2010 Bahrain Formula 1 GP Thread

[ozrevhead]

9 days 23 hours and 9 minuets to go - its time to get the first Race Thread of the year revved up

HEY PINO! - Is the chat room ready to rock and roll for next week?

IM SO PUMPED!!!

[pino]

Sorry guys but at the moment I cannot provide the usual chat-room :(

[ozrevhead]

bugger :(

i might have an option but id have to ask nicely

[pino]

What option ?

[Sonic]

Well I guess with temperatures sky high compare to the cold damp test days it will come down to whoever can look after their tyres best. Suggestions are that would be Sauber, Mercedes, Ferrari and Hamilton in the Macca.

The Red Bulls seem to be chewing their rubber up as does Jenson (apparently).

[christophulus]

Probably worth sticking this in again - they've added a new loop after turn 4, which might make the race even tougher on the brakes:

http://cdn.images.autosport.com/editorial/1264430274.jpg

[Sonic]

Probably worth sticking this in again - they've added a new loop after turn 4, which might make the race even tougher on the brakes:


Indeed. If Webs can run out of anchors last year, then with 170kilos of fuel sloshing about those same brakes are going to take a real punishment.

[AndyL]

They were talking about having thicker brake discs this year, I never heard if that change got into the rules though.

[Sonic]

They were talking about having thicker brake discs this year, I never heard if that change got into the rules though.

As I understand it the rules for dimension for brake discs has not changed - hence why the brake ducts have ballooned in size compared to '09.

Interestingly McLaren have shrunk their ducts in the most recent mods - presumably they were over cooled.

[DazzlaF1]

EIGHT days and counting till the very first practice session of the new season. Cant wait

[Sonic]

EIGHT days and counting till the very first practice session of the new season. Cant wait

And aprox the same number of days until the arrival of my second mini-me. I wonder if they have TV's in the delivery room? ;)

[Koz]

Use http://kozzington.com/chat/ for the chat if Pino's chat ain't working by then.

[UltimateDanGTR]

trying to predict who will win the Bahrain Grand Prix at the moment is impossible, or at least for me it is. but this aint such a bad thing!

[Saint Devote]

Well I guess with temperatures sky high compare to the cold damp test days it will come down to whoever can look after their tyres best. Suggestions are that would be Sauber, Mercedes, Ferrari and Hamilton in the Macca.

The Red Bulls seem to be chewing their rubber up as does Jenson (apparently).

Thats a new one and it would be a first one - Jenson has NEVER "chewed up" tyres in all the years - that was one item always mentioned by Flavio - a very difficult person.

Last year CEO Bridgestone racing in Autosport and F1 Racing is on record saying that Jenson is amazingly easy on his tyres.

And people like Nigel Roebuck and Mark Hughes have written about how well Button handles his tyres. And they have BOTH - and Hughes is a real apologist for Lewis - said that Jenson's tyre wear is "Prost-like".

Ross Brawn has mentioned that Jenson is inbcredibly easy on his tyres.

Lewis with the KERS notably chewed up rear tyres in 2009. He could never look after them. This is not to say he will not learn to as he is atop racing driver. But his style as Webber's is whip oversteer and that is terrible for tyre wear.

I would be extremely surprised if the Red Bulls chewed their tyres - they did not do that in 2009 and Webber is far tougher on his tyres than Vettel.

The key issues in testing were to try and set the car up to a point that tyre wear relative to the weight of the car would not be a factor and therefore the driver would be able to go long stints flat out without unusual tyre wear.

This is what Jenson said part of the focus was at Valencia and Jerez.

[ShiftingGears]

I don't think the new layout will punish the brakes more than it usually does. The new section is relatively slow, and don't forget that there's going to be less laps which means that the cars won't go through those massive braking areas at Turn 1, 4 and at the end of the lap as often.

I'm not really sure what the point of the new layout is. Judging by previews it doesn't really add any extra challenge to the track, and Bahrain could easily fit the extra teams anyway. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joJfd5yQ7-Q

[gloomyDAY]

Call me when the season starts, in Australia!

[Saint Devote]

I love those long straights. Last year the cars racing down them with the way the desert carries the sound was just superb! :-]

[Sonic]

Thats a new one and it would be a first one - Jenson has NEVER "chewed up" tyres in all the years - that was one item always mentioned by Flavio - a very difficult person.

Last year CEO Bridgestone racing in Autosport and F1 Racing is on record saying that Jenson is amazingly easy on his tyres.

And people like Nigel Roebuck and Mark Hughes have written about how well Button handles his tyres. And they have BOTH - and Hughes is a real apologist for Lewis - said that Jenson's tyre wear is "Prost-like".

Ross Brawn has mentioned that Jenson is inbcredibly easy on his tyres.

Lewis with the KERS notably chewed up rear tyres in 2009. He could never look after them. This is not to say he will not learn to as he is atop racing driver. But his style as Webber's is whip oversteer and that is terrible for tyre wear.

I would be extremely surprised if the Red Bulls chewed their tyres - they did not do that in 2009 and Webber is far tougher on his tyres than Vettel.

The key issues in testing were to try and set the car up to a point that tyre wear relative to the weight of the car would not be a factor and therefore the driver would be able to go long stints flat out without unusual tyre wear.

This is what Jenson said part of the focus was at Valencia and Jerez.

I agree its unusual - based on what we know - but that's what I heard. Red Bull have admitted they are too hard on their tyres on a long run so would have to quali on the harder compounds if they want a longer stint.

As for Jenson, perhaps its the skinny fronts that require a different style that has his legendary tyre preservation skills in a mess at the moment.

[Saint Devote]

I agree its unusual - based on what we know - but that's what I heard. Red Bull have admitted they are too hard on their tyres on a long run so would have to quali on the harder compounds if they want a longer stint.

As for Jenson, perhaps its the skinny fronts that require a different style that has his legendary tyre preservation skills in a mess at the moment.

The reports are misleading - a driver and a team that had the best car in 2009 and with the RB6 an evolution do not suddenly have such problems. Especially Jenson. In all the formulas he has raced, car conservation has been a hallmark.

In addition there has been no such reporting from the Autosport journalists and if it was the case, it would have been known about by now.

On Twitter during testing, the Mclaren team were extremely happy with the way the car was with new tyres and Jenson discovered that the car was even more sensitive than the Brawn in slow corners which is Jenson's known strength and another commonality with Alain Prost.

A naturally smooth driver with understeer as his comfort zone does not make sense to be hard on tyres. It is oversteer drivers that overheat tyree and grain them preventing the proper chemical reaction from occurring.

Until such time as there are actual struggles by Mclaren or Red Bull - the two most innovative cars this year and the two teams most likely to head the grand prix at Sakhir, I will dismiss such stories as naysaying by interested parties.

[Big Ben]

I will dismiss such stories as naysaying by interested parties.

Ok. That's fine by me. No need to get too excited. What you think, or me, or anyone else is bubkis. Just wait and in a few days and you'll see how things stand. All this wishful thinking doesn't really matter.

[AndyL]

I agree its unusual - based on what we know - but that's what I heard. Red Bull have admitted they are too hard on their tyres on a long run so would have to quali on the harder compounds if they want a longer stint.

As for Jenson, perhaps its the skinny fronts that require a different style that has his legendary tyre preservation skills in a mess at the moment.

Where did you hear it? Not questioning your veracity at all Sonic, just interested to know the source.

[Sleeper]

The reports are misleading - a driver and a team that had the best car in 2009 and with the RB6 an evolution do not suddenly have such problems. Especially Jenson. In all the formulas he has raced, car conservation has been a hallmark.

In addition there has been no such reporting from the Autosport journalists and if it was the case, it would have been known about by now.

On Twitter during testing, the Mclaren team were extremely happy with the way the car was with new tyres and Jenson discovered that the car was even more sensitive than the Brawn in slow corners which is Jenson's known strength and another commonality with Alain Prost.

A naturally smooth driver with understeer as his comfort zone does not make sense to be hard on tyres. It is oversteer drivers that overheat tyree and grain them preventing the proper chemical reaction from occurring.

Until such time as there are actual struggles by Mclaren or Red Bull - the two most innovative cars this year and the two teams most likely to head the grand prix at Sakhir, I will dismiss such stories as naysaying by interested parties.
The reports come from Bridgestone (about Jenson) and Red Bull themsleves and were reported in Autosport yesterday. Of course, this could all be related to running in near freezing tempretures and the tyres will act very differently in the desert heat.

Oh and the Red Bull has always been hard on its tyres, it cost Webber the win in Hungry last year because the tyres just wouldnt hold up as well as the McLarens.

[Sleeper]

Cant say I like the new section to Sakhir, it removes one of the few fast corner sections of the track.

[Sonic]

The reports are misleading - a driver and a team that had the best car in 2009 and with the RB6 an evolution do not suddenly have such problems. Especially Jenson. In all the formulas he has raced, car conservation has been a hallmark.

In addition there has been no such reporting from the Autosport journalists and if it was the case, it would have been known about by now.

On Twitter during testing, the Mclaren team were extremely happy with the way the car was with new tyres and Jenson discovered that the car was even more sensitive than the Brawn in slow corners which is Jenson's known strength and another commonality with Alain Prost.

A naturally smooth driver with understeer as his comfort zone does not make sense to be hard on tyres. It is oversteer drivers that overheat tyree and grain them preventing the proper chemical reaction from occurring.

Until such time as there are actual struggles by Mclaren or Red Bull - the two most innovative cars this year and the two teams most likely to head the grand prix at Sakhir, I will dismiss such stories as naysaying by interested parties.

Gods, that was a long post to basically say "I don't believe it" :D

Anyway, he's the quotes;


It (the Red Bulls) suffered high tyre degradation.
"we are working on the tyre situation..." Mark Webber.
"The key thing is to understand the tyre" Horner.


And for Jenson;

According to Bridgestone....


super-smooth world champion Jenson Button is working his tyres to hard, while aggressive Lewis Hamilton has it under control

From the horses mouth as it were St.D.

[steveaki13]

I have watched F1 since 1991 and I can't remember a season opener where I had so little idea of the order. Its great.

I can't wait.
Only 5 days, 8 hours and 20 minutes until we get our first idea.

I am so excited I can't keep still. :bounce:

[Saint Devote]

There is a big difference between working the tyres too hard as a driver and the tyre reacting in specific conditions.

In addition any comment from Autosport where Jenson is concerned and Hamilton has to be suspect. Autosport are, and when that big fat toad was F1 Racing's editor was also one of Hamilton's apologists.

It reminds me of the days of Nigel Mansell when Autosport and others accused him of pretending to limp to the podium after a race for "effect".

[Koz]

There is a big difference between working the tyres too hard as a driver and the tyre reacting in specific conditions.

So it's the tyres fault and not Button for he can do no wrong, is that what you are saying?

[ozrevhead]

I have watched F1 since 1991 and I can't remember a season opener where I had so little idea of the order. Its great.

I can't wait.
Only 5 days, 8 hours and 20 minutes until we get our first idea.

I am so excited I can't keep still.
your not the only one :bounce: This is the most open WDC Ive have ever seen since since ive started watching in 93.....Also im going to the Oz GP so my excitment levels are sky high :D :D There is somthing ive never experinced ever im my F1 life, and thats starting to toy with the idea that Mark is in it up to his eyeballs in this championship. Cautiously Optamistic would sum how I feel.

[Saint Devote]

trying to predict who will win the Bahrain Grand Prix at the moment is impossible, or at least for me it is. but this aint such a bad thing!

