Red Bull and Renault off to the stewards

[christophulus]

Red Bull have to explain Webber's pit release, Renault have to explain Alonso's wheel flying off. One of those definitely deserves a punishment in my eyes. Thoughts?


It is understood that the Renault matter relates to the wheel that fell of Fernando Alonso's car following his first pit stop, while Red Bull Racing will have to explain the late release of Mark Webber's car from the pits, which resulted in a near collision with Kimi Raikkonen.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/77351

[BDunnell]

I don't think either deserves a penalty. Clearly, Alonso's wheel falling off would not have merited even a hint of trouble from the stewards had it not been for the incidents involving Henry Surtees and then Massa.

[Dave B]

Both of them do.

There's a precident for penalising Red Bull, as Ferrari were fined for a similar release of Massa last year (Valencia?). A fine for the team would be appropriate, but Webber would have been relying on his team to be his eyes and should if anything be praised for taking avoiding action.

And WtF was Alonso doing with his wheel coming loose? If a component randomly detatches from a car with no warning there's nothing which can be done, but this was predictable and an accident waiting to happen. He should have pulled off the racetrack immediately the problem became apparent.

[christophulus]

Both of them do.

There's a precident for penalising Red Bull, as Ferrari were fined for a similar release of Massa last year (Valencia?).

Yep, into the unfortunate Ferrari-magnet, Sutil :s . A fine for the team would be appropriate, but it's quite clear that it's the driver's responsibility (how he's supposed to see anything I don't know) so a penalty for Webber would be harsh.

Renault should be at least reprimanded, it was obvious the wheel was going to fall off and was pretty dangerous

[Dave B]

Renault suspended from Valencia!



Renault has been suspended from the European Grand Prix for the events that led to a wheel coming off Fernando Alonso's car in Hungary today.

Following a post-race discussion with the stewards, it was deemed that the team had breached the regulations enough for it to be suspended from the next event.

It means Alonso will miss his home event that takes place in Valencia next month, unless he moves to another team.


http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/77354

I called for sanctions but this is bloody harsh. :s

[woody2goody]

Alonso did slow right down when he knew the wheel was coming off, he was probably only doing 50-60ish. I know it's very dangerous, but he wasn't reckless with it.

Also, he wouldn't want the wheel to come off in the pitlane and injure a mechanic. I thought it was a really dangerous thing at first, but on the replays he clearly slows to allow it to detach safely.

I also think Red Bull will be ok, as like Martin Brundle said, there was no contact, and Mark didn't gain the place.

[woody2goody]

Renault suspended from Valencia!



http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/77354

I called for sanctions but this is bloody harsh. :s

That's ridiculous. I thought you were bulls**tting for a minute there Dave :D That's how stupid it seemed when I first read it.

Why should Fernando and Piquet/whoever is in the second car lose out on a race just because of someone else's mistake?

And after all, it was just a mistake, an accident. Nobody did that on purpose, and there was no harm done.

I'm aware of recent events, but come on, that's absolutely crazy.

[ioan]

Renault suspended from Valencia!

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/77354

I called for sanctions but this is bloody harsh. :s

Maybe it was time that some harsh decisions were taken to put an end to hazardous actions.
Next time they will think twice when such a problem arises.

Certainly last Surtee's death and Massa's accident triggered the harsh sanction.

maybe this is a reason for Flav leaving so early today.

[ioan]

Alonso did slow right down when he knew the wheel was coming off, he was probably only doing 50-60ish.

I'd rather think he slowed down because he couldn't go any faster given the car situation.

[Dave B]

A reprimand for Red Bull, nothing more.

http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_news_item.php?fes_art_id=38562

[Ari]

Webber was released but had the foresight to look around him and quickly realised Kimi was coming fast. He moved over to avoid a collision and carried on behind Kimi. Webber did the right and safe thing and needs to be rewarded for that.

In the same sense had Alonso parked it after being told or seeing his car was not safe to drive would he have got a penalty? Of course not. It's the same thing as Webber. Webber took the safe approach, Alonso did not.

Maybe I have my rose coloured glasses on but that's the way I see it. Immediately after I watched the Webber incident I screamed that he moved across and avoided a collision. If they don't reward that then there's no point in drivers driving safely as you're going to be penalised anyway.

[Dave B]

Webber was released but had the foresight to look around him and quickly realised Kimi was coming fast. He moved over to avoid a collision and carried on behind Kimi. Webber did the right and safe thing and needs to be rewarded for that.

...

. Immediately after I watched the Webber incident I screamed that he moved across and avoided a collision. If they don't reward that then there's no point in drivers driving safely as you're going to be penalised anyway.
You can't reward a driver for simply doing his job properly, but maybe Webber's quick thinking was a factor in deciding not to fine the team.

[Garry Walker]

And WtF was Alonso doing with his wheel coming loose? If a component randomly detatches from a car with no warning there's nothing which can be done, but this was predictable and an accident waiting to happen. He should have pulled off the racetrack immediately the problem became apparent.

Again you show you understand nothing about racing or about the mentality of a true racer.

[Dave B]

Again you show you understand nothing about racing or about the mentality of a true racer.
Actually when I posted that I showed that I didn't understand the full situation: Alonso believed he had a puncture and the team did nothing to disabuse him of that notion. It was obvious to an observer what had happenned and I was shocked to learn that Renault hadn't told him. Now these facts are out in the open, it explains Alonso's reactions.

Do try to consider the timestamp on posts before you launch into one of your little tirades.

[Garry Walker]

Actually when I posted that I showed that I didn't understand the full situation: Alonso believed he had a puncture and the team did nothing to disabuse him of that notion. It was obvious to an observer what had happenned and I was shocked to learn that Renault hadn't told him. Now these facts are out in the open, it explains Alonso's reactions.
I am pretty sure Alonso would not have stopped even if he knew what really was going on.

[Ari]

I am pretty sure Alonso would not have stopped even if he knew what really was going on.

True.... but he may have traveled slower or been able to feel the wheel working away. Instead he may have, as he said, just thought it was a puncture.

Again you show you understand nothing about racing or about the mentality of a true racer.

Totally agree.

[ShiftingGears]

I've said it before - it's not the drivers job to pull over and abandon all hope when the car is falling to bits. It's to get back to the pits in the hope that the car can be repaired, and then they can continue racing.

Renault's penalty was awful. If anything, the stewards should've ordered Renault to tell Alonso to pull over and park it.

Renault's penalty was awful. If anything, the stewards should've ordered Renault to tell Alonso to pull over and park it.

Excellent point.

[jas123f1]

I've said it before - it's not the drivers job to pull over and abandon all hope when the car is falling to bits. It's to get back to the pits in the hope that the car can be repaired, and then they can continue racing.

Renault's penalty was awful. If anything, the stewards should've ordered Renault to tell Alonso to pull over and park it.

Renault's penalty was too hard also in my thinking - a fine with would be more right - I hope Renault’s appeal will change the punishment so Renault can be there in Valencia. And I agree that also the stewards can say to Renault team to tell Alonso what’s going on and to park the car in the side of the track – even if stewards are not responcible to what happened..

[Robinho]

surprised Red Bull got away with the unsafe pit release - that was blatant IMO.

also surprised Renault have been treated so harshly - i agree the team should have informed Alonso what was happening, but a race ban seems too much, although i do agree that the last thing we needed weas anotheer errant wheel making its way round the track, the speed of the wheel wouldn't have been the problem, the speed of the impact with another car would have, as proved with Massa, hitting anything at 170mph+ does not make for a happy ending.