, it's Schumacher. I'm sure he's already had the originals shredded by the team. lol

Point is though, before the upgrade (or downgrade I suppose!) not only was Nico faster that the Shoe, but he was also much nearer the front running pace than the old timer, getting good points finishes on merit, not others misfortune.

This is a step back for the team IMHO.

markabilly

9th May 2010, 17:56

markabilly

9th May 2010, 17:59

Point is though, before the upgrade (or downgrade I suppose!) not only was Nico faster that the Shoe, but he was also much nearer the front running pace than the old timer, getting good points finishes on merit, not others misfortune.

This is a step back for the team IMHO.
See above..... :vader:

(but u have excellent insight, and this shows why in this day and age of high tech, engineers watching the data acquisition to see which tires are slipping and at what angle...etc...etc....team mate comparisons are often very very misleading, esp as this change in the cars seems to show exactly this with Nico---same for Rubens last year for the first part of the season)

ioan

9th May 2010, 18:22

Agreed, the move was not very good. ;)

As good as pit passing moves can be.

ioan

9th May 2010, 18:24

SGWilko

9th May 2010, 18:27

You still think that Red Bull McLaren and Ferrari did nothing to improve and waited for Mercedes to overtake them?

Not at all my friend, but, given the positive spin Ross had put on the upgrades, it would appear that the team, relative to the others, are further behind.

F1boat

9th May 2010, 20:15

Given Button's almost complete lack of overtaking abilities this was a rather logical outcome.

I disagree. Jenson is a very good overtaker, as evident from his moves in the past, including the 2009 Brazilian GP or the 2009 Bahrain GP. I rate him extremely highly and that's why I am so happy and impressed by Michael.

ioan

9th May 2010, 20:19

I disagree. Jenson is a very good overtaker, as evident from his moves in the past, (including) the 2009 Brazilian GP or the 2009 Bahrain GP.

If Jenson is a very good overtaker then Hamilton and MS are the gods of overtaking. Heck even Ralf Schumacher was a better racer than Button.

Robinho

9th May 2010, 20:49

If Jenson is a very good overtaker then Hamilton and MS are the gods of overtaking. Heck even Ralf Schumacher was a better racer than Button.

hey thats just not fair. Jenson should have passed today, and racing pretty much anyone else i think he would have got past, but MS is a great defensive driver and will not be flustered.

Button made a lot of very good passes last year and has done in previous years. he, you are right, is not as an aggressive racer as some, like Hamilton, Alonso, Michael, but he's done alright for himself.

ioan

9th May 2010, 20:59

Button made a lot of very good passes last year and has done in previous years. he, you are right, is not as an aggressive racer as some, like Hamilton, Alonso, Michael, but he's done alright for himself.

And that's because he had a serious car advantage over most of the field, however I have to think hard to come up with Button overtaking anyone else but back-markers in the previous seasons.

Mia 01

9th May 2010, 21:53

This year it´s about being very fast, consistent and bringing home the points while you take care of your car. Nothing fancy about it.

Lewis what happened with the "driving the Jenson style"?

ArrowsFA1

10th May 2010, 09:19

Point is though, before the upgrade (or downgrade I suppose!) not only was Nico faster that the Shoe, but he was also much nearer the front running pace than the old timer, getting good points finishes on merit, not others misfortune.

This is a step back for the team IMHO.
Agreed :up: MS's 4th place finish may have been his best so far, but the Mercedes was over a minute behind the Red Bulls. It was a second slower than those ahead for much of the race. That may have helped hold Button back, but it doesn't show that the team are getting any closer to a race win.

We won't get to see a back to back comparison with their old and revised car, but the fact that this latest version seems to be a step backwards for Nico, and an improvement for Michael, doesn't bode well for the future.

markabilly

10th May 2010, 10:09

Agreed :up: MS's 4th place finish may have been his best so far, but the Mercedes was over a minute behind the Red Bulls. It was a second slower than those ahead for much of the race. That may have helped hold Button back, but it doesn't show that the team are getting any closer to a race win.

We won't get to see a back to back comparison with their old and revised car, but the fact that this latest version seems to be a step backwards for Nico, and an improvement for Michael, doesn't bode well for the future.
:vader:

Retro Formula 1

10th May 2010, 11:46

If Jenson is a very good overtaker then Hamilton and MS are the gods of overtaking. Heck even Ralf Schumacher was a better racer than Button.

???

Is it asking too much to ask you to explain your rationale for this claim?

Just how many on track overtake manoeuvres occurred in the points paying positions at Spain. I'm not talking about pit overtakes or backmarkers and the 2nd class cars but in the top 10 positions.

I think Button could have been a bit more aggressive on Schumacher but to claim Ralf was a better racer is ridiculous.

MS did much better today disproving the hype that he can drive a car not suited to him faster than anyone. Now Mercedes are developing the car around his style, he is more competitive.

Big Ben

10th May 2010, 12:09

What happened? Did someone overtake Button? Since when is that a news? I don't know how good of an overtaker he is... I don't recall too may of those moments, but his one hell of an overtakee.... was it 2005 when MS overtook him like he wasn't there :laugh: ... Well, let's not focus on silly things like that. Was he nice to his tires?

