Commentary: Patrick hot off the track; on it, not so much

[SoCalPVguy]

Link: http://www.dailybreeze.com/ci_14443721

Anna Kournakova-esq schadenfreud....

My favorite part: "...Patrick cooed. "What is your definition of too hot?" Just then, a veteran NASCAR reporter blurted out: "Apparently not you on this racetrack, Danica." ...".

=========
Commentary: Patrick hot off the track; on it, not so much
By Vincent Bonsignore, Staff Writer
Posted: 02/21/2010 12:39:11 AM PST

Midway through Saturday's Nationwide Stater Bros. 300 race at Auto Club Speedway in Fontana, ESPN2 aired another sexy Danica Patrick GoDaddy.com commercial.

Inside the media room, everybody turned their attention to the television.

"Danica, do you think these commercials are going too far, getting too hot?" an attractive female reporter asked Patrick, suggestively.

"That depends," Patrick cooed. "What is your definition of too hot?"

Just then, a veteran NASCAR reporter blurted out: "Apparently not you on this racetrack, Danica."

And with that, the Danica Patrick move from Indy racing to NASCAR was pretty much summed up.

Two races into Patrick's career change, a few things are becoming abundantly clear.

Whereever she goes, the crowds follow, the media horde grows and her merchandise sells.

How is she racing, you ask?

Did I mention her merchandise is selling like hotcakes?

OK, so it looks like it's going to take Patrick a little while longer to get acclimated to NASCAR, but in her defense she's entering into a completely different racing world than the one she just left, the only common thread being the four wheels both types of cars sit on.

Patrick finished 31st Saturday, which isn't great but somewhat better than last week when she a 12-car crash knocked her out in the 69th lap.

Off the track, it's another story. Patrick isn't even racing with the big boys yet - for
Advertisement
the non-race fans, the Nationwide series is equivalent to Triple-A baseball compared to the major leagues - yet already she's one of the most popular racers.

And not just for the fans, many of whom came to Saturday's race just to see her. That was evident by the constant pack of spectators who camped outside her garage at Auto Club Speedway hoping to get a glimpse of her, or maybe a picture and autograph.

"I don't think there is any doubt a lot of people are here to see Danica," said Patrick Miller, a 35-year-old NASCAR fan from Oceanside, as he waited by her garage Saturday. "And that's a good thing, because you're not just talking about longtime fans, but new fans, too. And NASCAR needs that. The more fans, the better. And she definitely creates that."

Just as important, she's become a media darling, or at least a media curiosity.

David Talley wasn't entirely certain, but the Fontana Speedway spokesman had a pretty good idea why he issued more media credentials to this weekend's NASCAR races compared to last year.

"I'm sure Danica Patrick has something to do with that" Tally said, smiling.

Without a doubt, the working media areas at Fontana were bustling with activity.

"The irony is I recognize maybe 10 people in here," said Don Coble, a writer for Morris News Service, as he scanned the bustling media center Saturday.

Coble has covered NASCAR fulltime for 32 years, and is one of only a handful of daily newspaper writers who still travels fulltime on the circuit.

It wasn't all that long ago Coble used to know nearly everybody in every media room he traveled to.

Now? Not so much.

"Different faces, different mediums," Coble said. "It's not like it used to be, that's for sure."

And Patrick is playing her part in that transformation.

Even before she arrived on the scene the sport was attracting more and more non-traditional media members - bloggers, Internet publications, Twitter and like - but now that she's here the coverage revolution is taking another turn.

This week alone Talley fielded interview requests for Patrick from a wide-array of mediums - everything from Katie Couric and CBS News, TMZ, Access Hollywood and Entertainment Tonight to The New Yorker, which followed the same trend last week at Daytona, where all sorts of media converged on Patrick for her first race.

"It's not just (beat writers) anymore," Talley said "It's feature writers and entertainment shows. It's the Internet world."

In other words, Patrick is opening NASCAR up to a different realm of media, and that usually leads to one thing: More fans.

"I don't think anyone is complaining about what she brings to the sport," Talley said. "All you have to do is look around and see the impact she's had. That's good for everybody."

Think about it. NASCAR has always been popular among some women, but typically they grew up in regions of the country where NASCAR was popular or with fathers and brothers who were big fans.

Patrick broadens that horizon. Women who didn't have much interest in racing might take a closer look now that a fellow female is mixing it up with the boys.

And there is no doubt Patrick's striking looks - and racy commercials and photo shoots - help draw in even more male fans.

NASCAR needs that.

Like all sports, the sport took a hit when the economy went south. Sponsors pulled out and fewer fans bought tickets, some turned off by the steep prices, others by some of the technical changes the sport was making. Someone like Patrick, with her crossover popularity, can bring them back.

"There are a handful of landmark moments in NASCAR, moments that have taken the sport to another level," Coble said. "This has the potential to be one of them."

Now just imagine if she ever wins a race.

vincent.bonsignore@dailynews.com

[71Fan]

Move over Junior....you've got some competition

[dunes]

She can't have it b ith ways. She claims she wants an even playing field and to be trreated like one of the regulars; But when confronted its always this guy cut into me and that guy shortened my line. If she just wants to run circles she needs to go back to her daddys back yard with her minin bike.
Quit complaining and start learning, Learn from your mistakes and stop using them for anger release techniques.

[71Fan]

>>>But when confronted its always this guy cut into me and that guy shortened my line<<<

Where did THAT come from?

[slorydn1]

>>>But when confronted its always this guy cut into me and that guy shortened my line<<<

Where did THAT come from?

Thats what she always says when ever she doesnt do well in the indy car races. Its always someone else's fault. To her credit, i didn't hear that yesterday

[dunes]

I just saw the interview this morning and to her credit she did say it was all a learninbg experience. I guess someones helping her with P.R.

[Easy Drifter]

I wonder how a tee shirt with a picture of Danica on it surrounded by a red circle with a red diagonal line through it would sell? :D

[beachgirl]

I wonder how a tee shirt with a picture of Danica on it surrounded by a red circle with a red diagonal line through it would sell? :D

I'll buy one - as long as she doesn't get a cut of the money.

[Mark in Oshawa]

I'll buy one - as long as she doesn't get a cut of the money.

Ditto. Drifter, you now have a new business....lol

The sad reality is the media are buying into this hype she will bring new fans to NASCAR. Where the heck were these new fans with the IRL? She raced there for 5 years, and will be there full time this year, and I can bet you a sizable sum of money that in the end, people will still be clueless to the reality she isn't THAT good a driver. She will be in Long Beach in an IndyCar, and I will bet you guys 90% of the media drones who went to Fontana for their first NASCAR race will not go there. The fact is she is a novelty to the NASCAR press, which is larger, and has made a ripple into the mainstream press again, but when it becomes fairly obvious that she has a LOOONNNG Way to go to be a threat to win, this will eventually die down. Unless ESPN/ABC have anything to say about it....because I blame them for 90% of this OVER coverage.

The reality is she is going to struggle in the NASCAR world behind the wheel, and while her attitude has improved (PR training or maturity? You decide), the result at Fontana is the new reality. 3 laps down, lapped 17 laps in by JOEY LOGANO (a true talent and the real deal)and while she didn't wreck, no one is going to put her even on the same level with a Sam Hornish, who was a damn sight better race driver coming to NASCAR than Danica Patrick could be in her best dreams.

