Teams bosses vote Vettel best '09 driver

[ArrowsFA1]

The full AUTOSPORT F1 Team Principals' top ten results for 2009 are:

1. Sebastian Vettel 76
2. Jenson Button 67
3. Lewis Hamilton 65
4. Fernando Alonso 39
5. Rubens Barrichello 35
6= Kimi Raikkonen 30
6= Mark Webber 30
8. Felipe Massa 19
9. Robert Kubica 10
10. Adrian Sutil 8

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/80222

[I am evil Homer]

Badoer was robbed! I call a fix...

[woody2goody]

Nobody can tell me that Sutil and Kubica drove better than Rosberg, Trulli, Heidfeld, Glock, Buemi and Fisichella.

Rosberg scored 30-odd points with very few mistakes. Trulli got on the podium 3 times and had four front row starts including a Pole position. Heidfeld finished ahead of Robert in the championship and generally raced better. Glock only finished lower than 11th once, also he had two podiums. Buemi was in his rookie season, and Fisi beat Sutil in most of the races, and would have beaten him more if he didn't go to Ferrari.

Both guys had a couple of good races, that's all.

Seriously, Nakajima and Kovalainen drove better than those two this year also.

The rest of the list is ok though. Massa deserved to be in it, because for me he was driving better than anyone apart from Button and Alonso at the time of his injury.

[ioan]

The rest of the list is ok though. Massa deserved to be in it, because for me he was driving better than anyone apart from Button and Alonso at the time of his injury.

Yep.
Strange that he is only 8th while Kimi is 6th. given that at the time of his accident Felipe had twice the points of Kimi. I guess team bosses are less than objective too.

[woody2goody]

Yep.
Strange that he is only 8th while Kimi is 6th. given that at the time of his accident Felipe had twice the points of Kimi. I guess team bosses are less than objective too.

Kimi probably deserves to be there based on his late summer run of form, but only just.

[ioan]

Kimi probably deserves to be there based on his late summer run of form, but only just.

There was no yardstick for him in the other Ferrari in the 2nd half so I can not agree. While he had a top team mate he was not delivering the better results.

Anyway I agree that Vettel was best overall, just a bit better than Lewis and Felipe, closely followed by Alonso and Webber.

[F1boat]

Honestly quite pointless award... But these are the bosses who I am to argue with them?

[ioan]

Honestly quite pointless award...

To me it proves that I was right about Button. :D

[F1boat]

He is still 2nd best, ioan, ahead of Lewis...

[keysersoze]

Nobody can tell me that Sutil and Kubica drove better than Rosberg, Trulli, Heidfeld, Glock, Buemi and Fisichella.

Rosberg scored 30-odd points with very few mistakes. Trulli got on the podium 3 times and had four front row starts including a Pole position. Heidfeld finished ahead of Robert in the championship and generally raced better. Glock only finished lower than 11th once, also he had two podiums. Buemi was in his rookie season, and Fisi beat Sutil in most of the races, and would have beaten him more if he didn't go to Ferrari.

Both guys had a couple of good races, that's all.

Seriously, Nakajima and Kovalainen drove better than those two this year also.

The rest of the list is ok though. Massa deserved to be in it, because for me he was driving better than anyone apart from Button and Alonso at the time of his injury.

Solid reasoning here, Woody, except the obvious tongue-in-cheek about Naka and Kova.

[woody2goody]

Solid reasoning here, Woody, except the obvious tongue-in-cheek about Naka and Kova.

I was being serious :) No, really, I was.

[pettersolberg29]

I was just going to come on here and complain about the Kubica 'love-in' then saw Woody get there before me!
Anyone else understand why everyone thinks Kubica is so good? To me he sems like an OK qualifier, with poor tactics, strategies, poor teamplayer and slower than Heidfeld.

[Garry Walker]

Yep.
Strange that he is only 8th while Kimi is 6th. given that at the time of his accident Felipe had twice the points of Kimi. I guess team bosses are less than objective too.

Felipe had more points than Kimi at the time of the incident due to bad luck and car problems for Kimi. Pacewise they were equal the whole year and were far more impressive than people such as Vettel and Button who lucked into great cars.

The only drivers who did something this year were Hamilton, Massa and Raikkonen, in alphabetical order. The others did not impress me at all.

