Kobe & Naka, the new Toyota driver team?...

[veeten]

Looks like a possibility, with Glock being given the boot, Trulli's contract not being speedily renewed, and with Williams getting out of Toyota's engine contract Nakajima is the likely choice to be retained rather than let go.

Opinions?...

[Dave B]

Why would anybody want Nakajima other than for marketing reasons? Thanks to him (or more accurately Toyota's insistance that he came free with the engines) Williams were effectively a one-car team this year.

[VkmSpouge]

Toyota should have Kamui Kobayashi for next season but definitely not Kazuki Nakajima. If they were to go for an all Japanese line-up they should just take on Takuma Sato instead of Nakajima.

[ShiftingGears]

Nakajima has done nothing to suggest he is worthy of a 2010 F1 race seat.

Kobayashi, on the other hand, has been ruthless and seems to react well to pressure. Time will tell.

I think a Kovalainen/Kobayashi driver pairing would be quite likely. Either that or Heidfeld instead of Kovalainen.

[Koz]

Nakajima has done nothing to suggest he is worthy of a 2010 F1 race seat.

Kobayashi, on the other hand, has been ruthless and seems to react well to pressure. Time will tell.

I think a Kovalainen/Kobayashi driver pairing would be quite likely. Either that or Heidfeld instead of Kovalainen.

Or Rosberg :D

Nakajima in no way being in an F1 car, or anywhere near one. Period.

[UltimateDanGTR]

Rosberg scored 34.5 points this year
Nakajima scored 0 points this year


now why oh why would you want Naka at all? That isnt even marketable, and its not like there was huge favouritism in the Williams team.

but short rant over.

Kobayashi looks like a good racer and may be a good F1 driver in the future, certainly Japans next hope. keep him on next year. now like the BBC presenters were saying about toro rosso, stick an experienced huy in there as well. glock wouldve been perfect for that but unfortunatly toyota dont want him. Heidfeld or Sutil would be good bets as would keeping trulli. but we will have to wait and see.

[christophulus]

Kobayashi was impressive in his two GPs, and Toyota should give him a shot in 2010. In fact, he might have convinced Toyota to sign the cheque for next year, a fast home-grown driver could be exactly what they need.

Nakajima is a waste of a seat though, I'm afraid. Kovalainen could do well as a number 1 driver though.

[Jag_Warrior]

I think Kobayashi is actually an Italian who grew up in the Bronx, New York... just disguised as a Japanese guy. I look forward to seeing him next year! That guy has got a pair! Hopefully he won't be a partial season, one hit wonder and self-destruct next season.

The only thing I can say in favor of Nakajima is that at least no one really rated him that highly to begin with... unlike Grosjean and a couple of other under performers.

Kovalainen could do well as a number 1 driver though.

He can't even do Number 2 driver well.

[ioan]

Kovalainen could do well as a number 1 driver though.

I hope you are joking.

[christophulus]

I hope you are joking.

Well, not exactly. What I mean is that he may do a lot better in a team where he isn't overshadowed by Hamilton or Alonso, who have the team built around them. But still, he'll never be a world champion.

[ioan]

Well, not exactly. What I mean is that he may do a lot better in a team where he isn't overshadowed by Hamilton or Alonso, who have the team built around them. But still, he'll never be a world champion.

Maybe. I guess we will know it next season.

PS: Did he ever have Alonso for team mate?

[BDunnell]

I think Kovalainen could just thrive in a team like Toyota, away from the likes of a Hamilton, depending on how good the car is. We shall see, though. Kobayashi looks like a genuinely good prospect. He has nothing to be ashamed about in relation to his driving in Brazil, and his performance today was very good.

[BDunnell]

PS: Did he ever have Alonso for team mate?

No, only Fisichella and Hamilton.

[wedge]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8336985.stm


When asked if he was now likely to take one of the team's 2010 driver slots Toyota motorsport director John Howett said "It looks like it, yes.

"We have to really seriously consider him now after this good strong result."

"I was very impressed, we were very happy again," added Howett.

"What we like is his real fighting spirit, not intimidated by anybody."