This is so sexist it is silly. If Danica looked like Sarah Fisher, she is life and death to get a decent ride. Where I respect Sarah is she never asked for anything other than respect, and she drives that way. Danica uses whatever she can, and while that has put her in this forum, we the people out here watching are being forcefed this crap once again, and it was old 2 years ago for me...

[Sparky1329]

Link: http://www.dailybreeze.com/ci_14443721

Anna Kournakova-esq schadenfreud....

My favorite part: "...Patrick cooed. "What is your definition of too hot?" Just then, a veteran NASCAR reporter blurted out: "Apparently not you on this racetrack, Danica." ...".

=========
Commentary: Patrick hot off the track; on it, not so much
By Vincent Bonsignore, Staff Writer
Posted: 02/21/2010 12:39:11 AM PST

Midway through Saturday's Nationwide Stater Bros. 300 race at Auto Club Speedway in Fontana, ESPN2 aired another sexy Danica Patrick GoDaddy.com commercial.

Inside the media room, everybody turned their attention to the television.

"Danica, do you think these commercials are going too far, getting too hot?" an attractive female reporter asked Patrick, suggestively.

"That depends," Patrick cooed. "What is your definition of too hot?"

Just then, a veteran NASCAR reporter blurted out: "Apparently not you on this racetrack, Danica."

And with that, the Danica Patrick move from Indy racing to NASCAR was pretty much summed up.

Two races into Patrick's career change, a few things are becoming abundantly clear.

Whereever she goes, the crowds follow, the media horde grows and her merchandise sells.

How is she racing, you ask?

Did I mention her merchandise is selling like hotcakes?

OK, so it looks like it's going to take Patrick a little while longer to get acclimated to NASCAR, but in her defense she's entering into a completely different racing world than the one she just left, the only common thread being the four wheels both types of cars sit on.

Patrick finished 31st Saturday, which isn't great but somewhat better than last week when she a 12-car crash knocked her out in the 69th lap.

Off the track, it's another story. Patrick isn't even racing with the big boys yet - for
Advertisement
the non-race fans, the Nationwide series is equivalent to Triple-A baseball compared to the major leagues - yet already she's one of the most popular racers.

And not just for the fans, many of whom came to Saturday's race just to see her. That was evident by the constant pack of spectators who camped outside her garage at Auto Club Speedway hoping to get a glimpse of her, or maybe a picture and autograph.

"I don't think there is any doubt a lot of people are here to see Danica," said Patrick Miller, a 35-year-old NASCAR fan from Oceanside, as he waited by her garage Saturday. "And that's a good thing, because you're not just talking about longtime fans, but new fans, too. And NASCAR needs that. The more fans, the better. And she definitely creates that."

Just as important, she's become a media darling, or at least a media curiosity.

David Talley wasn't entirely certain, but the Fontana Speedway spokesman had a pretty good idea why he issued more media credentials to this weekend's NASCAR races compared to last year.

"I'm sure Danica Patrick has something to do with that" Tally said, smiling.

Without a doubt, the working media areas at Fontana were bustling with activity.

"The irony is I recognize maybe 10 people in here," said Don Coble, a writer for Morris News Service, as he scanned the bustling media center Saturday.

Coble has covered NASCAR fulltime for 32 years, and is one of only a handful of daily newspaper writers who still travels fulltime on the circuit.

It wasn't all that long ago Coble used to know nearly everybody in every media room he traveled to.

Now? Not so much.

"Different faces, different mediums," Coble said. "It's not like it used to be, that's for sure."

And Patrick is playing her part in that transformation.

Even before she arrived on the scene the sport was attracting more and more non-traditional media members - bloggers, Internet publications, Twitter and like - but now that she's here the coverage revolution is taking another turn.

This week alone Talley fielded interview requests for Patrick from a wide-array of mediums - everything from Katie Couric and CBS News, TMZ, Access Hollywood and Entertainment Tonight to The New Yorker, which followed the same trend last week at Daytona, where all sorts of media converged on Patrick for her first race.

"It's not just (beat writers) anymore," Talley said "It's feature writers and entertainment shows. It's the Internet world."

In other words, Patrick is opening NASCAR up to a different realm of media, and that usually leads to one thing: More fans.

"I don't think anyone is complaining about what she brings to the sport," Talley said. "All you have to do is look around and see the impact she's had. That's good for everybody."

Think about it. NASCAR has always been popular among some women, but typically they grew up in regions of the country where NASCAR was popular or with fathers and brothers who were big fans.

Patrick broadens that horizon. Women who didn't have much interest in racing might take a closer look now that a fellow female is mixing it up with the boys.

And there is no doubt Patrick's striking looks - and racy commercials and photo shoots - help draw in even more male fans.

NASCAR needs that.

Like all sports, the sport took a hit when the economy went south. Sponsors pulled out and fewer fans bought tickets, some turned off by the steep prices, others by some of the technical changes the sport was making. Someone like Patrick, with her crossover popularity, can bring them back.

"There are a handful of landmark moments in NASCAR, moments that have taken the sport to another level," Coble said. "This has the potential to be one of them."

Now just imagine if she ever wins a race.

vincent.bonsignore@dailynews.com

Gag. Me.

Speaking from this woman's point of view, I love to see women in racing. By that I mean capable women who can truly compete on the same level in which capable men compete. Ashley Force comes to mind. Danica's exploitation of her gender by using her physical assets to mask her actual on-track talent makes me want to retch.

I have a ton of respect for Ashley simply because she's good at what she does and it shows in the points. I have NO respect for Danica because she's not at all good at anything but posing for cheesecake photos. I fail to see how she can respect herself even though she's laughing all the way to the bank at the losers who think she's anything but an empty firesuit.

[Jag_Warrior]

I wonder how a tee shirt with a picture of Danica on it surrounded by a red circle with a red diagonal line through it would sell? :D

Can you hook me up? I can get the money to you by PayPal in a few minutes.

[Jag_Warrior]

Gag. Me.

Speaking from this woman's point of view, I love to see women in racing. By that I mean capable women who can truly compete on the same level in which capable men compete. Ashley Force comes to mind. Danica's exploitation of her gender by using her physical assets to mask her actual on-track talent makes me want to retch.

I have a ton of respect for Ashley simply because she's good at what she does and it shows in the points. I have NO respect for Danica because she's not at all good at anything but posing for cheesecake photos. I fail to see how she can respect herself even though she's laughing all the way to the bank at the losers who think she's anything but an empty firesuit.

For the very same reasons, I agree with you on Ashley, and I would also add Angelle Sampey... especially Angelle Sampey. She's actually had to work and struggle to get to where she is (3 time NHRA Champion) and she hasn't crawled around half naked on a car to do it.

From a man's point of view, if Angelle had EVER wanted to use her femininity to sell herself, she could have beaten Danica Patrick like a drum. But Angelle is a nice, Christian girl and she was determined to be seen as a racer, not a model who races. If I had a daughter, I'd be proud if she saw Angelle as a role model. In fact, if I had a son, I'd be just as proud if he had Angelle as a role model. I wouldn't want any kid of mine to have Danica Patrick as a role model, anymore than I'd want them to have Paris Hilton as a role model.