[tec4]

Agreed, pointless, even if "team boss" means the Ross Brawns of F1, the chassis design has a huge effect. I guess AUTOSPORT had a slow news day?

[ioan]

He is still 2nd best, ioan, ahead of Lewis...

At least he's not first, and that's what is important.
Anyway he shouldn't even be in top 10.

[ioan]

Felipe had more points than Kimi at the time of the incident due to bad luck and car problems for Kimi.

Sure, because Felipe didn't have problems with the car?! Talk about one sided view.

[F1boat]

At least he's not first, and that's what is important.


He is first in what is important.

[macksrallye]

Pacewise they were equal the whole year and were far more impressive than people such as Vettel and Button who lucked into great cars.

I'm sorry but not matter what sort of car you "lucked into" you still have to be able to take advantage of it. Button did a much better job of that than Barrichello as did Hamilton compared to Kovalienen.

Every WDC has had something go their way, it's part of motorsport and alot of people here need to grow up & realise that being the best is more than just speed or talent or money or anything else, it's a package.

[Dr. Krogshöj]

Sutil in the top ten and Rosberg not according to team bosses? Max was onto something with the 'loonies' remark...

[Saint Devote]

At least he's not first, and that's what is important.
Anyway he shouldn't even be in top 10.

Ahem....
Makes you feel better does it? Well, as you are desperate......

Facts:
Jenson won the world title.
He is also one of the two Mclaren drivers from 2010.
JENSON will be racing in 2010 with number ONE on his car.

I'd say he is as number ONE as anyone can get!

And Vettel? As he sensibly commented yesterday that it was all very flattering but the only number ONE that counts is being world champion - and who has won that again this season? Oh yes, Jenson Button!!!! :D

[UltimateDanGTR]

At least he's not first, and that's what is important.
Anyway he shouldn't even be in top 10.

no ofcourse not, winning ONLY six races, making some great overtaking manouvres and becoming world champion. he has performed crap all year :rolleyes:

no, he ain't the best F1 driver, but he is good and at the end of the day he got the job done, albeit struggling at points down the line. but he still got points, and i dont know how you can say he deserves to be out of the top 10.

honestly, IMO, your opinions are wild.

[woody2goody]

I was just going to come on here and complain about the Kubica 'love-in' then saw Woody get there before me!
Anyone else understand why everyone thinks Kubica is so good? To me he sems like an OK qualifier, with poor tactics, strategies, poor teamplayer and slower than Heidfeld.

I agree really. He was beaten easily by Heidfeld in 2007, and in 2008, despite the fact people said he destroyed Nick, he didn't really. In the races it was very equal, if anything Nick's races were better, he just couldn't qualify the car well at all, which belies his ability over his career, where he has been a good qualifier. This year, the German had a better season overall, no doubt.

It's the same with Sutil. I agree he has talent in the wet, but the only reason he is rated so highly, is because the races he has performed well in, have seen him in the top 5. Italian GP, Nurburgring this year, and Monaco last year.

Only one of those he actually turned into a result, whereas Fisi drove his heart out this year in that car, got a pole position, a second place, and beat Sutil at a ratio of 3 to 1 in the races. And yet Sutil is the 'hot prospect' and Fisi is 'washed-up'.

It's the same principle I have with Kubica and Heidfeld. I have nothing against Sutil or Kubica, I just think, for the most part, they are overrated. Kubica does perform brilliantly on occasion, but I don't see how his career is on the rise, and was seen to have 'beaten' Nick over their time at BMW.

I suppose if Nick gets the second Brawn ahead of Schumacher then he'll finally have the car he deserves. I hope somehow Fisi can get back into a race seat either this year or next.

PS. I'm not the biggest Rosberg fan, but for him and Trulli not to be on that list is ridiculous.

[F1boat]

Kubi was ahead of Nick in 2008, he even fought for the WDC. No way Nick is as good as Kubi IMO.

[pettersolberg29]

F1Boat - you didn't read Woody's post did you? Yes he beat Nick in 08 but he hardly crushed him. Nick beat Kubica 2007 and 2009, and in the 3 BMW years, got more points than Kubica.

[Malbec]

Sutil in the top ten and Rosberg not according to team bosses? Max was onto something with the 'loonies' remark...

