Renault cost me title, says Massa

[Brown, Jon Brow]

Felipe Massa has accused Renault of robbing him of the 2008 drivers' championship.

The Brazilian was leading last year's Singapore Grand Prix when Nelson Piquet Jr crashed deliberately, which helped Fernando Alonso to win the race.

"All of what happened was robbery. Regarding the race nothing has happened, the result stays the same. That's not right," said Massa.

"It changed the championship. I lost by one point."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8286418.stm

So is Massa saying that this race should be annulled? I don't think that is a sporting thing to say. It 's completely unfair to expect results to change that could affect the outcome of the season. Drivers would have approached races with a different mentality. Would you expect Hamilton to trundle around for a few points in Interlagos if Massa had been closer in the title race?

I can fully understand why Massa feels robbed by Renault, but the championship is won throughout a season, not just on one race.

[Dave B]

It's balderdash anyway, like those people who said "if we'd had medals in 1934 my dad would have won the championship".

It doesn't work like that. Take Brazil, just for one example. Hamilton and McLaren made the deliberate decision to only drive for 5th place that weekend because that's all they needed. Had Massa been closer in the points, who can say whether that would have been the case? Lewis may have won; he may have crashed out trying to win.

Anyway, who is to say that Ferrari's hopeless traffic light system wouldn't have screwed them over some other time? I don't care if you're the lovechild of Derren Brown and Mystic Meg: nobody can predict this stuff.

Poor Massa is feeling aggrieved, and that's understandable, but he's gained a great deal of respect for the dignified way he handled losing the '08 Championship - he doesn't want to throw that goodwill away with ill-thought outbursts like this.

[Knock-on]

http://fivestarmusic.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/violin.jpg


It's balderdash anyway, like those people who said "if we'd had medals in 1934 my dad would have won the championship".

Or as I like to say...

"If my Aunty had Bollocks, she'd be my Uncle."

[ArrowsFA1]

While Felipe's comments are somewhat understandable, they are also disappointing.

There are far too many "what's ifs" that can affect the outcome of any world championship, not just 2008. Had one thing not happened, then a dozen other things may (not) have followed.

The Renault race fix itself might not have worked had any number of different things happened.

You can't remove one event in isolation, then say with certainty what would have happened. Sorry Felipe but you were, and are, the 2008 WDC runner up. Nothing can, should, or will, change that.

[CNR]

i do not see this that way



Massa is convinced the punishments were too lenient.

"I have seen in football how a referee took money to throw a game and all the matches he influenced were annulled," he said.
"The team responsible were relegated. Here they just sent Briatore home. I don't understand it and I don't think it was right."

[Cooper_S]

Massa can always cling to the notion, but it will not change nor diminish the fact Hamilton is the rightful 2008 WDC...

I wonder if Massa is starting to believe he will not be 100% fit again and he is lamenting the season he came closest to winning the crown...

[Triumph]

Or as I like to say...

"If my Aunty had Bollocks, she'd be my Uncle."

:laugh:


I think the championship went to the right person in the end. If it wasn't for the FIA's outrageously bare-faced attempt to stifle Lewis Hamilton at every imagined opportunity he would have won it earlier than the final round, and by more than one point.

[N. Jones]

Felipe Massa has accused Renault of robbing him of the 2008 drivers' championship.

The Brazilian was leading last year's Singapore Grand Prix when Nelson Piquet Jr crashed deliberately, which helped Fernando Alonso to win the race.

"All of what happened was robbery. Regarding the race nothing has happened, the result stays the same. That's not right," said Massa.

"It changed the championship. I lost by one point."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsport/formula_one/8286418.stm

So is Massa saying that this race should be annulled? I don't think that is a sporting thing to say. It 's completely unfair to expect results to change that could affect the outcome of the season. Drivers would have approached races with a different mentality. Would you expect Hamilton to trundle around for a few points in Interlagos if Massa had been closer in the title race?

I can fully understand why Massa feels robbed by Renault, but the championship is won throughout a season, not just on one race.