I see that the Speed Channel and ESPN NASCAR announcers have already developed (or been given ;) ) a list of excuses for when Danica screws the pooch and is slow as a snail. They might want to get some more paper... cause she's just gettin' started boys & girls. This is going to be a fun season. :bounce:

[Mark in Oshawa]

For the very same reasons, I agree with you on Ashley, and I would also add Angelle Sampey... especially Angelle Sampey. She's actually had to work and struggle to get to where she is (3 time NHRA Champion) and she hasn't crawled around half naked on a car to do it.

From a man's point of view, if Angelle had EVER wanted to use her femininity to sell herself, she could have beaten Danica Patrick like a drum. But Angelle is a nice, Christian girl and she was determined to be seen as a racer, not a model who races. If I had a daughter, I'd be proud if she saw Angelle as a role model. In fact, if I had a son, I'd be just as proud if he had Angelle as a role model. I wouldn't want any kid of mine to have Danica Patrick as a role model, anymore than I'd want them to have Paris Hilton as a role model.

I see that the Speed Channel and ESPN NASCAR announcers have already developed (or been given ;) ) a list of excuses for when Danica screws the pooch and is slow as a snail. They might want to get some more paper... cause she's just gettin' started boys & girls. This is going to be a fun season. :bounce:

I will add in a few others. Chrissy Wallace is trying to do it the right way. Kath Legge tried to do it the right way. Young Alison MacLeod from these parts is going through USAC Midgets and is trying to do it the right way.

I have no time for women who claim to just be another racer while doing the cheesecake photo's on the side. Listen, I love beautiful women, and I love the idea of women in racing and they can be both, but they cannot walk around using their sexuality to mask the lack of talent while the hype machine kicks all this bs up at large volumes on their behalf to the masses. The way ESPN/ABC have carried on (and to a lesser extent SPEED) I swear they were just getting a cut of the action.

Jag, you and I used to argue about the merits of Kath Legge as a racing driver in the old Champ Car series, but we never had to discuss whether she was using her sexuality or image to promote something she wasn't.

The double standard women are held up to in trying to make it in a male dominated sport is awful, but we don't need Danicamania obliterating the efforts of up and coming drivers like Ali Owens and Chrissy Wallace.

The reality is she will race 5 more times before she sees Fontucky again, and at that point, we will now have her back on a track for the second time. THAT will be the litmus test on her progress. With a 31st, two speeding penalties and being lapped 3 times....she has a bit of work ahead of her.

[beachbum]

I often think the "popularity" of Danica is based on a simple fantasy. To some, the ultimate fantasy is the hot chick down the street who is also better than the boys in any male dominated endeavor. It is even better if they are just a bit sleazy (or in the current vernacular "edgy"). They "win" on all counts - beauty, brains, athleticism, aggressiveness, sexiness. All attributes our society hold in high regard for both men and women. They could be an astronaut, a corporate leader, a politician, a race driver, or a pinup, depending on circumstances

When Danica was forced on the scene, she appeared to be the "one" who might fulfill the fantasy. She had some driving talent, appeared very competitive, was (in the eyes of some) very hot, and certainly willing to play into the fantasy. If she succeeded, she would be a huge celebrity and the marketing capabilities would be unmeasurable. Throughout her career, various mentors and promoters have jumped on the bandwagon, hoping to hitch their success to the potential if she was indeed the "one". She was given the best equipment, the best opportunities, an often sanitized PR history, and promotion to emphasize the dream (SI swimsuit, GoDaddy ads, etc) . She has had every opportunity to develop into the fantasy.

But like most fantasies, reality has a nasty way of getting in the way. She is a good driver, but is she capable of beating the "guys" on a regular basis?. IHMO, she has never shown the capability to use the great equipment she has been given. She may want to win very badly (you don't get to the top of any sport without desire), but is she willing to make the commitment needed to excel? Sure she has "fire", but does that translate into a cold, calculating drive to do whatever it takes to win? Often that fire has exposed itself more as childish petulance with the foot stomps and verbal outbursts. Is she in the gym every day like most drivers? Is she willing to drive anything with wheels to stay sharp (even Michael Shumacher raced karts). Does she live, eat, breathe racing? Check her twitter site and website. Racing is almost never mentioned. Is she really very brave, or is she clueless? Is she really that "hot", or is she the result of great makeup and photoshop?

Is she the real deal, or is she a pretender?

Now that she is making a presence in NASCAR, there appears to be a new market that has bought into the fantasy. She gives every indication that she believes it, and she certainly plays to it. IMHO, her followers still want to hold onto the idea the she will someday fulfill the fantasy. Various excuses are trotted out to sustain the dream - not Danica's dream, the dreams of the fans. Just a bit more "seat time", more experience, better equipment... She has had 5 years in a top level series in great equipment and more opportunities than almost any other young driver to prove herself.

But, again IHMO, many fans, particularly IRL fans, see through the fantasy and just accept her as a decent mid-pack driver who is capable of riding around in great equipment and able to pick up the crumbs left over when others falter. What is annoying is the constant drum beat trying to promote her as something she isn't. She isn't the "one".

For those who like to claim "she didn't ask for this attention", I humbly suggest that she didn't need to do SI, provocative FMH photos, and sleazy GoDaddy ads. She doesn't need to act like a celebrity at every opportunity. She plays right into the PR machine.

[Mark in Oshawa]

I often think the "popularity" of Danica is based on a simple fantasy. To some, the ultimate fantasy is the hot chick down the street who is also better than the boys in any male dominated endeavor. It is even better if they are just a bit sleazy (or in the current vernacular "edgy"). They "win" on all counts - beauty, brains, athleticism, aggressiveness, sexiness. All attributes our society hold in high regard for both men and women. They could be an astronaut, a corporate leader, a politician, a race driver, or a pinup, depending on circumstances

When Danica was forced on the scene, she appeared to be the "one" who might fulfill the fantasy. She had some driving talent, appeared very competitive, was (in the eyes of some) very hot, and certainly willing to play into the fantasy. If she succeeded, she would be a huge celebrity and the marketing capabilities would be unmeasurable. Throughout her career, various mentors and promoters have jumped on the bandwagon, hoping to hitch their success to the potential if she was indeed the "one". She was given the best equipment, the best opportunities, an often sanitized PR history, and promotion to emphasize the dream (SI swimsuit, GoDaddy ads, etc) . She has had every opportunity to develop into the fantasy.

But like most fantasies, reality has a nasty way of getting in the way. She is a good driver, but is she capable of beating the "guys" on a regular basis?. IHMO, she has never shown the capability to use the great equipment she has been given. She may want to win very badly (you don't get to the top of any sport without desire), but is she willing to make the commitment needed to excel? Sure she has "fire", but does that translate into a cold, calculating drive to do whatever it takes to win? Often that fire has exposed itself more as childish petulance with the foot stomps and verbal outbursts. Is she in the gym every day like most drivers? Is she willing to drive anything with wheels to stay sharp (even Michael Shumacher raced karts). Does she live, eat, breathe racing? Check her twitter site and website. Racing is almost never mentioned. Is she really very brave, or is she clueless? Is she really that "hot", or is she the result of great makeup and photoshop?

Is she the real deal, or is she a pretender?

Now that she is making a presence in NASCAR, there appears to be a new market that has bought into the fantasy. She gives every indication that she believes it, and she certainly plays to it. IMHO, her followers still want to hold onto the idea the she will someday fulfill the fantasy. Various excuses are trotted out to sustain the dream - not Danica's dream, the dreams of the fans. Just a bit more "seat time", more experience, better equipment... She has had 5 years in a top level series in great equipment and more opportunities than almost any other young driver to prove herself.

