Brawn back on form?

[Andy Harrison]

Are Brawn GP back to winning ways or was Monza a fluke?

Cool vid with the Brawn team talking about their season so far...

http://grid1.tv/#browse/media_vault/inside_track?id=2_221

[Knock-on]

I think with the circuits (and temps) we have left, Brawn will be finishing with a flourish :D

[wedge]

Too early to say but ATM in time I'd more likely to say its a one off.

Monza is a unique track which requires a unique package.

BGP got it right for Monza, RBR didn't.

[AndyL]

Too early to say but ATM in time I'd more likely to say its a one off.

Monza is a unique track which requires a unique package.

BGP got it right for Monza, RBR didn't.

That is quite a plausible argument... it was like going back to the start of the season, everyone turning up with effectively a new aero package, and Brawn nailing it on the first try. But apparently they also have some major revisions for Singapore so I think they will be strong for the rest of the season.
For the sake of the contest I hope so anyway, it's more likely to stay alive until Abu Dhabi if they're fighting for the places that are split by 2 points than if they're relegated to the ones split by 1 point.

[F1boat]

I think that they will be competitive in Singapore and Abu Dhabi and maybe not so in Japan. In Brazil, who knows, Interlagos is also unpredictable... But I really think that Ferrari and McLaren will be also very strong in the remaining races and maybe RBR or even FI can win a race as well.

[Roamy]

well they only need about one more fluke and its over.

[ioan]

Are Brawn GP back to winning ways or was Monza a fluke?


As far as I remember they won Valencia too and Rubens was starting 4th in Spa and without the gearbox problem would have probably been 3rd, IMO.

[UltimateDanGTR]

Brawn are back IMO. Spa was a blip, but Valencia was good, and Monza even better. In terms of can this last, this year is so unpredictable that it is impossible to tell. one minute brawn are the best, the next red bull, then ferrari and force india, then mclaren. Trying who will win the last 4 races is a bit like someone other than ioan trying to guess what ioan is having for tea tonight. No one knows.....

[stevie_gerrard]

I think they are back in form, it seems that they have fixed their tyre issues, and you can tell how much happier both drivers are with the car.

[Valve Bounce]

The cold weather for the first few European races didn't help. Now, I guess it is down to luck and which of the two drivers lady luck favours. Rubens does have a dodgy gearbox.

[Saint Devote]

The Brawn has been an excellent car - it never changed - the issue that created the sudden change in performance and makes it all unpredictable are the tyres.

A team can have a great car but come the weekend and the rigid tyre rules make the car now like a driver, having its ups and downs.

At this rate I think championships like that of Mansell and Schumacher in 2006 are past.

But I look at Monte Carlo and Valencia and with the Yas Marina circuit coming up and am confident that Brawn has to be one of the winning bets.

Of course I hope it will be Jenson rather than Rubens :-]

[Somebody]

St. Dvte, as usual you are over-hasty and over-confident in your own ability to predict matters.

This year's been mixed up a LOT by the all-new rules. Next year will be mixed up to a lesser degree by the lack of refuelling, and the knock-on effects of a larger tank.

But most of the mixing-up has been the result of unoptimised cars, or cars which were fundamentally that bit "off" to start with and have had serious workarounds implemented (i.e., McLaren). As the teams come to grips with the rules in 2011 and 2012, all of that will fall away, the areas of potential progress will narrow, and it'll be back to "evolution, not revolution".

[F1boat]

But I look at Monte Carlo and Valencia and with the Yas Marina circuit coming up and am confident that Brawn has to be one of the winning bets.

Of course I hope it will be Jenson rather than Rubens :-]

Same here...

[Mark]

But most of the mixing-up has been the result of unoptimised cars, or cars which were fundamentally that bit "off" to start with and have had serious workarounds implemented (i.e., McLaren). As the teams come to grips with the rules in 2011 and 2012, all of that will fall away, the areas of potential progress will narrow, and it'll be back to "evolution, not revolution".