Schumacher won the first grand prix and the Alonso won it twice and Massa twice as well. Jenson won it last year and of course I am hoping for another consecutive winner.

The pole position winner has only won it three out of six and the lowest grid position [twice] to win was fourth - Alonso and Button.

So - the winner is likely to be from the first four on the grid and one in two from pole?

BUT - this year the driver counts more because there is no refuelling and so we could have situation that the driver best able to conserve tyres and depending on fuel consumption could really make up positions in the last twenty laps or so.

Question is whether the Ferrari is still as thirsty as last year and does the Renault have the best fuel consumption. If Viry-Chatillon has increased the power then maybe, Red Bull will be favorites with Kubica as the wild card?

This type of racing favors Schumi compared to previously and he is until proven otherwise the best at managing and altering his car and driving.

I would love to see compulsory pit stops completely abandoned because then it totally up to the driver to manage the car well.

Will the cars that are perhaps less than a second and mid-grid go for a quick pit stop after one lap and then drive conservatively the rest of the way making up time as the others at the front push each other, wear the tyres, especially those who are oversteer drivers and stop later.

The mid-grid doing well as a result. Robert Kubica for a surprise podium? He does go well at the track and won pole position in 2008.

Mercedes have good power and Jenson has always driven a car smoothly, never punishing it, he won the race last year and his best qualification was third in the Honda in 2006. Hamilton has never won at Sakhir but he qualifies well and has finished second.

A Mclaren one-two?

The winner is likely to come from FIVE drivers: Button, Hamilton, Vettel, Alonso or Massa. That is my prediction. Not specific but narriwed!

[F1boat]

Historically Ferrari are very strong at Sakhir and it should be a track in which their drivers will excel. But I hope that Michael will stun all of them with a victory!

[Sonic]

There is a big difference between working the tyres too hard as a driver and the tyre reacting in specific conditions.


:D so now you know more than Bridgestone? I can't help but notice you used Bridgestone as a reference on a previous page when they were praising Jensons style, but now they are stating a fact - you don't accept it? Rose tinted glasses!



In addition any comment from Autosport where Jenson is concerned and Hamilton has to be suspect. Autosport are, and when that big fat toad was F1 Racing's editor was also one of Hamilton's apologists.


You initially rejected my informationed based on the fact that "autosport had not reported it" now that you've been proven wrong on that you accuse them of bias? Perhaps you'd prefer them to put a positive spin on Jensons troubles - for example, no more tyre heating problems!

[Saint Devote]

:D so now you know more than Bridgestone? I can't help but notice you used Bridgestone as a reference on a previous page when they were praising Jensons style, but now they are stating a fact - you don't accept it? Rose tinted glasses!

There is a difference between what happens at an event - a test - and the comments in 2009 that the CEO of Bridgestone saying that through the ENTIRE SEASON Button has been incredibly easy on his tyres.

Secondly, I have no idea of the context that Bridgestone spoke or what Mclaren were testing. I can assure you that nobody at Mclaren and definitely not Jenson through his web site are worried about soething that would be a first.

Until Sakhir is past, I will continue to doubt that an unusual tyre wear is a trend.

You initially rejected my informationed based on the fact that "autosport had not reported it" now that you've been proven wrong on that you accuse them of bias? Perhaps you'd prefer them to put a positive spin on Jensons troubles - for example, no more tyre heating problems!

A positive spin? I have been a supporter of Jenson through the Williams, the dratted Flavio period and the hated Honda era until Brawn.

I think I do understand Jenson's style of driving better than Bridgestone, Yes, and I refer you to my comment above.

And Autosport IS biased along with many others against Jenson. Just look back at the comments after Jenson won his World title.

The ONLY person to defend him was Kimi. And the reason given by Brundle that Raikkonen is out of F1 and agreed with by the former F1 driver is a pretty poor reflection on what has happened in F1.

[Dave B]

I think I do understand Jenson's style of driving better than Bridgestone, Yes, and I refer you to my comment above.
Seriously?

Seriously?

Wow.

[Sonic]

Seriously?

Seriously?

Wow.

Ditto!

ROFLMAO! :D

[Saint Devote]

Well I don't care what anyone believes or thinks. Nobody believed that Jenson COULD win the world title and when he did the campaign to undermine his achievement merely illustrated the cognitive dissonance of the perpetrators.

So why exactly ought I to accept that suddenly his known ability where tyres is concerned, confirmed by Ross Brawn in interviews after the championship win, has not changed, but SHIFTED?

And how convenient - the sudden shift has occurred at exactly the same time that not just anyone, but HAMILTON is suddenly so smooth and easy on HIS tyres. What an amazing coinicidence!!!!

So until we see the results at Sakhir and maybe until after Shanghai where a trend of the new season will become apparent, I reserve my judgement and continue to have confidence in what is historically known.

[Sonic]

Ahhh back to the same old rhetoric. We are not talking about his historical smoothness, or even what he may/will adapt to this season and recover some/all of his tyre management skills. I doubt any of us believe Jenson can learn to master the new tyres, what we doubt is that you, a fan (an enthusiastic one to be sure, but still a fan) know more about the style of a GP driver than tyre technicians and engineers that work with him every day.

Can you prove your claim? Can you provide simple information regarding Jenson at say turn one, Barcelona? Say turn in speed, apex speed? Or more detailed? Perhaps steering angle, throttle application, slip angle?

No? Then you can't lay claim to knowing more than the pro's!

[Sonic]

Ooops. Demo edit failed so the middle line should have read; "I doubt any of us believe that jenson can't learn to to master the new tyres"

[Saint Devote]

Ahhh back to the same old rhetoric. We are not talking about his historical smoothness, or even what he may/will adapt to this season and recover some/all of his tyre management skills. I doubt any of us believe Jenson can learn to master the new tyres, what we doubt is that you, a fan (an enthusiastic one to be sure, but still a fan) know more about the style of a GP driver than tyre technicians and engineers that work with him every day.

Can you prove your claim? Can you provide simple information regarding Jenson at say turn one, Barcelona? Say turn in speed, apex speed? Or more detailed? Perhaps steering angle, throttle application, slip angle?

No? Then you can't lay claim to knowing more than the pro's!

I dont have to provide boring technical detail and I cant.

But what I can do is refer you to MY long time support of Jenson - you tend to get to know a driver's ability - and the comments on Jenson of Anthony Davidson, Paul Lemmens, Jim Warren, Serge Saulnier, Marcus Pye, Jackie Eeckelaert, Andy Shovelin, Frank Williams, Alain Prost and so on.

[truefan72]

So it's the tyres fault and not Button for he can do no wrong, is that what you are saying?

basically ;)

[Sonic]

I dont have to provide boring technical detail and I cant.


Fair enough. Perhaps you'd like to retract your earlier statement?



But what I can do is refer you to MY long time support of Jenson - you tend to get to know a driver's ability - and the comments on Jenson of Anthony Davidson, Paul Lemmens, Jim Warren, Serge Saulnier, Marcus Pye, Jackie Eeckelaert, Andy Shovelin, Frank Williams, Alain Prost and so on.

And as I've said many times I'm hugely impressed that a long term fan such as yourself can be so enthusiastic about their chosen driver. Personally I haven't had that since Damon retired but with the benefit of hindsight I can see that I was blinded to his flaws and faults.

So if Bridgestone engineers say he hasn't come to grips with the new narrow tyres I am inclined to believe them over a fan.

[truefan72]

Ditto!

ROFLMAO! :D

me three

this is priceless LOL

[truefan72]

I dont have to provide boring technical detail and I cant.

But what I can do is refer you to MY long time support of Jenson - you tend to get to know a driver's ability - and the comments on Jenson of Anthony Davidson, Paul Lemmens, Jim Warren, Serge Saulnier, Marcus Pye, Jackie Eeckelaert, Andy Shovelin, Frank Williams, Alain Prost and so on.

...lol this is getting out of control.

The saint knows more than bridgestone technical staff and engineers. and your credibility in that matter is your long time fan support of Jensen by which you have somehow managed to acquire (via osmosis I presume) detailed information about his driving ability far superior to millions of dollars worth of technical data and sensors.

you strike me as the sort of fan who thinks he has a deep personal relationship with the person they idolize.

come back to earth saint, go towards the light!

[Saint Devote]

watching some of the Australian V8 racing at Sakhir a week ago, the track looks good. Palm trees and some greenery along with the beauty of the desert just beautiful.

The straights always provide good sight and sound.

The track is going to be a superb first track of the season and the teams will no doubt be happy to be in the warm middle-east away from countries with cold climates and, the horrible snowy weather of the recent winter.

I can only imagine what it must be like to have lived ALL one's life in a cold climate.

[truefan72]

yep ,and with the changes to the track ,no doubt it will have the feeling of being at a new circuit. 5 days until FP1!!!

[ShiftingGears]

I think I do understand Jenson's style of driving better than Bridgestone, Yes, and I refer you to my comment above.

Do you expect people to take you seriously?

[Saint Devote]

The track always has looked good IMO, as far as condition is concerned. With the amount of money that is spent at Sakhir, the track appears to be brand new every year. Its also nice to learn that a "hosepipe ban" is not enforced in that part of the world judging by the greenery edition at Sakhir. :)

There are irrigation methods that measure the optimum amount of water neccessary - drip irrigation and a system that is placed under the desert sand enabling a fertile top.

Through neccessity Israeli companies developed these systems and I am sure that places like Bahrain use this sort of technology.

Another race in the mid-east on the cards - Qatar. Do I laugh or cry?

I think it would be better for F1 to return to a traditional track - but then F1 never pays attention to fans.

[turismo6]

A quick subject change I see there, very wise.. :p

The track always has looked good IMO, as far as condition is concerned. With the amount of money that is spent at Sakhir, the track appears to be brand new every year. Its also nice to learn that a "hosepipe ban" is not enforced in that part of the world judging by the greenery edition at Sakhir. :)


Yeah that artificial grass needs alot of water.

[Saint Devote]

Yeah that artificial grass needs alot of water.

You think it is artificial? It is not nessessarily so. There are hardy grasses.

[Koz]

Do you expect people to take you seriously?

Damn where is ioan when you need him most?

SD, you need a professional psychological evaluation... I think even Button would agree with me on that one.

[pino]

Guys, let's quit personal comments...thank you!

[K-Pu]

I think it would be better for F1 to return to a traditional track - but then F1 never pays attention to fans.

Not so long ago you told me going to weird places where no one cares about it was good for F1 because Bernie knew it and we didn´t. And Bernie did what was best for the sport. And then I was wrong.


I think the asking price ought to be whatever the market can bear - it is the only way to calculate value. And there is a LIST of countries seeking to hold a grand prix.

For me to state that I know better than the man who created the F1 we know and love as to what is good for F1 in these cases would be a most arrongant and conceited action.


That was your answer to my point if it´s right to take F1 to Bahrein and so on. There you seemed to be on Bernie´s side, and now you speak from the fan side? Now you know best, just like Hulk Hogan? Or it is just a turncoat move at convenience? Now am I right?

[Shifter]

Perhaps I should reserve judgement until I take a look at that Aussie V8 'preview', but I don't think I like the new addition to the circuit. It would make the place more fun in my street car, but for F1 purposes the term 'mickey mouse' comes to mind.

[Saint Devote]

Not so long ago you told me going to weird places where no one cares about it was good for F1 because Bernie knew it and we didn´t. And Bernie did what was best for the sport. And then I was wrong.