How much money did Sutil bring to Force India and how much did Rosberg bring to Williams? Given that they are team bosses their ratings may be based on more than on-track performance.

For me Lewis showed that he can still drive his heart out in a car that underperforms, not just deliver the goods when everything is favourable. Thats why I rate him as the best driver this year, just as I rated Alonso the best last year. Vettel has shown a similar character too.

[ioan]

he has performed crap all year :rolleyes:

Nah, only 2/3rds of it. :D

[ioan]

Kubi was ahead of Nick in 2008, he even fought for the WDC. No way Nick is as good as Kubi IMO.

Nick was better than Kubi in 2007 an 2009, and Kubi didn't fight for any title, or maybe in his wet dreams.

[ioan]

F1Boat - you didn't read Woody's post did you? Yes he beat Nick in 08 but he hardly crushed him. Nick beat Kubica 2007 and 2009, and in the 3 BMW years, got more points than Kubica.

You're losing your time. While Nick is a much more complete driver than the cube will ever be, some fans are into F1 only because of the show and as such they support drivers who make a lot of noise about themselves, like Kubica does.

[ioan]

For me Lewis showed that he can still drive his heart out in a car that underperforms, not just deliver the goods when everything is favourable. Thats why I rate him as the best driver this year, just as I rated Alonso the best last year. Vettel has shown a similar character too.

Lewis really did better than I expected this year, but he also lied and questioned the team and their ability to build a fast car a lot in the first half of the season (inclusive Silverstone). He is maturing as a driver, hopefully he also learned teh lessons outside the track.

[Saint Devote]

Nah, only 2/3rds of it. :D

So instead of providing an answer, because you have no answer - you are just bitter that Button won like quite a few others actually including certain individuals on pitlane - you react by being facetious.

Jenson won and he is the champ and he will carry number ONE and that will always be shown in the history books - that in 2009 Jenson Button beat everyone to win the world championship.

[Saint Devote]

Lewis really did better than I expected this year, but he also lied and questioned the team and their ability to build a fast car a lot in the first half of the season (inclusive Silverstone). He is maturing as a driver, hopefully he also learned teh lessons outside the track.

What a hypocritical comment you have made - yes Lewis did lie, [and a good man, Davy Ryan was scapegoated] but at least he did not cheat his way to a world title.

How can you point a finger at Lewis when you serenade the biggest cheating driver in f1 ever, with your "signature"?

[Garry Walker]

At least he's not first, and that's what is important.
Anyway he shouldn't even be in top 10.

Why do you keep posting such stuff? The world champ (no matter how much we dislike him or how we dont consider him a true top driver) not in top 10? Really, get a grip.



Sure, because Felipe didn't have problems with the car?! Talk about one sided view.

Yes, he did. But the reality is that pacewise they were equal in pretty much every race. When one of them beat the other, it was mostly due to luck based on strategy, and not pace.
The only races were there was a clear pace difference in clear air were australia (Kimi faster) and china (Felipe faster).

[ioan]

Why do you keep posting such stuff? The world champ (no matter how much we dislike him or how we dont consider him a true top driver) not in top 10? Really, get a grip.

Did you know that it might happen that others don't share your views?!
Really, get a grip.



...it was mostly due to luck based on strategy...

Luck based on strategy?! That must be the biggest nonsense one could post. Strategy is based on logic and cognitive processes, so it can't be called luck.

[Garry Walker]

Did you know that it might happen that others don't share your views?!
Really, get a grip.

Yes, but there are difference of views and there is idiotic stuff. What you are saying just exposes your childish bias regarding Button and automatically weakens any argument you make regarding him.





Luck based on strategy?! That must be the biggest nonsense one could post. Strategy is based on logic and cognitive processes, so it can't be called luck.
Yes, it has a lot to do with luck.

Take Silverstone for example. Massa was clearly slower than Kimi in qualifying and didnt make it to Q3. Instead he was allowed to fuel up for the race, whereas Kimi, who was faster and made it to Q3 was given a lesser fuel load, but had the problem of not having any new sets of softer tyres left for Q3 (due to Ferrari not wanting to make the same mistake as they did in Malaysia and Spain both drivers). So come racetime, Kimi gets stuck behind slower cars all the time, whereas Felipe gets past them due to his fuel load. Felipe ends 4th, Kimi is not even in points. Did Felipe do a better job? No, not really. Was he luckier that weekend? yeah, for sure.