Correct me if I am wrong but isn't this the same Massa who couldn't keep it on the track during the '08 British GP while Hamilton was running away with the win??

[ArrowsFA1]

i do not see this that way
Fair enough, Felipe doesn't agree with the penalty, or lack of, imposed on Renault. He's not alone there.

[Cooper_S]

There is a difference in believing Renault have gotten away with effectively no penalty and believing that Massa was robbed of the title... as pointed out by others that Massa (and the Ferrari team) can finger many occasions during the 2008 season where they underperformed and fouled up all of which made it possible for someone else to win the title...

[harsha]

and hasn't he gotten a win for a rather undeserved spa grand prix that year...he would have prolly gotten in second / third had not the FIA seen fit to punish Hamilton for what was effectively racing...

[Steve2009]

Let it go Felipe!
Just let it go :p :

[keysersoze]

Felipe, you WERE world champion . . . in Brazil . . . for about 10 seconds. :D

[F1boat]

One thing I loved in the whole mess is that a race and a championship can not be changed 12 months after the end of the story. For Felipe to want championship in the court is ugly and unpleasant. Also it is insulting to his new teammate Fernando Alonso. Boo, Felipe!

[Steve2009]

http://fivestarmusic.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/05/violin.jpg



Or as I like to say...

"If my Aunty had Bollocks, she'd be my Uncle."
This is also very poor sportsmanship by FM.
Kinda makes me think that if anyone is going to be throwing toys out of his pram at Ferrari it will be Massa not FA.
Well I may be reading too much into it.
At any rate This was a classless act from a guy I thought was better than that! :down:

[555-04Q2]

Massa is right and wrong. He lost due to a blatant cheating move that ultimately changed the Singapore result and the outcome of the WDC between Massa vs Lewis. But at the same time, the FIA screwed Lewis at Spa, so I think Lewis is the deserved WDC in the end anyway. Its all history anyway.

[I am evil Homer]

Indeed, lets not forget the Spa fix. However this smacks of poor journalism TBH....they ask Felipe about his thoughts on cheating, in particualr Singapore 08 and then it becomes "I was robbed". I hope he was mis-quoted as I have a lot of respect for Massa and this comes off as bitter

[UltimateDanGTR]

Indeed, lets not forget the Spa fix. However this smacks of poor journalism TBH....they ask Felipe about his thoughts on cheating, in particualr Singapore 08 and then it becomes "I was robbed". I hope he was mis-quoted as I have a lot of respect for Massa and this comes off as bitter

agreed. the fia did everything they could to stop hammy from being champion, but they failed. singapore wasnt the only farce that year, spa was as well. 2008 was a twisting sintelating season, too many what ifs for anyone to start complaining about the final result.

quite classless by Massa IMO, what happened happened, he was graceful in defeat, he shouldn;t spoil it now.

Hamilton was worthy world champion, im not just saying thats as a fan, he really was.

[Brown, Jon Brow]

How did Renault cheating make the Ferrari 'traffic lights' fail on his pit stop? :confused:

[Steve2009]

Indeed, lets not forget the Spa fix. However this smacks of poor journalism TBH....they ask Felipe about his thoughts on cheating, in particualr Singapore 08 and then it becomes "I was robbed". I hope he was mis-quoted as I have a lot of respect for Massa and this comes off as bitterI sincerely hope you are right. I really wonder if FM is slyer than I thought,
and meant this to be the final nail in NPjr coffin, in regards to thinking he will ever be able to show his cheating @$$ in Brazil again :laugh:

[I am evil Homer]

Well with all these things I wonder (as a former journalist) what angle they were going for and what was actually asked....you can do all sorts with a quote! Fair enough he has a view on the cheating but it didn't cost him the title.

[UltimateDanGTR]

How did Renault cheating make the Ferrari 'traffic lights' fail on his pit stop? :confused:

interesting point, surely the lights would have failed at his schedualed stop anyway if PK hadn't of crashed, and it would be 'My team cost me the WDC!'