But, again IHMO, many fans, particularly IRL fans, see through the fantasy and just accept her as a decent mid-pack driver who is capable of riding around in great equipment and able to pick up the crumbs left over when others falter. What is annoying is the constant drum beat trying to promote her as something she isn't. She isn't the "one".

For those who like to claim "she didn't ask for this attention", I humbly suggest that she didn't need to do SI, provocative FMH photos, and sleazy GoDaddy ads. She doesn't need to act like a celebrity at every opportunity. She plays right into the PR machine.

You hit this one out of the park. Not much I could add to it.

AS I have pointed out probably 10 times before; the sad reality is her results have NOT backed up 10% of the hype. She is an Anna Kournakova like figure.

In racing terms, would IRL fans go nuts if Casey Mears went to the IRL? No....but his record in NASCAR is better than hers in the IRL. All the hype is around her image, and she uses it while getting mad as hell when people don't respect her ability as a driver. Sorry Danica, you couldn't win or get top 5 finishes in Formula Atlantics when they had 14 cars. Told me all I needed to know about why she was given an IRL ride. It was because she was "hot". Last time I looked, I thought women were supposed to be mad when we concentrated on their looks.....

[Sparky1329]

For the very same reasons, I agree with you on Ashley, and I would also add Angelle Sampey... especially Angelle Sampey. She's actually had to work and struggle to get to where she is (3 time NHRA Champion) and she hasn't crawled around half naked on a car to do it.

From a man's point of view, if Angelle had EVER wanted to use her femininity to sell herself, she could have beaten Danica Patrick like a drum. But Angelle is a nice, Christian girl and she was determined to be seen as a racer, not a model who races. If I had a daughter, I'd be proud if she saw Angelle as a role model. In fact, if I had a son, I'd be just as proud if he had Angelle as a role model. I wouldn't want any kid of mine to have Danica Patrick as a role model, anymore than I'd want them to have Paris Hilton as a role model.

I see that the Speed Channel and ESPN NASCAR announcers have already developed (or been given ;) ) a list of excuses for when Danica screws the pooch and is slow as a snail. They might want to get some more paper... cause she's just gettin' started boys & girls. This is going to be a fun season. :bounce:

+100

I used Ashley as one example but there are several other women who are serious racers. Danica isn't among them.

[NickFalzone]

I often think the "popularity" of Danica is based on a simple fantasy. To some, the ultimate fantasy is the hot chick down the street who is also better than the boys in any male dominated endeavor. It is even better if they are just a bit sleazy (or in the current vernacular "edgy"). They "win" on all counts - beauty, brains, athleticism, aggressiveness, sexiness. All attributes our society hold in high regard for both men and women. They could be an astronaut, a corporate leader, a politician, a race driver, or a pinup, depending on circumstances

When Danica was forced on the scene, she appeared to be the "one" who might fulfill the fantasy. She had some driving talent, appeared very competitive, was (in the eyes of some) very hot, and certainly willing to play into the fantasy. If she succeeded, she would be a huge celebrity and the marketing capabilities would be unmeasurable. Throughout her career, various mentors and promoters have jumped on the bandwagon, hoping to hitch their success to the potential if she was indeed the "one". She was given the best equipment, the best opportunities, an often sanitized PR history, and promotion to emphasize the dream (SI swimsuit, GoDaddy ads, etc) . She has had every opportunity to develop into the fantasy.

But like most fantasies, reality has a nasty way of getting in the way. She is a good driver, but is she capable of beating the "guys" on a regular basis?. IHMO, she has never shown the capability to use the great equipment she has been given. She may want to win very badly (you don't get to the top of any sport without desire), but is she willing to make the commitment needed to excel? Sure she has "fire", but does that translate into a cold, calculating drive to do whatever it takes to win? Often that fire has exposed itself more as childish petulance with the foot stomps and verbal outbursts. Is she in the gym every day like most drivers? Is she willing to drive anything with wheels to stay sharp (even Michael Shumacher raced karts). Does she live, eat, breathe racing? Check her twitter site and website. Racing is almost never mentioned. Is she really very brave, or is she clueless? Is she really that "hot", or is she the result of great makeup and photoshop?

Is she the real deal, or is she a pretender?

Now that she is making a presence in NASCAR, there appears to be a new market that has bought into the fantasy. She gives every indication that she believes it, and she certainly plays to it. IMHO, her followers still want to hold onto the idea the she will someday fulfill the fantasy. Various excuses are trotted out to sustain the dream - not Danica's dream, the dreams of the fans. Just a bit more "seat time", more experience, better equipment... She has had 5 years in a top level series in great equipment and more opportunities than almost any other young driver to prove herself.

But, again IHMO, many fans, particularly IRL fans, see through the fantasy and just accept her as a decent mid-pack driver who is capable of riding around in great equipment and able to pick up the crumbs left over when others falter. What is annoying is the constant drum beat trying to promote her as something she isn't. She isn't the "one".

For those who like to claim "she didn't ask for this attention", I humbly suggest that she didn't need to do SI, provocative FMH photos, and sleazy GoDaddy ads. She doesn't need to act like a celebrity at every opportunity. She plays right into the PR machine.

For who knows what reason, I'm been following her on Twitter (amongst many other drivers) for the past year or so. Many IRL drivers regularly talk about Karting and working out during the off-season. All I see on her twitters are dates for photo shoots, commercials, tv and print interviews, and thanks for followers that congratulate her on who knows what. She also talks about her newfound love of cooking and sewing. Sometimes she will tweet about excitement for upcoming races, but I don't get the sense that she really follows motorsport in general, outside of her own limited commitments. I do think that she's driven in one direction or another for SUCCESS, but I think her definition of that is a bit different than say a Scott Dixon's or a Jimmie Johnson's. Not saying she's a terrible person or anything, but she does come across as someone that is enjoying life and is not a single-minded passionate racecar driver. NASCAR really is just another big-money paying adventure for her, she finds it exciting, new, and a good way to cash in on the Danica brand. I'd say that as a business-woman she's very smart, as a race-car driver, she's not one of the better ones going right now.

[Mark in Oshawa]

For who knows what reason, I'm been following her on Twitter (amongst many other drivers) for the past year or so. Many IRL drivers regularly talk about Karting and working out during the off-season. All I see on her twitters are dates for photo shoots, commercials, tv and print interviews, and thanks for followers that congratulate her on who knows what. She also talks about her newfound love of cooking and sewing. Sometimes she will tweet about excitement for upcoming races, but I don't get the sense that she really follows motorsport in general, outside of her own limited commitments. I do think that she's driven in one direction or another for SUCCESS, but I think her definition of that is a bit different than say a Scott Dixon's or a Jimmie Johnson's. Not saying she's a terrible person or anything, but she does come across as someone that is enjoying life and is not a single-minded passionate racecar driver. NASCAR really is just another big-money paying adventure for her, she finds it exciting, new, and a good way to cash in on the Danica brand. I'd say that as a business-woman she's very smart, as a race-car driver, she's not one of the better ones going right now.

Nick....she could be parttime in the sense with the IRL with that season, but I can tell you that part time wont work in NASCAR.

[71Fan]

Well, as long as folks are talking reality....

