Nascar Creating Chaos on the Track

[muggle not]

This is a good article by Dustin long. Some may disagree but i think he is dead on.

http://www.news-record.com/content/2009/07/06/article/nascar_creating_chaos_on_the_track

[Sparky1329]

I'm not a big fan of plate races and Carl Edwards is right. Wreckfests aren't my thing.

[call_me_andrew]

At Talladega, everyone blamed the yellow line for causing the last lap crash. This time, I'm glad it happened so far away from the yellow line that no one can use that excuse without being properly labeled as a dumbass.

[wedge]

At Talladega, everyone blamed the yellow line for causing the last lap crash. This time, I'm glad it happened so far away from the yellow line that no one can use that excuse without being properly labeled as a dumbass.

:up:

[Lee Roy]

I agree completely. The sad thing is that NASCAR doesn't know how to get away from Restrictor Plate Racing. They've been doing it so long now that they've created a whole new class of fan that looks forward to "the big one".

I don't watch Restrictor Plate Racing. I hate it. The only way to get rid of it is to reconfigure Daytona and Talladega, and the current management would rather die than do that.

Mr. France, tear down those high banks!!!!!

[harvick#1]

they need to do something fast, this is getting insane, its out-of-control.

but they can keep it all the same, Nascar has to finally put there foot down and black flag drivers for slam drafting and blocking. no matter, its a drive-thru penalty. this will make the drivers think twice about their moves and they need to keep it cleaner

[Wade91]

I agree completely. The sad thing is that NASCAR doesn't know how to get away from Restrictor Plate Racing. They've been doing it so long now that they've created a whole new class of fan that looks forward to "the big one".

I don't watch Restrictor Plate Racing. I hate it. The only way to get rid of it is to reconfigure Daytona and Talladega, and the current management would rather die than do that.

Mr. France, tear down those high banks!!!!!
you should watch the plate races they are some of best races of the year :D if the high banks were torn down, then talladega and daytona would just become like any other cookie cutter track on the schedudule, just little longer

[The instant classic]

sad to say 90% of fans use to sell out Bristol night race just to see wreck after wreck after wreck, same thing for plate racing, nascar won't change the rules for daytona and dega cuz ever since they put banking on Bristol they can't sell out anymore less wrecks fans don't wanna watch, the rules won't change at plate tracks cuz most fans love "the big one" put it this way, do wrestling fans watch wrestling for the great "storylines" and "drama" or to see 2 guys kick the **** out of eatchother? samething with plate races, do fans watch for "great racing" and "the drama of nascar" or to see 25 car pile up? i know alot of us here don't watch for that reason

[harvick#1]

sad to say 90% of fans use to sell out Bristol night race just to see wreck after wreck after wreck, same thing for plate racing, nascar won't change the rules for daytona and dega cuz ever since they put banking on Bristol they can't sell out anymore less wrecks fans don't wanna watch, the rules won't change at plate tracks cuz most fans love "the big one" put it this way, do wrestling fans watch wrestling for the great "storylines" and "drama" or to see 2 guys kick the **** out of eatchother? samething with plate races, do fans watch for "great racing" and "the drama of nascar" or to see 25 car pile up? i know alot of us here don't watch for that reason

have you watched the last 3 fall Bristol races, that are horrible, from one of the best races to the worst, thanks to the Chase, the Drivers all play it safe and dont try. The chase is what made the racing a joke as drivers dont want to risk going for it

[The instant classic]

have you watched the last 3 fall Bristol races, that are horrible, from one of the best races to the worst, thanks to the Chase, the Drivers all play it safe and dont try. The chase is what made the racing a joke as drivers dont want to risk going for it
they are bad bad races now, even DW said one time this aint bristol
i hate the chase ever since nascar made the chase the ratings have droped off, im sure fans think, hey if my fave driver aint in the chase why watch?
you got guys like Jimmie Johnson who does nothing the first half the season, and come the 2nd half OMG he's superman, i have an idea for nascar, the first race of the chase starts at New Hampshire, why not move the daytona 500, to that day, cuz the chase really is when the season starts, :rolleyes:

i agree the chase made racing a joke!

[Lee Roy]

have you watched the last 3 fall Bristol races, that are horrible, from one of the best races to the worst, thanks to the Chase, the Drivers all play it safe and dont try. The chase is what made the racing a joke as drivers dont want to risk going for it

It isn't "the chase", that's silly. It's the new progressive banking at Bristol that finally allows drivers to pass one another without the "wrecking". If the "wrecking" fans from Bristol and the plate tracks (Daytona & Tally) leave and return to professional wrestling, or wherever they came from, and leave the racing to those of us who remember what the races were like before all the "wrecking", I'll be a happy race fan. I won't miss them a bit.

[harvick#1]

It isn't "the chase", that's silly. It's the new progressive banking at Bristol that finally allows drivers to pass one another without the "wrecking". If the "wrecking" fans from Bristol and the plate tracks (Daytona & Tally) leave and return to professional wrestling, or wherever they came from, and leave the racing to those of us who remember what the races were like before all the "wrecking", I'll be a happy race fan. I won't miss them a bit.

what passing at bristol??? in the fall race I dont think any passed anyone in the final 200 laps in the top 10

[beachgirl]

I'm not sure how you can really compare Talledega/Daytona RP racing with Bristol. Sure there's lots of banging, bashing, and wrecking (or there used to be) at Bristol, but it's done at roughly HALF the speed of Talledega/Daytona. The chances of major injury/death at Bristol are far, far less. Every time there's The Big One at Talledega/Daytona, the chances are tremendously greater. Personally, and I know I'm probably in a small minority, I do NOT watch the RP races for The Big One(s). I know they're going to happen. But that doesn't mean I like it at all.