But history shows that most of the time when you have a massive change in the rules, it's the top teams that come out of it best and the smaller teams which struggle, then the lesser teams gradually catch up when you have a period of a few years of rule stability.

But the opposite has happened in this case, it's the smaller teams who have found they can compete right at the front. I mean if you'd said a Force India would be getting pole position and finishing on the poduim at the start of the year you'd be considered insane!

[Andy Harrison]

The Brawn has been an excellent car - it never changed - the issue that created the sudden change in performance and makes it all unpredictable are the tyres.

A team can have a great car but come the weekend and the rigid tyre rules make the car now like a driver, having its ups and downs.

At this rate I think championships like that of Mansell and Schumacher in 2006 are past.

But I look at Monte Carlo and Valencia and with the Yas Marina circuit coming up and am confident that Brawn has to be one of the winning bets.

Of course I hope it will be Jenson rather than Rubens :-]


I agree! and good luck to Jenson for the rest of the season - although I do hope it goes to the wire!!

[ioan]

But history shows that most of the time when you have a massive change in the rules, it's the top teams that come out of it best and the smaller teams which struggle, then the lesser teams gradually catch up when you have a period of a few years of rule stability.

But the opposite has happened in this case, it's the smaller teams who have found they can compete right at the front. I mean if you'd said a Force India would be getting pole position and finishing on the poduim at the start of the year you'd be considered insane!

Not exactly.
Given that Honda invested 700 millions, the biggest budget ever for a F1 car, it is not right to say that a smaller team came out on top this time. In fact the team with the biggest budget came out on top, again.

[Garry Walker]

Not exactly.
Given that Honda invested 700 millions, the biggest budget ever for a F1 car, it is not right to say that a smaller team came out on top this time. In fact the team with the biggest budget came out on top, again.

Where do you get this 700 million dollars number? I find that impossible to believe, it is just too big.

[Somebody]

But history shows that most of the time when you have a massive change in the rules, it's the top teams that come out of it best and the smaller teams which struggle, then the lesser teams gradually catch up when you have a period of a few years of rule stability.

But the opposite has happened in this case, it's the smaller teams who have found they can compete right at the front. I mean if you'd said a Force India would be getting pole position and finishing on the poduim at the start of the year you'd be considered insane!

Well, there are abormal factors at play:

1) Double-diffusers and KERS. All but Honda/Brawn, Williams and Toyota missed the loophole (a couple of other teams thought about a DD, but cocked up the interpretations they submitted enough to get them turned back by the FIA), while former front-runners McLaren, Ferrari and BMW.Sauber focused on KERS and screwed their aerodynamic packages to little benefit in the earlier part of the season. .

2) Further, McLaren & Ferrari left it far too late to start work on 2009, because they were so busy with 2008. As a result, they both screwed themselves in the early part of the season, even before the KERS blind alley is considered.

3) Partially due to the way the new slicks behave, it seems to have been very hard this year to build a car to suit all tracks. That'll change as the teams get more familiar with the cars.

4) Neither Brawn's Honda budget nor Red Bull's budget can be considered "small". Honda gave up on their 2008 dog of a car very early and put a very large budget and two windtunnels towards getting out of the pit they'd dug themselves into, only to find the parent company giving up on them just as they got good. Meanwhile, RBR were already inching forward - remember, the STR that took a victory at Monza last year was ultimately [i]their chassis, even as the RBR team itself struggled with underpowered Renault engines that were (allowed to be) improved over the winter - and shaking the pack up just allowed them to jump forward as they focused on aero over KERS.

5) Force India are, granted, a bit of a special case, but it's merely unusual rather than unheard of for a small team to do very well very quickly. Remember, they're running a whole McLaren drivetrain this year as well as the Merc engine, which is time and money they can put toward other aspects of the car, and they also made noises after Spa that they weren't really aiming for a car which was particularly suited to a low-downforce/low-drag configuration, but that they kind of lucked into it. With that in mind, they were also helped by (3) in that respect.