Danica picked up near 3 seconds a lap from start to finish at Funtana, and Tony Jr said he was proud of her.

Another reality....She brought the car home in one piece and now has 470.5 miles in the seat....plus 200 miles in the ARCA car.

Another reality.....She sits 33rd in points, ahead of 20 other drivers including Bliss, Sauter, LePage, and both Greens.

Another reality....Not one female has even made a dent in Cup since Shawna Robinson, and before that Janet Guthrie.

Another reality....She's got a great sponsor who brings money to the table that JR Motorsports needs.

Another reality....You don't learn to hit 97mph fastballs by having somebody toss ya 45mph curves.

Another reality.....Rome wasn't built in a day.

[71Fan]

And one more reality.....It's not nice to deny professional writers the money they get when folks click on their articles.

[slorydn1]

Well, as long as folks are talking reality....

Danica picked up near 3 seconds a lap from start to finish at Funtana, and Tony Jr said he was proud of her.

Another reality....She brought the car home in one piece and now has 470.5 miles in the seat....plus 200 miles in the ARCA car.

Another reality.....She sits 33rd in points, ahead of 20 other drivers including Bliss, Sauter, LePage, and both Greens.

Another reality....Not one female has even made a dent in Cup since Shawna Robinson, and before that Janet Guthrie.

Another reality....She's got a great sponsor who brings money to the table that JR Motorsports needs.

Another reality....You don't learn to hit 97mph fastballs by having somebody toss ya 45mph curves.

Another reality.....Rome wasn't built in a day.

Another reality....She got passed by John Wes Townley on the racetrack without wrecking :p :

[slorydn1]

And one more reality.....It's not nice to deny professional writers the money they get when folks click on their articles.

I do have to back you on this one.

http://www.motorsportforums.com/forums/showthread.php?t=135920

This is pretty much the "unofficial-official" forum policy for posting articles on MSF.

In my weather threads I do violate that somewhat by just cutting and pasting from there, but that only comes from the National Weather Service website, a division within the Department of Commerce for the US Government and as such is free-open to the pubic and there is no "money" on the line, so-to-speak, as opposed to weather.com which would be a problem as a "sponsored" site

[Sparky1329]

And one more reality.....It's not nice to deny professional writers the money they get when folks click on their articles.

That's called copyrite infringement and it's illegal. A maximum of four paragraphs is allowed with attribution and that's it.

[Mark in Oshawa]

Well, as long as folks are talking reality....

Danica picked up near 3 seconds a lap from start to finish at Funtana, and Tony Jr said he was proud of her..
If you sucked when you got off the truck and got up to mediocre, then what business do you have behind the wheel of the best cars in the field? Of course Tony is proud of her, his pay check depends on this gig and her whims.....although I suspect if Danica the Diva starts her act up like she did in the IRL, Kelleye Earnhardt just might be a different level of nasty in return. Either way, Tony isn't going to rock the boat, Tony isn't that sort of guy.


Another reality....She brought the car home in one piece and now has 470.5 miles in the seat....plus 200 miles in the ARCA car..
Wow...what an accomplishment! Finishing a race....strike us a medal!


Another reality.....She sits 33rd in points, ahead of 20 other drivers including Bliss, Sauter, LePage, and both Greens..

After 2 races that is meaningless, and All those guys would beat her 9 races out of 10 on any track in America in a stock car. C' mon...quit reaching.


Another reality....Not one female has even made a dent in Cup since Shawna Robinson, and before that Janet Guthrie..

So we should be excited by Danica? Listen, I will consider it news when we stop making a big deal about women in racing. Janet was the one who was the star, and was 9th at BRISTOL in her best finish. If Danica can stay on the lead lap at Bristol in a Cup car in her first year, THAT would be still not close to what Janet did. Danica wont even SEE a Cup car this year. Please, don't compare Danica to Janet Guthrie. I am JUST old enough to remember Janet, and she could drive. She did it when there was TRUE sexism out there....


Another reality....She's got a great sponsor who brings money to the table that JR Motorsports needs..

That is why she has the ride. Doesn't mean I should cheer for her, and I am a Junior fan.


Another reality....You don't learn to hit 97mph fastballs by having somebody toss ya 45mph curves..If you have the talent, people don't need to toss you 45mph curves. The fact is she isn't hitting the 80 mph fastball either....she might...but I doubt it.


Another reality.....Rome wasn't built in a day.

You are right. She may get a lot better, but explain why we have to have the hype machine kick into high gear for her to be 3 laps back and be lapped 17 laps in. You ever do the math on how sad that is? AT Fontana they get around in about 38 seconds or so right? (didn't look it up). That means she was 2 seconds a lap slower than Logano was running up front. 2 seconds!!!!! For this, we have the full ESPN/ABC hype machine putting 3 cameras in her car, and all the coverage that goes with it?

Damn right Rome wasn't built in a day but the credibility of ESPN/ABC was destroyed in a day, and they keep driving through the rubble every time they do another Danica soaked race.

The sad reality is the overcoverage of this woman has just about destroyed any chance she has for credability with the serious race fan unless she starts winning races. Last time I looked, a fuel mileage gamble in the IRL is the only win this woman has had in a legitimate race since her go-kart days. Think about that....and tell me where Rome is going to be built.

[TURN3]

Mark, I love you.

[71Fan]

Danica is not much different from most every other open wheeler that has come to NASCAR. Most all of them have started in Busch or Trucks in at least reasonably good equipment, and most all of them struggled to make the change. Most all brought money, money talks, money buys a whole bunch of knowledge, and money powers the sport.

Here's another reality for you....

She has a NASCAR license.
She has the entry fee.
She has a legal car.

If the tv coverage drives the "serious" fan away, my guess is that they........well, I'm not going to go there. I'm don't come to message boards to question anyone's seriousness, or to make any comments on their love or dis-love of the sport. My opinions are my own, as are every other persons who follows the sport, from the first time watcher/attendee to those who drive around with a camper on their pick-em-up following the circuit.

[TURN3]

Danica is not much different from most every other open wheeler that has come to NASCAR. Most all of them have started in Busch or Trucks in at least reasonably good equipment, and most all of them struggled to make the change. Most all brought money, money talks, money buys a whole bunch of knowledge, and money powers the sport.

Here's another reality for you....

She has a NASCAR license.
She has the entry fee.
She has a legal car.

If the tv coverage drives the "serious" fan away, my guess is that they........well, I'm not going to go there. I'm don't come to message boards to question anyone's seriousness, or to make any comments on their love or dis-love of the sport. My opinions are my own, as are every other persons who follows the sport, from the first time watcher/attendee to those who drive around with a camper on their pick-em-up following the circuit.

If you would, please be specific as to which former open wheeler (past or present) brought sponsorship or money to get a ride at any level in NASCAR. I can't think of a single one so if you can make a list of drivers and what it was they brought I'd appreciate it. Seems to me that all of the other open wheel drivers that have tried NASCAR they went there because they were of the most talented drivers in their field (i.e. Montoya -- Champion, Multiple race winner, multiple series, Indy 500 champ; Hornish -- Multiple Race winner, Multiple Champion, Indy 500 winner; Franchitti -- Multiple Race Winner, Multiple Championship Winner, Indy 500 winner; Allmendinger -- Multiple Race Winner, Championship Contender, Championships at Numerous Ladder Series Levels; etc. etc. etc.). None of the short list I put together brought any sponsorship and none of the ran so ridiculously slow in what amounted to a handful of races at ARCA, Nationwide, or Truck Levels. You're trying to back a driver (not a girl, a driver) that has not shown she can compete with these guys on XBOX. Chill out and be happy with whatever it is that excites you about her.