Big Ben

10th May 2010, 14:45

ioan

10th May 2010, 18:00

???

Is it asking too much to ask you to explain your rationale for this claim?

Yes it is, given that the rationale is obvious for anyone who followed these drivers carriers.

ioan

10th May 2010, 18:01

F1boat

10th May 2010, 18:24

As I said many times, there is no shame to be beaten by drivers like Lewis Hamilton or Michael Schumacher.

Garry Walker

11th May 2010, 06:53

:laugh:

He made that move on the reigning WDC (a piss poor one as we all know), who couldn't do better than look into his gearbox for 2/3rds of the race and then complain about the pass after the race. :laugh:

Did you laugh about buttons bitching as much as I did?

F1boat

11th May 2010, 07:04

Did you laugh about buttons bitching as much as I did?

I think that after a tough race a man can be nervous and annoyed and tell something stupid.

F1boat

11th May 2010, 08:40

Thats my view point, but when Lewis does it everyone jumps on the band wagon to criticize. Its interesting seeing the reaction when another driver does it.

Lewis tends to speek quite arrogant IMO, which makes him a bit unpleasant, although this happens very rarely now.

F1boat

11th May 2010, 08:55

I've met both of them in person and I must say they are both very pleasant

I envy you! I am pretty sure that they are very cool, though, I mean, IMO it is obvious that Lewis loves his fans and Jenson seems like a very nice person.

Retro Formula 1

11th May 2010, 10:56

Yes it is, given that the rationale is obvious for anyone who followed these drivers carriers.

Fair enough.

Ralf has more GP's, less points and less wins. Oh, and one less F1 drivers title.

I can see how you rank him above Button.

F1boat

11th May 2010, 13:17

Fair enough.

Ralf has more GP's, less points and less wins. Oh, and one less F1 drivers title.

I can see how you rank him above Button.

:D

markabilly

11th May 2010, 13:55

well, Massa might be a good choice if and when da shoe retires.....if Nico weathers through the presence of MS>...

ioan

11th May 2010, 18:18

Fair enough.

Ralf has more GP's, less points and less wins. Oh, and one less F1 drivers title.

I can see how you rank him above Button.

I am fairly sure that you never saw Ralf race live in F1 so I think it is rather useless to try to make you reason.

Robinho

11th May 2010, 22:01

I am fairly sure that you never saw Ralf race live in F1 so I think it is rather useless to try to make you reason.

i did and i rate him below Button also, if that helps

F1boat

12th May 2010, 13:03

i did and i rate him below Button also, if that helps

While I don't believe that RSC is a bad driver, in my opinion he is below Button.

snellman

13th May 2010, 14:43

borat

Chev_350

14th May 2010, 04:04

Whats with all the Schumacher hate?

He has been out of the sport 3 years, He signed on to a team in December, there was no way the car was going to be suited to him for this year out of the box, The cars are alot different from 2006, add to the fact there is no in season testing and this is the most competative F1 has been in some time, and yet he is a has been :S I dont get it.

Triumph

17th May 2010, 00:12

I think Michael should be replaced by himself, taking into consideration that for the last two Grands Prix he has been faster than Nico.

:-)

Mia 01

21st May 2010, 12:21

Ralph is better as a man, as far as I know that is.

ioan

1st June 2010, 22:16

airshifter

2nd June 2010, 01:44

Time to bring this thread up again.

In the last 3 races, stupid Monaco penalty aside, Schumacher got 32 points vs Rosbergs, surprise, 14 points!

Where are those who doubted MS and said he shouldn't have come back?!

Time to dig up the "who should replace Rosberg" thread I guess?

As for Monaco, in hindsight it was worth it for MS to lose the points just to see Alonso get punked so bad. As soon as he saw MS coming he was all over the place trying to make sure the pass didn't work. But it did, proving yet again that Alonso isn't the driver he claims to be. :D

i_max2k2

2nd June 2010, 03:20

Time to bring this thread up again.

In the last 3 races, stupid Monaco penalty aside, Schumacher got 32 points vs Rosbergs, surprise, 14 points!

Where are those who doubted MS and said he shouldn't have come back?!

Yep absolutely, btw congrats for the mammoth 20k posts :) , Btw I couldn't believe Nico saying, that he was faster than Schumi, I think Schumi set the fastest lap par the RBR's, but the Mclaren's were on the fuel saving mode, I can discoun't others since, they were pretty close to other cars, however, I definitely din't understand Nico's claim, if someone loses they should accept fair and square, as how Schumi did till the Spanish GP.