[call_me_andrew]

I agree completely. The sad thing is that NASCAR doesn't know how to get away from Restrictor Plate Racing. They've been doing it so long now that they've created a whole new class of fan that looks forward to "the big one".

I don't watch Restrictor Plate Racing. I hate it. The only way to get rid of it is to reconfigure Daytona and Talladega, and the current management would rather die than do that.

Mr. France, tear down those high banks!!!!!

I think taking down the banking would be overkill. I think the idea should be to reduce mechanical grip (in an already undertired car). I think cutting grooves in the tires and going with a very hard compound would remove enough grip to force drivers to lift in the turns at Talladega. We can take away all the downforce we want, but the cars have enough mechanical grip to drive around these tracks without lifting.


Sure there's lots of banging, bashing, and wrecking (or there used to be) at Bristol, but it's done at roughly HALF the speed of Talledega/Daytona. The chances of major injury/death at Bristol are far, far less. Every time there's The Big One at Talledega/Daytona, the chances are tremendously greater.

That doesn't make it more acceptable. Rather than slow the cars/protect the driver/protect the fans/etc. approach to safety, I look at it from the standpoint of crashing as the worst possible outcome from racing (and death is the worst possible outcome of crashing). Protecting the drivers and fans makes crashes safer, but that's not the same as making racing safer.

[colinspooky]

I know - how about politely asking the drivers not to swerve about like lunatics when doing over 180 mph.

That way the fastest car gets to win, and we reduce the lumps of sheet metal in the stands.

Or slow the cars down to a more sensible 75 mph.

Otherwise you are just going to carry on getting racing drivers going fast trying to stop those behind from passing them. Hey, that's called motor racing isn't it?

Taking the plates off means they will all go the same speed only much faster with an exceptional few cars that don't have the advances in powerplants/aero others do.

But as soon as you introduce a rule that tries to make all the cars perform the same, they will generally all perform the same, and bunch up.

[Lee Roy]

I think taking down the banking would be overkill. I think the idea should be to reduce mechanical grip (in an already undertired car). I think cutting grooves in the tires and going with a very hard compound would remove enough grip to force drivers to lift in the turns at Talladega. We can take away all the downforce we want, but the cars have enough mechanical grip to drive around these tracks without lifting.


Grooved tires. Hadn't thought of that. It worked in F1 for a while. It would be interesting to see. Not sure if that small of a rubber patch would hold up for a stock car that's about 3 times the weight of an F1 car. But then, I didn't think they'd be able to get a tire to ever work at Indy again.

What I was thinking about was not so much just taking down the banking, because those two tracks would be real dogs as flat tracks, but a complete re-configuration into something else. What exactly, I don't know. But whatever they came up with, I would hope it would be a multi-purpose facility with a great oval, an FIA level road course for the Daytona 24 and the Motorcylce Race (and the US Grand Prix F1 race . . . . I can dream, can't I), a drag strip, and whatever else they can think of.

But I know it ain't gonna happen.

[Mark in Oshawa]

I think if Gary Nelson couldn't fix the plate racing quandary in 10 years of trying, then it is an issue that cant be fixed.

NASCAR wont do anything because ISC doesn't want to have to do anything.

Stop selling the first 10 rows of seats in the trioval and let them do what they want out there. THey are now anyhow. NASCAR said no slam drafting in the corners but we all know that is hard one to enforce and it isn't the cause of the last two dramatic finishs.

Tearing down the banks might interest me and Lee Roy but I think we are in a minority. I think a flat track imperative for new tracks is a must but the horse on that left the barn about 15 years ago when places like Texas, Kansas, Chicagoland and the like were being planned.

NASCAR is at its best where the cars are kept close and having to rely on driver skill.

IT is what it is. You either like it or you don't. I don't really like it, but I know watching guys run 4 seconds apart at Michigan or Fontana on a long run doesn't work for me either.

As for Bristol, progressive banking allows people to pass without having to push the guy out of the way. It was a one groove track and now it has two or three. Nothing wrong with Bristol if you can appreciate what you are watching. To those who like 17 yellows and 100 laps following the pace car while cleaning up one wreck after another, go watch pro wrassling.

[e2mtt]

Let me throw something out there; I bet the cars from 30 years ago could have run Daytona just like they do now... in giant jostling packs, bump drafting & going 3 wide.

However, they would have sometimes wrecked, and in every "big one" a couple of drivers (in the cars of the day) would have headed to the hospital for extended stays or worse. If the drivers drove like they do today, careers would have ended at every superspeedway race.

Self-preservation is a powerful force. With today's super-strong car, HANS devices, & Safer-barriers, it is no longer a big worry - thus the current show.

I don't think you can do anything to change it.

[UltimateDanGTR]

very good point e2mtt. drivers are more 'free' nowadays because they know that if they crash they are safe and wont get hurt (well they can be 99% sure nowadays).

maybe its not the plates so much that mean that we have insane races, crashes etc as much as it the more faith drivers have in their cars strength in crashes-but when i say that, plates also have something to do with it aswell.

safety evolves. aggresion does with it obviously aswell.