[HelloWorld]

I may be missing something here, but didn't Alonso win that race. That means Hamilton lost out on some points too, as did everyone else who finished.

The conditions in that race were the same for everyone. Yes, Renault did cheat and the only one who gained an unfair advantage was Alonso. If that was known at the time and the FIA anulled his win and moved everyone up one place Hamilton would still be champion.

The only thing Massa can blame his title loss on is the "disasterous pit stop." in which case it is his or ferrari's fault.

I think Massa should be focusing on getting better and competing for next season' championship. Woundering what might have been 12 months on isn't going to do anyone any good, especialy when you consider who his new team mate is.

[harsha]

me thinks that Massa knows that he has lost his best chance to be WDC....and probably will not now that Fred has come to ferrari...

anyway with the way he thinks,I wonder if Massa thinks that Fernando was also responsible for him losing the WDC :down:

[Knock-on]

me thinks that Massa knows that he has lost his best chance to be WDC....and probably will not now that Fred has come to ferrari...

anyway with the way he thinks,I wonder if Massa thinks that Fernando was also responsible for him losing the WDC :down:

Good point Harsha.

There is no doubt that Renaults cheating was initiated to benefit Alonso and thus give credibilty to their F1 campaign.

Although Tefllonso has not been implicated in the conspiracy, there will always be an association.

If Massa is bitter with Renault, and believes Alonso's victory unfairly denied him of a Championship, (no matter how misguided) then the relationship at Ferrari might be rather strained..... to say the least!!

Going to be interesting. :D

[christophulus]

The only thing Massa can blame his title loss on is the "disasterous pit stop." in which case it is his or ferrari's fault.

Absolutely right.

I'm quite disappointed to hear Massa come out with this. I know he must be annoyed about losing the title but Piquet's crash wasn't to blame for that, it was only the pitstop.

Besides, who's to say Massa wouldn't have had an engine failure or a crash or whatever.. there's too many "if"s in this!

[Cooper_S]

there where 3 other races after Singapore... was anyone else still in the running before Singapore... they could also claim the crash change everything for them also... can they not

[Koz]

I ask if someone remembers what McLaren did at the end of 2007 when kimi won the championship?

Did they not protest for BMW's (i think) disqualification so that Lewis would have taken the championship?

And yeah, Harsha is right. Massa will never be champion now. And seemingly has a grudge against FA because of this.
Ferrari seem to have ed up this time. 2010 will be a very bad year for them.

[Wasted Talent]

How did Renault cheating make the Ferrari 'traffic lights' fail on his pit stop? :confused:


Piquet Jnr had discussed this with Briatore before the race............

WT

[HenryM]

How did Renault cheating make the Ferrari 'traffic lights' fail on his pit stop? :confused:

Ok, as I understand that "traffic light" was a automatic system, but it was being operated in a "manual mode" by a mechanic, so they had a planned stop in lap XX, but than there was a safety car an instead of 1, 2 or 3 cars 10 cars came to the pits at the same time, including 2 ferraris, than there was a lot of pressure and confusion so the mechanic did the mistake in this context,

1 different event can change everything, and as I think that safety car (caused on purpose to benefit Alonso) changed the pit stop and the entire race result, it could change the following races to, or not.

so I don't think Massa is wrong feeling that he was "robbed" in some way...

about SPA, that wasn't a incident caused by him, and I remember other drivers supporting FIA decision, and if someone should be angry with it should be Lewis, but since he won the championship he naturally doesn't care.
and in the same interview massa said he knows the result cannot be changed now and that it wouldn't be something that would make him proud to write about 1 year later,

and anyone here think is fair that Alonso still have his trophy won in such a situation?

and some more quotes of the same interview translated using google translator
"My mechanic made a mistake, can not forget it, but a pit stop too complicated, with two cars coming at the same time and ten in the pit lane. He pressed a button in a situation that would never happen in a normal pit stop. The that bothers me is that Renault has stolen. one appeared to speak: "I really want to hit." All right. Briatore was stripped of the parade? Okay. engineer? Pilots? A pilot won the race by a theft. should have happened to the pilots as well, "