[keysersoze]

34 to 0 is a hard stat to explain away, but in terms of absolute pace I don't think Kaz is that far behind Nico. IMO he's certainly no a no-hoper. It's just that there is so little difference between 8th (where Rosberg typically was) and 15th/16th (probably KN's average)--perhaps 3-4 tenths. But in terms of points that 3-4 tenths may as well have been 3-4 SECONDS. Rosberg could benefit from 2-3 retirements and finish 5th, whereas Kaz could benefit from 3-4 retirements and still only finish 12th.

[Ranger]

Heidfeld and Kobayashi would be as good as they are going to get.

Glock and Trulli are too inconsistent.

[Jag_Warrior]

Kovalainen could do well as a number 1 driver though.

Yeah, but I don't think he wants to race in the IRL. :D

[christophulus]

No, only Fisichella and Hamilton.

Yep, my mistake.

[harsha]

Heidfeld and Kobayashi would be as good as they are going to get.

Glock and Trulli are too inconsistent.

I wouldn't mind Glock and Kobayashi there.....but Heidfeld and Koba would be a better move

Rosberg isn't linked to Toyota now is he :?:

[jens]

Considering, how the driver market has panned out, Toyota would be wise to try to get Heidfeld. Kubica keeps getting a lot more attention, but the overlooked Heidi has pretty much matched him this year. Unless Nick gets a call from McLaren, I don't think he has any better options than Toyota. Heidfeld-Kobayashi line-up could actually work.

[truefan72]

ok first things first

Nakajima is actually a fairly decent driver who is more than worthy of an F1 seat. All this talk of him being terrible is simply misguided, Sutil finished 1 race in the points this year and came in 3rd, all the other races he did not score, so is he a terrible driver?

It's not like he was finishing dead last in races or something.

1. Glock is to be announced as the 2nd renault driver shortly
2. Kobayashi is a lock for Toyota IMO
3. I don't mind seeing Nakajima at Toyota, it would be a step up in car quality and that combination might be a good team. I actually hope it happens. Some people might get a little surprised at the results from Toyota next year.
4. I say Glock and Heidfeld will pair up for the new Sauber team which will get their grid spot soon. I think that Sauber car will also be quite good next year if they can buy out that BMW engine team/company

[jens]

ok first things first

Nakajima is actually a fairly decent driver who is more than worthy of an F1 seat. All this talk of him being terrible is simply misguided, Sutil finished 1 race in the points this year and came in 3rd, all the other races he did not score, so is he a terrible driver?

It's not like he was finishing dead last in races or something.

1. Glock is to be announced as the 2nd renault driver shortly
2. Kobayashi is a lock for Toyota IMO
3. I don't mind seeing Nakajima at Toyota, it would be a step up in car quality and that combination might be a good team. I actually hope it happens. Some people might get a little surprised at the results from Toyota next year.


It's kinda contradicting that while you are highly critical of current Toyota drivers, you rate Nakajima highly. :p : Sorry, but there is no way in hell Trulli/Glock would have ended on zero points this year in that Williams if you think Naka-Toyota would be a good idea!

[truefan72]

It's kinda contradicting that while you are highly critical of current Toyota drivers, you rate Nakajima highly. :p : Sorry, but there is no way in hell Trulli/Glock would have ended on zero points this year in that Williams if you think Naka-Toyota would be a good idea!

You know what If Nakajima had driven that toyot his year, I bet you he would have finished better than either Trulli or Glock. He is certainly a faster driver than either too.

Yes he had one or two offs, but he also had some hard luck in that car as well and finished just outside of the points several times. Plus that car was useless in high speed tracks. His pace was not that far off Rosberg's IMO.

I think the results speak more about Rosbergs quality than naka's lack of it.
I rate him right along that kovy level. Fast enough to be an F1 driver but still in need of that extra gear to provide high finishes. While I don't want either driving for Mclaren next year, I do believe that in the right situation, they can flourish and are more than worthy F1 drivers.

The way some of you guys rate naka. yopu make him out to be some dirver 3 seconds adrift in last place, while he actually is a pretty fast driver who in 2010 will be entering his 3rd F1 season, and should now be coming into his own.

[Koz]

You know what If Nakajima had driven that toyot his year, I bet you he would have finished better than either Trulli or Glock. He is certainly a faster driver than either too.

Yes he had one or two offs, but he also had some hard luck in that car as well and finished just outside of the points several times. Plus that car was useless in high speed tracks. His pace was not that far off Rosberg's IMO.