Only wrong is your interpretation. Why do you assume all or nothing? I think that another grand prix right next door to the other two Gulf states is not neccessary and rather try to ressurrect traditional venues.

That was your answer to my point if it´s right to take F1 to Bahrein and so on. There you seemed to be on Bernie´s side, and now you speak from the fan side? Now you know best, just like Hulk Hogan? Or it is just a turncoat move at convenience? Now am I right?

I am on Bernie's side, as is pitlane and anyone else who uderstands that F1 is the house that Bernie built.

[gloomyDAY]

I am on Bernie's side, as is pitlane and anyone else who uderstands that F1 is the house that Bernie built.Thanks for the signature.

[Saint Devote]

You are welcome!

I am on Bernie side and so is the driver today that is closest to him and Bernie his defacto manager - Sebastian Vettel.

[gloomyDAY]

You are welcome!

I am on Bernie side and so is the driver today that is closest to him and Bernie his defacto manager - Sebastian Vettel.Explain that one to me, son.

I'm sure they have a personal relationship, but that doesn't make Bernie Vettel's manager. I guess Bernie must be Alonso's manger too, I mean, they do play poker together.

Looks like we have another oracle running around the forum.


Well I don't care what anyone believes or thinks.
Another load of crap. If you didn't care what others thought about your opinion, then you wouldn't be here to begin with, so quit being condescending. I'm just curious as to why you act like this. Did the boys at school play keep-away with your kippah?

[Dave B]

This has, inadvertantly, become one of the funniest threads on the forum - albeit for totally the wrong reasons.

Now, can we get back to the subject in hand: the 2010 Bahrain Grand Prix? It should be an absolute belter, with so many drivers having changed teams, the return of MS, new rules and regulations, and some new blood at the back of the grid! :D

[ozrevhead]

This has, inadvertantly, become one of the funniest threads on the forum - albeit for totally the wrong reasons.

Now, can we get back to the subject in hand: the 2010 Bahrain Grand Prix? It should be an absolute belter, with so many drivers having changed teams, the return of MS, new rules and regulations, and some new blood at the back of the grid! :D
Yes lets - ive made a self resolution to bite my toung more on the forums but how long that will last who knows :D

You know the GP is close when the Telly starts its promos - the one on One HD gave me goosebumps :D

[Dave B]

The Beeb are running a rather bland F1 trailer, but it does hammer home how close the season is. For me, the high point comes when I can put qualifying into my Sky planner as I did over the weekend. Now I can see the session listed on the screen it feels real! :D

[Saint Devote]

Explain that one to me, son.

I'm sure they have a personal relationship, but that doesn't make Bernie Vettel's manager. I guess Bernie must be Alonso's manger too, I mean, they do play poker together.

Looks like we have another oracle running around the forum.


Another load of crap. If you didn't care what others thought about your opinion, then you wouldn't be here to begin with, so quit being condescending. I'm just curious as to why you act like this. Did the boys at school play keep-away with your kippah?

Your last remark ought to get you banned from this forum, This is not the first time you have made some sort of personal attack.

[AJP]

Saint Devote is Jenson Button....

I can't believe it took me so long to figure this one out...

although, I didn't have scooby doo with me to help me this time...

"And I would have gotten away with it if it hadn't have been for you kids!" :)

[Saint Devote]

Saint Devote is Jenson Button....

I can't believe it took me so long to figure this one out...

although, I didn't have scooby doo with me to help me this time...

"And I would have gotten away with it if it hadn't have been for you kids!" :)

Actually I am Bernie Ecclestone! :D

I am sure anyone here that reads the motor racing press knows that Sebatsian Vettel is close to Bernie and considers him his confidente.

Seb has no manager, and Bernie since his early days as a manager for people such as Jochen Rindt has also always been helpful to drivers he respects.

Often he has publicly said that his "dream team" would be Lewis and Seb - and maybe one day they will be: how about it Ferrari?

Seb negotiates his contracts and given his prowess at that I am sure he is advised by one of the best alltime negotiators, BCE :D

I do think that Bernie has the best job in F1.

[K-Pu]

I am on Bernie's side, as is pitlane and anyone else who uderstands that F1 is the house that Bernie built.

So you are on Bernie´s side and at the same time you want F1 to return to traditional places. It seems to me that Bernie doesn´t, and you have backed the idea by saying Bernie is doing the right thing and he has built the F1 we know today.

So why bother about the fans? And why bother speaking as a fan if it is not better for the sport and you positively know Bernie is always right?

And what has Vettel to do with this???

It is like wanting it to be sunny, raining and snowing at the same time while making references to Vettel, who is as unrelated to the original issue as to the weather.

[gloomyDAY]

Your last remark ought to get you banned from this forum, This is not the first time you have made some sort of personal attack.Sorry. I'll comport myself.

[gloomyDAY]

Back to the topic:

I'm really not that excited about Bahrain as I am about Australia. For some reason the season opener in the middle of a desert doesn't seem as much fun as a crowd of unruly Aussies at Albert Park. I'll probably just download the torrent for the race highlights and that's pretty much it.

Australia on the other hand, going to do some partying and watch it with a group of friends. That should be a lot of fun because I'll be in Vegas.

[UltimateDanGTR]

Back to the topic:

I'm really not that excited about Bahrain as I am about Australia. For some reason the season opener in the middle of a desert doesn't seem as much fun as a crowd of unruly Aussies at Albert Park. I'll probably just download the torrent for the race highlights and that's pretty much it.

Australia on the other hand, going to do some partying and watch it with a group of friends. That should be a lot of fun because I'll be in Vegas.

Vegas? I thought you said you didnt like watching F1 in the desert? :p :D

[gloomyDAY]

Vegas? I thought you said you didnt like watching F1 in the desert? :p :D Clever, very clever. (http://www.entertonement.com/clips/gwxgvcwfqx--Short-Drum-Roll-with-Cymbal-CrashHilarious-Funny-Comedy-)

[F1boat]

I am quite excited about Bahrain, as it is the 1rs round of the championship. I'd be excited even if it was on Tatooine.

[Azumanga Davo]

Looking forward to another big year. At least we start off with a proper desert this year (at least Melbourne got a bit of rain :D ).

[K-Pu]

I am quite excited about Bahrain, as it is the 1rs round of the championship. I'd be excited even if it was on Tatooine.

It´d be better if it were on Tatooine, with Jawas around and stuff :D

[ioan]

I am on Bernie's side, as is pitlane and anyone else who uderstands that F1 is the house that Bernie built.

Hate to bring these news to you but F1 existed before money grabber and will exist after him too.

[Sonic]

Hate to bring these news to you but F1 existed before money grabber and will exist after him too.

Didn't cha know? Bernie's not mortal like the rest of us! He'll still be spouting BS about the new star from outer mongolia long after we are all 6 ft under.

[ioan]

Damn where is ioan when you need him most?

SD, you need a professional psychological evaluation... I think even Button would agree with me on that one.

Sorry I'm not a professional psychologist, however reading 'comments' around here it's almost as funny as watching Tom & Jerry! :D

[christophulus]

It's a shame the first race isn't in Australia, getting up at 5am to watch the race was a pretty special event. And Bahrain.. bah, dull. Only 111 hours to go though..

[truefan72]

2 more days to FP1

told my GF not to bother me this weekend
putting my phone on call forwarding
my new 55inch Samsung arrives tomorrow (replacing that useless Sony Wega)
I'm ready!

[Ari]

Call me when the season starts, in Australia!

Could not agree more! I'm excited as much as any for the start of the F1 season but a corporate, financial ****fest in the desert just doesn't cut it.

[TMorel]

Gutted, have just realised I fly out on Friday for South Africa as it's my turn to patrol the fences and keep the rhinos safe for two weeks. Seriously, they a big beasts and I'm sure they can look after themselves for a few days extra right?

I wonder if I stick a satellite dish on a giraffes head I'll be able to pick up the BBC feed.

[Saint Devote]

Hate to bring these news to you but F1 existed before money grabber and will exist after him too.

Existence alone is irrelevant.

There was a time when organizers paid teams-drivers whatever they decided. The facilities were uncomfortable and except for some places rudimentary. In a nutshell there was no voice that spoke for F1.

Along came Bernie, who knows this sport well. Former manager of Archie Scott-Brown and Jochen Rindt, who also witnessed how bad the emergency services were.

Bernie won world titles with his Brabham team, but also formed close friendships with Max Mosely and di Montezemolo.

He united the teams and they agreed that he would be their negotiator. The organizers have never liked this because within a few years they were PAYING, being required to upgrade facilities and F1 was also becoming a worldwide TV phenomenon from being a non-entity.

Bernie's efforts, made the ALL very wealthy. Bernie has become extremely wealthy. This is accomplishment and all the teams know this.

People such as Frank Williams and Briatore and the others know Bernie. Drivers do as well. He is a generous soul who when agreement is made, his word is his bond.

It is BCE who has made F1 what it is and made the brand.

Now you may disagree with him - and there have been times when even those who are close to him in F1 do, but you have no right, you have no cause, and you do appear to be extremely envious and jealous of this great man by calling him a "money grabber".

Bernie is a capitalist. He may not like in many cases the environment, but he acts properly. And there absoluttely nothing wrong with making as much money as you can and charging as much as the market can bear. THAT is justice.

If you do not like it - don't watch the grands prix - otherwise it is the height of hypocrysy.

Lastly, you do NOT know Bernie. You sit millions of miles away and point fingers and think that makes you so kewl because others here also climb on the Ecclestone attack wagon.

Well, shame on all of you! You pretend to love this sport yet you attack every single facet and people involved at every turn. What a sad collection of bitterness.

[Saint Devote]

Could not agree more! I'm excited as much as any for the start of the F1 season but a corporate, financial ****fest in the desert just doesn't cut it.

What is important about Australia that it must be the first race? Its not a right.

Secondly, you hate corporations? Then don't buy Fosters Lager either - it is a coporation, and dont watch the race.

And if you want coporations to disappear then don't complain when there is NO MONEY to go racing!

Whats wrong with the desert? Its a beautiful place. And Bahrain - ever been a to grand prix where liquor is allowed? In places like Sakhir there are no drunken louts around the track and you do not have to worry about thieves and pickpockets either.

The long straights at Sakhir are great. The track is a medium speed track generally and I don't see why you are complaining?

And the weather is just SUPERB as it usually is in the middle-east.

[steveaki13]

Gutted, have just realised I fly out on Friday for South Africa as it's my turn to patrol the fences and keep the rhinos safe for two weeks. Seriously, they a big beasts and I'm sure they can look after themselves for a few days extra right?

I wonder if I stick a satellite dish on a giraffes head I'll be able to pick up the BBC feed.


Hard Luck

I like your back up plans though :p :

[Dave B]

Lastly, you do NOT know Bernie. You sit millions of miles away and point fingers and think that makes you so kewl because others here also climb on the Ecclestone attack wagon.

I'm assuming you don't know him either, and yet you have no problem defending him to the hilt. That's fair enough, you're entitled to your opinion, but telling people who disagree with you that they've no right to air their opinion is the height of hypocrisy.



And Bahrain - ever been a to grand prix where liquor is allowed? In places like Sakhir there are no drunken louts around the track and you do not have to worry about thieves and pickpockets either.
I've been to many races where alcohol was allowed. I didn't experience any louts, nor did I didn't get anything stolen. I had a whale of a time, as did everybody else I saw, and when I got hot I had a delicious cool can of beer. Hmmmm, beer :facelick: ! Give me that over a sterile Tilkedrome every time.