I am not and never will be a pilot I think, "Oh, I could have been champion." Even if write today on my resume that I am the champion, after a year, would be something that I do not know if he would speak, who was the champion. "

http://tazio.uol.com.br/f-1/textos/13976/

[CNR]

is this all blown out of proportion

http://www.crash.net/f1/news/152992/1/massa_blanks_piquet_amid_singapore_fall-out.html


Felipe Massa afforded Nelson Piquet Jr a cursory handshake when the pair met at a Brazilian kart circuit this week, but repeated the claim that his countryman's 'accident' in last year's Singapore Grand Prix cost him the F1 world title.

Although Piquet attempted to greet the recovering Massa when they bumped into each other at the Kartodromo Granja Viana, the Ferrari pilot reportedly resisted the offered embrace and opted for a polite handshake instead. Piquet, clearly embarrassed by the awkwardness of the situation, left briskly and their paths did not cross again for the remainder of the day.




Massa has already made his feelings clear in an interview with TV Globo.

"It was an ugly attitude for a team to tell a driver that he had to crash to have his contract renewed," he said, "Piquet knew he was going to be fired, so he was vulnerable.

"[His actions] created a lot of things, as the safety car meant that most of the cars had to go the pit. We had ten cars going in, and my stop went wrong [when] a mechanic pressed a button in a situation that would never have happened in a normal pit-stop. That's why it bothers me, Renault stole the win."

While he accepts that Piquet's revelation of the truth was a worthy act, Massa insists that he should not have waited so long to do so, especially as it meant that there was no chance of having the result - and the outcome of the world championship - adjusted.

[Saint Devote]

Oh shut up Felipe :rolleyes:

I have one name that you can learn character from: Damon Hill :D

[CaptainRaiden]

I think it was more that Ferrari dropped the ball with their "pit-stop lights" and reliability problems than Hamilton winning it decisively. Sure, he was screwed by the FIA at Spa, and had that brain fart at Montreal which ruined Kimi's and his race, but I guess Massa would have won it by a good 10 or 15 point margin if Renault didn't play poker with Piquet at Singapore, and if the Ferrari engine didn't explode at Hungary, plus Massa's two DNFs at the start of the season by his own fault. And well, Massa being Massa at Silverstone in rain.

So, sure Hamilton is a deserving champion, one can say, but he was helped greatly by Ferrari's stupidity and Renault's treachery to be very honest. And this can't be denied.

[harsha]

So, sure Hamilton is a deserving champion, one can say, but he was helped greatly by Ferrari's stupidity and Renault's treachery to be very honest. And this can't be denied.

no one's denying that...but haven't world championships been decided because the screw-ups by the other teams before...

people could easily say that 2005,Alonso won because of Mclaren's unreliability....2007,Kimi won cause of Mclaren's stupidity amongst recent years...so this is nothing new...there's no point whining about it now

[ShiftingGears]

Ferraris terrible pitstop cost him. Which was not caused by Renault at all. Besides, he got the Belgian Grand Prix gifted to him, so he should shut up.

His comments are quite disappointing.

[CaptainRaiden]

no one's denying that...but haven't world championships been decided because the screw-ups by the other teams before...

people could easily say that 2005,Alonso won because of Mclaren's unreliability....2007,Kimi won cause of Mclaren's stupidity amongst recent years...so this is nothing new...there's no point whining about it now

Agreed. This is only sour grapes on Massa's part. Almost an year has gone by, and he blames his title loss on one race. Well, if he didn't bin it in the first two races, and drove like an a$$ at Silverstone, he still could have won the championship.

This is something you would never see Kimi do, even though he lost two championships because of things out of his control.

[harsha]

and even when mclaren filed an appeal for the 2007 championship,I remember Hamilton saying that he wouldn't like to win it on court

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2007/nov/17/motorsports.sport

[leopard]

Massa should have won, if he gave Glock cigar before the race commenced on the final race...