I think the results speak more about Rosbergs quality than naka's lack of it.
I rate him right along that kovy level. Fast enough to be an F1 driver but still in need of that extra gear to provide high finishes. While I don't want either driving for Mclaren next year, I do believe that in the right situation, they can flourish and are more than worthy F1 drivers.

The way some of you guys rate naka. yopu make him out to be some dirver 3 seconds adrift in last place, while he actually is a pretty fast driver who in 2010 will be entering his 3rd F1 season, and should now be coming into his own.

:arrows:

How about we just send him back to Manor?

Toyota can and will do better. And he doesn't matter much anymore, they have a decent Japanese driver now so his career has ended.

[ioan]

Heidfeld and Kobayashi would be as good as they are going to get.


:eek: That's exactly what I was thinking about 10 seconds ago. I really hope it happens.

[ioan]

You know what If Nakajima had driven that toyot his year, I bet you he would have finished better than either Trulli or Glock. He is certainly a faster driver than either too.

There is certainly truth in what you posted.

[woody2goody]

Well the way I see it is, that there would be no harm putting the two Japanese drivers in the team.

It would give Kobayashi a team-mate that wouldn't completely destroy him, and it would give Nakajima a chance to step up and see if he can lead a team.

People are criticising Kaz because he hasn't scored a single point, but they say Sato would be a better choice - now what happened to Sato in 2005? 1 Point vs his team mate's 37. However he came back stronger in 06 and 07.

Nakajima in my opinion has had a better year than last season, even though he scored 9 points in '08. He's qualified a lot better, and has raced more consistently and carefully than before. On pure pace he's a match for Nico, it's just like Kovy and Lewis during the races.

Toyota would do well taking a punt on him, especially considering he'd be cheap.

I don't think it's as good a lineup as Trulli and Glock, but with a good car they could get a few podiums.

[jens]

Nakajima better than Trulli/Glock? Are you serious? :p : Trulli/Glock are treated almost like worst drivers of all times. One of them has been employed by F1 teams for some strange reason for full 12 years and another one has got 3 podiums in a relatively short career - yeah, they are extremely sh*t, about mazzacanesque.

[ioan]

Trulli/Glock are treated almost like worst drivers of all times.

Let's not exaggerate, they are still doing better than Badoer. ;)

[BDunnell]

...about mazzacanesque.

I will now use that word in everyday conversation and try to introduce it into the English language.

[woody2goody]

Let's not exaggerate, they are still doing better than Badoer. ;)

Oi! :D

Anyhoo, Trulli and Glock are a great pairing in my view, so if they aren't kept on then it will be a shame, but I don't think Kobayashi and Nakajima is half as bad as some would make it out to be.

Ps Mazzacanesque should be a word, definitely. I'd possibly change it to Idesque but it's ok ;)

[wedge]

ok first things first

Nakajima is actually a fairly decent driver who is more than worthy of an F1 seat. All this talk of him being terrible is simply misguided, Sutil finished 1 race in the points this year and came in 3rd, all the other races he did not score, so is he a terrible driver?

Rosberg destroyed Naka this year

Rosberg arguably out drove the car

At least Sutil made decent use of the car when it came to him.

[truefan72]

Nakajima better than Trulli/Glock? Are you serious? :p : Trulli/Glock are treated almost like worst drivers of all times. One of them has been employed by F1 teams for some strange reason for full 12 years and another one has got 3 podiums in a relatively short career - yeah, they are extremely sh*t, about mazzacanesque.

Trulli fades in races, I do like Glock though, but don't rate him any better than Naka. Trulli will always be serviceable F1 driver, but Naka's potential is much better than Trulli's performance. As I said he is going into his 3rd year, and that experience along with driving a similar car with the same power train in 2010 should yield some much improved results.

We already know he has the pace and guile. with the experience now, he will be a good competitor. If he falters in 2010 then I would change my opinion, but I think if the toyota is going to maintain its current strength, they would do well with 2 drivers who are more inclined to drive the pants off this car.

[truefan72]

Rosberg destroyed Naka this year

Rosberg arguably out drove the car

At least Sutil made decent use of the car when it came to him.

I like Sutil, but let's get real he scored once in 2009. all other races, ZERO.

Also remember that Force India was pretty darn fast in Spa and sutil only came in 11th 42 seconds adrift of his teammate, so he didn't make decent use of that car when it came to him there, did it?