Roamy

2nd June 2010, 06:51

Oh Sh!t if I just lived close enough so you could pass me the bong

F1boat

2nd June 2010, 06:53

I didn't know that Nico has claimed that he was faster. I think that the current F1 youngsters demonstrate stunning arrogance. :(

i_max2k2

2nd June 2010, 07:02

I didn't know that Nico has claimed that he was faster. I think that the current F1 youngsters demonstrate stunning arrogance. :(

Absolutely, and trust me this is happening with all most every sport, younger unproven players/drivers, seem to think they are so much better than the rest.

http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2010/5/10853.html

Nico Rosberg (5th)
"I am reasonably happy with fifth place today although it was an uneventful race for me. I was slightly faster than Michael for much of the race but it was not possible to overtake and I had to be careful as Robert was pushing hard behind me. For me, the most exciting part of the race were the in and out laps for my pit stop which were pretty fast and together with the great work from the team, that enabled me to stay ahead of the cars just behind me on track. Although our general pace still has to be improved, I'm satisfied that we have taken what we could from this weekend."

I wonder what happened in Quali, and why did I always see a 1-2sec gap in between him and Nico.

Big Ben

2nd June 2010, 07:22

I wonder what happened in Quali, and why did I always see a 1-2sec gap in between him and Nico.

My guess is you saw it because it was there but it's just hunch.

Roamy

2nd June 2010, 07:35

well i would not read to much into it yet. Brawn built a special car for the cheater and now Nico has to learn to drive it. Probably also should look in the airbox area and see that the cars are identical. It may be that the cheater will prevail but I wouldn't count roseberg out just yet

Retro Formula 1

2nd June 2010, 09:09

Schumacher has had a couple good races but hardly dominated his teammate.

Lets not forget that Nico is a fast pilot buthardly top flight IMHO yet Schumacher is still struggleing with him.

I am confident that Nico will emerge with the most points of the 2 at the end of the season and have said so since the beginning of the season. I look forward to being wrong.

555-04Q2

2nd June 2010, 10:43

Big Ben

2nd June 2010, 13:54

One is technically a pensioner, the other a young man. The Shoe should not be able to compete with the likes of Nico in a modern F1 car, but he is. I would be embarrased if my father was better at sports than I am.

a true wonder kid...hmm... I mean a wonder pensioner. At his age it's real miracle he's not carrying an oxygen tube with him.

F1boat

2nd June 2010, 17:59

ioan

2nd June 2010, 21:06

Yep absolutely, btw congrats for the mammoth 20k posts :)

Thanks!
I didn't even realize it, however it is very fitting that it was a positive post about MS! :)

ioan

2nd June 2010, 21:10

I didn't know that Nico has claimed that he was faster. I think that the current F1 youngsters demonstrate stunning arrogance. :(

I think that but one race he always claimed that he could have qualified and raced better, he even claimed he could have taken pole position in Monaco.

Maybe it's something his father taught him to do, or he is just having a too good impression about himself.

Anyway he can talk the talk and MS can walk the walk and this is what matters in the end.

ioan

2nd June 2010, 21:12

One is technically a pensioner, the other a young man. The Shoe should not be able to compete with the likes of Nico in a modern F1 car, but he is. I would be embarrased if my father was better at sports than I am.

I was amazed at how fit he was after the Turkish GP when compared to the much younger drivers on the podium. Impressive form to say the least.

ioan

2nd June 2010, 21:13

You would have reached 20,000 a long time ago if the moderators hadn't interfered.. :p :)

True that! ;)

Wild Dog

9th June 2010, 12:01

I think Sutil or Heidfeld would replace him after this or maybe next season. But maybe Ross Brawn look after a german talent. :hmph:

ShiftingGears

9th June 2010, 12:07

I definitely think Heidfeld deserves a spot on the grid. But Schumacher isn't going to be replaced, and nor should he be.

ArrowsFA1

9th June 2010, 12:11

Anyway he can talk the talk and MS can walk the walk and this is what matters in the end.
Nico has almost double the points of his team-mate (66-34). I'd say he's walking the walk very well :)

555-04Q2

10th June 2010, 07:01

Nico has almost double the points of his team-mate (66-34). I'd say he's walking the walk very well :)

True, but The Shoe has been MIA for 3 years (he's an old man now!) and only starting to fire now after the first three races were terrible for him. It should be a different story by the end of the season. The Shoe by 20 points in the end.

i_max2k2

10th June 2010, 07:33

Nico has almost double the points of his team-mate (66-34). I'd say he's walking the walk very well :)

Absolutely he has almost double the points, btw how many messed up races did he have so far? If you take out Spain at most he has finished his races to the max he could, not that he has done badly. For Schumi starting from Australia with the first corner incidence (not his mistake), to Malasyia with DNF, Monaco with the penalty, and Chinese gp give or take his chassis problem, his results has been - 6,4,4 in the three races where it has been normal for him, add monaco to that he finished 6th, I don't think he has done badly for being out of the sport for 3 yrs. And I'm sure after 12 races he would be comfortably ahead of Nico.

Dave B

11th June 2010, 15:33

Schumacher himself is saying that he's accepted he'll not win the championship this year (shock!) but is looking forward to 2011. So he ain't planning on going anywhere!

It's more about building up and organising things for what happens from next year onwards, but you never know, it's still a long year with many points available."

Full article: http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2010/jun/11/michael-schumacher-mercedes