[ArrowsFA1]

Hate to bring these news to you but F1 existed before money grabber and will exist after him too.
Don't like to break it to you ioan but before Bernie we had Grand Prix racing. The World Championship came into being in 1950, but it wasn't until 1981 that this became the Formula 1 World Championship. Why 1981? Well, in the late 1970's, early 1980's Bernie began organising the teams as Saint Devote has said. FISA took exception to this and the sport experienced the FISA/FOCA 'war' (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FISA%E2%80%93FOCA_war) - essentially a battle for control of the sport. The end result was that FISA (now the FIA) governed the sport and Bernie took over running the commercial side, so...

It is BCE who has made F1 what it is and made the brand.
...is correct.

[jens]

Saint Devote, you devote quite a lot of time to writing such long posts that it would take quite a lot of effort to deepen into them. Just to make it clear in simple terms: predict quali position for both Hamilton and Button at the Bahrain Grand Prix. :)

[jens]

Saint Devote, you devote quite a lot of time into writing those long posts, so I'd like to see you making one thing clear in simple terms - predict the qualifying and race positions for both Hamilton and Button at the Bahrain Grand Prix! :)

[Saint Devote]

Saint Devote, you devote quite a lot of time into writing those long posts, so I'd like to see you making one thing clear in simple terms - predict the qualifying and race positions for both Hamilton and Button at the Bahrain Grand Prix! :)

Lewis has always qualified well at Sakhir and Jenson knows how to win there.

I'd like Jenson to win if not then its a placing and it doesn't matter who is in front or behind. Jenson and Lewis always race their best and I consider Hamilton as any other competitor - although naturally if one consistently beats the other the result is self-evident.

But I DO think that Fernando Alonso is going to ring that Ferrari's neck and even if it is not a clear advantage, with the Spaniard driving it is going to be something special. So my prediction is Alonso to claim pole position and winnng with Schumacher maybe not qualifying well but I reckon a podium is really possible - both drivers shading their teammates.

Jenson second?!! Lewis Fourth? :D

Mclaren gave the strongest team since 2007 and I think that civility will be maintained albeit that there will be a divide in the garage and I doubt it is going to be a Rubens-Jenson relationship.

I would like attitudes in general to be fair where these two drivers are concerned and not attacking or undermining Jenson while always praising Lewis regardless of the results.

It has been a courageous "Eric Cantona" type move by Jenson as mentioned by Renault PR Bradley Lord but I expect Mclaren as managed by Martin Whitmarsh to be fair and that both the Brits are going to challenge each other.

Jenson is not Coulthard as some in the press have suggested - the same people that wrote Jenson off years ago - and will not drive as a did David, constantly in mind that if he did not give best to Hakkinen he would be out.

[Azumanga Davo]

Saint Devote, you devote quite a lot of time into writing those long posts, so I'd like to see you making one thing clear in simple terms - predict the qualifying and race positions for both Hamilton and Button at the Bahrain Grand Prix! :)

He needs time to phone or email them first. First name terms with them too, I suspect.

[Saint Devote]

I'm assuming you don't know him either, and yet you have no problem defending him to the hilt. That's fair enough, you're entitled to your opinion, but telling people who disagree with you that they've no right to air their opinion is the height of hypocrisy.



I've been to many races where alcohol was allowed. I didn't experience any louts, nor did I didn't get anything stolen. I had a whale of a time, as did everybody else I saw, and when I got hot I had a delicious cool can of beer. Hmmmm, beer :facelick: ! Give me that over a sterile Tilkedrome every time.

It is not opinion but a valid view based on what I have read over the years from interviews of people in F1 and someone such as Murray Walker [there can only ever be one] based on Bernie's actions as a friend and colleague to them all.

I have tried to understand Bernie and all I see is someone that CREATED something called F1 and had the backing for decades now - despite periodic disagreements - of everyone in pitlane, who incidentally became ectremely wealthy as result of his efforts.

I see someone who is firm in his principles and holds F1 rightly as a valuable asset and knows its worth and will not be pushed around.

And what do I so often find here? People with bitterness only too ready and willing to accept and believe what so often is reported in the press and usually with an anti-capitalist slant. I find it disgusting and I WILL defend Bernie.

And it IS hypocrycy to attack Bernie based on his efforts related to F1 and then have no problem watching races on "Tilkedromes". Don't watch.

Clearly you have NEVER wandered around tracks like Monza or Spa or Monte Carlo or Interlagos.

It is definitely part of Bernie's efforts that problems have reduced over the years because ge DEMANDS adequate security.

[Dave B]

Clearly you have NEVER wandered around tracks like Monza
I'm going in September.


or Spa
Yup, been there.


or Monte Carlo
And there.


or Interlagos.
Dammit, you've got me there.

[Saint Devote]

I'm going in September.
Yup, been there.
And there.
Dammit, you've got me there.

I didnt ask whether you have been there, but whether you have windered about.

Then you will notice that things have improved over the decades BUT at Monza they still warn you about pickpockets and if you have not seen drunks stumbling around at Spa.........

[Dave B]

I didnt ask whether you have been there, but whether you have windered about.

Then you will notice that things have improved over the decades BUT at Monza they still warn you about pickpockets and if you have not seen drunks stumbling around at Spa.........
I've wandered about, if that's what you mean. A lap of Spa on foot is not for the faint-hearted! I've seen people in high spirits totally absorbed by the occasion, and I've marvelled at the capacity of some people to drink me under the table several times over. But I've never seen the slightest bit of trouble.

In fact, one of my favourite photos is one I took of a Hakkinen fan and a Schumacher supporter in a semi-drunken embrace after the latter had kicked the former's backside - a true sporting rivalry if ever there was one.

I'm struggling to see what the point is you're trying to make.

[jens]

Could not agree more! I'm excited as much as any for the start of the F1 season but a corporate, financial ****fest in the desert just doesn't cut it.

There have been loads of discussions about the choice of circuits and Bernie's activities (which Mr Saint is very keen to talk about :D ). However, I personally don't have anything against to having one Formula One Grand Prix in Middle East. And a location in the desert would just illustrate the diversity of the world, as such. But if I already mentioned about having one race in Middle East, then I'd prefer Bahrain over Abu Dhabi, as the latter is IMO just tooo artificial. Sakhir is at least natural and gives a vibe about the Arabic culture and scenery.

[Dave B]

Petrov will be sporting a one-off "Moscow" design on his helmet for this weekend :)

http://twitpic.com/show/thumb/17pw6v.jpg (http://twitpic.com/17pw6v)

[Garry Walker]

[/I]

I think I do understand Jenson's style of driving better than Bridgestone, Yes, and I refer you to my comment above.



:rotflmao: :rotflmao:

How on earth have I missed this GEM so far?

Oh well, only a few days to go before Button takes his usual place as the nr.2

[Saint Devote]

Petrov will be sporting a one-off "Moscow" design on his helmet for this weekend :)

http://twitpic.com/show/thumb/17pw6v.jpg (http://twitpic.com/17pw6v)

Definitely one of the prettiest designs - cant wait for a Russian Grand Prix. They will have the most beautiful grid girls in the world.

I hope Petrov does well - actually I like the Renault team drivers. No BS guys and definitely no whining will be coming from them.

THERES a new title: Ms Grid Girl!! :D

[Saint Devote]

The good thing about Monza is when Ferrari have no chance of winning, a huge number of fans start to leave the circuit and give everyone else a better view.. :p

Safety wise things have improved a hell of alot of the years thanks to Jackie Stewart, Bernie, Gerhard Berger, Senna, Max Mosley etc etc. Its not purely down to one person, and I agree that Bernie has raised the profile of F1, but he's not the sole architect.

I've also found that rival fans are alot friendlier at circuits than they are on internet forums.. :)

Bahrain although abit dull has abit of added spice where the heat is concerned. Last year we had cars overheating, and teams taking extra cooling measures to ensure reliability etc. This added some excitement to the viewers rather than watching an easy straight to the finish Brawn which no other team could touch. Well done to them though.

Actually do you remember how the tifosi would cannabalize the very high "Agip" signs and watch the race from there.

Also the old "Bog" at Watkins Glen was really a dreadful place to even get near.

I agree with you last remark - I think too many here aim for personal attack, but thats their problem.

I like Sakhir. It reminds me of the days when grand prix racing went to places everywhere including Tripoli and Morroco.

[Valve Bounce]

Could not agree more! I'm excited as much as any for the start of the F1 season but a corporate, financial ****fest in the desert just doesn't cut it.

While I may not fully agree with Ari's views, he has every right for stating his views here. I do strongly object to the pompous jackass who has the hide to admonish Ari for his views, just because he can drop names, claims to have been to more GP venues than everyone else, and claims to be the fountain of Motor racing knowledge.

Personally, I am not aware that there have been that many drunks at the GP at Albert Park making themselves annoying to other patrons, nor am I aware that there is a plague of pickpockets at Albert Park.

And I think that Bernie is a greedy weasel. :p :

[F1boat]

Guys, let's go back racing, shall we? For me it is very interesting that Mercedes continue to downplay their chances and the chances of Michael in particular. Heidfeld said that Red Bull are "frightening", Ross and Michael himself admitted that the car may not be up to the task of winning in Bahrain and Weber and Ralf Schumacher (a Mercedes driver in DTM) said that Nico is doing better, because the Merc is understeery. Do you think that this are signs of big trouble?
I'd also like to ask you, do you think that RBR are set to dominate the race? Alonso also said that this might be the case.

[gloomyDAY]

1 day away until FP1.

Oh baby! Ok, I must admit. Now I'm getting excited.
The race may be dull, but it's time to race.

I hope RBR does well and sets a good pace for the rest of the season.

[Azumanga Davo]

Guys, let's go back racing, shall we? For me it is very interesting that Mercedes continue to downplay their chances and the chances of Michael in particular. Heidfeld said that Red Bull are "frightening", Ross and Michael himself admitted that the car may not be up to the task of winning in Bahrain and Weber and Ralf Schumacher (a Mercedes driver in DTM) said that Nico is doing better, because the Merc is understeery. Do you think that this are signs of big trouble?
I'd also like to ask you, do you think that RBR are set to dominate the race? Alonso also said that this might be the case.

I wouldn't like to call it trouble just yet, they still need time to find out how they stand against others in proper race action.

[Anderton]

Fp1 tomorrow! I'm actually really excited, first time i've been like this for an F1 season in many years.
Is it tomorrow that Charile Whiting and the Stewards will be looking at the McLaren rear wing to check it's legality? Surely this rear wing business is just the same as the double diffuser issue we had last year with Brawn GP. It'll turn out the car part is legal, then come Australia, many teams will have a similar rear wing.

[Sonic]

Guys, let's go back racing, shall we? For me it is very interesting that Mercedes continue to downplay their chances and the chances of Michael in particular. Heidfeld said that Red Bull are "frightening", Ross and Michael himself admitted that the car may not be up to the task of winning in Bahrain and Weber and Ralf Schumacher (a Mercedes driver in DTM) said that Nico is doing better, because the Merc is understeery. Do you think that this are signs of big trouble?
I'd also like to ask you, do you think that RBR are set to dominate the race? Alonso also said that this might be the case.

Schumacher has flown under the radar for a lot of 2010 testing and I did put my neck out a few weeks ago on the testing thread and suggest the all wasn't perfect at Merc. That said I do not think it is a sign of "big trouble".