Anyway, alls I'm saying is that Naka is a competent driver and worthy of an F1 seat.

[wedge]

I like Sutil, but let's get real he scored once in 2009. all other races, ZERO.

Also remember that Force India was pretty darn fast in Spa and sutil only came in 11th 42 seconds adrift of his teammate, so he didn't make decent use of that car when it came to him there, did it?

Anyway, alls I'm saying is that Naka is a competent driver and worthy of an F1 seat.

Spa - got caught up in a collision on first lap

[jens]

I will now use that word in everyday conversation and try to introduce it into the English language.

:D

Or what about alguersuariesque!

[BDunnell]

:D

Or what about alguersuariesque!

But how does that differ from mazzacanesque, exactly?

[JSH]

Looks like a possibility, with Glock being given the boot, Trulli's contract not being speedily renewed, and with Williams getting out of Toyota's engine contract Nakajima is the likely choice to be retained rather than let go.

Opinions?...

Well you asked for it....

Toyota's about to pull the plug.... IMO. :eek:

[woody2goody]

But how does that differ from mazzacanesque, exactly?

Jaime's much better :)

[woody2goody]

I like Sutil, but let's get real he scored once in 2009. all other races, ZERO.

Also remember that Force India was pretty darn fast in Spa and sutil only came in 11th 42 seconds adrift of his teammate, so he didn't make decent use of that car when it came to him there, did it?

Anyway, alls I'm saying is that Naka is a competent driver and worthy of an F1 seat.

Agreed. Sutil's few good races somehow compensate (in the eyes of the media) for his usual erratic driving throughout the year. It happened with Monaco 08 and Spa 07, one good race somehow makes him a great talent, when guys like Bourdais, Naka, Glock, Heidfeld, and Kovy have achieved far more and have still been lambasted for so-called 'poor performances'. This year he has been better, but still not completely convincing to me.

Nakajima's problem is the zero on the scoresheet, which Sutil and Fisi would have had without the Belgian and Italian Grands Prix. He's been hovering around 8th-13th places in nearly every race, but the two or three good races he's had have either been blighted by terrible luck (Turkey and Brazil), or by being just a tenth a lap slower than Nico (Britain).

Compare him to the jobs Kovalainen, Piquet, Grosjean, Badoer, Fisichella and Bourdais have done this year, and Nakajima has just been unlucky, nothing else.

He's had a very similar year to Sato in 2005. He was just a little bit slower than Button for most of the season, and had bad luck in all the races he was on to score a good finish.

I'm pretty sure we'll see Nakajima again in F1, yes it might not be next year, but it could be 2011 if Kobayashi or Toyota's second driver isn't up to it.

[truefan72]

Spa - got caught up in a collision on first lap

where did he qualify vs his teammate?

[truefan72]

Agreed. Sutil's few good races somehow compensate (in the eyes of the media) for his usual erratic driving throughout the year. It happened with Monaco 08 and Spa 07, one good race somehow makes him a great talent, when guys like Bourdais, Naka, Glock, Heidfeld, and Kovy have achieved far more and have still been lambasted for so-called 'poor performances'. This year he has been better, but still not completely convincing to me.

Nakajima's problem is the zero on the scoresheet, which Sutil and Fisi would have had without the Belgian and Italian Grands Prix. He's been hovering around 8th-13th places in nearly every race, but the two or three good races he's had have either been blighted by terrible luck (Turkey and Brazil), or by being just a tenth a lap slower than Nico (Britain).

Compare him to the jobs Kovalainen, Piquet, Grosjean, Badoer, Fisichella and Bourdais have done this year, and Nakajima has just been unlucky, nothing else.

He's had a very similar year to Sato in 2005. He was just a little bit slower than Button for most of the season, and had bad luck in all the races he was on to score a good finish.

I'm pretty sure we'll see Nakajima again in F1, yes it might not be next year, but it could be 2011 if Kobayashi or Toyota's second driver isn't up to it.

excellent post

[wedge]

Nakajima's problem is the zero on the scoresheet, which Sutil and Fisi would have had without the Belgian and Italian Grands Prix. He's been hovering around 8th-13th places in nearly every race, but the two or three good races he's had have either been blighted by terrible luck (Turkey and Brazil), or by being just a tenth a lap slower than Nico (Britain).

Rosberg can regularly get solid points finish, Naka regularly struggles to finish in the top 10.