how to spice up the show?

[UltimateDanGTR]

the team bosses are discussing this, so why shouldn't the fans?


apart from my preference of more overtaking efficient cars (no complicated diffusers then) and better tracks (no bahrain in my ideal world then.....in the same world as f1 at potrero de los funes, the monza including the oval section, the old interlagos, the old hockenheim, ain diab and road america.....) anyway, you could have:

push to pass? (gimmick, but would be fun IMO)

more stringent rules on swiping/blocking (rather a differentiation between the 2. strictly not 'improving the show' but, ya know...)

cars that are harder to drive (ie no aids, so more driver input required, thus in theory more exciting racing)


now, any more ideas?

[F1boat]

I am against artificial spicing as I enjoyed the races this year and IMO you can never have whole season of great racing, as you can't have whole season of great soccer matches. But if you HAVE to bring gimmicks, push to pass is cool.

[UltimateDanGTR]

I am against artificial spicing as I enjoyed the races this year and IMO you can never have whole season of great racing, as you can't have whole season of great soccer matches. But if you HAVE to bring gimmicks, push to pass is cool.

i agree actually. no, a full season of epicly fun races should not be expected.

however, i believe changing the cars and tracks for the better would be more entertaining and better all round.

push to pass would be fun, works in indycar, if not entirely 'F1'. but, kers was an idea batted about and tested and used by some teams, and they are discussing bringing back that currently. that would be like push to pass, but with green credentials. if it was a fair format, id be for the return.

[truefan72]

to me short term, the easiest thing to do would be to allow refueling.

it will produce a mix of strategies, overtaking and certainly spice up the show.

They are already carrying that fuel around anyway so it would only be a matter of dusting off the rigs and making sure the blokes haven't forgotten the skills.

[Mysterious Rock]

the point is though woth no refueling the passes have to be done on track as the cars are all even on fuel, before they would wait until the pitstops now its a matter of if u want past u gotta do it on the track

[AndyRAC]

No thanks - this is meant to be the Pinnacle of motorsport. It shouldn't be 'spiced up' - Alonso was quite right. If you want entertainment - watch other formulae - Nascar, BTCC, etc
Saying that - i'd keep the refueling ban - but i'd want Bridgestone to do a better job with their tyres. Soft tyres should only last 15-20 laps max. And get rid of the compulsory 2 tyres per race.

[Dr. Krogshöj]

1) Reduce the amount of downforce and increase machanical grip.

• Ban double diffusers (already done for 2011).
• Mandate the rear wing angle to a short range near the Monza-spec.
• Limit the number of front wing flaps to one.
• Restore front tyre width to 2009 levels (and increase the width of the rear tyres proportionally).

2) Bring back push-to-pass (a.k.a. KERS). It wouldn't facilitate overtaking on tracks that have a single overtaking spot because everyone would push the button on the same straight. But it would help on circuits where there are multiple overtaking spots like Sepang.

These can be done for 2011. For this year, realistically speaking, two mandatory green flag pit stops might help, as some team bosses suggest. But I don't think there is any need for more radical changes.

[stephenw_us]

I think unlimited KERS (not spec) - the 18 inch rears, the double diffuser ban, and a smaller rear wing ought to do it...

in other words, let the current suggestions by the teams through...

[EuroTroll]

Harder tyres -- less grip and fewer "marbles" outside the racing line.

Artificial wetting.

It's the pinnacle of motorsports, yes. But that doesn't mean it shouldn't be consistently fun to watch!

[Sonic]

I think unlimited KERS (not spec) - the 18 inch rears, the double diffuser ban, and a smaller rear wing ought to do it...

in other words, let the current suggestions by the teams through...

Yes, if KERS returns it must be unlimited! The pointless max output regulations of last year were poorly thought out and offered next to no benefit.

tyres are hugely important and requires a great deal of research to find the ideal path; but the smaller fronts can't have helped. Maintain the percentage difference by all means but have the rears get larger - that would also increase the drag of the cars to make drafting easier.

Whatever dimension the rear wings are the engineers always find a way to create monster levels of DF and therefore dirty air. That will never be solved, so IMO the only solution is to make the cars inefficient in a straight line - punch a massive hole in the air by means of some mandatory spoiler.

[wedge]

'Better' tyre allocation with no step change gimmicks and free-for-all with tyre strategy.

Realistically I would like to see BS revise the tyre spec brought to races but they have their tyres logistics sorted till whichever GP down the line and won't compromise their budget. And Hopefully FOTA are not stupid enough to go for mandatory 2 stops.

[ArrowsFA1]

Tony Brooks: "A Grand Prix car should always have slightly more power than the chassis can comfortably handle.”