If the Merc is understeering that is understandable - the car was designed with Jenson in mind for many years and it will take a little while to adapt to (both) new drivers demands.

My personal opionion is that both Mercs will show more form than pre-season in the opening fly away races but perhaps not outright wins till later.

[Big Ben]

It's interesting that mister Horner thinks it looks more like the big 3 rather than big 4 although he admits they're not sure what to make of Mercedes testing times.

However I hope the young German will be a match for the old one. I really hope they wont make Robesberg Schu's sidekick

[Saint Devote]

It's interesting that mister Horner thinks it looks more like the big 3 rather than big 4 although he admits they're not sure what to make of Mercedes testing times.

However I hope the young German will be a match for the old one. I really hope they wont make Robesberg Schu's sidekick

Nico is not Massa. He is born and raised in Monte Carlo by Keijo - he is neither grateful to be in F1 or subservient to anyone but someone of high self-esteem and will not be intimiadated by a teammate like Schumacher.

If Schumi is quicker or races better it will be because he IS or DOES.

I think Nico COULD be quicker but the real test is going to be in the race under the changing conditions - this is Schumi's strength and there I have to be convinced he will be beaten by Rosberg. Nico is going to have to up his driving - nothing like Marina Bay 2009 can be allowed to happen.

[christophulus]

So, FP1 at 7am GMT tomorrow. Only 12 hours to wait! :D

[DazzlaF1]

So, FP1 at 7am GMT tomorrow. Only 12 hours to wait! :D

Oh yes, I cant wait for this, I mean its only Free Practice but its going to be fascinating to watch it, deffo worth getting up early for

[Wasted Talent]

Oh yes, I cant wait for this, I mean its only Free Practice but its going to be fascinating to watch it, deffo worth getting up early for

Well I can get up early to watch this AND listen to the Bangladesh-England Test on the radio :) :) :) :)

WT

[ioan]

Definitely one of the prettiest designs - cant wait for a Russian Grand Prix. They will have the most beautiful grid girls in the world.

No way, there are much more beautiful women out there, myself I prefer the Hungarian grid girls, than what you get in Russia, though I suppose it's just a matter of taste.

[gloomyDAY]

Definitely one of the prettiest designs - cant wait for a Russian Grand Prix. They will have the most beautiful grid girls in the world.


No way, there are much more beautiful women out there, myself I prefer the Hungarian grid girls, than what you get in Russia, though I suppose it's just a matter of taste.Can we get some pictures for a comparison?

Oh, please do not post grid girls from Bahrain!

[Saint Devote]

It could just be that Mclaren have tweaked the Mclaren and maybe they HAVE been sandbagging - I remind all how at the end of the Jerez test when Jenson set the quickest time of the eight days they reportedly - on Twitter - were high fiving and Jenson exited the car as happy as can be.

Now that the MP4-25 has passed scrutineering it is set for tomorrow.

Of course testing is one thing and the race is another especially the temperatures and surface at Sakhir.

BUT - Mclaren supporters I think can be confident and excited that 2010 is going to be a great year for the Woking lads led by Whitmarsh.

[Saint Devote]

The entrance to the Sakhir circuit has a a large presentation with: Hamilton and Vettel!!!

Neither have won the race - yet.

In my view it ought to feature Jenson because he won last year and Felipe Massa. I guess the organisers are either prescient - which is of course nonsense, dozey or, prefer the two other drivers.

I do NOT agree with their selection.

[Ari]

What is important about Australia that it must be the first race? Its not a right.

Secondly, you hate corporations? Then don't buy Fosters Lager either - it is a coporation, and dont watch the race.

And if you want coporations to disappear then don't complain when there is NO MONEY to go racing!

Whats wrong with the desert? Its a beautiful place. And Bahrain - ever been a to grand prix where liquor is allowed? In places like Sakhir there are no drunken louts around the track and you do not have to worry about thieves and pickpockets either.

The long straights at Sakhir are great. The track is a medium speed track generally and I don't see why you are complaining?

And the weather is just SUPERB as it usually is in the middle-east.

Some fair comments.

Now, what are crowd numbers like? And I've never been pick pocketed at GP's.... or anything like that. And I am one of those blokes who like to go to a GP and go to the bar and have a few drinks!!

It's not Australias right to have a GP or the first of the season. But you can't deny that this weekends GP is all about cash for the king.

The first GP should be a showcase. Italy, Monaco.... somewhere picturesque. Frankly, a yellow desert is not that.

[Ari]

There have been loads of discussions about the choice of circuits and Bernie's activities (which Mr Saint is very keen to talk about :D ). However, I personally don't have anything against to having one Formula One Grand Prix in Middle East. And a location in the desert would just illustrate the diversity of the world, as such. But if I already mentioned about having one race in Middle East, then I'd prefer Bahrain over Abu Dhabi, as the latter is IMO just tooo artificial. Sakhir is at least natural and gives a vibe about the Arabic culture and scenery.

Agree mostly.

I understand the need for a race in the middle east and it really shows the diversity we have as a sport and indeed a planet! Where we can go from a desert in the middle east to the sparkling waters of Albert Park.

I just think there are better ways to start a season....

[Ari]

Guys, let's go back racing, shall we? For me it is very interesting that Mercedes continue to downplay their chances and the chances of Michael in particular. Heidfeld said that Red Bull are "frightening", Ross and Michael himself admitted that the car may not be up to the task of winning in Bahrain and Weber and Ralf Schumacher (a Mercedes driver in DTM) said that Nico is doing better, because the Merc is understeery. Do you think that this are signs of big trouble?
I still think Mercedes are the dark horse. They've said very little in testing.... I have a feeling they will come out with a package and show us all. And I love Schumy but to see him doing his grin thing about puting it on pole. In a Ferrari I'm all for it.... in a Silver Arrows I might just want to get drunk and stay laying into him.... oh and steal his wallet! :D


I'd also like to ask you, do you think that RBR are set to dominate the race? Alonso also said that this might be the case.

Nope. Meanwhile I have 20 bucks on Webber at 16 to 1 for the race. I think it's too tight a track for RBR. I think, though, that it will bring their odds out a little for Australia which the car should suit extremely well.

[Dave B]

We're off! :D

(And live timing's already gone belly up :( )

[F1boat]

We're off! :D

(And live timing's already gone belly up :( )

F1.com is a total disgrace today... check autosport.com for love commentary.

[Valve Bounce]

Agree mostly.

I understand the need for a race in the middle east and it really shows the diversity we have as a sport and indeed a planet! Where we can go from a desert in the middle east to the sparkling waters of Albert Park.

I just think there are better ways to start a season....

Somehow, I have to say I agree with you on this one. However, there's unlimited funds available to line that greedy weasel's pocket when he runs a GP in the desert, and if he decrees that Bahrain is a wonderful place to run a Grand Prix, and the money pours in, who will debate the point with him?

[Valve Bounce]

Holy Mackerel, Batman!! The bunsen is leading the charge!!

[christophulus]

That additional part of the track is horrible, there's no way there's going to be any overtaking on it.

[truefan72]

nice lap. sutil goes tops

[Big Ben]

I for one don't care that much where the season starts. I find the Bahrain circuit rather boring and that's what bothers me. It's not the fact that F1 is going to this exotic places it's the fact that better tracks are dumped or always in jeopardy because of these new venues. If it was up to me we'd have them all... 25-30 race per year. A country wants to hos two gps... great! this sunday we are racing at A track and the following we are going to the B track.

[Dave B]

For a brief moment there was a Senna and a Schumacher on track at the same time :D

[ozrevhead]

For a brief moment there was a Senna and a Schumacher on track at the same time :D
Saw that :D - Waaaaay cool :D

[callum122]

Goodness I hope the Lotus' have 230+ litres of fuel on board and rain tyres.

[Ari]

Goodness I hope the Lotus' have 230+ litres of fuel on board and rain tyres.

hehehe it didn't look good did it? In fact you could almost convince me Bruno brought an A1GP car over! ;)

[Ari]

That additional part of the track is horrible, there's no way there's going to be any overtaking on it.

Agreed. Not surprisingly the Red Bull boys both wanted to have a couple fast corners put in there.... and why not!? So many slow corners. Is going to be a precession...

[Ari]

nice lap. sutil goes tops

I'm really trying not to get excited with the $5 i put on Sutil for the WDC at 350/1. :p

[F1boat]

Very nice from Sutil and Force India, ominous from Ferrari and solid from McLaren. The season start seems to be very interesting.

[Sonic]

F1 2010 is go baby! Ok I'm 2 hours late but at least I made it - much like HRT! ;)

My gods that's a long lap now! No wonder the Virgins/Lotus's are 7 secs off the pace!

[Dave B]

People mocked me when I said that if USF1 made the grid they'd be at least 5 seconds off! :)

[AndyL]

Very nice from Sutil and Force India, ominous from Ferrari and solid from McLaren. The season start seems to be very interesting.

Not so sure about McLaren... in the last half hour they were both doing consistent 2:02's, around 6 seconds slower than Force India's best, which seems like a lot even if there was the full 160kg fuel difference in there.

[Garry Walker]

so the new teams are massively off the pace. Time to bring back the 107% rule and get rid of these fools until they get their act together.

[Hawkmoon]

so the new teams are massively off the pace. Time to bring back the 107% rule and get rid of these fools until they get their act together.

Yeah. Massa and Webber don't know what they're talking about. :dozey:

[Dzeidzei]

For a brief moment there was a Senna and a Schumacher on track at the same time :D

The other one was too young, the other one waaaay too old :)

[F1boat]

so the new teams are massively off the pace. Time to bring back the 107% rule and get rid of these fools until they get their act together.

IMO only HRT are dangerous. Maybe they should be black flagged if they fail to improve in FP3. I'm OK with Lotus and Virgin.

[Dzeidzei]

Goodness I hope the Lotus' have 230+ litres of fuel on board and rain tyres.

Didnt you hear, Lotus was on fire. Literally, Heikki burned his ass :)

[AndyL]

For anyone who's into watching F1 in the moving-dot format popularised by VisionF1, check out the McLaren site http://mclaren.com/home . They have graphics showing Jenson's and Lewis's positions on track as well as live telemetry.

[Valve Bounce]

For anyone who's into watching F1 in the moving-dot format popularised by VisionF1, check out the McLaren site http://mclaren.com/home . They have graphics showing Jenson's and Lewis's positions on track as well as live telemetry.

Thanx for sharing this with us; after practice is over. :(

[jens]

Watched FP2. Well, I don't like that new twisty section at all on that track, seems quite useless. But that's modern F1 - changes just for the sake of it.

But... :laugh: , there are going to be some funny moments in Q1 tomorrow with the new teams. Looked like some F3 cars were let onto the circuit and faster cars were really wrestling not to hit them in the process. :p : Senna 11 seconds behind the top - are we looking at the new Lola? :D Chandhok has never driven an F1 car before his GP race debut, is that correct? Can't remember as unprepared driver as him to reach F1 grid! But probably that doesn't matter, because the car isn't faster than his GP2 car used to be and secondly the car will break down quickly after the start anyway! Nice to see Lotus having an interesting innovation at the rear wing, but that hasn't helped much - they need a major redesign.

At the top... McLaren and Mercedes look good, while Red Bull looks suspicious and I'm not sure, what to make of Ferrari.