[71Fan]

Ok.... brought money was the wrong way to put it......Let's say "secured sponsorship money"

Thanks for the un-asked for advice. :-)

What excites me about Danica is that she has the best shot at NASCAR since Janet. And Janet didn't have much of a shot. I have always been interested in female drivers, and am ever hopeful that one will come along to challenge the boys.

Is it Danica? Maybe. Maybe Not. But I won't chuck her over the side for quite some time if ever.

[TURN3]

Ok.... brought money was the wrong way to put it......Let's say "secured sponsorship money"

Thanks for the un-asked for advice. :-)

What excites me about Danica is that she has the best shot at NASCAR since Janet. And Janet didn't have much of a shot. I have always been interested in female drivers, and am ever hopeful that one will come along to challenge the boys.

Is it Danica? Maybe. Maybe Not. But I won't chuck her over the side for quite some time if ever.

Fair enough, I can accept that. but keep in mind that spades are spades and the more you try to turn it into a diamond the more you look like a fool.

[beachbum]

Here's another reality for you....
Here's another one. She brought GoDaddy bucks - lots of them from all reports.

[71Fan]

And, would the 7 car even be on track without her?

[Mark in Oshawa]

Ok.... brought money was the wrong way to put it......Let's say "secured sponsorship money"

Thanks for the un-asked for advice. :-)

What excites me about Danica is that she has the best shot at NASCAR since Janet. And Janet didn't have much of a shot. I have always been interested in female drivers, and am ever hopeful that one will come along to challenge the boys.

Is it Danica? Maybe. Maybe Not. But I won't chuck her over the side for quite some time if ever.

Here is what you are forgetting. First off, since Janet Guthrie came along and showed she was for real; there have been drivers like Patty Moise and Shawna Robinson; and also Erin Crocker. All didn't really do that much, but I dare say all 3 in their own fields came along with race wins in their respective series, and all 3 didn't have the hype. All three of those ladies also didn't really sell the sex and all 3 were not in top flight equipment at any time in their NASCAR career. So, in short, what Danica is doing isn't new. What is new is the hype, and the class of ride she has under her. Understand, I don't fault JR Motorsports for putting a car under her. You are correct to point out that it is probably help keep the 7 on the track this year and Kelly Bires I am sure can live with the 3 ring circus for a few races a year.

The whole problem with Danicamania is the inconvertible truth: The HYPE and promotion is the story, NOT the driving talent. Danica hasn't won but one race in the last decade. She raced Formula Ford in England, didn't win. Came to Rahal-Letterman, ran Atlantics for a year. Didn't win a race or even come CLOSE with fields of 14 or so cars often. Still, for whatever reason, she gets a ride in the IRL with Rahal. Has a GOOD Indy 500. She can drive THAT place for sure, but there was doubt among many who set those cars up and those stories are louder when you see Tony Kanaan at her current IRL team taking her car out to shake it down. She won ONE race in the IRL, at Motegi, and I will say she stayed pretty much out of trouble and ran decent this last year in the IRL. That's it...one decent year in a weak IRL driving to just NOT go near anyone. Never saw her pass anyone for position.

That said, Montoya, Hornish, Allmendinger and Franchitti has far better pedigree's coming to NASCAR and one of them failed because he couldn't bring money. Hornish and Allmendinger show flashes of being good, but haven't been consistent, and Montoya is just a talent. So in the reality, if REALLY good OW drivers find NASCAR tough, why the heck would anyone pretend Danica got here on talent? She didn't.

No more than Scott Speed did. There is the best parallel. Speed had Red Bull pushing him. His image and aggressive style is similar in a sense to what Danica has with her GoDaddy deal. Difference? Speed went to ARCA and Truck and WON in his first year. He hasn't done much in Cup, but he is better this year. Does Scott Speed get face time? Camera time? Hyped out of all recognition? Nope....he is just a guy. Danica isn't getting ANY credit really as a driver. Never has...and if she wants my respect, then stop the cheesecake diva crap and drive the car! Actually, not just drive it, but understand it and make it better. Danica has yet to prove in the IRL she can do THAT and I am damn sure going to bet you dollars to donuts here and now she wont do it in NASCAR.

I am all for women drivers in NASCAR or the IRL or anywhere you want to see them. They win in Drag Racing. I see names like Ali Owens, Chrissy Wallace, and the like and I know they have spent years in some cases looking for a break. Then I see Milka with her sugar daddy Hugo Chavez buying her rides, and Danica with her circus, and I think: These women are demeaning the serious ladies who have dedicated their heart and soul to make this and do it the right way. Not asking for favours, not using their femininity in a negative way; and gaining respect from those they race against. Danica has shown she has some level of talent in the IRL, but I think that is a reflection of the weak fields beyond the top 6 cars in the IRL more than her driving to the front. When Danica duels and really makes life difficult on the race track by sheer talent and declines to be the focus of all the attention, then I will respect her. Right now...she is a side show looking for the circus and the reality of it all is people have already caught on to this. Look how the Fontana race ratings are actually down. I think the hype has just people who watch a lot of racing like me just fed up. Bout time.....

[Mark in Oshawa]

Mark, I love you.

Sure..you say that now...but will you respect me in the morning??????

[Mark in Oshawa]

Danica is not much different from most every other open wheeler that has come to NASCAR. Most all of them have started in Busch or Trucks in at least reasonably good equipment, and most all of them struggled to make the change. Most all brought money, money talks, money buys a whole bunch of knowledge, and money powers the sport.

Here's another reality for you....

She has a NASCAR license.
She has the entry fee.
She has a legal car.

If the tv coverage drives the "serious" fan away, my guess is that they........well, I'm not going to go there. I'm don't come to message boards to question anyone's seriousness, or to make any comments on their love or dis-love of the sport. My opinions are my own, as are every other persons who follows the sport, from the first time watcher/attendee to those who drive around with a camper on their pick-em-up following the circuit.

As for who the serious fan is? It is people who have followed the sport for a long time, gotten into the history of it, the stories of drivers and where they came from, and having a knowledge of the business on more than a superficial level. I would say about 33% of NASCAR fans would qualify. They have the Sirius NASCAR station on every day, and follow the three top series. Most of them also have a working knowledge of the IRL and what has been going on in OW. These fans (and I like to think I am one) are not amused nor impressed by the hype machine. No one went this stupid for Scott Speed or AJ Allmendinger. Heck, Montoya might have had this much attention, but the man was an f1 winner and left one of the best teams to come to NASCAR. He had won an Indy 500 in his first attempt AND a CART championship. So The man had pedigree oozing..and many of the "serious" fans like myself resented the fuss made for JPM. NASCAR wants so desparately to have a female or minority star that they have bent over backwards to get them into the sport, and the problem is with this that people need to earn their chances. There is no evidence that Danica has ever earned this chance....and hence the backlash.


Gawd...I am full of debate tonight. Have at it guys....