Gilles Villeneuve: "My ideal Formula One car would be something like a McLaren M23 with a big normally aspirated engine, 800 hp, 21 inch rear tyres. A lot of people say we should have narrower tires, but I don't agree because you need big tyres to slow you down when you spin. And you need a lot of horsepower to unstick big tyres, to make the cars slide. That would be a bloody fantastic spectacle, I can tell you. We would take corners one gear lower than we do now, and get the cars sideways. You know, people still rave about Ronnie Peterson in a Lotus 72, and I understand that. I agree with them. That's the kind of entertainment I want to give the crowds. I believe the crowd is really losing out at the moment, and that's bad."

Aero and tyres determine grip levels. Engines determine power.

All the tweaks we've seen tried, or suggested, such as refuelling, various different qualifying formats, KERS, narrower tyres, grooved tyres etc have done, and will do, nothing to address what Brooks and Villeneuve were talking about.

[Mark]

Redical changes to the aero so that following cars are almost completely unaffected by the 'dirty air'. They've been saying this for 30 years!

There's no need to get rid of front or rear wings, just make them standard issue.

As for the rest, get rid of the engine freeze! Lets have a development power battle! Engines are too reliable these days too.

[Valve Bounce]

now, any more ideas?

Yep! coming up!! Get them to come in for a driver change and let one of the grid girls do the second stint.

[bluegem280]

The more overtaking may spice up the show, head to head wheeling at places a driver can give enough defensive drive to retain the position is exciting. Perhaps typical of race with enough length of some floating corner of chicanes can promote drivers with more influence on defensive and juicy race.

[Big Ben]

they could change all the drivers with members from this forum. That should spice up the race.... for 2 laps... or I'm being optimistic?

[slorydn1]

they could change all the drivers with members from this forum. That should spice up the race.... for 2 laps... or I'm being optimistic?

I don't think you would want me subbing for your favorite driver (or mine, for that matter)....I'm not so sure I would make it through Eau Rouge in one piece, and that's just on the short blast after having merged from pit road :p :

[slorydn1]

Redical changes to the aero so that following cars are almost completely unaffected by the 'dirty air'. They've been saying this for 30 years!

There's no need to get rid of front or rear wings, just make them standard issue.

As for the rest, get rid of the engine freeze! Lets have a development power battle! Engines are too reliable these days too.

Now that's change I can believe in :up:

Heck, bring back the V-10....no wait, better yet, bring 'em all back....everything from a turbo-charged V-6 up to the ground pounding V-12, and let the constructer decide what the displacement is gonna be! Now THAT would be priceless.

[Big Ben]

I don't think you would want me subbing for your favorite driver (or mine, for that matter)....I'm not so sure I would make it through Eau Rouge in one piece, and that's just on the short blast after having merged from pit road :p :

It's not eau rouge but for some reason this video popped up in my mind :laugh:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETrsMuOiROM

[slorydn1]

It's not eau rouge but for some reason this video popped up in my mind :laugh:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETrsMuOiROM


cool :up: i remember that....wasn't that in the late 90's?

[Big Ben]

cool :up: i remember that....wasn't that in the late 90's?

1998. Hill won that race in a Jordan after MS crashed in DC's car. 1998-2000 were probably the seasons I enjoyed the most so far. And to the topic, back then overtaking wasn't piece of cake either (and it shouldn't be) but seemed more likely to happen than now.

[Big Ben]

Very optimistic mon amis. I have 2 karting trophies but I'm hardly Lewis Hamilton. My neck would be in agonizing pain by the first chicane.. :p :)

I would be very careful for the first few laps (that is going 50 km/h) before trying anything so unless you'd take me out I thing i have a good chance of making those 2 laps... true, in 10-12 minutes... doesn't sound that spicy after all. forget about it, let's keep it the way it is.

[steveaki13]

It's not eau rouge but for some reason this video popped up in my mind :laugh:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETrsMuOiROM



I think if we replaced the drivers for GPs then I would be like Ricardo Rosset was there, ploughing into everyone else after the accident had happened. :laugh:

[steveaki13]

On a serious note my key changes would be


Tyres: The tyres must vary more, super soft for 10-15 laps, soft for 20-25 laps, medium for half a race 40 laps, and hard for the whole race. With no stops mandatory.[/*:m:2frqvmcd]
Personally I would like to see manual gearboxes return.[/*:m:2frqvmcd]
Lower Grip levels (Not being as technical as some here I am not really sure what is the most effective way to achieve this).[/*:m:2frqvmcd]
Engines: I would welcome a mix of Engines i.e like the early mid 90's V6 V8 V10 or even V12[/*:m:2frqvmcd]
Tracks: More of a return to classic circuits, also circuits that are not all snooker table smooth, a few bumpys through corners should make them work for their money.[/*:m:2frqvmcd]If all of these came in, I think I might explode with excitment as it would become a fantasy formula.