[slorydn1]

Man, it seriously looks like these cars are going to be absolute bears to drive at the beginning of the race on a full fuel load.They seem to bounce A LOT,with a ton more suspension travel. Also, with only two tire compounds, soft and softer, tire wear will be a big issue. Drivers of many teams, including Ferrari and McLaren, were reporting that the rear tires were all but gone after only 4 Laps, and that was on the harder of the 2 compounds!

[Sonic]

Not so sure about McLaren... in the last half hour they were both doing consistent 2:02's, around 6 seconds slower than Force India's best, which seems like a lot even if there was the full 160kg fuel difference in there.

No that sounds about right. On a shorter lap we'll be looking at 4.5-5 secs slower with fat tanks but I doubt anyone will break 2mins in the GP until at least half distance.

As for the new teams - 5.5s off for Lotus in FP2 would be inside 107% if my maths is right and only HRT would be out under the old system.

[Pulidor]

Watched FP2. Well, I don't like that new twisty section at all on that track, seems quite useless. But that's modern F1 - changes just for the sake of it.

I liked it. It probably requires a big change in the setup of the cars (more downforce) and there's a couple of interesting corners in there, specially the left handed almost at the end of the new section. I think it makes the circuit more challenging as a whole: you need to be quick during breaking, on the long straights and on slow corners while keeping everything refrigerated. Nice balance for me.



But... :laugh: , there are going to be some funny moments in Q1 tomorrow with the new teams. Looked like some F3 cars were let onto the circuit and faster cars were really wrestling not to hit them in the process. :p : Senna 11 seconds behind the top - are we looking at the new Lola? :D Chandhok has never driven an F1 car before his GP race debut, is that correct? Can't remember as unprepared driver as him to reach F1 grid! But probably that doesn't matter, because the car isn't faster than his GP2 car used to be and secondly the car will break down quickly after the start anyway!
We need to be patient. 11 seconds after the first 20 laps the team EVER did is not that bad. Probably 9 or 8 seconds by tomorrow's qualy, only one second off the other new teams pace. Sadly, reliability is not gonna help a jot.
Note to self: "Why is everybody forgetting about mid 90's and recriminating the new teams?"
Regarding lack of experience when debuting, what about Alguersuari last year?



Nice to see Lotus having an interesting innovation at the rear wing, but that hasn't helped much - they need a major redesign.
Wow! You say that after........erm.......... 2 free practice sessions into the new season?
Sorry, I need more proof.

[jens]

We need to be patient. 11 seconds after the first 20 laps the team EVER did is not that bad. Probably 9 or 8 seconds by tomorrow's qualy, only one second off the other new teams pace. Sadly, reliability is not gonna help a jot.
Note to self: "Why is everybody forgetting about mid 90's and recriminating the new teams?"
Regarding lack of experience when debuting, what about Alguersuari last year?

HRT may find a few seconds, but it was expected that any kind of mechanical gremlins are going to be a major headache for the team and I don't expect either car to get far in the race. This also means it will take them quite a fair amount of time and GP weekends to reach the potential of the car - even less so to develop it further, which others keep doing.


Wow! You say that after........erm.......... 2 free practice sessions into the new season?
Sorry, I need more proof.

Proof about what? They are probably still around 5-6 secs behind leaders, aren't they? They need a major redesign (which is scheduled to appear at Barcelona) to have a chance of fighting against the established teams, that's what I meant.

[AndyL]

Thanx for sharing this with us; after practice is over. :(

Sorry, I only found it myself near to the end of the session! I did actually post that slightly before the end of the session, the forum's clock is a bit fast.

[Pulidor]

Proof about what? They are probably still around 5-6 secs behind leaders, aren't they? They need a major redesign (which is scheduled to appear at Barcelona) to have a chance of fighting against the established teams, that's what I meant.

I see where you come from, but following that logic Virgin and even Hispania already need a "redesign" too. I can't agree here Jens, sorry.
Anyway, I probably misunderstood you, because for me there no such thing as a "redesign" in the middle of the season. All the teams can do is bring new parts, and for sure the car is all different at the beginning and the end of the season, but redesign is not the word here. The word "design" implies "from scratch", hence "redesign" is "start again from scratch", which is not likely to happen.
Besides, IMO only big teams are capable of making big changes a reality during the course of a season (mp4-19b anyone?)

[555-04Q2]

Lotus and Virgin are just plain old SLOW :down:

We dont need cars over 5 seconds off the pace. They will be lapped about 3 or 4 times during the race at that pace :s hock:

I hope they improve quickly as the season goes on.

[Dave B]

Lotus and Virgin are just plain old SLOW :down:

We dont need cars over 5 seconds off the pace. They will be lapped about 3 or 4 times during the race at that pace :s hock:

I hope they improve quickly as the season goes on.
Everybody has to start somewhere. They've moved mountains just to be in Bahrain with functioning cars. So long as they're ultra-respectful of the faster cars around them I see no problem.

[555-04Q2]

Everybody has to start somewhere. They've moved mountains just to be in Bahrain with functioning cars. So long as they're ultra-respectful of the faster cars around them I see no problem.

I agree that everyone has to start somewhere. But they need to improve quickly. Front running teams get faster and faster as the season goes on and if the likes of Virgin and Lotus dont improve, they could be 7 or 8 seconds off the pace come the middle of the season. I hope they prove me wrong though!

[Dave B]

Remember though that the other teams have had years or decades of experience to build on. Virgin and Lotus, for all the talented people in the team, are starting from zero. They don't have data from last year's car, they didn't have the luxury of unlimited testing. Like you, I'm confident they'll improve.

[555-04Q2]

They will get better :up: Lotus has great engineers and a proud heritage.

[christophulus]

I'm sure they'll improve, and the fact we have three brand new teams turning up to the first race with two (mostly) functioning cars shows what a shambles USF1 was.

I can't watch qualifying tomorrow because I'm working, so I'm going to place my "bet" early and say that Rosberg will be on pole..

[555-04Q2]

I can't watch qualifying tomorrow because I'm working

Hard luck mate. I will enjoy it on your behalf then ;)

[truefan72]

Everybody has to start somewhere. They've moved mountains just to be in Bahrain with functioning cars. So long as they're ultra-respectful of the faster cars around them I see no problem.

me neither. folks need to get off their high horse and relish the fact that 24 cars are on the grid. This is race one of a long 19 race season. I am not willing to bury them before they have even learned how to walk.
Perhaps the FIA will allow unlimited testing for the new teams throughout the season and next off season so these teams (and for that matter other team) won;t have to be going through their growing pains on GP weekends

[christophulus]

Hard luck mate. I will enjoy it on your behalf then ;)

Enjoy! I'm going to record it to watch later but I don't think I'll resist the temptation to look up the result on my phone..

[Dave B]

You can download the live timing application for most phones free from the F1 site ;)

[truefan72]

so after the first day of FP
Mclaren - look good but tyre wear might be an issue Hamilton faster than button
Ferrari - look really good, Alonso faster than massa
Red Bull - look like they have balance issues with the car, drivers equal
Mercedes - will qualify well, race? unsure. Nico (as I predicted) getting the measure of MSC early on.
Renault - surprisingly fast and leaped past Sauber as the new dark horse.Kubica over Petrov
Force India - extremely competitive, good to see, Tyre issues though sutil over Liuzzi
Williams - best of the cosworths, will scrap for points Nico over Rubens
STR - eh pretty much where they were last year, Buemi over Jaime
Sauber - surprisingly slower than Renault - drivers equal
Lotus - best of the backmarkers- kovy over trulli who looked completely out of sorts in FP1.
Virgin - A bit of a mess IMO hydraulics demons. slight edge to glock
HRT - just happy to be there, but not really ready for a GP. This is where the fIA should let them practice as much as they want until it goes dark on the circuit. The rules they put in place to help teams like HRT get on the grid are actually hurting them and the other 2 newcomers.

[wedge]

Track extension gets a thumbs up for me.

About time we had another epic 4mile circuit on the calender.

[52Paddy]

Track extension gets a thumbs up for me.

About time we had another epic 4mile circuit on the calender.

Key word being epic yes?

[wedge]

By epic the lap times are under/over 2mins depending if you're a regular or new team

[Sonic]

Track extension gets a thumbs up for me.

About time we had another epic 4mile circuit on the calender.

Epic? Methinks not? If its just circuit length that makes a track epic then the M25 is an award winner :rolleyes:

The new section is dull and an extension for an extensions sake. The old layout was more of a challenge coming from the hairpin through the esses then wrestling the car back to the left for another hairpin. Now its just; Stop. Turn. Stop. Turn.......Yawn! :(

Gods! We so hard up for good tracks I'm praising the old Bahrain layout! :D

[wedge]

Epic? Methinks not? If its just circuit length that makes a track epic then the M25 is an award winner :rolleyes:

The new section is dull and an extension for an extensions sake. The old layout was more of a challenge coming from the hairpin through the esses then wrestling the car back to the left for another hairpin. Now its just; Stop. Turn. Stop. Turn.......Yawn! :(

The new section reminds me of the Esses at Road Atlanta but without the huge elevation changes

[Sonic]

The new section reminds me of the Esses at Road Atlanta but without the huge elevation changes

Ah, yes, well throw in a few blind brows and off camber turns and we might be onto something, but snooker table smooth constant radius corners doesn't float my boat.

[wedge]

Ah, yes, well throw in a few blind brows and off camber turns and we might be onto something, but snooker table smooth constant radius corners doesn't float my boat.

At least its a gradient of some description.

The Abu Dhabi corner supposedly modelled on Eau Rouge was a complete joke.

[N. Jones]

So far, looking just at practice, my FGP chassis/engine curse is working it's magic on Red Bull!
(I choose BMW chass/eng last season and looked what happened - from race winners to out of the sport)

That classifies as a double sad-face.
:( :(

[52Paddy]

By epic the lap times are under/over 2mins depending if you're a regular or new team

Nah, have to disagree so far. I'll reserve my final judgement until the race is over and I think you should too. But if you're happy, then more power to you :)

[jens]

I agree that everyone has to start somewhere. But they need to improve quickly. Front running teams get faster and faster as the season goes on and if the likes of Virgin and Lotus dont improve, they could be 7 or 8 seconds off the pace come the middle of the season. I hope they prove me wrong though!

If anything, new teams will close the gap on the leaders, not drop further backwards, because due to newness there is a lot more untapped potential in their cars/teams. Those groups have just working together and are still finding ways of most efficient team-work. And 5 seconds per lap on such a long circuit is nothing to be ashamed of.

[ioan]

If anything, new teams will close the gap on the leaders, not drop further backwards, because due to newness there is a lot more untapped potential in their cars/teams.

That's nonsense.
They will probably close the gap because their margin to perfection is bigger than that of the established teams, but I have no doubt that their chassis do not have as much potential as those of the established teams

[UltimateDanGTR]

My thoughts after today:

Mclaren looking good, but Im sure the other teams will have something to say about the flappy thing.

Ferrari looking smooth and consistent, looking strong for the weekend.

Red Bull look disapointing so far, as does Schumacher.

Im impressed with renault, and I think Force India are the real deal, Im anticipating some good results this season for them.

as for the new teams. Lotus about 5.5 secs off pace. considering how new they are and the fact that they put the team together in 6 months, id say not bad for them. Virgin slightly disappointing, over a sec behind lotus.
and HRT. about 11.5 secs of the pace. It could be worse for a quickly knocked together team (see Lola 97) but they have alot of work to do, but at least the only way is up.

but, we wont see until quali tommorrow who is the fastest on low fuel and we see the true true pace.