[Sparky1329]

As for who the serious fan is? It is people who have followed the sport for a long time, gotten into the history of it, the stories of drivers and where they came from, and having a knowledge of the business on more than a superficial level. I would say about 33% of NASCAR fans would qualify. They have the Sirius NASCAR station on every day, and follow the three top series. Most of them also have a working knowledge of the IRL and what has been going on in OW. These fans (and I like to think I am one) are not amused nor impressed by the hype machine. No one went this stupid for Scott Speed or AJ Allmendinger. Heck, Montoya might have had this much attention, but the man was an f1 winner and left one of the best teams to come to NASCAR. He had won an Indy 500 in his first attempt AND a CART championship. So The man had pedigree oozing..and many of the "serious" fans like myself resented the fuss made for JPM. NASCAR wants so desparately to have a female or minority star that they have bent over backwards to get them into the sport, and the problem is with this that people need to earn their chances. There is no evidence that Danica has ever earned this chance....and hence the backlash.


Gawd...I am full of debate tonight. Have at it guys....

You'll get no debate from me. I believe you've nailed it.

[71Fan]

Well Mark, I don't follow much open-wheel at all anymore. Like NASCAR, the spec-car nature of open wheel is just not much to my liking. F-1 gets a little more attention but not to the point that I know this driver/team from that one. Even Le Mans doesn't suck me in like it used to. And, NASCAR itself is slowly giving way to the same stuff that is killing all the major series. Homogeneous Spec Cars. Innovation is a thing of the past, and with it went most of my interest. Today's racing for the most part is about drivers rather than machines. I've always preferred machines.

Not to mention the manufactured (ahem) racing that NASCAR produces. Or the mostly homogeneous tracks that NASCAR races on. Or the plates that imo has just ruined racing at Daytona, and Talladega. Limits of any kind on any car in any series is just something I can't abide.

I do spend quite a bit of time at the local dirt shortie tho. And work on a buddies car when needed. When I lived in Vegas, Saturday night at The Bullring low in Turn One was where I could be found. Didn't miss too many races at the half-mile dirt either. Didn't miss too many races at Riverside where I grew up either. And the Toyota All-Star thing from Irwindale is on my can't miss list. But the thing is, I enjoy auto racing. Always have.

What I don't enjoy I have pretty much outlined above so I'll just leave that there for now. I'm sure I could get the marbles in my brain to shake around and find some more, but what's the sense as doing so would only lead to my being even more turned off than I already am. And btw, I don't have satellite radio, nor do I subscribe to any of nascar.com's premium services, and I have never listened to a race on a scanner.

As for the history of the sport. That history has been so skewed by today's media that it's hardly worth mentioning. The great cars, tracks, and drivers are all but forgotten, giving way to The Fight and other such nonsense. Ever hear of Fish Oil Turn? Herman The Turtle? Oak strips on movable skirts?

Anyways....Do I fit your criteria? Don't really care. I'm not here to contest anything, nor am I here to fill anyone's expectations. I'm here to discuss (and hopefully learn more about) racing. Even after all these years I remain teachable. What I'm not here to do is put folks down for having different ideas and/or opinions. Nor am I here to engage in one-upmanship, and will not engage those posters that do. It's a discussion board, not a fight board.

Anyways. Always a pleasure discussing stuff with folks who are willing to keep it civil. And will simply try (because sometimes it's not real easy) to ignore those who won't or for some other reason can't. While I actually enjoy (to a point) being shown that my ideas and/or opinions are without merit, start telling me that I am stupid or that I should think if I can etc etc and no matter how well you state your position, I will probably not respond. As a matter of fact, I probably won't even bother reading the rest of the message or any messages thereafter.

Have a great day and accept this little bit of un-asked for advice: Live Easy And Let Em Spin :-)

[TURN3]

Well Mark, I don't follow much open-wheel at all anymore. Like NASCAR, the spec-car nature of open wheel is just not much to my liking. F-1 gets a little more attention but not to the point that I know this driver/team from that one. Even Le Mans doesn't suck me in like it used to. And, NASCAR itself is slowly giving way to the same stuff that is killing all the major series. Homogeneous Spec Cars. Innovation is a thing of the past, and with it went most of my interest. Today's racing for the most part is about drivers rather than machines. I've always preferred machines.

Very well put. I think more and more and more of us are going away for the very same points you mention here.

[beachgirl]

And, would the 7 car even be on track without her? More to the point, would the 7 car even be on track without GoDaddy?

[71Fan]

That to beachgirl. If GoDaddy wants to pump money in to JRM via Danica, what's the problem? Shucks, if GoDaddy wanted YOU in MY car (which I would have to buy with GoDaddy money), I would put you in the car. And while I'ld like to see you win races, the important part for me would be making money to support my team.

[71Fan]

btw....

Fish Oil Turn...Monaco....It was down at the fish market where the merchants would haul fish guts across the road to throw in the bay.

Herman The Turtle Beam....Finished 4th in 1959. Never led a lap during his entire career. "In fact when he once found himself leading a race after the leaders pitted on a caution flag, Herman promptly pulled to the apron and dropped to the rear of the field. Why risk wrecking a good Ford with so many hungry drivers bearing down on you when the green flag drops?"
http://www.gordonline.com/beyond/010202.html
http://racing-reference.info/driver?id=beamhe01
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Herman_Beam

Oak Strips.....They were attatched to leather skirts on the sides of racecars back in the late 60's or early 70's. They would drag along the track surface effectively sealing the car to the track. They were almost immediately outlawed because of the mess they made when they were involved in crashes.

[Mark in Oshawa]

Well Mark, I don't follow much open-wheel at all anymore. Like NASCAR, the spec-car nature of open wheel is just not much to my liking. F-1 gets a little more attention but not to the point that I know this driver/team from that one. Even Le Mans doesn't suck me in like it used to. And, NASCAR itself is slowly giving way to the same stuff that is killing all the major series. Homogeneous Spec Cars. Innovation is a thing of the past, and with it went most of my interest. Today's racing for the most part is about drivers rather than machines. I've always preferred machines.

Not to mention the manufactured (ahem) racing that NASCAR produces. Or the mostly homogeneous tracks that NASCAR races on. Or the plates that imo has just ruined racing at Daytona, and Talladega. Limits of any kind on any car in any series is just something I can't abide.:-)

Hey, I don't blame you on any of the above. Except the plates. I remember how we got them, and I know with the 900hp and the aerodynamics of the current car that 220mph laps would be common and the problem of safety if these guys starts flipping into the stands has pretty much scared all the lawyers. AS for Spec racing, I dont like it, and I hate it more in the IRL, but NASCAR's popularity really hasn't suffered for the COT. People think it has, but the numbers have held reasonably steady.


I do spend quite a bit of time at the local dirt shortie tho. And work on a buddies car when needed. When I lived in Vegas, Saturday night at The Bullring low in Turn One was where I could be found. Didn't miss too many races at the half-mile dirt either. Didn't miss too many races at Riverside where I grew up either. And the Toyota All-Star thing from Irwindale is on my can't miss list. But the thing is, I enjoy auto racing. Always have.:-) Cant fault you for that either.


What I don't enjoy I have pretty much outlined above so I'll just leave that there for now. I'm sure I could get the marbles in my brain to shake around and find some more, but what's the sense as doing so would only lead to my being even more turned off than I already am. And btw, I don't have satellite radio, nor do I subscribe to any of nascar.com's premium services, and I have never listened to a race on a scanner.:-)I think you would REALLY enjoy the NASCAR Sirius package. When you get the quality of commentary on shows like "The Morning Drive" with Mike Bagley and Pete Pistone; or "Sirius Speedway" with Dave Moody, you really get some really great insights and interviews. It is NASCAR saturation and you get into the family of racers a lot deeper and informally in a way TV isn't covering the sport.