[truefan72]

And incorporating a fuel filler cap back into the side of the car, or we'd have pitstops lasting into the minutes whilst the engine covers are removed.. :p :)

lol , yes,

although i think they are there somewhere, but not really used

[Roamy]

I think the series has come good.

[Saint Devote]

A world champion dares to speak truth - if you find F1 "boring" DON'T WATCH - MIKA HAKKINEN says:

http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=363649&FS=F1

So people that want extra show, maybe they should reconsider whether they want to watch Formula One," said the Finnish driver.

Similarly, Hakkinen urges critics to look deeper before dismissing the pinnacle of motor sport.

"They should study it. If you just turn on your television and watch the Grand Prix and watch people go around and around, it's boring and you change the channel.

"The more knowledge you have, the more interesting it is," he told the New Zealand newspaper Weekend Herald,

[fandango]

Redical changes to the aero so that following cars are almost completely unaffected by the 'dirty air'. They've been saying this for 30 years!

There's no need to get rid of front or rear wings, just make them standard issue.

As for the rest, get rid of the engine freeze! Lets have a development power battle! Engines are too reliable these days too.

I agree, but isn't there a non-radical way to do this? I mean, I remember the eighties, when they had to change the rules to improve the drivers' chances of surviving an accident (and with both feet still attached). This all resulted, eventually, in the crash tests that each car must pass now at the start of the season.

When they talk about "dirty air" and the downforce lost by the car behind, it's something that can be measured. I don't know what the figure is, but you hear them saying that the chasing car loses x% of downforce when it gets closer.

So, why don't they just make it a rule that no car can disturb the air for the following cars by more than X %?

They'd do a wind-tunnel test at the beginning of the season at the same time as the crash tests, and it would be up to genuis's like Adrian Newey to figure out how to have optimum aerdynamics while keeping within the regulations.

[V12]

I agree, but isn't there a non-radical way to do this? I mean, I remember the eighties, when they had to change the rules to improve the drivers' chances of surviving an accident (and with both feet still attached). This all resulted, eventually, in the crash tests that each car must pass now at the start of the season.

When they talk about "dirty air" and the downforce lost by the car behind, it's something that can be measured. I don't know what the figure is, but you hear them saying that the chasing car loses x% of downforce when it gets closer.

So, why don't they just make it a rule that no car can disturb the air for the following cars by more than X %?

They'd do a wind-tunnel test at the beginning of the season at the same time as the crash tests, and it would be up to genuis's like Adrian Newey to figure out how to have optimum aerdynamics while keeping within the regulations.

I wouldn't mind that actually, would make an interesting challenge. Definitely no standard front/rear wings - we have enough standard components as it is :mad: (and they need to be gotten rid of too) I'd rather wings be banned altogether, if your idea is a good one if it could be made workable.

[i_max2k2]

I would think bringing back kers could be interesting given, it has to be used by all teams, and it doesn't do bad for the weight distribution of the cars, as last year when some cars had kers they had poor balance, so the effect that they were trying to achieve, wasn't really there. Also front and rear tyres being as wide as they were in 2009. But I guess for immediate results, having two compulsory pit stops would help.

[V12]

KERS should only come back if it's opened up to a proper development race and unleashed, no stupid standard system or something you can only use for so many seconds per lap or whatever. Sadly we'll probably get both of those things :(

[jens]

The funny thing is the fans keep asking basically each year, how to spice up the show. FIA keeps changing rules almost each year, but we still keep asking the same questions without ever reaching a result. :p : Throughout years we have seen all kinds of various set of rules, but nothing has been genuinely groundbreaking despite expectations. It's already harder to ask, what still hasn't been tried among other things. People keep throwing out new thoughts about "solutions", but as time has repeatedly proven, none of those idealistic theories work.

I've given up on this. Let F1 be as it is. F1 is meant to be "boring" - fastest cars drive away from others into the distance. If that's the way it is, let the best one dominate and they deserve to do so. I doubt the banning of double diffuser is going to change anything significant. If even the radical rules of 2009 were incapable of changing anything, nothing is! Only if we get some massively artificial methods like those vastly deteriorating soft tyres we saw Oz'09 - well for sure this does spice up the show, but then once again fans would start questioning whether F1 needs to become a joke and the same discussion circle about solutions starts all over again. :p :