[52Paddy]

I do expect to see them close the gap as the season goes on but not because of untapped potential. I reckon that the new teams will be rethinking their approach to certain aspects of the car and, as those flaws are ironed out, they will be closer to the pace of the front runners. But, the top teams will also develop their cars as the season goes on and getting in the ball-court of the top teams is far easier than actually getting close enough to challenging them on track.

But I have faith in them. Many teams suffered a similar fate when starting out, not least Williams who campaigned some terrible cars (inc. Wolfs) during the 1970s. It would not be fair to regard them as no hopers this soon.

[jens]

A few more additions.

I have never seen a season, when people (including insiders) even after free practices say that there is no clue about the pecking order. :D But what I may claim based on today, is that Mercedes and Renault look a bit better than what was feared. Times are complicated due to very varying fuel loads, but still a few things can be noted. The fastest laps of McLaren and Mercedes were in 1:55's, while the lap-times in their long-runs were in 2:02-s. Considering that the time gap between empty tank and full tank is expected to be about that big, I may guess that both teams tried everything in terms of fuel loads.

Ferrari is a bit more complicated, because the amplitude of their times was much smaller (from 1.56,5 to 2:00s in long stints) - it's up to us to guess, how much did they show their hand in any department. But if they have any kind of weakness, it will be qualifying. Their race pace has been rated as dangerous throughout winter. Red Bull seems a bit concerning, because Vettel looked quite nervous at FP and ran wide on multiple occasions - seems to have some kind of setup problems. Force India, Hülkenberg and Kubica looked promising with their stints in 2:00-2:01's. Sauber is unclear - they may struggle in qualifying if the rumours about them having the most tyre-conserving car (information by Bridgestone) proves to be correct.

[ioan]

Sauber is unclear - they may struggle in qualifying if the rumours about them having the most tyre-conserving car (information by Bridgestone) proves to be correct.

They only need to run a couple more laps before the flying lap in order to get the tires up to temperature, I bet the top teams would love to be in that position instead of having their tires destroyed after less than 10 laps.

[Sonic]

That's nonsense.
They will probably close the gap because their margin to perfection is bigger than that of the established teams, but I have no doubt that their chassis do not have as much potential as those of the established teams

Perhaps, as you say, potential is the wrong phrase but these guys will close the gap. Just look at Force India's rapid improvements. Was it 2008 that they made the biggest percentage improvementof all the teams? Mostly because of how far back they were starting from, but the credit to them is they've been able to take the leap from way off the pace to nibbling at the heels of the midfield and then keep improving to possible rehualr Q3 runners.

[ioan]

Perhaps, as you say, potential is the wrong phrase but these guys will close the gap. Just look at Force India's rapid improvements. Was it 2008 that they made the biggest percentage improvementof all the teams? Mostly because of how far back they were starting from,...

And where did I say otherwise? Stop repeating what I posted! :p :


...but the credit to them is they've been able to take the leap from way off the pace to nibbling at the heels of the midfield and then keep improving to possible rehualr Q3 runners.

When did that happen? :confused:

[DazzlaF1]

My view of Free Practice

McLAREN: Lewis has the edge over Jenson with McLaren showing great overall race pace

MERCEDES: Have to be a great bet to not only take pole but lock out the front row too, race pace is questionable though and Rosberg early on has the edge over Schumi

RED BULL: In my view, they looked very disappointing, of the top 4 teams, it seems they have the bigger problems especially when it comes to tyre wear.

FERRARI: The times dont suggest it but they do look good to challenge McLaren for race victory

WILLIAMS: Hulkenberg proved the Cossie has some decent grunt in it, if the reliability of the powerplant has improved also, then surely Williams are clear favourites for 5th spot in the constructors

RENAULT: For me, the suprise of the day, I honestly did not expect them to be as quick as they were. Petrov looks very handy too and Kubica could have a good solid season if the team keep up with development

FORCE INDIA: Pre-season optimism clearly paying off with both cars in the top 12, I'll be amazed if both Sutil and Liuzzi are not anything less than top 10 regulars.

TORO ROSSO: Seems the pre-season testing program has helped Alguersuari big time, he is a lot closer to Buemi than last year but overall the car itself looked disappointing, If the trend continues, they could be in the sights of the newbies later in the year

LOTUS: Early niggles for Trulli but overall they can give themselves a good pat on the back, 5.4 seconds off the pace on a nearly 2 minute lap considering the team was built up in just 6 months is a fantastic achievement

HISPANIA: Didnt expect much from Hispania but at least they've finally got some laps under their belt.

SAUBER: Maybe they were doing longer race runs, if so then they are in a good position to come away with some points, not much between DLR and Koba' though.

VIRGIN: Reliability woes seem to have continued but pace wise they are more than OK, all they need is one trouble free run.

[F1boat]

Good analysis of the situation, IMO.

[DexDexter]

IMO Lotus looked much better than Virgin, the car was balanced, it was just slow whereas the Virgin was all over the place, oversteering and understeering depending on the corner...HRT did a very good job to complete almost 20 laps considering that was the first time the car ran.

[pettersolberg29]

Sauber looked good to me. They were very heavy in P1 acording to DLR but in P2 they got 10th and 11th and could go faster if we base anything on testing too. DLR is my dark horse to break into the 'top 8' of Red Bull, Merc, McLaren and Ferrari.

[ioan]

TORO ROSSO: Seems the pre-season testing program has helped Alguersuari big time, he is a lot closer to Buemi than last year but overall the car itself looked disappointing, If the trend continues, they could be in the sights of the newbies later in the year

What trend? We only saw 2 FP sessions.

[DazzlaF1]

What trend? We only saw 2 FP sessions.

I meant continuing from last season, in terms of performance they seem to be the only established team to have stayed put

[ioan]

I meant continuing from last season, in terms of performance they seem to be the only established team to have stayed put

It looks like both RBR and STR have a slight problem with tire durability in Bahrain, but other than that both are fast cars and none of the newcomers will come close to STR this season.

[F1boat]

Ioan, what do you think of the order in Bahrain? How would you rate the teams?

[ioan]

Ioan, what do you think of the order in Bahrain? How would you rate the teams?

I have little idea at this moment, only hopes!
For what I care Ferrari are showing good race pace so I hope they do well if they make no strategy mistakes.
And Sauber might spring a surprise.

[F1boat]

I have little idea at this moment, only hopes!
For what I care Ferrari are showing good race pace so I hope they do well if they make no strategy mistakes.
And Sauber might spring a surprise.

Thank you. I think that the top teams are very close and it is very difficult to predict what will happen, but I too think that Ferrari look fast.

[Robinho]

i don't think Hispania are anything like as slow as they seem, they've just run their first 20 laps, no way they will have attempted to be anywhere near flat out yet, too many systems checks and basic things too complete before they start chasing times. i expect they'll be pretty close to Lotus and Virgin by qually.

we're also assuming everyone has attempted a time on low fuel, i'd imagine that the slower guys will gain more by testing with a bit of fuel on and work on race pace. i hope they are'nt 6+ secs off the pace, although it is a long lap.

up at the front Red Bull seem to be not as fast as we thought and i think Ferrari are hiding their light under a Gary Bushell at the moment

[ozrevhead]

Redbull always havent liked the slow corern tracks as much

Also mark's driver shaft and Seb's breaks were causing them greif - mark didnt even get onto the track in P2

[ioan]

Also mark's driver shaft and Seb's breaks were causing them greif - mark didnt even get onto the track in P2

Same like last year. Somehow Newey never learns from his own mistakes.

[Ranger]

I was always under the impression that getting rid of Geoff Willis was a mistake for Red Bull. I won't be impressed if the same things happen during the race.

[ioan]

Talking of Willis, where did he end up?

[Alfa Fan]

Talking of Willis, where did he end up?

Hispania

[truefan72]

Track extension gets a thumbs up for me.

I have to agree with you. Did not want to judge it before seeing it in action. If they had made it with more sweeping turns and perhaps a mini straight, it would have been nice, but as it is currently configured, it is fairly useless. I can see how it it would be good for motogp etc, but not for F1. I hope that by next year they will remove several turns and make it more pleasant

[Sonic]

Just been watching Inside F1 on the red button - that RBR simulator - wicked cool! :D

[DazzlaF1]

Hispania

I think he's actually working for Dallara and is overseeing the operation on their behalf, might be wrong though

[ioan]

Hispania

Good for them.

[Alfa Fan]

I think he's actually working for Dallara and is overseeing the operation on their behalf, might be wrong though

Not sure about that. Only seen him connected with Hispania, would be interested to see where you saw he was working for Dallara.

[Valve Bounce]

From what some opined about tyre wear, I think this will be a major issue during the race. It does make me wonder which teams are testing for tyre wear under different pace and high fuel loads. The way I see it, I've learnt very little from P1 and P2, and I expect the real picture will come to light during quals.

Then, of course, unexpected tyre wear will still play a part during the race. Having said all that, I think SchM will do particularly well in this race as he is by far the most experienced driver.

I certainly don't think that being the fastest car in practice will mean as much as it used to in previous years when two or even three pit stops for fuel (lighter loads) were the norm. Now, it is he who can replicate Professor Prost will probably win.

[Saint Devote]

According to the Twitter Mclaren used the practice sessions as an extension of their testing with Lewis focusing on aero set-ups and Jenson doing tyre wear and tyre changes. I would say that Ferrari are doing something similar.

Schumacher MUST be ironing out the rust but it is a good boost for Rosberg to head FP2.

Looks like Red Bull were dealing with rear cooling problems and I doubt Webber will be FOUR SECONDS!! slower than Sebastian.

I agree with ValveBounce above that said we have learned nothing really from FP2 and will have to wait until qualifying.

Regardless, it was just superb to see the new cars and teh drivers and teams back at work :-]

The cars really look like a handful and the bottoming especially at Turn 6 is phenomenal.

I reckon that qualifying will also not mirror potential race form because of the fuel-tyre situation. Ten laps from the end could be when the tale of how well the driver has managed his car begins to unfold.

[Hawkmoon]

HRT seem to be doing their best to get Chandhok up to speed. :dozey:

Two practice sessions and he hasn't turned a wheel. They do have two cars don't they?

[F1boat]

Well, Hawkmoon, it seems that HRT is a team with a number one driver :) BTW, I agree with Valve about the tyre wear. IMO the race is totally unpredictable no matter the qualifying order.
Can't wait!

[turismo6]

Maybe HRT won't race, show up test then onto the next race weekend and test

[UltimateDanGTR]

HRT seem to be doing their best to get Chandhok up to speed. :dozey:

Two practice sessions and he hasn't turned a wheel. They do have two cars don't they?

Theyve had huge time constraints with that. hopefully they'll both be in quali.

although it did remind me of Andrea Moda yesterday the way one car ran briefly and the other not at all. Though that seems like an insult to HRT.

[DexDexter]

Theyve had huge time constraints with that. hopefully they'll both be in quali.

although it did remind me of Andrea Moda yesterday the way one car ran briefly and the other not at all. Though that seems like an insult to HRT.

I know I'm beating on a dead horse here but the new teams should have tried to get the Toyota chassis, I bet buying it would have been cheaper than developing their own slow chassis, at least in the long run.

[Valve Bounce]

I know I'm beating on a dead horse here but the new teams should have tried to get the Toyota chassis, I bet buying it would have been cheaper than developing their own slow chassis, at least in the long run.