In anycase, Ferrari made horrendous strategical decisions many times this year, something I hope will continue for them next with Alonsos car.

[woody2goody]

In anycase, Ferrari made horrendous strategical decisions many times this year, something I hope will continue for them next with Alonsos car.

:D

I like Alonso and Massa but that's too funny to ignore Garry.

[Saint Devote]

In anycase, Ferrari made horrendous strategical decisions many times this year, something I hope will continue for them next with Alonsos car.

:s mokin: I second THAT!!! :D

I just wonder what sort of reaction will occur upon Massa outqualifying Alonso. After all since Lewis Hamilton in 2007 the Spaniard's teammates have been Piquet and Grosjean!!

Dear Fernando does NOT take kindly to quick teammates!!!

[ioan]

Yes, but there are difference of views and there is idiotic stuff.

Yeah, we would have less of the later if you would not post so often. :\

[Saint Devote]

Autosport magazine journalists and columnists vote Jenson Button as best driver followed by Hamilton and Vettel in equal second place.

They vote the Brazilian Grand Prix as the best and the worst - the score was 1 point - Abu Dhabi grand prix. One comment - not much of a track and a place only for the "five star set" - a playground not to be taken seriously.

Cant say I disagree with any of teh above really although for me the highlights of the 2009 season was Monte Carlo - Jenson was perfect all weekend, Spa-Francorchamps - the Kimi we all love and unbeatable on the day and the Nurburgring - who could not be thrilled for Mark Webber and his dad? :-]]

[leopard]

The full AUTOSPORT F1 Team Principals' top ten results for 2009 are:

1. Sebastian Vettel 76
2. Jenson Button 67
3. Lewis Hamilton 65
4. Fernando Alonso 39
5. Rubens Barrichello 35
6= Kimi Raikkonen 30
6= Mark Webber 30
8. Felipe Massa 19
9. Robert Kubica 10
10. Adrian Sutil 8

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/80222
Didn't Webber deserve a place better? perhaps if not move to Ferrari, Fisi will be there in the list of top ten. Despite Renault had to struggle the whole season I'd rather agree with the result of Alonso which constantly outperformed the car and killed his teammate. However the order looks fine...

[Garry Walker]

Yeah, we would have less of the later if you would not post so often. :\

Coming from a supposedly adult male, whose posts most often read like teenage fangirl posts, that is really funny.


Vettel the best of 2009? Well he's definately up there IMO, but I'd grant it to Sutil and Hamilton for that matter. Sutil has shown that he's got pace and he's slowly learning the ropes, if not a little slower than SV. I think Hamilton has also shown that he can push and adapt to a dog of a car and it has gone done in my view as his best season so far. Vettel has made alot of errors but one would expect this at his stage in his career. He's shown that when the car is complete, he can deliver and win, so IMO Hamilton and Vettel would be my drivers of the season.

PS A mention should also go to Mark Webber for 2 victories which many doubted he could achieve... :)
Sutil? What the hell did he do all year? Nothing.
He was very often even slower than Fisichella.

[woody2goody]

Sutil? What the hell did he do all year? Nothing.
He was very often even slower than Fisichella.

:up: I don't see what's so special about him apart from good wet weather ability.

[Saint Devote]

Didn't Webber deserve a place better? perhaps if not move to Ferrari, Fisi will be there in the list of top ten. Despite Renault had to struggle the whole season I'd rather agree with the result of Alonso which constantly outperformed the car and killed his teammate. However the order looks fine...

We have no idea what they were asked and why they responded that way.....

For me the journalists and the columnists of the magazine are more in line with my thinking.

[ioan]

:up: I don't see what's so special about him apart from good wet weather ability.

Apart from being damn fast drivers there is nothing special about any of them! :rolleyes:

[jens]

The list doesn't mean much (team bosses may have done it with tongue in cheek as well), but at least good to see that Vettel is highly rated by team bosses regardless of what the sceptics think. :p : The weirdest thing is that Rosberg has been left out of Top10, but never mind.