As for the history of the sport. That history has been so skewed by today's media that it's hardly worth mentioning. The great cars, tracks, and drivers are all but forgotten, giving way to The Fight and other such nonsense. Ever hear of Fish Oil Turn? Herman The Turtle? Oak strips on movable skirts?Herman the Turtle and some of the great cheating gags I do remember hearing and reading about. All this is great stuff, but you are right, we don't get to hear about it much except on Sirius NASCAR's shows where they do go back in time often.


Anyways....Do I fit your criteria? Don't really care. I'm not here to contest anything, nor am I here to fill anyone's expectations. I'm here to discuss (and hopefully learn more about) racing. Even after all these years I remain teachable. What I'm not here to do is put folks down for having different ideas and/or opinions. Nor am I here to engage in one-upmanship, and will not engage those posters that do. It's a discussion board, not a fight board.

Anyways. Always a pleasure discussing stuff with folks who are willing to keep it civil. And will simply try (because sometimes it's not real easy) to ignore those who won't or for some other reason can't. While I actually enjoy (to a point) being shown that my ideas and/or opinions are without merit, start telling me that I am stupid or that I should think if I can etc etc and no matter how well you state your position, I will probably not respond. As a matter of fact, I probably won't even bother reading the rest of the message or any messages thereafter.

Have a great day and accept this little bit of un-asked for advice: Live Easy And Let Em Spin :-)

Hey man, no worries. I apologize if I ruffled your feathers, but when it comes to Danica, I just have little or no time for this idea that any of the hype or action concerning her is needed nor warranted. I can put up with the COT, cookie cutter 1.5 mile tracks, and Green-White-Checker finishes where they are stage managed up to a point. I even put up with pothole gate. But when the Hype machine turns on for someone clearly based on how she looks in a bikini, then my BS meter will go into the red and I do tend to come out with phasers on "kill". I wasn't so much mad or upset with you per se as your argument.

[Mark in Oshawa]

That to beachgirl. If GoDaddy wants to pump money in to JRM via Danica, what's the problem? Shucks, if GoDaddy wanted YOU in MY car (which I would have to buy with GoDaddy money), I would put you in the car. And while I'ld like to see you win races, the important part for me would be making money to support my team.
People might misconstrue my dislike for Danicamania as being not allowing her in the series. I am all for anyone paying enough dough to keep JR Motorpsports on the track. I don't really care that Danica is entered. What irritated the heck out of me is the endless hype and BS that has come with her. If you stated "hey it is great Danica is here", I wont find fault with it really. I don't agree, but I wont knock it. I don't bust Danica Fan's chops over his enthusiasm. But when the press starts pushing my buttons for me to pay all this attention for someone who is out to lunch at the back of pack and is likely going to spend all season there, I will not take the force feeding and puke it right back.

Danicamania will keep the 7 on the track this year, and her car will have numerous guest drivers, but Danica herself will likely prove to be such a work in progress that eventally, the hype machine will have embarassed itself totally. ESPN lost all crediability with me for how they covered her in the IRL.

[Jag_Warrior]

Danica! Danica! Danica! :bounce:


I'm just going to enjoy this circus for as long as it lasts. "Look, Danica tied her shoes all by herself! Quick, get a camera over there for an interview!!!" But the funniest thing about all of this is Danica thought she was ready to just jump straight into Cup a couple of years ago. But from what I (we!) have seen so far, she's not even ready for Nationwide. :rotflmao:

[Easy Drifter]

Unless by some miracle she has a good race it wouldn't totally surprise me if she quietly quits the series before her next race in June, saying she has to concentrate on IC.
Nothing will be said until after Indy.

[TURN3]

Unless by some miracle she has a good race it wouldn't totally surprise me if she quietly quits the series before her next race in June, saying she has to concentrate on IC.
Nothing will be said until after Indy.

I've been thinking the exact same thing.

[beachgirl]

Well, she didn't have a good race. And the next time she races in Nationwide (assuming she does) she'll have to qualify or go home. It'll be interesting.

[Mark in Oshawa]

She didn't have a great race? Quel surprise. Practice is always different than racing. IN practice her times were good...but that of course doesn't show long runs and the falling off of times....

Guess reality bit her in the tushy again....

[Jag_Warrior]

By the time I got home and turned on ESPN, she was already being shown as "out", in something like 35th place. So what was today's excuse?

Oh sure, I could go to ESPN and read the sanitized, PR version. But I'd rather hear the "no spin" version from you guys. :D

[Mark in Oshawa]

By the time I got home and turned on ESPN, she was already being shown as "out", in something like 35th place. So what was today's excuse?

Oh sure, I could go to ESPN and read the sanitized, PR version. But I'd rather hear the "no spin" version from you guys. :D

I was doing the Olympics TV thing today but apparently Michael McDowell thought he was clear, and she was there...and while I think it is likely just one of those racing deals from what I have heard and read, ole Danica ripped McDowell for being a back marker taking out good cars...conveniently ignoring that she needed points to get in the show and was not running up front. McDowell took the blame, but I doubt highly he should have expected her to be where she was. She was divebombing into the corner over driving the corner so all bets are off on who really should be at the blame if she was a regular, but for a rookie to be pulling that stuff, well it shows she doesn't grasp there are guys you don't do that to. Mark Martin you can trust to not turn down on you, as well as a Kevin Harvick or Kyle Busch. Mike McDowell? He isn't much farther down the road of making than Danica is. Better her than I trying to take his corner away....

Her Ego just cannot be PR perfect when she gets near a microphone. It almost makes me wish she stuck around for about 3 months more races. She wont have a career left by summer if this kept up.

[beachbum]

Frankly, I am beyond tired hearing about the great Danica. Once again, her performance isn't even close to the hype. Given the level of equipment and the talent of the team, her performance was dismal - again. With the lack of speed she has shown, qualifying on time is not a good bet for the future.

Did McDowell turn down? He took 100% responsibility but did make an interesting point. He expected her to take the outside. I noticed that the fast cars almost always passed on the outside of slow cars.

Why Danica chose to dive bomb the inside no one will ever know, but it wasn't as though she was racing anyone. No one on the same lap was even close to her. She was, as she usually is, running all by herself.

But as I said, I am tired of the time and print wasted on her in the media, racing forums, and blogs. She does not deserve the notoriety. Perhaps with her gone for at least 4 months, NASCAR (and especially ESPN) will talk about racing.

[Jag_Warrior]

OK, thanks guys. So this is one that Danica didn't really cause, but it sounds like she could have avoided it.

She's doing so well in NASCAR Nationwide, I wonder if she'll decide to jump straight into Formula One next year?

When you Peak... you win. Maybe Danica needs to Peak. :p

[71Fan]

Danica! Danica! Danica! :bounce:
"Look, Danica tied her shoes all by herself! Quick, get a camera over there for an interview!!!":

Great to see a sense of humor around here Jag.

Meanwhile, there is a Grade Danica Poll over at nascar.com When I spotted it this morning she was holding down a "C". Which is where I graded her myself.