I hear the brakes don't work so good on Toyotas. :p :

[rayburn]

I know I'm beating on a dead horse here but the new teams should have tried to get the Toyota chassis, I bet buying it would have been cheaper than developing their own slow chassis, at least in the long run.

Agreed. It would surely have been a better starting point. We shall never know for sure now though.

[UltimateDanGTR]

I know I'm beating on a dead horse here but the new teams should have tried to get the Toyota chassis, I bet buying it would have been cheaper than developing their own slow chassis, at least in the long run.

yeah I tend to agree. But, I think each team wanted to design their own car, which is fair enough. USF1 should've picked up the Toyota chassis IMO, that way they could've had a car to race with............

[UltimateDanGTR]

Hmm. start of practice 3, Chandhok having hydraulic problems in garage and likely not to see practice today (and thus not allowed to qualify) whilst a wheel comes of Glock's virgin.

yep, in the era where F1 cars are very reliable, these new teams (as expected) are not fitting in with that pattern. But to be fair, this is expected.

Though wheels are something that should never be failing, far too dangerous

[Dave B]

Early days, but Lotus appear to be just getting on with the job. Virgin are not far behind but having drama, and poor Hispania are doing well just to be there. I really feel for Chandhok, poor sod won't turn a wheel all weekend now.

[F1boat]

Well done for Fernando, can't wait for qualy now.

[Valve Bounce]

I wonder if they'll be a knuckle wrapping for Virgin? :)

WHAT!!! :eek: Do you realise what you are saying?

[Valve Bounce]

Early days, but Lotus appear to be just getting on with the job. Virgin are not far behind but having drama, and poor Hispania are doing well just to be there. I really feel for Chandhok, poor sod won't turn a wheel all weekend now.

Well, he get's a free pit pass - what more could he want?

[Sonic]

Well, he get's a free pit pass - what more could he want?

Ha! Poor sod though.

[F1boat]

I am also very sorry for Karun :( I keep my fingers crossed for Bruno, though.

[Dave B]

It's being reported that he will be able to take part in qually - assuming his car is ready. What a mountain to climb!

[F1boat]

It's being reported that he will be able to take part in qually - assuming his car is ready. What a mountain to climb!

This is too dangerous IMO.

[ioan]

We've just had the Virgin not getting out of Kubica's way on a straight! :\

[ioan]

Karun is finally on the track!

[ioan]

Well RedBull are showing their qualifying muscles.

[ioan]

C'mon Fernando, what use to throw away a set of tires just to top Q1?

[picturegallery]

Bah! Another GP with empty stands... granted it is qualifying, but I don't reckon that's a good look for a season opener!

[DazzlaF1]

He is and its shocking to see how far they are off the pace.. :eek:

Not as much off the pace as I thought TBH, nearly under 10 seconds behind the fastest time on a near 2 minute lap considering the circumstances is not a bad effort at all.

Plus the Hispania is getting better, Senna's time was just 0.605 from the 107% time (2m 02.635) if that rule was in force, thats a big improvement

The other newbies have done well too, Glock especially who gives Virgin the early bragging rights.

1. Fernando Alonso ........ 1m 54.612
---------------------------------------------------
18. Jaime Alguersuari ........ + 2.459
19. Timo Glock ........ + 5.116
20. Jarno Trulli ........ + 5.240
21. Heikki Kovalainen ........ + 5.701
22. Lucas di Grassi ........ + 5.905
23. Bruno Senna ........ + 8.628
24. Karun Chandhok ........ + 10.292

[Sonic]

It's being reported that he will be able to take part in qually - assuming his car is ready. What a mountain to climb!

No Way! That madness - I feel for the guy, really I do, but he is in no state to quallify with ZERO track/car/catergory experience.

[DazzlaF1]

DRIVERS THROUGH TO TOP 10 SHOOTOUT

1. Vettel
2. Alonso
3. Webber
4. Massa
5. Rosberg
6. Hamilton
7. Kubica
8. Sutil
9. Schumacher
10. Button

I've been very suprised at how off the pace McLaren are in terms of their qualifying runs

[Sonic]

No Way! That madness - I feel for the guy, really I do, but he is in no state to quallify with ZERO track/car/catergory experience.

Weird! I posted this an hour ago - what's it doing down here?

[ioan]

The usual suspects made it through into Q3.

[DazzlaF1]

Q3 underway, i'll say Alonso to get pole ahead of Rosberg

[DazzlaF1]

What a lap from Vettel!

[Garry Walker]

hahahahaha Alonso beaten clearly by Massa, too funny.

st.devote - your comments on button destroying hamilton, going by what you predicted was going to happen?

[AndyL]

So we think this is going to be the most hotly contested season for years, and fuel loads have been removed as a variable in qualifying, yet we've ended up with a spread of over 2 seconds between first and tenth in Q3. How on earth did that happen?

[Hawkmoon]

What's with the time spread? It's not fuel and they said they were all on the softs so why are Massa and Vettel 0.5s up on the rest?

[ioan]

:eek: Great lap by Vettel, exactly what I was expecting from him, one fabulous lap. And 1 second faster than Webber.

Great lap also by Felipe given that the Ferrari isn't as good at qualifying as the RBR but much more consistent in race, and also for staying ahead of Alonso by some margin.

Well done to MS, 7th on his comeback under 3 tenths slower than Rosberg.

[ioan]

What's with the time spread? It's not fuel and they said they were all on the softs so why are Massa and Vettel 0.5s up on the rest?

Vettel and Massa are extremely fast drivers, even though some people will never acknowledge this.

[DazzlaF1]

PROVISIONAL GRID

POLE: 1st Vettel, 2nd Massa
ROW TWO: 3rd Alonso, 4th Hamilton
ROW THREE: 5th Rosberg, 6th Webber
ROW FOUR: 7th Schumacher, 8th Button
ROW FIVE: 9th Kubica, 10th Sutil

ROW SIX: 11th Barrichello, 12th Liuzzi
ROW SEVEN: 13th Hulkenberg, 14th de la Rosa
ROW EIGHT: 15th Buemi, 16th Kobayashi
ROW NINE: 17th Petrov, 18th Alguersuari
ROW TEN: 19th Glock, 20th Trulli
ROW ELEVEN: 21st Kovalainen, 22nd di Grassi
ROW TWELVE: 23rd Senna, 24th Chandhok

[Garry Walker]

:eek: Great lap by Vettel, exactly what I was expecting from him, one fabulous lap. And 1 second faster than Webber.


It was a good lap yes, but the gap came from webbos mistake in S2. But Vettel had a little bit of advantage over Webbo anyway.


Cant wait to hear the excuses from button fans (read: st.devote) and alonso fans.

[F1boat]

I am very disappointed with the pole lap of Vettel, who I continue to dislike immensely. Hopefully, we'll see the promised race pace by Ferrari tomorrow as I have a good feeling about 1-2 finish. I too, like Hawkmoon, am perplexed by the enormous gaps between the drivers and am not sure what to make of it, maybe Webber and Alonso got blocked in their fast laps. It is also curious that some of the teams failed to reach their FP times, last year qualy almost always showed better times than the practice sessions.
For tomorrow, I keep my fingers crossed for Ferrari and I am looking forward for some clever tactical driving by Jenson and Michael.

[DazzlaF1]

It was a good lap yes, but the gap came from webbos mistake in S2. But Vettel had a little bit of advantage over Webbo anyway.


Cant wait to hear the excuses from button fans (read: st.devote) and alonso fans.

No excuses from me, McLaren just seem to have a very average car in qualifying trim.

Also with the new tyre rules, the likes of Barrichello, Liuzzi and Hulkenberg must be rubbing their hands with glee a bit if most of the top 10 run very short opening stints on those soft tyres.

[ioan]

And what's with these sh!ty laptime and position graphics?!

[F1boat]

What's with the time spread? It's not fuel and they said they were all on the softs so why are Massa and Vettel 0.5s up on the rest?

I wonder whether some drivers didn't push less because of the tyre situation, I don't know.

[F1boat]

And what's with these sh!ty laptime and position graphics?!

Wow, I liked them :)

[Garry Walker]

I am very disappointed with the pole lap of Vettel, who I continue to dislike immensely. Hopefully, we'll see the promised race pace by Ferrari tomorrow as I have a good feeling about 1-2 finish. I too, like Hawkmoon, am perplexed by the enormous gaps between the drivers and am not sure what to make of it, maybe Webber and Alonso got blocked in their fast laps. It is also curious that some of the teams failed to reach their FP times, last year qualy almost always showed better times than the practice sessions.
For tomorrow, I keep my fingers crossed for Ferrari and I am looking forward for some clever tactical driving by Jenson and Michael. I am dissapointed by vettels pole as well, i hope he collides with alonso tomorrow and both are out.

Massa for win :up:

[Garry Walker]

No excuses from me, McLaren just seem to have a very average car in qualifying trim.

Hamilton was much faster than Button, that was my point.
St.Devote told us Button is a much better driver.

[F1boat]

I am dissapointed by vettels pole as well, i hope he collides with alonso tomorrow and both are out.

Massa for win :up:

As I like Fred, I hope that Vettel will be able to do the job for himself.

[F1boat]

Hamilton was much faster than Button, that was my point.
St.Devote told us Button is a much better driver.

I have to admit that it was a bit confusing, as he was beaten not only by his teammate, but by the drivers in his old team, which his teammate managed to beat. But in my opinion in the race tomorrow things might be different, much different to what we saw today, so I'm not ready to jump into conclusions. In fact, I think that both Ferrari drivers may beat Vettel, that Michael will beat Nico and Jenson will beat Lewis. But we have to wait and see what happens.

[Valve Bounce]

It's being reported that he will be able to take part in qually - assuming his car is ready. What a mountain to climb!

Don't be ridigilis!!!!!!!!!! Bahrain is flat as a pancake. :D :D :rotflmao:

[EuroTroll]

I don't think Schumacher will beat Rosberg tomorrow. He can't be as race fit as Nico, neither physically nor mentally. Signature bet, anyone? ;)

PS. Kudos Vettel!

[Valve Bounce]

Bah! Another GP with empty stands... granted it is qualifying, but I don't reckon that's a good look for a season opener!

I've seen more people shopping in Al Khobar on a Friday evening. Maybe they all went there. :p :

[Valve Bounce]

I don't think Schumacher will beat Rosberg tomorrow. He can't be as race fit as Nico, neither physically nor mentally. Signature bet, anyone? ;)

PS. Kudos Vettel!

OK! I'll take that bet. Winner chooses the sig for 1 month.

[AndyL]

Cant wait to hear the excuses from button fans (read: st.devote) and alonso fans.

It was a short wait - Button just said in interview there was something wrong with the car... either a reason or an excuse depending on your prejudices...

[EuroTroll]

OK! I'll take that bet. Winner chooses the sig for 1 month.

Cool. :cool:

[Valve Bounce]

I am very disappointed with the pole lap of Vettel, who I continue to dislike immensely.


Care to share your reasons for this with us?

[ioan]

I am very disappointed with the pole lap of Vettel, who I continue to dislike immensely.

Get used to it or you will get a heart arrest one day.

[ioan]

I am dissapointed by vettels pole as well, i hope he collides with alonso tomorrow and both are out.

Massa for win :up:

I wish Felipe gets the win but I don't want the others to collide.

[EuroTroll]

I'm also interested in why you dislike Vettel immensely, F1boat. What's he done?